yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
You tested Java script "off", on a third party browser app. We are comparing apples to oranges here. My argument is with the stock browser that Samsung provides. Turning the javascript off there has zero effect, one way or the other.

As I stated before, in other threads , people have been complaining about their Samsung stock browser over several devices for several years. It's 2014. They shouldn't be this far behind the eight ball, with their competitors. Yet again, I'm spoiled. The Asus Web browsing experience is the best I've experienced over a multitude of devices, over the last 4 years.

Suffice it to say, I still love my Samsung overall. I guess no device can be perfect. Heck, the display on the Asus is washed out and antiquated. The sub-par web browsing on the Samsung won't allow me to give up on this device. . Whatsoever.
[Galaxy Tab S General] BarryH_GEG:
Here are the detailed SunSpider and Octane scores (which test Java script) for my N3 and N10.1-14. They seem proportionate taking in to account the massively larger amount of pixels the N10.1-14 is pushing. [MENTION=4742155]xRevilatioNx[/MENTION], can you post the same test results for your TF701? It's running the same resolution as Samsung's tabs so it would be an interesting comparison. In spite of the big variation in the numbers the two devices completed the tests at 13/44 and 14/47 seconds respectively.

The N3's Octane score got cut off. It's 3996.
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
@ Rev, why do you insist on using the stock browser when there are other vastly superior 3rd party browsers? Turning off Javascript even on Dolphin makes the Tab S every bit as fast as your Asus demonstration, maybe faster.

There is nothing wrong with the Tab S cpu. The amoled screen is not making the browser slower. This is a SOFTWARE issue and the culprit appears to be Javascript. I mean look at my video. With Javascript off websites full of graphics load instantly.

In Dolphin Browser with Javascript on the status bar moves across quickly then gets stuck for 2 or 3 seconds at he end. With Javascript off the status bar just flashes and the page appears. I mean it's obvious.

** UPDATE. Just tested turning off Javascript on the stock browser. Again it is DRAMATICALLY faster with it off. You saw no difference on your Tab S? The difference on mine is clear.
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
Here you go Barry ?

Samsung Stock Browser

Asus Transformer Infinity TF701 Chrome Browser
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
Any thoughts Barry?
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
Here's the bottom line on this...

1) Page loads in all browsers on the Tab 10.5 are dramatically faster with Javascript disabled.

2) I do not believe this is a bug but rather a security feature from Samsung as most people do not use Antivirus software on their tablets. Fewer virus infected tablets, more happy customers.

3) Page loads are still plenty quick for the average consumer even with Javascript enabled, albeit not the lightning speed one experiences with it disabled. I.e., the average consumer won't care and that's who Samsung is selling to.

4) If you want blazing page loads as you would find on a tablet not implementing this security check (the ASUS model mentioned previously), just disable javascript. Will this limit functionality of some webpages? Yes, but if you are looking to just blaze through for some quick reading you won't really notice. However, if you are planning to do a lot of interacting with websites such as using popup menus or typing in forums such as this one, leave javascript enabled and endure the slight slowdown for extra functionality and security.

5) Ok, and here's the BIG ONE. The lagginess in browsing using the Tab S line has NOTHING to do with the CPU, GPU or amoled screen. This IS a SOFTWARE issue and in my opinion, an intentional "security feature" by Samsung.

** IMHO the ASUS tablet described above is NOT a superior piece of kit. It simply takes a difference approach to checking javascript (i.e., it doesnt) before page loads. Once Javascript has been disabled on the Tab S both tabs website performance is identical.
[Galaxy Tab S General] snoopy1492:
A few things I think are important regarding what you are saying :

1 - If there was a speed issue due to JavaScript it would show on the JS benchmarks (sunspider, kraken...) With those, the tab s is within 10% of the note 3 (snapdragon s800) results.

2 - JavaScript is handled by an interpreter which is different from browser to browser and has nothing to do with the system.

3 - You can try wherever you want, if you disable JavaScript on any browser, the page load time will always be significantly better. For info on a powerfull computer theverge.com loads in 1600ms with Javascript, 504ms without it. So time/3. So saying it's faster with JavaScript disabled so there is a problem with it is just wrong.

4 - Where the hell did you get this idea of a security thing from Samsung?

5 - Yes the tab s is not fast. No as fast as the note 3 or an iPad air. We'll see if it improves with updates...
[Galaxy Tab S General] suzook:
While I agree there is an issue with JavaScript, I don't think its security related. My note3 and wife's s5 don't have this issue. I believe it has something to do with the kernel and or CPU and GPU.
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
Sigh. Ok, let's go through this again. Javascript is a well known method by which viruses can take over your computer. We have two machines, an ASUS and a Samsung. The ASUS is apparently not slowed with Javascript on and the Samsung is. The ASUS does not have superior hardware to the Samsung so we need to look elsewhere for the cause. Turning Javascript off makes the Samsung as fast as the ASUS.

So let's get away from benchmarks as the holy grail for a second. Step back and use your intuition. What is the one thing making ASUS faster than Samsung? Javascript is not slowing it down. Why? I propose this is a security decision made by Samsung. Watch the status bar on your browser when javascript is enabled vs not. SOMETHING is happening right at the end of the load cycle that is lagging the page view. What is that SOMETHING? I believe it is Samsung implementing a security protocol on Javascript.

Samsung is not interpreting the javascript, it is filtering it and thus the lag.

No, the Tab S is NOT slow. No, there is NOTHING wrong with the hardware. This IS a software issue and I believe it will never be fixed (by Samsung) as it is intentional and by design.

It will be curious once we finally get CM on the Tab S if this problem is solved. That would mean it is a Touchwiz related thing. Who knows. The one thing is sure, based upon reviews from average consumers and not enthusiasts like ourselves, no one cares. They believe the Tab S blazes. Read the BestBuy reviews sometime. In all the 5 star reviews "slow internet" is not mentioned. Exactly the opposite. These are the people Samsung cares about. The enthusiast crowd (us) make up a tiny fraction of tablet buyers. Samsung cares so much about us they void our warranties for rooting. They definitely do not design for us.
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
Snoopy & Suzook. No matter what statistics or facts you throw at this guy. Nothing will change his mind. I gave up yesterday. Next, he'll tell us he knows someone who knows someone that works for Samsungs development team, if you throw anymore FACTS at him. Let him keep on ASSUMING... "what he knows" as fact. He's living in his own little rose colored glass bubble. It's kind of cute actually. ?
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
As you said before, the tape doesn't lie.

[YOUTUBE]cvsD1W9EHus[/YOUTUBE]

This is every bit as fast as your fabled amazing Asus. If Tab S was being hamstrung by hardware what you have just witnessed would not be possible and yet there it is.

And thanks for thinking I'm cute although honestly you're not my type.
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
Did you even bother reading snoopy's rule number 3. No one is disputing that javascript OFF, speeds it up. But your diabolical "conspiracy theorist" reasoning on WHY the browsing lags is, in a word, laughable...
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
How is thinking Samsung would implement a security filter on Javascript a diabolical conspiracy theory? From Samsung's viewpoint this makes perfect sense. Are you saying Samsung makes no attempt to build security into their system? Are you saying with complete confidence that Samsung does not have a protocol to filter Javascript? Curious as to how you KNOW this? I am proposing a theory and yet you claim that it is impossible despite having no conceivable way of knowing that.

It is a theory and from a business standpoint it is plausible and even a good idea.

Yes disabling javascript will always speed up a browser, but in the case of the Tab S the difference is more dramatic than on other devices. Why? What is different? Try to think outside benchmarks.

Again, will be curious if this issue solves itself when we have CM.
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
Let's just say, for a second, your theory is plausible. Still doesn't explain away the stutter lag when scrolling on websites.
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
Can't comment. On my 10.5 I have no stutter when scrolling (even with Javascript enabled). I also noticed that with Javascript on using the back button is quite slow and with it off pages reload instantly. Since the prior page is already cached, why is going back so slow with Javascript on? What is happening there? It always seems to circle back to the Javascript.

Maybe the stuttering is related to the Stock Browser? As you know I prefer Dolphin (has flash, sidebar bookmarks, a cute fish) so that would be my primary experience and no stuttering there.

** With regards to conspiracy theories remember, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean everyone really isn't out to get you. :)

No stuttering with Dolphin Browser:

[YOUTUBE]Ig4OSqu06u0[/YOUTUBE]
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
Ok, here is the best example I can provide of what I am talking about with the page loads with Javascript on vs off on the Tab S. For purposes of this test I am using Dolphin Browser.

Watch the status bar and how it hangs at the end for 2 to 3 seconds with Javascript on. Now there is not enough javascript on these web pages to take 3 seconds to load so something else is happening here. The ASUS tablet does not have this lag at the end even with Javascript on.

Watch. (I recommend you blow the viewer up so you can see the status bar better).

[YOUTUBE]fjLQCnkasuc[/YOUTUBE]
[Galaxy Tab S General] snoopy1492:
Maybe if you see for yourself you'll understand that it does exactly that on every device :

Here on my note 3, exactly the same as your video first with JavaScript then without. You'll see how fast it is without it:

youtu.be/CHnshcKXrU0 (I can't post link, if someone wants to embed the video, go for it!)
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
Here you go..

[youtube]CHnshcKXrU0[/youtube]

So basically, you're saying the javascript page loading boost, isn't inherent to just one device (as the OP claims) ) thus rendering his hypothesis about it being exclusive to Samsung Tab S ( because of a presumed security flaw).... obsolete..
[Galaxy Tab S General] snoopy1492:
Thanks! ☺
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
I believe this may be something Samsung does with all of their devices running Touchwiz. As I recall, my Note 10.1 years ago did the same thing. I have been referring to the Tab S 10.5 in the OP and this thread because that is the only one I have been testing it on.

Snoopy, all you've done is prove this is happening on other Touchwiz devices as well. It did NOT happen on the ASUS. As your example of "every" device you used another Touchwiz device, I mean come on.

I have NEVER referred to a "security flaw" but merely a filter to provide additional security to users.

It is so obvious I am right on this.

** By the way, did you clear the cache between tests? If not your second test was pointless.
[Galaxy Tab S General] snoopy1492:
I should stop trying to show you how wrong you are but here you go, same thing with an LG Gpad 8.3 with CM11. No touchwizz here, so what's gonna be the next reason?

youtu.be/4yds8VefyF0
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
Note that's two devices..

Still going to hang on to your "thesis", Mitchellvii..... LOL.

[youtube]4yds8VefyF0[/youtube]
[Galaxy Tab S General] kliu888:
For a fair comparison, disable Javascript on BOTH Tab S & ASUS, then see which one is faster.
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
It's not a matter of which one is faster. My main issue is the stutter-lag that the Samsung has when scrolling up and down on websites. Mainly graphic intensive sites. You try to scroll back to the top, after reading a page, and you get hit with a snag. My videos I posted here and in the troubleshooting forum, shows that.
[Galaxy Tab S General] snoopy1492:
Unfortunately I think the GPU has a hard time driving the display... I'd like to have the comments of people owning the note 10.1 2014 which has the same GPU and same resolution. But for what I remember the initial reviews said that the tab had some lag... I don't know if it was fix with an update
[Galaxy Tab S General] simacca:
I think it's more touchwiz that causes the stutters than the gpu. I would like to see a Google Play Edition side by side to see what the speed difference is like.

Even with the micro stutters, etc, I'm still really liking this tablet. Hopefully future updates will make things even better.
[Galaxy Tab S General] HughesNet:
Guys, you aren't going to convince Mitchell of anything.
[Galaxy Tab S General] 12MaNy:
Agreed
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
The UI & TouchWiz Lag was rectified with our latest update. My only concern with this device is Browsing.
[Galaxy Tab S General] snoopy1492:
On my side despite the latest OTA update I still have some lag with the UI, you know when switching between apps or opening one... I use apex as launcher and I don't have any problem with it.
[Galaxy Tab S General] suzook:
I have a note 2014...same lag. I think you got it! Its the gpu.
[Galaxy Tab S General] BallistaSlim:
Hmm, I think you guys are a bit unfair here. Javascript does affect scrolling in a pretty big way.

Take for instance this site: http://www.aftonbladet.se (rubbish Swedish news site btw)

When Javascript is enabled the scrolling is horrendous, disabled it is (at least on my device) really good. I refuse to think it's the gpu. All games play with decent framerate.

Edit: This with Chrome browser.
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
You will not convince me because I am correct.

Do a thought experiment with me.

It appears that Javascript causes excessive page load lag when operating under Touchwiz (even more so than usual). This lag does not occur in the Asus tablet which does not have Touchwiz. The common thread is therefore Touchwiz.

So is this a bug or a feature? Hard to imagine such a glaring bug would remain after all these years (my Note 10.1 lagged the same way). That leads one to believe it is a feature. But why on earth would Samsung introduce a feature which slows down the browsing experience? What possible benefit could there be? What potential risk does Javascript hold? Viruses perhaps? So if this Javascript lag is a feature and a risk of javascript is viruses, why is it inconceivable that Samsung is doing this on purpose in order to filter for extra security?

And yet we have those here who claim this could not possibly be the reason? How do you know it cannot?

And the whole argument the GPU or CPU is not up to driving this display is silly. Without javascript enabled page loads blaze. If there were a hardware issue this would not be possible.

This is a software problem and until we can flash a CM rom and get rid of Touchwiz completely it will never go away. It is like this on purpose.
[Galaxy Tab S General] HughesNet:
People aren't saying it can't be. They are rebelling against you saying it IS. Your statement had 4 serious assumptions in it and then your get all annoyed when people aren't interested in your opinion due to the way you present it. You present your opinion as fact and that removes you from consideration. You do it to yourself.
[Galaxy Tab S General] snoopy1492:
OK, I'm done here...
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
I have stated numerous times throughout this thread that this is my theory and in my honest opinion a damned good one. Before pontificating on how I conduct myself I would recommend first reading more thoroughly. You are the one who told everyone they wouldn't convince me of anything. In saying this you imply that I am wrong and must be shown the light. But I am not wrong. All the evidence points to my conclusion. It is the most reasonable explanation given the facts at hand.

The most popular explanation offered here is that the Tab S has some sort of mysterious hardware deficiency that makes fast rendering of Web pages or lag free scrolling impossible. Amazing that this is such a popular theory as it is completely preposterous - a modern 8 core cpu can't render a webpage? Ridiculous. And yet this crazy notion is praised and my perfectly reasonable one is denigrated.

Anyway, doesn't matter. Facts are not determined by popular vote.
[Galaxy Tab S General] HughesNet:
There. You did it again. You called them facts and stated you are not wrong. You also started some of your last posts with that statement. Drop your claims in self defense that this is your theory or opinion. Your posts put the lie to that being your position. Anyone who bases their position on pure speculation and then claims they can't be wrong and that their opinion is fact isn't worth bothering to include in a discussion.
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
Sorry to break it to you Mitchellvii..

For the hell of it. I tried the javascript on my ASUS again. Low and behold...

Asus TF701 Javascript Test

[youtube]1mhrepYqU-k[/youtube]

There you have it. Lag does occur on my ASUS (no Touchwiz) So there is no....... "common thread"

But even as we present you with even "more facts", with you, your "VOTE" is always going to be the facts that matter..
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
Thanks. But it is not just javascript that is the bad guy here. It is javascript under Touchwiz. It is worse than in normal circumstances, much worse and that's my point. Touchwiz is doing something "extra" when it comes to javascript. If this is the case there must be a why.
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
I'm sorry but you have just proven my point. The javascript lag on the Tab S is MUCH worse than on the Asus. MUCH MUCH WORSE. Look at my prior video. Your Asus is fractionally slower but the Tab S takes 2 to 3 seconds longer. This means Touchwiz is doing something EXTRA with Javascript.

Previously you claimed that your Asus was dramatically faster than the Tab S now you are claiming it is the same speed. You can't have it both ways.

Watch this again.

[YOUTUBE]fjLQCnkasuc[/YOUTUBE]
[Galaxy Tab S General] simacca:
I'm yet to receive any update on my 8.4. Am looking forward to one though to see how much improvement there is across the board.
[Galaxy Tab S General] xRevilatioNx:
What did I tell you folks! Well the "evidence" had been laid out by both sides. It's up to the readers to decide.
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
You gotta love this guy. He dedicates an entire thread as to how his ASUS is SO MUCH FASTER browsing the web than the Tab S. How the Tab S is therefore some lag beast due to some hardware deficiency.

And now he uses as his "evidence" that the Asus is JUST AS SLOW WITH JAVASCRIPT ON AS THE TAB S! Does anyone else see the searing hypocrisy here? No, you can't have it both ways. The ASUS can't be held up as faster than the Tab S one minute and then the same speed the next depending upon which position supports your argument.

So which is it? Are you now admitting to everyone that the ASUS is NOT in fact faster than the Tab S when browsing the web (a complete contradiction of your earlier statements), or do you admit that Javascript is making the Tab S slower (since both are equally as fast with it disabled)?

I believe the ASUS is faster with Javascript on than the Tab S because of "something" Touchwiz is doing with Javascript that vanilla Android is not. I believe that "something" is a security filter which would make perfect business sense from Samsung's standpoint.
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
Things we know:

1) We know the hardware specifications of the Tab S are more than sufficient for fast and lagfree web browsing.

2) We know that HD video on YouTube streams instantly and flawlessly on the Tab S.

3) We know that with Javascript disabled, web pages load with blazing speed on the Tab S.

4) We know that while Javascript slows all web browsing, it slows it more on the Tab S (and apparently other devices running Touchwiz).

5) We know that Javascript can be a security threat to the average Samsung consumer.

6) We know that Samsung builds security into Touchwiz.

7) We know that there is an economic benefit to Samsung to provide additional security by filtering Javascript.

8) We know the average consumer would not notice this lag in web page loads (as can be demonstrated by the vast majority of 5 star reviews on retail sites like BestBuy).

In conclusion, it is preposterous to conclude that the Tab S hardware is lagging web performance on the Tab S. So if it isn't hardware what is it? We know that the status bar on our Web browsers gets "stuck" for 2 to 3 seconds at the end of a page load with Javascript on. So it would seem that Javascript IS the culprit. We also know that this lag is worse under Touchwiz than under stock Android. Could this be a bug? I doubt it. Too easily solved to have been around all these years. So if it isn't a bug it's a feature.

So ask yourself, why would Samsung code in a "feature" which slows web page loads? My theory is web security. It is completely plausible given what we know and from Samsung's standpoint, would actually be a good idea.

P.S., So what's the solution? No one likes disabling Javascript just to get fast page loads. Well, if you want to maintain the Touchwiz ecosystem, there really is no solution. I don't see Samsung "fixing" this as it is their idea in the first place. Basically, the only solution will be to go pure Android with a CM type rom. Of course you lose some functionality (split screen) but you get faster internet with Javascript enabled.

BTW, has anyone ever wondered WHY Touchwiz has such a bad reputation for laginess? Why Samsung designers are so lame they could never fix it? Well, maybe they arent so lame after all. Maybe at least a part of the problem is on purpose?
[Galaxy Tab S General] mitchellvii:
BTW. I want to thank all of the participants to this lively debate for keeping things as civil as possible given the strong disagreement between the parties. Debate, even enthusiastic debate is good, flame wars are not. :)