yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
Did an "unscientific" test using SuperTask.

I had no other applications running, started after soft reset all times (but of course WindowsMobile will run some background tasks, but since I soft reset each time it should be at least simmilar for all tests). I played same MP3 track that is encoded with 192 Kbps.

Here is the results;

PocketMusic with A2DP

40-45% CPU

PocketMusic without A2DP

20-25% CPU

WindowsMediaPlayer with A2DP

35-40% CPU

WindowsMediaPlayer without A2DP

15-20% CPU

So A2DP (if we trust this "unscientific test"!) takes approx 20% CPU, and WMP takes approx 10% less CPU than PocketMusic (but I still prefer PocketMusic due to usabillity issues).

And this seems to fit with my experiences with A2DP on my JasJar...I seldom have problems with my JasJar outputting...it is a problem normally with BT signal/connection between JasJar and headset...and that is reduced by keeping them close, few/little objects between them.

...but then again...other people might have more CPU intensive apps running on the Universal than me, and therefore get a problem due to the approx 20% CPU usage of A2DP.

UPDATE: Made a seperate post for the test with more info...here http://xdaforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=53717
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] ady:
I got this from the wizard forum. Apparently there is a free task manager which works on universal as well and shows plenty of info. Can't find the thread though
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] hannip:
Thanks, that's a pretty cool app, however the cpu utilization doesn't seem to work for all apps. With PocketMusic playing it shows 0 % cpu for that process. It claims my Idle is 90% with PocketMusic over A2DP. That just can't be correct. Gonna try SuperTasks next.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] hannip:
Using SuperTasks I see the following stats

PocketMusic w/A2DP 15-25% cpu

services.exe 4-6% cpu

device.exe 5-15% cpu

everything else was 0.

So cpu-wise the device doesn't seem to be stressed. What I am hearing is from 2 to 15 seconds of music that gets paused for about a second before it continues. When it continues it sounds like the music is sped up for a moment as if it were trying to catch up.

It's almost like some kind of flow control start and stops. I've tested this in a wireless free area so I don't think it's interference related.

Neither one of these tools show priorities from what I could see. I'm still looking for something that can show process/threads and service priorities.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] DaveUK:
Mmm how do you get Pocketmusic and AVRCP to work?

I cant get it to work at all......WMP works fine with my HT820's but not with Pocketmusic.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] hannip:
What version are you using? Try the latest one.

http://www.pocketmind.com/files/pmusic.zip

Note that you should disable gapless playback if you experience hangs when switching tracks.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
I agree that this does not sound like "interference related". I think that when you have "interference"/"BT signal" issues, you will just loose some of the sound, while when it is JasJar issues it continues where it left of, or sometimes sound like it suddenly speeds up for a short while to catch up.

The behaviour you have here, I have not heard at all in at least a month, and I use A2DP a couple of hours every day...so it makes me wonder if there is something in the ROM that you have or some software on your JasJar that I don't have...!?

Maybe we should compare ROM versions, what services that are running in background of device, what apps we have installed currently, so forth? ...we probably won't find anything...but maybe worth a try!?

BTW

I DID have that issue a lot before though, and I don't really remember exactly WHEN I got rid of it, if it was manually entering the "A2DP lag patch", or if it was uninstalling some software...since I tried so many things in that period to resolve it...it just works pretty well now (except of course that it sometimes lags if there is to much obstructions between headset/JasJar).

On sunday (first time I have chance to "play again":-) ), I will also test with my Motorola HT820's again...just to verify that it works just as well with those headphones as it does with my iTech headset. ...it would really surprise me if that has had an effect...but I do not remember when it started to work fine...and "desperate people try desperate things"! :-)
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] DaveUK:
For some reason the version I downloaded direct from their website was 4.03

The copy you sent works like a charm with AVRCP.

Thanks alot!!!!!!!!!!!
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] hannip:
I'm sorry if I implied that I had a JasJar. In fact I have a Treo 700w. Hence the comment I posted earlier that your tips can apply to any device trying to get A2DP running cleanly. I have installed the Tornado A2DP cab and my device is updated with an AKU2 rom. Our devices both run Windows Mobile 5.0 Phone Edition OS however the Treo uses an PXA272 xscale processor that I run at 520Mhz.

If you'd like to keep this thread specific to the JasJar I will understand, but it's hard finding help for the A2DP lag issues and this seemed like a good fit.

The services I have running (from SuperTasks) are:

Service Status

--------- --------

Altkeys On

BPWServ On

BTAGSVC On

BTHIDSVC On

credsvc On

DTPT On

KGUServ On

LASSD On

NOTIFY On

OBEX On

SNApi On

SuperTasks On

Trusted

VOLServ Unknown

My processes after a soft reboot are:

NK.EXE

filesys.exe

device.exe

shell32.exe

gwes.exe

services.exe

sddaemon.exe

tmail.exe

connmgr.exe

srvtrust.exe

BatteryIndicator.exe

cprog.exe

mstli.exe

poutlook.exe

I guess I should remove any potential that an installed app might be causing some problems so I'll try a hard reset and give it a test.

I have heard that some HT820's have the lag issue even if the device is working ok. Apparently there are several iterations of the HT820's and that problem was fixed later on.

I have two sets of A2DP headphones.

- Samsung SBH-100

- Jensen WBB100

The sound quality is better with the Samsung's, but the Jensen's seem to be a bit more tolerant with different devices. Both exhibit the lag issue on my device.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] hannip:
I tested after a hard reset. Same results.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
Sorry to hear!

I myself removed all today plugins in a "desperate" moment when I struggeled with A2DP some time ago. But now that all works fairly fine, I installed PocketPlus, PocketWeather and PocketTime again...and I have not noticed any problems so far...so I really start to wonder what on earth is different with my JasJar now and for 1-2 months ago?

Maybe I just need to do a hard-reset, apply a "regular JasJar ROM", add "Tornado A2DP" patch you mentioned, test...see if lag is there, then manually apply "A2DP lag patch"...check again if "lag" is there, so forth. ...since until we find out WHAT it is that makes mine "ok"...it all sounds like "magic"...and "magic" is hard to reproduce for others! :-)
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
Hannip,

Processes that we both have after softreset;

NK.EXE

filesys.exe

device.exe

shell32.exe

gwes.exe

services.exe

connmgr.exe

srvtrust.exe

BatteryIndicator.exe

cprog.exe

Processes that you have, that I do not have;

sddaemon.exe

tmail.exe

mstli.exe

poutlook.exe

Processes that I have, but not you;

SuperTasks.exe (you probably just did not mention it)

PQzII.exe (keyboard utillity for Universal)

replog.exe

pMSNServer.exe

I have earlier removed all programs from "Windows/Startup" on my Universal...that was during "my moments of desperation" (when trying to get rid of the "lag/stuttering" issue)...so that might explain why I don't have "sddaemon", so forth...but I do not have the foggiest idea of what impact removing those really have had on my device...everything seem to work fine without them.a

For the ones that I have, but not you...

SuperTask is fairly easy to explain, since I used that programs to see what services I had! :-)

PQzII is something I have added to my "Windows/startup"-folder (and is the ONLY program I have there)

replog.exe, I have no idea what do.

pMSNServer.exe...I do not know...PushMail related maybe!?

Strangely enough...my "Supertasks" does not show "status" on the services...I can swear it did when I installed it last week!? But I did install and uninstall a lot of different programs when I tried to find a program for showing CPU utilzation++...so it might be due to that?

Anyway, I will (as soon as I get the time) do a full reinstall with a new ROM, and apply everything more controlled, and test between each step...and hopefully it will be possibly to detect what steps made some improvement. ...but this I expect will take me quite some time...since I probably need to listen to music for 10-30 minutes (with JasJar at different distances) to verify if there is any impacts of each step.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] ng:
bluetake i-phono mini bt450rx

Hey,

Thanks for the post, it helped me to find out some more about how to make A2DP work better. Best thing I can do is share my experiences on a different bt headset, the bluetake i-phono mini 450rx. When deciding on ordering them I really missed a personal account of them with a universal with A2DP. So here is my experience with them.

I've had the now for a week but it has so many short-comings that I'm going to send them back. The reason I bought them was because they're two separate earpieces which would make them more comfortable and I figured the sound would be fine (I don't care much for advanced sound options, as long as sound is decent). BUT, to connect them to the universal is an art. It takes forever and it isn't garanteed to work in the first attempt. I often had to switch bt on/off on the universal and the headset and reconnect all over again hoping that I would get some sound out of TCPMP. On average it took me 10 minutes (!) to connect them properly and that is too much when you're often on the go. After succesfully connecting the headset the connection between the universal and the headset is completely fickle, even without wifi's around. I get the idea that when my arm is in the way, the connection fails! I can't get away from my device more than a metre before the connection strutters. In use the sound is good, but with using TCPMP, AVRCP doesn't work which was a huge let-down. But after reading the initial post I hope using a different player will help. Also I made a few calls with the headset in, but I couldn't hear my caller properly and the caller couldn't hear me. The only time it worked well was when I was in a quiet room. I had hoped that the i-phone would redeem itself in use, but after reading this post I'm convinced that this headset and the universal are not a good combination.

So I'm in the market for a new bt stereo headset. I'm inclined to go for the motorola ht820, although I don't like the look of them much. But, if they are good in sound, connection, remote control and calling (basicly in functioning properly), then I'm convinced. Does anyone have any other advise on an alternative headset that would be good for the universal?

I'm sorry I can't be more positive about this nice looking headset. If it works well for others that's good, but they're not for me.

Allright: After some browsing the jabra bt620s is the other contender. Does anyone have any advise for choosing between the two? On looks, I would go for the jabra, but I would like to know if the functionality is as good as the account given of the motorola headset.

Thanks
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] hannip:
Thanks Ronny for all of your help! I really appreciate it!

So for my next test I killed off any extra processes that didn't show up in your list so we have the same processes running excluding the extra apps that you had. It didn't seem to make any difference unfortunately.

We still could have different drivers or priority settings that might be making the difference between our devices. I'm thinking of writing a tool to list priorities since there doesn't seem to be one out there. I've applied the bta2dpsnd priority to 60, but I have no clue if it's actually running at that priority. I've read some Microsoft docs that say the device manufacturer can actually restrict apps from setting priorities below the normal range. Not sure how they go about doing that.

I'm also wondering about interrupt sharing issues. I don't know a lot about Windows Mobile but I know the Windows OS in the past had issues with interrupts being shared that could cause problems. I'm just throw stuff out there. :)

It would be interesting to see if you get the lag issues when installing the Tornado cab, however it seems many others use it with success.

NG: I have been really enjoying the sound quality of my Samsung SBH100's and all of the AVRCP controls work great. These headphones are also separate for easy fit. You may want to consider them.

Edit: I used the taskmanager app to stop all services while I was playing music over a2dp. Amazingly it still worked, however I did not notice much lag improvement if any.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] ng:
Thanks, I'll check them out.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
NG, thanks for the input, this will give "readers" more input in choice of headset!

HANNIP, not strange you "throw ideas around"...it is frustrating to not be able to nail it down, and find the "root cause" for the lag/stuttering you are experiencing.

I was in the same situation for several months, and was "THAT close" to give A2DP up...and was even pondering dramatic steps, like switching to one of the Ericsson "Walkman-phones", since they are supposedly having A2DP that works. ...but that would be an enormous leap for me...who have stuck to Windows Mobile since the end of the 90's, and have had Windows Mobile Phone since 2002 I believe. ...but that would be "madness" of me...since my JasJar is used for so imensly much more that just listening to music/podcasts...I surf the web, read books, handle projects and appointments, I see videos, I even write some code sometimes on it...a Walkman-phone would not "satisfy" those needs sufficiently I am afraid.

But I still can not say for sure "what cured it" for me either, all I know is that now I seem not to have any stuttering/lag due to "JasJar struggling", even though I have it due to "obstructions"/"disturbances" for radio signal (I know it is this when it occurs, since it always disapear if I get closer to JasJar or remove obstruction).

Hopefully I will find exactly what help for the Universal when I do a fresh ROM install and test out the "Tornado-A2DP-patch". But that will not help you, since you most likely have done whatever it is (and a lot more) without helping on your Treo700w.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] gunigugu:
Newbie question here, but i can't work out the best solution:

When i installed PocketMusic, my mp3 ringtones, stopped working.. and unless i unregister mp3's with pocketmusic, which i don't want to do, i can't fix it..

anyone else have this same issue? or idea's how to fix it?
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] FOSA:
RE

ng,

AVRCP works partially with the new plugin from Conduits Pocket Player with my BLUETAKE iPhono mini 450Rx

Get the plugin here:-

http://xdaforums.com/viewtopic.php?p=313880#313880
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] FOSA:
RE

ng,

After reading your post on the BLUETAKE iPhono mini 450Rx headphone (which I'm using for many months now) these are my views

a) TCPMP is never a good music player. If you want to listen to good quality songs then choose a good music player with plenty of effects settings like GSPlayer, Conduits Pocket Player (my preference) etc

b) besides WMP (which also does not support 100% of the AVRCP), NO player on the market supports AVRCP till the plugin released now by Conduits

c) IMO, sound quality is the best

d) small and comfortable to wear

e) not good in handling incoming/outgoing calls though and don't have any obstruction between your PPC and the headphone

If you're looking for a good headphone for listening to superior music quality then the BLUETAKE iPhono mini 450Rx is highly recommended. For phone calls use your PDA phone or handphone directly instead
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
Re: RE

That statement is not "entirely true"...since the latest version of PocketMusic also works with AVRCP (mentioned in my original post)...and for me also works BETTER than WMP in that regard since the play/pause/resume button on my iTech PROsound works flawlessly with PocketMusic. The equaliser/bassBost also works fine with PocketMusic (over A2DP).

When it comes to PocketPlayer, I have not tested latest version of it (AVRCP plugin++), so I'll take your word for it, that it works great with AVRCP and A2DP! :-)
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
Sidetrack here...but I now have myself also "tested" the "Tornado A2DP patch", and it worked perfectly as others have mentioned before.

I installed a AKU2 ROM that does not have A2DP enabled (the latest official Norwegian JasJar ROM, downloaded it from www.i-mate.no ).

After installation, I did not have A2DP, but I then applied the "Tornado A2DP patch" (which was as easy as "copying 3 dll's to /Windows folder on my JasJar, and then running a 41KB CAB-file on my JasJar"), and then A2DP worked immediately! Cool! :-)
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
gunigugu,

My ringtone is an WMA-file (I converted it to WMA ages ago for reasons I do not remember), so I do not have that problem.

But I have not registered PocketMusic as default player for MP3's either, so I presume it would not be a problem for me using MP3's as ringtones either (I can test out later today)...since I always play MP3's from inside PocketMusic.

In other words, when I want to listen to music, I always start PocketMusic first, and then chose the songs/tracks to listen too..since I have set it up to always load music from my "Music folder" on my storagecard. I never start the music from "File Explorer" anyway, so "registering PocketMusic" as default app for MP3's does not make a big deal for me.

Will test out with MP3 later today and update...
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] gunigugu:
Fair enough, i may unregister it, from playing mp3's.... seems more like a wm5 flaw, then anything else...

Anyways, one more question, how do i get it to work with AVRCP, because, i just installed it, and i'm able to control it fine from windows media player, but it's a no go, from pocket music, is there something i need to do/enable?
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
You need to install the latest version (is available from ver. 4.2.5 at least, that is the one I have).

Windows installer here; http://www.pocketmind.com/files/pmusic.exe

CAB-file here; http://www.pocketmind.com/files/pmusic(cab).zip

Then it should "just work"...no settings, no plugins...just install, and then AVRCP commands will work (it does for me at least :-)).
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] hannip:
Ronny, I see the tornado install worked for you which is good news. I have yet to get rid of my lag problems, but someone has shown me some new a2dp settings that may be useful to others with bandwidth problems. You can control the bitrate with the following registry key/values.

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Bluetooth\A2DP\Settings]

"BitPool"=dword:00000051

"SampleRate"=dword:00048000

There is a table in the a2dp spec that shows several values to use that result in the following bitrates.

Medium Quality

BitPool=35, SampleRate=44.1khz = 229kb/s

BitPool=33, SampleRate=48khz = 237kb/s

High Quality

BitPool=53, SampleRate=44.1khz = 328kb/s

BitPool=51, SampleRate=48khz = 345kb/s

There are also parameters called "MinBitPool", "MaxBitPool" so the device can pick for itself depending on mp3 quality etc. I haven't tested the min/max parameters yet, but apparently these are used by default.

For the Treo only the quality of the sound changes when I set different bit rates. It didn't change the lag problems for that device. So the Treo doesn't appear to have bluetooth bandwidth issues and is not cpu stressed. It would seem to be a resource contention problem. I've played with changing the driver priorities for bta2dp.dll and wavdev.dll, but I haven't found any combination that gets rid of the lag. The current theory is that the sbc.dll which I assume performs the subband encoding might need a priority boost, but I'm not sure how to do that since there is no registry entry for that dll.

The theory on why it works on htc devices is that maybe the sbc encoding is being performed using the bt hardware module. The Treo being built by another manufacturer may be falling back to software sbc encoding. Again, this is just a theory. I don't actually know if htc bt modules have a built in sbc encoder, but it sure would make sense. Maybe the treo has it too, but since the driver has been extracted from an htc device it just doesn't know how to use it and falls back to software.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] sas90850:
Totally agree. I used 818pro with Pocket Music Version 4.2.6 can use all AVRCP Function as well.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
Hannip, that was a lot of settings to check/test...I will look into how it is on my device later...right now I am "busy watching fotboll on the TV"! :-)

Thanks for all the info, will play with it later, and come back with some feedback here! :-)
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] FOSA:
RE

I installed PocketMusic Pro v4.2.6 on my QTEK 9000 and it doesn't work

PocketMusic is not WM5 compatible

There's also a problem of not able to display too many sub-folders or too many files in a folder when in landscape mode

:x
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] FOSA:
RE

Quote

"There's also a problem of not able to display too many sub-folders or too many files in a folder when in landscape mode"

Portrait mode has no above problem

Another problem is the Select Preset feature. After selecting and accepting a particular preset it always goes back to default (portratit and landscape modes) i.e. the preset is not sticky
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
Re: RE

That comment is just not true FOSA, I have used it with WM5 for 2 weeks now, 3-4 hours every day, and it works very fine on my JasJar, and of course it is a WM5 device. EDIT: I use "PocketMusic 4.2.5 Bundle"...and THAT works fine with WM5 at least! :-)

Instead of firing of comments like that, try to describe WHAT does not work for you, and people might assist you. Comments like that is not very much helpfull for you or others reading this.

I am using THIS specific file; http://www.pocketmind.com/files/pmusic(cab).zip, I have not used this 4.2.6 that you are testing (but some other person commented that it does work on his Dopod or something). But that CAB-file works fine for me, and I use it in landscape without any problems that I can see.

So explain more WHAT is not working, and HOW it acts...and possibly link to the file you downloaded, and I can test the same file on my JasJar and see if it behaves like the version I have now, or differently.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] RonnyGydar:
Re: RE

Where do you have that setting, can't find it in my version (I use "PocketMusic 4.2.5 Bundle" btw), but it switches automatically and that is the way I like it too...but still, there seem to be quite big difference between this Pro version you have and the "PocketMusic Bundle" that I use.
[JASJAR, XDA Exec, MDA Pro General] FOSA:
RE

RonnyGydar,

The version of PocketMusic as per you link is v4.3

I just installed and tested it but its not working with A2DP and AVRCP. My BLUETAKE iPhono mini 450Rx is not picking up music from the player although I can hear 'click' sound when I tap on the screen

PocketMusic is NOT WM5 compatible. Nowhere on its homepage says so!!

And, my conlusion, is that its not supporting A2DP and AVRCP

I'm using QTEK 9000 with the latest QTEK ROM with A2DP

I've also Conduits Pocket Player installed and it supports A2DP + the latest plugin which supports partial AVRCP when tested with my headphone