yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
Hello,

I finally got the 3D-printed part and the Qi charger. They both fit very well together. :)

However, I ordered and got some 8x1mm N52 magnets, but they don't hold the phone very well. They stabilize the phone horizontally (not a lot) but can't hold it vertically. My phone got a case (the official bumper) but I tried without this case and it still doesn't hold the phone well. They're less efficient than magnets inside the new Google Qi charger (which can't hold a phone vertically though).

It has nothing to do with your video in the first message. BTW I could record a video of my magnets to show how they perform if needed. So I wonder if my magnets are bad (and if they're really N52)...Did you try your N52 magnets ? If they work, where did you order them ?

Could this be related to the fact that my magnets are 1mm thick instead of 2 ? I doubt it because I tried to stack them (I ordered 20 of them) but it wasn't enough to really hold the phone, even when I stacked 4 x 5 of them.

Thanks in advance.

EDIT : I tried magnets before gluing them on the charger, so I didn't ruin it. So I still wonder if I should order the same magnets from another provider or try ordering thicker magnets.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Hi,

Great to hear that somebody tried it and the adapter fit well :)

Yes I tried 8x1 N52 magnets and find out that they have the same strength my 8x1 N45 had.

So I contacted the vendor and he told me there is no big difference. At least they where exactly the same, just sold different.

When I looked more into it I found a formula:

Strength = magnetisation x volume

N45 8x1 = 2262

N52 8x1 = 2614

N45 8x2 = 4524 <- used in video

N52 8x2 = 5228

So yes you need the 8x2 magnets to get the power.

When you use the bumper try the N52 8x2 magnets.

If they hold it with the bumper please tell me ;)

Gesendet von meinem GT-N8000 mit Tapatalk
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
That's strange because even when I stack 2 (or more) of my 8x1mm, so it becomes a "8x2mm" magnet, it still isn't powerful enough. My magnets are maybe defective.

I don't know if ordering magnets of bigger diameter (> 8 mm) might help.

When I order neodymium magnets, most of the price is freight so I'll probably order a lot of different sizes to try them all. I'll post news when I'll get them.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
just read again and saw I might misunderstood.

ringmagnets might be better then cylindrical ones for the flux, but on the opposite they are less strong on the same size.

So at the end they should be worse then cylindrical at the same size.

And for good charging the gap between the charger and the phone should be as small as possible. So you need small ones.

Over all two flat cuboid magnets stick together for each metal plate is the best solution
[Nexus 5 Accessories] sireddie:
Hi guys,

Been reading this thread, and have found a lot us useful info.

I've got a Nexus charger, which I'd like to use as a car charger/dock.

I have a Samsung Galaxy Note 3 with 10mm/1mm magnets disks in the case.

I've noticed I don't have as strong magnetic attraction to the charger as a friends Nexus 5. This thread explain quite well why that's the case. Also, the magnets interfere with the pen input on my device.

I'm now trying to acquire some Nexus 5 disks/plates so I can install these in place of my magnets in my case.

Does anyone have the disks from a Nexus 5 that they don't have any use for, or does anyone know where I could find equivalents?

Thanks

Eddie
[Nexus 5 Accessories] imthenachoman:
I see a lot of information in this thread. Wondering, excluding the official Nexus charger, what is everyone using for good results for charging with a good strong magnetic hold? All the talk of magnetic configuration confused me and I can't tell what is the best arrangement now.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
updated OP a little bit. There you see the arrangement I'm using for months now. It charges with around 600mA and has a nice strength so it should not drop when you don't like to hurt your car.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] janeyenaj:
Anyone going for nexus 6? I doubt that it will stick to our charges, because of rounded back side. What do you think?
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
if you use plasti dip on the magnets instead of the rubber there should be no problems. Just the metal plates should be on the same position in the phone.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] janeyenaj:
But the area where the phone and charger stick would be smaller due to curvines of nexus 6. And it is heavier than N5. I think this is a problem.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Samip430:
Magnets being used

The ones I found were these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-Pezzi-NE...334?pt=Collezioni_diverse&hash=item1e8730ae16

They are N44 so not sure if they are strong enough.

Also, how far apart are the magnets mounted?
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Those magnets should be fine.

When you use the cardboard as recommended (0,5mm) it would be the same hight. Just because the back is not completely straight it sticks at it nicely.

But with 6x4x2 magnets you can't use a case
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Samip430:
No I mean as in how far the magnets from each other? I followed a similar guide elsewhere on this forum and it stated to put the magnets about 38mm apart from each other in a square.

Thank you
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?p=49667423

There is the exact position of the metal plates.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Magnets don't work this way.

They won't get stronger when you stick two together.

A stack of 10 magnets will still have the power of one, when all have the same strength

Edit: Yes that was not correct. was a thinking error from me, but they also don't have the double strength
[Nexus 5 Accessories] sobanb:
That is incorrect. Source: http://www.kjmagnetics.com/faq.asp#stack

It's the volume that counts.

@ Ano59: Use http://www.kjmagnetics.com/calculator.asp to calculate your pull force. 8mmx1mm is too small to hold the phone. It barely has 0.25 pound pull force. Don't forget to factor in 1mm or so gap between your magnet and metal plates in the phone. I reccomend going for 12mm x 1.5mm at the very least to get decent pull force.

Eg. I am currently building a wooden charging stand and I had to stack 2x 12mm x 1.5mm in four corners to get good pull force factoring in my Ringke Fusion case and 0.3mm of wood
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Sorry but this page is not 100% correct.

I tested it and here are the results:

1x N45 8x1 = 70 mN

2x N45 8x1 = 120 mN

3x N45 8x1 = 170 mN

1x N45 8x2 = 170 mN

The force depends on how you measure. I've done it with a thin metal stick. That's why the numbers are so low.

So I recommend to not use 2x 8x1 but 1x 8x2!

And like you see in my clip, they hold the phone well
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
I though it would be better to put magnets in the Qi charger, so the phone is closer to the charger and I don't have to modify the rubber band.

I disassembled my charger, it's quite simple in fact. :D Then I checked that it would work with magnets (it does, however I don't know how efficiently ; I'll measure this before doing something irreversible).

When I stack 4 x 3 magnets, it starts holding the phone, not like in your video though but I tested it without rubber. I think it will hold well with rubber though. So I should be able to make my wireless car charger with a maximum of 4 x 8x3mm N52 magnets (EDIT : I remind you that I got the official bumper case). Probably less. I measured how deep I could go through the charger and luckily it's around 3mm deep.

Then, how to put magnets inside plastic without ruining the charger ? This guy figured it out. Didn't try it ATM but it should work. It should de-magnetize the magnet too so I'll use a spare one.

BTW I have the same feeling as this guy. I can't understand why, and I don't want to disassemble my phone to understand it.

My post is probably looking very confusing without pics, but if I manage to succeed I'll post a walkthrough of course. ;)

Not very soon though, because I'll wait for new magnets to ship. Magnets cost nothing and freight is most of the cost so I'll order many of them to try them all.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
As I figured out, it would be better to use on big magnet and not stacks. And the strength will decrease significant with bigger space between the magnet and the metal plates in our N5.

You see that they are metal plates because you can stick the magnets with both sides to it. And they will never be repelling a magnet. So check out that you stick you magnets to the plates and not on other spots.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
I agree for the logic with the metal plates. But my magnets seem to disagree with physics laws because something inside the phone repels them from both sides. :/ I doesn't really matter because near those spots, magnets are attracted, but I don't understand what's the thing inside my phone which has such a strange behavior. I have probably done a mistake somewhere (physics laws aren't usually wrong) but I don't see where.

I ordered magnets and they should be at home in a few days. I'll try to use them and post some news, then.

Now here are pictures of what I'm trying to achieve inside the charger. I used magnets I don't need anymore and some crap plastic thing for this try. All is described in pictures, except the fact that I might use plasti-dip if needed.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
just superconductor could regret magnets from both sides ;) and it would be revolutionizing when work in room temperature :D

no I tested it myself and opened my phone for this. It's just the effect when you shear two magnets of the same size, or in this case when the magnet and the metal have a similar size. then you feel the same.

I also measured the position of the plates exactly. They have a diameter of 6,2 mm and are placed in a square on a circle of 26 mm radius.

So 12mm magnets don't make much sense.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] lifeisfun:
I presume that your last picture is the charger, probably not good idea to place magnets over the coil....
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
It's no prob as long the magnet don't hit the coil.

The efficiency should be decreasing, but it still work fine
[Nexus 5 Accessories] lifeisfun:
Measure the charging current with battery widget, you will se how less efficient it is with magnets over the coil.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Just works great with me with fine charging speed, but I'll check

Edit: can you plz give me a link to the battery widget that can measure the current?
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Have to wait some percent for this.

Will do it tomorrow.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
Haha don't worry, I'll put magnets under the rubber band in fact, just next to the charging coil (but not over it). I already disassembled the charger to check if I can put the magnets here ; I can. I didn't put them there in the picture because it exceeded my incredible image editing skills. ;)

I've already seen reports of other people putting magnets over their coil and getting no charge and maximum heat, which is quite logical because magnets receive inducted currents. Thanks for warning me though.

Yes I've read somewhere else that they were around 6mm large. I tried to estimate metal plates spacement from pictures and I estimated it as a square with 2 magnets separated by aprox. 27mm each.

As I said freight was the most expensive part of my order so I ordered various magnets from 6mm to 10mm diameter (I can't put larger than 10mm on the charger without overlap with the charging coil). Will try them all and tell which is the best.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] eneka:
I did something similar to mine, but I drilled holes and epoxied the magnets in, and then sprayed it over with some plastidip. I used 1/2 x 1/8 neodymium magnets and they hold the phone really well. The charger itself is velcro'd to the dash and I have music playing via bluetooth. Works excellent. Now I just need to tuck the usb cable being the trim
[Nexus 5 Accessories] lifeisfun:
Would you mind to post your charging current numbers?
[Nexus 5 Accessories] eneka:
it hovers around 400mA compared to my nexus orb that hovers around 620mA and my Nokia Dt-900 at ~650ma

I do have a Ringke slim case on however.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Here you have a picture of the exact position of the metal plates. Your 27mm don't look n1

My QI charger with the magnets provide 600mA.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
Sorry, in fact we are both right because I made a typo : I intended to say 37mm.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] lifeisfun:
Well, then the picture you posted with mags inside the circle is wrong

http://xdaforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2529928&d=1390311387
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
Yes. As I said :
[Nexus 5 Accessories] JohnLocke44:
I bought 12 N45 8x1mm magnets, but even using all of them (3x on each corner) it cannot handle the phone, even without case.

Now I gonna try a stronger magnet. What you guys recommend (I'm between 8x3mm and 12x2mm) for use with a hard case? And I only have N35's magnets as options, just can't find N45 or N52 here.

Thanks a lot!
[Nexus 5 Accessories] prosettera:
Looks sweet! This is nice stuff
[Nexus 5 Accessories] crazifyngers:
has anyone found a "univeral connector" like the one in the OP but ships to the USA? I like the few inch arm that it has.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
the both 3D manufacture are in the USA. Just order them there and send to your home
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
best magnets in my opinion are 6x2 N45/N52

at least in china you would find them and shipping to your home

I just finished some simulations for the N45 magnets. Cause I don't know the real permeability of the metal plates the numbers aren't exact, but you can see the dimensions.

N45 Force in N

8x1 1.5

8x2 2.65

8x3 2.95

12x1 1.5

12x2 2.8

12x3 3.1

Edit: Done more simulation, that crushed my mind!

6x1 1.63

6x2 3.06

6x3 3.58

Keep in mind, that the magnets with 12mm diameter will have a much more impact on the coil.

They will reduce the efficiency and so the charging current!

Edit:

did some failure in the simulation. so don't trust those numbers...
[Nexus 5 Accessories] JohnLocke44:
Thanks for the answer!

I Bought the 12x2mm N35 for while. I don't have the wireless charger yet, it's coming from Honk Kong I will buy the magnets from there too, only that this time I will buy the N52 or N45 8x3mm.

Thanks again!

Regards!
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
I've done more simulations for the case!

The best for the case should be 12x2

Simulations with case (increased distance from 0.3mm to 0.8mm)

N45 N

6x2 0.75

6x3 0.815

8x2 0.983

8x3 0.95

12x2 1.39

12x3 1.41
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
I got bored of my magnets problems so I disassembled both : my Nexus 5 and my wireless charger pad. I made photos but they aren't available at the moment, I'll post a complete walkthrough on a separate topic about how are the charger's internals.

However I'll already post a few statements :

- I was right, and so was this guy : there was something strange about the metal plates inside the Nexus 5. They're discs, 1/4" x 1/32" (sorry guys I'm european but this is the exact size of the discs - and I got used to use inches with magnets because I ordered US ones with sizes in inches). They don't seem to be magnetized. And for whatever reason, they attract magnets from everything but their center. In fact their center repels magnets from both sides. Yes, this is not possible, and don't ask me why because I have no ****ing idea, I only see and describe this...I'll post proofs (videos if needed) when I'll get more time to do so

- This is a feature, not a problem, because Google took this into account when designing their charging pad. I wondered how it could attract perfectly the nexus (which a normal magnet does not) and I found out how : the four magnetic sides of the charger are not single magnets, there are 3 magnets per side, 2 cubes bound together by another magnet. So the 2 cubes are attracted by the most external side of Nexus' metal plates and don't get repelled by the central part

- This means everyone here is designing sub-optimal magnetic docks because they put only one magnet per metal plate (or they don't use them). A "good" solution is to use at least 2 magnets per side

- I was not satisfied by this "good" solution so I thought to remove metal plates (they're held by a simple adhesive) and to put magnets instead. First tests are confirming this would work well. I didn't thought about which size to put (EDIT² : You can only put 1/4" x 1/32", 1/16" thickness is too big) and how to glue them not too strongly, I'll see this later

EDIT : Yes, I got my new magnets, and I had ordered lots of different sizes, including sizes that fit perfectly in the Nexus (a mod which I didn't plan ;) )
[Nexus 5 Accessories] crazifyngers:
Sorry I meant the universal attachment mount not the 3d printed portion.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] crazifyngers:
I noticed this as well.i'm curious if using 8x1mm magnets to replace the metal plates will have a negative effect on the phone. i have some of those that would fit perfectly in place of the metal plates currently on the back cover.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
In fact it is exactly 1/4" x 1/32", which is not an integer in millimeters. It's close to 6-7 x 1 mm. You'd better order a product sized in inches if you want it to match perfectly.

I didn't experience short term side effects on the phone, and I don't see why there should be some (except on antennas and on wireless charge - I didn't experience noticeable troubles for those). I just glued my magnets in the back cover, if I experience something weird I'll report it on XDA.

If you replace plates with magnets, the official Nexus charger won't hold well. It does dock and charge, but docking is less efficient than with plates. You might consider to change magnets in the charger for discs if possible (I'll try it).

I'll probably post 2 topics : one for charger teardown, one for "Nexus 5 magnets mod". Not immediately though, I don't have access to my pictures ATM.

Of course I'll try to finish this car charger too, it should be easier with those magnets glued inside. ;)
[Nexus 5 Accessories] crazifyngers:
I don't have the official charger and don't plan on purchasing one. I don't think the price premium is justified with the slight increase in supply current. I have the same type of wireless charger in the OP, simple a round fairly generic qi charger.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
k I dissembled the metal plates to measure them exactly.

Mine are 6.01-6.03mm in diameter and 0.5mm in height.

My digital sliding gauge has a tolerance of 0.01mm!

the back of our N5 at the plates is also 0.5mm thick.

So I'll do some new simulations

never ever they will repel the magnets! It's another effect cause of shearing!

do what you want. I can't imagine this would be better.

When it would be fine to place such a strong magnetic field next to the electronics the whole time, why google hasn't done it?
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
looks like you have another product

is it possible that the google charger has coils to generate the magnetic field instead of permanent magnets?
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Can somebody tell me how thick the nexus 5 bumber exactly is?

So I can improve my simulations
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
Well those 1/4" x 1/32" magnets I ordered from K&J Magnetics fit perfectly in the metal plates' slots, that's why I say they're sized like the metal plates. For diameter it fits exactly, and Google tells me that 1/4" is 6,35mm. If your tools are right then the magnets I got have a diameter of 1/4" - 0,35mm - which may be true, I don't know size margins of K&J Magnetics.

For their height I didn't check, I only saw by eye that they were (almost ?) the same, for Google 1/32" = almost 0,8mm. As my eyes are less accurate than tools I might have done an error of 0,3mm, you should be right. ;)

Nope, it is very clear in the charger, it's permanent magnets (and if you don't plug the charger, it still attracts the phone). As I said I'll post pics tonight.

Roughly 1mm.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
when did you bought your N5?
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
Google play, I think I got the standard non-US model (which only picks different frequencies).

However I know that there were slight variations in phones models since initial releases, probably because Google had to replace many early Nexuses. You can easily find topics here talking about little differences between those almost-identical Nexuses. I ordered my phone at the beginning of December.

But I don't know why would Google do such a pointless change. So I must have done errors when measuring. ;)

BTW, I almost finished the charger-teardown topic.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
I bought in the release hour. So it looks like you have the second revision. I should have the first revision.

It's absolutely not pointless. The taller your metal plates are, the better they will stick to magnets!

Don't think that one of us did so huge errors.

I think they realized, that the first model wont be able to stick to a magnetic charger with a bumper on it.

I'll ask if they will send me the new revision cause of this :D
[Nexus 5 Accessories] matejdro:
Has anybody tried that in actual car with navigation?

I would love to have dock where I just snap phone on, but I'm worried 600mA of charging current would not be enough for screen + GPS + high CPU activity for constantly drawing map.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Here are the new simulations, that looks way better!

N5 revision1 (got before December)

Magnet 6x2 N45

Magnet 8x2 N45

Magnet 12x2 N45

Edit: better ones will follow, when picked out all errors xD
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
When I tried the GPS Signal it works flawlessly, but don't used it in a car for now, so I can't tell if 600mA is enough :/ but I'm really convinced that it will.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
Even if it would not charge it enough fast, it would at least slow down a lot the discharge. With a decent amount of battery, even with one of the worst wireless mount, I doubt you'd run out of juice quickly.

BTW, here is the charger teardown.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
K I got what and why Google is doing this. If you want I can make some n1 simulation pictures for you ;) don't like to explain it in words...
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Ano59:
Nice because I still don't get it. :p

With my new "magnetized" Nexus 5, I tried magnets on a placeholder (some cardboard with 4 sacrificed magnets glued on it), it holds very firmly even with my bumper (detaching the phone is easy though). :) Without rubber. So if I manage to make perfect holes in my charger, then I'll probably have a nice car mount ! BTW I don't have any noticeable difference in 2G/3G/4G reception nor in Wifi reception and NFC is completely as efficient (I'm absolutely sure about this due to the tags I'm using). Wireless charging works, I didn't check over time if the charge is consistent though.

EDIT : Oh and as I got the proof of concept by myself that car docking will work, here you go for the big beer. ;)
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
Wow thanks so much!!! *big hug*!

For this I'll do a short sketch until I'm home to do the simulations :D

Edit:

There it is :)

Gesendet von meinem GT-N8000 mit Tapatalk

Edit 2:

What you have done

What you can try:

But so this array don't make much sense, because the NdFeB magnets have a permeability of around 1.

So the strength won't increase when the other magnets are stronger.
[Nexus 5 Accessories] Craiq:
So here is the Simulation

I guess the distance from the magnets to the metal plates are around 1mm because the additional glas between.

The magnets are 4mm x 4mm

it says the force is 1,5N, but don't know how it comes to this number, cause its only a 2D model.

The other 2,5D models (rotation symmetrical) are below this force with a distance of 0.6mm.

The best there is 6x2 with 1.38N. 8x2 what I use has just 0.8N in this simulation.

So google has the strongest but also the biggest arrangement.

Edit:

Guess this will also reduce the impact on the coil.

So I'll look again into my arrangement with this knowlege