yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[One (M7) General] One Twelve:
Minimum for what ?

Viewing on full HD only requires 2MP. This means you can do a 50% crop and still be ok. If you have a 4k screen then you want 4MP. No crop possible. The max size you can print with 4MP is 10 x 14 inches. if you want a bigger picture then you need more pixels.

The 1020 reduces a 41MP to 5MP. Are you going to tell Nokia they are nuts too ? the oversampling will produce a better photo than the 41MP.

Just look at the Z1 photo thread. Hell look at any photo thread of any phone on this board and all you need to see is one photo to debunk this very often parroted statement.

To quote an HTC one owner from the HTC one thread, bad photo does not mean bad camera.

Those that learnt to play with manual have been getting good shots since October. SA is hit & miss. You could always get better if you tweaked things with any camera. How many people do that ? no, they just want to hide behind the camera.

the camera does not make the shot, you do. Step out in front and say i took that shot instead of xyz camera did it.

---------- Post added at 10:49 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:45 PM ----------

I said i would examine in more detail i've not done that yet. I wanted to seperate out the HDR htc ones from the regular and take a better look.

Not found the time yet.
[One (M7) General] pshdo:
If you use your pictures for anything other than viewing them on your phone or on a tv you'll know that you won't get anywhere with 4mp...

If you eg use them to document something for a costumer, it is a problem that you can't zoom on a picture later on...

It is actually hilarious that HTC in fact downgraded the camera resolution from the older phones instead of just keeping the 8mp and just make them better and better...

4mp is so last century...

That said, the point and shoot, auto mode is as usual working great on HTC in general...

That is NOT working on the Z1 at all...!

And THAT auto feature just has to work, because lets face it, none of us is pro photographers anyway, and if we were then a phone camera would never be our choice anyway....
[One (M7) General] PcFish:
Everyone check out the Z1S, seems they've fixed all the problems the Z1 had. IPS screen now too.
[One (M7) General] pshdo:
Funny man... ;)

I use the cam to document things and problems, type numbers and so on, often instead of pen and paper...

- and that just have to work...

Three of my earlyer phones was many times better than both the Z1 and the ONE, and plece note i have actually both here in front to me...

When you are at work, and out with a customer, you should not have to think mutch about distance, light, iso or any thing else, just point and shoot, and see the details later...

My three earlyer phones, the Xperia S, the One X+ and the Xperia V (all 3 that i also still have in a drawer) lived up to that, with a clear edge for the Xperia S and V, only becource of more pixels, and thereby better zoom posibility later on...

- all three had working point and shoot auto mode, just as the ONE has...

I think i said that 8mp was absolutly minimum, not that it was quite enough...

With 4mp you have to think about what details you need to focus on, and not just point and shoot...

You need to be really carefull, becource you are not able to zoom and see details later...

With eg. my Xperia V, i allmost never had to think about anything, just take the picture and use it like i need to later in the office...

When i say that 4mp is so last Century, i mean it...

The way i have to work with the 4mp in this phone is actually a lot like working with an old digital camera 10 or 15 years ago...

If you take a picture of a bird, that you just want to view on the phone screen or your tv, then you are right, the camera is fine in the ONE...

- i just use it a little different...

The Z1 dont work in automode for my use...

- the Pictures look Sharp on screen, but when you try to zoom later, you see they are blurry in the details, and that is not better than having too few pixels like the ONE...

If your statement about HTC saying that fewer pixels are better, is true, then explain why HTC have not removed the auto feature yet, as you have used the last half to point out that auto is crap...

Offcource auto is not perfect for everything, but if they put the feature in the phone it has to work well, and Z1 don´t....

Just yesterday i tried over 20 times to get the Z1 to take a picture of a detail label on a machine, and i was not able to do it at all...

HTC ONE, i used 2 sec, and bam the first picture was perfect...

So don´t say the autofeature works on the Z1, becource it simply dont...

Pleace note that i have latest firmware released on both phones...
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
Personally I never zoom in, not like I can do it on the TV anyway so I guess for my needs htc one is enough , forgive me if I'm mistaken but we all want for the most part simply to point and shoot, at least that's what I want and usually what I do is some macro, people, animals,indoor rarely some other stuff like what I posted on the first page, I just don't see the point of taking landscapes with my phone especially with htc one since it sux there, I had HoX before and it was great for this but I never used it, besides I do have some landscapes with htc one and I'm perfectly happy with those nor I seek for anything better, I simply don't really care for camera and if one 2 has exactly the same camera as the htc one I'm gonna be happy as long as it sports the things that matter to me like : 5 inch display, 3000+ battery and s805, for the rest I don't care.

Sorry for OT , anyway long story short all I want is usable camera for pretty much any scenario without me having to manually work on it, just plain point and shoot, and this on htc one truly works great.
[One (M7) General] HtcOneJon:
I'd have to disagree with almost everything you have said in your post.

I have the Z1 and the HTC One, and each phone has it's pluses and minuses.

4MP is absolutely fine for almost any use, including printing up to A3 photo size, which I have done a lot recently, viewing on TV, taking pics in good and low light, of any subjects.

The Z1 is a great camera when used in manual, auto mode is ok though.

If you don't know how to take pictures with HTC One or Z1 yet, and I can, as well as I can on my Canon Powershot 14MP, 10X Digital camera zoom in some situations, then give up.
[One (M7) General] pshdo:
Damn, i am sorry, i see it now....

I am sorry that i said your lovely phone has a crappy camera, as 4mp is the best ever...

- it is clearly the BEST on the marked, the marked leeder, the bleeding edge, it is the best there was, is and ever will be...

Damn it... it is even better than a Hasselblad camera...Clearly better...

- you just have to take a step forward if you have not enough pixels, but how can that be, it has 4mp and that is more than enough for everybody in the world...

Nothing compares to a HTC ONE... NOTHING...!

And even thoug the Z1 has the potiential to be a better camera, it can NEVER beat the HTC ONE... Nothing can, and nothing ever will !!!

I just didn´t remember that HTC was the god here...

- and i AM sorry... but only for waisting time on trying to open your eyes to the fact that 4mp is SOOOO last century...:rolleyes:
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
Little to much sarcastic, anyway I agree with you that 4mp isn't enough for everyone, in my case where I don't really care for camera is pretty much enough since I never bother cropping but yes 4mp still does sound pretty old and sort of a shaming, but that still doesn't change the fact that htc one does what htc said it will, which is pretty much great low light, indoor and social life picturing, these things truly htc one does great and us who complain don't really have any right to do so, did htc ever said it'll have more quality then 13mp shooter, no it didn't, but did it say we don't need more than 4mp? Yes it did, we're they right? Depends how you look at that, if you follow what they wanted to do with the camera then yes, if you wanna take a pic and crop it then no but they never intended to make it good for cropping... And let's face it we can't even see our 4mp pic on pretty much any TV in full size so what is the point of even having 50mp if you'll never in your life have the chance to see it? Lastly this is a phone like every other and it's meant to capture fast snapshots not professional photography, let's get real none android phone comes even near Nokia shooters like 1520 or even already long retired pure view 808, I doubt we will even in 2014, maybe in 2015.

I doubt many non techy ppl even care for this, all what average Joe wants is for the phone camera to work when they need it, and that's pretty much it, ppl wouldn't spend thousands of dollars on professional dslr cameras if phones were good, I mean our camera sensors are what 15/20$ seriously Lol what can 15/20$ sensor do to an 300$ dedicated camera? Nothing don't even compare it to professional stuff that are like 2/5k worthy :confused:

Can't we all just be happy with this piece of **** cameras we got Lol and let it go, when oems decide to spare some real money on camera and nano tech gets serious we might see some real quality pictures , I assume this is starting, htc started making low light technology and ois + everybody pretty much followed , sony started using Carl zeiss lenses, it's a good start vs 2012 imo :cool:
[One (M7) General] One Twelve:
You said you had a problem but did not really give us a chance to suggest anything.

Basically your point is...

xperia S/V or one+ >>>> One or Z1 (for your particular needs)

No comparative photos uploaded showing the issues, we are supposed to imagine what the problem is. More importantly we are expected to believe everything you said here. There is no way to debate here without seeing some evidence.

You have not tried hard enough to show us that 4MP is so 'last century. Not a clinching argument yet.
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
Good point lol.
[One (M7) General] Timaustin2000:
Returning to the OP; the daytime outdoors shots of the HTC One look terrible to me - not natural at all. They look over-exposed and flat. There's more depth and texture to the Z1's shots, even if they're a touch darker than reality (which, based on the captured cloud cover, I doubt - there's no way that the day was as bright as the HTC made it out with cloud cover that thick).

My 2 Cents.

Note: I have a Z1 and, in Manual 8Mp, I'm completely satisfied - I've taken many, many photo's with it that I'm pretty certain no other Android snapper could deliver. Here are some examples:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/16762205@N04/sets/72157635983420745/
[One (M7) General] Arthur Hucksake:
The HTC One shots would have been better if the sharpness was lowered.

I have the Z1 for awhile and was pretty disappointed with the camera. It's the software that lets it down.

(Then there is the screen, don't get me started on that.)

Such a shame, I really loved everything else about it.
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
I wouldn't bet on that * no other android could deliver * never the less the pics you've taken are great as well.

Here some pics that literally destroy your pics , taken with HTC One.

https://plus.google.com/photos/113335639550553560304/albums/5910434304629850081

Here's the ORIGINAL THREAD which much more photos :) This is how the pics from HTC One look like when someone knows how to use the camera to it's full potential :)

Thx to [MENTION=1979777]shasderias[/MENTION] for the pics.
[One (M7) General] allhill:
Both ONE or Z1 has a good camera, depending on the user.

There a quote from photography world...

“THE BEST CAMERA IS THE ONE THAT’S WITH YOU”. Chase Jarvis
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
Agreed !
[One (M7) General] Timaustin2000:
Excuse the emphasis but PLEASE DO NOT TRY TO "DESTROY" ANYTHING WITH POST-PROCESSED PICTURES!

That's a ridiculous comeback. The OP who created those images says quite clearly that those shots are HEAVILY post-processed and enhanced. Mine were not. If I wanted to, I could post-process mine and "DESTROY" (you like that word) these.

Fact is, I'm interested in the native capabilities of each camera not touch-ups. I could take an iPhone 3G picture, touch it up and make it look epic, for crying out loud.

Though appreciate this comment. Peace.
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
Well my cousin with z1 is coming tomorrow at my place ( hopefully he is Lol) well take another short test, this time I'll try and convince him to leave all photos without deleting them, also night and flash photos. Except this time I'll be using MANUAL as well ;).

We'll see where exactly does z1 stands :sly:
[One (M7) General] iPhonda:
I vote for one not because I've one but because I just like two photos from the z1 and it's cloud photos, the z1 have a great camera but the colors and clarity from the one are greater...

Enviado do meu HTC One através de Tapatalk
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
For me mainly why I like one photos more then the ones on z1 in overall is because I can actually see every detail on every pic while z1 shots are just too dark and most missed the real colors or some same stuff look just different on each photo while the same stuff look on all htc photos the same.
[One (M7) General] bamps:
Some pictures I choose Z1 over the One. But in other pictures I like the One more as the Z1.

In low light conditions the One is much better. But saturation of Z1 is beter in good light conditions.

Me personally would choose the One over the Z1. Cause when I take picture it's moostly in bad light conditions.
[One (M7) General] pshdo:
HTC ONE just has mutch too small sensor (4mp is so last Century), and there is nothing to do about that...

SONY Xperia Z1, has the hardware to be the best, but lack of camera optimazion in firmware is obvious...
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
This test clearly proves that even 4mp is enough to beat 20, so what's the point of having 20?, the hardware indeed is better on z1 camera but software is pure crap, and by the time IF software ever gets fixed will be too late, in just 1/2 months we're getting new flagships and neither htc one or z1 will be mentioned in camera test, so both will be last century Lol.

The point of buying a phone is to have everything working from day one, especially key features which in z1 case is camera which didn't deliver what it was hyped for and now few months later it's still pretty much the same and I doubt this will change any time soon and if does it'll be too late.
[One (M7) General] pshdo:
4mp is enough until Sony get the finger out, and optimize the camera... True!

The only thing I say is that Sony actually HAVE the hardware to improve, the camera if they put in the effort, HTC can't improve anything as they are at the limit with the 4mp (last century) chip...

And that's a fact!

At last, no phone is bug free from the release, certainly not Sony or HTC, bugfixes fly all over the place...

An other "key feature" is phonecall, but my ONE keep insisting that I am on a airplane if I talk for more than 10-15min, and close both sim cards... Bug free indeed... LOL
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
This issue with talking i've never seen it before , and this issue could be only yours ALONE , while z1 camera sux WIDE range among all Z1 devices not one ... LOL.

HTC One definetelly had less buggs then sony , this is a fact as well.

Anyway i agree z1 camera has great potention , but i'm afraid you'll never get to see the full camera potential , it's like you bought lamburgini car that is supposed to go 350 MPH but it goes for 50MPH lol and you hope one day you'll get those promissed 350MPH which is most likely never gonna happen, asap Z2 comes out Z1 will get abadoned and all what will sony care about is the z2 not last year flagship :) It's the same with all oems not sony lol, the sad part you guys most likely will never get camra fixed trully which is sad cuz i'm dying to see true power of z1 camera >.<
[One (M7) General] evo21:
The One's sensor is as big as the Galaxy S4 and iPhone 5S (1/3"). I don't think you know what you're talking about. The Z1 does have a bigger sensor (1/2.3") but calling a 1/3" sensor last century is a bit extreme.

Megapixels aren't everything, just look at the Nexus 4. There are a lot of factors that contribute to image quality. I'm not saying the camera on the One is better than the Z1, just saying you can't base everything solely on the amount of pixels the sensor can output.
[One (M7) General] HtcOneJon:
I have the HTC One and now the Z1, and in some situations the Z1 camera is great, but in most, the pictures come out incredibly poor. This is mostly due to the lack of focusing. The Z1 can't focus properly to save it's life and details are not sharp enough.
[One (M7) General] pshdo:
I call 4mp last century, and it is...

The actual size of the chip is not for dissussion, it is still only a 4mp sensor nomatter what you say or do...

Pixels do matter, or so it seems...;)

WHAT is the reason for this thread, if not for HTC ONE owners to sit here and agree that the camera is better than the big bad Z1...:laugh:

Interresting !

We have two of these "bug free airplaine phones", both with the same problem, so it is NOT mine alone.;)

We also have a supporter at HTC saying that this is a known firmware bug, that will be fixed soon with 4.4...

The absolutly first responce i recived was "This sounds like a firmware bug"... HTC ONE Bug free ??? Indeed :good:

It is allways funny to see people fight the truths just to validate their buy...
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
Lol 2 devices of which both that you're saying could be lie, take a look at one forums PLEASE find me someone complaining on this, if this was firmware bug we'd have it mentioned in q/a forum or general, but there are none.

This isn't the matter of htc owners, everyone with just a bit of common sense and good eyes will vote for the htc regardless of how many pixels does it have.

I agree with you it should have more pixels but if I must choose overall usability from htc one vs z1 I'd chose htc one, i want working camera when I need it not to waste time to tweak it and then again even with tweaking it still doesn't match htc one in most scenarios.

And again since we're speaking of pixels htc one has larger pixels then any phone and it has larger f2.0 vs 2.2 on s4 so in overall when you compare z1 vs htc one in night z1 should see about 30% better and it does, but still can't match htc one in the quality of the picture nor it makes better picture, so your pixels are quiet useless here especially if we're gonna zoom z1 has too much noise here ;).

In daylight z1 definitely doesn't match htc one in color precision, in fact I haven't met android phone that does. Nexus is the only one that is quiet close to this.

So please enlighten me why are pixels so important aside from cropping when z1 camera overall produces worse pictures then htc one? Oh wait I know the answer! You're one of those where " bigger is better regardless of what your own eyes show you" :sly::what::confused:

Edit ;

I'll be actually kind and ask my cousin ti bring tomorrow xperia Z vs htc one camera test we made, xperia Z should definitely win right? More pixels! /sarcasm

And even better! My cousin and I will make another quick test Z1 VS HTC ONE just for you but this time I will use MANUAL AS WELL.

Just a hint I will slaughter z1 even more this time since it won't be all auto from my end ;)
[One (M7) General] Sentinel196:
I own a Z1 and One and overall I find the quality of the photos that the Z1 takes to be superior.

The One is great for people that think post-production filters and over-saturation make good photos (the Instagram generation).
[One (M7) General] pshdo:
Are you actually that stupid, i have screendump of both conversations with HTC...

And the fact is that the phone has a known frmware bug...

- this bug we have on these phones, is somehow related to an other also well known bug, that also is pressent on this amazing Hasselblad camera phone...

You do know about the "sim 2 losing signal" problem right ??

The rest of your funny reply i dont even bother to answer, as it leeds to nothing...

- we both know you are wrong m8...:laugh:

It is allways funny to see people fight the truths just to validate their buy...
[One (M7) General] Sidgah:
Well... I have a HTC One and my brother has a Z1 and the 4MP resolution of the HTC One camera it does matter. At small sizes it looks pretty close BUT at full size the Z1 it just kick HTC One...
[One (M7) General] Timaustin2000:
A couple of photo's to consider, here: both taken by the z1. With the greatest respect to the HTC One, the resolution just ain't there to produce similar results to these.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/16762205@N04/12217885885/sizes/h/in/photostream/

Indoors, high-detail image. The Z1 has a narrow depth of focus so if you focus on summat, it stays focused on that - in this case it's the coat and racks of buttons. This delivers outstanding Bokeh effects. It's an indoors shot, too - relatively low-light.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/16762205@N04/12218028663/sizes/h/in/photostream/

A night shot - only 2 real light sources and a VERY dark street. The reason I'm sharing this one is this: see the street sign at the far end of the street? It's (just about) readable. In the Dark.

As I say, nothing against the HTC One but the OP would have you believe that the Z1's camera is an utter loss. This is completely misleading. If you know how to use it, there's no doubt in my mind that it's the king of Android Snappers. For now.

Let the flaming begin :)
[One (M7) General] dakunclear:
I'm not going to post with flickr just cause I'm on my phone and I'm lazy so here are some photos with my z1
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
Those are very good shots.

Anyway the new test I was hoping for to do with the cousin failed. He sold the z1 due some hardware/software issues ( yellow screen, touch screen issues and some other stuff ) before I got the chance to make a test with him, anyway he got himself htc one... luckily his brother has z1 and a friend has note 3, so he should be giving us some test soon within 1/2 days if not I'm going to their place ( 350 km away) in a month after I get from the trip from France and do some tests with them. Hopefully z1 camera improved with firmware 136 and will get even more improvements by the time I get there.

Till then here some shots from today from mine and his m7.
[One (M7) General] PcFish:
Can anyone tell me how action shots are with the Z1? It doesn't have OIS, but it does have that BIONZ chip, but I don't know if it fares well.

My One has had battery issues (12 hours with everything google off, wifi/data/gps/EVERYTHING off, even on Airplane mode), I just sent it in for repair twice and it's been annoying me. So I'm considering the Z1S or the Two next month.
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
From what I've seen seen z1 is quiet good with action shots, still htc one does better due ois + ZOE, it's literally impossible to miss a shot. While we have Flash is also very good but z1 fails here.
[One (M7) General] Shadow.Mage:
...and I was actually considering replacing my HTC One for a Z1 Compact because of the camera. Not anymore! Thanks for the awesome comparison and saving my money! :highfive:
[One (M7) General] Shan89:
Well this test is vs z1 not z1 compact, I don't know anything about z1 compact.

Either way you're welcome.

I have another test of z1 vs htc one, tho photos are from viber and quality is lost so I won't be pushing it online, in a month when I get to my cousins place I'll make a full test again, this time on a sunny day.

In the meantime here few photos from the viber.

Keep in mind my cousin doesn't really know how to use htc one camera since he has the one for about few days now and he pretty much did point and shoot.

The next test of mine will be hopefully vs z1 vs note 3, except this time I'm going fully manual not like the first time only auto and hdr :D

Z1 is first photo 2nd htc one.

Note ; there are many more photos I've just uploaded few, overall z1 and htc one were pretty much overall close from my cousins test + the quality is lost via viber + Tapatalk. So please don't take this few photos as real test.