yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus 10 General] brees75:
I thought there was a Chromebook with the same SoC?

Personally, unless I am doing a side by side comparison with my wife's Ipad4 or looking for problems I don't notice any gamma issues. I notice that when I sit down and just enjoy it, it's actually pretty easy to do. I love my Nexus 10.
[Nexus 10 General] EniGmA1987:
Actually your right there is a chromebook thqat uses this chipset. I am sure a dev has already at least casually looked through its source. If anyone else wants to look, the Samsung Chromebook is supposed to use this source tree:

http://git.chromium.org/gitweb/?p=c...now-2695.B;hb=refs/heads/firmware-snow-2695.B

source for finding that git tree is:
[Nexus 10 General] 3473:
Looking forward to this if its possible, the whites on my nexus 10 look yellow
[Nexus 10 General] Aftershok:
Like someone above mentioned, I believe the latest official release of the kernel comes with the color tweaks baked in.

I've attached a photo of my N10 (top) next to my dad's iPad 3. It's even more egregious in real life, but even in this picture, it's easily seen how much softer and lighter the blue paint looks on the Nexus. Knowing what the car looks like in person, I can attest that the iPad is displaying it much closer to real life.
[Nexus 10 General] the_boo:
Is that the same picture or did you take pictures with each device's camera?

They look like different pictures to me(slightly different angles) ... You need to load the same picture(from the same camera) on both tablets and then take a picture of that...
[Nexus 10 General] Aftershok:
Of course it's the same picture. How would this be a comparison of the screens if I took two different pictures with the tablets' cameras? It's clearly the same photo, and the angles are the same.
[Nexus 10 General] the_boo:
The way each device has cropped the image makes it look like different pictures and I totally agree it looks better on the ipad... Especially the first of the trees on the left
[Nexus 10 General] EniGmA1987:
The top one looks way better to me. The iPad has a lot less detail and far too over saturated colors.
[Nexus 10 General] Aftershok:
It's totally up to you to make that subjective call, but I don't think it's up for debate that the iPad has much better color reproduction. The iPad is actually very well calibrated and makes colors pop and look vibrant without cranking up the contrast and saturation too much. I don't see what you mean when you say the iPad has less detail, maybe you're seeing how the camera that took the picture underexposed some of the darker parts of the iPad's display. It's still clear to me that the blue is just waaaay off on the Nexus 10. In real life, the blue is a deep, almost purple-y blue hue. The Nexus displays it almost like a sky blue/baby blue shade. I would attempt a blind comparison between the devices, but it's difficult as it's immediately obvious to distinguish between the devices due to the differing aspect ratios.

Tom's Hardware did a great job in their review on this front, though. Can't post links, but just remove the space in the middle.

tomshardware .com/reviews/nexus-10-benchmark-tablet,3410-6.html
[Nexus 10 General] espionage724:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nexus-10-benchmark-tablet,3410-6.html

The flower pictures, I can see more detail on the N10 screen. The iPad's screen looks more saturated, but it also seems to have too much contrast, thus losing the finer details.

I like details over over-saturated colors.
[Nexus 10 General] 3473:
I also own both devices, and the colours are definitely a lot better on the iPad
[Nexus 10 General] jweitzel24:
Off topic, but good god do I want a focus st
[Nexus 10 General] Aftershok:
Brofist. I love the Focus ST, and plan to buy one as soon as I can. Kudos to you for recognizing it! It first occurred to me how bad the blues were on the Nexus 10 when I was frequenting the forum for the car, and it was particularly bad with that particular shade of blue.

For those of you mentioning how there is more "detail" on the N10 display, I'm think detail is something that's better experienced in person. These photo comparisons of the screens serve better to capture the relative difference in color.

At this point, I guess we are to assume that there is not much progress being made as far as color calibration is concerned? How was the nut finally cracked for the color control on the GNex? Did it take more than nearly six months in the product cycle for it to happen? That's about where we're at for the Nexus 10.
[Nexus 10 General] EniGmA1987:
It is true they are best served to compare colors, but if you are viewing the images on a proper IPS panle monitor that is calibrated properly you can see how crushed the detail is on the iPad. In the heavy color areas it is so far over-saturated that all detail within those areas is lost completely. I noticed this same thing in the darker areas of your own picture on the first page too. You claim is is probably from underexposure in the camera but that cant be right because then the Nexus 10 would have the same problem. Yet I can see detail fine on the N10 and the dark areas in the iPad are crushed.

With the color adjustments in the KTmanta kernel, after professional measurements were done to the screen we clearly find that the Nexus 10 is pretty close to perfectly calibrated in gamma, and greyscale, and many colors are near dead one. The one big issue remaining is the blue, which is basically almost into cyan color. Everything else is pretty good now.

I believe Ezekeel created the color control for the Galaxy nexus, or at least he is always credited when a kernel enables color control in it. I bought my GNex a couple months after it was released and the color control was already there in full swing. So I imagine the Galaxy nexus got this feature enabled very soon after its launch, probably cause it was either much easier to do on an OMAP4 processor, or the code was already there and easy to reach. This Exynos5 chipset is brand new, and has had its color control code completely removed from the source. Which is why things are so difficult.
[Nexus 10 General] s1lenz:
I just wanted to share my own experience with the Nexus 10's color calibration. I "rented" a unit from office depot and returned it 2 days later because the colors were so overly warm compared to an ipad. If you just looked at the grass you'd figure it was spring on the ipad and fall on the nexus 10.

Here is my photo gallery comparing the two

http://imgur.com/a/zQ8rF

please don't 'rawr nexus 10 rules' 'rawr your camera sucks' 'rawr pixel 1647 in the upper left 37th quadrant looks superior to pixel 4728 on the ipad rawr' at me.

I took some quick shots with my nexus 4 before i took it back, these are 1000000%%%%% unscientific comparions and should be taken with a grain of salt. If you want to see the full resolutions click on the gear icon on the upper right.
[Nexus 10 General] AM Radio:
based on this gallery, both are off, IMO. Nexus 10 colours are definitely weaker overall but the iPad is a touch too saturated -- those reds are on fire.
[Nexus 10 General] EniGmA1987:
Overall color temp was brought to be a bit "cooler" with the color tweaks in the KTManta kernel. But yes stock colors are warm.
[Nexus 10 General] s1lenz:
thanks, thats good to know, i might try my hand at a reburbished model from ebay...
[Nexus 10 General] EniGmA1987:
I dont have an iPad for comparison directly in a pic, but if you could link me to that same image you used I can put it on my Nexus 10 and take a picture of it with my Nexus phone as well and show you what the colors look like now.
[Nexus 10 General] s1lenz:
would but i have no idea where that source is from

edit: i think this is it

http://images4.fanpop.com/image/pho...-you-happy-teddybear64-16736131-2560-1704.jpg
[Nexus 10 General] EniGmA1987:
Just so you know, my calibrated IPS panel monitor does show a little bit of a warm tint to the grass in this image. So both the iPad and Nexus 10 are off in the comparison you did. The iPad not showing the proper warm temp and the N10 showing far too warm of a temperature. Still, the iPad did get it a bit closer in how far it is off. The untweaked N10 is just way off in how warm it is. I will take a pic of my Nexus 10 with the color tweaks in the morning and post it here.
[Nexus 10 General] s1lenz:
Yeh its funny because when I took the pictures I was at work and didnt see how uncalibrated the image was until I got home and looked at it on a calibrated IPS display. The entire image is oversaturated. So much for my comparison!
[Nexus 10 General] knoxploration:
If it's any consolation, you simply cannot compare two tablets using that method anyway. Even if you took a single picture with them both in the frame together, side by side, all you're really testing is the white balance accuracy and image quality of your camera. Whichever tablet is closer to the color temperature chosen by the camera will look better.

The only way to properly test color calibration is with a dedicated colorimeter.
[Nexus 10 General] AM Radio:
just had an idea. based on absolutely no proof that it could work. please bear in mind i'm a flasher of ROMs, would never dream of being able to develop one!

but what IF the Sony Mobile Bravia Engine 2 was ripped out of the Xperia Z/ZL or the Tablet Z — and ported to the Nexus 10? it promises smarter/faster saturation and contrast (makes the blacks slightly darker, colours more punchy).

i mean, could this even be a thing?
[Nexus 10 General] apastuszak:
Some pics

I don't know if this helps anyone, but i took some pics of a comic book, and then the same comic on a Nexus 10 and an iPad 2. You can clearly see that the iPad is far closer to the actual printed page.
[Nexus 10 General] AM Radio:
interesting comparison. what's the brightness set on the Nexus 10?
[Nexus 10 General] knoxploration:
As I pointed out previously, this method -- taking pictures of the tablet screens with a camera -- tells you absolutely zip, apart from:

* Which tablet's color temperature was closer to that of the ambient room lighting in the room you chose

* Which tablet's color temperature the camera was closer to selecting for white balance

* Which tablet the camera's metering system (or you, with manual exposure) exposed the image more correctly for

It tells you absolutely *nothing* about the quality of the screens. Only a colorimeter is going to do that.
[Nexus 10 General] EniGmA1987:
Franco said he spent a bunch of time looking into color control and that it is not possible on the Nexus 10, at least within his abilities. And Franco is a really good dev. Someone will have to completely make the code themselves if we want color control.
[Nexus 10 General] apastuszak:
I'm surprised Google doesn't want to fix this issue and properly calibrate the screen colors on the Nexus 10.

And those pictures were taken using the auto-brightness setting on the Nexus 10.
[Nexus 10 General] KrummeEs:
Have we (= you developers) given up on this?

I say you because I'm not a developer, I'm only enjoying (and appreciating) the good work that is being done by the developers. I'm curious to know if this is where it ends. Anywhere I can "+1" on a request to Google to fix this problem?
[Nexus 10 General] JasW:
Perhaps Google thinks colors on tabs should be natural rather than oversaturated. When I see these iPad/Nexus 10 comparison, the iPad pictures look like someone painted the grass for St. Patrick's Day. I actually like the pop of oversaturation in some instances -- for example, on my Note 2, I keep the Screen Mode on Samsung's Standard (over)saturation rather than the more natural (and some would say undersaturated) Natural or Movie settings. But I likes me a natural look on tabs.
[Nexus 10 General] mark.m.moran:
I only have my Nexus 10 about a week but yesterday when reading an eBook on a white screen I am sure I noticed a yellowish tint in the top left hand corner, is this normal guys!?

Cheers,

M
[Nexus 10 General] EniGmA1987:
No its not. That comes from backlight bleed
[Nexus 10 General] mark.m.moran:
But I can only notice it mate on a white background!??
[Nexus 10 General] 3473:
It's not backlight bleed. The whites on this tablet are inherently yellow due to poor contrast
[Nexus 10 General] mark.m.moran:
OK, is there a way to fix this at all!??
[Nexus 10 General] 3473:
Probably not unless we're able to access mdnie values for color tuning. Even then it might not be perfect, as its to do with the panel itself

Though with that said, blacks look very good for an LCD. It's just the whites that look poor (IMO)
[Nexus 10 General] mark.m.moran:
Cheers
[Nexus 10 General] JasW:
Interesting thing happened last night -- my daughter (age 9) had drawn a very colorful picture on my Note 2 with the S Pen. I sent it to my Nexus 10 and it was immediately apparent (as my daughter quickly noted) that the colors were much more washed out as well as different/inaccurate on the Nexus 10.

I told my daughter it was because of the Standard setting I had on the Note 2, and changed that to Natural to show her the difference. While that toned down the display on the Note 2, it was still apparent that the colors were different and more washed out on the N10.

I sent the picture from the N10 to a Canon printer, and saw pretty much the same thing -- what was a brilliant magenta and intense lavender on the print out (and Note 2 display) was a pedestrian pink and odd shade of blue on the N10.

I really wish there were a way to calibrate the color on this thing. For a device whose main marketing claim is its display, the colors do indeed disappoint.
[Nexus 10 General] PoisonWolf:
Amoled displays are the epitome of color-flooding. It's too high in color saturation. If you like that, good for you. I prefer real-life looking displays.
[Nexus 10 General] JasW:
I'm certainly not expressing a preference for Super AMOLED over LED, or for oversaturation for that matter, at least in tabs (phones and their smaller screens are another story -- I kind of like the pop of Super AMOLED there). That is in any event the x axis. I'm more concerned with the y axis of color accuracy. The N10 has a nice, natural seeming, undersaturated look, but its color accuracy leaves something to be desired.
[Nexus 10 General] s1lenz:
It's been like that for all nexus devices (4 7 and 10). Unfortunately Google doesnt seem to give a **** about having proper color calibration. You can argue that the average consumer doesnt care, but thats not true. they just dont know they care. you put a nexus 10 and an ipad (retina) side-by-side and you ask anybody off the street what looks better and they'll say the ipad. not because they know what the hell deep blacks are or have any idea what color calibration is. They just look at it and say "I dunno... this just looks better."

To be fair, nexus devices are incredibly cost effective, and calibrating the screens would be an extra step in production which would raise the cost of the final product. that being said, there's no reason they couldn't softcode color profiles into say, an app and allow the users to color calibrate the screens themselves. Its a total waste of an ips panel. Samsung does it (although its very limited) on their phones. MS is releasing an advanced color calibration profile for the new lumia. No reason.
[Nexus 10 General] espionage724:
I personally no nobody else besides myself who cares about color calibration.

Heck, Diablo III, a popular game, ignores all gamma settings when fullscreen. To make matters even worse, their in-game gamma adjuster is nothing but a brightness adjuster. And out of the millions of people who purchased it, only a very small handful of people (I'm talking less than 10 maybe, me included) seem to notice this (notice meaning reported on their forums as a bug). If you have a "perfect" screen, this wouldn't really be an issue to be fair, but there's no way "that" many people have perfect screens... Which leads to the conclusion, people just don't care.

I didn't even care about gamma settings until recently when I randomly decided to calibrate my screen. Was greatly surprised to see how "off" it was lol
[Nexus 10 General] mark.m.moran:
So mate, what did you use to calibrate it!??
[Nexus 10 General] espionage724:
I meant my Desktop's screen; I just used Window's calibration wizard thing
[Nexus 10 General] knoxploration:
If the relevant code to support color profiling was added to Android, the cost would be almost nothing. Sample variation is relatively minor, and it's the work of a few minutes to make a color profile for each display type your suppliers are providing to you. It would be infinitely better than it is now in terms of color accuracy even after you accounted for sample variation.

Sadly, if Google don't come up with a decision themselves, they really don't care what users think. They are not a customer-oriented company, because as far as they're concerned, the customers *are* the product.
[Nexus 10 General] die_for_rock_vn:
I think we need to ask Google for help. N10 is a product of Google and we are customers, we can claim it :D
[Nexus 10 General] s1lenz:
bwahahaha... good luck with that :D it'll fall on deaf ears. they know their products are uncalibrated, they just don't care because they think the average consumer doesnt care, which like i said somewhat true, somewhat false.
[Nexus 10 General] 650hpAMG:
To add to the thread ,I have the following: 2 Nook HD+, iPad 4-64, iPad 3-16, 4 qty iPad 2-16s, Asus TF700-32, and the Nexus 10-32. The Nexus has by far the worst color of the bunch, this being my 2nd,my first exhibiting a large crack sound if you squeeze the rear plastic on the rear right. My new one does the same, just not as loud. Incidentally, the Nooks just suck due to the B&N os on ICS, but the colors were still colors.

The TF700 has the best display overall by far, especially in brightness.The iPad 4 display, though not as bright as the Asus had more accurate colors, though in games such as Epoch the

Nexus 10 looks better vs TF700 and the iPad4 apart from the colors.

The Nexus 10 screen is downright boring as the colors are washed out and bland. If not for the ridiculously slow memory chips causing significant lag on the TF700 (even on CromiX ROM) , it would be my perfect tablet. In person, the Nexus is not even in the same league vs the other top two. Sure the res is higher, but seldom has it occurred that the better PPI made any difference as the washed out colors are what stands out the most-in person. The Nexus is fast, far snappier vs the Asus even with CromiX, but the colors just push me away.

My Note II and S3 both have better color than the Nexus. Go figure.
[Nexus 10 General] Neckberg:
For those of you that own a N 10, would you still today buy one with the colors as they are? I am looking to buy my first tablet and the N 10 was going to be the pick until I started reading all of this color problem it has.

I really will use it for web, a little work (excel/word), and some games. The note 10.1 or the N 10 were my final choices.

What do you think? I can get the N 10 32gb from WalMart for 399 and the Note 10.1 16gb for 329, both refurbs.

For $400 what else do you think I should look at? The screen is a tablet, and I dont like the idea of washed out colors...
[Nexus 10 General] Andrewtst:
Go try out Sony Xperia Tablet Z.

I am damn happy replace my Nexus 10 with Sony Tablet Z.
[Nexus 10 General] c1oud:
I bought it one week ago. It works perfect. Despite having a note 2 which has stunning colours, i have no problem at all with my nexus 10. The colours look ok! I wouldn't notice anything if there wasn't this thread. I reccomend that you buy it. Can't you try it in any store?
[Nexus 10 General] enik_fox:
I would just caution you because the note is only a 720p display with a horrible pixel density so if your going to be doing anything text related the n 10 screen will be much much better and you have the best hardware currently in a tablet
[Nexus 10 General] Fidelator:
This issue has been bothering me ever since I first turned on my N10, after seeing a few N7s in the wild and buying a N4 I can tell that Google did this on purpose, all Nexus devices are cheaper than what their partners offer for similar hardware, I believe that's the reason why Google screwed it's devices in a not too noticeable way.

I will not be buying another nexus device unless there are calibration tools for it, the screen on my N4 was just complete crap until I calibrated it thanks to the work of the Devs (now it's a really good display), the screen on my N10 is the same way, it bothers me.

And the screen calibration isn't the only issue they implanted on their devices, gesture responsiveness is the other one, my dad bought an Optimus G and the pinch to zoom gesture there is far more responsive than on my N4 (despite being the same hardware), pinching to zoom on a Nexus device results in nothing until your fingers are about 1/3" apart from each other. This applies to all current Nexus devices.

Try zooming and going back with the quickpic gallery app and then do the same on the stock gallery, the hardware is picking up the touches, Google put in software restrictions. They put a lot of care into worsening the devices so that their partners wouldn't get mad at them.
[Nexus 10 General] s1lenz:
- color calibration is an extra step at fab that raises prices on the screens

- 4.3 fixes the nexus 4 touch responsiveness. source: i'm running it.
[Nexus 10 General] Fidelator:
Even so they completely removed the mdnie from the code and while the price issue could be understandable on the N4 and N7 it's not acceptable on the N10, I paid $500 + taxes for this device, it costs the same as other High End tablets (you may argue that I paid for a 32gb one vs a 16gb iPad but the iPad is made of aluminum and has a better calibrated display and a bigger battery, components that make the manufacture of that device more expensive, they are profitting from this tablet and not delivering what they should just because Samsung profits more from the overpriced Note 10.1)
[Nexus 10 General] johno86:
There's no sense in arguing about that here. There's really nothing we can do at this point unless an individual has the knowledge and skills to do anything.

One way to avoid disappointment is to enjoy the high resolution with the colors it came with. Comparing it to the Ipad is just going to degrade the N10 in your eyes. So just let it go and stop trying to find reasons this tablet is inferior when it's most definitely not.

I have an ipad but I sure as hell won't let color calibration take away all the other great aspects of this tablet.

I have an endless list of things this tablet can do that I wish I could have done with the ipad in the past. I won't ever waste money on another ipad again. It has sweet colors, but what else can it do that the nexus 10 can't? ITunes? Lol.

Let's just hope a dev can figure something out and posts in this thread or starts a new one in the android development section

Cheers!

Sent from my Nexus 10
[Nexus 10 General] Fidelator:
Oh I didn't mean it that way, I wouldn't trade my N10 for an iPad, iOS lacks too many features and I completely dislike the 4:3 aspect ratio.
[Nexus 10 General] s1lenz:
I think that's a very fair point. It is technically priced at $500, they should calibrate the screen for that amount of money.
[Nexus 10 General] 3DSammy:
To me it would be much better that Google add a standard color calibration app/settings to Android. Then the hardware manufacturers would hook their proprietary drives into those APIs. This would solve the issue once and for all.

I'm not sure why this hasn't been done already.