yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[HTC One V] mynewshiny:
Google is indeed my friend!

Logcat attached (created with CatLog).

It looks like the line where I started the timer is

06-25 06:26:29.412 D/TimerReceiver( 1533): Setting times up to 549774898

and the part where the timer went off is

06-25 06:32:37.683 D/TimerReceiver( 1533): playing ringtone
06-25 06:32:37.693 I/ActivityManager( 382): START u0 {flg=0x10040000 cmp=com.android.deskclock/.timer.TimerAlertFullScreen} from pid 1533

I had set the timer for 5 minutes and 0 seconds, and the display said approximately -1:15 when it went off.

The only obvious errors I see in between are "Skipped XX frames! The application may be doing too much work on its main thread." and a Java exception immediately following an entry stating "Could not lock surface". However, the Java exception occurred several times before I set the timer.

I had to try several times to reproduce the error (the attached logcat contains is only for the successful reproduction). So far I've only been able to trigger the error when using the countdown timer to "snooze" for a different amount of time than the snooze value configured for the clock. In other words, this only ever seems to happen while I'm alseep :D
[HTC One V] Zxo0oxz:
Since I was having trouble finding a decent mirror through goo.im, I've uploaded a copy to mega for everyone else.

cm-10.1-20130612-UNOFFICIAL-primoc.zip (153.9 MB)

https://mega.co.nz/#!lxEFyDwS!PEBiHVNjqZ5StBvvCmEzVTzBYw4erSE_RwIWNWmL5aY
[HTC One V] mynewshiny:
What changes are in the July 10 nightly? Does it address the countdown timer problem?
[HTC One V] kaizone:
rukin you can port for HTC ONE V GSM ????
[HTC One V] RFrancis:
Latest nightly doesn't boot?
[HTC One V] vinnievegas:
Will this rom work with the new hboot? If not, is there a kernel that will make this rom work?
[HTC One V] lilrob1213:
I think it does, but if not simply boot into bootloader and fastboot flash the kernel from rythmic rom 4.2 that one works fine with new hboot :)
[HTC One V] syrkles:
fastboot

i would like to flash this but i have ubuntu 12.04 and i am having trouble flashing the boot.img in linux. i already added the command but i do not know where to put the boot.img so it will flash it. please help i have a bricked one v till i can fix this
[HTC One V] reV17:
You have to place it where fastboot is. Then CD using the terminal.
[HTC One V] syrkles:
So just place it where fastboot is located then just fastboot flash boot boot.img ???
[HTC One V] lilrob1213:
Yeah place the boot.img in the folder that your fastboot files are located on your computer. Then CD (change directory) to where those files are located and then type the command: fastboot flash boot boot.img
[HTC One V] leeb0z:
May have to use sudo depending on your setup. sudo fastboot flash boot boot.img
[HTC One V] syrkles:
can someone send me everything i need to type in cuz i cant access where fastboot is it says access is denied thanks for all the help

---------- Post added at 02:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:02 AM ----------

can someone send me everything i need to type in cuz i cant access where fastboot is it says access is denied thanks for all the help
[HTC One V] leeb0z:
When your phone is loaded into fastboot and plugged in to USB open terminal and run:

sudo fastboot devices

Make sure your phone serial is displayed. After that in terminal cd to directory boot.img is in and run:

sudo fastboot flash boot boot.img
[HTC One V] mrcorey:
I was wondering how you added the command. Some people don't know that Ubuntu has the android SDK in the repos. So, if you want fastboot to work anywhere and if you want to be sure it is installed, add it with apt-get.

apt-get install fastboot

Then, go to the folder where you have the kernel on your PC and run the command as root

sudo fastboot flash boot boot.img

If you didn't rename the file, then use whatever it's name is.

sent from a phone that's running a rom
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Guys don't download the latest build just yet. I'm still figuring out the kinks
[HTC One V] GreatCaesar:
How have the nightlies been lately? I don't think I've flashed one since March.
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Lol I don't think I have either. But not good right now. I haven't really been keeping up to date on them
[HTC One V] brasssmunkye:
are the latest nightlies 10.1.3? that would be dope if a stableish 10.1.3 showed up at some point.
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
I almost have 10.1.3 working correctly, but if you run it right now you'll have many problems. I'm just trying to get it stable
[HTC One V] brasssmunkye:
right on man, will check it out sometime after its stable lol :)
[HTC One V] TehFlash:
When can we expect it to be stable Rukin?
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
I'm still trying to diagnose the problem. So I can't give you a good estimate of time
[HTC One V] green.apple:
For some reason I can't get this rom to work properly on my phone. My phone has the old hboot but it has newer radio. After I flashed the rom and reboot, I get graphical glitches like the screen turning yellow and the phone is very unresponsive.
[HTC One V] thebestiam:
Works for hboot version 1.00.00.0928?
[HTC One V] mynewshiny:
Discontinued?

The thread title says this ROM is discontinued. Do you have a recommendation for an alternative Jelly Bean ROM for the CDMA One V?
[HTC One V] EirikrHinnRauthi:
7 years, 3 months later: Did you ever find a ROM to use with an Evo V?! Do you happen to have any laying around somewhere?
[HTC One V] blameitonchemo:
No Wi-Fi still with 1/28 after a system wipe and a fresh install. Is anyone else having the same problem? I'd hate to be leading Rukin astray with a unique problem.
[HTC One V] orb3000:
.

Al right mates, please keep on topic, only discussions about ROM and related.

All off topic posts will be wiped and if posts continue infractions may visit you.
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
I'm sorry guys I had it fixed and then it decided to break itself again.. Building is so frustrating

I'm only going to say it is fixed once I have fully and truly tested from a full wipe/install from now on. Sorry :p
[HTC One V] blameitonchemo:
Wi-Fi is working now with the Wi-FiWorking.zip file! Hooray!

Magnificant job, Rukin. The hard work does not go unappreciated.
[HTC One V] Ryuk666:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

Wow. Really liking this. It's so smooth. And I can confirm WiFi working as well. :) great job rukin. Although I have one question. How do I turn off the screen off animation? I think I'm missing it somewhere in the settings unless CM removed it. Thanks rukin :D

Codename: One V.
[HTC One V] aaronrw:
+1 WIFI working, and Thanks for the dedication to primoc and your builds...
[HTC One V] evoshifter2107:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

All I have to say this is one of the smoothest ROMs I've ever ran on this device, and add another one to the list with working WiFi. Good Job rukin
[HTC One V] hunterwei:
How did you flash the rom to make Wi-Fi working? Flash the nightly build, and boot.img, then flash the Wi-FiWorking.zip?

Please advise. Thank.s
[HTC One V] blameitonchemo:
Total system wipe, flash the build, flash gapps, flash boot.img in fastboot, then go back to recovery and flash Wi-FiWorking. There might be a more streamlined way but that is how I got it working.
[HTC One V] hunterwei:
Thanks, Bro. I figured out the problem, I flashed boot.img from the zip, I should flash the one provided in the OP's link instead, so stupid, hope nobody would make same mistake as me.
[HTC One V] Whoareyou:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

So, just out of curiosity, would anyone here be able to get cm10.1 working on the mt4gs?
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Guys, my only build with WiFi right now is WiFiWorking.zip. So until I let you know, the new nightlies won't have WiFi working. Just letting you know :)
[HTC One V] aaronrw:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

STOP spamming this thread. :banghead:

sentfromybrain
[HTC One V] andrewnelson23:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

Anyone test the ion kernel yet on this?
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
I'm actually about to :)

I don't think it will work with mine until I enable it in the ROM as well
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Okay, so WiFi works with the new ION Kernel, alas every thing else is broken. And by that, I mean sound and the wifi option in Settings disappeared (weirdly). My guess is it has to do with the ION running out of memory, but that's just a prediction.

I'm currently trying to build Andromadus as it is more made for our device (or 7x30 devices). Let's see if I can actually get somewhere with it.
[HTC One V] sbkjuggalo:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

Sorry to hear that every thing is now FUBAR in your rom. But one question- i tried googling it but I'm sure i looked up wrong but what do u mean by 7x30 devices?????

I heard that akop is a project being tackled by u:o true? Any luck, :screwy: can u give some top secret info leak?????:p

Also if u need

ANY

assistance i really want to get involved [log cats, test dummy, code editing with some instruction via u, i do make a really good patsy) in a project with developers of your skill and knowledge so i can learn more, as i already have knowledge of some of this please consider

Any way enough begging and grovelling and sorry to take yo your time.

Sent from my One V using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2
[HTC One V] -Duir-:
He's referring to the phone's CPU

7x30 devices
[HTC One V] cybervibin:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

I thought the ion memory caused the camera to get screwed up...
[HTC One V] BeyondExistence:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

@cybervibin It does but we don't have a fix for camera yet so we might as well use it until then ;P
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Update for this ROM guys is that I've gotten it to where it is coming out with WiFi not working, and I just need to push modules and it will work. Once I can get it to build the modules, I will start pushing out more nightlies. Still working hard, so don't lose hope :)

Also, me and beyond have been working on camera lately. Might have a fix for that soon
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Alright guys. While I'm waiting to fix this WiFi module business, I've uploaded a temporary hack. After you flash my newest nightlies, just flash the Modules.zip I have provided in the OP.

NOTE: So far this only works for the ION ROMs, as I've only gotten an IONModules.zip uploaded. More info on ION will be inside the OP.

If I'm not being specific enough in this post or the OP, please let me know :)
[HTC One V] Ryuk666:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

Okay so, I know that ION is meant to improve performance and efficiency, but what do you mean that PMEM is better for compatibility? Is it because ION is currently new, under development and still needs some fixes or is it because all of the one v's ROMs have been built using PMEM (which Is fully functional) up until now?

Codename: One V.
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Well, I didn't necessarily mean for our device. You see, most devices don't use ION because of the lack of camera. Most devices can't get camera to work on ION at all, and that's not good. Simon said he's going to try and hack ION to use the PMEM camera, so that it will work. We'll see how that plays out :)

Also I just tested my CM 02-04 build and it was a no-booter. Seems that it's not building some of the proprietary libs. I'll see if I can fix it and release an actual-working build today for you guys to play with
[HTC One V] $@N:
Plz guys dont ignore the Primou users :)

keep up the good work ;)
[HTC One V] Ryuk666:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

thanks for the info rukin! I didnt realize that ion had such a problem with the camera. So hopefully simon can figure it out. I'll be watching for that build. Keep up the great work. :)

Codename: One V.
[HTC One V] cammykool:
you guys always get stuff first let us have the shine for once :P
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
I believe 1ceb0x is getting it done. But I'm throwing in help where I can for him.
[HTC One V] sbkjuggalo:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

So for the pmem builds what kernel do we use fr it.

Sent from my One V using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Good question. I'll see if I can whack one up real quick.

At this moment, I don't recommend pmem builds until we can get camera working on it. That's the only thing it succeeds in for me. So I may stop pmem builds altogether.

EDIT: I found the source to the libs not being built. My newest nightly is fixed, not sure if modules work in it or not yet
[HTC One V] lilrob1213:
Nice job Rukin!! :)
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Okay guys, the IONModule.zip is fixed and is confirmed working on the newest nightlies :)

Remember, just flash it after every nightly you flash, and it will fix WiFi. Treat it like a GApps package

Now that I have finally figured out what the problem is with the modules, I can begin to fix it in the nightlies. If anybody wanted to know, it is because the modules aren't getting the proper permissions when being flashed.
[HTC One V] andrewnelson23:
la;sjdf;lksdjf!

man.

I really wanna try this. But I have to have camera in order to snapchat my girlfriend. Goooooo simonsimons34!!!!!!!!!! You've got it man!
[HTC One V] jeepjeep2010:
Great work so far, this is actually the only Rom i havnt tried before, and I actually seem to be liking it. However one question, I am having issues finding your source code for the project. Im not real expirenced but id like to take a look and see what I could do. Thanks,
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
well I have a lot of different sources for this, and they are all located at: https://github.com/rukin5197

just look at the projects for PrimoC
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Another update: it seems beyond has made leeway with messing with the kernels and gotten the PMEM builds to be more stable; i.e., no more glitches and random reboots. It still needs more testing, but this is looking good :)

PMEM kernel is looking really snazzy and I have it up to date with the ION builds :)

I have updated the pmem module.zip in case anybody wants to run it. Now everything should be working the same as Evervolv! Enjoy guys :)
[HTC One V] Aashuk Mehta:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

I think 1cebox is working on aospa (paranoid android )

Is he working on cm 10.1 for primo u as well Rukin?
[HTC One V] served24:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

Question. Pmem kernel is still for CDMA right? And is camcorder and camera working? I'm really looking forward to flashing this ROM.
[HTC One V] Ryuk666:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial
[HTC One V] served24:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial
[HTC One V] sbkjuggalo:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial
[HTC One V] cammykool:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

Do camera workes on pmem but not ion?
[HTC One V] Gryff302:
Experiencing random reboots on ion and pmem builds. Pmem builds reboot during initial setup after first boot. Ion builds reboot on random occasions when opening apps.
[HTC One V] Zakman72:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

You downgrade your baseband?
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
I haven't gotten Camera to work at all yet.
[HTC One V] cammykool:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

If anyone can do it its rukin!
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Okay guys, big update

I've switched to building Andromadus, which is still CM10.1 but it's optimized for our devices (msm7x30)

With this, I have fixed the WiFi on first boot. So no more hacks needed for that.

Also, I have used beyond's fixes for camera, and they work very nicely. I think we have 3mp camera and 480p video recording. I haven't necessarily tested it out well, but that seems to be the current situation.

I have also fixed the apps not being compatible in the Play Store.

I will update the OP once I upload a perfect build. After that, we should be pretty bugless :)

Hooray!

EDIT: Also, Andromadus isn't compatible with ION. Seeing as I've brought PMEM up to ION anyhow, there shouldn't be that much of a difference :)
[HTC One V] -Duir-:
Just installed the new version and tried the camera and it opens, a popup shows asking if I want to remember photo locations, and then it closes with a message that "Unfortunately, Gallery has stopped."

As I mentioned, just installed, so no logcat at the moment. Will try to post later.

EDIT1: logcat is here (since attachments aren't working as of my typing this) and just to confirm, version I am using is cm-10.1-20130208-UNOFFICIAL-primoc.zip with boot.img included in ZIP.

EDIT2: Tried a 3rd party camera app (Pudding) and that works. The problem does seem to be with the gallery because it only shows an image for one album (currently the photo I just took with PuddingCamera) and my other albums are just grey squares.
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
What is the md5sum of your build? I ran a build last night that was supposed to fix the Camera
[HTC One V] -Duir-:
Matches one on website:

2ee8ca1c645b9dcfc89772934514ba04
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Alright thanks. Dang, looks like I'll need to find out what the problem is
[HTC One V] cammykool:
does this include provision?
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
No, only previous CM10.1 builds
[HTC One V] Tehwafflez:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

Lol op has 780p for not working instead of 720p.

I'm debating on testing this out I'm tired of redoing everything haha ;)

Sent from my HTC One V+ (Because the X+ isn't as bamf as my V+)

If I helped you don't say thanks, click it!!
[HTC One V] rickyx32:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

780p is what's hip and happening lol What ROM are you using? Anyway we're fortunate to have plenty of ROMs to choose from :)
[HTC One V] cammykool:
flashed rom with camera FCs

download cameraICS from here to fix the issue: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.moblynx.cameraics&hl=en
[HTC One V] andrewnelson23:
How's the stability of this rom as opposed to cfx?
[HTC One V] cammykool:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

Dunno what cfx is. But stable for me
[HTC One V] andrewnelson23:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

Codefirex, its the rom beyond did. Over in android original in the evervolv thread. Kinda buggy for me. The systemui kept force closing on me and got a few reboots.
[HTC One V] Zakman72:
Is this as fast as cm10??
[HTC One V] bradthomas127:
I haven't had any reboots yet or the lockscreen image disappearing like on CFX.
[HTC One V] XxlemonxX:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

Love this ROM!!! Smooth.. And emoji works to iOS and you can receive too!!! Finally after months
[HTC One V] hackahero:
so is everything a lot more smooth and less buggy now? Do games work? I was having no luck gaming on the last version....
[HTC One V] XxlemonxX:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

1. Galley doesn't work

2. Camera doesn't work

3. Occasional jitter or two.

Other than that excellent, good work :) there is camera ICS and another gallery option in the play store for now
[HTC One V] cammykool:
seem to be having Lag/OC issues i assume a rom reflash will fix the issue
[HTC One V] worldindo1:
Does anyone know if the Andromadus builds are ION-enabled?
[HTC One V] cammykool:
i dont think so remember no one coukld get camera going in ION
[HTC One V] andrewnelson23:
No.
[HTC One V] worldindo1:
Yeah I do remember that but of course being the picture nerd I am I just use Pudding Camera.

Alright crap. I guess I'll just have to snag an ION kernel to match up with the 4.2. Possibly one from his older ION builds.

---------- Post added at 06:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:13 AM ----------

Actually better yet, how is the performance with the PMEM? I am still kinda iffy because I like to play graphics intensive games like NFS Most Wanted and it's performance is meh on PAC 19.3.
[HTC One V] cammykool:
okay it seems reflash did it

---------- Post added at 10:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:50 PM ----------

what ive learned:

Smaartass v2 governer makes this rom wig out

dont use smartass v2

otr it could be the facebook app
[HTC One V] Whoareyou:
does this one reboot all the time like the CFX build?
[HTC One V] cammykool:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

As long as you don't use the official fb app. It runs like a dream

---------- Post added at 10:09 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:03 AM ----------

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.wFacebookWebsiteViewer

This is my way to help out. I whipped up a Facebook website viewer witch seems to be working well
[HTC One V] Whoareyou:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

What happens if you use the official fb app?
[HTC One V] cammykool:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

I made a thread about it in the general section
[HTC One V] cammykool:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

The project butter revamp on 4.2 really brings this phone to its full potential streaming Pandora via Bluetooth on tapatalk texting on fb (using my app)w/ messanger and not a single studder

---------- Post added at 10:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:07 PM ----------

Anything change in the nightly rukin?
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Lol no just typical 4.2 smoothness :)
[HTC One V] robaho:
Just installed the 2/10 nightly. Still no bluetooth audio when using the phone. I would post a logcat, but there is no developer menu to enable the usb debugging ??? Or I can't find it...

I posted one the 'everything jelly bean' in General thread. I think it is a AOSP rom issue, not a kernel one...

I just don't know how people can use a rom that doesn't have bluetooth phone... unless they don't drive.

Still nice work. The 3Mp camera, and 480P camcorder work fine. Fix the bluetooth and it would be great.
[HTC One V] cammykool:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] Andromadus CM10.1 Unofficial

Bluetooth audio for radio and crap works

---------- Post added at 12:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:45 AM ----------
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
Another decent-sized update for you guys.

I've reverted back to using CM10.1 source, although I'm using a large amount of Andromadus repos. This somehow has lead to better performance and better overall stability. I've gotten a big improvement in this.

Oh, and the camera app is now working. I would recommend a full wipe to this. I don't think I'm going to be rebasing any more. Yay :)
[HTC One V] Whoareyou:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

Facebook working?
[HTC One V] rukin5197:
I don't use Facebook so I can't report that
[HTC One V] robaho:
Re: [ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

Cammycool, Please don't talk about stuff you don't know. you probably have a crappy car - if youre even old enough to.drive. Bluetooth doesn't work for phone voice. It works fine for media. Reads peoples posts other than mine.
[HTC One V] rickyx32:
Keep your comments relevant to what will help in the development of this ROM. Also, please don't whine about what's lacking, or make negative personal remarks to other members that hardly correlate to what this thread is even about. I'm putting this lightly robaho.
[HTC One V] robaho:
[ROM][PrimoC][CDMA][NIGHTLIES][4.2.x] CyanogenMod 10.1 Unofficial

I wasn't whining about what is lacking. The OP doesn't mention the problem, but I scoured many threads, and many people are having the issue. Trying to get it in the list of known issues. So when people make incorrect and off the cuff comments that dissuade that, who is really causing the problems???