yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Galaxy S III General] AndreiLux:
The Imagination chips supposedly have had that type of coherency since ages, that's what I've been told when I raised the same question as you in another forum.
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
so if they will use SGX544MP3 in Exynos Octa for GS IV it will be a dumb thing cuz till Q2 2013 apple probably will use series 6 which is 2-3 times more powerful than series 5 and IP4 has already more powerful GPU than SGX544MP3 ( its SGX554MP4 ) :silly::silly:
[Galaxy S III General] alex9898:
Thanks, that's good news. With SoCs becoming more complex and heterogeneous (A7 + A15 + programmable GPU), I think this type of coherency across the entire SoC becomes important
[Galaxy S III General] demlasjr:
I know Wikipedia is written by users but sometimes the information comes to fast and detailed there (like Chrome change logo, which I couldn't find on any other website) that makes you think if isn't the company the one posting there.

Do you have any link or something about that exynos 5 quad (not OCTA), other than rumors or printed pieces of paper? I couldn't find any.

Le: btw, where do you found that SGX544MP3 is twice faster than Mali604? I found that Mali604 works at over 80 gflops and Sgx544mp3 at around 52 gflops, slower than an ipad
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
BTW

the new screen on GS IV will save a lot of power :cowboy:
[Galaxy S III General] alex9898:
I think it's a confirmation that next AMOLED screens will use green pholed sub-pixels.

A screen has 33% green sub pixel and pholed will reduce their consumption by 75%. 33*0.75=25% less consumption.The exact same number that Samsung gives us.
[Galaxy S III General] darkbahamut:
That would be assuming that all OLED sub pixels use the same amount of power, which they do not. Green is the most efficient colour and uses the least power. So while in a RGB sub pixel matrix there are 33% green sub pixels, they don't account for 33% of the power consumption. There must be other optimisations at least to make up the power savings.
[Galaxy S III General] wednesday13:
How could they implement this if they don't even know how to properly develop a software?
[Galaxy S III General] AndreiLux:
The phosphorus green subpixel they announced last year came in a 4 subpixel per logical pixel arrangement. I think they use it for synthesizing white and bright colors, not green only. Dynamic voltage scaling on a per LED basis coupled with colour correction can basically half the power consumption without much noticeable intensity change. We may see an implementation of that.

Care to share more of your in depth knowledge? If not stop posting idiotic nonsense.
[Galaxy S III General] Ausboy 2011:
What about the apparent gpu the powervr that supposedly going with the octo?? I would of thought a mali would of gone in instead
[Galaxy S III General] -A-P-M-:
Sony provides needed sources to devs and they can build faster, more optimized and stable roms. Hardware isn't everything, Galaxy Nexus with dated hardware is smoother than SGS 3. Unfortunately Samsung didn't provide promised sources. My guess is Xperia Z will be phone to beat this year.
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
Well sgs3 runs as smooth as nexus 4(I have used nexus 4) on cm10.1 yes they haven't released full sources but still it runs very good (I am not a developer though)

And also xperia z would be still using s4 pro with adreno 320 which might be a bit outdated for 1080p phone by the time it releases I think optimus G2 with s4 prime and adreno 330 also releasing the same time would be a better competitor at least in this aspect
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
Galaxy s4 benchmark seen on antutu:

http://www.liquida.it/foto-blog/samsung-galaxy-s4/

Other photo I got it from antutu app by searching GT-I9500

It should be using same octa processor
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
s3 or note2 can get 21000 in antutu with oc + modifying build.prob u can get whatever u want :laugh:

and S IV will probably called GT-I9400 :)
[Galaxy S III General] AndreiLux:
GT-9500 is their Tizen phone from last year. Also the S4 should be getting >30k in Antutu. It's just some guy spoofing his results.
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
Guys,

Whats i read is that, the best chip is Apple A6X for 2013.

Are these apple fans crap or its real that, no any manufacture has made a chip better than Apple? :confused:
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
2013 ?? :silly:

Exynos 4412 more powerful in terms of cpu but A6x have more powerful GPU and faster ram i think

edit : A6x http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1546823

Exynos 4412 http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1509219

http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1544642

Exynos 5250 ( 2 arm A-15 cores ) http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1544360
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
Thats means 5250 is also out shadow by A6X GPU.:(

Why only apple is capable of making such powerful gpu?

Sent from my GT-I9300
[Galaxy S III General] alex9898:
Because Apple is the only one who really develops SoCs specifically designed for tablets. All other manufacturers use smartphone's SoCs which does not take advantage of the extra space and battery in their tablets
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
yep A6x PowerVr sgx 554MP4 is more powerful than Mali t604 :(

but mali t604 on Exynos 5250 still not that bad :rolleyes:

if they will use Mali t658 in Exynos Octa its x4 time more powerful than mali t604 and maybe they will use PowerVr GPU
[Galaxy S III General] Ausboy 2011:
Hopefully the t658 is ready by then my guess is s4 wont be octacore but note 3 will be epic :D
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
Mali t 658 has been removed from arm's website

http://www.arm.com/products/multime...-gpu-compute/mali-t604.php?setcookie=classica
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
HMM thats true :rolleyes:

maybe they will use Mali t678 :fingers-crossed:

http://www.arm.com/products/multimedia/mali-graphics-plus-gpu-compute/mali-t678.php
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
http://www.ubergizmo.com/2013/01/samsung-exynos-5-octa-specs/

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6654/...a-powered-by-powervr-sgx-544mp3-not-arms-mali

Ipad 4 should still lead the pack in terms

Of GPU :(
[Galaxy S III General] alex9898:
iPad 4 has a SGX554 which has 2 times more vertex shaders than the SGX544.
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
this not official :eek::eek:

and anandtech already apple fanboys IMO :/

and how the hell Samsung will use less powerful GPU than Mali t604 in Exynos 5250 for Octa O_O
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
How is that less powerful than mali t 604 ?
[Galaxy S III General] alex9898:
GFlops performances can't lead to any conclusion about real performances on complex 3D activity.

An example of Gflops vs real performances

GFlops :

IPad 3 : 32 Gflops

IPad 4 : 71.5 Gflops (+123%)

IPhone 5 : 25 Gflops (-22%)

GLBenchmark results (offscreen 1080p without V-Sync) :

Egypt HD :

IPad 3 : 3019 Frames

IPad 4 : 5868 Frames (+94%)

IPhone 5 : 3290 Frames (+9%)

Egypt Classic :

IPad 3 : 9882 Frames

IPad 4 : 14999 Frames (+52%)

IPhone 5 : 10363 Frames (+5%)
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
Mali t604 get about 72 gflops

Sgx 544MP3 get 51 gflops

and here some benchmarks :

mali t604 http://www.glbenchmark.com/phonedetails.jsp?benchmark=glpro25&D=Samsung+Arndale+Board

http://www.glbenchmark.com/phonedetails.jsp?benchmark=glpro25&D=Google+Nexus+10&testgroup=overall

Sgx 543:http://www.glbenchmark.com/phonedetails.jsp?benchmark=glpro25&D=Apple+iPhone+5

Sgx 544 on some chinese tablet :p : http://www.glbenchmark.com/phonedetails.jsp?benchmark=glpro25&D=Onda+V812+Core4&testgroup=overall

Sgx 554 : http://www.glbenchmark.com/phonedetails.jsp?benchmark=glpro25&D=Apple+iPad+4

but there is good point for PowerVr GPU's they have better fill rate and better Triangle throughput
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
http://www.onda-sale.com/onda-v812-quad-core-a31-tablet-pc-android-4-1-8-inch-ips-16gb.html

That chinese tab uses sgx544mp2 not mp3 (if sources are not wrong )
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
i don't expect that much difference from one core more :rolleyes:

but i really hope they will use PowerVr series 6 in Octa :D

Damn it will be the fastest mobile GPU- CPU in the world
[Galaxy S III General] alex9898:
The frequency also will be different if Anandtech is right.
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
:rolleyes:If you dont expect much difference from 1 core more then 544MP3 should be quite comparable to 544MP4 too included higher frequency clock :D :p
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
Kool :D

but still nothing official at all about the GPU ;)
[Galaxy S III General] :
Don't think Series6 Rogue is ready for mass production yet. They just showed a demo. Anyone knows about power consumption for Rogue?
[Galaxy S III General] hung2900:
Because Apple always has the best Power VR GPUs exclusively.

I don't know why almost nobody recognizes that fact.

SGX535 appears in iPhone 3GS's SoCs and Apple A4 only

SGX543 appears in Apple A5, A5X and A6 (the SoCs inside PS Vita also use this GPU probably because of the cross licencing between Apple and Sony)

If i am not wrong, SGX554 will be Apple exclusive as well
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
I'm not sure if that true or Samsung don't really want to put more powerful GPU's in their SOC's or maybe they use Mali cuz its cheaper who knows :rolleyes: , i really hate to see apple always in the lead in terms of GPU :(

BTW A4 was with Sgx 535 and Exynos 3 was with Sgx 540 just FYI ;)
[Galaxy S III General] :
Samsung Hummingbird used 540.

TI OMAP SoCs also use PowerVR. 4470 uses 543/544MP2. 4430/4460 used 540.

Intel also uses PowerVR. I believe they have some shares in Imagination.

NovaThor is also supposed to use Series6 Rogue in their upcoming SoC.
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
:silly:
[Galaxy S III General] hung2900:
I forget to mention about the GPU of iPhone 3GS and iPod Touch 3rg gen, it's SGX 535 also and the beast of that time :)

Maybe at the time Apple released iPhone 4, there was no new best PowerVR's GPU available yet (SGX540 already used), and probably due to the secret contract between Apple and Imagination Technologies so Apple also couldn't share the same GPU with others.

Maybe the key of success in graphic war: be the quickest to sign the contract for the best PowerVR's GPU!
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
Okay let me get this clear, samsung make its own cpu but the gpu is from other company so it need a contract.

So to make a soc, samsung purchase gpu and put it with his own cpu.

Im I right?
[Galaxy S III General] atsamoon:
what about the galaxy s 4 its gpu mali t-658 is almost twice as strong as the ipad 4
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
Hmm the problem not beacuze of heating but as I read in N10 fourms Cpu don't have cpu sensor so throttling happening with how much power its using which sucks :banghead:

Edit : some more info http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2098157&page=3
[Galaxy S III General] hung2900:
Mali t-658 is removed from ARM website.

It's replaced by three different GPUs: Mali T624, T628 and T678 on the road map, and it seems too early for Samsung to manufacture them.

Even if the rumor is true, at least 533Mhz PowerVR SGX 544MP3 533 MHz will be 1.6 times stronger than the GPU inside iPhone 5 (333 MHz SGX 543MP3) and if the GLBenchmark is the the same between iOS and Android, 1080p Egypt 2.5 HD point will be about 5280 frames (about 46.56 fps) which is a little bit slower than Apple iPad 4 (5868 frames, 51.9 fps).

The analysis from Anandtech depended on the GFLOPS, which cannot tell the exact equivalent number (Mali T-604 has about 70 GLOPS but still much weaker than SGX 554MP4)

I know somebody wish a Rogue GPU will appear inside new Samsung SoC but like the story about the newer Mali versions, I think it's too early.
[Galaxy S III General] alex9898:
IPhone 5 use a PowerVR SGX543MP3 @ 266Mhz.

That's the iPad 4 wich uses a GPU @ 300Mhz.

Moreover, PowerVR SGX554 has a strong GPU for triangle throughput but it isn't any better than a 543/544 when it comes to filrate.
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
i think SGX544MP3 @500Mhz will be about 2-3 times faster than SGX543MP3@266MHz and little slower than SGX554MP4@300 MHz but it will be more than enough for 1080p screen i think

but i still hope they will use more powerful GPU than SGX544MP3 :D
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
2x if real world performance then its performing quite same as ipad 4,iPhone 5 gets 29fps

Quoted from someother forum:

Now I think it might perform same/outperform ipad 4 s GPU
[Galaxy S III General] :
I will try a few points. If I am wrong, someone please correct it :)

Samsung licenses the ARMv7 instruction sets like all other vendors Qualcomm, nvidia, Apple etc. Samsung Exynos, nvidia Tegra, OMAP also uses the standard ARM architecture like A9 or A15.

Qualcomm and Apple now make their own 'custom' cores. Krait (qualcomm) and Swift (Apple) are somewhat comparable to 'normal' Cortex-A9 or Cortex-A15. They simply run ARMv7 instruction sets, but these processors are not designed by ARM.

Even within standard A9 or A15 design there is be differences in implementation in terms of memory, GPU, ISP, multimedia decoders and many more. Typical example would be a Tegra2 without NEON even though all other SoCs in same generation had this implemented.

Samsung is paying ARM for licensing the ARMv7 instruction sets and also for Cortex-A9/A15, big-LITTLE architecture designs. It will also have to pay ARM for Mali GPU or Imagination for PowerVR IP.

nvidia won't pay for big-LITTLE as they use their own 'companion' core technology.
[Galaxy S III General] hung2900:
I think you need to check again

iPad 3 uses A5X SoCs with @250 Mhz PowerVR SGX543MP4 GPU

iPhone 5 uses A6 SoCs with @333 Mhz PowerVR SGX543MP3 GPU (That's why the performance is equal to iPad 3 with less GPU cores.

iPad 4 uses A6X SoCs with @280 Mhz PowerVR SGX554MP4 GPU.

It's only 1.6 times, not 2x performance, so it's still a bit slower than iPad 4.
[Galaxy S III General] alex9898:
Maybe you are right but that where I read A6 uses a 266Mhz GPU : http://www.anandtech.com/show/6323/apple-a6-die-revealed-3core-gpu-100mm2

And I think I have read somewhere that A5X runs only at 166Mhz.
[Galaxy S III General] Ausboy 2011:
So ive been reading more leaked details on s4 and they saying now that it might have the mali t658?? Hope so because that gpu would wipe the floor :)

Source

http://m.techradar.com/news/phone-a...ltius-could-debut-as-soon-as-february-1126806
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/apple-iphone-5-a6-soc-chip,17843.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPhone

http://www.phonearena.com/news/The-iPhone-5s-A6-is-a-dual-core-CPU-and-tri-core-GPU_id34769

Many sites show sgx543mp3 inside iPhone 5 is clocked at 266mhz

And this says ipad3 s gpu is clocked at 166mhz

http://www.itproportal.com/2012/03/08/new-ipad-apple-a5x-gpu-scrutinised-166mhz-powervr-sgx543mp4/
[Galaxy S III General] Ausboy 2011:
Who cares about iphones and there ****ty cpu/gpu?? ;)
[Galaxy S III General] uvaman:
Mali 658 doesnt exist anymore ;) It could be only 678 from now on ^^
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
News (unconfirmed) for upgraded GPU for Samsung Galaxy S4, codenamed 'Altius'

Eight-core Exynos 5 processor, an eight-core

Mali-T658 GPU

,

How is this gonna fair to Apple A6X??
[Galaxy S III General] st3chn0:
If the s3 is the competitor to the I phone 5? Why are we comparing the s4 to the 5? Shouldn't we be contemplate on what the I phone 6/5s may have?

As at the end of the day the s4 will be the main competitor for the next I phone
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
I forgot to quote that one
[Galaxy S III General] AndreiLux:
It's not going to fare at all because we have ample evidence that it uses a 544MP3, and secondly because the T658 is dead on arrival and will never exist in any product.
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
Well,

I dont see the need for Samsung to shift from Mali to Power SVR GPU!!

I dont see the reason behind, Lets wait and see!!
[Galaxy S III General] :
Speculating -- maybe they were not much happy with Mali performance or power efficiency. Also PowerVR 5 series is quite mature. We will know when we verify the benchmark and compare against T604.
[Galaxy S III General] AndreiLux:
Power efficiency might be an argument for them, but that is to be seen. Another argument is DX compatibility for Windows, they can reuse their own chip instead of going to Qualcomm. Their setup will outperform an T604 for sure, maybe ARM's other GPU's like the T624/8 just weren't ready for the S4 time window, and Samsung couldn't afford to stay stale on the GPU again add they did on the S3.

And of course maybe they are just getting back into the PowerVR ecosystem for Rogue.
[Galaxy S III General] Toss3:
Not sure what you guys are planning on doing with your phones, but a 544MP3 should be more than enough for 1080p and way better than the mali 400 in the SGS3. I don't know about you, but I'd take power efficiency before performance any day(given that the performance is better than the previous generation).

The Nexus 10 already showed us that the SoC has some thermal issues, so adding more cores + newer GPU does not sound like it would yield any better results, despite the new 28nm process.
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
Well those throttling issues are more of software related
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
WOW :eek:

https://twitter.com/SamsungExynos/status/294471058889793537 :cool:

LOL now we are close from PC ram speed :D
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
Thats one hell of innovation for 2013!! :D
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
From here: http://www.arm.com/files/downloads/big.LITTLE_Final.pdf

samsung octa could use all 8 cores at a time:) some people said it won't but I am now sure , although it was already stated in this thread in earlier posts by someone

sent from an Galaxy s3 GT I9300

Running perseus kernel , XELLA 4.1.2 leaked build
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
Samsung's 2013 flagship smartphone is rumored to sport a Super AMOLED display of FullHD resolution and a whopping 8-core Exynos 5 Octa processor, 8-core Mali-T658 GPUand 2 GB of RAM.

A 13-megapixel rear camera with the ability to shoot 1080p full HD videos at 30 fps will be mounted at the back, while 2-megapixel front camera will take care of video-calls.

The next Samsung flagship will reportedly be powered by Android 4.2.1 Jelly Bean.

It the rumors are to be trusted, the smartphone will be available in Europe first, with the whole Asian market is expected to follow by the end of April.

Galaxy IV will make it to the shores of America, Australia and Africa by the end of Q2.

The report also confirms the model number of Galaxy S IV to be I9500 as well as its Black and White color options.

:good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::good::D:D
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
^^

its rumors ( Sammobile should stop it )

and there is no Mali T658 anymore :eek:
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
So the rest is real but mali is a rumour!
[Galaxy S III General] yahyoh:
ask Sammy :D
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
:D
[Galaxy S III General] uvaman:
If they will use Mali there is only two options. Mali T678 cuz 648 doesnt exist and 678 isnt ready (who knows). And second option is Mali T-62x.. Ofc they are talking about PowerVR 544mp3 too..

Personal. I would like to get Mali 678 :D
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
Umm... Isn't powerVR sgx544mp3 clocked at 533 MHz good enough ? At least it will perform better/same to iPad4

According to my calculations it should roughly get 58fps in glbench (offscreen 1080)

And anything more than that would be overkill for 1080p phone

sent fromXperia sT21i

Everything stock
[Galaxy S III General] _Variable:
Octa core!

I guess my dual core tab is now obsolete

__________________

Sweet Devil >_<

GT-P3100 | Android 4.0.4 ICS | Sun Cellular

PM me if you need help
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
With powerVR SGX544 GPU will be powerful but when iphone 5S or 6 is released later this year will be more powerfull than this even twice.

Its never enough performance with technology advance!!:D
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
Is A7 supposed to be twice of A6 in performance or A6X? If the answer is A6 then it won't be a problem but if A6x then we might need something like Mali t 678 or 628

sent fromXperia sT21i

Everything stock
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
Yes, your right....we will need T628 or T678. Both are of same base difference in cores and speed.
[Galaxy S III General] mikereidis:
So.

Latest rumors are Qualcomm on US/North American/? models and Exynos 5 Octa on International models.

There's no Galaxy S IV GT-I9500 section on XDA yet ?

I don't see any recent GS4 discussions and we seem close to release.
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
http://www.brightsideofnews.com/Dat...Revealed/Samsung_GT-I9500_Browsermark_689.jpg

GALAXY S4 BROWSER MARK BENCHMARK

[GTi9500 ]GALAXY S4 Scores 2710 , HTC one scores 2262

Tegra 4 scores 2777 , could this be octa? !

sent from an Galaxy s3 GT I9300

Running perseus kernel 33.1 , XELLA 4.1.2 leaked build

:D xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1784401

Dont click,you might regret , I won't be responsible if you brick ur head
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
On antutu if you click on charts then on Galaxy s4 (name) then you will see its specifications:)

sent from an Galaxy s3 GT I9300

Running perseus kernel 33.1 , XELLA 4.1.2 leaked build

:D xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1784401

Dont click,you might regret , I won't be responsible if you brick ur head
[Galaxy S III General] barondebxl:
There will be a Galaxy S IV forum once it is announced and made official, not before. (I assume of course)
[Galaxy S III General] mikereidis:
I posted here in the "*** New Device Forum Requests ***" thread: http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?p=38652118#post38652118
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
Ladies and Gentlemen,

The Exynos 5 Octa is alive!!! :D

We are waiting for benchmark comparison with Snapdragon 600 and 800.:p

We really miss the Mali T678 GPU hope to see it in GS5 or GS6, hehehehehe!! :angel:
[Galaxy S III General] eseregin:
To the hell all Sammys chips with there lack of support open source comunity...
[Galaxy S III General] deom2i:
We hope this time samsung will offer source codes for their chips and we hope to see smoother UI with Snapdragon!! :o
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
Now there is a new octa coming and most likely CCI is working and with a better gpu.
[Galaxy S III General] disclaimernotice:
Haha, way to revive a dead thread.
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
Well the only thread with this discussion going on :rolleyes:
[Galaxy S III General] i9100g user:
http://www.androidcentral.com/don-t-try-home-overclocking-all-8-cores-gt-i9500?style_mobile=0

Sarcasm?

Device: GT-I9300

Kernel:Googy max,dual boot

Rom:1st ROM Slim bean (4.2.2) with latest Mali drivers

2nd ROM CM 10.2(4.3)

CPU 900mhz;UV

GPU 440mhz;UV
[Transformer TF300T Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] AxeL-V:
Hey, I have a 4 tablets with same problem, all with cracked touchscreen.

I bought 5 new touchscreen, which marked 69.10I21.G01, but all of them refused to work, but perfectly working with other TF300, which have native 69.10I21.G01 touch.

After great research I found that my four tablets have "Touch Panel Version" 3011-4822 and 3011-4817 - on a tablet which work with new touchscreens.

Anybody know how to change firmware of touch screen panel (PCB) ?
[Transformer TF300T Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] Stempanssi:
Bump. Did you ever get it to work? I now am facing the exact same problem as you...
[Transformer TF300T Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] funnel71:
I have no idea if this will help, but if you go to settings - about tablet - and repeatedly tap the touch firmware line rapidly you get a firmware load screen for pad, dock, and camera. Now if touch is broken perhaps you can emulate with a mouse pointer click if you have one available. I've never used this update tool. I just know it exists.
[Transformer TF300T Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting] Stempanssi:
I know this menu but as you I can't find a way to use this. I do have a mouse.