yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Ok_Kaleidoscope5109:
That's a bunch of crap. FIrst how do you control a phone being used the same way one day to the other? There's no way. As Zuckerberg said in the FB Home, you see your lockscreen hundreds of times a day. People screen on just to see what emails or chats came in. They check just to see the weather, or updates. You're telling me you do the EXACT same tasks day to day?

Franco kernel also comes with color calibration. You think that doesn't influence the screen drain?

What I'm saying is feeling that my phone does better today versus yesterday can also come from day to day run variation. It can also come from your usage difference. How can you say it's the kernel?

That's exactly why you need controlled tests. If your complaint is that my test doesn't accurately simulate how you use your phone, then what? Are you implying your usage of the phone will show a significant difference between stock and Franco kernel in terms of battery drain?
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] undercover:
NOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooo...........

Sent from my fridge. Make: LG Model: N⁴
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] brodern:
dmo580, thanks for doing these tests!

But I must say that I find these results very weird, because when I ran stock kernel, I was consistently getting screen on times like 3-3,5 on WiFi only. I got my Nexus 4 on Xmas and I spent all the time at home during the winter break so my usage pattern is pretty much the same and as I said I only used wifi. Maximum sot running stock was 4 hrs 12 min.

When I switched to Francos I was suddenly getting a lot better sot. From 3-3.5 to 5-5.5 consistently and I got a new record of 6hrs 18 min. This was during Francos r2x-r3x period.

I have some thoughts :

*maybe your test is not a good way of comparing kernels, it's not showing the kernels full potential? I think the main source of battery drain during your tests is the screen itself, maybe that's why the results are so similar?

*Please check the "battery usage" of screen after next time, when I switched from stock to franco.kernel, I noticed that screen went from about 55% to about 70% during a battery cycle, this indicates that something else is using less battery because the screen still draws the same power.

*this could be impossible for a app to do, but a fair test would be a app that simulates swipes on drawer and homescreen. For example 3 swipes 200 px left, pause 10 sec, 3 swipes 200 px right and repeat this instead. I think mpdecision turned used too much cores / high frequency when you didn't need it (for example when just touching the screen) , Franco had much more control over this with hotplug. and maybe that's why we got better battery in real life because then we touch and interact with our devices and with stock we would have used higher frequencies for longer periods?

Just some thoughts :)

Edit: I should mention that the numbers I got was with stock 4.2.1 because 4.2.2 was not released back then. 4.2.2 is supposed to be slightly better, but I can't comment on that because I went straight to franco.kernel when 4.2.2 was released

Sent from my Nexus 4
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Underground_XI:
None is better, but at least those that post sot screenshots do not keep *****ing around and complaining why the other tests say the opposite of what screenshots show. People post screenshots because they love this phone and custom kernels + those people change phones every 3 months, unlike somebody else that has used only 3 smartphones in his life, but still has the guts to say that the htc one x got better battery life than the latest nexus phone.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] melbourne408:
You all know what's going on. And some thinly decide, and divide, our community, hasn't the same OP reading skills the generation who weren't swimming in the cores of eclair , stupid radios and, Froyo had something in recovery. We have surpassed a lot of technologies, with the unrelenting work of dedicated Dev's, that on their spare time. Work on building, progressing with. As Deltron once said, "Upgrade your gray matter, cause one day it may matter."
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Ok_Kaleidoscope5109:
For my phone on-time:

Franco Kernel: 5 hrs 7 min on battery, 74% screen

CM 10.1: 5 hrs 22 min on battery, 70% screen

I think its close enough. I did these overnight so it was dependent on when I woke up. Thus the approximate ~ 5 hours. The test only lasted 3 hours before dropping to 15% and shutting off automatically.

But the browser test does use quite a bit of battery. 3 hours SOT isn't normal. If I just left the screen on, I showed a screenshot of 7 hours SOT when the test crashed on stock. Thus a good chunk of drain came from CPU as well. mpdecision's weakness is in touching the screen. Touching the screen is a bit harder to benchmark on a consistent basis. I can try a video test as that's one option of the battery tester.

The other thing you could argue with my battery test is that it's supposed to stop at 15%, but the battery meter is off. But how off can you be at 15%? It's not gonna severely distort my run times, and certainly isn't going to be making a 3hrs versus 5 hours difference.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] vickpick:
People whose phones don't last a whole workday.. maybe you should use your phone a little less. If you don't get to charge the phone every day, perhaps you should clear your damn schedule. If you don't like the battery life, perhaps you should invest in a portable charger or get a different phone. There is no point in this endless bickering over whose life is better. At the end of the day, it's only going to get worse as new Android versions come out so you might as well get rid of the phone right now when it holds value.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Underground_XI:
Yo brian why you never post a screenshot of your "objective" sot?;)
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Ok_Kaleidoscope5109:
Do you have evidence to say the N4 does better than the HTC One X? My point is you need objective tests to say that. Going off of feeling is as good as me saying my Prius is faster than your Lambo because it FEELS faster.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] mitchdickson:
Or, you know, you could just not spend hours obsessing over objective battery tests and annoying everyone in your path.

Sent from my iPad 4
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Underground_XI:
Dude there are 1000 people at least that used the htc one x and posted results and 1000 people that used nexus 4 and posted results. And i am one of those people that had one x s3 and nexus 4 and in all forums i have noticed that the nexus 4 got absolutely the best battery life among all. So you are saying, 1000 people are all wrong while your tests are more credible? :D
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] brodern:
Oh, I've never gotten so good numbers on stock :(

What I mean is, even though the browser test users done cpu it's not really showing the real benefits of using a different "core on/offlining" driver than stock mpdecision.

Running an automated refreshing test on the browser is similar to running a game imo, it just press a constant load on the kernel which both stock and Francos hotplug handles pretty similar.

The benefits of hotplugging for saving battery is more obvious when you're interacting with the device. If you've ever ran perfmon while browsing around on your homescreen or switching apps you can see that stock mpdecision bumps up cores very fast and uses a lot of power, this is intended for having a 100% lag free device, project butter.

Doing the same when using franco.kernel, you'll notice that less cores are online on lower frequency thus saving power. That problem is that you have to balance this and still get ui fluidity, something Franco had succeeded with imo.

I'm not a native English speaker, so I have some troubles getting to the point, but I hope you can understand :)

Sent from my Nexus 4
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] kioshi:
Its a very close tie. My friends Sprint Galaxy S3 used in Hong Kong alongside my Nexus 4, I would get better battery than him through the end of the day after sightseeing. We both would use our GPS/Google Maps/Navigation walking/and few calls placed to food restaurants. There were times when the S3 would hold its battery longer than my Nexus 4 but that was dependent on how my phone handled the same app my friend was using. Regardless, by the end of the night I would have a little more charge left than his phone. I was on franco M1 kernel while he was on stock rooted.

That is my real world test, @dmo580
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] thebryceee:
Reason why I say feels is because I don't test battery objectively with different kernels, just Franco's build to build. My daily usage at work is mostly web browsing and xda browsing with about 15 minutes of non HD YouTube. I use auto brightness and LTE all day. Usage is consistent but not exact and I remember getting about 9 hours total before needing a charge on stock and 14-15 hours on Franco's. I also don't take battery life into consideration until after a coupe of charge cycles.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] drawde40599:
Ive tried every kernel out there including cm kernel (stock) and i dont get even close to the results that guy dose, franco gives me 1-1.5 hours more without even trying

---------- Post added at 12:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:58 PM ----------

I have that phone also and yep exactly, N4 with franco better battery
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] kioshi:
Exactly, should give it at least 3 days or so to get better results. Flashing at night and trying to judge it the next evening isn't fair.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Underground_XI:
Dude he is an i-sheep user that came to this thread one week ago saying franco kernel gives same juice as stock kernel. Then the troll changes skin, and jumped into saying his iphonw 5 gives him better battery life than custom kernel nexus 4. Then the troll again changed skin, and came up with "scientific conclusions" and now tells us all that people around these forums posting battery life screenshots in hox forums, s3 forums and n4 forums, that we all are wrong. Only the i-sheep troll is right. I honestly do not give a damn what he says but saying stock kernel gives users same juice as custom kernel is the same as saying that all the devs we got know nothing about codes. And btw we got the best devs around xda, so if you say their codes are no beneficial in regard to battery life then oh boy you got serious issues!
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] PetritH:
What does deadline IO Scheduler do and what does Row do? Also the lerformance governor and interactive... it may be a dumb question but im seeking for answer,thanks
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] mitchdickson:
Just Google it, man.

Also, http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1369817

Sent from my iPad 4
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] drawde40599:
Well i do have the money and own the phones, 100% stock yes those phones get better battery, but u add franco to the mix and N4 out lasts easy (this is franco thread im in right? .) stock kernel sucks for battery on N4 like that other guy said 1000's of people agree I dont need foncy tests to tell me Franco kernel makes battery better. ;)
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] ctfrommn:
Here you go :)

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1989824

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1558153
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] PetritH:
Thank you guys, asked this because with performance governor and deadline scheduler i have no lags at all... but wanted to know if it consumes the battery more.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] hospital349:
The last 6 pages have absolutely RAPED this thread and torn it apart. There's just no need for this crap really. I don't know what's going to be achieved by making statements about subjectivity, objectivity, the correct and incorrect methods to test battery life. "I'm right!" "NO I'M CORRECT!!" Blah blah blah.

How many people actually care about any of this? Seriously.

I really don't think that any user is going to gain respect within the XDA community through absolute speculation and theory. All this really is and all this ever has been is one opinion after another. I've been around for long enough, browsing thread after thread, to know that there is no right or wrong answer. The matter of battery life will and always has varied based on each individual's unique experience of his/her device. There's no test for this. It's personal.

I just want everybody to leave the subject alone and if folks can't do this, please just take the subject where it belongs: The Great Battery Impression Thread - and if you don't find the thread 'fitting', make a thread of your own and then you can converse the subject of battery to your hearts content.

This talk of battery life isn't Franco Kernel specific, so it's classified as 'off topic'. Moderators should technically wipe the floor clean of the last few pages and users should be instructed to go elsewhere with their talk.

I hope I speak for many of us.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] ctfrommn:
Well said and a big reason I dont frequent this thread much anymore. Its a shame really.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] JNewms:
Couldn't agree more.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Xparent Skyblue Tapatalk 2
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] drawde40599:
Its what happens when everyone is happy with current build, used to happen on his Gnex thread also, not saying its right or wrong but......... Its what i noticed
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] jayjay3333:
Well said hospital349

It is very subjective. Discuss it with maturity, manners, respect and some "proof" or just move on.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] drawde40599:
Performance going to chew up more batrery yes, try bumping min freq to 486 leaving everything else stock, i really like it there and battery don't take big hit
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] PetritH:
Many thanks mate, gonna try that... cuz I feel some lags in homescreen and sometimes in apps while scrolling.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] ctfrommn:
Hang out in the Trinity thread, were bored there too and people post pictures, talk sports, movies, whatever with no drama or fighting. Not saying its Francos fault in any way, shape, or form but it is curious. My .02$ for the day....moving on :)
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] steviewevie:
Flashing a kernel doesn't delete recovery, no. But the stock ROM does try to replace a custom recovery with the stock recovery unless you stop it doing so. It sounds to me like your ROM replaced your custom recovery soon after you flashed it, but you didn't notice. That Android lying down is the stock recovery screen.

There is some stuff in the FAQs about how to stop this happening, it's very simple to do. See http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?p=34744793 . Also I think there's an option in ROM Manager to fix this too.

Sent from my Nexus 4
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] ctfrommn:
Only the stock image would do that. Was the Rom flashed via fastboot/adb?
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] blade_:
122 seems amazing after 111 :)
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] thebryceee:
Yeah. I had a hard time moving from r111 because battery was so good with really good performance but 122 matches battery life and exceeds performance.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] michael_ta315:
I wonder if we could ever reach a point where software & coding is so advanced we can run Crysis 3 all high for 8 hours on our tiny phones :silly::silly:

Well.. I'll keep dreaming.. until I :angel:
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] .coomb.:
Franco, did you by chance read my post about UI and UX improvements for your app?
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] franciscofranco:
Ok I've been trying not to answer but I'll be short:

Scientific tests or not there is nothing in the world that can emulate real life usage in performance or battery. There are only synthetic tests. Refreshing the same page for 4 hours in a row means nothing to me. All the kernels behave the same with 2 cores online and using 1,5GHz freq on both cores refreshing pages, they will use the same battery. The real gains come from usage, which means, how fast the governor scales down, how fast/slow the cores go offline after the load gets lower, how the governor reacts to load, if it scales to max, if it goes to an intermediate freq just for a tiny load, how fast the device enters idle, how many wakelocks the device has, how many phone calls I have/don't have, how many hours watching/not watching a movie, how the kernel "garbage collector" works, how often/not often it flushes the pages, how often/not often does android kill processes to free memory... I don't want to go on.

All these examples occur when using the device day to day not by running some synthetic tests. Same as benchmarking. Its just a measure in numbers of how strong the device can be in a certain number of controlled tests. If a real game renders everything with the CPU (software rendering) the CPU will be maxed out all the time. If the game renders everything with the GPU (hardware rendering) then the CPU won't be as taxed and probably it won't use all the cores, while the GPU is doing its job. But during a benchmark everything is controlled, there is no changes, so we can only take few guesses and conclusions out of it.

I also do appreciate that everyone gets a ****ing decency pill and stop bashing each other. If dmo is posting with his tests but you don't agree just ****ing post with your own view and your opinion but respect his opinion. And same goes for dmo, respect and opinion exchanges need to be mutual and respectfully given.

Stop ****ing bickering and rather post constructive posts like I did give out opinion in the beginning of this post ;)

No, it probably got ****ing lost in all the bickering. Can you re-post please?
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Clark Joseph Kent:
Thread Cleaned as stated the bickering/back and forth stops now....Thank You.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] franciscofranco:
Thanks. I got it under control now.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Ok_Kaleidoscope5109:
Wow really? How old are you again? How am I a troll saying my iPhone 5 gives me better battery life than a Custom Kernel Nexus 4? I own both phones. Are you saying I'm lying? Better yet, do you have data that disproves my observations?

The important part is I ran tests and posted numbers. I did a controlled test.

You may not like it, I may not like it, who cares. At the end of the day, numbers speak the truth. I love Franco too, and I would love if it the benchmarks show Franco whooping Stock Kernel's butt. However, it didn't happen. We are XDA and you can question the test methodology or the performance of the kernels. I don't know what whining and calling people iSheep does, but it certainly doesn't help resolve ANY issues.

Yes we do have the best devs around XDA. I never said their codes are not beneficial. I like what Franco is doing as well as other great devs out there like Morfic, Gokhanmoral, etc. just to name a couple. In no way am I saying their codes suck. I'm just saying if we want to judge their performance, let's not judge it through gut feeling and some user saying their battery life was SOOOO GOOD after 2 hours of flashing. That's meaningless. I'm saying to NOT be clouded by placebo effect and actually test for battery life.

Do you think Samsung, LG, Google, Apple, etc develop their products based on gut feeling? Goodness. Tell me you work a real job at least.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] jarjar124:
Your username is awesome. Just had to point that out. Anyways, r122 is amazing. Headphone gain makes a huge difference. Thanks Franco!
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Ok_Kaleidoscope5109:
Thank you Franco. I encourage active discussion and productive discussion, but yes, let's not name call. We're here to solve problems, not to create new ones.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Underground_XI:
... :D
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] thebryceee:
Lol I was gonna say that. I liked that movie.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] michael_ta315:
@Franco I know this is off topic but I just wondering about your plan with the nexus 10 kernel. Not asking ETA ofcourse :p Just curious about your plans for the nex 10 :D
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] yokuyuki:
I think a good test, which hopefully the dev of the battery test app can solve, is just to have extended refresh intervals. If the refresh intervals are far enough apart, the phone should go back to idle and that's where we'll see the biggest difference in hotplugging between stock and Franco.

Another nice test might be to have a dummy google account for testing and push emails to the phone at a set interval to see how stock and Franco deal with having to wake up from idle and then return to idle.

---------- Post added at 06:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:44 PM ----------

I meant which is more useful :p

Sure, posting SOT once in a while may be useful, but people end up complaining and wondering why they don't get that SOT when they're unwilling to turn off as many syncs, don't have as good reception, or have more apps. It's just not consistently useful nor comparative.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] rumirand:
About sound settings, now I'm trying gain: -11, volume boost: 0.

I have Panasonic RP-HTX7 modded headphones. Using play music with some light EQ, with gain -5 or more, I noticed some hiss when playing music. Now, I've really clear sound and I'm really satisfied with the sound.

Thank you Franco for making my nexus even more awesome!
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] miku3191:
HOTPLUG!!!

I visit less often to this thread as my exams are going on, although i am still updated, with the latest version r122. ;)

Plz. Tell me if it is OK to revert back to

High-90

mid-50

Low-25

hotplug values. ? i am using franco.KERNEL app v9.2.

Sorry, if this thing has already been discussed ! :(
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] yokuyuki:
What exactly do the screenshots show? It shows that one person got x SOT. How do you prove the opposite of that?

What he's trying to measure is how much of a difference there is between stock and Franco.

Also: :silly:

Edit: These aren't mine. They're dmo580's.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] jarjar124:
Mother of god o.O
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] Connor Baker:
Is that an iPhone 5? And an iPod Touch? :mad: Hissssssss

Connor Baker

Franco: I'm getting some AMAZING battery life. Thanks for all of your work dude :p
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] miguepereira77:
LOL those are only your daily usage one's I suppose...

Enviado desde mi Nexus 4 usando Tapatalk 2
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] franciscofranco:
You didn't want to see how may devices I had with me sometimes this year... like five galaxy nexus, two nexus 4, two nexus 7, one nexus 10, sometimes more! :)
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] yokuyuki:
You gotta use other ecosystems if you're going to be able to fully evaluate one particular one.

Google pushed some new code to AOSP for 4.2.2 and before you get all excited, it doesn't seem to have any wifi delayed notification fixes.
[Nexus 4 Original Android Development] franciscofranco:
Of course its ok, if that feels better for you go for it!