yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[HTC One X] maddog1979:
Why can't people just wait.... we'll get it when we get it.
[HTC One X] exocetdj:
JB is crap and not worth the wait anyway :silly:;)

(end of trolling lol!)

Certainly not worth all this acrimony!!!
[HTC One X] maddog1979:
Hear hear.
[HTC One X] kelvintisw:
It's pretty interesting to see all kind of "argument" here! :silly:

Cheers!:cool:
[HTC One X] hamdir:
no JB is nice it brought some fundamental fixes to android

but lets see seem them whine about 4.2 which is just such a silly update
[HTC One X] exocetdj:
I know mate, was just messing :) JB is excellent!!!!!
[HTC One X] exoticashu:
Paid update, if i am from HTC or some company to make decision on this, i would think many of times and even won't go for it...

Reasons???

1. The most people who care about new updates for their phones, belongs to developer category (guys who like to play around ROMS).. they will install what ever ROM they will find, instead of paying for upgrade. Rest of people are always fine with their phone, and never goes to "Software Updates" area of phone.

2. If i as HTC, takes money from you to release a upgrade, there has to be significant amount of requests for same so that my development team can afford to work on it.. i will not be carried away with assumption, that lets say in 2015, new Android 8 is releases and lets make a update for One X also...

3. Also when i take payment for a service as a company, i am liable to provide 100% accurate information and service on same. because this is what my customer will expect.

So like current case, where HTC promised an initial date of October month, and has already crossed half november without global roll-out of JB... where HTC social network can say JB will be available soon..all these things, after taking money from people, can put a legal complain against my company... i can't entertain that.

Thoughts????

---------- Post added at 10:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:02 PM ----------

Just want to mention that as a moderator of Forum, this was very righteous behavior from your side... i am sure the exchange of thought and facts is well received by majority of community, regardless of whom they favor.
[HTC One X] BarryH_GEG:
Folks, I've seen it published in a couple of different places that the "enthusiast community" (us) make up 5% of device owners. So things like locked bootloaders, voided warranties, and update delays are far less important to a company's success than we'd like to believe. HTC, Motorola, Samsung (on VZW in the U.S.), and Asus are all behaving similarly. And while Samsung doesn't generally lock their bootloaders they are cracking down on warranty repairs for devices using third party ROMs as they've just re-worked their flash counter and no one's been able to crack it yet. HTC started locking phone before the One X was released in March so anyone that bought it should have known achieving S-Off was a crap shoot. If you don't like a company's business practices don't buy their products. That sends a stronger message than buying them and complaining after the fact.

Of all that's been said here the thing I agree with most is HTC's poor communication. Samsung takes a different approach. They don't say anything and when they do its broad and vague. HTC speaks regionally with different messages coming out from different countries which is actually more frustrating than saying nothing. Samsung uses terms like "soon," "very soon," "this year," and "before the end of the year." I've never seen them directly say "The update for 'X region' will be out in November." When a date's given and missed that's when the villagers storm the castle with pitch forks and torches.

There's six weeks left in the year. I'd like to believe that no matter what's been said that the update will be completely rolled out this year. So all this debate over HTC's competence, communication skills, and integrity will all blow over in six weeks once we're all updated. But like Hamdir said, with 4.2 out, it's about to start over again. Maybe you should copy and save your posts in this thread so they can be reused when the "where's 4.2?" thread is opened? It'll save a lot of key strokes. There’s nothing that’s been said in this thread that wasn’t said multiple times in the “where’s 4.0.4?” thread that preceded it.

P.S. - Newly introduced high-end phones are still shipping with ICS. The LG Optimus G and Sony's latest Xperia's are example. So it's highly likely our nine-month old phone will be on JB before phones that people are purchasing for the first time this month.
[HTC One X] exocetdj:
:good:
[HTC One X] GriffinSauce:
I'm not sure I'd go for exactly that model, but it's worth exploring the options at least. Thanks for the non-flame reply. :)

1. Yes, although this is 1-5% or whatever, that is that percentage of millions of uses. Enough to pay a few devs.

2. I do not fully understand your point? Can you try to reword it? (no offense, small language barrier I think .. )

3. Yes, exactly. This is the goal! Having it paid means it can be a "serious activity" where those points are respected, instead of a little side-activity without control.

My point was that if they were paid for updates, such a situation of missing deadlines, miscommunication and overal chaos would not occur or much less. The problem now is that these updates are just a small support activity, not a product feature or product themselves.

For example:

It's not exactly the same, but where I got the idea;

http://www.reaper.fm/purchase.php

They are now at 4.261

This is a very strong model IMO, it gives people a strong sense of being future-proof, but also it draws a strong line as to how far that will go. Would anyone whine that they didn't get 6.0? No.
[HTC One X] exoticashu:
Thanks to you too for appreciating it.. I was just trying to learn and share some.

I am not sure if this % would be able to cover the cost of all Devs, testers and infrastructure used to push a upgrade.

What i wanted to say is that when a company decides not to release a major upgrade for any of their old phone, not only hardware limitation but over all profit also pays a major role in it.. After 5 years from now, it will be completely insignificant for HTC to keep ready a latest OS upgrade for One X also, even though they charge for it... because now here we all know that, a major OS upgrade is not only limited to OS update but also involves in-house testing, beta testing, carrier testing and eventually a systematic release and after support.

How can a company go with assumption that they will get enough request for OS upgrade on any old device, when their is a famous saying "You can always find a better partner and Mobile in future, if you waited a bit"

If HTC's first release of JB could have went perfect in Taiwan, we would be having JB by now.. but Wireless and Media link type of issues caused HTC to re-work on their build... hence product is delayed... same will happen when people will pay... only that HTC won't announce an earlier release date...

a simple question, when we pay for a service and asked to wait without giving a time, what will be our reaction? it will provoke anger of customer, which is happening now.

The example given by you simply looks working and successful. but it is similar to a Windows OS purchase for desktop.. means used for commercial purpose.. and we can see a future business in it, unlike to Mobile OS upgrade. i hope i understood your example, what you meant to say.
[HTC One X] Atlantics:
You forgot to mention this phone.

It's also newly released by Siemens this year, even without Android. :p

I'm sorry, but I pay not for set of diodes and resistors, when buying the phone, but also for the maintenance of the software up to date. If the company did not promise to update to JB, then I would choose the Samsung, which not only promised, but also fulfilled this promise.

And now I feel cheated, like many others on this forum. I am not a programmer and not an enthusiast, but I want to get my investments efficient and that means to me keeping my phone in most updated form.

This is my own point of view and I'm sorry if it's opposite to other opinion
[HTC One X] GriffinSauce:
When did you buy it? Because before JB was released I don't think HTC mentioned that at all, let alone promise anything.

If you bought it recently, after HTC announced that they will update, then ok I understand your feelings. (even then the update techinically was still not a part of your purchase if it is not advertised specifically with the product)
[HTC One X] Atlantics:
I got it 3 weeks ago when HTC officially announced JB for HOX. Do you really think that the update is not a part of the purchase? It was crucial for deciding which phone to buy and I feel cheated
[HTC One X] thekillingroad:
Just a quick note, any "acceptable" price for extended updates, will never ever ever pay for the developers.

You will pay the wages for the developers in any conditions, you will pay their social security, you will continue to employ them no matter how few users have bought updates. What if you release an update with months' work and only 1000 users bought it. Especially HTC can not afford this, just can not afford the risk.

I think the mobile community should have more "acceptable and understandble" request from their manufacturers. Do you expect Sony to update your 2009 Vaio to Windows 8?

It is just sold with what it is, and what we should expect is updating the phone, not the software, and this can easily be achived with the shipped software version.
[HTC One X] Dysphonic:
Just provide vanilla Android updates after, say, one year. Rather have that anyway. Much cheaper perhaps.
[HTC One X] tkolev:
When waiting for a bus and it's running late, do you feel "cheated"? You WILL get JB. It has been delayed, not cancelled.
[HTC One X] GriffinSauce:
I mean from a legal viewpoint you bought the same product as I did.

That they promised some extra support for free (which is basically what the updates are) and didn't deliver (yet), that sucks.

When I bought my phone, one week later htcsense.com got axed. I felt cheated, that was a big part of why I chose HTC at the time. (now I'm extremely happy with an awesome phone). Do you think if I sued them for taking own htcsense.com I would win? I don't.

Anyway, just hang on, JB is coming 100% sure. I think we've all made it clear that we are angry about the delay by now, so let's just chill out a bit.
[HTC One X] thekillingroad:
Well, while developing Sense in a first priority, making second version of software and employing developers for that is not actually cheaper.

yes vanilla is easier to develop/adopt, but that is not what they're mainly doing, thus becomes an additional task.

Also, they are not in control of what google will develop and require.

Do you think HTC stating 512MB devices will NOT get JB is just, playing lottery with numbers? :)
[HTC One X] tkolev:
It's not "silly". The new presentation framework is amazing. Image processing is much faster and it brings security features that will allow media content providers to seriously consider android as a platform. Though I admit that the top advertised feature (multiuser support) is useless for phones but on tablets it's a killer.
[HTC One X] BarryH_GEG:
Here's why updates from Android manufacturers are so pitiful and it's purely a commercial decision on their part. They all have access to the code for an update Google's working on well before it's released. There's no practical reason that the manufacturers couldn't push updates out in tandem with Google or within a month or two on a consistent basis. All it would take is $'s for the additional resources and the will.

There is no will and there is no financial upside to spending the $'s. As it stands it's a level playing field. They all suck fairly equally. If Samsung decided to spend $2MM a year and form a new update group to improve update timing to the point they'd never be more than 30 days behind Google, within days everyone else would follow them to remain competitive. Same thing if HTC did it first. Since they all suck, and there's no financial benefit of updating devices they've already been paid for and profited from, there's zero incentive for any of the major players to change the process. Even with all the media coverage of Android’s fragmentation and wild-wild-west update process its gaining market share over iOS each month. So, from a competitive perspective, they either all “suck” or their all “good” but since sucking costs less and there’s no downside for it there's no reason not to suck. And since whoever decides to be "good" first knows everyone else will follow there’s no upside for spending the bucks to change it. So with no financial upside and knowing competitors will follow there’s no reason for HTC or Samsung to pull the trigger on a better and more expensive process unless they have to.

We view updates as an obligation; they view updates as a pain in the ass. Since Google exerts no control over what happens with Android I'm afraid we're going to have to continue playing the "update game" well in to the future. If you really want to blame someone, blame Google. They're providing an open source OS free to manufacturers who are generating billions in profit from it. If Google grew some balls they'd find they have more control over the manufacturers than they realize. If Google said "starting with devices released on 4.2 all manufactures have to release updates within 60 days of their public release" do you think HTC and Samsung would abandon Android? Hardly. But as Android grows and more people are committed to the platform Google will sell more mobile ads and content from Play. So they have no incentive to “poke the bear.” Their total lack of regard for the end-user experience is sort of shocking though and could very well come back to bite them in the ass at some point in the future. And with Samsung selling 30MM SGS3's so far Nexus isn't the answer. It's more like pissing in the ocean.
[HTC One X] tkolev:
Google can't make OEMs update their phones. Sense, Touchwiz, Blur, etc. all have their toll on performance. Any OEM has the right to evaluate the performance of their devices and decide if it meets their standards or not. If not - the update will not be pushed because it will make most of the current users unhappy. And no OEM will drop their custom enhancements just to please the xda-ers. Look at WP7. Every phone is exactly the same as everyone else. Where did it get them? One figure market share. In fact the ugly Touchwiz-ed Galaxy Tab 10.1 being the last to be updated to ICS outsold every other HC tablet that launched last year. Add the lack of incentive for the OEMs to update and the indifference of Google and you get the current situation. Everyone that wants updates ASAP - go buy a Nexus. Everyone else - wait for the OEMs and don't listen to their managers.
[HTC One X] forceware:
The moral to all this?

there's no such thing as a free lunch!!!

If you want windows 8 on the release date and not a moment sooner or later then buy a copy.

If you want iOS updates on time then pay more for a similar spec hand set..

If you want free updates you need to wait a while. Something has to give.
[HTC One X] BarryH_GEG:
Sure they can. All they have to do is threaten to block Play Store access for manufacturers that aren't compliant. Look how fast Acer dropped the Aliyun project with Alibaba when Google threatened them. It's more a matter of "won't" than "can't."
[HTC One X] tkolev:
Acer got what they deserved (a slap on the hands). There was a clear breach of the OHA agreement, so Google told them that they can't both benefit from the OHA and a forked version of Android. If you want to be in the OHA - that's fine, if you don't want to be in the OHA - that's fine also, just pick one. They can't change the OHA rules all the manufacturers accepted when it was formed. Acer figured it has better future making Android devices, than being the Chinese equivalent to whoever makes the Amazon abomination of Android.

That being said, sure Google won't make OEMs do something that would hurt their business. It would be silly to force your partners into something neither you nor they will benefit from.
[HTC One X] colinmc8:
The Messers become the messees! :D
[HTC One X] BarryH_GEG:
That pretty much sums it up. ;) And why we're doomed to suffer in update purgatory. We, the "enthusiasts," are the only ones that think (or care) that the system is broken which brings us back full circle to how this thread (and others like it on every XDA device forum) got started and why people here are so frustrated.
[HTC One X] colinmc8:
While we're on the topic of nonsense (or non jelly bean!) How many times a day are you guys hitting the "Check Now" button?

I would say an average of 10 for me, depending if I'm busy or not :eek:
[HTC One X] exoticashu:
I prefer to check in this community on XDA which i think is 100% full-proof... and it avoids that much navigation also on phone.
[HTC One X] Cloudane:
The depressing thing is I now have 4.2 on my Nexus 7 and it adds some brilliant things like the new gesture keyboard and AC charging without shorted data pins along with numerous bug fixes and now I'm kind of waiting for that... but we don't even have the previous version yet!

Oh well it's all a learning thing and one is to go for nexus devices if you want quick updates.

I hear the stock camera for vanilla 4.2 has HDR support now which is the one thing I was still bothered about Sense for... so may be time to switch to CyanogenMod once it gets updated... Which I think will be a lot sooner than HTC hehe
[HTC One X] Zlotin:
1. Sense has already Swype keyboard.

2. With cm you won't have that sort of camera quality, because it uses own frameworks and has no proper access to the hardware.

4.2 has almost no features sense doesnt have....
[HTC One X] BarryH_GEG:
That's pretty much my approach too. Since Taiwan were the guinea pigs I'd guess they'll be the first to receive the "new and improved" update before another region sees it first.
[HTC One X] smash_07:
There is something to note here.

I have 3 phones from different brands. I got one LG, Samsung and the HOX. All of these 3 are awating the update to the next version of Android. The LG is still waiting for the... 4.0 update, yes it is still on Gingerbread. LG here in my country always gives me the answer "we don't know when the update will come, we will give informoation when you know about it".

The Samsung is waiting for the Jelly Bean update and they said it would come in November, we are already in it and there is no signs of the update yet.

And the HOX needs no discussions here about the update. So keep in mind, you can complain about HTC and how late they release updates, but let's be honest, there's no brand that updates fast and they all take several months to deliver. Not HTC, Samsung, LG or others.

Our only choice is waiting, even though I too get upset of taking so long but... oh well :(
[HTC One X] Cloudane:
I'd be damned. Never noticed that option in the keyboard before! Thanks for the info!

Oh well will see. I'm also hoping that one of the two versions fixes a bug with Bluetooth on my car stereo where it won't stay connected on the media profile for more than a split second. I don't mind which version does...
[HTC One X] tkolev:
I don't think the system is broken. I think that while not perfect, it is actually the best we can have. Recently I read an article from some Wallstreet guy explaining how wrong are Google because although he spends 90% of his time using android phone and 10% using iOS devices, the money he has spent were like 100$ for android apps and 1000$ for iOS apps. So Apple was the winner, right? Google were loosing money because they were developing the system for free, the developers were losing money because there were too many free apps. Man, I'm not surprised the economy is where it is with those idiots around. Android devices are outnumbering iOS three to one and with 1.3M activated each day, that difference is only going to get bigger. Would it be possible with a different business model? I'd say "No". OEMs would have not stood behind Android so strong and with fragmented smartphone ecosystem (each having its own proprietary OS) we would have all been left to the mercy of Apple. WP failed to launch because of iOS competition much more than because of Android competition. Symbian was destined to die. True, Android may have sped up the process but it was going to happen anyway. RIM are also loosing customers to iOS penetrating in the enterprise environment. Android in its current form was (and still is) the only way for both Google (now that Apple are kicking them out of the iPhone) and OEMs to secure their place in the smartphone market. I don't think anyone on this forum had illusions that HTC or any other OEM will update any of their phones in the same fashion that Google updates the Nexuses. We have all made our informed choice so I don't see the point in whining like little girls that things turn out the way we know they would turn out rather than the way we hoped they would turn out.
[HTC One X] colinmc8:
I'm hoping they update the bluetooth as well, HTC don't support Bluetooth profile AVCRP 1.3 as mentioned here http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1649974
[HTC One X] BarryH_GEG:
Tell that to these poor souls...

Android users outraged over Motorola's broken promise

Company concedes some customers got "a raw deal" in decision not to upgrade 2011 flagship devices to Ice Cream Sandwich.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57526994-94/android-users-outraged-over-motorolas-broken-promise/

Hmm, I wonder. ;)

Personaly, I think we've had it pretty good going from 4.0.3>4.0.4>4.1.1 and Sense 4.0>4.1>4+ in nine months. Many owners of other high-end devices would be envious.
[HTC One X] kelvintisw:
<< By: BarryH_GEG >>

"Personaly, I think we've had it pretty good going from 4.0.3>4.0.4>4.1.1 and Sense 4.0>4.1>4+ in nine months. Many owners of other high-end devices would be envious."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That is the best and the honest and the fairest statement ever! :good:

I totally agreed! HTC has done an awesome job! Many people have actually forgotten about all the speedy updates/fixes in the last 9 months :)
[HTC One X] Actura:
there is no point in getting upset for that

the update progress is not as simple as usual people think

i am just hoping the jelly bean will be bug free (or at least free from serious bug)

and it would be very good :good:
[HTC One X] colinmc8:
Taking Bets

Anyone putting money (virtual) on an update tomorrow?

People have said HTC release updates on Fridays?
[HTC One X] orderme:
sometimes before, when all the jelly bean hype started, I also started to get impatient for the ota release. But after some time I noticed all the news about bugs and things not working properly. Also the software on X+ seems to have some flaws.

Now, when new releases for elevates come up, I get the feeling, that guys at htc try to make the things really good. I also think, that the late release for jb on HOX is not only because of the X+, but because of the fact, that htc wants to deliver a flawless software.

And this is the way I like! Devs at HTC: Take your time and come up with a great release when its done right! :good:
[HTC One X] lilvfr400boy:
Cannot wait too see how good jb is, USB otg is going to be so much fun to mess with, so htc is improving my phone I already love for free? Thanks HTC can't wait
[HTC One X] Andy:
I'm glad you can see my way of thinking & understanding, whilst remaining true to your point.

The power of the 5% as you put it is only powerful when as a collective we work together. Until the point when 100% of the 5% make a stand and cause real waves to be made, such as HTC unlocking their bootloaders (albeit half hearted), we will get no where together.

As for the fan boys, well you'll know for next time :). I wouldn't go on a Apple/Mac forum asking what handset is better or purchase advice because it will be very heavily biased. Even "impartial" blogs & tech review sites these days have underlying brand bias/favoritism and its hard to get an honest frank review or opinion.