yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Android General] :
Sorry, you are not looking at this in the right way. If the official page mentions no carrie names then all carries will be assumed. Motorola Mobility can be held accountable when at later time they make another official statement with specific carrier(s) . What needs to be done now is to have a screenshot of the page for future litigation to prove how Motorola Mobility misled the consumers. We need to be smart, fair, and use any evidence we can collect from Motorola Mobility to present them for the litigation time, should we need to.
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
I think you missed my point. They have nothing in place for other carriers yet the page would lead people to believe otherwise. Then their statement regarding the $100 credit only mentions phones carried by Verizon without actually saying Verizon. I would have far more respect for Motorola if they were upfront about the whole thing. I'm not the only one that has little to no trust of the manufacturers and carriers when it comes to updates and policy.
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
#supportmymoto Support My Moto IRC chat to discuss issues and tactics
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
Found this in my inbox from the man himself

:D
[Android General] dragontology:
"The man himself"?

Now I'm wondering... is there one specific goal you all have, or just a wish list?

It seems to me that there are several solutions that would "satisfy" the #SMM campaign:

1. Upgrade to ICS offered to any affected phone's owner who wants it (but not the general public, because Motorola believes it would be detrimental to the experience).

2. Bootloader unlock offered to any affected phone's owner who wants it

3. Drivers/libs released to the public/anyone who wants it

4. Monetary compensation (e.g. a percentage of what you paid for your phone)

5. An exchange to another handset

I've been thinking about 5. What if I go to US Cellular and plead my case, and they offer me a refurbished device of equal or lesser value. So, Samsung Galaxy S2, or HTC Hero S (HTC Evo Design 4G, for you Sprint folks). Which do I take? Galaxy S2 is clearly a good choice, but I bought a nice case (Otterbox Defender) for my Electrify, and my wife doesn't want it. My brother might, or my wife might want to hold onto it to sell with hers when she goes to upgrade. Hero S isn't a bad phone, but it's what I traded after 6 days of owning one for the Electrify, and I have never regretted that trade. The S2 has JB, I believe -- at least ICS. And the Hero/Design got upgraded to ICS this summer, that I do know. But all in all I think I would stay. It would be a tough call. (And this is all hypothetical; no such offer was made.)

Money would be nice, but once it's spent the issue still remains.

If they release the ICS update, those with locked bootloaders will still have locked bootloaders after upgrading, I would imagine. Those without can wait for unlocked ROMs, as usual. But that won't help those who are locked.

I just think we should have some unified goals in mind, that we can all basically agree to, even if we have different ideas for ourselves.

Also with regards to organization, what are the top 3 things that would stop or severely limit what we want to do? And how can we prevent them or avoid them? I suggest "lack of motivation/interest" as one. People realize Motorola and their carrier won't budge, so they give up. Any ideas what we can do then? Besides pledging to not buy Motorola next time?

And what are you guys using for IRC? I searched IRC on Google Play and "AndChat" seems to be the highest rated free IRC client. I know nothing about IRC, other than the most basic of basics. Tried "Freenode" and it says I need to log in via "SASL". Is this something that can be done on mobile? edit: None of the apps I've tried can connect, they all say something about a "SASL" error.
[Android General] infeu:
support for the action!!! request for the release of source code, unlocked bootloader and update!!!

ps : If the bootloader is unlocked, is it possible to help my hard bricked phone(it can connect to the pc through the factory cable)?
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
Unlock and source would make JB ROMs available to anybody that wants it.

Updating would cover more moto owners and thereby minimize the impact to Moto's profits and public image.

The reason I ask for both is that it gives Motorola room to work with. Once/if Motorola decides to open up a line of communication then specifics could be discussed. Ideally unlock and an update would cover almost all Moto owners. Either way, both solutions would be of benefit to Moto. Even though I'm fronting the campaign I would like to see as many people walk away from it happy, or at least not want to attack each other.

The biggest is Moto has already written us off and has planned for it financially. If this is the case then all the bad press and all of us, businesses included, dropping Moto for any other manufacturer will accomplish nothing. I really doubt they have done this.

Apathy/lack of motivation is the second biggest issue. It's easy to complain about it but filing complaints and signing petitions? Who has time for that? What many don't realize is that without action there is no reaction as Motorola most likely ignores those "I'm never buying Moto again" posts. How do you think the BBB and others would react if they received complaint filings from just 25% of the affected Moto owners. Where do you think the petition would be if the same 25% signed it?

We're on freenode IRC. It may take some time for the channel to propagate the channel search sites

Meanwhile in the Motorola forums (see attached pic)
[Android General] p0wder2:
I vote for #2 AND #3

I doubt #1 is at all likely to happen, #4 is in NO WAY a satisfactory solution as it still allows them to skate on the issue at hand (IMO), and I would much prefer community development over a different handset.

I agree that this may be something that needs to be hashed out officialy though.

You have my vote :)
[Android General] dragontology:
Gotta love the Motorola forums. I posted a message in that topic, and during signup it asked me what phone I had. I told it and got a funny icon. When I hovered over it, the tooltip said "Telegraph". That's what Motorola thinks of our phones (or at least the Electrify, Loki's got a pager). Anyway, I suspect my reply will make some people at Motorola (or at least that forum manager) very uncomfortable.

So that chat is web only? I got past the captcha, but it kinda looks/works like crap on the phone. So hard to hit the little send button. Since the issue is phones, it would be cool to have a chat that works on phones.
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
I'll look into android apps that can access the #supportmymoto channel and update everybody.

EDIT

AndChat seems to work ok and will issue random nick for those not registered. I've added it to the OP and the website.
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
With all the insanity of running the Support My Moto campaign I missed the cut off for the Big Android BBQ so no BBQ for me. And next year is definitely not an option.

Hopefully somebody here can step up and represent us. If you want the job then PM me please.
[Android General] chronicfathead:
Quick request.

If we are posting on forums about this, can we keep the posts clean and civil. Last thing we want is to come off as a bunch of retards.

I'm not saying we are, but I don't think it will help if we descend into swearing.

Sent using my Jelly fingers.
[Android General] GPhoenix:
LOL! True..I hate it when I come out as an One Eye monster! :cyclops: Hopefully my posts haven't been just rants and have some merit to them. But all seriousness aside...I think most of us here are able to put sentences together to convey our displeasure with Moto on XDA forums as well as other public forums. I just hope the general masses who are also affected don't drown out the legitimate posts with logic and reason.

By the way, check this out guys. I saw this old Legal petition on Groupal last year filed by Atrix users that received an official response from Moto's Consumer Affairs division. Is this something we can need to do to get an actual legal response or will the petitions on Change.org be sufficient? Gropal legal petition in reference to Atrix users requestin an unlocked boot loader in 2011 - [here]
[Android General] dragontology:
Weird. AndChat was one of the ones I tried. Said I had to register via SLAS or SALS? How do I register? Sorry, total IRC newbie. Don't suppose we can all agree to use something a little more... user friendly? I mean, you've used your real name (e.g. the Gmail conversation screenshot). I don't mind using mine. We're talking about phones, not pirating movies or overthrowing dictatorships.

It's in Texas, right? Too far for me. I'm in NC and at the eastern end to boot. I've actually driven from Texas (Dallas area) to here without sleep. Long story there. Anyway, I left around noon one day and got here around 10pm the next day. So it's a good 34 hour drive. I can one-shot here-to-Connecticut (11 hours) without breaking much of a sweat, but Texas? Plus the gas. Love to, but sorry. Bit too far. Hope somebody does it, though.

Fully agreed. However, people who are angry about their phone being abandoned are going to get ugly about it, without even intending to represent #SMM.

We should have a code of conduct, as well as a guide. Some quickly-quotable facts we can draw from. I don't think we should copy and paste. I made a fool of Motorola on the BBB complaint because I addressed their copypasta in the initial complaint, they used it anyway, and I called them on it. But some facts would be nice to have. Maybe a top 5/10 points we all or most of us agree with. ICS runs better than GB, ICS has access to more/better apps (Apex/Nova, Chrome, Google Now), things like that.

Here's another idea. People. Those of us who are willing to share, maybe we provide a picture and a survey, come up with a few leading questions, such as "When did you get your phone", "What do you want Motorola to do", "How do you feel about Motorola abandoning its phones", things like that. Just 1-3 sentences for each. You know, put a face on it, as they say. I dunno. Show that and show that Motorola has this one reply they just copy and paste to everyone. Really goes to show that we're not just whining or looking for something for nothing, but that we have a valid grievance here.
[Android General] matriX1218:
Hey, I saw Motorola is sending the same response to everyone who filed complaint...

Why don't we Draft a common reply to Motorola that we can use against their response...

We all have common questions and complaints and motorola is also replying common statement to everyone...

What do you guys say?

Sent from Motorola Photon 4G via Reliance
[Android General] tatperson:
LOL that would be epic!

Sent from my #Motofail... No further Plans coming...
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
I'll look into IRC alternatives but it may require that I host the chat server. I chose IRC as that tends to be the most accepted way to do this. I'll also put together an IRC guide for PC and AndChat with basic info for folks unfamiliar with it.

I'm not to worried about my name in the emails as google search "Kiev 60" and my work is usually the fourth hit (not counting "images"). Using our forum names in chat makes it easier for us to identify each other but you do have a point. "not pirating movies or overthrowing dictatorships" speak for yourself, world domination is one of my life long ambitions.

I used to go from D.C. to Manhattan Island for coffee and a Ruben on a regular basis but 34hrs would be insane. Hopefully we can get some representation at the BBQ. I'll admit I did drop the ball on that one and I apologize.

I've been asking for folks to forward their correspondence with Moto to me be no takers so far. I'll put this out there now. The coverage has been great but imagine if ALL the forum posts and petition comments as well as any previous petitions were compiled into one massive database of, well, angry customers. Take that to the BBB and other agencies and the press. Hundreds, maybe thousands, of pages of angry customer comments is not so easy to ignore. That's just one part of it. This type of action should normally have at least five to ten people on it minimum.

As you can see I have a very daunting task in front of me and none of the things we are asking for would be of any benefit to me. It still doesn't change that what there are doing, and have done in the past, is wrong and it should be addressed.

The survey idea is a pretty good one. Let me think it over and get back. I think the first thing is have specific folks cover specific areas of the campaign.
[Android General] GPhoenix:
I finally saw your posts in the forums Loki and Dark about accusing Loking of muddling the water and starting rumors! :good: Nice work there. Anyhow I'm going to go somewhat silent for the next couple of days since I have a deadline due this week so won't be able to contribute too much but afterwards I can help more with the background research and gathering of details, etc. if still needed.

That is awesome we got Azrienoch to support us. Although you won't be at the BBQ Loki would the other lead developers here on XDA that is supporting the cause going to be there? Maybe they can carry the torch there and give us some exposure?

Side notes although it may lead to it (not anytime soon I bet) but there were previous class action lawsuits levied against #MMI but I'm not sure what the outcomes where and couldn't find any results on the web by Motorola CLIQ XT users:

Case 1: Elyse Wood v. Motorola Mobility, Inc., Case No. 11-cv-04409, U.S. District Court, Northern District of California, Oakland Division http://bit.ly/PO7v5x

Case 2: Jack Haught v. Motorola Mobility, Inc., Case No. 12-cv-2515, Illinois Northern District Court, Cook County http://bit.ly/TkE80X
[Android General] tiger013:
http://www.androidpit.com/android-update-motorola
[Android General] Alaq:
Sent this for the xda portal. Reply:
[Android General] ppero196:
I just trolled Motorola

https://twitter.com/markmagnus/status/255358550543585280

Sent from my house via interwebs to You!
[Android General] GPhoenix:
Sorry I just couldn't help myself to stay away anyhow here are updates on additional coverage of the campaign by other online news portals/blogs:

Hot Hardware - http://hothardware.com/News/Motorolas-Broken-Upgrade-Promise-Gives-Android-a-Bad-Rap-/

Linux Today - http://www.linuxtoday.com/infrastru...-upgrade-promise-gives-android-a-bad-rap.html

Android Headlines - http://androidheadlines.com/2012/10/featured-the-rise-against-motorola-has-begun.html

Android Headlines - http://androidheadlines.com/2012/10...-google-when-it-comes-to-android-updates.html

R-Tools Technology - http://motorola-customer-problems.articles.r-tt.com/

Phones Review UK -http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2012/...ic-owner-frustration-over-ics-update-letdown/
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
Thanks! The articles and comments will be very useful.

I reached to Adrian Kingsley-Hughes at ZDNet who recently wrote an article about the current Android upgrade mess to see if he, or one of his colleagues at ZDNet, would be interested in covering this current issue with Motorola.

Please do not promote SMM in the article's comments at this time.
[Android General] dragontology:
Honestly I am disappointed by all of the articles I've seen so far. I think important parts of the story are being left out. Maybe they don't matter and the picture is complete enough without them, and I'm glad this is getting attention, but I'd like to see some outlets call Motorola out on ICS not running well on these phones. I'd like to see a real-world comparison between a freshly unboxed Photon or Electrify and one with freshly installed CM9. I'd like to see benchmarks, battery testing, and opinions of people who have tried both. Because currently we have "Motorola reneges on promise to update phones, and that sucks" but leaves the reasoning vague. I think it leads some to suspect that maybe Motorola had a good reason for not doing the update. I think it lends credence to Motorola's excuse that the phones aren't good enough for ICS. And I personally think that's the real issue. That the only reason they aren't updating is because they want us to buy a new device, way before we qualify for the subsidized rate, and more than that, they want us to switch to Verizon.

When I write my article, I'll cover all this, but I get almost no views. I can copy and paste my article into the comments of these other articles, but I don't want to spam. I'll definitely post it here.

Now I'm wishing I hadn't jumped back to ICS so quick. I'm gonna Nandroid backup my ICS ROM, then Nandroid restore my stock ROM, and factory reset it to get that fresh, just-installed look, and then get some screenshots. I'll then flash the latest CM9, and get screenshots of the same areas in ICS.
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
Task of the day: Go to Google and search support my moto with no quotations

Enjoy and many thanks!!!

SCORED LATE REG TICKETS TO THE BBQ!!! I'm having a "Support My Moto" t-shirt done, nothing fancy, up so everybody can find me (or run depending who you work for).
[Android General] XxReApErxX:
Great idea!

How about making a video reviewing/comparing the best ICS/JB rom vs the stock GB rom? In order to show:

- The Photon is capable to run ICS/JB

- There is no excuse from Motorola for not developing a functional ICS rom after so many months. What have the Motorola software developing team been doing all these months?

- How ICS/JB custom roms are already better than their stock GB and how even better they might get if they provide us whatever the devs need to make them fully functional. (Btw, I don't know if that's even possible, I know nothing about developing)

We can link that video to every relevant place
[Android General] matriX1218:
+1

EDIT:

We must put this video on our official website also... as well as social networking websites...

Sent from Motorola Photon 4G via Reliance
[Android General] p0wder2:
Another +1 on this
[Android General] matriX1218:
I had a chat with Moto and they told me...

"It is the decision of Motorola, Google and the specific Carrier of the phone that the phone will not be upgraded anymore."

HTC Incredible 2 vs Photon 4G

http://www.gsmarena.com/compare.php3?idPhone1=3938&idPhone2=3987

HTC has official ICS.. Can Moto justify this?
[Android General] infeu:
We have to ask motorola to release everything including SBK as well, I see that ASUS's transformer can be unbricked because they have SBK. And for motorola, they do not release SBK. If our devices are hard bricked, we have to change hardware and cost lots of money. So if it releases SBK, at least it has hope for our device!!

p.s. hard bricked ATRIX
[Android General] ppero196:
Aren't these called SBF in Motorola's case?

Sent from my house via interwebs to You!
[Android General] jbaumert:
Another nail for the moto coffin....

http://hothardware.com/News/Motorolas-Broken-Upgrade-Promise-Gives-Android-a-Bad-Rap-/
[Android General] infeu:
you can refer to this about SBK

http://androidroot.mobi/technical/tf-secure-boot-key/

because lack of SBK, we cannot use nvflash to unbrick our deveice (at least it is a possible way we can try to save our devices if motorola can release SBK. If motorola does not release SBK, there is no hope to unbrick unless send our devices to change the hardware which is absolutely costs us much more money! And it is ridiculous. Why don't we just use a more easy way to unbrick our devices instead of replacing hardware???).

So we are here to encourage motorola to release everything to us including source code, unlocked bootloader, SBK and everything! We should let Motorola hear our discontent!

And let say, ok fine, Motorola you don't want to continue support on devices. But you at least have to release those source code, SBK and unlocked bootloader so we can develop our custom roms!
[Android General] matriX1218:
I think video is needed at the earliest so that other websites can cover it with proof... :rolleyes:

Sent from Motorola Photon 4G via Reliance
[Android General] Matada02:
Im in as a tester with my atrix (if u will port it) also im gladly donate some $.
[Android General] alteredlikeness:
This is a great, well-organised effort - thank you - but, please include the ATRIX 2 (edison) - MB865 & ME865 - yea we got ICS, but, like the rest, we need the bootloader unlocked and source code.

Any support or info needed about the A2 will be happily provided by our friendly community..:D

Edit: sorry, just read a little more thoroughly - this is just for those that recently got word of no further updates from moto, ey? Oh well.. Nonetheless, let's get the bootloader unlocks rolling...
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
I really need the emails, chat session logs , screencaps of this stuff. Without it this is just hearsay

The video idea is a good one. If anybody has two of the exact same phone and would be willing to do video and send it too me I will put it here and on the site. PM me or hit up the IRC chat.

This is one of the 64 articles I came across yesterday in my search. It's also one of the 52 sites that needs to be contacted.

Going through my emails and AndChat is now our official Android IRC app. See attached screencap.
[Android General] matriX1218:
I've a chat log.... Should I post here?

I also sent them email but no response till date...

Sent from Motorola Photon 4G via Reliance
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
Yes if you could please. Just attach it to your post, or if it's too big zip it first.
[Android General] matriX1218:
Here you go...

Sent from Motorola Photon 4G via Reliance
[Android General] upndwn4par:
Epinter says he has an ICS leak for the Atrix.

http://xdaforums.com/show....php?t=1928569

Edit:

Rumor is that it is not from Moto.
[Android General] dragontology:
I think I can help you guys with the video. I wanted to test something on my wife's phone: I enabled the second profile and rebooted, hoping it would boot into that second profile and not default to the first. Well, it did like I wanted, so all I have to do is factory reset after a nandroid backup, and I can record a boot race. Anything else I should compare?

What should I do with the video? Just upload it to YouTube?
[Android General] matriX1218:
Link it to our official website...

Also post links here so that we can use it to spread it...

Sent from Motorola Photon 4G via Reliance
[Android General] dragontology:
I have a screenshot of a page on Motorola's blog that MotoFail posted on Facebook. Imgur refuses to host it and XDA won't let me attach it without compressing it too much to be readable. The link is still up for all to see, maybe you guys have access to an unbiased host. Or I can email it if they happen to take this down.
[Android General] matriX1218:
Atrix 4G ICS leak is out...

Either they are trying to draw attention of Atrix 4G users from main goal of petition or they are really serious...

We must continue unanimously...

Sent from Motorola Photon 4G via Reliance
[Android General] Lokifish Marz:
Over fourty articles covering Motorola's removal of the ICS update and over ten articles that mention the campaigns

Also added to the OP and the website
[Android General] NishantM:
I guess this can be added to OP too.

http://www.xda-developers.com/android/motorola-this-is-why-we-broke-up-with-you-xda-developer-tv/
[Android General] olegfusion:
awesome video, great speech.
[Android General] matriX1218:
I sent email to Motorola and I got this response...

Sent from Motorola Photon 4G via Reliance
[Android General] XxReApErxX:
The perfect way would be a side by side comparison with 2 phones, but I know it's kinda hard to accomplish. I think the video should show how long both take to boot, the general smoothness of the system, how fast the apps open, the new ICS/JB features, how customizable the custom rom is, stuff like that.

Oh and it would be nice if you show what are the defects and consequences of not having the ICS/JB libs/drivers that we are requesting.

That's great. Let's see if it's a really helpful leak or not...

Ha! Awesome!

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