yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Motorola Droid RAZR] meteron:
*blink*

They HAVE been taking their time. 6 months + of time. So this argument of "they shouldn't rush it or it will suck" is moot. You have a team of developers and QA people, get it done. If people in high school can get a build running with minimal bugs within a couple of weeks (with updates either weekly or via nightly builds or whatever), there is no excuse. Which would be the case if they would unlock the bootloader... oh yeah taking their time on that too (or flat out lying, you choose). Guess we should not rush that either, eh? Yes I could flash the leak. I am trying so hard to be patient and see if the official release is close... but something tells me we won't see anything till June 30th.

And why ICS? There are PLENTY of reasons. Personally, if I have hardware that is not being fully tapped because of outdated software/OS, that irritates me.

I did not quote you to attack you. Just displaying my frustration with this.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] IP IHI II IL:
Again, we've already waited this long, what's a few more weeks? The Bootloader thing: I get it, and I don't all at the same time. HTC lets users unlock their bootloaders but you lose your warranty, so you have zero options if you goof around and brick your device. I'm no development, and I understand that unlocking the bootloader is great for some, but you have to look at the stats... MOST users aren't as savvy as those of us here. The average person buys a smartphone, and NEVER UPDATES ANYTHING, let alone flash ROMs or create custom kernels... Unlocking bootloaders means more work for (unfortunately) Verizon. Their employees don't have the knowledge, or time, or pay to support anything custom. Nor will they hire devs to support devs. You have to admit, it makes sense business wise to keep them locked, regardless of what Moto & Google want. Service providers suck. Period. You're better off selling your razr on Ebay, buying an unlocked version, getting a sim only plan, and getting your updates from Google themselves.

To sum up, Verizon sucks as all carriers do, and we all have to deal with the consequences of that until we stop depending on them for our services.

That's just my opinion, though...

\\Carved into this thread with my RAZR//

http://android-gz.com
[Motorola Droid RAZR] cemgsirj:
Google has already started buying and selling process, without the patent, of course, because they are always the focus of interest of google, money ... If we will have updates more frequently than other devices, I'm not really sure about it .... That´s MY point of view...

Regards, Cem.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] jelenkovic1:
This time it is all about patents

I think that this time it is all about patents and desire of google to have its own hardware company to make phones and tablets and to be more like apple so the hardware can be 100% optimized for software.

This does not mean that other android partners like samsung, htc and others will be taken from the picture, but there will be more good and not cloned devices :)

This is my point of view I would do something like that.

Regards from Serbia :)
[Motorola Droid RAZR] meteron:
Oh I know, a few more weeks will not kill me at this point. I am just being impatient at this point… as I really want to see how this phone will handle it.

As far as I know, Verizon encourages locked bootloaders… and no I do not believe a word they said about why they prefer manufacturers to lock their bootloaders. I don’t think Verizon commands them though to lock them... If that was the case there would be no dev community at all for the unlocked (or decrypted) HTC phones. The only thing that made my Thunderbolt usable was the fact that I could install custom roms. If it is a contract thing that allows HTC to unlock and Moto cannot… again then that’s moto’s fault for allowing that. And if that was the case they should have never said bootloaders would be unlocked.

Part of my frustration with Motorola is, this is my third device with them (previously owned a V551 and a Motorola Q), and after the Q I said I would never own their hardware again. The battery on my Maxx was too tempting, and I jumped with it. I almost regret it.

I could go on and on and on about this... but I will not hijack this thread. I had a friend visiting for two weeks (who happens to work for Verizon, and would give me no ICS secrets!) and we would debate and talk about things like this for hours. He left yesterday and I am looking for a fiery debate!

Cheers.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] qoncept:
That's not the way software works, and in this case there are multiple parties involved. Software can be spit out quick, but ensuring quality takes time, and that's something the devs creating roms just don't do.

Do you understand how Google debuts new versions of Android? Notice how one phone always has the update WAY before everything else? The manufacturers bid and whoever is willing to pay the most will have their phone released with Jelly Bean.

With OS software, the source has to be available when the binary is. So you have no idea how long the Galaxy Nexus was in development and ICS was being tweaked to run on it. That process was finished before anyone else could even start.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] ftx437:
Hmmmm..mine is now also saying update is down..kindda odd time for fixing stuff
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Eddy T:
Th didn't stop Motorola saying that the RAZR would have ICS 6 weeks after Google released it!!!

That was the reason I bought my first Motorola device.

I won't be falling for that trick (lie) again.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] meteron:
So then enlighten me, please. When a leak is out there, within weeks there are custom roms built on the leak. Bugs, yes. Bugs get fixed? Yes. The Nexus was released with signal issues and (I believe) hardware issues. Bugs will always go out no matter what. But at least with the dev community things get fixed in a timely manner. With my Thunderbolt, I had a VERY stable Gingerbread build running on my phone, 5 or 6 months before it was officially released.

I understand the "bidding" completely. With the Nexus line. Who gets to build "their" phone. That is building a phone from the bottom up (hardware and software included) vs taking source code and building it around what you already have. You have the hardware already, you have the code. So what you are saying is, even though a lot of the work has already been done, it is still going to take as long to tweak this OS vs building new hardware and an OS all together. The nexus was announced in May 2011, so if that was a start date of development and it was released November 2011 in the UK.. that would be 6 months. Give or take a month or two... so lets say 7-8 months. Source code for ICS was released November. It will be June tomorrow. We are going on 7 months for this when, I feel half the work was already done. To me that just does not seem right. And I know this is not just with moto either (as I ran into this with HTC as well).
[Motorola Droid RAZR] meteron:
"The Motorola Droid RAZR, launched Tuesday morning, will receive ICS in early 2012, Alain Mutricy, senior vice president of portfolio and product management at Motorola, said during a Wednesday press conference in Europe, as reported by Pocket Lint UK. The $299 phone is set to hit Verizon in November with Android 2.3, aka Gingerbread.

Mutricy said that although the Motorola RAZR (Motorola dropped the "Droid" name overseas) was designed for Gingerbread, the company has a plan in place to update the phone to ICS at the "start of 2012" and that all the innovations in the RAZR would be optimized for ICS."

I am sure if I looked for longer, I could find more sites and links to the actual press conference. But I am at work and, well should be doing more work LOL.

Edit: I also realize this is for the UK. I am unsure if he was talking about the UK version of the phone or just in general, as the article talks about the US release of the phone.

But, June is not early 2012.

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2395026,00.asp
[Motorola Droid RAZR] hotleadsingerguy:
Sorry...I had to reply to this. Coming from the Galaxy Nexus (with ICS), I cannot *wait* for the ICS upgrade on the Razr. it's a vastly-improved operating system.

The basis is that ICS is a big upgrade over gingerbread. It *is* faster, it introduces a ton of features, it's more streamlined (making the things normal people do easier and quicker to accomplish), and it looks a helluva lot better. I've used it for 6 months...going back to Gingerbread is a noticeable downgrade, and not because of the hardware that it's running on.

---------- Post added at 01:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:03 PM ----------

Oh, and the thing I forgot to mention: I'm assuming for most of you that this is your first Motorola device. Motorola does this with *EVERY* single device it they release. The Xoom was meant to get the 4G LTE upgrade within a few weeks after it launched. 10 months later they started sending out boxes. The Atrix was supposed to get a system update within weeks after launch. 8 months later they released an incremental upgrade, and then another 2 months after it they released the actual upgrade.

Motorola is *notorious* for announcing upgrades and updates that they either fail to release or prolong until uselessness. Get used to it.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Giblet535:
People are accustomed to the development lifecycle on PCs, which millions of bit-pushers can write code for because the basic architecture is all identical. Adding a Win7 driver for Marvell's latest SATA-9BillionAnd1 chip takes a few months at most.

Device drivers take a lot of time to create if you are already extremely familiar with the (brand new) hardware and the rest of the (brand new) system.

Each phone manufacturer's drivers are unique and proprietary, but they all have to work the exact same way by the time Android (the OS) tries to use them. Most of those phone devices have unique hardware architectures. What have you been learning, then doing, since November? Not as much as the device driver team at Moto, I'll wager. 10 months is not unreasonable for a set of device drivers for a device that is more complicated than any COTS PC or a typical laptop.

Moto's dev team has had since November to learn Android 4's architectural changes, then design, implement, and debug new device drivers for that architecture, from scratch likely, do some QA, and document the changes.

The first *working* leaks appeared six months after Android 4's release.

That's not bad at all.

Feel free to explain how you would streamline that process, because every tech industry will benefit from it.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] meteron:
Alright, I'll bite.

I work QA for my company and work very closely with the devs for our in house web based software for the call center. I work in the health care industry with the health plans. Just recently, starting in February of this year, we had to change code for the base of the program to allow tracking numbers instead of just case numbers. Started development, ironed out the bugs, and had everything implemented two weeks ago. Is this anything like developing for a phone? No. All we did was add some code to what was already there. We have a whole new interface coming up and won't be ready till next year. That is being built from the ground up. That will take a while. You already have the ground work here. Build a driver. They have done it before. It is not like they are new to this game. The architecture is the same. Kernal, libraries, Java based APIs, etc… that is all the same. So unless they drastically changed all that or I am not understanding something… that shouldn’t have to be redone. It’s not like they went from an Android architecture to, Windows or something. Also the Galaxy Nexus and the Droid Razr share the same CPU and GPU (GPU run at different speeds). The SoC in the Razr is a 4430 and the Nexus is a 4460. So even the guts of these two phones aren’t that much different.

Streamline? Well I think they are working on it. They stripped motoblur down, which takes up a lot of time. Hopefully in the future they don’t have to work around such a bloated skin, and having to write code and test code for apps and features that, generally no one cares about.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] qoncept:
People ***** and moan about bugs, and with good reason. When Temple Run crashes you deal with it. When the phone drops data connections, won't boot with Bluetooth enabled or doesn't notify when texts are received and you're using your phone for work, people are going to raise hell, stop buying phones from a manufacturer or carrier and start demanding money back.

For example, say you have 100 people in your company using Google Voice for SMS. If it goes down for a week that's a whole lot of people changing the way they work and realizing they don't want to depend on you anymore. Maybe this adds 10 minutes of time making calls to each person's day -- if these guys are getting paid $15 an hour, that's a $10,000 issue. The majority of Android users (especially have forums) have no or very limited perspective on the impact what they consider to be a minor inconvenience can have. I'm not saying that's a fault, just the reality.

The time it takes to do comprehensive testing is pretty much static. Obviously as you make code changes you test those changes (unit testing), but when you're done you have to test EVERYTHING to see if those changes impacted anything else (integration testing). Unit testing is pretty much included in the development time, and what Moto lists as a testing phase is comprehensive integration testing. I would guess it probably takes a couple weeks if they find no issues. If they do, they have to fix them and, depending on the risk, completely start integration testing over.

After that, Verizon is going to do their own integration testing. And from the sound of it, they do find bugs and send it back fairly regularly. After any of these bugs are fixed, both Moto and Verizon will do integration testing all over again. So, any change to anything that hasn't been released yet is likely to bump a release out an entire month.

IMO, Google themselves are pretty piss poor at quality control and let far too many (and often far too critical) bugs get released in their different apps.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] racingglock35:
You all are hillarious!
[Motorola Droid RAZR] meteron:
I totally get where you are coming from... especially this. A bug went live here two weeks ago with our call comments box... when pasting notes, instead of the cursor being at the end of where you pasted, it went all the way to the bottom of whatever was already in the call comments box! Nothing at all was changed with the call comments box. Just an... unintentional feature, as we like to call it.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Giblet535:
You're comparing web development to kernel development? You're talking apples v skyscrapers... There's a reason why web devs get squat (LAMP/perl/python devs that is - Microsoft devs have to take out a loan to afford squat) and why kernel devs get 6+ digits.

It sounds like you think that Samsung handed Motorola their driver source code? Are you thinking this is Ubuntu or some other Open Source code?

Wouldn't that be great though? An unlocked bootloader, with a BD containing the current fastboot image, PDF change lists, and the complete source tree on BD-ROM in the box that comes with the phone? See ya, I'll be in my bunk...

I'm sure there was some (very brief) discussion between Motorola and Samsung regarding driver source, ending with "YOU WANT HOW MUCH???" and the sound of sirens as the ambulance drivers collected the Motorola rep having the heart attack.

Samsung doesn't share source code. Neither does Motorola.

It is nicely debloated, isn't it? That was the biggest change from my perspective.

The 79 leak is great. I can live with the glitches until they have those glitches ironed out.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Hindle1225:
Considering Verizon/Google started rolling out 4.0.4 for the Galaxy Nexus today.... My guess is they will give those users 2-3 Weeks to update before they start rolling out the ICS update for our Razr's.

Razr Maxx
[Motorola Droid RAZR] meteron:
I assume ours get 6 figures too. They damn sure have better cars than I do! Maybe living above their means, lol.

As for Samsung sharing source code (or Motorola), I wasn't thinking that. I was more so thinking that they would each get the code from Google. I will admit being unaware of exactly WHAT google provides to each company. I assumed they provided a kit of sorts to each manufacturer.

Yeah... I am REALLY looking forward to a debloated skin. I would like to not have to run a launcher that's less laggy than the stock UI. I like to try to run as few programs as possible.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Giblet535:
No, AFAIK, Google doesn't provide the low level stuff, other than the recommended generic kernel, plus minimal /bin and /lib bits to support their "very-java-esque-but-totally-open-source" VM. ;)

I'm pretty sure Samsung had the ICS source way back in aught-10 when Google announced it, and just before Apple started trying to squash Samsung's dev efforts. If I were Apple, I'd be worried too; 400,000 Android activations a day, lol.

It would be nice to see a launcher with a good chunk of it done in native code eg, all of the effect calculations. Tiny and mean, spinning around at a touch of the screen...

PS: Better than a part-native launcher, add Objective C coding support FTW.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] dligon:
so umm does anyone know the repercussions if i get a iphone 4s cross out the 4 and replace it with a 5 a sell them to apple fanboys as the iphone 5.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] sRDennyCrane:
Well, it's a little off-topic for this forum and thread, but...

Apple essentially moved the antenna, loaded the Siri app and drew an "S" next to the 4 and called it a new phone, so why not.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] MyEntityRemains:
Well, also went from single core to dual core processor... :)
[Motorola Droid RAZR] racingglock35:
Way off topic but still on point...Apple sucks.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] circleofomega:
Seeing the Galaxy NExUS ROM and I believe it's the best out there...pure ICS/Google experience...wonder if we will get it...SGSII has one...sigh...
[Motorola Droid RAZR] BakaPhoenix:
From the video poster by motorola some days ago it seems like a very clean version of ics aside the lock screen and camera
[Motorola Droid RAZR] hasbrobot:
Never off topic.....ha :D
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Bubblegutz:
The V551 huh i didnt think any body knew about those phones anymore. I used to work for a cell phone company doing repairs. And motorola was the weakest phones i seen. At first I thought it was the companies choice in phones. But the nokias were so durable. I swore i would also never own a motorola but took a chance with the droid x. It was a awesome phone but motorola dragged their tails with updates then too. The only real reason i have the MAXX is. The whole verizon killing the the unlimited data plan. I wanted the galaxy s 3 so bad but couldnt risk waiting. So i settled the MAXX is a good phone. But i know wonder what could have been with the s3. I guess forever alone. Atleast another leak came out with the. 208

That is so funny because it is so true.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] circleofomega:
Do u mind sharing the link??

Big thanx!

Hi...

WHAT is this??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXNI5ttoznk

Can I do this on my GSM version?? I have root, will I lose it?
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Bubblegutz:
Official Motorola Android 4.0 demo videos show off new UI and Webtop 3.0 - http://pulse.me/s/9GmKs

Dont know if its the same video but this is the one i watched.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] soudy1994:
http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1676361

15 videos for motorola ics
[Motorola Droid RAZR] circleofomega:
People..chek the YouTube video link I posted...IT HAS THE GNEXUS ROM!! WHy would I want a Blur+ICS when I can get only ICS!!!

I think am gonna flash it NOW!!! LIKE NOW!! WOOT WOOOT!
[Motorola Droid RAZR] lukas77:
Maybe because some people want to use camcorder sometimes?
[Motorola Droid RAZR] circleofomega:
hehe..yea..but I love the stock ICS and hate the Galaxy NExus..

But RaZr+ Stock ICS...OHHHHH!!!! :) :D :)
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Giblet535:
I traded the Nexus for a Razr because of the Nexus' radio problems.

I seriously considered taking it apart and modding the antenna because I wanted to keep it so badly. Silky smooth, beautiful HW and SW design...

It was a wonderful phone that can only make calls within line-of-sight of a cell tower, or over Skype.

The Razr, with the .79 leak, beats it

easily

. The Razr is sleeker AND HAS AN EXTERNAL uSDCARD SLOT. Mine is loaded with a 64GB SanDisk card for about 75GB internal storage. (Suck on that, 64G iPad2, iPhone4, iPhone5).
[Motorola Droid RAZR] hotleadsingerguy:
All of this ^^^

I had the same issue. The Galaxy Nexus is the finest phone on the market, if not for the signal quality issues. Voice and text work great (I've never dropped a call or lost texts), but the data connection was horrible. Here at work it never had a data signal...while with the Razr Maxx I'm at 2+ bars of 4G or it drops to 100% 3G signal when I walk to another part of the building. Completely different.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] circleofomega:
Thats why I love the Stock ICS...but it is obvious I will inherit the call issues..OR WAIT..was it cause of the hopeless Sammy hardware...I am open for trying it on this lovely MOTO device....

If all goes well..will keep till we have JB... :)
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Giblet535:
It was the Samsung hardware. I tried flashing all available radio code before swapping for a Razr.

ICS on a Razr kicks keesters.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] circleofomega:
I knew it. Now waiting anxiously for a GalaXy NeXus port ROM for our RaZr...
[Motorola Droid RAZR] eyriiii:
If the ICS won't be out in the end of this month I will flash the ICS leak
[Motorola Droid RAZR] bwheelies:
I read last night that ICS will be out in late June for the RAZR. I am too lazy to pull up the article. It was posted early yesterday though.

I personally don't mind waiting. After being on this Droid Charge for almost a year with little development, the stock rom always was the most stable and refined experience.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Bubblegutz:
Well atleast the zoom is getting ics june 4th
[Motorola Droid RAZR] tk76:
So if I want to flash ICS in a form where I can roll back to GB for the OTA... then it has to be one of the old leaks (.75?) Does Matt's utilty do this simply? Also, does that old leak unlock the phone for international GSM use the same way the newer leaks do? I really need my phone to work with a UK sim in about 2 weeks, and am about to give up on the OTA.

My main hesitation is that I am completely new to flashing on Android and really don't have days to give to this if I mess up.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] tribalb:
? Xoom has had ics for months now. Least the wifi does.
[Motorola Droid RAZR] IP IHI II IL:
I feel pretty confident in suggesting that we'll get it before the end of the month... If the Xoom gets it on Monday, I don't think we'll be too far behind...

\\Carved into this thread with my RAZR//

http://android-gz.com
[Motorola Droid RAZR] cheekrox:
The end of June would signify the end of Q2 2012, so it would have to be before that any way. :p
[Motorola Droid RAZR] Eddy T:
At 23:59 on the 31st!:mad:
[Motorola Droid RAZR] agoNITE:
Dunno about England. But here in Holland, June only has 30 days :p
[Motorola Droid RAZR] pedrotorresfilho:
That's really interesting.. lol

Enviado de meu XT910 usando o Tapatalk 2
[Motorola Droid RAZR] lilmoney30:
I just came from one of those fruit devices. The Razr Maxx is a beast and eats fruit daily! I can't wait for Ics on this! !
[Motorola Droid RAZR] dligon:
switching up

Ok who would switch to the galaxy S3 if and when it comes to verizion. http://phandroid.com/2012/06/02/fcc...msung-galaxy-s3-variants-complete-the-circle/
[Motorola Droid RAZR] MyEntityRemains:
If Moto doesn't unlock the bootloaders and Samsung fixes the radio reception issues, I'll get one in a heartbeat!