yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[HTC One X] andreasy:
You want to laugh more?

At my recent contact with HTC, asking something about S-OFF, their reply back to me was that after I have unlocked my bootloader I should see S-OFF and not S-ON. "If you have followed all steps successfully and after reboot you see S-ON in boot loader, it means that you have done something wrong. Please follow the procedure again until you see S-OFF."

I'll look for that email when I get back to my computer and post it here if I haven't deleted it.
[HTC One X] nooomoto:
Signed
[HTC One X] Emmure:
That message just made my day. So actually that guy is so well informed, he just said WE ALL did it wrong...ROFL

Sent from my rooted HTC Quadcore Beast
[HTC One X] delorentz:
Let us be realistic in our expectations at least

Fellow technology enthuisiasts. Would I like S-OFF, definitely. Do I expect to retain my warranty? No. It is only common sense that if a product is provided to you in a specific way, any changes beyond that introduced should be for your expense and at your risk if it goes wrong. Also, legally what are the implications I ask. Let us assume a house is built to meet very specific safety etc. regulations. If YOU choose to modify it in any way and it collapses and someones is injured, who is responsible/accountable. Let us apply some common sense and at least put a reasonable request forward, not if you give me S-OFF I will like you more. Thank goodness this forumn represents a VERY small minorty of HTC users and certainly not any that built their own huge international company with numerous products. So, anybody in the process of designing and producing the HTC One X beating devices without ANY design flaws which meets absolutely everybody expectations ??? I did not think so. Also thank you to the enthuisiasts whose tinkering makes this forumn fun and makes me see beyond the senseless wining of others.
[HTC One X] abc27:
No. The request currently being made is perfect. If you want HTC to walk over you, you can request it yourself.
[HTC One X] jchoong:
Isn't it correct that when one unlocks the bootloader thru HTCDev, the warranty is essentially void? If that is the case, why not give us S-OFF as well?
[HTC One X] Electronic Punk:
Has anyone even asked HTC why it is locked to begin with:

"There has been overwhelmingly customer feedback that people want access to open bootloaders on HTC phones. I want you to know that we've listened. Today, I'm confirming we will no longer be locking the bootloaders on our devices. Thanks for your passion, support and patience," Peter Chou, CEO of HTC

http://www.facebook.com/HTC/posts/10150307320018084

It does not say we will unlock the boot/system partitions, it says bootloaders, this has not been the case at all.
[HTC One X] chrisjcks:
I've done my bit....

The woman I spoke with seemed very agreeable to my comments & seemed determine to help us, it's worth a try - & I hope she sticks to her word about contacting the correct people regarding this.
[HTC One X] chrisjcks:
Deleted.
[HTC One X] andreasy:
Found it. Here is the exact reply from HTC:

Thankyou for contacting HTC.

With regards to your enquiry, kindly note that if your phone is still showingS-ON, it means that one or more step in the whole unlocking process haven'tbeen done properly, and you did not unlock your phone. In the case of thesuccessful unlocking it would show S-OFF. Please repeat the whole processagain, until it shows you S-OFF.

Thank You.

If you have any other inquiries, don’t hesitate to contact us again.

For further details, please go to http://www.htc.com/europe/support.aspx

Thank you for using HTC products.

Respect & Regards,

HTC Technical Support Team

http://www.htc.com
[HTC One X] RichmondoUK:
Well well well if that's true they fu@#*@*ed themselves up there!

Safeguard that email severely
[HTC One X] delorentz:
Good luck in your quest

Hardly, since as a consumer I have a clear choice and these days there are so many. The phone however does what it is intended to do (fit for purpose) for its intended users, but may well benefit from some improvements, which is hardly unexpected given the complexity and multiple technologies, hardware and software combined. I sincerely wish you success in your quest, but I for one won't manufacture a product for someone else to try and re-engineer at my expense and even possibly reputational damage or potentially affect the license agreements that protect the multiple intellectual properties that accompany it and may have been specifically granted to me under certain terms and conditions. Good luck with your quest and I mean it since I enjoy the creative energy exhibited in these forums.
[HTC One X] abc27:
"Re-engineer at (my) their expense"

What on Earth are you talking about? I just want access to my hardware. There's nothing unreasonable about that.

Kindly explain how granting users full access to the hardware they paid for will lead to "reputational damage". By your logic, Samsung's reputation must be terrible.

Absolute and utter nonsense. If Samsung can release a phone with a fully unlocked bootloader without imploding, so can HTC.
[HTC One X] nikzDHD:
Highly doubt it, I can just imagine her on her end thinking WTF is this guy going on about lol. Probably not understanding anything!
[HTC One X] delorentz:
Maybe time to familiarise yourself with intellectual property rights laws etc. ... the possibility also exists that you are merely granted hardware useage rights and not a modification license as owner. :eek: Given your limited expertise of the product and all its components, you may cause a phone battery meltdown with your tinkering or an unsuspecting individual may use your modification (at own risk of course) and be injured as a result and then who will reputationally look bad or possibly even be blamed? HTC or some tinkerer who has never come close to building the equivalent product from the ground up into a global company with MANY laws etc to consider. No further comment from me on the subject as clearly some people just have no insight into the actual complexities of bringing a single product to market. Still, I truly wish you success.
[HTC One X] chrisjcks:
LOL that thought did enter my mind too, but you never know - no harm in trying. :)
[HTC One X] abc27:
Maybe it's time for you to familiarise yourself with simple concepts such as "ownership" e.t.c.

If I buy a car, it's not up for the manufacturer to tell me how to use it. If I modify my car and it explodes, i'll be the one who gets blamed, not the manufacturer.

What on earth is this nonsense?

Not all people lack expertise or competency.

I dunno... the person responsible maybe? :confused: Or is that just crazy?

And some people clearly have too high an esteem of their own knowledge (Hint: You're not the only person clued in to the procedures surrounding a product launch). As for laws, that is absolute and utter rubbish. Direct competitors such as Samsung provide fully unlocked bootloaders and outside of patent disputes they haven't run in to many issues.

Look, to be blunt, if you want to be pessimistic and pretend you have "insight" and inside knowledge than do so on another thread. This thread is for people trying to make a simple feature request to HTC.
[HTC One X] otakonx:
I usually don't feed these types of comments but... Wow, you went full retard :D (j/k but had to be said)... Look, we just want S-Off like every other android I've ever owned has had. It really is that simple. If you and your whopping 7 posts disagree, that's perfectly fine. Just don't expect much love coming from the users who actually want to utilize the full potential of the device they've just spent a large chunk of money on.

That being said, I see no reason why we can't get s-off if HTC is already voiding the warranty on HTCdev. Personally, I think it's just so they can turn away anyone trying to do a valid warranty repair. For example, a screen defect, like the first HTC One X I bought had, is not an effect of using HTCdev to unlock my bootloader. But that doesn't matter to HTC since they'll still deny you warranty repair. It's just another way HTC is covering their ass but pretending to be pro-android developer. Bad HTC...
[HTC One X] SB13X:
XDA Quote of the Day!!!
[HTC One X] BenPope:
I'm probably being a bit thick, but I can't really work this out... Why do you want S-Off so bad? So that you can flash ROMs without a PC to hand? Or so that you can pretend you didn't flash ROMs for warranty sake? Anything other uses? Windows Phone ROMs? Ubuntu? The principle? Just something to moan about? (I'm not *just* trolling, I genuinely don't see the big deal, want to know what I'm missing)
[HTC One X] otakonx:
Don't take this the wrong way but if it needs to be explained than it's obviously not a big deal to you which is OK but its not OK to some, like myself.

Basically, I want permanent root plain and simple. I want to be able to edit system files, edit the splash screen, increase efficiency of mounts other than sdcard. These things need S-OFF.

I have an HTC Inspire 4G and customize the crap out of it which is what I want to be able to do to this device as well. Plain and simple.

I guess I could ask you the flip side: why wouldn't you want S-OFF?
[HTC One X] H-Cim:
I'm pretty sure there are serious reasons why they don't offer S-OFF (Perhaps certain partners would stop selling their products ? Carriers might not be happy to hear that?)

Pretty sure they don't do it to annoy us :P
[HTC One X] abc27:
Samsung offer the equivalent of S-OFF with no such issues.

HTC's OTT security measures are purely driven by them.
[HTC One X] BenPope:
None of those things can be done with htcdev unlock?
[HTC One X] otakonx:
The htcdev is not permanent root it just unlocks the bootloader. Big difference.

You also can't flash new Kernels or Radios without S-OFF. I'm not sure you can have a custom recovery without S-OFF either. ChriKn, pointed out these are false. I stand corrected.

I want the full potential of my phone unlocked like every other android I've owned. For me, it's as simple as that.
[HTC One X] ChriKn:
Ehhhhmmm did you look at the Dev section for just half a second ?

You CAN flash a Kernel, you CAN have a custom recovery (how would it be possible to have custom roms/kernels etc ?)
[HTC One X] otakonx:
EEEHHHHmmm No need to be an ass about this stuff. These forums are for learning.

I didn't think you could flash Kernels without S-off? I stand corrected. I also said I was "not sure" about the recovery.

Still doesn't change the fact that I want S-OFF since I've had it on all of my devices prior to this one.
[HTC One X] anoniemouse:
Here's hoping that HTC take notice of this & not spout some Bull, like they did/do about the UK & the OTA updates to unbranded handsets.
[HTC One X] abc27:
We need *a lot* more signatures. So far we've only gotten people with the One X to sign. We need a huge array of HTC owners. At least a few thousand. So far we have 139 which isn't anywhere near enough.

I urge you all to spread the petition as far as possible.
[HTC One X] Appsdroid:
Just giving this a bump mate as were back on page three now, ive spoke with a HTC Customer Relations Manager today and hes made some good points and is sending a report to the relation team. My main point made to them is this device is now being sold not fit for purpose. I explained my older phones had a number of apps which required root and s-off access to run them, nothing major here. The next thing i explained was to run these apps now ill need to void my warranty using htc dev. This is unacceptable why should i void my warranty when you provided a phone not fit for purpose. If it cant run all the relevant android apps direct from the playstore then they are selling this as not fit for purpose.
[HTC One X] abc27:
That's a very good point actually.
[HTC One X] jchoong:
Galaxy S3 is launched in my country today - and still no S-OFF from HTC. So, its bye-bye to One X - I put it in eBay and sold it at quite a loss. Such a pity as the One X is a very nice smartphone. I won't buy another HTC phone if it has S-ON.
[HTC One X] Emmure:
Thats exactly what I said yesterday. ;p

Sent from my rooted Galaxy SIII
[HTC One X] BenPope:
Who are you trying to convince?
[HTC One X] abc27:
Himself.
[HTC One X] cranio84:
Todey i try s3 in a Vodafone one center and now I'm happy 2 time becouse I've buy the one x,don't see you all potential of one x? Ok buy s3 and go to the s3 section,sorry for my bad english friends

Inviato dal mio HTC One X
[HTC One X] Emmure:
Buying the SIII doesnt nescessaryly mean selling the One X. Still hoping to see a resolution to the bootloader issue...

Sent from my rooted Galaxy SIII
[HTC One X] nicu96:
I really appreciate your enthusiasm and work but HTC gave us everything they can give with htcdev unlock. The problem is NOT that they don't hear us or we aren't enough like many of you said, it's because of the carriers! HTC has contracts with them and if we could modify things like CID, radio and SIM-lock (what we can do with S-OFF), you can sim-unlock and debrand your phone what the carriers want to prevent.

I respect HTC for giving us htcdev unlock to flash custom roms, i hope they will fix the bug (I believe it's a bug) that you can't flash the kernel (boot.img) via recovery... that's really sad :(
[HTC One X] sabret00the:
How many signatures thus far?
[HTC One X] f4flake:
Sorry but your argument is somewhat flawed.

You can sim unlock nearly any phone for a relatively small fee. Bu rooting and flashing a custom Rom you remove the software that is at the heart of cell phone monetisation. Bundled apps and suchlike.

The laptop I just bought contained all kinds of bundled ****e before I wiped the windows partition and installed Linux. I didn't have to mess with the Bios to do it.

Smart phones are pre-paradigmatic. If we'd let the same **** slide with PC's much innovation would have died at birth.

HTC have given us all they can?

No, they've not even given us what we paid for.

Our own damn hardware to do with as we please.
[HTC One X] phobos512:
I bought an unlocked unbranded phone for a large pile of money. Tell me why I should give a damn about any contact HTC might have with any carrier?
[HTC One X] massalami:
That was a beautiful speech! Exquisite finish! Bravo!

But yeah, agreed
[HTC One X] chris_cheechy:
You Sir have voiced the thoughts of what I think 99% of HOX owners using this forum... WE own the hardware so let us do what we want with it, if we somehow kill our phone's then tough s**t, we know what risks we're taking... (Well most of us do) :rolleyes:

Just my two cents...

Sent From My maXimus raped HTC One X!
[HTC One X] :
You sir are a legend
[HTC One X] atrako1973:
Htc doesnt listen ,thats why it will never work ,plus as i ve heard a few times ,from htc elevates people here ,are saying that our community represent not even 1% of htc clients so keep on dreaming id say
[HTC One X] baum01:
I'm curious how you will make a case for your claim. Please outline for me how "99%" of the HTC owners on here (I'm sure you're not talking about all HTC owners) make a significant difference to HTC's sales. Please on't forget that most of these 99% will stay with HTC, with or without s-off.

In reality, whether the smile of the girl/guy holding a One X in some ad campaign is just "nice" or "great" affects sales significantly more than whether their phones can be s-offed.

The best counter argument you could use is that some of the users on here have reach beyond their own small circles of friends. However, please keep in mind, we're talking about s-off here, not about rooting. We can root, we can use custom roms, we can do almost anything. What keeps some of us from doing so is fear for warranty issues. If HTC stops releasing phones which are not ready to be sold (i.e. the one x for the first weeks), this will be even less of an issue.

PS: I'm not against this partition. As my signature implies, I'm also waiting for s-off. I just accept/respect HTC's stance on it. They wouldn't have had to make it that hard to find an exploit, though ;)
[HTC One X] wkd2639:
I disagree with the theory that the number of people who want S-OFF represent such a small % of HTC customers that there is no reason to provide such a facility - if that theory were true - why would they bother implementing a bootloader unlocking solution?

Clearly a large number of customers want to load custom ROMS onto their phones - otherwise such an official unlocking tool would have no reason to exist.

My problem is that - I am currently on Three, I'm still stuck 2 or 3 updates behind the unbranded users. My current software includes a radio that is known to be bad. I can unlock the phone and flash something like CM9/10 onto it without much issue - but that doesn't fix the problem with the bad radio firmware which can only be update by Three OTA or via a RUU.

If the phone were however S-OFF'ed I could flash the latest international radio firmware to the phone (the one that Three have rejected because it failed the radio tests - even though every other carrier in the world rolled it out) and I would at least then get a network service.
[HTC One X] Arsaw:
Yes 99% HTC users on XDA care about it. A lot doesn't bother to post here though :)

Based on observation : any device that cannot be s-off or unlock by XDA community, the device will never do well in sales as well. Please proof me wrong.

Make sense? ;)
[HTC One X] Stuar:
Dont quote me on this but im pretty sure that i read somewhere that the roms now contain the radio?

So when you flash a rom you are also flashing a radio...?

Im not 100% sure on that but i know what you are saying that with S-Off you can flash a radio which is what i used to do with my htc Desire but im sure someone out there will correct me as i am not sure about the One X

Back to on topic but that you for this idea and i honestly think it is a great idea, but i would still recommend HTC to my friends even if they were not to flash custom roms but i highly advice them too do so but none of them listen
[HTC One X] uqadwe:
Yes, on the Tegra version the rom contains the radio.

On Qualcomm arhitecture things are different.
[HTC One X] dexteral:
Done ..
[HTC One X] cowboykiller1313:
I am in the same boat. My Inspire has been my daily driver for 2 years flashed with prob every Rom made for it.. Finally after 2 years with the same Inspire I wanted a dual core

I recently purchased 2 HTC ONE X. One for mods one for normal use. No S-off is a deal breaker..... Have 15 days left before return window is closed..... Fingers crossed for S-off
[HTC One X] Babydollll:
My phone is not carrier branded. I paid full price for my HOX. HTC has no reason to withhold s-off for unbranded handsets if I believe your argument.

Snowflake approved this message.
[HTC One X] Flozzo:
Imo the whole carrier restrictions to S-OFF argument is bs. Samsung provides all phones what HTC owners call 'S-OFF' out of the box. Furthermore, if users can already flash radios and remove bloatware by rooting/unlocking via HTCDev, what have the carriers got to lose?

HTC themselves indicate they are really protective about their phones' 'user security', another argument/POV I find hard to believe, as users who don't make use of the fact the phone comes S-OFF out of the box won't even notice a difference, as long as their CID is the default CID so they receive OTAs normally. People who use the fact it's S-OFF know (or don't know) what they're doing and are responsible for whatever happens to the phone themselves. I'm sure if Samsung copes with this policy HTC could too.

These points leave me to no conclusion of why HTC does put all this security on our phones. Then again, let's be honest here. How many sales is HTC going to miss out on (in total) with their security policy? A few thousand? S-OFFing all phones by default won't significantly increase their profits or suddenly make all Samsung owners regret their decision. That's a whole different argument.
[HTC One X] 24inchsub:
Signed it hope they actually add s-off to HTC Dev.
[HTC One X] Arsaw:
HTC purposely leave the phones S-On to discourage hacking community.
[HTC One X] Flozzo:
That's not a valid reason. Preventing hacking/modding would probably cost them more than it prevents in repairs, as people seek unofficial methods with a higher chance of bricking their phone or don't buy the phone at all, whereas out of box S-OFF would mean more customers (not significant but makes up for the people who brick their phones and blame HTC) and same amount of bricks probably. Please give me one good reason discouraging modders is a benefit to HTC.
[HTC One X] Arsaw:
HTC can just stop all this nonsense by giving unlock bootloader or S-Off out of the box. But why HTC not doing that? Simply because HTC believe they are providing the best user experience and does not want people to tamper their devices. Does HTC cares about lost sales due to S-On policy? Obviously not.

Due to demand/pressure from hacking communities, HTC came out with htcdev.com solution to unlock Bootloader but still remain S-On. Why?

Hell, you can flash anything you want with unlocked bootloader. Why bother to keep it S-On?

By keeping it S-On, all hacking processes required more steps and higher chances to brick the device. Developers will have hard time developing custom roms, kernels or any other mods. Users will have to follow more steps to flash anything to their device. All these will create poorer user experience when trying to hacks/tweak the device and hence discourage hacking community.
[HTC One X] Flozzo:
You just repeated my point and still gave no reason why HTC would do this. I know they don't care about the losses due to S-ON, but they wouldn't lose/gain a significant amount by having phones S-OFF/S-ON out of the box. A bad modding user experience is a negative. It doesn't discourage users as much as it frustrates them. It makes them question their loyalty to HTC and if they made the right choice. This doesn't mean they won't root, they'll just root their phones and, in a many cases, decide their next phone won't be a HTC. It doesn't make sense to me, but I'm sure they have a reason. As I stated in my post before, users not tampering with devices doesn't get them anywhere, or so it seems to me. Anyway, this is going too far OT I think.
[HTC One X] Arsaw:
I don't know about you. Is very clear to me that all these nonsense happened because of HTC policy against hacking community.

A bad modding doesn't discourage users as much as it frustrates them? Then wtf this thread doing here?
[HTC One X] Flozzo:
... One again, I understand they're against hacking, I'm asking why they are anti hacking, something you still haven't answered. This thread is here because of

frustrated

users who want S-OFF, not people who are scared to root because of warranty policies. If they were scared, they would also start questioning their loyalty. I've said this before...
[HTC One X] Arsaw:
Apparently HTC believe they are better off without hackers. They are producing great hardwares as well as "great" softwares and in the end, CyanogenMod hackers getting all the credits!

If you are HTC's software engineer, what do you think you will do? Praise CM for their hard work? :rolleyes:
[HTC One X] Rusty!:
There is a really obvious reason they don't provide S-OFF that isn't being mentioned; S-OFF is completely reversible and undetectable.

By providing the 'official' unlock they know when you've been dicking around and you can't hide it.
[HTC One X] supendal:
They can still know it with official s-off. Even if you reverse to s-on and leave no trace, they still know you did it because you gave them your information. So, what I don't understand is why they don't give s-off instead of unlock in the first place.
[HTC One X] Rusty!:
That's the thing, they don't know it. They might have a record you applied for S-OFF but they have no way to prove you actually did it.
[HTC One X] supendal:
That's against natural course o life. Why would a person apply for something if he/she is not going to do it. Besides, they can add something like "by applying to this process is understand and accept my warranty may be void" to the agreement.