yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
do you mean getting your mail program to display on the icon information about whats going on? wouldnt think there is much space to get any real info but if you pin your mail program (for the purpose of all my posts ill say that all desktop programs are programs and metro programs are apps) to your task bar then if the program has been designed correctly then it will display some limited info, outlook works great for me, and tells me how many emails i have sitting there.
[Windows 8 General] AmericanDane:
The UI is very different from the Mac and doesn't even work the same. Not sure where you got that - other than all touch interfaces use Icons....

Compatibility is outstanding. I was shocked at how many of my normal use applications ran perfect. For a Beta of a major OS change, the compatibility is excellent.

It's Win 7 AND more new features.

Win 8 will win you over (unless your an Apple fan) once you see how people utilize the OS enhancements.

---------- Post added at 03:09 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:02 AM ----------

I'm not sure what you are talking about. You use the term "app" which to me is one of the little micro applications we use on tablets. Or, are you talking about applications like Streets and Trips, Excel, etc... If you're talking about Metro specifically, then maybe I see what you mean, but I've had multiple ones displayed and running on my laptop although in Metro the sizing is set to 1/3. I did some work with multiple windows between IRFan and Excel and used the old desktop to customize the sizing of the windows. So, again, not sure why you say you can't do it.???
[Windows 8 General] N8ter:
Those same under the hood enhancements could have been made to Windows 7 while keeping and enhancing the Windows 7 UI and called Windows 8 on release (or even a Service pack FFS, look how big XP SP2 was).

It has nothing to do with Apple. It has nothing to do with under the hood improvements that could have been made to 7, anyways (like going from Vista to 7, hello...). It has to do with the jarring and otherwise terrible user experience this release has on non-touch PCs and also for multile monitor users (who are becoming more prevelant with budget graphics cards allowing this and LCD monitors being so cheap nowadays).

I've ran the beta on its own PC. It's terrible for desktop use and will deserve the reviews I'm almost sure it will get when it releases to non-touch users later this year.

Compatibility is always excellent because the Win32 API is forward compatible. There's nothing great, exciting, or unforseen about that. Solaris is UNIX and it has the same backward and forward API compatibility very similar to Windows.

They destroyed Multi-Tasking and generally destroyed the way people use their computers for the sold purpose of pushing their own dumb-down UI metaphor down people's throats. Metro wastes a ton of screen real estate. Look bow big the banners are in many of those apps, and how much odd whitespace is in some of them (Email app, Pictures app, etc.).

Then they throw a highly curated/bastardized version of the explorer shell in as an app and tell us "see, the desktop is still there" even though only Metro apps will be sold directly (and updated directly) via the Windows Store and they're basically deprecating Win32/MFC development, among other things.

I have a hard time calling this a multi-tasking OS, especially if you sit in Metro most of the time.

Sorry, but I'm not sure what YOU'RE talking about.
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
oh, your here as well, thanks for the constructive feedback, I trust you are using the feedback options within Win 8 to provide MS with your deep insights in to the workings of their BETA product that you asked to test for them

Oh, and Desktop isn't an app, its the desktop, its no different than before and ive not found anything that doesn't work yet strangely enough as i said on the other thread, multi tasking works fine

But anyhow, im not going to bother replying to it all as you seem to have completely made your mind up without really understanding what its all about
[Windows 8 General] N8ter:
I stopped giving feedback when they stopped listening to and implementing the most trivial QoL changes in their products.

The Desktop doesn't even have a functioning start menu comparable to Windows Vista or 7 yet you somehow feel compelled to believe it's functionally identical.

Fine is in the eye of the beholder. Being thrown from Desktop to full screen metro apps and only being able to multi-task Metro apps by pinning one to 1/4the screen is a terrible compromise bordering on laughable.

Oh, and have you tried using Windows 8 on a non-touch laptop with only a Trackpad? Laughable...
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
Then why bother downloading it, its for testing purposes only

:rolleyes:

you have this so unbelievably wrong
[Windows 8 General] fed44:
I somehow doubt you have used windows 8 for 2 weeks... and I wonder how many other "haters" lied about how long they have used it. It's also surprising how many ditch it even though they have no clue...

EDIT: Here is over an hour of footage introducing Windows 8, please go through it... http://www.lynda.com/Windows-tutorials/Windows-Consumer-Preview-First-Look/100467-2.html
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
agreed, I actually wish MS would have some sort of competency test to vet which people are aloud to download beta tests, it would save themselves a lot of negative FUD from folk who don't have a clue and have no interest in helping other than to help spread FUD.
[Windows 8 General] ShadowEO:
Actually, this sounds like rehash of FUD that I've seen from everywhere else. I use Windows 8 on a daily basis with a non-touch 10" netbook running at 1024x768 so I can use metro apps and I have found the experience pleasurable at the very least, navigation is not bad at all.

But to each their own, you obviously have not used metro enough lol.
[Windows 8 General] Redsand26:
I've been using Windows 8 for over a month now on a touchscreen hp tm2 tablet PC. Installed over Windows 7 and don't plan to go back. The touchscreen in all progams works much better than in Windows 7.

I use the PC for browsing the internet, as a media center for the big screen and using Microsoft Office/One Note for school.

As far as the Metro UI goes, I find myself skipping past it and going straight to the desktop as soon as I boot up. The desktop is where all of my important files are located, of which I frequently add to and find that it is too much of a pain to keep updating the Metro UI in an organized fashion. Every once in awhile I'll revert back to Metro to check the weather and email as those apps are awesome, but that is all I use it for.

Maybe if there were as many apps available for Metro as there are on the Android and Apple markets I could make more use of it. Hopefully the Microsoft Store will grow just as big. If not, they can scrap the Metro UI for all I care.
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
that's the point of metro on a desktop, at least in my mind, its a tool, once we have more apps, and you setup the apps there are, you can push a button, see it all, then push a button and be back to desktop and your work.

there may well be apps that will be great, which would only take a push of the mouse and a click to open it up from either desktop or metro.

its just about getting used to it, im still learning, so it really bugs me when folk only use it for min and say its crap
[Windows 8 General] snickler:
I support Metro on the Windows Phone.. I honestly don't know about it being on a Desktop though.. Tablet? Yeah.
[Windows 8 General] Rakeesh_j:
My complaints about metro are thus:

- The tiles are a neat idea, but the square corners and mono color aren't aesthetically pleasing

- I'd really like to be able to have the option of the old start menu

- Microsoft did a terrible job at allowing the desktop and metro to mesh together and even possibly complement one another. As it is now, they both seem to "hate" each other aesthetically, yet you still can't do many things without one or the other.
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
such as?
[Windows 8 General] Alexander-HTC:
...turning computer off (even a simple task)

In Desktop mode you get (if you can figure out how) Metro panel on the right to do it.
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
Win-I brings out the panel in desktop or metro power, then select option

that's not hard and certainly no harder than before, if you want to use the mouse then take it to the bottom right and move it up the screen.

that works in metro and desktop, you don't need to go to one or the other for it to work so again, my original question was, such as?

win-c is another useful one (charm bar)

win-l (log off)

win-d (desktop)

win-r (run)

win-q (search) search can work just by typing too without clicking at all
[Windows 8 General] fed44:
not 100% correct:

win-l = lock

win-q = app search

win-f = files search

win-w = settings search

also good to know is:

win-I = settings
[Windows 8 General] Rakeesh_j:
Well for example, try running a metro app on the desktop, or try running a classic app on metro.

The fact is you NEED both, but they don't mesh well together. That is not a good design IMO.
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
:rolleyes:
[Windows 8 General] Adoxo:
I like the fast boot, and win button + x. But metro start page seems useless.
[Windows 8 General] lexian_za:
It seems like this post is been run by win 8 lovers, which don't like it to have their product critised.

I have tested win 8 for just over a week and found myself 95% of the time still on the desktop, so decided to return to win 7. This is going to be a great product for touch screens and tablets, but realistically my laptop is not going to see it. It is too limiting for a non touch device. The desktop environment worked well even though it felt messy, but you controlled what should be where. Here, you loose that control.

I am sorry if you think I don't agree with you guys, but my biggest fear is once you can only get windows 8 all my non computer literate customers are going to struggle to figure it out. I really dread that day.
[Windows 8 General] snickler:
This entire comment is what many others feel. I can say a lot of customers won't even WANT to go to Windows 8 because Windows 7 just WORKS. Adding big blocks to the screen and giving the option to switch back to the classic desktop (most customers I know will want to stay in classic desktop mode) will just have them wanting to go back to Windows 7. I have a rule of waiting a year or so before fully adopting a new Windows OS. I usually beta test the OS, but I haven't even wanted to test Windows 8...
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
Its not that we run it, its that firstly we are the majority, secondly we are becoming more vocal given the rise of FUD against MS and W8. If you dont like it fine, but use it, not for a day or two but give it a couple of weeks, be open to it, test it, if you don't like it and have good reason then that's your opinion, however if you come on forums flapping about it without spending any or a minimal amount of time on it refusing to learn or even consider a more mature stance then don't bother posting and also don't expect people who have put alot of time in to this to give you a free windows 8 slagging ticket, if theres one thing that's more destructive than anything else, that's "FUD"

which is why I said, no FUD aloud :)
[Windows 8 General] jerome snail:
Poll speaks for itself.
[Windows 8 General] Rakeesh_j:
I don't deal in FUD.

I rather like microsoft, actually. I was at a competition last weekend that was full of engineers and other tech enthusiasts (I myself was competing in a cisco expert battle - and won btw) where I actually met a guy from microsoft who was a VIP representing them. When I first spoke to him, he said we probably wouldn't like him for being from MS (because most of us don't work with Windows,) but I said that's not true at all. I told him I am rather OS agnostic, and even talked about many benefits of windows 7 that other OS's lack (I am also a linux enthusiast.)

That said, I have no bias against microsoft.

However I do not like metro on a desktop pc in its current form. I think it can work, however they need to allow it to mesh well with the desktop. Right now there is just too much of a disconnect between the two.

Disclaimer: I am a heavy android user, and do believe it is the current and future dominant mobile operating system. However I don't have any inherent desire to see WP fail.
[Windows 8 General] lexian_za:
I hear what you are saying and am not against Ms at all. It does create good OS's but they also create failures. Look at vista vs w7. It is no contest and working in the it support field, I see what people struggle with. What my biggest concern was, that there are people that still prefer xp to w7 because they are scared of change. How am I going to explain to those people to go to w8? I really wanted w8 to succeed and I found it feels wrong on a desktop. If Ms just kept the option to change to the the classic start for those who hate metro, I feel that would solve the problem. I know I am going to get a lot of people that uses the basics of computers to take metro off....
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
absolutely, and those points are completely valid, although I don't agree that what is vista now is much worse than 7 is, all be it after a couple of Service packs.

What we need to keep in mind is that despite what some think, this is no where near completion, there is a learning curve for people used to the "old" ways so I would expect some changes, and I would expect some form of learning tool similar to what Windows 95 had. We cant rule out the start button returning either, although I no longer miss it.

For new users though I do think the situation is somewhat different, metro seems basic and that is its point, it is also easy to use, al be it in a basic function, which to be fair is what most people who are not tech savy want.

Take outlook, or outlook express or live Mail as it is now. I can promise you that most users don't use even a third of what they are capable of doing.

MS will have all these stats and would have seen similar trends, by an large, the large chuck of the general public will use the mail client to download their email, look at it, then delete it. which is exactly what metro apps would be good for.

They funny thing is, I use it too, if I have something more substantial that needs done then I fire up outlook but on the whole, its not used that much any more.

And this is where I really like the metro idea, because it is very efficient, IF you can and are able to set it up right ( I do take on board the learning curve though)

as for convincing folk to move to it, well, for jo blogs the problem would be a lot less if they actually used it rather than read FUD on the web written by people who have either "heard x y z" didn't bother using it at all, or didn't give it a chance. This alone is going to be the biggest battle MS has to face, it happened with WP as well, and they lost that one. I think they completely underestimated the power of the web where perception is everything and facts mean nothing.

In the work place its going to be more of a financial difficulty, I have plans already in place for migration and I really like where it "could" go, Company app hubs, messaging, email (exchange), Win 2 go, the app hub alone would be very handy, the problem comes down to finances, app development, system upgrades etc, but the work force will learn and from an admin point of view it will save money, after the initial outlay of course :)
[Windows 8 General] ShadowEO:
I haven't missed the start button at all, in fact the hot corner replacement works fine for me and hasn't even interrupted gameplay like Developer Preview did. I also agree with everything in the quote.

Also, I must agree, there is quite a bit of a learning curve. I just gave my nephew it and he loves the fact that all the information is there and that you no longer have to goto Start -> All Programs -> Expand the group you want -> Click the program. Especially after I showed him the All Apps button :D

Well Dazza, It seems like the poll served it's purpose in my opinion. When I read posts of "half the peoples here hate win8" and saw the poll for the first time, I figured you must've thought "Challenge Accepted" lol. So far 50% of those who bothered to vote like Windows 8 :D

Also, I love the fact that the Calendar application synchronizes with Google Calendar, I never need to open Chrome or use my Android phone to edit my calendar ever again :D (And can still see it all on the phone)

They did an excellent job on the web services integration. The Facebook and Google integration work very well. I would love to see a plug-in for Google Voice in Messaging though and the Xbox applications are amazing, Xbox Companion is great! xD
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
The results are even better than that :)

Off the bat without playing with them around

62% of people who voted overall like Win8

30% of people who voted didn't like win 8

the remaining were unsure

So twice the number of people like it than dont. not bad considering!

If we then add people who are unsure based on the like to dislike ratio of that time frame we see the following

overall

71% of people like it

33% of people don't like it

and Statistically the longer you use it the more chance there is you will like it.

Unfortunately these figures are slightly skewed as several of the people who didn't like it and said they used it for more than 2 weeks appear to have lied judging by their other posts.

Quite why anyone would want to make this look worse than it is, is beyond me

I just don't understand the mentality of some people, why go out of there way to discredit something they know little about, presumably these are the same people who just slag off anything Microsoft out of some twisted belief that MS are the devil and must be bad. whilst of course remaining completely blinkered about ethics of their own choice of software.

News flash folks, nothing and nobody is perfect, and the only person to lose out when your insisting on sticking to your brand/distro loyality is yourself, the best software is the software that gets the job done in the best way for your needs, and right now, it looks like Win 8 will fit my needs perfectly.

anyhow, rant over.

im expecting a jump in dislike votes after posting this as from what I can tell some folk would rather lie and discredit this rather than let the general consensus suggest that perhaps just maybe Win 8 isn't so bad after all.

ps.

Before anyone jumps up an down suggesting that MS fanboys will like this regardless let me just say this, maybe your right, but at the end of the day, who are they hurting? if they like it, so what, its an opinion so themselves is the answer, but people spreading FUD around without any real reason potentially hurts many others out there who believe your FUD, as I said, if you have a factual reason for not liking it then im cool with that, but baseless mindlessness FUD is not cool, its pretty ****ty to be honest and very immature.
[Windows 8 General] mdwbeex:
Metro: Hate it, with the fire of a thousand suns.

Been using this for a while on a non-development machine just to try and get the feel of it, and I can say beyond a shadow of a doubt, that I absolutely loathe the metro interface.

I don't know what changes are in store for the final version(s) but I would hope against hope that they make it easier than it is now to disable that atrocity than with a regedit. Granted, it's pretty easy to do, but the general public isn't all that keen on digging around in the registry for anything.

In regards to the poll - I have an unofficial poll result of my own to share with the class: Out of 10 people I know that tried Win8 out (11, myself included, so I'll leave myself out) 6 of them disabled the metro interface within the first week, 3 more a week later. Only one out of the group kept the metro interface, and he had mixed feelings on it. So 90% (intensely) dislike, and one undecided.

Beyond that interface though, everything else looks and runs great (for a beta). Looking forward to the final release and an optional metro screen, or a few seconds in the registry.
[Windows 8 General] dazza9075:
So you have a small poll that's questionable at best using the previous version the developers preview? As folk have already stated, there is a learning curve to this at the moment, you lot binning it before you give it a chance proves a couple of things.

Firstly your opinion is worthless

Secondly, your not helping the situation, either MS or the public

I honestly think MS should scrap the preview programs, its quite clear that its a waste of time with many people and is only giving them bad PR with minimal useful feedback from very negative vocal people. There should be a competency test or something before you can download it....

:rolleyes:
[Windows 8 General] mdwbeex:
The OS itself was outstanding, ran smoothly and did everything we expected from a beta release - the issue was with the metro UI.

by the way, the "unofficial" poll I spoke of was just that, unofficial and based on real-world usability. The UI was garbage as a desktop interface - great for phones, crap for desktops. Just one (or 10) guys opinion.

As an aside, I didn't realize I was on an Apple board here - last time I checked they were the only ones dismissing opinions as "worthless" if it didn't jibe with the company line (or Jobs edicts on the way things oughta be)
[Windows 8 General] snickler:
I agree with your statement.. Metro is fine for phone and quite possibly touch-screen tablets.. Desktop? NO. Don't want... Just my sole opinion... Even being in a pure Microsoft shop, those I've spoken to have said the same thing. I would like at least the option of using Aero or Metro as the default UI during setup or having a control panel entry.

On a technical note, I haven't tested any of the Windows 8 builds by myself. I've seen and played with it on a few computers that others were using.. What features of Windows 8 (outside of Metro UI) would be highly compelling for a typical Windows 7 user to feel the need to migrate to Windows 8? I would like to know so maybe I can think, "Hmm maybe I SHOULD test this out and convince others that they should potentially upgrade to this when it comes out".
[Windows 8 General] mdwbeex:
There's a lot to like...

Just a few nice perks:

1. Skydrive integration (finally)

2. Sign on / sync with Windows Live ID (think: roaming profiles)

3. IE10 with Ribbon bar (don't use IE, but 10 is pretty fast from what I'm told)

4. Windows to Go (boot from USB)

5. updated task manager with new features

There's a lot more, for a fairly large list go here: http://www.winrumors.com/heres-a-list-of-300-windows-8-features-that-microsoft-didnt-show/

I'll be upgrading once it comes out, but I'll be ditching Metro before I install the first application.
[Windows 8 General] FC1032:
I've use it for a bit more than 2 weeks.

Yes there are some bugs here and there, and it seemed like a big change in the beginning. For some reason, my wifi seemed unstable in Win8, soI went back to Win7.

There were many features and things I missed from Win8. So yes, I do like it, though I can still see them improving it a bit more.