yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Col.Kernel:
And what happens when you leave WiFi off and start moving in your car?

Now I'm fairly certain that the GPS issue was software related and fixed in the latest patch, but you won't know either way till you start driving around with the WiFi off.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] wynand32:
Well, I'm one of those people who don't really care about navigating with my Prime, so I haven't conducted this test yet. My post was more in response to people who say that ALL Primes can't get a single satellite to lock in any situation, as part of a general assertion that "all Primes are the same," which is part of an even larger assertion that anyone who is happy with their Prime is just evading reality.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Col.Kernel:
Asus did NOT have a presence in here until after we made it clear that this level (or more accurately lack) of quality control was unacceptable.

I think the real problem here is that there are two classes of people who bought the Transformer Prime. One is the class that wants the latest and greatest toy and has a large discretionary income. The other class bought this expensive (to us) item to use as a tool and are quite displeased that we spent money on a tool that doesn't do what it was advertised to do, and has other defects on top of that.

---------- Post added at 06:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:11 PM ----------

The question isn't "Are you happy with your prime?", the question is "Is your Prime defective?"

I don't really care if you like or use a feature or not, I care if the feature worked as advertised. Which in the case of the GPS we pretty much had a general failure across the board.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] franky_402:
I would just like to add something here, I see a lot of ppl saying stuff about wifi/bt issues, well Im currently using my evo3d to stream to a Bluetooth I home, while its tethering 4g to my tablet and my speeds are fast and bt has not skipped a beat once... also my wifi in my evo is about 5x as strong as the prime, but that doesn't bother me much as the prime basically just stays tethered to my phone. Also my GPS is about as worthless as an ipad.

Happy prime owner

PS. Wimax, bt and wifi all run on almost the same freq.

Sent from my rooted TF201
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] wynand32:
And here we go back in the endless cycle... If you don't like the GPS performance, then the Prime's not for you. If you can, return it. If you knew about the GPS performance while within your return period and didn't return it, then shame on you.

If you didn't know about the GPS performance, or that it wouldn't be resolved, while you were still in your return period, and kept your Prime in good faith, then you have a legitimate claim against ASUS. But that claim has been stated on this forum quite enough times. What you should be doing is asking ASUS for your money back, or taking whatever steps you feel necessary along those lines. But constantly posting negative feedback here isn't helping you and all it's doing is dragging down the forum.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] BarryH_GEG:
What's ironic is that the people who are trying so hard to prove it works and refuse to let it die are the same one's that say it's not an important feature and that “people who use tablets for navigation are nuts.”

At this point, I think the GPS issue is just the poster child for wireless deficiencies because it's the most visible and one that caused Asus to come clean on the back cover being an issue. And wynand32's right, it's no longer a feature so the point of discussing it specifically is kind of mute. That goes for those that think that it should be included in a high-end Android tablet and those determined to prove it works when it won't ever perform half as well as the Zoom or G-Tab in real world use.

I stopped participating in GPS conversations when people started clapping each other on the back based on dismal performance during some driving demos and declaring victory. When it comes to some aspects of the Prime people see what they want to see. These debates rage on because both the supporters and naysayers are each determined to convince the other that there's only one way to see an issue. That rarely is successful.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] wynand32:
I kind of agree with you, except to say that generally speaking, I find wifi performance to be acceptable and not anywhere near "defective," which would be the claim that's being made by some. That is to say, it works for me in all of my use cases--anywhere in my house or my office where I need it, and at sufficient throughput for all of my uses (browsing, transferring files, streaming video). It's slower in benchmarks, sure, but it's not meaningful in actual use.

I think this is worth pointing out because the bottom line is it's not unreasonable to accept lower wifi performance due to the other factors that make the Prime a great device. For me, it's the Super IPS+ screen that makes it a great device for me, and I'm willing to give up a little wifi performance to be able to use my tablet outdoors in the SoCal sun.

So people who argue that someone like me is fooling himself by accepting the wifi performance is just as bad as someone who berates others because "they shouldn't want to use GPS in a 10" tablet anyways!" The fact is that I recognize the reduced wifi functionality but don't care, because I like other aspects of the Prime that much. Just like I accept slower wifi performance in my Epic 4G Touch vs. my Motorola Photon, because I like some things in the Epic 4G Touch better.

Yes, it's silly to argue that GPS is just fine (it's not), or that it doesn't matter (it does, to some people), just like it's silly to argue that GPS is completely non-functional (it's not), or that it has to matter to everyone (some people legitimately just don't care).

Maybe I'm repeating the post I'm responding to, and if so my apologies. But it just seems like the ENTIRE "metal backplate" issue has been blown so far out of proportion as to make it seem like the Prime is an utterly useless piece of crap. When, in fact, if it were an utterly useless piece of crap, then I wouldn't enjoy using it so damn much every day since I've owned one.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] DarsVaeda:
You just try to justify that you bought an overpriced unfinished product which you are actually beta-testing for them now.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] junrider:
Hehehe, thats what I have been saying numerous times now and no one has commented against it. And to think the real prime isnt coming out till Q2. :D
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Doktaphex:
I thought that I would add this little idea to this lovely thread.

Interestingly of course, they specifically mention that nVidia are currently testing/qualifying a new update, which in my eyes qualifies the fact that all these issues are not simply down to ASUS, they are also down to nVidia.

Do remember that the Transformer Prime was jointly designed by ASUS and nVidia, and who knows, maybe ASUS' engineers were saying the whole time that the back plate would cause issues, but nVidia said, if you want the flagship TEGRA3 tablet, it has to look like this, and they caved so as not to waste the $ Millions that had already been spent in R&D? Just a thought.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] morphiend:
i'm not going to type out a long response but i'll just say i completely disagree with the op. i don't owe a damn thing to asus and they don't owe me anything either. i bought the prime but i returned it because it didn't live up to my expectations and i saw other products on the horizon i'm willing to wait for.

i have no hate for asus though. my next tablet will be the memo 370t..in fact i plan on getting two of them. if those don't live up to my standards i'll return those too. i'm glad that all those people complained about the disappointing wifi. those people are the reason why i feel more confident that the memo will get better wifi reception. asus, like all companies will make mistakes. the prime has a lot of mistakes but to their credit asus is trying to correct them.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] acidus.:
Well said Barry.

I'm one of the people that needs GPS, not for car navigation but for positioning. After the last update, the GPS is functional enough for me to use.

The device still has issues, like weak WiFi. I'll decide by the end of this weekend whether I'll keep it or return it.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Col.Kernel:
People dissing the performance of the Prime are not the ones who started this fanboi thread.

People making idiotic statements that a feature is fine when they haven't performed proper troubleshooting are the ones I have replied to.

It is a well known FACT (and I know how many of you hate that four letter word) that QA/QC on the Prime was inadequate, to put it politely.

I am doing my best to be objective here, and I'm doing a lot better job at it than the Asus cheerleaders are. I recognize that the metal back is causing some signal degradation, but that a software fix for the GPS has a high probability of resolving most of its issues.

I recognize that many people, many more than usual for a new product launch, have experienced issues with physical and/or software defects on this product.

I challenge you, and the OP, to go to another device launch forum on XDA and see what you get in there. The majority of the time you won't see the endless griping that you've seen here because MOST launches aren't bungled the way the Prime's has been.

Sure, there've been exceptions like the Samsung Vibrant. But for the most part new product launches are relatively smooth.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Diamondback:
nope i disagree here. there are no product launches with completely new hardware and software which go completely smooth...

this is unfortunately just not possible today.(because of lacking tests)

oh wait, i do comment against that. I couldn't be any more happy with my prime :) for me it's not unfinished at all :)
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] junrider:
Maybe I missed it, but can you post the status of your prime? In terms of GPS capabilites, wifi connectivity performance, blue tooth/with wifi, serial number problem, and all the other complaints about the prime so far?
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Diamondback:
Sure, GPS doesn't work at all (non issue for me) WiFi is perfectly fine, better than my DHD after the ICS upgrade, bluetooth/wifi problem is existant, but also existant on all my other devices (Desire HD, Laptop, gf's Xoom, gf's nokia phone), so this is in two ways a non issue for me: I don't use wifi/bluetooth in these specific scenarios (streaming over wifi with bluetooth speakers) and it's not the the Prime's fault.

My serialnumber is there and the other issues are non existant too (bleed, bad colors, yellow screen, etc)

So as I said, for me my Prime is working perfectly well and as expected.

Of course noone will deny, that other people are unhappy about those issues, but I am not, because they are non-issues for me. :)
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] kristovaher:
And of course there are no product launches that go completely soon. But there is a difference between not going completely soon and having more problems than one can count on their fingers. Had this been an iPad launch, Apple would have been destroyed in media. No quality control for screens for dead pixels and light bleeds, weaker WiFi than competition, almost non-existent GPS for navigation, no serial number on large amount of devices, crash issues and banding issues, a lot of keyboards not working at all or partly not working.

Sure, a lot of devices are not affected by most of these problems, but there's a great difference between 'launch not going completely smooth' and this.

And it is not possible because of lacking tests? Of course it is possible. Company just needs to test the device before launch for a week or two before throwing it onto market. Majority of these problems would have been caught. Reality is that ASUS wanted to get it on market for holidays and compromised, causing a lot of problems due to not testing the device and rushing it to the market.

And yes you can -test- these devices prior to launch. Even reviewers caught some of the problems in just one day of having the device in their hands. Rest of the testing was apparently done by us, the early-adopters.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Diamondback:
Taking Apple as a comparision here is more or less the worst choice you could make.

Apple doesn't get killed in media. Think about Apple's problems, Antennagate for example.

There was some hate but soon everyone forgot about it (without any fix - no, giving away cases is not a fix :p)

Apple is the most media proof company in the world, they could do much worse things than other companies while gaining way less damage for it ;)
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Logseman:
If people kept buying faulty iPhones in swarms in spite of the faulty antennas, it's because they made a choice and didn't care enough about the antenna to buy any other phone. Certainly we knew of the Antenna issue very quickly, as we have known of any other anti-consumer measure taken by Apple. Apple may have a reality distortion field which works for some insiders, but their dirty laundry is thoroughly exposed. It is only fair that Asus gets the same treatment.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] kristovaher:
So if something doesn't suit your case, you just dismiss it?

Fact is that every Android tablet out there is compared first and foremost to the tablet that started the tablet-craze in the first place. And Apple is not media-proof at all, they are being criticized by many tech portals for their flaws. Recently their inner workings have been under scrutiny. Steve Jobs biography cast light into the unfriendly workplace as well. Their patent-strategies are heavily covered with negative light.

If you only mean Apple-evangelists like MG Siegler then yes, they are critique-proof, but most tech portals are more down to earth than that.

As for Apple's Angennagate, sure it was not a solution. And it was a critical problem on the device. And it remained mostly unfixed, though it did get patches. But that was one problem.

Prime has GPS issue alone that is the same scale as antennagate. And it also has quality control issues, weak WiFi range, serial number issues and keyboards that partly or fully don't work.

Use the same measuring stick for both, Diamondback, because pricing for customers is similar. If your next excuse is 'Apple has more money' then it simply is not valid, since from customers perspective we are paying as much.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Diamondback:
You don't get the point. Media proof doesn't mean there are no critical voices, it means that critical voices don't have any influence.

The iPhone 4 (with it's somewhat inability to phone other people) sold better than any other phone.

And people did know about the issue.

I wouldn't say GPS issue equals phone functionality issue, but that's personal taste, I won't discuss that here.

And I really don't understand why people are so critical about software issues... (btw, not a single issue - manufacturing issues apart - has been proofed to be a hardware issue, not even GPS or Wifi - I don't think it's a software issue, just pointing out that we don't have independent sources who can say 100% that GPS is due to the backplate - not even Anandtech)

Every device has software issues, there is no bug free software.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] gogol:
Err .. Do you think the official statement from ASUS is not enough?

Do you think that we (consumers) must proof that?

Why?

Why cant I trust the information from ASUS?

Are you saying this to maintain your "hope" that this is not hardware (backplate) issue? So, one day, there will be a software update, and VOILA!!!! The GPS works for car navigation! And you will screaming all aloud "HEY! I TOLD YOU SO! IT WAS NOT HARDWARE ISSUE!! THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THE BACKPLATE!".

Hmm ... are you still dreaming?
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Col.Kernel:
I bolded the part of my quote you wish to ignore.

I am a realist, and have worked in both electronic manufacturing and in IT. Don't try to sell me a line of garbage because you choose to skip a word in my quote that is inconvenient for you.

My point is quite simple, and you know that it is valid. You will find calls for social media assaults against extremely few companies on the XDA fora. This is enough to tell me that most companies do their due diligence prior to releasing a new product and, furthermore, that Asus failed to do so as evidenced by a sufficiently large portion of the Prime's userbase both experiencing significant issues, and being incensed enough to create a social media stink that Asus felt the need to address (after ignoring problems put to them by individuals).

The last time I saw this large an outcry against a company was when Samsung released not one, but two, broken phones (Behold II and Vibrant) in a row. I swore to never buy a Samsung product again. Samsung has since turned their behavior around and I have changed my mind about purchasing their products. But make no mistake, I believe that without our PR campaign that Samsung would not be a diligent in QCing their new products prior to release.

Asus will no doubt turn their reputation back in the right direction as well. But had there been no outcry on the state of the Prime at release the message Asus would have received is that we'll buy whatever blinky, plastic trash you want to price at $600 or more and go away happy. It doesn't even have to work.

That is not the message I want ANY company to receive.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] kristovaher:
I am jumping out of this discussion as it has become obvious that Diamondback is on a crusade in his religious drive that corporations can release products with multiple critical flaws, ask money for them and not have to face critical backslash from customers who paid for the whole shebang once these flaws are discovered.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] demandarin:
funny how someone compared Prime Gps issue to iPhone 4 antennae problem. Just realize the fact that Gps is not that important to most consumers. you don't see several news channels covering the Prime and it's GPS issues. now the iphone4 was plastered all over the news getting slammed left n right for antennae problem and screen problems. There was alot bigger outrage over it. Prime situation doesn't hold a candle to that big of a problem apple went through.

GPS is not a feature most people get hyped about when a product is released. its really a moot feature. GPs issue is across the board. No denying that. Wifi on the other hand, can easily be debated that at least most owners here in xda have no issues with it. its not an assumption. Its what most have stated here through posts n polls in Prime section. All these b.s. about people not testing right then since they can't get same piss poor results I got. Maybe you not testing right. Numbers don't lie. Its obvious same ones complaining about GPS just through wifi into the mix also.

Anandtech last return to wifi tests for Prime was good. He even said right on par with OG Transformer. Even with GPS issue he still recommended The Prime over any other Android tablet.

Regardless Prime still selling. Online orders still sell out as soon as they pop online. Prime still most sought after tablet. CES was a fail as far as competition goes. Most major reviewers hold Prime to reign up top for at least half a year or maybe more. Fact is most accept the GPS issue with the Prime. GPS is not that big of a feature. you just have GPS buffs here who make a big deal about it. At least Asus is trying with constant updates and is proving GPS gets better n better with each update.

Asus only admitted to backplate was a major contributing factor to GPS issues. They mentioned nothing themselves about wifi or BT. They didn't say wireless in general. They GPS n nothing more. If you can show the official statement saying otherwise, then please do so.

This debate is tired. You have majority here who satisfied with device and features trying to be told otherwise by the few defectors. When will they realize they can't win..lol.

Like Barry said, this is an interesting study in human behavior. You have a few basically thinkn they can walk into clearly outnumbered scenario and actually do something. Just like Congress vote, Presidential vote, or any vote, Majority rules. Plain n Simple. Just take a look at how fellow xda members voted in the numerous polls here. Majority rules. Wifi issues, screen issues, etcc.. All debunked the assumption that every prime affected. Every poll showed 75-80% in favor of Prime. Just accept the fact that issues aside from GPS is a very small minority. Period. End of story.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Diamondback:
Answers later as I am on the phone right now, one thing though: you still don't get my point.

slowly I start thinking you don't want to understand me...

Gesendet von meinem HTC Desire HD mit Tapatalk
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] scsurface1:
You stated before that you don't own a Prime. Go back to your Apple forum.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Dagrog:
Let me start off by saying I didn't read all 15 pages. ASUS rushed to put out a product before Christmas knowing full well that the product has issues. I was wondering what "fix" they were doing to the Prime and get it out on time but the fix is a bandaide. After the last update the GPS functions but it's signal reception is still poor. Plus to take GPS off the specs after people bought them is a slap in the face. If I'm laying out top dollar money for a tablet it better be top dollar. If you order a pizza with ham pepperoni and onions, pay for 3 toppings then open the box and the ham is missing and the guy at the counter says come back next week we might have a fix for it.

Every ASUS I ever owned has been quality but I'll never blindly trust them again.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] demandarin:
good analogy. made me laugh. and still laughing. putting it that way you have a good point.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Diamondback:
haha, better than the scenario where the guy comes back 5 minutes later and takes away your ham again :P
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Col.Kernel:
You are absolutely correct. I don't get your point.

The closest I come to understanding where you are coming from is what I posted a few pages back. I'll repost it here in case you missed it.
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] Diamondback:
yes this is a totally valid point. as you can imagine, i am in the first "class" ;-)

more on that later...
[Asus  Eee Pad Transformer Prime] murgo:
i can't and won't believe it's not a hardware issue. i had two primes now. the first one had a BCOKAS06 serial number, my second one came today and was BCOKAS15. so i'm pretty sure i got one of the newer batches today. yet the new prime had even WORSE wifi performance than my first one. standing outside on my balcony, i got 14mbit down / 5 mbit up with my sgs2. guess what the prime managed to pull out of my router? 1mbit down / 1mbit up. that is not acceptable.

todays GPS update also didn't do anything for me. my new prime couldn't even see 1 freaking satellite :(

i don't know what the problem is, but there definitely is a very big one. i'm not hating, i'm just telling people about my disappointment. i think the prime is broken at its core, and asus can't do anything about it with software updates. and if anyone asks me if i can recommend this device, i'll say no.