yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Android General] joecool1029:
It's not abuse when they advertise an unlimited plan. It's abuse when they discriminate and throttle or cap people who pay for unlimited service. Again you're totally missing the point that I'm paying for a service, not a payment plan on a cellphone. I buy my equipment outright just like I do for my home and business service (I don't pay modem rental fees). I am paying approximately 5x more than I used to pay with unlimited t-zones (GPRS/EDGE) on t-mobile for unlimited service that nobody bugged me on. I understand the costs of going to a new technology and I might even consider $50-60/month fair rate for *unlimited* LTE service.

Imagine if the same logic were to be applied to your home ISP. You upgrade to a new computer and your ISP now tells you "well, this system is a lot more powerful, we are going to bill you more... oh by the way our data transit costs are nearly zero, but we're now going to cap you anyway so you can't take over $0.10 cents away a month on our profit."

With all the above in mind, I'm not against AT&T selling different speed tiers of service and giving higher QoS priority to higher paying customers. Indeed I believe this is already done between the different APN's. I know for sure on wap.cingular we don't see the same peak speeds as other customers. I'm also not against AT&T putting QoS measures in place during times of high traffic, so long as it does not discriminate based on hardware or usage. Right now their methods don't seem very good.

It's people like you that get into regulatory positions that have drank the kool-aid big telco is supplying. Telco is starting to sound like the MPAA crying wolf, "the VHS will kill us" "smartphone data is killing us". No, it's making them rich, very rich.

What I'd like to see is a AT&T network engineer pop in and explain some of the methods they use to manage their networks, but I'd imagine all the ones out there are bound by NDA's.

EDIT: I also pay for an unlimited text messaging plan on my account to bring the price of the data lines down. Text messaging actually uses zero traffic on the provider, it's built into the signaling that phones use, hence the short character length. It's a ripoff to charge for it and it's why you see so many MVNO's that provide unlimited text anywhere in the world, because it's essentially a free service to the provider. I don't just pay $10/month, I pay ~$35/month per line. It's my choice to pay $400 for phones and save on the service instead of paying more monthly to pay down the phone that AT&T subsidized.
[Android General] Mr.Mischief:
[GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

Your argument falls apart when you realize that AT&T advertises this for dumb phones, NOT smartphones.

Your argument doesn't hold water.

I would agree with you if you we're talking about the unlimited smartphones plans that used to be offered.
[Android General] joecool1029:
I activated it before smartphones came about. The network does not care whether a device is smartphone or not, it's doesn't change anything on the technical end (maybe for you on iPhone they need to provide an additional visual voicemail service). Again, I don't have options from my home ISP as to whether I want "netbook" or "desktop" service levels. No, they sell raw access with service tiers.

I do think it's unfair that if you want to pay the $700-800 for an iphone and activate it on medianet (knowing you'll be speed restricted and lose visual voicemail) you cannot. Blackberry is the only service tier that actually requires special equipment, well that and the former T-Mobile sidekick. Instead they are passing the cost along to you in your service fees.

Nowadays the tides have turned so far that if you want to unlock your subsidized iphone to move to the competition it comes with a felony, an absurd fine, and potential jailtime. I'm waiting for the day to come when they lock out nonpaying customers' own owned equipment IMEI's so they can't be used on *any* network (not on the phone, but the IMEI blacklists).
[Android General] Mr.Mischief:
[GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

It has nothing to do with the phone and whether you first activated your line with a dumb phone or not. It's about how much you use.

This plan was sold for/with dumb phones. That is a fact. Dumb phones typically use less data than smartphones. That is a fact.

Thus, through a little logic, we realize this plan is primarily meant for light users.

You can try to justify your abuse of the data any way you like. It doesn't hold water.
[Android General] killme2:
Can we please keep it on topic? I don't think this is the place to discuss ethics.
[Android General] joecool1029:
I'm assuming the butthurt comes from paying a absurd rate for your iphone's data plan. The service is branded as unlimited. I averaged around 7GB/month on my dumbphone BEFORE I transitioned to a smartphone. If they want to market service to light users and cap it, that's fine. I'm saying the rates and restrictions imposed on unlimited users is not fair and their current service plans are inadequate and overpriced.

I could apply your logic to Gym memberships, charge a monthly rate like $20/month (just pulling a number out) for access. Do you expect to get yelled at for going every day because members typically go only once or twice a week? No, it's called using what you pay for. I don't use over 10GB every month, but there are times I need to have this kind of data and I'd appreciate it if AT&T continues to supply and not complain about usage habits.

EDIT: More arguments on unfair marketing practices. I've already defended that the technology in place is the same used for "dumbphones". I didn't defend how it was branded though. This hearkens back to the days of selling CD-R's at a premium branded as "music cd-r's". They preyed on misinformed customers assuming they'd need a different product than your generic CD-R for music.

Another example were a couple lawsuits regarding contact lenses branded as dailies as opposed to bi-weekly replacement schedules. The manufacturers were selling the same product in different quantities with a different box, quantity, and instructions. Obviously they could now market two products and price accordingly to maximize profit and the consumer would not know that the product he was discarding after a day could be used for 2 weeks. I realize this is a bit off-topic, but it comes down to what is really fair and what kind of consumer you are.

EDIT2: A friend of mine who holds a econ degree just suggested you look up "price discrimination".
[Android General] chrism.brunner:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

I haven't had any of my phones flagged, and I have 5, but I might look into some of the phones coming out of China. Some of them look decent.
[Android General] Mr.Mischief:
[GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

You couldn't be farther from the truth. I'm on a MEdia Net plan, and my parents pay for it.

As for your gym analogy, it's faulty.

What you do is like, you, an adult, buying a kids buffet ticket and sneaking in or disgusting yourself to get in as a child.

Your CD and contact analogies are entirely irrelevant.
[Android General] joecool1029:
You are a prime example of why people shouldn't have children. (EDIT: ok it was overly harsh) Some of us actually pay their way in life starting young. I have never relied on my parents for cell service, and I *actually* had my entire family under my account until the past few years to save them some money. This is a part of being an informed consumer, not a spoiled child.

Irrelevant? My first argument before you jumped in was a resource argument. A buffet does have to pay more for food to an adult. Data is not a limited supply and I could use just as much on my old dumbphone device, and indeed I often did. A child cannot physically consume as much as an adult (usually) and there is no extra material cost to use that data between the two devices.

My analogies are not irrelevant as they relate to the topic of price discrimination which I am calling AT&T out on. Some of us have been around long enough to see telco data go from pay-per-use, to buckets, to all you can eat, and back to buckets (and the new shared buckets). There's no reason why we should be asked to pay more for same technology service.

FFS, do you think it's fair for them to charge $17/MB for international roaming then make it a felony to unlock your phone to use another provider while abroad? Grow up.
[Android General] Mr.Mischief:
[GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

I'm in freaking high school bro. I pay for my own phones and my parents pay the monthly cost.

I started my computer repair company when I was 14 to make money, since I didn't and still don't get an allowance I had my own damn office in the middle of the capital of AL.

I also dual enroll at college. I have 16 credit hours completed, and I'm working on 3 more (Ethics class). Additionally, I have a 4 year academic scholarship to Auburn University.

I'm far from a spoiled child.

---------- Post added at 03:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:52 PM ----------

On the principal of not arguing with idiots(because they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience), I'm finished.

Nothing in your last post hasn't already been addressed in a previous post.
[Android General] joecool1029:
Oh cool, you should bring this discussion into your ethics lecture (seriously). Would be very interesting to see the input. As a business owner you should realize the importance of controlling costs, unless you're operating as a sole proprietor without true overhead (ie. onsite computer repair and the sort. When I was about your age I did that, but now I own a corp and provide more specialized services).

With the above being stated, if you actually have a technical background then you should be able to go back and analyze my arguments and do some research on where data prices were and where they've gone today. There are some groups that have been tracking this behavior of the telco industry such as http://stopthecap.com

Believe me, it's not just the mobile industry but the cable and landline industry are just as bad. Research localized telephone monopolies, net neutrality, and some of the ISP's capping practices (comcast, timewarner, etc). If i could, I'd buy up some fiber and attempt to roll municipal broadband access where I'm at but it's prohibitively expensive for my company right now and big telco WOULD sue the pants off me.

EDIT: Do you actually have an iphone on medianet? I'm curious because this is usually an insta-flagged phone, iPhones are AT&T's bread and butter.

EDIT2: On topic suggestion. Doesn't matter what manufacturers and models you list up here. Unless you're putting up IMEI's for AT&T to flag just listing a model isn't going to help them come flag you. Keep the list public.
[Android General] Alucard400:
Topic about ethics, every customer uses the service to their advantage. Could be extreme or light. What matters is AT&t tries to control use ofdata and prventing the nation from being up on par with the other countries. We dont need to argue about how service is abused or not. AT&T offers unlimited data but really intended not to allow unlimited data use. We re helping eachother get around their measures of control and should keep it that way.
[Android General] joshyth:
[GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

AFAIK, you need the Verizon's version of the iPhone 5 or maybe even the sprint version. Any other versions that is intended for gsm carriers will get instant flagged
[Android General] Daedalus_:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

I've found that it is much nicer just to get any old phone as long as it wifi tethers to my tablet which I bring more often with me. All I need for a phone to do now is music, GPS, calling, and Google voice.
[Android General] izdabombest1:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

I think its time to ask 4 help. I have a Sony xperia x10i and a Verizon sim. The phone is rooted and unlocked. It is now running 2.1update1. I have every conceivable Rom ever made for it. I have unlocked and done 100's of apn registers. For some reason i can't get the Verizon to work on the x10i. I have it set on gsm/cdma preferred. Would that b right? Never tried a cdma based sim on a gsm device. I've ran tweakker as a last resort but that was useless. Any ideas?
[Android General] Mr.Mischief:
[GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

It won't work on Verizon. The x10i is a gsm phone, and Verizon is a CDMA carrier.
[Android General] paperWastage:
the "CDMA prefererred" refers to the GSM 3G technology (WCDMA)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W-CDMA_(UMTS)

There is no CDMA technology in that phone

http://www.gsmarena.com/sony_ericsson_xperia_x10-2964.php - all GSM (HSDPA is 3.5G GSM)

iPhone 4 (CDMA edition) http://www.gsmarena.com/apple_iphone_4_cdma-3716.php - all CDMA
[Android General] sucsss:
isn't the Verizon sim used for their LTE modem?
[Android General] joecool1029:
I get called out on discussing the ethics of using the medianet plan but this is Verizon talk in an AT&T thread. You're not going to get very good answers here.
[Android General] jcash74:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

Lets keep this thread pertaining to medianet. I would hate to see this informative thread become closed.

Jc we can continue our discussion on ethics if youd like but not in this thread. I really dont see the point as we obviously view things differently anyway and really what is the point of arguing online...
[Android General] izdabombest1:
I believe so that's what confuses me. When the sim is in the Lumia it says that it is in gsm mode and when it comes out it says cdma but no service. I didn't know that cdma can be run thru a sim. But i guess anything is possible nowadays.
[Android General] sucsss:
your "factual" posts were just spam.

where as there are numerous Verizon phones with gsm radios in them.

that particular sony experia is unluckly not one of them. it's just for LTE. so no chance of working on att.
[Android General] joshyth:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

uh...but that SE x10 was a att phone, and he tried to use it on verizon, which wont work.
[Android General] Alucard400:
I was wondering. Would LTE speeds now cause AT&T to flag phones? My previous phone that got flagged was hsdpa+ from t mobile. But wonder if lte and hsdpa+ speeds now make a differencr in flagging since it's obvious dumbphones dont have hsdpa+ and lte speeds. How many of you are still not flagged using an LTE PHONE?
[Android General] nunyabiziz:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

No Lte on medianet provisioned phones.
[Android General] chrism.brunner:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

All of my phones use H+ and haven't been flagged. Don't think that is it....
[Android General] Jack143:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

Is at&t now flagging the International galaxy note ll? just got the funds to buy it, and don't want to lose unlimited data. Is it just a few people getting flagged or it's it wide spread flagging.
[Android General] sumeet909:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

Anyone else got flagged on htc radar 4g? I want to know if my line was flagged due to imei mismatch or do they really have radar 4g in their imei db. The rep couldn't tell me "which smartphone" I was using. I wonder if I could call them back and just give them imei of radar 4g and continue using that.
[Android General] yw2012:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

I see many instances that note 2 international got flagged.
[Android General] joecool1029:
You should be banned for extreme stupidity.

1. AFAIK, the only verizon phones with GSM modems are a few blackberry international phones. Hardly numerous. EDIT: apparently some of the newer Verizon LTE phones also have GSM modems now. Not sure if it's still numerous though.

2. That X10i was made in 2010, it doesn't have LTE, and it doesn't even have 850/1900mhz support for AT&T's 3G. The phone would work on AT&T's EDGE network but it would never work with a verizon LTE sim.

3. I've stated again and again in my posts and you and other people above me in this post keep missing that LTE will not ever work on medianet, we don't have access to that APN. HSPA+ phones work, but at HSPA speeds (again due to having restricted access to the APN)

Regarding the other posts above here, whether a phone supports HSPA or HSPA+ shouldn't affect whether it'll flag. It's based solely on whether AT&T has the IMEI data for the phone and possibly on what IMEI they have on your file. Unknown IMEI's are what they seem to have unpredictable behavior with. I really don't think the SIM is pulling OS info from the phone to report to AT&T, though my HD2 did flag shortly after I went from CM9 to CM10 on it.

It just occurred to me that my Xperia U flagged before, I took it out of commission shortly after, but my sister had made purchases through Market and AT&T (it was called it then) with my X10 mini pro and it never flagged. I was always concerned they'd flag it smartphone after seeing app purchases on my phone bill but it never happened until the U.

Finally, I am in agreeance with jcash74 that this thread should stay on topic and that it should stay informative. So far so good with my current phones. Will keep the thread updated if that changes.
[Android General] bedwa:
I would disagree on some vzw phones Joe, but I'm leaving that topic aside.

On my phones, my N7000 (Euro original note) has no issues, a Sharp Aquos SH-02D slider, Motorola Droid Bionic, or Motorola Droid 3 all have had no issues. My T-Mobile HTC One S was pegged in less than 24 hours.
[Android General] chrism.brunner:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

I'm not sure about app store etc.... I use it all the time, as well as amazon. None of my phones have been flagged. Just my thoughts.
[Android General] Daedalus_:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

But do you pay for apps on your cell bill?
[Android General] chrism.brunner:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

No. I set it up on my credit card. Maybe that's the difference.
[Android General] bedwa:
Forgot to add another good device.

My Goddaughter has a Motorola milestone 2 on her line with no issues.
[Android General] paperWastage:
there are a couple of Verizon phones that have GSM modems (and non-LTE), and (possibly) unlockable to be used on AT&T (details below)

my Droid 3 (Motorola xt862 verizon model aka Milestone 3) works* and is undetected so far after a month

* requires unlock code(ebay codes work 70% of the time), and radio flashing.

Heard the Droid DNA is SIM-unlocked works on AT&T, but dunno if it works on medianet

http://www.androidcentral.com/how-use-verizon-droid-dna-att-or-any-other-gsm-network

Iphone 5 Verizon model works on AT&T, don't see anyone complaining it's detected

there are a couple of Chinese android phones that I want to try... might get it soon

I don't see a point keeping the list quiet... just one member leaks the list, and it's gone... and I'm sure AT&T can detect smartphones if they put any effort in it

also, I would stay away from T-Mobile phones from now on...
[Android General] bedwa:
Agreed. As a former employee I agree that there are many ways for them to find out. A part of the system reads system flags. I found someone a year and a half ago that was using an HTC dream and questioned. They denied it and I placed the media net plan on the device. That part of the system was made to determine iPhone software versions and that's part of the reason why I don't use a proxy, run my SMS through Google Voice and always use a CC or redeem a card for my Play Store purchases.

You can never be too cautious.

Oh, and the reason I went unbranded? I got throttled with the UNL Smartphone plan while still being an employee. I was being good. Then I got throttled. Of all the people you shouldn't is those willing to show off your devices and capabilities to everyone else..... Oh well.

Edit: I'm wondering if fast dormancy may not be tagged as well. There are some days I do wish I was still on the inside. If not only for the info.
[Android General] xtmzone:
Thanks for this list of phones Kaijura!
[Android General] sucsss:
it's numerous.

who said anything about lte?

who said anything about lte on att?

go back and read.

that driod DNA is pretty sweet. Tempted to get one.
[Android General] lilraver018:
Would someone be so kind and send me a copy of the new list?
[Android General] johnfry:
Blaze

My samsung blaze 4g is flagged. Called in to get the data plan changed back and they new it was a tmobile smartphone and wouldnt add it.:crying:
[Android General] sucsss:
I guess all t-mobile phones are "dead" now. probably because of that banned imei list they are now sharing.
[Android General] joecool1029:
That's really interesting. Fast Dormancy... I have it disabled on most of my phones. The Ion HSPA has it disabled by default (only one in the line with it off) according to a FXP dev. Yeah it's pretty crazy UNL smartphone users got throttled and we don't. But we are essentially throttled to 7.2mbit/s so I guess it's a tradeoff.

Oh btw I hit my bill cycle, still golden. Winning™

EDIT: I had a Mytouch3G on a line forever, it never flagged. My HD2 flagged once and hasn't reflagged, I'd hardly say T-Mob is sharing the entire list, just the new stuff. I wouldn't touch any recent Samsung or HTC though.

EDIT2: My EDGE-only HD2 just reflagged. HSPA Ion still good. ****
[Android General] faulty_machine:
Non-carrier smartphone used to be on ATT

I am wondering--

I guess a rule of thumb is that models of smartphone ATT never carried themselves work with medianet as a dumbphone.

But, what if a particular unlocked handset (a model not carried by ATT) was previously used on ATT, with a proper smartphone plan?

Would ATT remember its imei as a smartphone and immediately (or eventually) flag it when used on medianet?
[Android General] joecool1029:
No, but it looks like all T-Mobile phones are likely flagged and worthless now on this plan, even ones that won't work on AT&T's 3G network. Scumbag carriers, this IMEI sharing list is just to make more money and expand control.
[Android General] flouflou:
Re: [GUIDE][10-31-2012] List of phones compatible with ATT Family/MediaNet Plan

Very good. Thanks
[Android General] faulty_machine:
What are you basing this on?

I know a case where a model not carried by ATT (not t-mo phone, either) was identified by ATT as a smartphone by the imei alone.

How could this happen?
[Android General] joecool1029:
Phones intended for US sales on a carrier but not sold directly by the carrier will do this. A personal example that I once owned was the Dell Streak 5. This phone will flag immediately. Another example is the Nexus line of phones.

I would say that the best suggestion I can give is to buy phones that are not intended for the US market that will work here anyway. The HSPA Ion was the safest bet I could take to that effect (phone intended for sale in France). But we'll see, it usually takes a few months for AT&T to get new model information, they can't even unlock their gophones for a month or so.

Again there's no point in hiding your model, they can't nail you down on name alone.