yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[HTC EVO 3D] nate420:
now that i think about it more (and after the convo i had with a sprint manager)

its not really Carrier IQ's fault or HTC's

at this class action law suit they will point fingers at other companies/people just like any multi billion dollar company would....

all htc has to provide is a simple written out contract with sprint: stating they want this program pre installed on the phones before they will ever buy them and resell them with a SPRINT name on it...

so HTC will point a finger at sprint and say "DEM MOTHAFU*KA'S TOLD US TOO!"

then it will be CIQ's turn to explain WTF is going on....

now lets look at there website for a minute: http://www.carrieriq.com/

they just look like a company that is in the industry of development of software to data log/key log malfunctions on a wireless device

so all they have to prove is sprint bought their product in which HTC used it...

so i dont think HTC nor CIQ are gonna face any legal problems over this

(unless they lost the contracts with sprint that details the programs they want on the phone before they will sell them)

the people that want there punitive damages/breach of their 4th amendment should be suing SPRINT for requesting this **** on the phones... and not telling us or having a option to opt out of it WITH OUT VOIDING THE WARRANTY

just my rant.... sorry ill go to the bar now :)

PEACE!

---------- Post added at 12:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:02 AM ----------

no he is not taking credit he is a well known and highly renowned kernel developer from the SGS forums... he is the mastermind behind voodoo sound,voodoo lag fix among many other things....

he simply made a app that detects it on your rom/device (more phone support)

TrevE's app is only for HTC devices if im not mistaken

he would never kang someones ideas without giving credit......

ive donated alot of time (and money) on IRC with him when i had a vibrant/G2x, from system dumps to data logging with him and other kernel developers i doubt many can say the same...
[HTC EVO 3D] blingdogg:
LoL just called sprint told them I saw this on the news just to see what they would say about it and they agent told me customer service was "briefed" on the issue this morning and were given a general response to phone calls... and she also said that's all sprints been getting calls about today lol
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
Yeah, I bet. I'm sure some people are scratching their heads. "We boned?" "Yeah we're boned" "Let's tell them we are looking into it, and will come up with a solution soon" "Then laugh all the way to the bank because we can ass rape them and there is nothing they can do about it?" "Yeah! Stupid Joe public and their 2 year, Whatcha gonna do about it, contracts! Muhahaha" "Yeah what are they going to do? Go to another carrier? We all ass rape customers, and they bend over for two years and take it! There is no competition to run to, hahaha!"

.....

In todays news, 45 million Americans started going to proctologists, in one day. The gaping ass hole epidemic's cause is not yet known.

Lots of people with sore red ass tomorrow, Dianne.

Got that right, Kent. In other news....

Sad panda very sad. And very bum sore.
[HTC EVO 3D] nate420:
Most skitzophranic post I've seen on xda.. ...

But somewhat the truth!
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
My mind may be eclectic, but there is a method behind my madness. I definitely know when I'm getting screwed, pun intended.
[HTC EVO 3D] eboogie33:
TrevE mentioned on CNN http://money.cnn.com/2011/12/01/technology/carrier_iq/index.htm?hpt=hp_bn6
[HTC EVO 3D] xHausx:
Well, you can add T-Mobile and Apple to the list of companies with class action lawsuits against them now

AT&T, Sprint Mobile Phone Users Sue Over Carrier IQ Tracking Software
[HTC EVO 3D] Rippley05:
I have a serious mancrush on Treve... he really brought this to light.

This HAS to be the start of some changes being made..we should have the legal right to know and decline any app/service/bloatware that is forced on us when we purchase a phone.
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
Bloat is one thing, I can write that off as an annoyingly personal form of advertising. Invading privacy beyond all other invasion of privacy is however not acceptable without a choice being given. I can't accept the patriot act, and that is supposedly to protect national security (ha!), but this is just spying without permission for financial gain. I'm no constitutional lawyer, but that has to be unconstitutional, per breaking my constitutional right to privacy. Yes?
[HTC EVO 3D] heathmcabee:
Yeah if that dude had a vagina and some boobs, I'm pretty much marry him even if he looks the same way. okay.. maybe.. not.. but.. well.. damnit.. you get my point. I am glad to know I was aware well before the point of CNN and what he put out and have it not on my phone!
[HTC EVO 3D] ®AndroidDoctor®:
Looks Like The Law Suits Are Poping Up Everywhere
[HTC EVO 3D] flonker:
I just love Sprint's response to the whole matter, that it is just a tool to improve customer service. Really Sprint? Didn't know you cared...

So Sprint, if you think my phone should be used as tool to collect information on ways you can improve your service to me, I AGREE, but maybe you should have just called me (I think you have my number), instead of installing spyware on my phone. If you had, I could have kindly offered all the information you need to know to improve customer satisfaction free of charge, mainly: YOUR NETWORK SUCKS.

By the way, how much did you pay for that spyware to be installed on my phone? A lot I bet, huh? I could've ran a speedtest for free. 56kbps download?! Looks like we found the problem!

Damn, and you needed install this crap on my phone to try and locate problems so you could better serve me? The only way that would happen is if you were sitting around waiting for the data you were secretly uploading from my phone and you thought, "Wow! It's taking a really long time to get all this data we're secretly collecting, maybe we should upgrade our network..."

Anyways Sprint, thanks for caring, also thanks for ending early upgrades, increasing ETF's, and changing your definition of "3G" to fit the capabilities of your network instead of changing your network to fit the definition of "3G". Can't wait to see what other great ideas you guys come up with to get an edge on the competition, have you considered just kicking customers square in the balls the second they walk through your door? Think about it.
[HTC EVO 3D] solver404:
What an interesting trip ahead- hope not too short. Now that media has hands on this we shall see, they usually have a way of ruining my days. Every true societal issue needs to not move so quickly... how many reporters, and listeners have no real clue about the true issue.

Too much too fast, where is the discussion? Cease and desist? Enlightened society, technological advancement, our children's future.... Litigation vs Discussion.... We were here for you guys and you slapped our hand.
[HTC EVO 3D] sgt. slaughter:
http://www.engadget.com/2011/12/03/carrier-iq-vp-says-software-poses-no-threat-to-user-privacy-bac/

here we go time to back track now.

I just wanna know how we can be sure that its "...discarded almost as soon as it comes in..." as unless we are sitting at the datacenter itself we wont know for sure.

This is of course if he is saying "...comes in..." as in the log coming into the data center and NOT coming into just the carrieriq app itself on the phone and its discarded there.

If its discarded there on the phone itself i would like to be shown this in a video itself just like TrevE did.
[HTC EVO 3D] oldjackbob:
If the data is being gathered at all (and it obviously is, even by CIQ's own admission), then federal wiretapping and privacy laws have been broken. It doesn't matter why the data is being captured, or what it's being (or not being) used for. Federal law protects my private data from being intercepted at all without my knowledge and consent. So CIQ's management can babble on about how the data is being "filtered" and "discarded" all day long, but that doesn't make them any less guilty of breaking the law in the first place. And we have all been irreparably injured, from the very beginning.

I, for one, welcome the incoming tide of class action suits.
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
This is the fact of it. I don't give a **** what is done with MY data, and it is my data. If you have my data it is only because I graciously give it to you or I sold it to you. Since I did neither of those you STOLE my data from me, and you can't just give data back once it is stolen. My right to privacy is as basic as equality and freedom to speak, and ciq broke my right.

Furthermore, aside from not asking my explicit permission for MY data, these companies have shown they can't keep our data secure. So filtered, discarded, I don't give two ****s in a camel hump and ****, I can't trust that it won't get swiped from the air (because I can guarantee they aren't using a secure connection like ssl), on top of that I bet it isn't kept safe either! Since they are logging keys and text messages, even of I use ssl to buy something from my phone I am transferring credit card info, social security, or any other dangerous data. It didn't matter that it was done securely because it isn't secure to ciq or safe on their servers!
[HTC EVO 3D] Droid-o-matic:
I'm not one to buy into conspiracies but this has me unnerved. My data would be extremely boring to read but, as stated earlier, it is MY data. I don't care for things like 'Cloud' storage and I am more worried each day about the erosion of our privacy. Now this. I'm sure there is something buried in the contract regarding this that no-one has published yet. As for Class Action lawsuits the best we can hope for is that the 'Opt-out' option is forced on the carriers and/or CIQ. Typically the only winner are the attorneys. :rolleyes:

And for those stating legal opinions as fact, IE: illegal wire tapping, please indicate your legal credentials with the post so we can know that you are indeed a subject matter expert as the law is not always so easy to decipher. I sure hope there is a resolution soon as I think my front facing camera is staring at me right now and I'm not dressed. :p

My meager contribution. Thanks for the time.
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
I think you have a point, it isn't appropriate to state which law specifically you think they broke unless you have education on the subject matter, which I certainly am not qualified to talk about. As stated before though, I'm not a constitutional lawyer, but I know despite privacy not specifically being mentioned privacy is guaranteed as a basic human right under the 4th and 5th amendment (and maybe the third). On top of that though it is been guaranteed by the ruling of the supreme court with countless cases, which sets a future precedent when ruling in future cases. So there is no ifs about it, they broke constitutional law based on the two amendments I mentioned, and possibly the third.
[HTC EVO 3D] sgt. slaughter:
Unless you have and sign a privacy policy which is the route Sprint will likely try and cover all of this as they have said in their statements. no?
[HTC EVO 3D] oldjackbob:
Lol, I don't need to prove I'm a "subject matter expert" to know that my rights have been violated!

There are already plenty of "subject matter expert" lawsters working on it on my behalf, thank you very much, lol!
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
Well in this case it won't matter. When a contact is written and signed, it is only valid if the contact is lawful. In this case the rights we are guaranteed under the constitution way far and above trump any contact. Not even a law can trump the constitution, except and amendment to the constitution. So...even it being hidden somewhere, the only way you get around this right is by offering a choice to NOT invade your privacy. They didn't, so and contact, Eula, agreement, all of it is invalid

Edit: on phone easier not to edit typos. Sorry
[HTC EVO 3D] Droid-o-matic:
Well we KNOW at least we feel violated. I'm willing to bet, unfortunately, that we gave up that privacy in the Terms and Conditions of our contracts. Mine with Sprint has some rather ambiguous terms like:

"We may use systems or tools to follow your use of our Services, including using cookies, web beacons

and other tracking mechanisms.

" Other tracking mechanisms?!

Just for the record, my qualifications are I've seen nearly every episode of Law & Order seasons 1 & 2 multiple times and never liked LA Law AND I know words like "Pro Forma". I don't know what it means but I know how to say it. :p

Back to the real message, as oldjackbob stated, I hope your right that the "lawsters" can get something done on our behalves. Perhaps the pressure of our backlash will be enough. This is really uncomfortable. Anyone remember that fictional movie "The Net" where the security software company had access to all the data it was protecting. Think this sort of feels like that or am I over reacting? It's a ton of data collected by one company's software in a device that has network access all the time.
[HTC EVO 3D] sofla2:
I called Sprint today on this. The conversation got pretty heated. Everyone I spoke with claimed they have never heard of Carrier IQ. I told this one ***** that there was nothing in my contract that says your can collect my personal and private data. Her response...there is nothing in the contract that says we can't. That was the end of the conversation and I'm going to wait until I cool down to call back.
[HTC EVO 3D] sgt. slaughter:
this made me laugh.

what in the world do you hope to accomplish by calling a CS rep? What in the world do you think they would be able to do for you to fix the problem?
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
As stated above, there is a reason in this case why the extent of the invasion of privacy is not legal, no terms or conditions will make a difference. A contract that has terms that are illegal are not valid. I could sign a contract allowing sprint to confiscate my second born child, that doesn't make it legal. If they take my kid it is still kidnapping.

Sgt slaughter is right, calling sprint will do NOTHING. Specially now that their is an open court case their lawyers will instruct the company not to talk about it. Don't even bother calling, it will do no good, just take time away from legit customer service calls.
[HTC EVO 3D] sofla2:
What did I hope to accomplish? Probably nothing. But you know what? I pay about $350 a month to Sprint for service. So if I am unhappy with something about that service, you better damn well believe I will call and complain about it.
[HTC EVO 3D] sgt. slaughter:
Just saying calling regular CS rep isn't the best route. Best to email the corp members or least when you call immediately ask to speak to a supervisor. Otherwise your doing nothing but waisting everyone's time.
[HTC EVO 3D] oldjackbob:
Very good point. Did we sign away our rights under some nebulous verbiage in the contract?

One thing, however, that would seem to shoot that argument down is that, according to Trev's findings, the data collection continues even when the phone is deactivated and no longer on any active Sprint service.
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
How is this such a hard thing for some of you to grasp. Considering you are making contracts daily (like going into a store and buying something as example) you all need to know your rights when entering into a contract.

There are two problems with the contracts we have signed, and the terms of them. In this case, yes there may be a contract signed where we allow data collection. However for that term in a contract to be legal it has to be clearly stated and specific enough that there is "a melting of two minds". That means you and the contract originator must understand the contract terms to have the same meaning. You mean to tell me, where the contract states data collection is allowed to have taken place, that was specific enough for you to know that another company, not the carrier, was going to collect keystrokes, text messages, pictures, ad infinitum? There is no way anyone understood this to be the meaning of that very ambiguous term in your contract up until Trevor started doing his research, just no way it was specific enough to have explained to you that the invasion of privacy would be to that extent. This ALONE makes the contract invalid, illegal, and unenforceable.

Another thing in this case that makes the contract invalid. If any one term breaks a law, a contract is also illegal and void. We have wire tapping laws, we have improper search and seizure laws (which by the way also covers INFORMATION), we have it spelled out in the constitution that you have a right to privacy, and a bunch of other laws covering this topic, and countless rulings by the supreme court that set legal precedent in the topic of the case ruled on at that time, and any and all future case covering that same circumstance.

Here is my source, read it, understand it, seriously. If you don't know diddly about contractual law why in the world have any of you entered into contracts? Why do you think you have to be 18 and of sound mental status to enter a contract? It is so you understand contractual law as it is currently written and accepted. I seriously implore the lot of you to read more about your rights. Not trying to sound like a jack ass, but you owe it to yourself to understand your rights, and the agreements you enter into.

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/business/contract_law.html
[HTC EVO 3D] Droid-o-matic:
Please note my responses in red above. With regards to the first line of your response please try to keep it from getting personal. This is a great discussion and something that needs to be addressed in these electronic times of ours. You present an interesting argument and deserves further exploration. I haven't taken the time yet to review the website you linked to yet but since you took the time to find it it warrants the time it takes to review it. So I will and hope others do the same.

Meanwhile, as we discuss this further, what is the next step? The data continues to be collected at this point, legal or not. What do we do right now? Or, is there nothing to do right now? Personally I don't know. I'm not changing my habits any. Should I?

I feel like we hijacked the thread a bit here. I apologize if I have helped perpetuate that.
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
No worries I'm not at all offended by what your said, specially since you made a specific point to make sure I didn't take it personally. And the fact that you questioned what you were told is a good thing, everyone should. I cited a reliable source to back up what I was saying, and there are lots out there.

I'm absolutely positive what I said is true. You definitely could use this as a means to cancel your contract legally. Unfortunately though the carrier is still going to consider it early termination, and charge you. If you went to court I am positive it would be ruled unenforceable. The legal fees alone would make fighting it not cost effective, and time consuming which is why people don't fight things and just bend over to the will of the carrier. But yes definitely means the contract is LEGALLY void, the carrier will still try fighting you on that fact almost guaranteed, though.

I did read my contract, which is how I know it doesn't get specific enough in the terms.

Well there I have to respectfully disagree that people don't know enough rudimentary facts about contracts to get by. The contract you sign to get mobile service is complicated enough for someone to need to learn more about their rights. Another example I can think of is the rental or purchase of a home or dwelling. Everyone has to sign some contract for that agreement unless they are homeless. Millions of people signed contracts before reading them, which aided in the down turn of the economy. So my point is that yes maybe people have a very basic, and fundamental understanding of a contract but millions enter into them without taking responsibility and reading or understanding them. If you don't read or understand a contract it is a very bad idea to agree to the terms anyway.

The next step? There isn't anything we can do except continue to help Trevor spread the word. Even if people are not tech savvy this is serious enough to anger the entire population, so spreading the news articles via social networking, and any other avenue will be advantageous to the cause. Beyond getting involved in the class action law suits, spreading the word, remove as much as you can of the software, I think it is a wait and see type deal.
[HTC EVO 3D] sgt. slaughter:
http://vulnfactory.org/blog/2011/12/05/carrieriq-the-real-story/

interesting mroe stuff from Dan here...
[HTC EVO 3D] Sad Panda:
Thanks for the contribution, an interesting read. I'm not any less concerned by what he found, and I am still pissed. As stated in the article; no opt out options, verbose collection, possible ability for a third party to intercept data and use that or the access given to the application for nefarious purposes.
[HTC EVO 3D] SketchyStunts:
still pissed also. grrrrrrr
[HTC EVO 3D] solver404:
This just came up on my Slashdot feed.
[HTC EVO 3D] willy900wonka:
Here's a thread which links to the FBI's letter.

http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1388897
[HTC EVO 3D] il Duce:
O_o

/puts on tinfoil cone helmet, hides in closet...
[AT&T Samsung Galaxy S II Skyrocket SGH-I727] horton heat:
Has anyone cut their lte sim down to micro size? I know it's easy to do with the older sims. I'm going to upgrade to a skyrocket tomorrow and plan on keeping my iphone 4 as a backup. I will also use it for running since I already have an armband and earbuds with controls. I'd like to be able to put my sim in the iphone so I can use data for apps like runkepper. I don't want to use to my old sim since it's not lte. I've searched all over this site and others and I've read people suggesting this as a solution to this problem but I've yet to see the results.
[AT&T Samsung Galaxy S II Skyrocket SGH-I727] topprospect:
Hey Horton,

I have your exact scenario. I used a sim cutter to turn my Skyrocket sim into a micro sim. Works just fine swapping back and forth between the Skyrocket and my iPhone 4.

Visual voicemail does not work on the iPhone 4, however.
[AT&T Samsung Galaxy S II Skyrocket SGH-I727] horton heat:
Thanks for the reply! Is there anyway possible to check your voicemail with the iphone?
[AT&T Samsung Galaxy S II Skyrocket SGH-I727] jslanger:
If you look under Settings>>Calls>>Call Forwarding, it should list the number for voicemail. If you call it, it'll give you traditional access to voicemail.
[AT&T Samsung Galaxy S II Skyrocket SGH-I727] horton heat:
Thank you jslanger!
[AT&T Samsung Galaxy S II Skyrocket SGH-I727] Phoneguy589:
I cut a small piece of cardboard to fit the micro sim spot, took my sons sim cardfrom his samsung impression and used a utility knife to cut the card down to the exact size. He's got my iphone 4 with no issues from the sut down simm
[HTC Desire S] tcccy:
I'm looking for an app that's similar to music 3d on ios. Which is used for editing the pitch and speed of the playing music.
[Kindle Fire Accessories] fleton:
There is a HTC Flyer sleeve at amazon, 5.99, fits the kindle fire nice and snug, if your looking for a sleeve I would recommend it and put your two day free shipping you get with your kindle fire to good use. I really enjoy it, the cable tie is kinda weird addition but doesn't hurt since its free lol.

Cosmos Neoprene 7" 7 inch Black color Tablet case/bag/sleeve for HTC Flyer EVO View 4G+ Cosmos cable tie
[Kindle Fire Accessories] chaose:
I bought a luxmo kindle fire sleeve for the fire from amazon for 15 after shipping. it feels pretty nice and solid. I'd recommend it

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0069F1VJO/ref=ox_ya_os_product
[Kindle Fire Accessories] hariustrk:
I have the same sleeve in black. Got it on ebay for $5. My only beef is the textured part is not "tacky".
[Kindle Fire Accessories] munit85:
Added this to my christmas list. I was thinking today that I want a sleeve, just like I have for my laptop.

thanks
[Kindle Fire Accessories] uncola:
I ordered one of these. I'll give a quick review when it gets here about fit etc