yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Windows Phone 7 General] JVH3:
Not sure on the blame.

Initial thought is Microsoft for keeping everything so locked. When it was first released, it wasn't ready. I wasn't around for the NoDo update, but from what I read that went badly.

Maybe they should have gone 1 more year with Windows Mobile and had Mango be the initial release. People then would have had a much better impression of the platform. That would have driven demand, which would have led manufacturers to produce the phones.

Another option would be for Microsoft to be less restrictive on hardware. So that any phone currently running Android could have Windows Phone 7 instead. This assumes driver development by the manufacturers.

It would be similar to ordering a PC with Windows on it or Linux.

Finding the blame isn't going to fix it though. Really hoping for Nokia to bring a variety of devices to the game as the solution. Along with some higher end devices.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
I still think the whole thing is not so complicated. There are three sides to the equation here:

1. The OEMs

2. The Carriers

3. The Consumer

Ultimately, the OEMs want to make phones that will be popular. The carriers want to carry popular phones to lure people into their service. And the consumer is the entity that depending on a whole variety of reasons will decide to choose a particular phone.

Android has a 3 year headstart on Windows Phone. Android provided the consumer with something that Apple has not - choice. It has always baffled me that Apple has been so successful with this lack-of-options one-size-fits-all approach to all their products besides the MP3 player (which I believe they had no choice but to do). But that is for another discussion. Android is popular, and it does the job for most people as convergent device. People want a phone that can also play multimedia, email, surf, take pictures, and install apps/games.

What compelling reason is there right now for a consumer to pick a Windows Phone? What compelling reason is there right now for carriers to push Windows Phone? or the Sales Reps? The smartphone market is growing, but it is saturated. Just look at Rim. Or on the catastrophic side of the scale, Palm.

Microsoft needs to do more advertising. Superbowl ads. Incentivise retailers to push the phones. And ultimately it is not a 100m dash; this is a marathon. They will need to be in it for the longhaul. But the one trump card that I do not hear anyone mentioning is Windows 8 and Metro look coming to the PC/Tablet world.
[Windows Phone 7 General] feygor:
I have to agree with you here, I'm disappointed with the fact that my HTC WP7 has no decent handsfree kits. I inquired about this once and I got the answer 'we are a hardware manufacturer, not a headphones manufacturer, we don't specialise in making headphones, but the 3.5mm jack will fit any headphone.' I want a decent handsfree kit. And don't even start with the 'beats' nonsense, not sure about in America, but in the UK they have a bit of a reputation for putting a £100 price tag on £20 headphones.

I'm really not that bothered about FFC, I had an early video phone, I've only ever made one video call. I know many people use them for many reasons, but I really wouldn't be sold on any phone for a feature i'd never use, and FFC is not something I could ever get use out of (maybe this is because in the North East you don't get 3G signal, yes we are stuck in the dark ages with GPRS at best!). For the same reason mentioned in brackets, 4G would be useless for me as well.

But we need accessories for the phones!
[Windows Phone 7 General] ohgood:
1) $99 and no sale, for smart phones = something is wrong, bad wrong

2) yep. there still are no sales numbers from microsoft. there is no way to know of 5 or 5 million phones have sold. shame really.

3) i think you're mistaken here. i see quite a few phones with broken keyboards, and year or so old models. they may -want- a new one, but they aren't all buying them. (I haven't seen a wp in college/similar in 3 months now).

4) it's pretty slick, but the slick impression will fade when a friend wants you to share a picture, or song, or entire sdcard full of porn.

5) business users are not qualified to handle android, but can do all the hacks required to get exchange working, and are willing to upload all their files to shared services before opening them ? also, where is the ease of use ? document on computer needs to be on phone, and editable - on phone. how easy is that ?

6) agreed. the more phones the better. from what my friend in eu are telling me, they need phones with:

ffc

nfc

swappable sdcards

big screens

....like yesterday
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
Let's be honest. Microsoft had the biggest head start. No way around that. They've been doing mobile phones for 10+ years! It was just another launch for them. They always offered a choice in devices.

Last year Superbowl was actually sponsored by Windows Phone. Didn't notice huh? They also sponsored a lot of basketball games too.

People are mentioning Windows 8, but it is yet another waiting game. Wait wait wait....wait.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
I did notice that one of the sponsors of last year's superbowl was Microsoft. But that was probably lost on other viewers. They want to see funny commercials with talking babies, and pets doing stunts.

Wait wait wait is your newest criticism. People are mentioning ICS but it is another waiting game. iPhone 5? Waiting game. What you are failing to even mention is what exactly are you waiting for?

I want an Apple phone that has a screen bigger than 3.5" now! They told me I would get one this year! :mad: :mad: :mad: *nerd rage*

You are just being difficult. Some people are using Windows Phones now and are not waiting for anything. I waited until I could get some apps that I considered essential. Windows Phone Mango will fulfill my needs and I do not need to wait on Tango / Apollo / or any other iteration. If you need to wait then that is your position based on your needs.

But there is no question Windows Phone will get better with time. That has been the case with Android and iOS as well. It is this funny thing called progress that takes time.

Edit:

I forgot to comment on the 10+ years in the game. I learned from N8ter that was the foundation of Windows Phone. But the iPhone changed everything. There were rumours that Google was working on a BB-like OS but scrapped it opting to do an iOS type of OS due to the success of the iPhone. No idea if it is true or not, but the years of experience RIM had with BB is not helping them either. You make it sound like this problem is isolated to Microsoft.

WinMo and BB OS are both older than iOS and Android.

The OS now known as iOS came along and changed the game.

Android rode the success of the new market.

Microsoft and Rim had two options. Stay the course, or follow the trend. Microsoft chose to reboot and you hate them for it. No one in here ever mentions how much Rim screwed up by failing to follow the trend. Losing all the work MS and developers like yourself built over those years was a necessary consequence of rebuilding to try to be relevant. You can hate them for it, but I rather be MS with less market share than the mess Rim has on its hands right now with irate shareholders.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
I see what you're saying. However I'm not waiting on anything. People don't buy phones for what it can potentially do. Its just in this particular forum where people always scream 'just wait until..".

The thing is, that is ok MS rebooted. Nothing wrong with that, but don't come with that new OS crap. The look may be new but that's it. They have over a decade of experience.

You must haven't read any business news. Investors have been demanding Ballmer to be removed.

You look at rim as failing, but they sold more phones last quarter than WP7 did in a entire year. Dont be bias.
[Windows Phone 7 General] PG2G:
It's part of being an early adopter, some of us have realized this and some of us haven't. You have to wait for the OS to grow in capabilities, you have to wait to get all of the apps you want. It's how things work. If people aren't ready to do some degree of waiting then they shouldn't have jumped into a new platform.

You act like iOS and Android are clean slates. iOS is based on BSD and Android is based on Linux, just like Windows Phone is based on CE 6.5.

So did Symbian, you don't see that as failing? Look at the trend, not the numbers.
[Windows Phone 7 General] nicksti:
The few do not define the many. Buy the phone you need now for the features it has now. Or wait. Do not buy a phone now if it cannot do what you want it to do now, and do not wait if you need a phone now. That is sound advice.

They have a decade of experience and it shows. Windows Phone is a solid OS with a, dare I say, revolutionary UI when compared iOS and Android. So that is where the years of experience comes in. But that does not mean after a reboot they will immediately be where Android or iOS is. It takes time.

And RIM is under much more scrutiny as a company than Ballmer. By far.

And I admitted RIM's marketshare bigger than that of Windows Phone. I bet you could buy shares in either BB OS or Windows Phone you would choose Windows Phone as well.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MartyLK:
I pondered the idea of Apple releasing a new iPhone that, if times got tough for Apple, they would release with a much desired 4.3" Retina display. Then I thought, it really wouldn't appeal much to me because I'm so pleased with WP7. It's all the mobile OS I care for. Anything else seems a waste because WP7 is so nice. I find myself using it for portable gaming all the time, so gaming on the others isn't a concern. It provides all the functionality I need.

There just is no point, for me, to consider anything else when I am fully content with what I have in WP7...until the Focus S arrives. :)
[Windows Phone 7 General] dotcompt:
WP7 is a kind of fresh air in the mobile world, a different approach with easy-to-use interface focused in integration of features and social network. Its fast, clean, intuitive, full of people-centric features with memory management like no other OS. Overall is has unbeatable perfomance.

Metro UI it is not just a app launcher, it has live tiles and not that sea of the same old and boring icons. The touch responsiveness is awesome and the short transitions between applications is the best experience I ever had.

The WP7 keyboard is clean , the mail experience is solid, IE9 is fast, the Office integration make WP7 impossible to ignore for serious business users, terrific Zune and Xbox Live integration with beautiful and useful user interface. All of these features are as simple and clean as the rest of the OS.

A kid can use it, a grown up can use it, a elderly can use it.

WP7 its still a work in progress and yes there is a lot of features missing but since it is just one year old, you can wait and live without it. The most important is that what we have now does not break, crash or lag. It works perfectly and smooth. Bottom line, you love it or you hate it.

In my case, I Love Windows Phone.
[Windows Phone 7 General] JohnMcD348:
That is what I truly think is one of the biggest drawbacks for this phone and form factor. When the specs first were published a few years back on this new version, I had the impression it was going to be a near toe to toe competitor with iPhone. That would allow other businesses to develop and market accessories and other items for the end user much like the iPod/iPhone has. HTC makes the phone I have, an Arrive, and there's even a Docking mode program for it. Problem is, there's no Docking station available for it. I haven't seen much of any kind of aftermarket accessories available for this or other WP7 phones. Even with all the different makes/models of Droid phones out there, there is still some after market support for them.

When I use my phone in the garage to listen to music, podcast, streaming radio, I have it plugged into a wall outlet using my wife's Palm wall wart and a pair of 20 year old Sony powered portable speakers I used with my Walkman back then. A Docking station would be nice.

My wife is getting a iPhone in a few weeks and has already bought a docking station for it to use as her new bedside clock radio. How great is that. She doesn't even have the phone yet and is already buying accessories for it.
[Windows Phone 7 General] grifter024:
I agree with most in here that the sales rep are very bad at selling phones.

Went into a Tmo store to check out the HD7...what do you know I actually had a hard time finding it in the sea of Droid phones. There was only 1 WinMO phone and that was the HD7.

When I asked the girl how much the HD7 was the first thing out of her mouth was....

"You wouldnt want that...its glitchy."

Then I had another girl who had no idea what she was doing and made you wonder how she got the job.
[Windows Phone 7 General] anseio:
Some sales people just don't get it. Their job is to SELL, not tell you their personal flawed opinion... unless it helps the sale.

When she made the comment to you, she was actually insulting your intelligence and showing her lack of product knowledge. You expressed interest in a product and she directly challenged you and said that you're interest is wrong. Poor, poor sales skills. "Here, let me show you that phone..." How easy is that?
[Windows Phone 7 General] cobraboy85:
It infuriated you? Do you have stocks in Microsoft or something? Lol stop being a tool
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
As I stated, the waiting game. You can play it.

That makes no sense. You're referring to kernels and code. Android and IOS never had a previous OS. They never had a previous device. They're completely new. Windows Phone is a regurgitated OS, get over it. Windows mobile, windows phone 6.1, windows phone 6.5, windows phone 6.5.x, windows phone 7, windows phone 7.5. Do you get it?

Now you have Android 1, and IOS 1, what did they have before, what were their first versions?

Get over it

Who said it wasn't? You can name others that are failing.
[Windows Phone 7 General] PG2G:
Yes, it is the waiting game. Though, if everyone used some logic and understood why things are they way they are then perhaps the forum wouldn't be such a mess.
[Windows Phone 7 General] dkp1977:
It wouldn't even be such a mess if finally one of the several responsible mods would get their ass up and do something about it.
[Windows Phone 7 General] ohgood:
Maybe, just maybe, they've seen the writing on the wall for wp7, and decided to put their energy to better use ?
[Windows Phone 7 General] dkp1977:
Maybe, who knows? It's just sad to see what's happening here.
[Windows Phone 7 General] morpheuszg:
Yep it' getting rediculous. People are beginning to get personal and to be honest this forum is not really worth for Windows Phone anylonger. Even XDA is beginning to neglect WP or why is nearly every news on the first page about android? Maybe once a week there are news about WP, quite a pity.
[Windows Phone 7 General] pillsburydoughman:
Why does it need to be popular?
[Windows Phone 7 General] JohnMcD348:
I think Android is so much more popular here on this forum because now, it's probably the most hacked OS on the market. Similar to how WM was cooked, ripped, jabbed, stabbed, nuked, whatever with different variations and options and people jail breaking their phones and installing "pirate" ROMs of some form or version. That's the nature of this forum, from what little time I spend here. It's filled with people who like to tinker and customize. Maybe when/if WP OS's begin to get more hobbyist involvement in ROM redesign and development, the forums will pick up with something more than the usual;"Mine is Bigger than Yours!" threads out there.

There's an article out now stating the Android costs carriers the most in service calls and down time than any of the other OS's out there. I speculate it has to do with bricked phones and people using them more as toys now than phones. There's so many out there now available for free or near free with contract that people don't really see them as anything other than throw away devices.
[Windows Phone 7 General] lumpaywk:
This sort of thnk makes me angry to cos its not like they are giving real reasons. The HD7 is the least glitchy phone i have owned since the n958gb (a true great). I would understand at least if they used actual fats to sway ppl away. Shame on these folk.

Though i bet its diff with the lumia as nokia has been pretty strict on expected sales targets etc so they will be told to push it like the iphone but dont expect it to be marketed with windows lol tbh i dont remember seeing any ms branding on any photos i have seen.
[Windows Phone 7 General] SausageSlice:
The more popular it is, the more developers there will be and the more apps there will be and so on.
[Windows Phone 7 General] addicus:
Microsoft teases something big in NYC next Monday for Windows Phone

From what I can tell Microsoft really wanted a dedicated partner and Nokia seems to be that partner. They are picking up the advertising overseas (Europe) and it looks like they are starting off big in NYC also. http://www.wpcentral.com/microsoft-teases-something-big-nyc-next-monday-windows-phone

I'm not a big fan of the

current

Nokia form factors, but the quality of the hardware and screens seems high. I personally don't give a **** about all the android fan boys hating on WP7. It does what the average user needs and wants extremely well and the majority of these features are built into the phone. What this platform needs is positive publicity and if MS decides to do what they did with the XBox and throw $ at it until it succeeds than it will work.

Like someone above stated, this forum is for the tinkerers and out of the box developers. For all that Android is the best platform hands down. For those of us with extremely busy lives that need things to work I strongly believe we are going to drift towards the iPhone and WP7. Truth is my HD2 running WP7 is a more stable OS with more native features than my wife's G2X running Gingerbread. Her phone is consistently freezing, n

In all reality, Android wasn't a hit right out the box. iPhone fan boys clowned on Android for a good 2.5 years. Say what you want about market share but only 5-7% of the world has smart phones. There is plenty of room and time for Apple, Google, Microsoft or another company to come along and truly take over the way Microsoft has the PC market and Linux has the enterprise market. Look over the last 3 years and see how major players RIM, Symbian, WebOS, Palm, etc... have either declined or disappeared. This fight is just beginning and claiming victory at this point is really just premature ejaculation.
[Windows Phone 7 General] MikeyMike01:
I'm hoping that Nokia's entrance really puts WP7 over the hump. I love WP7 and all it needs to crush Android in every way is some more apps. Mango made this OS on par or better than the others, can't wait to see the next update that will push it further than the others.
[Windows Phone 7 General] addicus:
While not a fan, I don't really see Android getting crushed being a necessity or a reality. As a long time Windows Mobile user I understand the desire to push your handset to the edge and add the many options that are not included with the OS. While the similarities in the platforms have spawned the gigantic growth of Android here in XDA and other similar sites with Windows Mobile virtually dead, it turned me away because it was "been there and done that". I hate Apple and wanted more freedom and varied handset choices than what they provide. I finally dove into flashing Windows Phone on my HD2 when Mango became available and truth is I have never been so happy with a phone. There are things I would like to see improved, but not to the point that my disappointment leads me to vent and spew hatred on the platform every time someone says something positive like Vetvito. Truth is we all knew the 1st generation of WP was underwhelming and missing many capabilities we were all used to on other platforms. For people like him I say don't be an early adopter and then be pissed off. No one forced you to dive in early and patience is a virtue.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
^ What exactly was hatred? Quote it?
[Windows Phone 7 General] addicus:
Really every thread made on what people like on WP you come and tell everyone about it's weaknesses vs the other platforms or how we are not wise to deal with the shortcomings. Really by now - we know. I'm not saying all of your points are invalid, but they don't need to be said over and over. Truth is a lot of us actually like the way the system works and it's okay if you don't get to do everything Android does. Android has serious flaws also and many of them take the joy out of using it. Security flaws, widespread os upgrade fragmentation, Android Market set up (on credit cards, etc...) and the feeling that your new phone just went to **** and became old hat 3 weeks after buying it keep people looking elsewhere.

Truly your hate seems more for MS than it does for the OS. Also, while Windows Phone may based on some version of CE this definetely isn't Windows Mobile. There is a gigantic difference in functionality, stability, etc... You know this, but you put the weight on MS because they had the experience in the market. Well the flip side to being in the market for 10 years or so is the amount of business clients you have and how to ensure they can transition to the next phase. In this case, the success of the Iphone and Blackberry wiped that need away as Windows Mobile died.

Could they have been more "revolutionary"? Hell yeah. Would it have been a great game plan? Probably not. The success of the Iphone is proof you don't have to give the average joe every option in the world. The failures of Web OS show that without major price breaks people don't care about the ultimate completely new system. Windows Phone is a mature and encompassing system that has room to grow. Should it have come out like it did - no. Mango should have been the first installment of Windows Phone. That said, Mango is here and niiiiiiice.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
I stop reading after you said my hatred.

Nice troll attempt though.
[Windows Phone 7 General] LordLugard:
How far is Lincolnshire from High Wycombe? Looks like this store could do with some experienced job seekers....like me !!! :p :)
[Windows Phone 7 General] Packard Bell:
by far wp7 is the worst

reasons: (the ESSENTIALS only)

1-no file manager

2-can't download anything from the IE

3-only one multimedia(not so multi) player inside (zune player)

4-no avi mkv divx xvid mov and other format players

5-everything is uploaded to your windows live account whether you like it or not(it's true)
[Windows Phone 7 General] sayonical:
Did you just join xda to post that? LOL
[Windows Phone 7 General] DarkenCypher:
Go away troll
[Windows Phone 7 General] anseio:
1 - Neither does the iPhone, and non-rooted Android(?)

2 - Not a fully true statement. Only supported file types can be downloaded. Which types are supported and how few may be a better complaint.

3 - How many media players does the iPhone have?

4 - New OS - more important things to get up and running, IMO

5 - So not a true statement. There's a simple setting to stop the uploading of photos. Music is not uploaded, and contacts are uploaded to their respective accounts. I have to be connected to my LIVE account, but it's not the hub.

It's a shame that you came to this discussion with what seems to be no working knowledge of the product. If there a way to give negative Thanks, you'd be the second person on XDA that I'd want to do that for.
[Windows Phone 7 General] vetvito:
Let the thread die.
[Windows Phone 7 General] anseio:
empty post.
[Windows Phone 7 General] N8ter:
+1

Oh, and it's nice to know that if you jsut joined you aren't allowed to have an opinion.

Not that that crap actually is "essentials" but on forums most stuff is just an opinion. Stating yours is not trolling.