yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] jglm4u:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6QbAX_E3-k&feature=youtube_gdata_player is it kinda gonna look Like this lolz thats to much I wish it do hehehe...:)
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] 95Z28:
I use the app called autostarts from the market. When it comes to google maps though you still have to force stop it through settings/apps first. When I use the built in task killer with go launcher ex maps still restarts until I force stop it.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] CozzaFrenzyy:
good job raver this looks epic hands down!

miss my sgs4g!

might have to flash it on my dads lawz
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] VenpaCasa:
Wtf I flashed this on my cousin's phone and now its in a infinite loop and has random ****ed up colors and will not boot into recovery or anything.... Some one please help me out!

Sent from Venpa's awesome 3VO!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] FBis251:
Follow my GB starter pack guide. It's in my signature.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] VenpaCasa:
Thanks but I can't follow ur steps because I cannot boot the phone into anything. I.e. recovery, download mode, nothing.... Is it bricked?

Sent from Venpa's awesome 3VO!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] VenpaCasa:
Holding up down and power just boots up system 4g splash goes black and restarts.... Holding just up dlsame just down same.... Holding none it goes to splash then a screen with random colors den just black for a few mins then restarts again.....

Sent from Venpa's awesome 3VO!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] shdw03:
try battery pull, holf vol up/dwn/pwr then put back...or just vol dwn/pwr
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] VenpaCasa:
Nope didn't work.....

Sent from Venpa's awesome 3VO!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] FBis251:
By didn't work, what do you mean? Black screen, rainbow screen, other screen (describe)?

Try hooking it up to Odin anyway, if it lights up yellow you can flash.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] VenpaCasa:
By didn't work I mean it did the same exact thing I described above.... :( splash then black then splash den black.... When turned on without holding any buttons down it goes splash messed up rainbow screen then black then starts all over.....

Sent from Venpa's awesome 3VO!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] FBis251:
Sounds like you haven't followed the directions someone suggested.

Pull out the battery.

Pull out usb cable from the phone (leave the other end in the computer)

put the battery back in.

Hold down vol + and -, continue holding them.

Plug in usb cable

You should be in download mode. Let go of vol buttons.

Flash the roms from my guide.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] kaz050:
there are 4 or 5 ways too get in too download mode i swear my phone is meh.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] VenpaCasa:
I have done this the phone does not go into download mode..... Ill try again later I hope it works

Sent from Venpa's awesome 3VO!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] VenpaCasa:
hey man this worked thank you so much, i was so exhausted last night i was doing it wrong :-X but i am going to follow your guide now..... i thought i bricked my cousins phone....
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] makavelicruz:
Loving this rom. Yet again an outstanding job raver and team acid. Muchas gracias :-)
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] josepresas:
for those who havent flashed v2.0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmR_TbSCzvU&feature=youtube_gdata_player

:D
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] xolanir:
Thanks for sharing. Looks awesome. Power!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] tehgyb:
This explains a lot. I really like Valhalla, but this one takes the cake. Its got all the badassery of Valhalla with more juicy content imo
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
New Build And new screenshots :P

Newbuild uploading atm :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] tehgyb:
I'm shaking I'm anticipation. Flashing it when i get home from work!

Downloading now!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] jglm4u:
Hell yea !
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] jglm4u:
Downloanding:)
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] QUIETLYloud:
Flashed... got bootloop... went into recovery got errors

E:failed to open /etc/recovery/command.fstab (no such file or directory)... Plus more concerning mounts that won't, can not even get back to my backup

and help greatly appreciated
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] Tempott:
So been using the last version for a bit now, and the rom is really smooth. If anything, I only have one suggestion. Any chance you can make the numbers on the dial pad more visible. Maybe make them a solid color like white. Or maybe even a blue. I think any color rather than the grey would make the numbers more visible. They are really hard to see in regular daylight. I don't mean lots of sunlight, just regular daytime light. Of course, one could argue, no need to see the numbers since we all know where they are. But I do think it would give the dial pad a more solid look and feel. In any case, your work is solid and much appreciated.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] spy4ka:
Awesome ROM c-c-c-combo :D
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
the dialer is going to be changed to the ics dialer :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] neotoky:
does this have crt on/off and power menu options? thanks
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] QUIETLYloud:
did anyone get this up and running yet?

Raver... what should be the size of the file?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] jazzmanmonty:
i did! its an amazing improvement!!!!!! only gripe i have with ics launcher, is that the shortcuts on the bottom (where you'd have phone, web, etc) don't stay constant as you switch pages. but all in all pretty damn awesome.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
yes it does sorry i didnt put that in the op just assumed everyone is used to having those lol :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] ptaylor09:
Srry if this has been asked alot, knew to this forum but if coming from your 2.0 should I full wipe or just delvik and cache wipe?

EDIT. nevermind, read op again. Thanks for the amazing rom. And just wondering is there any way to I'm prove wifi signal? Cuz my g2 sits at 2 bars but this galaxy goes from no signal to one bar to no signal, just off n on? Same room same spot. Maybe add something in buidprop?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
sence there the same roms and not from one to a diffrent rom you are free to just not wipe :P if u have any issues tho u may have to factory reset :P also note dont forget to clear your caches and once booted clear the market cache if your updateing u shouldnt have to clear your launcher cache...
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] ptaylor09:
Okay. Thanks.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
i woudlnt lie when i say its fast lol....
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] Juls317:
Of course this releases right after i finish calibrating my battery. No tell me if im wrong but couldnt i just copy the battery stats file that i have now and paste it into the new rom so i wouldnt have to calibrate again?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
if u just calb just flash :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] jcjackjay:
i have a request: do you think u can provide the ROM without the themed stuff? like just a plain GB Rom with all the tweaks and fixes.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
i guess i could possably
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] daxecutioner24:
You could just mess with uot kitchen to your own liking!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] daxecutioner24:
Is there a ji3 kernel?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
not rooted
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] Tempott:
Great Rom. Only two things that don't work for me.

1) When opening music from the dock lancher, it gives a force close. It's the only

one in the "running apps" list that will force close when trying to launch it.

2) Setting 480x800 Wallpaper does not work. It Zooms in when choosing it.

960x800 Works fine of course. But for those that like 480x800 to stop the

wallpaper scrolling, you out of luck. Not a real biggie though.

So far so good though. Thanks for the great work!

Any chance we can install touchwiz over this. I'm a big fan of the stock look. I was running ICBINB until I ran into SMS issues.

Thanks Again!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
you can install any launcher u want

dock launcher works for me
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] DjTrippZ:
Very nice work Raver, very glad to have you with SGS4G
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] bkoon1218:
This ROM looks really good! Btw, isn't it supposed to be "Octane"? :P

Will this be getting the toggle menu like in Valhalla?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
ya ya i know my spelling sucks lol cant do **** about it now lol...

and not unless a i port quick toggles myself or whitehawk lets me use his build to build off of :P i asked i dont khang :P **** so but im going to try to see if i can do the tabs like another rom we wont mention names of lol god i hate that thing...
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
thanks mate
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] QUIETLYloud:
Lol... I push a Audi also
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] j3.cole:
Nice! I love mine
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
thanks for reminding me i drive a ****ty ass 94 ranger xlt stick lol
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] j3.cole:
This is a trip.. I flashed it and the Phone and Data were jacked up. Kept dropping my calls. So I flashed another Rom, same thing.

After the issue, this is what I did:

1. Disabled Voodoo and turned off system lag fix

2. Wiped factory - then data cache and dalvik.

3. Formatted data

4. Wiped again

5. Flashed ROM

6. Enabled Voodoo and start system lag fix

7. Rebooted

8. Let it sit for atleast 5 minutes.

9. No Data

I went into the settings to search for a network... Nada

Next:

1. I accessed other setting

*#*#4636#*#*

2. Chose WCDMA Preferred

3. Turned off radio

4. turned on radio

Then:

1. Back to regular settings - Wireless - Mobile Networks

2. Changed network mode to WCDMA Only

3. Searched for networks

4. Chose T-Mobile

5. Select Automaticly

Lost Data Again.

Went back to *#*#4636#*#*

1. Turned off radio

2. turned on radio

Still Nothing Data Off , Not Registered on any Network bars with an x. :(

Any ideas?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
factory reset in the phone
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] jglm4u:
Kinda missing 5.1 :(
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] JAWheat411:
Installed today's update. Seems to be a lot smoother. No more lag and launcher redraws. It also took a little while for the screen to show icons before. Not as bad now.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] punjabi_xtasy:
Raver I have a question about the audio over anything else...i know i have asked this before, but just to clarify ONE MORE TIME,

is the audio in ALL your new roms the SAME if not better than the audio you used for the Audiophile Series: Redux rom and the one for the BSGS4g rom?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
slighlty better actually lol :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
thats usual while the davilk cache builds :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] alien001:
Does Voodoo need to be disabled before flashing?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] punjabi_xtasy:
GREATTTT!!! flashing RIGHT NOW!!

ps. you did mean the audio for the music and what not right? lol
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] BRICK0044:
Love the rom, but it only fills 2/3 of the screen. any thoughts?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] spy4ka:
What do you mean?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] BRICK0044:
after flashing the home screen only fills 2/3 of the screen, the far right just has the background
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] punjabi_xtasy:
can someone tell me how to do the long life battery thing again...whats the process i mean??

am i supposed to change some kind of settings? am i supposed to let it run for couple of days till it runs out..what am i supposed to do EXACTLY?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] iHelper:
1) Download battery calibration from the market

2) Wait till ur battery is 100% charged

3) Open battery calibration and click the "battery calibration" button

4) Give it like 4 days to soak in and then u'll notice the insane battery life :)

-Sent From My Amazing Galaxy S 4G-
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] punjabi_xtasy:
^^^ thanks i will do that later tonite

another question:

I love the rom and was able to get the lockscreen everything to work, but I had the BSGS4g rom installed before and it had that EDT or w.e lock screen, now everytime i lock my phone, its fine the screen shuts off and everything, but when i turn hit the button to unlock it on the side of the phone, i see for a SLIGHT second the old lockscreen, how do i get that to stop, do i unistall the EDT tweaks app?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] BRICK0044:
actually it is only the super clock widget that is miss sized, will figure it out later. Thanks
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] punjabi_xtasy:
also related to lock screen, how do i make one of my options to unlock to change from camera to music player etc etc.

is there a way for me to have the music player option as was in the EDT tweaks lockscreen?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
not atm

im going to decompile that lockscreen

then add it with the ability to change things ;P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] BRICK0044:
ok my home page has room for 5 icons not 4 and the weather widget I have is to small is there a setting to change
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
put your widgit on it long press it and resize it :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] BRICK0044:
Thank you that worked for me
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] sunsurfer42:
Best ROM ever!

Thanks Raver, this is the best ROM that i have ever used!!!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] lphillips80:
buttons

Is there a way to get rid of the buttons that you put into the ics version? It's kinda redundant don't you think? But i have to say i love the font you used.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
the buttons at the bottem are alas sutck there as the nexus doesnt have hardware keys
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] xolanir:
So would you say this is 100% ready or is it close. I'm itching to flash (not in a pervy way...lol), but I'm just waiting till you get everything done before I plunge LIKE A BOSS.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] punjabi_xtasy:
Regarding calibrating your battery,

I downloaded the app I was told "battery calibration" and charged my phone to 100% followed the instructions on the app.

now my question(s) is/are:

1.) How do you know if the program is doing its thing? is it working in the background or how does it the process really work?

2.) I charged it about an hour ago MAX, and used my phone for basically downloading one or two things from the market, played one song (4 minutes long), searched two things on the network, and watched half a video on youtube and my battery is 80%, is this normal as of NOW, and will it get better once the battery is calibrated?

3.) lastly, If i opened the "battery calibration" app just to see what it says does that reset my whole process or anything?

thanks for any kind of feedback! :)
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
it wipes your batterys status eg your old battery status

your old battery could have very well reported it full when in fact it was not fully charged... drain it to 0 let it charge up and let it drain again so on so forth you will get better results over time :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] tehgyb:
I know quads dont mean much, but check this out... lolll

Update is pretty nice man, it feels great!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] poopypoo13:
You have out done yourself this time raver!

So excite!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] rickyy00:
#1 developer for sgs4g

Congrats
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
lol what???? thanks.....
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] tehgyb:
I think he's saying you're the best bro, lol
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] kaz050:
awww i gotta reflash again o.o
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] bhundven:
This rom makes me want full ics even more.

Kick ass rom, raver & co!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
once i find a dump of it (provided samsng doesnt give u guys one as you are in the 18 month window).. Ill look into porting the full rom to this device...
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] shdw03:
whats this magiclocker?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] kaz050:
so i just flash v2 like a normal rom.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] Jerry D:
I just freeze Google Maps using Titanium Backup and when I need it I defrost it.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] onyx1898:
2.0 is amazingly fast and smooth and NO REDRAWS!!!! (little excited about that)

can't wait for the final version.

Great work!!!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] rickyy00:
Lol exactly
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] steeleain:
You are truly talented Raver. Thanks man. Running fast and smooth. Beautiful rom bro ;)
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] wizardslovak:
I had same think.....just removed lockscreen with titanium.....
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] bhundven:
Actually, I do have one problem with this rom (build from yesterday, the 23rd).

After moving to this rom and doing a full wipe, I tried to install xda premium and the market says "Your device is not compatible with this item".
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] onyx1898:
Its compatible... Using it now. i dont know if you use titanium, but try to restore vs. New instal from market...

Hope it helps
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
I will be flashing this ROM tonight. I've been stock rooted for a while and got the urge to start tinkering. I'm suing you if I brick my phone :p
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] onlyonthursday:
Can't seem to change the wallpaper..... I don't know if its just me being retarded but it's now letting me....

Edit: I tried to turn the wallpaper hack off and applied the settings and now I don't have a launcher O_O

Edit2: NVM fixed it haha
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] bhundven:
I think it the 'new install from market' issue.

I tend to bounce around between roms (and back and forth between froyo and gb). I think my longest run on one rom was 4 days.

I was on Bionix - Black Ice (stable) prior to installing this rom. So if I restore from my backup, I'm sure thing will go bad. ;)
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
clear market cache
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] David1239:
I am running this rom, but my quaddrant scores are only around the 2000's. I have never, ever gotten a quad above 2100.My games like nova 2 are pretty laggy. I tried a full wipe and even redid fb starter pack. I also tried reformating my sd. My sd has many partitions on it. Could that be the problem? What can i do?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] bhundven:
Hmm. I tried that, and then tried clearing data for market as well.

Then I tried a full wipe of data/cache/dalvik (bake for 20min after bootup), then went straight to market to install xda and got the same thing.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
odd consideirng i put the stock market back in it lol.....hit force stop clear data and try that also reboot the device once....
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
how many parttions does ur sd card have on it? NOrmally it shouldnt cause a issue and are u sure you have ext 4 enabled? If u dont know how to check u can download the vodoo app from the market and look... NOt that having it off would make your game lagg... Also try re downloading the app from the market see if that helps
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] digitallure:
Slick ass rom dude
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] bhundven:
idkwtf happened there. Wiped everything, reinstalled the rom, got xda-premium back. Thanks again!
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] silverspoon80:
+2.

flashed over the pervious build with /data intact; install was buttery smooth w/ no issues.

shout-outs to raver for this daily driven s!ut ;)
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] shdw03:
Love the look....love the font. Having some small issue with blackscreen when pushing home button, or comming from lock. Not everytime, but takes like 15 sec to go.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
So I followed this guide CLICKY and now I'm stuck in the red CwM Voodoo Lagfix Recovery screen. Every time I reboot, it won't boot into anything. I followed everything to a tee. Any ideas?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] hechoen:
What step are you getting this on? I would say try flashing a ROM and see.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
I made it all the way to the end where I click install busybox.zip in cwm and it does its thing. Am I flashing the ROM wrong?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
why would u have to flash busybox in cwm? Ummm just flash the rom so long as you have the gb bootloaders your fine..... you dont need it for ext 4 as the kernel and rom are prerooted and will convert for you.....
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
I didn't see anything in the tutorial on installing the bootloaders. Was I supposed to have those before I started the process? Or can I flash them on using ODIN? Where do I get them from? Once again, I'm sorry for such low level questions.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
ill make it even simpler

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/40595761/1 click bootloader debrick.zip

run that from ur pc while phone is in dl mode :P it will reflash ur device with the gb bootloaders :P once u have that just flash the rom :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
I will do that right now. I'll get back to you in a minute. You are the man.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] hechoen:
You get the bootloaders from the KH2 odin in step 7. But since Raver stepped in I'll step out. Thanks Raver for all the work and still having time to answer peoples questions.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
Raver, thank you so much for your help. I'm going to play around with it but I got it to boot and everything. I'll check and make sure everything works well like calls and texts but it looks beautiful. I will be donating when I get paid in a week.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
ya my 1 click debrick will just hemdall the bootloaders for u so no need to odin roms just to flash 2 files :P well at least u got it working lol
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
Awesome work. Do I have to do anything special for battery conditioning or is it just the old let it die, charge it up thing?
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
wipe ur status :P u can get that off the market
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
Ok so one thing I can't figure out is how to get rid of the sounds when typing. I disabled the sounds in setting/sound/audible touch tone but i still get sound for every key when typing a text or anything else with the keyboard. I'm using better keyboard 8. IN the swype settings, there is a check box for tones when typing that is checked but it is greyed out and cannot be unchecked. Any ideas?

EDIT: Nevermind, it was a setting in better keyboard I missed. :D
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] coldcrush390:
thanks Raver!:D
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
Is bluetooth supposed to work in this build? I drive a stick shift so I bought a bluetooth so I can talk on the phone so it's important to me. All I get is turning on... and then nothing.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] RaverX3X:
blue tooth is fine did u pair it lol :P
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] ccalvo:
Beautiful ROM...favorite of all time but am having Bluetooth issues also. Already did factory reset, wiped, and fixed permissions. Bluetooth just hangs a while but never turns

on. I came from octaine 2.0 to 2.x 10/23...but did full wipe before flashing. Thanks :)
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] bhundven:
Try doing a full wipe and flash 2.x 10/23 again.

Worth a shot.
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] E-Thug_WannaBe:
Splash Screen Restarts

Hey guys,

Its been a while since I've been on the forums and I'm glad to see the huge kitchen for T959V Roms...

Well here's my issue.

I Loaded CWM with ODIN using http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1223765

After Loading the Rom, Linda starts and talks a bit then restarts.

I get to the Splash Screen with the Samsung Galaxy 4g, then it constantly restarts over and over again.

Can anyone help a noob? Thanks.

EDIT: So I've read up a bit more and I've been following these steps:

1. Flash Bootloader using Raver's UnBrick Heimdall

2. Flash Rom from .zip

3. Reboot

4. Bootloop (Samsung Galaxy S 4G Loops)

HELP :(
[Samsung Galaxy S (4G Model)] fishdonotbounce:
I can't get to the point where I'm pairing. It hangs up on turning on... after I click the checkbox and then never turns over.