yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[TouchPad Development] rwhitby:
http://testing.preware.org/ is a wiki page. If the instructions require more detail, then please add the detail *THERE* where it can be moderated for correctness and kept up to date.

Note that the instructions you have given in your post will now become obsolete the next time the feeds change, just like the instructions in the OP already have. And you also neglected to warn people about the risks and obligations if they come across your post in isolation. That is likely to cause problems down the road, which is why we have the rules to prevent that happening.

Please consider the impact of your actions on the developers (e.g. myself, unixPsycho and Codecrumb) of these kernels and the people who (as evidenced in this thread) may be getting in deeper than what they are prepared to handle without reading about the potential consequences of their actions.

It's very simple. If you want to use the alpha and beta feeds, then we expect that you follow the rules. If you don't want to follow the rules, then we expect that you do not use the feeds. Access to the feeds is not a right, there are obligations that come along with it, and people who use the feeds are expected to act in accordance with those obligations.

We encourage anyone who is prepared to be an effective alpha or beta tester to enable the feeds and help test these items. This is about people making informed and conscious choices to participate in alpha or beta testing. Anyone who makes that conscious choice with all the information in front of them, and who agrees to follow the rules, is very welcome to participate.

Update: Thank you for editing your post. It is very much appreciated.

-- Rod
[TouchPad Development] hutchy007:
I for one am very happy with your post mate, and i commend you :D

Whilst i do see the concerns of rwhitby, i have to be honest and admit that without alot of these step by step guides i wouldnt have been able to learn anything about computers or phones - so the compromise should be a step by step guide on the wiki page!

Not what i consider to be a condescending and alienating to learners comment.

For the record, i managed to bumble my way through it before the advice, it would have been a hell of alot easier if it had been posted on that wiki page though.....

or are we now in the process of only sharing help and info with those of who we deem worthy????
[TouchPad Development] thebadfrog:
Alpha and beta is for testing. They normally assume that those using them are not complete n00bs. They are also for reporting back to the dev. Most people just install these releases and then piss and moan when something doesn't work without actually providing any details on what doesn't work.

"HELP!!!!! I installed ________ alpha kernel and it randomly reboots. What will stop this?"
[TouchPad Development] goodelyfe:
has warthog been removed? i cant seem to find it when searching
[TouchPad Development] Colchiro:
Preware has changed. The OC kernels are now in the beta feeds and the alpha feeds probably aren't needed for anyone but developers. Testing Feeds - WebOS Internals
[TouchPad Development] rwhitby:
Indeed. We expect anyone who finds a missing clarification from the instructions, or who has additional detail that is not in the existing wiki page, to ADD IT TO THE WIKI PAGE. A wiki page is a community-maintained resource. If there is something missing, then please add it there rather than increasing entropy and obsolescence by duplicating the information elsewhere.

The whole point is to make sure that *ALL* the information is shared with anyone who makes a conscious decision to participate in the alpha and beta testing. Not *JUST* the information about how to enable it (which is freely and publicly shared with anyone who wishes to participate) but *ALSO* the warnings and rules that are associated with participating.

So please address your concern about sharing info to those folks who are only sharing *HALF* the info (the instructions) and not the most important part (the warnings and rules) that allow end-users to make an informed and conscious decision about whether they wish to be an effective alpha or beta tester.

Again, anyone is welcome to participate in the alpha and beta testing if they are aware of all the information, are willing to follow the rules, and make a conscious decision to do so. Note that these things are a function of attitude, not a function of skill or intelligence. Anyone can have the right attitude to be an effective alpha or beta tester. What we don't want are those people who are not intending to alpha or beta test the items in those feeds, but are simply using them as some sort of "early access" mechanism without understanding the risks and dangers associated with doing so.

-- Rod
[TouchPad Development] Cyber Akuma:
Lets see, according to them:

Well, this is pretty rude of them. I mean, first of all they made it far more complex with the whole method of having to uninstall preware and use a Linux-based CLI to use the beta kernels instead of just adding a feed, but they also have to act elite and refuse to help you if you don't know how to use Linux basically.

Yeah yeah yeah I know, beta testing, rules all that. I don't see why they can't have people just plain old agree to the risks and not hold them responsible for anything that happens like just about any previous device, EVER, that I have used which had unofficial beta software, kernels, or firmware available for it.
[TouchPad Development] rwhitby:
That is exactly what we do.

The issue is that people were distributing the feed URLs *WITHOUT* the associated risks and responsibilities, so the people installing the feeds never even saw the risks and never had a chance to make a conscious informed decision about whether they wanted to participate in the alpha or beta testing or see what the obligations associated with do so are.

Note that you do not need to know a single thing about Linux to enable the testing feeds. An attitude to carefully follow instructions is all that is required.

Also note that http://testing.preware.org/ is a wiki page, and you are encouraged to added clarity and details to it as required to make it more accessible to anyone who understands the risks and responsibilities of following the instructions contained within.

-- Rod
[TouchPad Development] uNiXpSyChO:
hmm. I should not hang out in the Android threads so much. I missed this informative thread. :)

I never knew my kernels couldnt overclock the 2nd core. Sounds like the same pissing and moaning going on in the EVO 3D threads. Maybe someone should take a look at what the userspace apps do before making comments :)
[TouchPad Development] rwhitby:
Indeed, there is a lot of misinformation in this forum about the kernels developed by yourself and the others on our team of WebOS Internals kernel developers.

I guess it's not surprising when the first post of this thread does not even *LINK* to the official WebOS Internals wiki page that you keep updated to document the experimental kernels ...

-- Rod
[TouchPad Development] GuileZ:
Now...how could I install the f4 phantom Kernel in my Touchpad ???
[TouchPad Development] TooSlo:
1. Go to HTTP://testing.preware.org

2. Read the wiki page

3. Follow directions on enabling the beta feed

4. Install kernel

5. Do happy dance
[TouchPad Development] rwhitby:
6. Donate to WebOS Internals http://donate.webos-internals.org and http://bit.ly/phd-ac

-- Rod
[TouchPad Development] largemansmay:
As a newb I can't tell if you are being sarcastic here or not. lol, if I am reading this right you are saying everyone is stupid and your kernel does overclock the second core?
[TouchPad Development] rwhitby:
All WebOS Internals TouchPad kernels (UberKernel, Warthog, and the PsychoKernel series) have always overclocked both cores.

Some people seem to want their car to idle at the traffic lights at 7000RPM ...

-- Rod
[TouchPad Development] uNiXpSyChO:
Adding to what rwhitby said, the OS (userspace) purposely turns off the 2nd core due to whatever algorithm it uses. Most people think the kernel was broken. It has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the kernel. But they didnt want to hear that. fine. They should get an iPad or a StarTac.

Now i'm getting pissing and moaning about battery life with 2 cores enabled fulltime. Lots of n00bs want their cake, eat it, and have hot chicks to go with it.
[TouchPad Development] drt054:
I have the F-15 O/C Kernel on my TP and profile set to Performance 1.836GHz.. On this setting the 1st core is always at 1.836Ghz and then when the 2nd core is needed it is at 1.836GHZ. Open up a bunch of apps including Govnah and then flip back to it. You will see both cores at 1.836 or whatever your setting is but then after apps like preware are finished loading the 2nd core will go back to 0. I haven't tried the full 1.9, just don't want to ruin the device before I get cm7 just in case... ;)
[TouchPad Development] largemansmay:
OK, can you guys verify if I have this right then. I have done some research and found your threads on http://forums.precentral.net for govnah and f15. After reading through those I came across this post from RWhitby:

"the (second) CPU goes offline to save battery. So the filesystem associated with the CPU goes bye-bye too."

So can you guys verify if I have this right? Basically the second core is only activated when needed to save battery life without effecting performance. But when the second core turns off, it will then disrupt the file system so that govnah does not report its speed at all. So even though govnah says it is not running, it will actually kick in up to an equal speed of cpu 1 if needed. Am I on the right track here?
[TouchPad Development] rwhitby:
When the second core is off, Govnah displays it correctly as 0 MHz.

When the second core is engaged due to system load, Govnah displays its instantaneous speed.

BTW, "filesystem" = /sys kernel control pseudo-files related to the parameters of that core, not anything related to a user filesystem.

-- Rod
[TouchPad Development] largemansmay:
Well it seems that no matter what I do the second core stays at 0, even if I open up a bunch of apps and run sunspider. So doesn't that mean that f15 shuts off the second core completely or that govnah is not properly displaying the second core?
[TouchPad Development] uNiXpSyChO:
First thing, you should always power off the TP when installing a custom kernel from stock. If everyone actually looked at the logs on the device they would see why things weren't working right, if they suspected problems. But apparently that doesn't matter. Any novice Linux user could log in to it and run a echo 1 > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu1/online, and see it magically come online. But that doesn't matter any more. :D

Second, F15 has been fulltime dual-core for a while now, you should upgrade and your complaints will go away. No option to disable it either. :)

I love how these threads get started all over the Internet to complain about something, but not go to the source.... and maybe even go to the source (developer) and give him hard

facts

on why something is broken, instead of saying "...it doesnt work, it's br0k3n, use XXX kernal...". I dont have time to scour the Net. the OP should have linked to the correct places.
[TouchPad Development] squeakyl:
roger roger, thanks!
[TouchPad Development] markdanielmiller:
ps - I can't find this alternate kernel anywheres. All that's available to me are UberKernel and the Palm Recovery Kernel :(

Help? I'm able to get it up to 1.51...but I'd REALLY like to kick her up to 1.7 (or even 1.9) and see how she hums! :D
[TouchPad Development] amirborna:
I just very detailed upgraded instructions. Try to redo it and see where you messed up.

If you can only get up to 1.51 , most likely you are not able to access the experimental feeds which means you may have done the pre.is.awesome part wrong. Try that part again. Make sure you have Govnah installed as well. Read the text instructions this time and see what happens.
[TouchPad Development] aim1126:
Update to 3.0.2
[TouchPad Development] markdanielmiller:
I do have the update to 3.0.2 already on there (that was the very first thing I did)...and I do have Gov'r as well (along with quite a few other Preware patches).
[TouchPad Development] markdanielmiller:
My guess as well is that I goofed up the pre.is.awesome part.

If I enter a feed incorrectly into the Feed Manager for Preware on my TouchPad...is there a way to delete the feed and re-enter it again?

If I mess up any part of a feed (such as a letter in the URL)...I can't seem to find a way to delete the goofed up feed.

ps - not sure if this helps to diagnose why I can't get the other kernel...but when I start up Preware...I get a MASSIVELY long error message that ends with:

ERROR: Command failed with return value 1: 'wget -- passive-ftp -q -P /tmp/ipkg-9W0wMO http://preware.is.awesome.com/Packages.gz'

:(

how can i "redo" the preware.is.awesome part?
[TouchPad Development] amirborna:
Go to your feeds, if it is there, try to delete it, then add it again and restart immediately.

It isn't preware.is.awesome now, it is (For anybody reading this thread, it still is preware.is.awesome when you add it, but when you add it, on the list of added feeds, it translates to the URL below)

ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-kernels/testing/3.0.2

Slide your finger across on the feed that is named "webos-kernels-testing" with the URL above, if you slide properly the delete option will come up. Delete it and re-add it properly. Then choose the disclaimer properly and restart your WebOS. The restart is crucial because then it won't convert the preware.is.awesome to the URL I posted above.

On yours, on the list it may even be under preware.is.awesome

basicly x.is.awesome.com is a URL shortening service. What it does is you can create anything under x , then link it to another URL.

So for example PREWARE.is.awesome.com leads you to ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-kernels/testing/3.0.2 , and I think what happens is if you don't restart immediately ANNNNNND after restarting hit UPDATE FEEDS , the PREWARE app doesn't take that translation and tries to look into the wrong URL...

--which seems to make sense in your case, as it is looking at literally preware.is.awesome for the feed where in fact after updating the feeds it should look at ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-kernels/testing/3.0.2

(just my theory, try it out and see whaht happens)
[TouchPad Development] markdanielmiller:
Okay - so (using your tips - thank you kindly for them :) ) I was able to gain access to the 2 additional Experimental Kernels (WarthogKernel & F15C Eagle)...but when I go to download & install "F15C Eagle", it errors out. I do already have UberKernel installed...and as such, am attempting to install "F15C Eagel" on to of UberKernel. Do I need to "Remove" UberKernel before I attempt to install "F15C Eagel"? If so - do I need to "Remove" UberKernel - then re-install the "Palm Kernel" (that's found under "Available Packages" > "Recovery") - and THEN install "F15C Eagle"?

Attached is a PDF of the contents of the error log that I got when I attempted to install "F15C Eagle" on top of UberKernel.

Any help you can offer is greatly appreciated! I'm SOOO close to 1.9!! :D
[TouchPad Development] Matt V:
I've followed this guide by the book and can only get mine to 1.7 GHz. On top of that, it shows nothing for Core 2.
[TouchPad Development] jstafford1:
I just uninstalled uberkernel and installed f15c eagle then rebooted and it worked fine for me.

end of line...
[TouchPad Development] Matt V:
Does it show 1.7 under both CPU's are just 1?
[TouchPad Development] markdanielmiller:
Trying that now.

Did you restart after you uninstalled UberKernel...or did you wait to restart until after you had installed F15C?

Thanks much!
[TouchPad Development] Matt V:
Well I have activity under CPU 2 after a restart but now I get nothing. I'm going to remove Govnah, restart and then re-install Govnah followed by another restart then install F15 and then final restart. I'll let you know in a few if it works.
[TouchPad Development] amirborna:
Yeah only 1 Kernel at a time. Restart after installing / removing. Everything I post here I gain from reading other places as well, I am as new to HP Touchpad / WebOS as anybody else.
[TouchPad Development] markdanielmiller:
So I waited to restart until after UberKernel finished uninstalling and F15C installed. Restarted...saw a bunch of Linux-y code fly by...things appeared to bootup normally...fired up Govnah...changed the "MAX FREQ" to 1.944"...an error message popped up that says:

"Unable to open /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu1/cpufreq/scaling_governor"

...with an "Ok" button below it...but now my TouchPad is completely frozen/locked up. I've tried holding down every button on the tablet...and nothing.

Anyone have any ideas? :confused:

(times like this makes me with the TouchPad had a removable battery :p )

Also - I just tried running webOS Doctor...but it stops at the

"Connect your device directly to your computer with your USB cable.

Do not remove the battery or disconnect your device during this process."

...screen. The "Next" button never become available (and yes...my TouchPad is connected to my laptop via USB...but nothing happens).

HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELP!!! Please? :)
[TouchPad Development] Matt V:
Did all that and still nothing. Going back to Uberkernel.
[TouchPad Development] amirborna:
From Ncinerate's post.

I wouldn't mess with the Governer's CPU scaling just yet...

And also the exact error message you are getting, try reading this

http://forums.precentral.net/webos-internals/289961-f15b-f15c-test-kernels-8.html#post3101459

More on recovery : http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/How_To_Recover
[TouchPad Development] markdanielmiller:
Yeah - I've tried bumping the upper CPU threshold up to 1.9 twice now...and both times my TP completely froze instantly. The only way I could get it to work again is to force a reboot (hold down the "Power" + "Front Button" together for about 15-20 seconds). Sooooo...yeah. It's nice to SEE 1.9Ghz as an option there. But I'm not going to touch it again until I see word on this thread that it's been tested THOROUGHLY and works GREAT!! :)

Does anyone know what the other "hot features" are for F15C Eagle kernel are? It says "Various tweaks" on the product description page for the kernel inside Preware...but doesn't really describe what those "Various tweaks" are :)

Thanks y'all! :D
[TouchPad Development] galupo:
I'm in the same boot you are only one core 1.7 ghz
[TouchPad Development] uberamd:
What do you mean it shows nothing for core 2? Are you saying that Core 1 will often peg at 1.7GHz and Core 2 sits at 0MHz? I've seen this on mine, but when I pulled up the graph for the CPU usage of Core 2 it did say that it hit up to 1.7GHz a few times.

My guess would be that there isn't anything going on at the moment you're looking at Govnah to take advantage of any CPU cycles in that second core. Mine often says 0MHz but the history graph that logs even when Govnah isn't focused says otherwise.
[TouchPad Development] largemansmay:
Honestly, I really appreciate what you and all the developers are doing. I'm not trying to sound like a d*ck or complainer or anything like that. I was just genuinely curious about the issue and how it was working. I know absolutely nothing about linux and to be honest I am a bit scared of trying to install beta feeds because of this...and from what I understand I would need to install alpha feeds to get F15 upgrades, which according to the wiki, I should CERTAINLY not do.

Also, how does the full time dual core effect the battery life? Does it hurt it too much?

And the reason I haven't looked at the logs on the device (if you haven't figured it out already) is because I have no idea how to do that nor did I even know there were logs that I could check. As I said, I am a complete newb and literally know nothing about any of this. Following the directions in the OP was about as far as my technical skills could take me, and even that took multiple tries.

And just to be sure, if I wanted to upgrade the kernel I would have to install beta feeds, right? I found these instructions on how to use novaterm but it seems pretty complicated for myself. http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Accessing_Linux_Using_Novaterm

On a side note are you saying that since I might not have powered off the TP when I installed the kernel it isn't working properly, or am I reading that wrong?

Also, on a side note, if I read the faq correctly in the link from f15 on my touchpad, once f15 is stable it will be taken out of alpha testing and added to uberkernel? Is this correct? Is there a timeframe for this?
[TouchPad Development] uNiXpSyChO:
The battery life is obviously not as good since the OS (userspace powerd process) can't shut off the 2nd core anymore. I did this due to most people thinking just because they have 2 cores it should always be turned on and running. hence the case with the complaints and hacks on the EVO 3D as well.

Like with anything CLI, if you never had to use it, it can be overwhelming at first :). There are a bunch of threads for beginners around. Take a few uninterrupted hours and installed the Palm SDK and find novaterm. Unfortunately the kernel devel thread isnt the best place to ask how to install the SDK and may clutter the thread.

F15 may never leave the Alpha Feed. My current plan is to have stable features of F15 enter F4 kernel which is in the Beta Feed, then rwhitby can pick what features he wants to put into UberKernel from F4 since it's guaranteed to boot.
[TouchPad Development] largemansmay:
lol, I had to google CLI...I would imagine that you mean this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Command-line_interface

and not Mack-Cali Realty Corp, a publically traded company on the NYSE under the initials CLI
[TouchPad Development] rwhitby:
How are you intending to recover your device and data when the bleeding-edge experimental kernels you are using eventually wipe your device and cause it to be non-bootable?

If you continue to install things from the alpha feed, that *WILL* eventually happen.

It has happened before, and it will happen again, and the developers putting bleeding-edge packages into the alpha feed have no qualms about that (since the alpha-kernels feed is specifically there for the developers to find out the limits of stability of the experimental kernels).

It does seem that you have previously installed an alpha kernel from the old testing feeds without being aware of the dangers and obligations associated with doing so. That is the unfortunate result of threads where the raw instructions are posted without the corresponding warnings and obligations.

This is exactly the situation that the separate alpha and beta feeds addresses, cause it's fairly clear that you're now making an informed conscious decision to stay away from the alpha feeds (and for people who are not actively alpha testing something, that's the right decision to make).

-- Rod
[TouchPad Development] largemansmay:
So what do you suggest I do? Just uninstall it and install uberkernal? I don't plan on installing anything else from the alpha feed after reading the wiki. I don't even know how to activate the alpha feed even if I wanted to do so. So as a complete newb who wants an overclocked touchpad without the risk of bricking it or not being able to recover it, what do you think my next course of action should be? I am relatively safe with the old version of f15 as the complications come from updating, correct?