yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[HTC EVO 3D] SoraX64:
For the people saying that apps are stored in RAM.. what?

RAM is volatile memory, which means that when the power is turned off, everything on the RAM is wiped.

ROM is used as storage. For something to be used, it must go from storage to RAM; RAM provides a way to access the storage.

You don't use up RAM UNLESS you're actively using it. Running apps uses RAM. Downloading and installing apps DOES NOT.

This means that of the 4gb of ROM storage on the phone, we are only allocated 1gb of it. It may not make sense, but the 3gb that we don't get is used by the OS, Sense, and all of the preinstalled stuff.
[HTC EVO 3D] ickwonder:
Yup yup...
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
That's exactly right. I don't know what the hell the others were thinking. Especially since the Internal storage is larger than the 1GB of RAM they were talking about
[HTC EVO 3D] vulcZ:
I wonder if we get any of that back by uninstalling the bloatware :P
[HTC EVO 3D] Jye75:
You are not allocated 1GB of ROM to run apps. You are given 1GB of RAM to run apps. Yes, apps are stored in the eMMC internal storage (which is also NOT just ROM, but flash memory), but what the OP is complaining about is the 1GB of RAM, which is used to run the apps. The phone has 4GB of internal storage/ROM combined (which does not include the 1GB of RAM)
[HTC EVO 3D] SoraX64:
No, he was complaining about the lack of internal storage. When you install an app, you use up internal storage to keep it on your phone. Then when you run it, it consumes RAM as well.
[HTC EVO 3D] Jye75:
It would appear that the OP didn't know exactly WHAT he was complaining about, because he referred to only having 1GB to play with (which would be the RAM, NOT internal storage). I believe the correct question would be, without a doubt, is there 5GB total of memory (4 internal storage, 1 RAM) or 4GB total (of which 3 are internal storage, 1 allocated for RAM)? The specs are not specific enough to determine, unless I missed it somewhere.

*Edit: disregard, I just looked at everything on Mini Info. It shows 1.1GB internal memory and 1GB of RAM. My mistake, the OP WAS asking about the internal storage. But it still begs the question 4GB plus 1GB RAM or only 4GB total?
[HTC EVO 3D] ogrenator:
That's exactly right...basically the definition of ROM has changed of the years....flash memory is now considered ROM....the 4 gigs is absolutely internal storage and has nothing to do with running apps..the running apps/system impact RAM

either way we need to find out where all that space went and get some back!!!
[HTC EVO 3D] Jeremiah239:
Oh damn that epic dude!
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
He specifically mention that the rest is abused by htc. The reality a good chunk is likely set aside for updates.
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
um ok but if thats the case yall are saying theres 4gigs of storage plus 1gig of RAM ? meaning 5gig total in phone? That's definitely incorrect

The phone has 4gig total of memory, some for rom and some you can use (1gig,but really about 833meg of user usable space)
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
Ok, there is a 4gb eMMC. That is for storage. OS, system apps, Sense, etc... and then also the "Internal Storage". Then, there is 1gb of RAM. That is the memory that is used to actually run the system.

It's exactly like a regular computer. The eMMC is a "hard drive" and the RAM(memory) is volatile storage for the execution of the programs.
[HTC EVO 3D] aimbdd:
Did htc really need the 2.9 gb of the space for rom? I am curious to see how much of it is currently in use...
[HTC EVO 3D] williamjf77:
the cdma version has 4gb, the gsm 1gb, right?
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
Well, there is legitimate use of it.. but, I don't know if and why they need all of the 2.9GB. Obviously the OS needs space and it needs space to download and run the updates. That's a fairly big chunk, considering the RUU is 400mb.
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
A drop from 8GB to 7.5 is acceptable, not from 4 to 1GB. Thats 75%. You honestly don't think thats a tad retarded? You don't really have to be an engineer to figure that out.
[HTC EVO 3D] ScrapMaker:
I thought most of the people on this site were fairly technically-inclined :) Obviously the ROM in current devices is re-writable... we do it every time we flash. RAM is almost never used for long-term storage...
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
You might really want to reconsider your knowledge of "computer science" or lack thereof. RAM is random access memory, which is the essentially the memory available to the run time for application segmentation and execution. That is just the amount of memory the phone has available for the applications to use when they are loaded on the Operating System and are being used. It has nothing to do with persistent storage which is the 4GB internal storage that was advertised.

The official spec does not use 'ROM' anywhere its stated as --> 4GB eMMC / RAM 1GB. Which should be 4GB of Internal Storage and 1GB of RAM which is application execution space.
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
DITTO! No idea why people post BS here and mislead the entire thread. Also if I may, a slight correction here is that ROM can never be written to, so 4GB ROM is incorrect. Notice how HTC accurately states the spec as Internal Storage: 4GB eMMC NOT ROM.
[HTC EVO 3D] xoreactionzox:
The os shouldnt be 3gb theres no way so where else is the rest going
[HTC EVO 3D] fowenati:
I'm just curious what the hell is htc putting on that 2.9GB

Shot from my L96A1
[HTC EVO 3D] xoreactionzox:
Idk maybe they took the 2.9 and put 600 for rom or so and the other 2.3 they

Put a tracking device and a bomb so invase we try and return it for this bootloader crap lmao jk
[HTC EVO 3D] fowenati:
Could be anything.

Shot from my L96A1
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
always a smart ass

why are you even talking about RAM when i didnt mention it?

I know what ram is

are you telling me that ROM doesnt mean Read Only Memory?

how you trying to correct me on ROM but talking about eMMc?

I SAID ROM, not eMMC, PLEASE READ FIRST before you try to half sass

If i said you couldnt use anything in the eMMC THEN you might have a case but i didnt

furthermore you went on to explain some crap that still had nothing to do with the ROM i was talking about,stop rambling

on sprint website when you order the evo 3D its says "Memory

4GB ROM internal", not eMMC mr know it all

so go scream to sprint for using ROM and not eMMC

finally, your description of the phone mr know it all is saying that we have a total of 5 gig memory in the phone AND YOU SIR ARE DEAD WRONG,

no matter where you look in the phone, by the camera, under the battery, you will only find a total of 4 GIG in an EVO 3D,PERIOD. THE END

but i dont know about computers but you are load and wrong right?

please go sit down somewhere
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
And Sprint's website had it mislabeled. Also, ROM is not necessarily read-only, though not likely the best label for the eMMC of the Evo 3d. As for why you got singled out, probably because you were siding with the people that were misunderstanding RAM... whether that was 100% intended or not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Read-only_memory
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
sprint's website uses the word ROM

plus you guys are still saying theres 4gb eMMC + 1 gig ram which is WRONG
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
Try looking at HTC's specs..

http://www.htc.com/us/products/evo3d-sprint?view=1-1&sort=0#tech-specs
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
another smart ass

so now you telling me the history of computers has changed? ROM is now RAM and we can read and write to it?

I was talking about ROM

you guys are trying to correct me on how eMMc works when thats not what i was talking about. You trying to say ROM is exactly the same as eMMc?

how you not know about computers but try to correct somebody else on it?
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
people are NOT going to HTC to order

they order from SPRINT.COM, and there they see ROM

but looking at that page, it says

"4GB eMMC / RAM 1GB"

are you telling me you are reading that to be 5 gig total? seriously?

you've got to be kidding me

that means 4gig of eMMC, of which 1 gig of that can be used as ram,which means its 4 -1, not 4 +1 (to equal 5total gigs)

but yet yall screaming im wrong through this whole topic?

looks like im the ONLY one that knows about computers then

like i said, dont sass me, go be pressed and tell sprint to correct their site

i explained to people what ROM is, i never said the evo 3d didnt have eMMC

so stop putting words in my mouth when i was never wrong in the first place
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
I'm not the one being a prick here. I merely pointed out information. I told you Sprint mislabeled the eMMC as ROM. I told you that ROM is not always read-only, which is entirely factual.

From the article, "Read-only memory (ROM) is a class of storage medium used in computers and other electronic devices. Data stored in ROM cannot be modified, or can be modified only slowly or with difficulty, so it is mainly used to distribute firmware (software that is very closely tied to specific hardware, and unlikely to need frequent updates)."
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
either way you are NOT storing ANY apps or files in the ROM area (3gig), you only can in the space allocated which is 1 gig(of which about 800meg or so is usuable)

all fact

which is what ive been stating since my first post
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
There is no ROM, though.... There's just a section of the eMMC that isn't available.
[HTC EVO 3D] Scotty_Two:
Check out the specs on the Sensation page:

"Internal Memory:

768 MB RAM, 4 GB Internal Storage (1 GB user addressable)"

http://www.htc.com/us/products/sensation4g-tmobile?view=1-1&sort=0#tech-specs

Same deal with us, but for some reason they didn't make that clear.
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
tomato

tamato

thats pretty much what ROM is, an area of memory that you can not use

this section of memory thats not available, it can be READ though right? hence the R in ROM
[HTC EVO 3D] treckin:
I was loling for days till someone stepped in with the truth and ruined the noob party.
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
I agree that at this point, it's splitting hairs. However, for the sake of continued information, I want to point out that flash memory is a type EEPROM and as such a type of ROM.

So, Sprint and HTC are both correct.. as is the definition of the storage as ROM.. people are right and wrong all over the place... business as usual.
[HTC EVO 3D] Runelaron:
From the looks of the Data Specs HTC takes up about 2gig of the Rom.. Apparently all the APK's for the sense OS are un-compressed. Thats why most load instantly.

(NOTE! UN COMPRESSED APPS USE LESS RAM! THERE IS NO NEED TO DECOMPILE)

If you take a look at a lot of your apps under ALL, most if not all built in system apps say 0.00b.

Meaning these are all on there own partition but the OS is only displaying the amount they use up on the 1gig partition.

The only things that display space used are widgets or apps your can edit like the Clock, Which uses about 92kb just to store alarm clock data.

Com's and radios are 0.0b

along with Footprints and other useless apps. But being all uncompressed they can consume up to 10 MB each if not more. Eventually after you root this you MAY be able to re-partition your ROM but I would not condone it.

Especially due to the fact it might be programmed to function better with the duel core, IE .. one core runs the OS and the other runs the application.. Same how windows handles the OS and a video game you may load up.

I hope this helps. So yes HTC Sense and the 3D functions do use up 3 gigs.. Most likely 2gigs with 1 set aside for updates.

WHAT NOW APPLE!.... YEAH TAKE IT AND LIKE IT.
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
For one, try and put things in to context before you go and fire your emotional, typo filled, grammatically flawed diatribe at me. If you read the post that you replied to here:

Originally Posted by Jye75 :

They didn't false advertise, you only read what you wanted to read.

Tech Specs on the Sprint website say: 4 GB ROM, hence it would not be available for application installs anyway.

Tech Specs on HTC's website say: 4GB eMMC/1GB RAM, which is still saying you only have 1GB to play with for your apps.

YOU SAID:

"this is correct

folks (the OP at least) need to learn the basic terms of computer science,before claiming false advertising

it could have 25gig ROM but with rom u cant store any apps in it since the R and O stands for READ ONLY"

So essentially you agreed to Jye75's last statement which states that :"Tech Specs on HTC's website say: 4GB eMMC/1GB RAM, which is still saying you only have 1GB to play with for your apps."

I don't have a problem with the first part of the sentence which states that HTC's website has '4GB eMMC/1GB RAM' as the official tech. spec. It is the second sentence that is wrong there where Jye75 goes on to say that "which is still saying you only have 1GB to play with for your apps." which is ridiculous. You agreed to that entire post by saying "this is correct".

1GB of RAM doesn't mean that you have only 1GB of internal storage for your apps. Internal storage is not the same as RAM (which you have made quite clear clear that you understand apparently) which makes the post slightly misleading there. So there isn't any need to lecture the OP on 'computer science' terms. People have questions if you can't answer them without being condescending then don't answer at all.

That being said, you should now understand why I defined RAM for you, because I assumed that you didn't know what it was because you agreed with that statement above.

Finally, what the heck are you talking about -> "finally, your description of the phone mr know it all is saying that we have a total of 5 gig memory in the phone AND YOU SIR ARE DEAD WRONG" ... When did I ever say that? I think in your aim to create your own soap opera you got carried away, rode yourself over the cliff and plummeted down head first, which is quite clear by the brilliance of this statement -> "but i dont know about computers but you are load and wrong right?" hahahaha, wow, what is this guy trying to say people? Anyone?

To end it all again, this phone has 4GB of internal storage and 1GB of RAM, they are two completely different specification categories and if you interpreted THIS as 4+1 = 5 ... then, I rest my case "sir" because you are not one to waste my time with.
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
Well, in the traditional engineering sense and implementation scenarios of EEPROM and other programmable ICs ROM is strictly read only even today wherever it is used in its traditional form, whether that is in embedded systems, drive electronics or other such places. Modifying ROM(I'm referring to a real ROM chip) like the wikipedia article you pointed out is an intense process which takes a fairly complex process to accomplish over a considerable period of time and cannot be achieved in the way our "ROMs"/Flash chips get their firmware upgraded.

The term ROM is of late commonly used to refer to flash chips that can be reprogrammed and hence can be written to in case of phones, but thats more popular jargon than anything else, which is why HTC, Samsung or any major hardware manufacturer stays clear of the word "ROM" in the official tech. specs even though the community goes with that term.

Just my $0.02c.
[HTC EVO 3D] aronslusa:
So... uhmmmm..... who's right? :p
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
Dude, honestly I NEVER said 4GB Internal Storage + 1GB RAM = 5GB total storage. Why do you keep saying that I did? I don't want to argue with you, I should have worded my response to you in a better way, that was my bad but seriously, you are misinterpreting my post.
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
listen , the only smartness of computer knowledge i see in you is you being a smart ass, which really amounts to nothing

Unless im submitting in a term paper or report, I can careless about my grammer and such. As long as you passed 8th grade reading and writing you can understand what I'm saying

, i know what RAM is, its random access memory,guess you going to say im wrong on that too right? ive always known what it was even though you obviously do not,you're just typing random jargon that even you dont understand

You so quick to say me and him are wrong:

""which is still saying you only have 1GB to play with for your apps." which is ridiculous. You agreed to that entire post by saying "this is correct".

1GB of RAM doesn't mean that you have only 1GB of internal storage for your apps."

But where is your right answer? You go into some silly definition but never tell us the correct answer if we are indeed wrong.Are you sayin you can put more than 1gig worth of apps internally on the evo 4D? if so you're wrong again. You have up to 1 gig to use for apps, thats correct. What are you sayin is the correct answer? That one can store 4 gigs of apps on the evo 4d? You are so lost. Go play dungeon and dragons while knowledgable people talk about computers
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
yes in your weak attempt to sass you had very poor wording of whatever point you were trying to make

and the end of the day, you havent proved me wrong in any case

I speak on ROM, but you operate backwards and try to correct me on RAM that I never spoke about

now you wanna nit pick about rom not always being 100% not changeble/writable, but turn around any say that there a section in the eMMC that a user can not write to or use for apps, which is exactly what i said, right on line to how a ROM operates,just that you want to use the nerdier terms for it

no matter how you slice it: you, him , or anyone else is not storing any apps in the current configuration that is set up in the 3gig area. The only thing, especially since we dont have root, that one can do with an evo is use that 1gig partition. Now you can swap my words out with more geeky technical ones but theres no denying the truth about what I say: 1 gig is all you have to use in this phone (not even the full gig either)
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
If you want to get pedantic, it's 1.15GB.

There is 4gb of internal memory, of which 1.15gb is reserved as "Internal Storage" for apps. There is also 1gb of RAM.

The point being made is that it isn't 4gb, of which 1gb is for ram.. It's 4gb storage and 1 gb ram.
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
OMG, honestly this has to stop. Dude you are continuously misinterpreting me. I don't want to argue with you because noone wins there. Let me try and re-word this one last time, Jye75's last sentence was what i quoted here .. HE SAID (NOT ME) -

""Tech Specs on HTC's website say: 4GB eMMC/1GB RAM, which is still saying you only have 1GB to play with for your apps""

That is the sentence that I have an issue with. From his statement it sounds like he is trying to say that the 1GB for apps is the 1GB of RAM that is stated there which is WRONG. I am agreeing with you when you say that 1GB of RAM is NOT the same as 1GB of internal storage. RAM and ROM are two different things and we both agree on this. Is that clear?

Now for the ROM part, like I stated to xenx earlier, ROM is 'read only memory' and in its traditional form even today is exactly that just like you had pointed out, I never found fault with your definition of ROM. However the community uses the term ROM and Flash mem(eMMC) interchangeably, but if you notice no major hardware manufacturer will do that, they will NEVER use the word 'ROM' for the most part anywhere they just state it as "Internal Memory: xxGB". On HTC's site it is Internal Storage: 4GB eMMC which you agreed with so yes that is correct. Sprint is just following popular jargon by calling it 'ROM' which is misleading.

Now, again I thought you were agreeing with Jye75's line that "you still have only 1GB of mem to play with your apps" and it looked like he was getting that number from the "1GB RAM" in that same sentence in his post which is misleading. If that is not the case then I apologize for not getting what you were trying to say correctly.

As for the ROM part and there only being 1GB available out of the 4, that is something that I think is not completely accurate. On a phone with 4GB of ROM (in reality this is eMMC not ROM so it is writable to, as opposed to traditional ROM which even though modifiable is a very complex process and cannot be done in the time it takes our firmware upgrades to complete, so this is definitely not traditional ROM), there is no need for 2.9GB of that "ROM/Flash memory" to be used by Sense and Android. We should get at least 50% of that space. My Evo had 1GB of internal storage and I had about 580MB usable which is about 60% as opposed to the 1.1GB that is available to users on the 3d out of the 4GB which is barely 25%. Don't you find this a bit odd? An honest question, I'm not trying to argue with you.

I do this for a living man, I am not talking through my hat. This is just a simple misinterpretation of information. It’s been a long day 
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
so yall truly dont know what it is

the other smarty says 1gig doesnt mean 1 gig, and basically he can use the whole 4g for apps, so false

but the same goes here, u not storing more than 1gig of apps on the evo 3d, period

and NO i dont want to get pedantic, i use 1gig and not your specific 1.15 but yall just getting way to techy, just to prove your point and claim you're right
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
goodness griefus

so the answer you agree was 1gig, but simply he shouldnt have gotten the 1gig answer from looking at that quoted line? smh although the answer is 1gig, man oh man

Run your evo 3d, or even reset it to stock, get as many file manager and memory apps as you can, name one place on the phone (other than the SD card) that shows more than 1gig of any free space avail?????????????????????????????????????

so obviously that 3gig is being used, or simply unaccessible, which leaves only 1 gig of user useable space, which ive only been saying for hours

the only way you'll get more access to that 3gig is if you obtain root, and reformat all the partitions and stuff (if possible)
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
You posted in response to a message in such a way as to imply you agreed with the content of the message. You proceeded to get butt hurt when we called you on it. It's been mentioned by cranialsurge that was what happened.
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
but you didnt call me on anything that was WRONG

and if you IMPLY the wrong things as well, thats on YOU

my 1gig stance still stand until you can show me a evo 3d with 2+ gigs worth of apps internally

fat chance
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
Assuming we're both saying 1gb of RAM, 1GB of "Internal Storage", and 3gb of storage used exclusively by the OS/Sense/Etc... Then we're now on the same page.

The argument was going in circles around the misinformation regarding the 1GB of Internal Storage being directly related to the 1GB of RAM, and the apparently accidental implication that you agreed with that assessment.
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
Hahaha, which is EXACTLY what I am agreeing to. I agree to the fact that there is ONLY 1 GB freely accessible at this point out of the 4GB available but it really shouldn't be the case. Out of the 4GB of ROM, the user should have access to at least a little more than that. We started out on the wrong foot here thats all.

I am expecting more of that eMMC's 4GB to become user available space once we get the S-OFF from HTC so that the phone can be rooted and HTC sense can be stripped down from its pedestal. *Fingers crossed*.

And c'mon, I love XDA, we all do ... so PEACE!
[HTC EVO 3D] cranialsurge:
Hope everyone is on the same page now?
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
cranial and xenx, can you agree that RAM and ROM are both memory?

simple math: how much total memory is in an evo 3D ?
[HTC EVO 3D] SayWhat10:
ram is 1 gig

internal is 1gig

i always said the answer was 1 gig

why assume i got the RIGHT answer from the WRONG section????(internal vs ram)

all that should have mattered was that i was right

not how i somehow WRONGLY came to the right answer

makes no sense
[HTC EVO 3D] xenx:
That is 100% the wrong way to look at it. One is for storage and one is for active use. Sure, 4+1 = 5. But, saying it has 5 gb of memory is incorrect.

You don't say your computer with 6gb of ram a 500gb hard drive has 506gb of memory. It's the same here.