yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Xoom General] musashiken:
If this thread didn't make sense, you shouldn't even post in here. Especially with your numerous attempts to justify Google's actions with reasons that are purely of your own opinions and conclusions. If you actually said this post right in the beginning and left it at that, so be it. But the fact you kept defending yourself with redundant posts is just funny.

I agree that since we have already bought the Xoom knowing that sd card and 4G support is not yet enabled, we should live with it. But this thread is about questioning how long should we should wait and why are the officials keeping mum. It is not a worthless thread simply because you think it so.

The only reason why I keep rebutting your posts is that it's fun and your tone is snarky. This is a forum no? I completely understand your willingness to accept the Xoom as it is and your stance as an early adopter. Have I ever said I hated my Xoom? I love it to bits if you must know. So why can't you accept that there are people unhappy with Motorola's follow up on their delays? Indeed some here were overzealous in ranting against Motorola but that doesn't mean you should call them idiots for buying the xoom in the first place.

So now you are telling me to go ahead to blame Motorola. Well, yeah that's what I have been doing for the past few posts. The fact that you kept on replying just cracks me up. And saying this thread proves nothing is also funny because you have been active in it.
[Xoom General] jamaicansolja:
Motorola caused me and my fiance to return our Xoom's. We wanted 4G tab's and it's not going to happen. Does my experience matter? Yes.. And here is why.

You don't believe there is a few hundred.. maybe thousand more willing Xoom owners waiting for SD Card/4G?

If this thing doesn't get SD Card/4G it isn't any better than the Playbook or any of the numerous non SD Card/4G/Tegra2 Tablets.

It was promised to us and the only 'reasoning' we had behind the 799.99$ price tag.

Yes, I purchased the Tab on release date @ BB of-course no one knew what it was at the time. I honestly thought SD-Card was working out the box I found out when I got home:rolleyes: but I could live without 4G. End of returning my Xoom after 2 month's because I felt SD-Card/4G was a marketing scheme. I keep checking new's to when but what has it been what 3 month's now with no word?

Just add 4G the title of 'FIRST 4G TABLET ON Verzion" is enough to sell more!!!
[Xoom General] colbyb25:
Personally I don't think either of you, or anyone on this thread, have proven much, especially considering everyone's thoughts and opinions about the Xoom, its features and the support we receive (or don't receive) is purely subjective to our own thoughts and needs.

Personally I like Moto products, but don't care for their Customer Service. I own a Droid X and love it....even more because the Dev community around it. Same with the Xoom. While most might not dive into XDA or the developer communities with Android devices, for me that is why I am a happy customer. It is why my wife and I sold 2 iPhones and 2 ipads to come to the "light side". We do not live in a perfect world and most of the time, companies get it wrong, I own and run two businesses and fully know the challeneges. In the end I have a Xoom that suites my needs, mostly because of dev support. Because of that I don't care about official 4g and SD card support. Personally I want Google to release the source code for honeycomb 5000x more then carring about the Xooms lack of promised official features.

There are enough choices available now to get what you want. Spending a week complaining about the Xoom, Moto, or Google gets you no where and it is a waste of time. Sell your Xoom, buy another tablet and move on. Way too much ego on this thread...if I wanted to read that I would go to an Apple online forum.
[Xoom General] gogol:
Well said, it's a waste of time arguing this.

Your argument won't go anywhere.

If Motorola can keep it silent for 3 months now, why not another month or months or even year?

All your vents and rants are already "contained" in this XDA forum and Moto official forum. It ain't go anywhere :rolleyes:

Unless this is picked up by big media or blogs or news, it won't change a thing.

They just don't care or too busy thinking another product (Xoom2?) while waiting Google to deliver Android Ice Cream Sandwich :)

What's better? You choose:

1. Enjoy your Xoom while it last (before upgrading to Xoom2 or other newer device)

2. Return your Xoom while still can return it, then buy another tablet

3. If you cannot return it, sell it, then buy another tablet

4. Or give it someone else

There is nothing you can do to change Motorola decision to silent (or laughing behind your back). They already got your money, put your money in the bank and enjoy the interest while blaming Google (sure!).

So, stop wasting your energy :)
[Xoom General] p-slim:
I would easily wait till the end of summer, meaning September before I flip my lid
[Xoom General] csseale:
In talks with a lawyer now...she seems to think its a little early for a class action...but would maybe be willing after 6-8 months after release

And thread ain't closed
[Xoom General] J3bu5Cru57:
Thought I would fan the flames a little

w w w.unwiredview.c o m/2011/06/17/that-leaked-verizon-android-tablet-may-be-the-motorola-xoom-4g/

Which will materalize first, the promised 4G for the original xoom or this speculated xoom 4G?
[Xoom General] csseale:
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/4268499/petition.html
[Xoom General] Saintfyre:
I've done minimal research compared to others posting in this thread, but I would agree with the idea that I believe Kurttrail posed and that being Motorola already as our money from the purchasing of the Xoom.

Their priority being generating income, they'll be paying out the ass to navigate through the 4G LTE upgrade. It would be more profitable to prioritize future devices, but I don't understand why they don't realize how infuriated their customers are.

Here we are with other tablets being released with the Nvidia Tegra 2 chip and 4G LTE already enabled, so the bull**** excuses are being debunked.

Motorola in my eyes really has no excuse at this point in time, other than they've given up on the Xoom and are focusing their attention to future devices.

I don't know though, i'm merely speculating, i'm just upset that I made an investment and was not delivered what I was guaranteed.

Come the 1st of July i'll be in my local Verizon store where I purchased my Xoom asking for a refund to put towards a future tablet that has full functionality out of the box.
[Xoom General] willverduzco:
1 week to 1 month "vacation" to the next person flaming in this thread, depending on severity. Do I have any takers?

Seriously, though. Everyone, quit being so immature and quit the flaming / trolling.
[Xoom General] Kokanee483:
how is any of this trolling? This thread is simply frustrated owners venting a bit; unless people start hurling slander against one another what is the harm? As a Xoom (wifi) owner, I would be upset if I had bought a verizon model and promised 4G that turned out to be more Moto smoke and mirrors...
[Xoom General] p-slim:
Looking better

http://tinyurl.com/6znnhrc
[Xoom General] JanetPanic:
There were people throwing insults at each other. Most of the offending posts have been deleted. There was a bit of a flamewar going on and a lot of off color language, both of which are against forum rules.
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
A-hem.

The delay wasn't due to Jha, Moto, VZ, NVidia, space aliens, etc. etc. after all- just like I'd figured, the device hadn't finished (iterative?) FCC certification and simply wasn't ready in time.

All that wailing and gnashing of teeth by some, all for naught.
[Xoom General] p-slim:
the people or person who thought the current xooms weren't getting 4G must feel completely stupid (or maybe not because they're use to feeling that way) I wish the moderator didn't delete all those post, lmfao
[Xoom General] ZanshinG1:
I wouldn't say for naught... I got some good laughs out of the FUD-flinging.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
Yeah. I bought a MOTOROLA Xoom, and it is Motorola that is responsible to fulfull their obligations to Xoom owners, not the responsibility of Motorola's vendors.

And considering that it is mere speculation that the LTE card that passed the FCC last month is destined for the Xoom, your excuse is meaningless.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
Add $750, and I'll eat the shipping. ;-)
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
No, I don't. But there's more than one card that could be used- Novatel's, IPWireless' and Sierra Wireless' cards all just passed recently, and Samsung has one under development.

However- references to the "GOBI" networking protocol (qcserial module) being turned on in a recent kernel source-code update hints to Sierra Wireless being the chosen device, as their 7750 datasheet does support that protocol.
[Xoom General] zbee:
actually what i would really like to see is a fm tuner inbuilt then these would make the perfect carpc setup...but this is the wrong section:)
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
Really? If you were throwing a birthday party, and the truck that's delivering your custom-made cake for the event gets broadsided by a semi so your cake arrives late, would you say it's your fault the party is now "ruined", despite everything else pretty much going OK?

What do you expect Moto to do?!
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
Heh. What's funny about that is the Bluetooth/WiFi chip we've got actually does have an FM tuner (and transmitter), but I'm pretty sure Moto didn't hook up those pins.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
Exactly. You are offering mere speculation as a legimate reason why Xoom owners should remain patient.

I present facts for the reasons why I no longer trust Motorola.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
I'd sue the company that failed to deliver my cake as promised, if they wouldn't refund my money, since I'd have no need for a late birthday cake. That company's insurance company would pay off the cake company, and go after the Semis insurance company for payment.

That's how it works here in the US.
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
Dude- you DO know there's an empty filler where our LTE radios should be in our Xooms, right?

So, question- why didn't they put a radio in there when they shipped them (I have a first-batch Xoom), or the ones they shipped later, etc. ?! Simple- they just didn't exist in a usable form then. Hell, even if the SW isn't ready yet, the later Xooms should at least ship with the radios in them, right- just like the not-quite-supported SD-Card?! After all, the mini-PCI form-factor for these radios is nothing new- it's been tried and tested, and I even experimented with putting a CDMA-only mini-PCI radio I had lying around to see if the kernel would see it.

So, since there's MISSING HARDWARE, and most of what goes in there hasn't been certified 'till recently (and let's not forget- that not only does the FCC have to certify these radios, VERIZON has to, as well- and as someone who's been involved with getting a device certified on the VZ network I know they can have some insane qualification requirements), what else could it possibly be?!
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
... and that's your recourse here, too. Are you looking for a refund? There's nothing wrong with that, but I personally don't get the "baby with the bathwater" stance since 90% of the device works as advertised.

(I just hope you're not one of those wingnuts that like to bring class-actions over silly **** like this, esp. since it's a good chance that the rest of us will have our radios- and I have no doubt it'll happen- before you even get to trial.)
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
"Jha said they were late with the 2 4G/LTE products because '…we had network interactions with our protocol stack…'." - http://thedroidguy.com/2011/06/moto...h-verizon-more-at-boamerill-lynch-conference/

That doesn't sound like a late hardware delivery by a vendor of Motorola to me. Sounds like an internal Motorola problem, considering that other companies are shipping LTE devices on Verizon.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
I was acting as Motorola in your analogy.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
So kdump, the CEO of Motorola's own words makes Bull **** out of your blaming the FCC and/or Motorola's LTE hardware vendor.

Do you have any more BS apologia or lame-assed analogies to explain away Motorola's obvious incompetence in fulfilling their obligations to Xoom owners in a timely manner?
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
Yeah, (1) that whole "Tegra 2 doesn't work with LTE" line has been debunked by NVidia, and considering that the mini-PCI LTE device is just a USB serial device that uses a bog-standard control interface, if anything that means the VENDOR's hardware isn't ready to work as advertized- I've personally seen the kernel code (i.e., "network protocol stack") that controls the LTE radio, there's nothing non-standard in it one bit and it's used in other wireless-data contexts w/o issue. I've been involved in cases where we select a certain hardware/software combination expecting the hardware to be able to work with the software we've chosen, then the hardware vendor comes back to us and says "we need to make changes", and that inevitably leads to delays on our end as sometimes we need to fix our software to help facilitate their changes. It wouldn't surprise me if this is some variant on that.

(2) Jha didn't say which LTE devices were late (I can't believe that the Xoom and Bionic are the only ones in the pipeline), especially since putting in an on-board LTE chipset (i.e., in portable handsets like the Bionic) is more challenging.

Also, those handsets wouldn't be using the hardware we're waiting on- a choice that was made, probably 'cause no other LTE solution existed at the time of design and using a mini-PCI form-factor meant that it could be applied retroactively after product launch.

They're not using mini-PCI form-factor radios like ours. Apples and oranges.
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
... and one last thing, as you seem to be unwilling to listen to experience-based evidence on this- if there were "Network interaction" issues, it's not going to come from Moto- it's going to be with the third-party vendor who's radio is actually communicating on the network.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
1.) Who mentioned nVidia? Oh, that's was you! So what does nVidia have to do with Jha blamining "network interactions with our protocol stack…”

2.) Actually he was talking about the Xoom and the Bionic. All of the LTE questions he was answering were about the either Bionic or the Xoom during that press conference call.

3.) What does the hardware form factor have to do with a incompatible "protocol stack." Other companies' LTE hardware have no such "protocol stack" problems with Verizon's LTE network.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
Jha said "our protocol stack." That "our" means MOTOROLA'S.

Why are you still arguing that Motorola isn't to blame, when Motorola's own CEO is literally blaming Motorola's "protocol stack?"
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
No- that again, was Jha, who earlier tried to imply that NVidia was at fault as well for the Xoom not having LTE yet. I put that out there 'cause that has shown to be false to the point where NVidia had to deny it (and therefore implies that this statement about protocol stacks is somewhat suspect, as well).

Conceded, then.

Nothing directly- but when using mini-PCI we've already seen there's only a few manufacturers in this form-factor to choose from. So like I said before, there's recent support built into the latest Xoom kernel for the "Gobi" networking protocol stack, which for what I've seen only the Sierra Wireless series of mini-PCI LTE cards seem to explicitly support. Now Gobi, while having been used for a while, is a protocol from Qualcomm that is used up 'till now for EVDO/UMTS cards. For all we know, some extension to the protocol required for use on the LTE network isn't supported by these cards- despite the vendors promises it would be (I've seen this happen, too) and now there's a scramble to make up for the missing functionality.

I modify and use the Xoom kernel code every day- there's very little Moto has had to do to support LTE with this kernel (and very few additions other than power, reset and firmware-loading support) so the only "protocol stack" issues would have to come from elsewhere, as Moto is using what's already in the kernel. Now, if Moto wanted to fault themselves for the way they've decided to hook the LTE card into the device, that's another thing altogether ...!

This of course is all speculation, but it's a possible scenario based on years of this kind of stuff (I'm in the handset industry), and if you'd lose your anti-Moto bias you could see where it's plausible (esp. since really, getting on the air on LTE isn't that big a deal whereas your "Motorola is too incompetent to pull it off" just doesn't make sense, esp. since it's not a single company involved in this issue- and let's not forget- we're STILL waiting for the hardware).

How can you say that, when we are the only device using a mini-PCI LTE card?! You wouldn't use that form-factor in a tablet unless the LTE hardware didn't exist by the time you were shipping out product (or you were planning on future expansion, which is unlikely as LTE is brand-new). No handset (i.e. the Bionic and Thunderbolt) will use it- it takes up too much space, for one thing.

Everybody else, having the benefit of coming later (like the Galaxy Tab) and having the benefit of having more available hardware to choose from will be using an on-board LTE chipset instead.
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
See my reply above- there's really no new Moto code in the kernel related to LTE networking, so "our" here is apparently "the protocol stack (already) in the linux kernel we're using in the Xoom", not "the one we created".

... anyway, anyone else?!
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
How do you know there is "no new Moto code in the kernel related to LTE networking," when Motorola does not have a device on the market that has functioning LTE networking?

I've never read a kernel-related prophesy before!

And who's words are you putting in quotes? Please provide links.

... anyway, anyone else want to defend Motorola with mere speculation and kernel prophesies?!
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
Eh?! Did you not see where I said I "modify and use the Xoom kernel every day"?! I saw when power support for the "Wrigley" device (code-name for the LTE) went in. I saw when the Gobi support was turned on. After HMJ37 was released, I saw the code in the init scripts that handle parts of its initialization and connection.

You're on TapaTalk, so you don't see .signatures, but in mine is a link to my modified/OCed Xoom kernels (and the source from whence they're created, which comes from upstream as it's pushed from the various devs from Moto/NVidia/LKML/etc.). I'm willing to bet that when the kernel source for the Galaxy Tab is released (and let's not forget, Samsung won't have an LTE model shipping soon either) there won't be any new networking protocol code in there, either.

... but go ahead. Blame Motorola; it seems to be the answer that makes you happiest!
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
Actually Jha never mentioned nVidia by name.

But that still doesn't change the fact that Jha blamed "OUR protocol stack."

Samsung obviously has no "protocol stack" or any other problems with either Verizon's network or with the Tegra 2 chipset. So using Occam's Razor, the problem lies in Motorola's inability to deliver a working LTE device, not with the network, or the chipset.

... but go ahead. Apologize for Motorola; it seems to be the answer that makes you happiest!
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
Have you seen one kernel for a working Motorola Android LTE device?

Answer yes or no.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
1.) Verizon has multiple LTE devices, including USB LTE devices, running just fine on its LTE network, so we cannot blame the network.

2.) kdump provided the evidence for why we cannot blame nVidia's Tegra2 chipset.

3.) And as kdump said, "considering that the mini-PCI LTE device is just a USB serial device," you really cannot blame the mini-PCI form factor when Verizon has three USB LTE devices available.

Whether Motorola made a bad choice in LTE radio vendors that other Android LTE device manufacturers didn't make, or they just cannot figure out a working "protocol stack" as Motorola's CEO said, doesn't really matter. All that matters is that Motorola has failed to fulfill their obligations to Xoom owners in a timely manner, and that's MOTOROLA'S fault, not Verizon's network, or nVidia's chipsets fault.
[Xoom General] Arizona Willie:
Yep, the fanboys on Motorola can call people who point out the lack of support " moron " " a-hole " and various other things but put one FU in your message and your history.

When a fanboy moderator moves a post about lack of support to the unlocked area where fewer people will see it and you speak to him without due reverence and then repost what he moved you are banned!

GASP!!

How will I ever live without posting on that forum?
[Xoom General] Arizona Willie:
I suspect kcdrup is trying to buttkiss his way into a moderator position on Motorolas forum. It seems to have worked for fletch333.
[Xoom General] KerryG:
Go to any forum here. Samsung users are mad at Samsung, HTC users are mad at HTC, Motorola users are mad at Motorola. If you decided not to buy any device because there have been complaints from users, you will be without a smartphone. Every manufacturer has issues, delays, bugs, etc. There are no perfect devices.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
Just sign up using another name, and fake the hardware number they ask for. Motorola is so stupid that they don't even check IP addresses.

Hell, I even signed up as kurttrai1 after being banned as kurttrail, and Matt was so dumb as to think that he had unbanned me, instead of me getting around Motorola's forum signup process.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
Software issues delays and bugs are one thing. How many Android device manufacturers are having to keep delaying getting internal hardware functioning after sale?

Only MOTO, that I know of.

Sent from my Bolt
[Xoom General] kcrudup:
Hrmph. Were I to care enough to try and get a Mod position anywhere, the Moto forum would be the LAST place I'd consider; the overall level of competence of its' members is among the absolute lowest of any forum I visit.
[Xoom General] blackte4:
just sell your xoom and keep it moving.... I love my xoom and everything works great. Rooted and running at 1.4ghz. The best decision I have ever made. It was great before but beautiful now.
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
So if Verizon and NVIDIA cannot be blamed for Motorola's LTE problems, who is to blame for Motorola's LTE problems again?

You might have a lot of knowledge about the Xoom kernel, but you obviously lack the ability to use simple logic.

Sent from my Bolt
[Xoom General] kurttrail:
$800 with free shipping and its all yours. If you think the Xoom is all that, then put your money where your mouth is.

I'll even throw in a free dock and case to sweeten the deal.

Sent from my Bolt
[Xoom General] e.mote:
Hahah, funny talking about outdated toys, since I'll be grabbing the Nook Touch. It's got 2GB RAM and runs Eclair, only 802.11 b/g. No need to worry about outdated, coz it's practically a dino in tech terms.

But for an Android toy with a daylight screen and 3 weeks batt life.. for $140.. B&N is my BFF..

Wonder if it can play vids.. may be 2fps hahah.. need to update my conversion script...
[Xoom General] gogol:
Who is to blame? Motorola !

It is obvious, especially Samsung is likely able to deliver the 4G tab using Nvidia Tegra 2 with Verizon.
[Xoom General] csseale:
Arguing with kcrudup gets nowhere. I have learned he is the only one who knows what there is to know about the end all of the Xoom. He just argues to argue and throw in attitude to back it up.you should prob. Just ignore him and go on. Would be better in the end