yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[Epic 4G General] AndrewZorn:
This. I don't like it either.

It's typical spyware, and as is typical, blown way out of proportion by its 'users'.

I really wish I could just use 100% vanilla Android, to avoid all the things Sprint thinks are awesome. Not that Google doesn't 'spy' on me, it would just be that much less hit on performance.

Hint: CIQ is not to get your girlfriend's naked pictures. It is for usage statistics to make things better. I enable usage statistics in situations I feel it will not make my experience worse (ie, browser on a desktop computer). I do not feel the phone platform needs any more background services, and thus dislike CIQ.
[Epic 4G General] dreamsforgotten:
I'm with you 100% on this the one scary facet of ciq to myself is the keylogger feature!
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
I know they did not implement it to get naked pictures off of phones. Nor did they implement it to keylog and steal my user names and passwords. However, because as it is implemented in our phones it CAN do these things I want it removed. If Sprint wants to monitor metrics they can through responsibly implementer software packages that do not have the ability to collect information they have no right to or business knowing.
[Epic 4G General] chris41g:
i would like to reiterate, that CIQ is disabled even when its still on the phone...
[Epic 4G General] iSaint:
Yes... the should have the right to implement it ... as we should have the right to know about and be able to remove it.
[Epic 4G General] KennyG123:
Bottom line, they already know which tower I hit when I make a call or use data. It shows on my bill. Extra software is unnecessary. That is all the info they should need to improve their service.
[Epic 4G General] dreamsforgotten:
If it were remotely enabled, you wouldn't know. The same with gps, they can enable it remotely only them you would notice the status signal
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
No, CIQ is not disabled. CIQ is running at all times in the background as a service, only logging is disabled. CIQ monitors everything the phone does and every interaction between it and the user.

One may ask why is it running as a service if it is not logging or collecting any information. The answer can easily be found in other softwares and Trojan Viruses that lay dormant as a running service until activated remotely or by a triggering action on the user side. What does this mean? It means that CIQ logging and transmission of data may be enabled via a SMS or MMS message or via an email, it may be activated by a signal over the CDMA network, via WiFi, Bluetooth, piggybacked on a PRL update or Provisioning. Because CIQ is running as a background service and monitors everything the potential for any incoming data being able to activate logging and/or transmission of data is there.
[Epic 4G General] chris41g:
the service is running, but all of its features are turned off... not just logging

as far as im concerned it may have just been an unimplemented plan they had? or a yet to be implemented.. or something..

my biggest problem isnt the fact they use it.. but there should be more disclosure.. they tell us, sort of, but not to what extent. us as xda members are power users and we take it off for performance/battery/paranoia but the common user knows nothing of it... they should be made to disclose to a greater extent the data gathering policy
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
To keep this thread on topic I have created a second thread here to provide information on the CIQ software and what it is capable of doing.
[Epic 4G General] iil:
What is the carriers intent when adding ciq? To me, that is the question.

Is it to read our text messages? No...they don't need ciq to do that.

Is it to see which websites we visit? No.. they don't need ciq to do that either.

Is it it to view our pictures? Doubtful.

Is it to keylog our passwords? Doubtful, and I would argue any interested party wouldn't need ciq to do that.

So what is the intent? For one, i'd just like confirmation from sprint is is there intentionally and not placed by any rogue employee.
[Epic 4G General] chris41g:
they spent like 12 million dollars putting it there, so i doubt its a rogue employee haha
[Epic 4G General] megabiteg:
Amen!

Sent from an Epic with 4G
[Epic 4G General] iil:
Ok. So then again, what is the intent? Sprint doesn't need ciq to do many of the things people are complaining about. Anything that traverses through there network they can already capture. (i would imagine)
[Epic 4G General] chris41g:
in the info thread, i posted some data sheets. it looks like the put it there for pre release device testing and major issue support. but speculation is speculation
[Epic 4G General] dreamsforgotten:
Everyone needs to take a look at sonys recent server exploit. The deal with me is what happens when their server that stores the data is compromised? When logs of info about purchases you made on the market passwords etc fall into the wrong hands. I'm also willing to bet your info is being sold to marketing companies just like every time you full out a survey.
[Epic 4G General] iil:
This link has some good info

http://mobile.eweek.com/c/a/Mobile-...r-Better-Service-from-Cell-Phone-Data-165496/

It definitely has the ability to keep track of some metrics I would rather keep private (such as which apps I use), but also has some good stuff with it. Either way, it should be opt in (IMO).
[Epic 4G General] JMMusic:
I would not tolerate such a thing on my computer. These days I use my phone much like a computer.
[Epic 4G General] Overstew:
I think if it's non malicious information (signal strength info gathering, etc.) then I honestly don't mind. I'm pretty sure Sprint's got a list of your purchases and passwords already, regardless of Ciq. You use their network and they have control of it. Not much you can do, especially if you sign a contract.
[Epic 4G General] TheDub:
Google and Sprint already have access to EVERYTHING you do. Who you text, what you text, who you call, maybe to a limited capacity what you say on said call, what sites you go to, where you were at 10:03PM on such and such day. ETC

Do they use it in a malicious way? I would sure as heck expect this to be a no.

Carrier IQ is OFF by default. I suspect this is some kind of law enforcement tool turned on when you need to be monitored extra carefully. Perhaps if you were a suspect in a murder.

The other portion of it might be good, including what apps you're using, what apps are crashing, what phones have signal problems in the same area as phones that don't, etc.

Sprint can use this information in a positive way for current and prospective customers. I'm sure there are many emails that go out retail warning of such and such app causing X amount of crashes on Y type of phone.

Is there any proof that this information is not being used anonymously? I'm sure if they needed to they could dig in and find out who did what but I bet it just gathers metrics they use to improve your experience.

This whole thing is being blown way out of proportion. If you don't agree with it their are rom's with it removed. If you're that worried about Sprint and Google knowing what you're doing then you're to late because they know everything about you already.
[Epic 4G General] coolqf:
Very good question. I can see how some of the information is useful for Sprint, but then I can see how more of the information may be more useful for Google in helping them develop their Android, yet Google doesn't implement such software. So, it makes me question how pivotal it truly is for the consumer experience. I lean towards it's not needed. I compare it to IE in Windows. If I don't want it, since i paid for it, I should have the ability to remove it since it in no way has an impact on my consumer experience. We, the consumer, pay full price for the device. Yes, you can argue the discount, but over the 2yr span you pay for it through your contract, and if you cancel you also pay for the phone also. So, I pay full price for a phone and it also tracks what I do??? I hope it's anonymous, because it might lean me towards purchasing another device.
[Epic 4G General] dreamsforgotten:
That's why I went with the nexus s I rather have a phone that is pure google like android was intended, most every custom rom such as cyanogen mod and miui which also don't track you can be flashed over. The epic doesn't have those choices yet but at least its got the option to remove it if you don't feel comfortable with it
[Epic 4G General] chris41g:
We arent sure what miui tracks or does tbh... they never released the source...
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
I do not believe it is being blown out of proportion for many reasons but I will list just two for the moment.

1. If left to their own devices, eventually Carriers and CarrierIQ will find a way to make sure Dev's are either unable to remove CIQ or make it so difficult and time consuming that it won't be worth the time.

2. Per both Sprint & Samsung, removal of CIQ voids you warranty. If enough accurate negative attention is brought to light about CIQ, Sprint may remove it. Removal of CIQ by the carrier will to some extent protect Epic owners warranties.
[Epic 4G General] gjones77:
Let me preface this by saying that this post only covers people living in the US.

The OP question is actually poorly asked, do carriers have a "Right" to use CarrierIQ, no since no such right exists in the Constitution.

Now, is it a violation of your rights for them to use it?

No, it's not, and I really wish anyone who says "Company doing X violates my rights" would educate themselves on rights and application of said rights before running their pie holes.

The Constitution, which is where our rights are defined in the first 10 Amendments, only covers actions by the federal government itself, not private entities.

Now, if a private company violates your privacy in a damaging way there are laws and legal routes in the courts that you can use to find resolutions to these issues.

Now, as for CarrierIQ, when you sign up for service with your cell phone carrier you agreed to them using this, no one forced you to use that carrier, no one held a gun to your head and screamed at you to sign the contract, you did that of your own free will.

Here's an example, as a condition of your current position you are not allowed to publicly bad mouth your employer, if you do so your position would be terminated, that's not a violation of your right of free speech because you agreed to not bad mouth the company publicly as terms of employment.

So please, stop screaming that a company is violating your rights, they may be violating the law, but your rights are only protections against the federal government, not a private business since those are regulated by separate laws.
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
You are absolutely right, the original poster worded the question poorly. Wait, thats me, someone better send me to the cyber corner. lol I definitely should have worded it better. We as United States citizens have Constitutional rights and Legal rights and here I was referring to our legal rights and did not differentiate. We all know the law has a hard time keeping up with technology. Currently there is a Senate sub committee investigating consumer privacy rights and not just Google and Apple but all carriers actions. Historically, if consumers do not act against invasions of privacy it only gets worse. Now is the time to gather all the information on CIQ that we can and make our voices known.

We can argue all day about signing contracts with statements such as "gathering information" "right to protect our network" etc etc and so on. But where is the line to be drawn between carriers rights to protect themselves and our rights to privacy and to protect ourselves and families?

I wholeheartedly believe a carrier has the right to protect itself and its network. I believe they have a right to gather metrics in an effort to improve service and grow their network and profits. I have no problem having network metrics software on my phone as it will eventually benefit me as a customer. What I do have a problem with is CIQ as it is designed and implemented in Android phones. Its capabilities are far too invasive and thus subject to potential abuse either by corporations or hackers. This is why I have started the two threads, one to get overall opinions and one to gather factual information on CIQ.
[Epic 4G General] gjones77:
Ahh... you only have one set of rights, your "Legal Rights" are derived from the Constitution.

Simply put, if you don't like CarrierIQ then don't sign up for service, if more and more people avoided a carrier that uses CarrierIQ then you would create an incentive for them to stop using CarrierIQ.

Why do people always want to get the government involved when a simple market solution does the job...
[Epic 4G General] xjman:
If you are that worried about CIQ you better get off of the internet right this second.

Its all stupid, everyone is claiming the removal "boost performance, and "increases battery life". It doesn't.

I don't think companies really need to track all kinds of things. but I think they should have the ability to if needed. You never know what situation my arise that its important that you be tracked, monitored, ect.
[Epic 4G General] yayorbitgum:
It DOES increase battery life. Of COURSE it does. Anything you stop from running on your phone in the background will inevitably free up some resources and increase your battery life.

Remove it, and there's nothing using up all that extra CPU to record and log everything even as small as which area of the touchscreen you are pressing. I tested this myself (read my post before this one) and so have several individuals. Try it out yourself! It's so unbelievably simple!

You don't think companies need to track "all kinds of things", yet you say they should be able to track everything if needed... What is the difference?!

You never know what situation may arise where it's "important that you be tracked" and "monitored"?? Yeah, and with CarrierIQ, you never will! Do you ever question people? Do you accept everything at face value? These are all serious questions. I am trying to figure out how someone can even think like this.

Now I'm not saying providers don't need any ability to track anything. What I'm saying is you can't just agree to speculative deals. You need to ask WHY, ask WHAT, where, when, how, etc.. You need to know the details. Otherwise it's simply too easy of a power to abuse, and you are the one who will take all the negative side-effects of that abuse. You need to ask what is going on and why it is going on, and you need details. Don't simply agree to something so broad and general as "we need to be able to track stuff, and whatever. For Situations and what not". I mean really! Think!
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
There is certain information that carriers should be entitled to, there is certain information that we have no choice about privacy and security because we transmit it across the world wide web, and then there is certain information that CIQ has access to that they have no need knowing but yet CiQ gives them access too.

Whether removal of CIQ does or does not provide any performance benefit is not a part of this discussion and I hope those who keep bringing it up with drop it.

I believe certain aspects of CIQ should be running in the background to help improve the network. I believe certain functions should be consumer opt-in for assistance in diagnosing and troubleshooting equipment problems. I also believe that certain functions should be consumer opt-in to provide an enhanced and more enjoyable user experience. My problem is the depth of CIQ's potential invasiveness, the lack of consumers ability to opt-in or out of certain "features", and the potential for abuse by Sprint, 3rd Party Affiliates and hackers with malicious intent.
[Epic 4G General] xjman:
I did test it, I tested it for days on end. It makes little to no difference. You better remove anything debugging logging, as well. It does the same thing, and man its killing your performance and battery life.

I don't do anything that requires me to be afraid of anyone. Therefore they can track me until they are blue in the face. I don't care.

To make this simple I'll relate this exactly to sprint.

I don't feel companies should have the right to know what I say if I call someone, or what I text someone else. I also don't think they should be allowed to know exactly what websites I go to. However, to know that I make X amount of calls for X amount of time, or X amount of texts, and X amount of data and use X apps doesn't mean **** to me. He touched the screen this many times, he did/didn't use the keyboard, he does/doesn't use speaker phone. blah blah blah

I think they need to have the right to track where you are, because when its your child, or loved one you'll be glad they could find them.

As far as the personal questions. I generally don't give a crap about random ass people, I question people when its something that is currently bothering me, not has the potential to, if I questioned everything that had the potential to annoy, bother, or piss me off I wouldn't get anywhere in life. Accepting things at face value goes along with that, I have no reason to question anything unless it gives me a direct reason to. Just because something has the potential to do something ****ty doesn't mean it will.
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
While I did know that Sprint, like all carriers, collected metrics to diagnose and improves their network, I was not aware of the invasiveness or potential privacy and security issues CIQ could represent. I signed a binding 2 year contract not knowing that the phone I was purchasing had this software on it nor did Sprint disclose that their metric's gathering went beyond what is considered reasonable. Now one may say what is reasonable to one person is unreasonable to others but if you look back a few years you will see that computer manufacturers went through this same thing. They wanted to gather "metrics" to improve their customers experience. The level of "metrics collection" was considered far too invasive and a violation of privacy. In the end a settlement was reached and these "metrics" gathering packages became less invasive and opt-in.

As for leaving Sprint and speaking with my wallet.....

More and more carriers are implementing software with this level of invasiveness. Carrier IQ for example is already installed on over 90 Million phones world wide. Leaving Sprint for a carrier that does not currently use software of this nature will most likely only serve to delay the fight to have it removed. We are a community and with numbers have power. Let us gather together to use that power to not only protect ourselves but others who do not root or flash roms. In the end it will only serve to benefit us as a community.
[Epic 4G General] dreamsforgotten:
At the far end of the spectrum of "i do nothing wrong they can track me all they want" one can argue before the holocaust the jews said I did nothing wrong I'll wear the star of david on my clothes. That ended up more damaging than they ever expected and when placed on the trains to the camps, they realized up until that point they submitted to many of the request put on them but after boarding the trains it was too late. I'm not comparing ciq to nazi concentration camps before the flame war ignites keep reading. I'm comparing the willingness of the general public to submit to methods of control electronically to being essential in the end to t their downfall. Some are taking the intent of the corporations toolightly here. What happens when someone gains control of these "metrics" (if you can sum up the knowledge of your every move, thought, and habbit as a metric) with ill intent be it a corrupt corporation or entity, or simply a hacker. What happens when this information is compromized? Take into consideration the droid kung fu hack (?sp on the name there) where in china android phones are turned into "bots" to send out all your information and your contacts info as well to said hackers. What happens when ciq servers are hacked? Do you really want this info in the wrong hands? Look at credit companies who your info can and does get compromized from, more often than not you are responsible for the charges when it could have been the in adequite security measures of a vendor you used or the actual credit card companies themselves. One must consider the entire picture not just at what they choose to observe. You can tag this as a conspiracy theory if you will, the problem is history both far and recent has proved numerous times that this isn't the least bit unlikely and an informed consumer is the best consumer. These companies like banks have but 1 drive and that is profit and they will sit back and let every one of us fall victim before they sacrafice a single dollar. Its the American way afterall. This is my take on the situation and being so I feel compelled to share it I'm trying to inform people of the possibilities but not persuade anyone. If you disagree that's fine I don't look down upon those who do.
[Epic 4G General] stud_muffler:
Just to add to conspiracy theory... How many of you have wrote to your congressman about renewing Patriot Act? How many of you still believe to Congress issued report of 9/11? Sites like Facebook and LinkedIn is a best tool for any "law enforcement" agency and as "conspiracy theory lover" I sure they have their hands in the CIQ as well.

:cool:
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
"Hey, just because your paranoid doesn't mean people aren't watching you"

---Author Unknown

:D:D:D:D
[Epic 4G General] stud_muffler:
source

:cool:

1234567890
[Epic 4G General] carrieriq:
Carrier IQ

To be clear, what Carrier IQ actually does is report on the performance of the network and device so that the operator or handset manufacturer can take action to fix it.

Understanding why a call dropped or an SMS failed or a battery died is really important for service providers and handset vendors to provide a high quality product. It’s also important if you ever call customer service so they can actually figure out what problems you are having.

Before any device containing our software is launched, exhaustive testing is conducted to ensure battery and performance is not compromised.

For more details than I can reasonable put in a posting, please see the privacy section of our web site (under Company).
[Epic 4G General] Decad3nce:
Regardless of what you post here, people will don their tinfoil hats because they simply don't understand things.
[Epic 4G General] dandog96:
Dang its amazing how a conversation about ciq can lead to the Holocaust
[Epic 4G General] Phasma343:
Ok, that explains part of it. It still takes up resources on the system.
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
Why does CarrierIQ, Inc., ignore all requests for comment on direct questions regarding consumers concerns over the safety and security of their data and information on electronic devices where your software is installed?

Why has CarrierIQ, Inc., ignored all requests for comment on the allegations made public in late February that CarrierIQ is a trojan like spyware giving carriers extremely invasive control over the users device and data?
[Epic 4G General] twolostminds:
That is just truly unnecessary. There are many people concerned about the invasive potential of CarrierIQ. Just because they have concerns about this software does not make the aluminum foil hat wearing paranoids living in windowless boxes.

If these concerns are nothing more than a misunderstanding, if this software does not have the invasive capabilities that were made public back in February, CarrierIQ can put a stop to it all with a public statement or press release denying the claims made against them.
[Epic 4G General] stud_muffler:
Since you've joined us to tell us what we already know and refusing to elaborate in details I think we have the right to assume that your software does in fact nothing else but a piece of spyware and can be controlled by "carriers" or "big brother" at their will.

Sounds like good enough reason to want it to be removed.

:cool: