yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[General Topics] joelee100:
Also, personally, I don't think an amber alert sounding on thousands of phones at some huge tennis match or wedding is really going to be that productive...A silent alert would be more appropriate(and maybe that is the plan...who knows?)...just saying

I whole heartedly agree with you, the info is sorely lacking. I will write my rep, but...LOL...I'm sure he has no clue about these questions.

Also, I wonder how much it is going to cost? who is making the money? and how it will effect our battery?
[General Topics] KOAO:
lulz,International Unlocked Phones From Asia and Europa FTW. :3
[General Topics] dandv:
No info on cost, battery and GPS

I read all the "PLAN documents" on the FCC website. The CMAS Third Report and Order mentions that cost recovery is left as a decision for carriers: they may choose to absorb the costs themselves, or pass them on to customers.

There is no mention anywhere of battery usage, or anything technical like, how will geographic targeting work? Will it use GPS as BBC and MacDailyNews mention? Using GPS means that the chip will have to periodically broadcast the position of the mobile device. Besides more battery drain, this just reeks of surveillance.
[General Topics] dandv:
Perhaps, but all the information in their article matches what FCC says on the site. Daily Mail is also the only source with a nice diagram of what the system will behave like. The diagram also conforms to what all the other sources I added to my first post say.

According to FCC, the alerts will also be pushed to wireless carriers, who will then push them from cell towers to mobile phones.

The alerts are even shorter than SMS. They're limited to 90 characters.

Why do we always have to "write to the congressmen"? Why don't they open issue like this up for discussion before they become law?
[General Topics] il buono:
The carriers would obviously pass on the cost to us like the 911 phone service. Any excuse just to raise prices and any excuse for the government to become more involved in our lives.
[General Topics] xaccers:
Because you live in a Representative Democracy don't you?

I'm suprised that the first time this is being posted about, after it's been legislated for back in 2006, normally the tinfoil hat brigade types are onto this from the get-go.

Over here we'd expect something like that to be announced for publicity (Look at us coming up with a clever idea to warn people) at least, otherwise it would be picked up during the first reading in the Commons (such as the bill a few years back which was so badly written it would have meant all motorbikes, even artwork and museum pieces had to have a valid modern registration plate), if it wasn't announced in the Queen's speach.

We also wouldn't expect it to be used for anything other than emergencies unless it was opt-in.

Looking at the FCC article, that's exactly the case too, you can opt out (well, for 2 years at least).
[General Topics] joelee100:
I you believe the NY Post, then the Drod X, Iphone 4, and the innuendo already have the chip.

Also, an interesting comment I found on the att forum, from a Mr. John Merrill, the Chairman of the Consumer Electronics Association's Public Alert Technology Alliance. He says:

"The first issue is indeed who is developing a chip and under whose standard-setting guidance, since any speculation of a defacto standard "emergency chip" for PLAN are currently unfounded. This same speculation of a unified format was put out by IPAWS proponents in 2004 with an announcement of a "fifty cent" upgrade cost when in fact their projected Utopian "e-chip" not only did not exist but had a projected industry cost closer to $7.00 and a development cost estimated at over $3 million......PLAN integration has a number of hurdles to overcome which will get addressed --- hopefully within 2 years --- but it will take a great deal of required user interface, product development, industry partnerships, and legal and licensing work in order to avoid litigation and deliver a consumer product."
[General Topics] jcbofkc:
Silly Brit. The Federal government has no need to insert chips into every one's phones allowing them control over that phone.

They can push a text to the carriers who could send it to us if we opt in.

Leave it up the the Federal government to make something 10 times more expensive and invasive than necessary.
[General Topics] jcbofkc:
It's little late to be concerned about privacy if you have a android based phone. Google has numerous contracts with the defense department, DHS and the NSA. They routinely hand info over to governments. They helped china round up all sorts of people.
[General Topics] dandv:
CMAS (Emergency Alerts) app

The Droid X does seem to have the chip, according to Android Central, this post on the Verizon forums (which mentions the mandatory presidential alerts and says that the Emergency App can't be uninstalled) and this post on the Motorola forums.

Someone here on xda-developers found a "cmas.apk (Emergency Alerts)" application in the ROM.

It would be really interesting to have a look at that app.
[General Topics] xaccers:
That's what I'd be objecting to, not the concept of a warning system.

Has anyone found an article stating the benefits of this system over SMS (other than SMS isn't reliable).

The use of GPS - why? If a message is sent out does it have a header saying "Only show the message if you're on 5th Ave" and is sent to every single handset in the US? What happens if you're in a building so can't get a GPS signal?

I know operators can push things out to specific masts and therefore locations because during the Arms Fair at Farnborough the operator text changes to welcome the arms dealers.

I can understand the desire for having the system hardwired into a handset so it can't be disabled, hence the need for the "chip"
[General Topics] dandv:
Why not use the existing Cell Broadcast of the GSM standard?

I've read by now 15 first-hand articles and the cited reason for having an extra chip embedded in each cell phone is that the current SMS infrastructure can get congested in times of emergency. However, PLAN still uses wireless carrier cell towers to push messages (as opposed to a different frequency, like the ones used for radio clock synchronization or GPS). The GSM standard already supports Cell Broadcast (CB) messaging. What is the exact justification of the extra chip? Is there an extra chip even, or are the AT&T and Sprint spokespersons (and a host of other sources) confused? The FCC and FEMA sites mention a "technology", but no "chip" explicitly. The Droid X does have an "Emergency Alerts" app. Does that simply enable CB messages?

The only sources I've seen so far mentioning the use of GPS are BBC and MacDailyNews. Why is there so much confusion about the exact method used to locate the mobile device?
[General Topics] xaccers:
Just reading that page on SMS-CB, it states 93 characters per message, and 15 messages.

That nearly ties in with the info that the system will have 90 characters per message.

Actually that WIKI page states it is going to be used to send emergency alerts.

Makes more sense.

I would imagine that the modification to phones (either chip or app, which ever it turns out to be) would be in order to enable users to opt out.
[General Topics] kltcommando:
probably monitor calls and all your info :)
[General Topics] xaccers:
They can do that already, no need for a new system for that.

Basically from the sounds of this it's actually a case of the government using a feature of GSM to give public warnings, and to give people the ability to opt out of the non-dire ones, they need to adapt handsets.

Apparently it was used in London after the 7/7 bombings as it doesn't suffer from traffic overload unlike normal SMS.
[General Topics] blackangel104:
Wow....well atleast if the world ends, we'll get a txt to let us know

We drown in four loko :)
[General Topics] joelee100:
Why the lack of info? Let me guess...because the whole thing is a big smoke and mirror show that is all about money...designed to shove it up our rear ends
[General Topics] xaccers:
What money?

The Act states $107million (or was that $106?) is available to get the ball rolling, and you can't be charged for each message sent, but your bill may go up a bit (can't see it being much) to cover the costs to your provider.

It's using technology that is already in place, and has already been shown to be of benefit in a crisis.

If you don't want messages about little timmy being lost, or there's a tornado on the way so be prepared then you can opt out.
[General Topics] TooVerily:
how will any carrier network handle this load when text messaging in a natural disaster on a small scale causes massive choking?
[General Topics] livingbread:
Don't they have an overriding function that will broadcast whatever they wish regardless of telcos in the country?
[General Topics] xaccers:
Mast broadcast doesn't suffer from traffic choke.

From the looks of things the telco sends the message to the mast and it starts broadcasting until it's told to stop.

Your phone picks it up (as part of the GSM standard) and displays it to you. As the message has an identity your phone ignores the repeat sends so you only have one copy on your handset.

No, not even in banana republics where the government has forced telcos to cut service, the telco has to cut the service.

The legislation even states that telcos don't have to participate but if they opt out then they have to make it clear to customers that they will not recieve these broadcasts, so someone who would like them doesn't end up wasting money on a contract that won't provide what they want.
[General Topics] dandv:
While the government doesn't have an Internet killswitch, "The Cybersecurity and Internet Freedom Act (“CIFA”) does include a vaguely worded provision that enhances the government’s authority over the Internet and that authorizes the Department of Homeland Security in an emergency to shut down some elements of the Internet or to curb some Internet communications, without adequate clarity and limitations. [...] but nonetheless would grant the government extensive power to tell the private sector how it should run its networks." -- Center for Democracy and Technology, February 24, 2011.

But if we want to continue this particular discussion let's do that in the Offtopic forums, as politics was deemed against the rules in this thread and we don't want it closed down.
[General Topics] dandv:
It does cost

That's an unclear part - whether there's a new chip required or not.

But it's certain that hardware modifications are necessary, otherwise all phones would be PLAN-capable already. These hardware modifications cost time and money and R&D resources, and that cost will ultimately fall upon us the customers. Development of other phone features will also be slowed down a bit.
[General Topics] xaccers:
Most phones (I'd imagine practically all, but I don't have the figures to hand) have the capability as it's part of the GSM standard, but it is not enabled by default so that users don't get inundated with messages.

Even my HD2 running droid has the feature.

The only modification would be to have the handset always recieve presidential CBs, and give users the ability to opt into other CBs, which would be software controlled, IE a new setting/app.
[General Topics] Curious!:
yeah right! 9/11 "killed" thousands in america, america killed millions in middle east. sure it will be great
[General Topics] americo1:
plan is customized, it is also the end of the theft?

Is what you can live off phone? :o
[General Topics] bgonderi:
This will probably have another $0.25 "service fee" associated with it as well. I can't wait to see what happens when everyone's phone simultaneously makes the "special ring/vibration" that no one has every heard before.
[General Topics] MaxPower84:
what do you think about developers? it will be possible to use this chip in smart way?
[General Topics] xaccers:
Doesn't look like there is a chip, it uses current technology which your phone is most likely already compatible with.

The most they'll have to do is write the firmware so presidential alerts can't be opted out of.

Storm and teacup spring to mind
[General Topics] evo_like:
I can't imagine this will be a bad thing, really. We all get notified whenever crap is about to hit the fan..lol. But I guess instead of inserting another chip, couldn't the government have like a central messaging service or something, where individual users could go enroll/subscribe into? I don't know...just my two cents.
[General Topics] loldmanjenkins:
ffs there is a special 'chip' for everything now
[General Topics] xaccers:
You mean like how it's actually going to work...
[General Topics] omgdracula:
Im sure developers will come up with a way to disable this, even though the government probably can access our phone information now anyways.
[General Topics] :
lol, they might have just said that they wouldn't have to go into detail..

Side note: Hmm, what if this happened: Some hackers, let's say "Anonymous" or "Lulzsec" somehow get into the system and sends a bunch of spam to our phones? We wouldn't want that would we?
[General Topics] dandv:
Opt in doesn't work

The problem with opting in is that it doesn't work. Take organ donation in case of a fatal road accident:

In Germany, which uses an opt-in system, only 12 percent give their consent; in Austria, which uses opt-out, nearly everyone (99 percent) does. The difference is in how the choice is phrased on the driver license application form:

Germany: check this box if you'd like to be an organ donor

Austria: check this box if you would prefer not to be an organ donor
[General Topics] eibbed0001:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/02/us/in-illinois-tornados-devastation-sinks-in.html

The tornado, gauged preliminarily as having wind speeds around 170 miles per hour, touched down here around 5 a.m. Wednesday, moving swiftly and cutting a path that city officials have described as several hundred yards wide. Warning sirens had gone off here, and some residents described waking even before the sirens to text messages with warnings from local authorities.
[General Topics] antispiral:
I actually think this would be very helpful, much like the tsunami/earthquake warning system they have in Japan. I know people who have their cell phones on them almost all the time. Even in the toilet*cough* so I think it's reach is unquestionable
[General Topics] jm0990:
Hah! My first thought too. We're all hoping for ever thinner phones and now they're mandating unnecessary parts be added.

I guess we can still pick up unlocked gsm phones from international sellers though...
[General Topics] 85gallon:
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you!:D
[General Topics] spunker88:
Why does it need some special chip, couldn't we just have carriers send out a mass text message to all phones with the emergency info. For people without unlimited texting the message would still be free.
[General Topics] scoffyburito:
The Martian invasion plan needs to be rethought :/ damn

Sent from the Nokia Galaxy Nexus Arc 5530 Live with Walkman S2 XL XE S X 3G CDMA LTE T-mo PSN Certified Plus with Beats Audio
[General Topics] xaccers:
If you check out this thread http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1098821 fully, you'll see that it's actually cell broadcasts.

The whole chip stuff was poor journalism and paranoia.
[General Topics] silverfang77:
Big Brother is watching.

I'm not surprised by this, just disgusted.
[General Topics] xaccers:
By what? Cell broadcasting?
[General Topics] burtfurkurl:
Well they can track us, listen to us talking even with the phone off, unless you pull the battery out, our cars have black boxes that can tell the police how fast u were going after a wreck-- all of this we don,t want --and we cannot turn off--but we are learning things thanks to xda and everyone here!
[General Topics] xaccers:
You do know that XDA is a CIA front right?
[General Topics] sitizenx:
Because you are paranoid. Remember the Vchip? The government mandated it. It's in every television bigger than 13inches. Has that slowed down the rate of porn consumption or prevented any cable companies from carrying channels from the middle east? Has the government tracked peoples viewing habits and used it against them? Breath and relax. This is Vchip 2.0. In a few years we will even forget they are in our phones. Unless a blond 6 year old girl goes missing every week... Then your phone will be lit up like the fourth of July every five minutes :)
[General Topics] jt.one:
waste of governmental budget.:confused:

solution? buying devices prior to this =profit
[General Topics] FrankRNC:
The freaking town I live in started using message broadcasts over our home phones. I actually got a call to alert us to the missing dog of a fellow town resident. Now I love dogs, and I hope he finds it, but really? REALLY?

And the worst part is that they somehow have some agreement with Verizon that keeps unanswered call from being forwarded to voicemail. The thing keeps ringing until someone answers it.

Now I know it could help in an emergency, but calling me to announce a missing dog on the other side of town is an excellent example of how easy it is for this to be misused. I can just see it now ... my cell phone ringing because the president lost one of his socks.

---------- Post added at 09:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:39 PM ----------

Oh, and BTW, I'm won't lose any sleep over a chip in my cell phone for these alerts. Someone over in the developers forum will tell me how to turn the damned thing off!! :D:D
[General Topics] zelendel:
Let's hope so. The specs that were leaked and pulled showed it wired into the mic and GPS. Disabling it may dusablebthose as well.
[General Topics] xaccers:
For crying out loud there is no "chip" it's a feature of mobile phones that most have had for nearly a decade.

It's cell broadcasting, it was used when the London 7/7 (for the Americans, that's 7/7) bombs went off to notify people near cell towers as the SMS network was shut down for security in some places and due to overload in others.

You even have the option of opting out of all but the highest priority messages.

That's the only change, that there will be one service level that you can't opt out of that will hopefully never be used.

Think of it like a twitter app where you have to follow high level notifications, and can if you wish follow two lower level notifications.
[General Topics] sitizenx:
I don't know how true this is but if it is I just want to thank you for being a voice of reason. The NSA (the largest congregation of computer scientists and cryptologists in the history of the world) can't even handle all the data they are currently collecting. What makes anyone think they are going to start listening in on your phone calls to your buddies... let alone care?!

By the way you got it backwards... In America it is 7/7. You have to put the month first. Other than that correction, good post.
[General Topics] xaccers:
Dang, thank you for the correction, I always get them mixed up :)
[General Topics] sreza:
Frankly, the conspiracy nuts need to settle down.

First of all, there is no chip.

Second, even if there was, there's nothing stopping you from buying a phone overseas.

Third, Japan has a very similar system already. You know, the one that alerts people moments ahead of time when an earthquake/tsunami/natural disaster is about to hit? That's what this is all about.

Forth, we already have emergency public broadcasting on tv and radio that have a legal right to take control of your programming on command. Does the reigning political party abuse those systems to spread propaganda? Making a similar system for the cell phone network is a natural evolution of these integral services that actually save lives.
[General Topics] twingoonz:
whoa that's kind of creepy
[General Topics] Rakeesh_j:
That's gay that you can't opt out of presidential alerts.
[General Topics] npainter7:
I'm not surprised by this one bit....but I'm not to worried about it. They can do whatever they want.
[General Topics] xaccers:
Surprised by what exactly?

That there isn't a "chip" and it's just a load of paranoid tin foil hat wearing loons that don't read the thread fully and have never heard of cell broadcasting? :)
[General Topics] Zeitgeist4:
george orwell speacking... :(
[General Topics] Kaybabe4:
GOV'T mandate my ****

I started getting texts about school lockdowns, shootings other places, robberies nowhere near me, and governers from different states lately! I can't wait to figure out how they turn those off!! I want to learn myself so I can help too!!!:) :)
[General Topics] masondoctorjt:
You sure It's not 07/07?
[General Topics] npainter7:
I just wouldn't be surprised if it actually did happen that's all. And Im definitely not one of those paranoid weirdos either:D or wouldn't make it a big deal.
[General Topics] lalocolin:
i think its a good idea but, i wonder if sending common sms is cheaper and we wont have to install another chip
[General Topics] xaccers:
The problem with SMS is it can become saturated in an emergency (or event at xmas and new year), and texts are often just dumped, it's also not geographical, so the authorities would send out a SMS to everyone on Vodafone, not much for Vodafone customers in Scotland use if there's an emergency in London.

Also, such as in the case of a terrorist attack, the phone network is likely to be shut to the public, firstly to stop any phone detonators, and also to leave it open to the emergency services.

With cell broadcasting, you can do all that and still get the message out to the public in the area.

---------- Post added at 12:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:37 PM ----------

If you were taking it to two significant figures, but haven't you also made the same mistake I did?

Shouldn't it actually be 07/07?
[General Topics] usaff22:
Hmm. The government can already track all of our moves through CCTV, now GPS and Voice Recording is necessary? I wouldn't be surprised if they started watching our pockets through the front camera.
[General Topics] xaccers:
Since when is GPS and voice recording necessary?

If they could really track anyone through CCTV, New York would have no crime and no missing persons.
[General Topics] cbr69er:
I wonder if it will work in Canada? I usually buy my new phones from t-mobile. I hope we can find a way to remove the chip or disable it at least.
[General Topics] strawww:
I hope it will not work in Canada! If the chip is implemented, I think i'll be stuck with my Nexus S for a long time :P
[General Topics] thehummer12:
Is there a known location of these chips in android phones and is there a way to remove them?

Also, is there any coding that can be executed to bypass roving bugs the FBI uses?
[General Topics] dandv:
Sod off, presidential alert

That's exactly what I did. My reliable Samsung S7 (Asian markets version) has not received today's spam.
[General Topics] galaxys:
Got this big brother alert on my Pixel 2XL :eek:
[General Topics] zelendel:
Should join the lawsuit that started over this. I have. This is too much. It's an invasion of privacy as well as an unwanted tool implanted into every home.
[General Topics] dandv:
Link to the lawsuit

Maybe you could help folks join that lawsuit by providing some information about it?
[General Topics] zelendel:
https://www.cnet.com/news/new-yorkers-sue-trump-and-fema-to-stop-presidential-alert/

This was to try and prevent it at first. I have already contacted a few lawyers on my end about it.

For me it's really less about it being Trump. I don't care who it is. If I want you to get a whole of me the I will give you my number. Other then that there is almost zero they could say that I would care about
[Android Themes] kanttii:
Feeling old-school, eh?

After using these graphics for a while on my phone (especially statusbar icons), I thought to share these in here too. So here you go, if anyone wants these, the res folder from Android SDK m3-rc22a. The graphics are obviously MDPI resolution since only that existed back then.

I know that this thread is not very useful to most of XDA members, but at least these files were for me.

Download: http://goo.gl/YidRo