yashsingh1/xdaforums huggingface dataset:
[EVO 4G General] ZachPA:
For the most part, Verizon's LTE network will be more consistent than Sprint's WiMAX network. It's because of the frequencies used and nothing else.

Verizon purchased a large chunk of the 700 MHz band for their use and is deploying LTE on that band. Sprint and Clear use the 2.5 GHz band for the WiMAX network in most places.

The physics of electromagnetic radiation make the 700 MHz band superior for penetrating both man-made and natural features like buildings, cars, topography and flora, as compared with the 2.5 GHz band. Typically, as the frequency increases, the radio signal gets drowned out in a shorter distance and interfered with by more items. Very low frequencies travel forever, while very high frequencies like light can't make it past two thin sheets of paper.

The 2.4 GHz band is famous for its use by Wi-Fi devices and cordless telephones. WiMAX transmissions over the 2.5 GHz band are subject to the same types of things that attenuate your Wi-FI signal and make it weak in parts of your house: walls--especially steel or block walls, topography, trees, and even heavy rain! While WiMAX is a higher power transmission than your typical Wi-Fi, it still can't overcome the 2.5 GHz band's physics.

About the only thing going for the WiMAX band at 2.5 GHz is that it can carry over 3x the data per timeslice than the 700 MHz band.

What this means for us is that we should be able to maintain a connection to the LTE network in more places and through more interference than we can with WiMAX. How the network acts once we are connected is a different story, however.
[EVO 4G General] Bielinsk:
4g does not have the same capabilities that 3g does in handing off communications from one tower to the next.

So when you move from one tower to another, you need to re-establish the connection. SO if you are on a train, in a car, or a skateboard, you will outrun the signal. I believe 4g towers cover about 2-4 miles.

4g is great if you are staying put. If you are moving and trying to stream or download files, you are going to have a problem. I do not know if LTE handles the hand-off any better.
[EVO 4G General] NewZJ:
My 4g kicks ass, check out this speed!
[EVO 4G General] jxr94:
I only use 4G when I'm in a line or sitting somwhere waiting for something. The battery drain and inconsistency isn't really worth it. Also don't recommend it when your moving. But when you wanna watch a video or won't be moving for a little while, its the bees knees!

Charger not included lol.
[EVO 4G General] misterzeno:
I agree with everything you say TC. I am in Houston and the only time I use 4G is at work because its pointless to try when moving around the city.
[EVO 4G General] Genjinaro:
^This

I experience this riding on Amtrak NE Regional & SEPTA Regional Rail into work, its better in the car. On the train its a headache dealing with the hand-offs.

The NEC from Philly to New York has Sprint 4G coverage but not much use unless your train is making many stops.
[EVO 4G General] corynat:
Yeah, I quickly figured out the same thing the OP did. 4G is great if you are staying in the same area. Causes more problems than it solves when trying to stream music in the car. If the phone could handle the switchover with some grace it would not be so bad, but the loss of signal while it loses 4G and 3G picks up is a pain.
[EVO 4G General] fadimo305:
Uhhh.ok Stop Complaining WIMAX IS SUPERIOR TO LTE.at the end of 2011 or by January 2012 clearwire will be upgrading their Wimax to the new WIMAX Revision 2,this upgrade will make Wimax 2X faster than LTE. So just wait :)
[EVO 4G General] aph:
Wimax is awesome. Just keep trying and when you get it, don't move (your body or the phone).

And make sure to use it to its full potential before it kicks you off.
[EVO 4G General] sog1971:
Sad, but true. In all reality, many of us are covered by wi-fi at home and at work -- which for me at least is about 80% of the time.

I would hope that in the "rare" occasion that I would like to fire up the expensive beast during my commute to stream some high quality encoded tunes or a movie, that it would be a pleasant experience and not just 30 seconds of music followed by 30 seconds of stutter, followed by 30 seconds of silence, followed by a flashing dead battery warning.

We are getting closer to this "always connected" nirvana - maybe in the next generation. At least we will have the war stories of expensive data add-on bills (and soon to be caps), spotty coverage, and battery life panic to pass on to this next "always connected" generation....the same way the previous generation passed on their "had to walk five miles uphill to school each day, in their bare feet" stories.
[EVO 4G General] vbetts:
It would actually be nice to have Wimax first.
[EVO 4G General] CheesyNutz:
yea no sh*t
[EVO 4G General] Cuppeerr:
I loveeeee my 4g

http://db.tt/N8EWAVq

Thats my speed in dallas. Holy god I cant use the xda app for android......
[EVO 4G General] Cuppeerr:
Wow stupid xda app double post
[EVO 4G General] Sim-X:
I didn't know wimax couldn't do a hand off from tower to tower. Does anyone know if Verizon's LTE network can do a handoff or does it have to reconnect as well? No wonder I have wanted to through my phone out the window trying to stream music over 4G in the car. Is this a limitation on wimax or something that sprint just haven't got working yet? So even if Sprint went LTE it prob wouldn't help indoor coverage anyway cause of the bands they use?

Also has anyone tried Verizon's LTE network driving around? I'm so curious to see how it works in my market or just in general.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
Average smartphone data usage is less than 500 MB/month (*less than 200 MB in 2010 and under current trends won't even exceed 2GB in 2015). Most people wouldn't notice a thing, except well, that their download speeds will be several times faster under TMO.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
(If you are even capable of getting these speeds via your mobile data radio which is doubtful) you're not going to notice a difference downloading apps, surfing the web, checking email, or streaming music.

Period.

The only time you would is downloading torrents or huge files on fast servers, streaming HD video and movies, or server related tasks.

Guess how long that pathetic 5GB cap will last you doing any of that?

Pointless.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
You throw opinions, I throw data. The usual from you. So HSPA+ is both faster and more battery effecient, plus most users will never get close to 5GB, and even if theu do, you'd still be able to do a majority of the things that you do with the throttled speeds. Throttled speeds which I might add are what alot of people have to endure for unthrottled 3G data on Sprint.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
Matty, why don't you go ahead and repeat your usual 3g data speeds again. Then go on Sprint.com and mention your usual data usage. I'm certain that you'll lie but I'll be satisified enough knowing that you realized how wrong you are even in your own personal usage case.
[EVO 4G General] DirtyShroomz:
Coming from the individual that gets proved incorrectly by everyone on this forum and quietly backs out of every conversation? Yes I see the data daily, do you?
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
I'm looking at data right now. Average smartphone data usage in 2010 was less than 200 MB /month and is expected to barely pass 1.5 GB in 2015.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
You throw un-cited data that is MEANINGLESS. The usual from you.

I've seen no data that proves that HSPA+ is better on battery.

You continue to ignore the fact that there's NO DIFFERENCE between 8mbps and 42mbps when you are referring to "normal usage."

Moreover, I don't want to hear about "current trends" that "seem to indicate" that "people won't be at 2GB / month usage until 2015".

That is meaningless too.

Why? First of all, predicting the future is a joke.

How many companies thought Android was going to explode like it did in the last year?

None.

Secondly, as mobile data speeds up the mobile pages and mobile usages will increase.

When the vast majority of people had dial up, 95% of the internet was text only.

Now, well that number is significantly less.

No one is able to predict usage for the next year much less the next 5.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
Go on Google then type "Average smartphone data usage", it'll save everyone else's time and will likely prevent you from continually looking dumb to people who actually know the unbiased truth.

I'd link it here but I'm on my phone plus you need the practice. Maybe it'll help you next time.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
Listen friend, EVEN IF the average usage is as low as they say (And I really doubt it's as low as you say it is. My mom uses 500MB a month and she doesn't do much of anything abnormal), that doesn't change the fact that those speeds are meaningless to people that only do "normal usage."

Those speeds only have a point if you can stream HD movies, download large files or server related tasks.

None of which you can do with a 5GB cap.
[EVO 4G General] DirtyShroomz:
How many smartphones were around in 2010 on Sprint before June? Lets rephrase that, how many smartphones at that time could actually do anything that was data intensive? 0.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
If your mom uses 500 MB a month, even a marginal improvement in speed is better. She probably uses EVDO and not WiMax either, so guess what? HSPA+ would be significantly faster than Sprint's crummy EVDO.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
This isn't Sprint only data. Smart phones weren't invented in June 2010. Plus iPhone users were pegged at about 300-400 MB /month, and they've had a lot of streaming options for a long time.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
No, but they became popular in the second half of 2010.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
iPhone users... see my above edit.
[EVO 4G General] DirtyShroomz:
Did I say Sprint only? No phone was data intensive in 2010, not even your God phone. Matter of fact until the release of Froyo, Android was still worthless as advanced as it was. iPhone has always been worthless, they can't do anything but stream netflix, that is if you could keep a signal with atts overcrowded network.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
Man, you really are pushing the boundaries here.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
Only Netflix huh? You're both clueless and biased.

PS: ATT 3g absolutely crushes Sprint's in NYC.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
And you're ignoring the important parts of the conversation by fixating on this idea that data usage won't significantly increase as more bandwidth becomes available.

We have undeniable proof that as bandwidth increases, so does usage.

The argument that "well people don't use it now so they don't need it" is ridiculous at best.

Speeds like 42mbps only mean something if you can actually use them for what that kind of bandwidth is made for.

With 42mbps Video chat will never have an issue. Thus, people will use it more and that technology is likely to lead to group video chats and so forth.

With 42mbps you can stream HD movies without an issue as well, thus that usage will increase.

Google Music is about to come to all and that is going to cause a lot more usage via mobile.

Etc etc etc.

Stop ignoring the reality of the situation and stop falling back on predicting charts that anyone with half a brain know are never even remotely accurate
[EVO 4G General] DirtyShroomz:
You know how he is.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
You see I never did say usage will not increase. In fact I said the opposite. You are basing your growth predictions entirely on personal random assumptions and piss, me? Ill let the people who took the time to analyze the data to do the talking. They predicted a very healthy pick up from about 150mb in 2010 to 1.5 GB in 2015. No where near 5GB and that's without saying that you could get a cheap off contract plan with no obligations under TMO.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
How many of those people predicted in 2009 that Android would be where it is in 2011?

I could give you a hundred more examples of predictions of this nature being wrong but that one right there settles the validity of these predictions.

I remember most of these "analysts" writing Android off, actually.
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
I don't remember that. Maybe the Apple clowns who were as biased and defensive as you are. Growth in 2009 was steady and promising. Tons of OEMs jumped on in 2009, and the signs and numbers pointed to the possibility of success.
[EVO 4G General] madiom:
OP, I think its just you, 4g is good here in Los Angeles. I use it during my commute (when I am not driving) all the time. Locks on and stays on, with good speeds the whole 2 hours it takes for us to get the 20 miles back home.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
Alright friend, alright :o
[EVO 4G General] Award Tour:
Alright, alright? I'm tired of your BS. You pretty much say what YOU WANT to think is true.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
Is it "talk about yourself" day?
[EVO 4G General] fadimo305:
READ.WiMAX is used internationally/worldwide (Asia,Europe,USA..etc).The wimax r2 upgrade is inexpensive and the frequency change is already happening it just takes time for them to deploy the equipment also the rate at which wimax is being upgraded is really good since wimax R2 was proposes as so was the standard.
[EVO 4G General] fadimo305:
Its not what its labeled but what the technology can acheive the standards set be the IMT.HSPA is not considered real 4G because it does not meet the requirements sure 42mbps is great but it can't reach peak speeds wimax can.i agree sprint messed up on what frequency they place wimax but if they had set it to LTE frequency/band it will reach speeds of 90mbps(true 4G)
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
Did they really have a choice? Is it not the FCC that controls the available frequency?
[EVO 4G General] phatmanxxl:
Drove 8 Hrs to get some 4g goodness

Aurora Il

3g 544 down

4g 144 down

Awsome.

I got better 3g in southern Missouri.

Last year in lilburn GA I got 3g 12xx/25xx 4g down.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
In the mountains in PA I was getting 1 mbit on 3g so I don't know what to tell ya.
[EVO 4G General] r916:
I'm in citrus heights ans I work in sac, I don't know what your smoking but I average over 1mbps on 3g and 4-10 on 4g (sac). My friends TB barely gets over. 80kbps on 3g and he lives in roseville(by carmax).

Edit: 1.50mbps on speedtest app in citrus heights just now
[EVO 4G General] theoner1:
Wow 4g in Sac, CA is much more reliable than in the Bay Area. Inside Nordstrom Rack Arden as I'm typing and my 4G is in the 5,6 Mbps INDOOR. Im way in the back of the store waiting for the wife and 4g not once lose signal or slow down this whole time. Imo much more reliable than at my Moms house in Oakland. Just thought I share my experience.
[EVO 4G General] Sim-X:
Wish it was like that here.
[EVO 4G General] phatmanxxl:
I don't get it, 4g over here is completely useless. Its like that all over the western suburbs.
[EVO 4G General] hypersonicx:
For everyone with bad 3G / 4G, might be time to just jump ship to another provider. I can understand complaining if Sprint was the only cell provider in the US but thats why there are others to choose from LOL

Might be best to try a GSM provider is CDMA is not good in your area. I was on TMobile and just switched to Sprint about a month ago and love it. Compared to TMobile over here. CDMA owns the GSM providers here in Nashville TN.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
As product Fred said, jump ship to what?

Att hasn't had an unlimited data plan since the dinosaurs.

Verizon is done with it this summer and their prices are much higher.

T-Mobile has much less coverage than the other three and is capped at either two or five GB.

So where ya going?

Speeds are in the rise across the country, if you're going somewhere its too late.

You waited this long, might as well hold out until June 30th (the planned date for these fixes nationwide)
[EVO 4G General] phatmanxxl:
The thing is I don't live in northern illi, in Missouri the 3g is just fine usually between 800-1200 kbs. Im just disappointed that im spending a week in the big city and the data speed on 4g and 3g around here surprisingly blows. I used to have T-Mobile but where I live there is only aTT, VZW and sprint available.
[EVO 4G General] r916:
Yeah I work near Arden. When I visited family in San Francisco I was constantly getting 8+
[EVO 4G General] Strife025:
I hate how finicky WiMax is. I live in SoCal and get really good 4g most of the time, around 5-6mb down speeds.

I work on the 3rd floor of an office building though, and I can't get a good signal up there. When I go down to the first floor cafeteria for lunch I get 3 bars on 4g and excellent speeds.

We had a technology showcase a couple weeks ago though and Verizon came out with a booth. It was on the fourth floor and they were showing off working 4g. I asked the dude about it and he said that LTE uses a much lower frequency then WiMax? I hope Sprint 4g gets more optimized down the road...

It's awesome when it works, too bad optimal conditions are so specific.
[EVO 4G General] senji75:
It's funny, I get horrible 4g service here ( Bridgeport, CT ). It was even in the newspapers here that Sprint is now turning the service "on". Honestly, its just not worth it. I watch my wife's 4g phone on verizon blow my evo away.
[EVO 4G General] LexLuger82:
I

join vzw
[EVO 4G General] funcrusher:
Same here.
[EVO 4G General] swaze:
Those speeds are only relevent if yoy can get a good signal....but most places T-Mobile customers can only get edge......so it sounds nice but majority of the network can't see any of that.
[EVO 4G General] saj1jr:
Only used it once, in Chicago, and it was awesome. I'd imagine smaller areas, not so much.
[EVO 4G General] Sim-X:
I like Sprint and my 3G speeds have been fine especially since I updated my radio and removed the proxy. I'm not just gonna jump ship because Sprint made a bad choice with WiMax. They were first to market with 4G and were first in getting 4G in my area. It just so happens that it sucks. There are all kinds of rumors of Sprint going LTE and even if they don't I'm sure they will get things fixed down the road. If I jump ship now sweet I get the thunderbolt and have a dead battery all the time. Yea LTE might be nice but I'm on wi-fi a lot anyway so wouldn't do me that much good right now. I just hope Sprint has a long term plan for 4G cause the current wimax setup sucks a phat one.
[EVO 4G General] snick8467:
rochester, ny

speed test 2139/289 on 4g and 194/550 on 3g

tested back to back
[EVO 4G General] mikeyxda:
Sarasota, FL... would be happy to even GET 4G so I could test it. They're mighty slow with the rollout.

Mike
[EVO 4G General] oespinoza83:
Live in Houston. 4G works excellent at my house and job. I only really need it at these times, so I think it's a positive. I can understand the OP complaining about the signals dropping while driving, etc, but I never use my phone when driving other than Navigation if I need it, and even then 3G or 4G doesn't matter since I still get a signal.

I think most people in non-4G cities that are hoping to get 4G believe it will blanket the entire city with a perfect signal every square foot of the city with outstanding downloads 24/7/365. It won't. But there are patches of areas that give these stats, you just have to find them.
[EVO 4G General] 632627:
for all the problems and complaints people have with sprint's wimax, verizon's lte is just as bad(and was way worse for me).

I am a long time sprint customer and 4g actually works great at my house. my family has a shared plan with verizon so i added on and bought a Droid Charge and decided to switch over if the service was good during the 14 day trial.

When LTE works, its damn fast. Unfortunately, there are lots of different issues I had, and apparently others as well by looking on different forums, be it with the thunderbolt or charge.

among them.... 4g connectivity randomly switching to 3g, even when the 3g signal is very weak. Wifi issues during tethering. Data connectivity completely off, and forcing a restart or airplane mode toggle to work again.

These issues are well documented across many forums, and caused me to ditch verizon after only a week. Yes i got verizon 4g coverage in lots of places, yes it was faster than sprint's 4g, but the overall experience was worse for me.

the grass isnt always greener on the other side...
[EVO 4G General] liverstealerJobs:
Not to discount your results. I have friends who own the Tbolt and I also read the forums. It seems that these problems are with the phone and not the network. An OTA update even created a random reboot problem. The launch of the Tbolt was most probably delayed for a reason. They haven't figured out how to get the phone to play nice with the network, yet.

That is my perception. In my area Verizon just built out their LTE in just 3 months, while Sprint/Clear has been dragging their a$$es since announcing in 2009.

I will buy the EVO 3D off contract and wait to see if Verizon offers a similar phone. I will then jump carriers and sell the 3D and wash my hands of Sprint, a carrier I have been with since 1999.

My main concern is that Verizon is now under the sphere of influence of Apple. That will most certainly retard any Android phone offerings. I await future developments.
[EVO 4G General] Bp3dots:
Here in Cleveland, 4G has worked great for me. I get better 4G signal in my store than I do 3G, Speeds are consistently around 5 DN. I do know a few spots where I won't get signal, but they show on the map as no coverage, so that's to be expected. I've been running full time 4G since February and I refuse to go back.
[EVO 4G General] 632627:
i owned the charge, not the thunderbolt, but the issues seem to be the same if you look through both the charge and thunderbolt forums. Bottom line is that 4g for both networks isnt as polished as 3g. I was going to leave sprint, and my SERO plan, as well as the excellent voice and data service ive experienced the last 4 years to get on Verizon and its LTE network. Like i said, when it works, its fast, and the droid charge is better than any current sprint phone... but the verizon lte network still has kinks that need to be worked out(whether its with the network, the phones or both) and i stayed with sprint.
[EVO 4G General] mattykinsx:
Brand new technologies don't always work 100% in the beginning?!

Who knew!?

This is why I don't buy new technology on the day it's released.
[EVO 4G General] leo72793:
I honestly never had, used, nor paid for 4g thanks to calling late @ night and them not remembering to charge me :P.

Its not that great. i get 3g speeds up to 6mb dl n 7 up when in normal areas of use
[EVO 4G General] dw3bb10:
-_-

3G will max at about 3mb down and 800kbps or so upload. 4G doesnt even deliver 7mb up, its capped at 1mb so WTF are you talking about?!
[EVO 4G General] dwntwnall4u:
Finally got to try out 4G while in Vegas. I must say for me it did suck. Very inconsistent with Mac download around 2.6 Mbps
[EVO 4G General] Marlowr05:
It will be very interesting to see what Sprint and Lightsquared have in the plans for the future. In my opinion for Sprint to stay alive they must build out there network or they will die. Sorry just speaking the truth.
[EVO 4G General] Sim-X:
That's interesting. I would love to switch to the Thunderbolt for a few days just to try it around here to see how it compares.

Hopefully Sprint can close this LightSquared deal.
[EVO 4G General] Lancerz:
Yes sprints 4g is utter garbage...unless you stand outside all day in the same spot and dont move then its awesome!