TELCORN
Senator Percy

Mr. Kissinger

7-17-69 10:00 AM

K said he has read Aiken statement which he thinks is very good. K said
he talked to Fulbright last night in the sense he and P had discussed.
Fulbright said he would join them. K said he does not know what he will
say. P said the one he is concerned about is Teddy Kennedy. P talked
with Farris last night and asked him to have Mike brief Kennedy on what
is transpiring so he will either be quiet or help. P said we will probably
have to do it Tuesday. K asked if P thought he should call Aiken about
the statement and P said it was not necessary. K said he would send something
to P for Symington. P said K was going to give him names of other
people that would be favorable. K said P probably has better judgment
on that than K does. K said the only thing he would say is that it does not
help us if it turns into series of talks pressing us to do more.

P said on another subject how does he proceed to have briefing by Rowland
Herbst. K said to call Laird's office. K said when he talks to Mel later
he will tell him that P will be calling and that we look favorably on it.
P said he has to call him about something else and will mention this - no
need for K to call him.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958
By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCOM

Bill Sullivan
Mr. Kissinger

7-17-69 10:30 AM

K said on private talk he has question re para 29 were we talk about prisoners. K said he knows a lot of this is technical stuff that refers to specifics. President is getting itchy about what he takes to be abject behavior on this thing. K mentioned using peace group and thanking them 60 times for releasing the prisoners - he notices we are thanking them again and K asked if this could be toned down a bit. K said another point - what business is it of theirs how we bring them home. S said this is what they put to Dellinger. K asked why it had to be repeated at private next meeting. S said he would find out exact background on this. He will call Paris and ask them to tone down and see if there is any need to reassure them directly since it has already been done thru Dellinger.

K asked if anything had happened yet in Paris. S said he has not heard but Bui Diem indicated they would not be competing with the moon shot and would be very negative.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

TELCON
Elliot Richardson
Mr. Kissinger

7-17-69

11:45 AM

K asked if R had some up with anything we can announce on China before
leaving on trip. R said he has memo which is being rewritten.

K said he does not think we should offer cultural exchange - just say we
would be willing, if Chinese would/willing to receive them, to permit
be

students to study there. R said memo he is sending over oxx covers
several things - most promising is tourist thing which R understands Pres
would be willing to go ahead with. R said he was going to suggest
consideration of lifting of restriction on trade to include

grain shipments only - also possibility of lifting travel restrictions.

R said trouble with that is xiao longx restrictions are unenforceable anyway.

K said would we have to say that and R said if you allude only to China,
what about North Korea, Vietnam, Cuba etc. R said restrictions expire
Sept 15 unless renewed. R said K's thought on students might be way of
doing this - we would be prepared to lift travel restrictions for students
and journalists and members of congress. K agreed. K said if he
can get that approved tonight, could we announce tomorrow or Monday.

R said he should think so - does not require consultation. K said he could
call Mundt and advise him. R said he would get memo over this afternoon
and McCloskey could do in regular briefing tomorrow. K said fine.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

TELCORN
Senator Javits

Mr. Kissinger

7-17-69 5:45 PM

J said he is really of a mind to give this Administration help with the
Surtax - he is concerting his speech making on it with John Williams
of Delaware. J said here is what he would like to ask: When original
surtax was passed, he put amendment on it which required Admin
to submit ____. What J would like to put on this one is resolution
which amounts to commitment that we will act on tax
reform promptly. J said his argument in proposing that is because
Democratic Policy Cte is wrong. K mentioned something about
Secy Kennedy and then had to get off phone because President was calling -
K said he would call J back.

jm

(K called J back but he was out of office - word was left)

J later called back to say he had talked with Secy Kennedy and matter
was taken care of

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958
By DS NARA Date 4/15/1986

TELECON

Secretary Laird
Mr. Kissinger

July 17, 1969 -- 6:25 p. m.

Secretary Laird said there were two things which he had failed to mention in their meeting of the a. m. (1) Robert Ferry's nomination as Civil Administrator to the Ryukyus. Ferry is a career Foreign Service Officer (L is sending the background to K). The reason he wanted K to know about it in advance was because he thought perhaps the WH might want to go ahead and approve Ferry before the President visits Okinawa. The procedure is that he will be designated by the Secretary of Defense after and with the approval of the President -- and approval of the Secretary of State, which L has already obtained. K said he couldn't see any reason why this wouldn't be approved; he will check it out.

(2) The second urgent item is General Carter's replacement. K said L could not know what a battle he had been fighting for L on this one. He has been keeping Maxwell Taylor off L's back -- he feels his Board is entitled to make a recommendation; and K has told him to deal with L on any recommendation. L said his recommendation is at the White House -- he recommends Admiral Kiler (?) K said this is a very sensitive position and that not too many people are qualified to fill it. L said Kiler is; at one time he was military assistant to Tom Gates; and L feels Kiler is first-rate. L asked for recommendations from the 3 services through the JCS. He personally conducted the interviews. He chose Kiler because he will do a good job. K said this is one on which it is essential that it not turn into a bureaucratic donnybrook, and asked the deadline for action. L said the incumbent retires on August 1. K said we should be able to do this one before the trip. K said there was no problem on the first item; the second one, only insofar as the sensitivity of the position. He repeated that he thought action could be taken on both before departure on the trip.

L said, on a third item, the nerve gas leak on Okinawa, a memo had been sent to the White House in early July giving details, to Col Haig. Herb Klein had called Laird and said Rogers and Kissinger didn't know anything about the matter. K said this wasn't so; when the news broke this afternoon, we here at the White House were trying to assemble the facts so the President could be informed. Laird said he was sending another memo over this date referencing the earlier one and giving more details.

lds

DECLASSIFIED

TELECON

Col. Borman
Mr. Kissinger

7/17/69, 10:30 p. m.

B said he just got a reply to his phone call and he said they gave him
complete perimeters and the assurance that it won't interfere with
Apollo 11. B said he was told they would remain in orbit for two days
and there is an indication that it will not land. K said that's very
interesting. K asked if this was his first call and B said it was the
first and it was signed Kaldish(?). B said he asked them to cable
the answer because he couldn't get it all over the telephone. K asked
if there was any achievement. B said no achievement, orbit just like
ours. B said they gave the exact perimeter of the orbit which they
have not as yet done. B said this was the first time they have
indicated anything about their flights like this. B said he gave this
information to the trajectory people and wondered if they should make
mention of it. K asked if there would be this would be an interesting
scientific fact and B said it would and it would also make people a
little heartened about cooperation. K said that is what I don't want.
K told B to tell Houston to keep their mouths shut until the morning
and B said fine.

DECLASSIFIED

Telecon
Senator Mundt
11:15 a.m. 7/18/69

K said in light line with their conversation the other day, we have
cancelled that particular set of measures. For the reasons which
he gave, we are now considering some others which K preferred wated
to run by Mundt. (1) the lifting of tourist purchases on imported
boods. Would be $100 limit on good manufactured there. They still
pay the tariff. Goods cannot be resold in U.S. All this does is to
permit American tourists to buy goods for non-commercial use.

Mundt said this would be o.k. with him. The second point K brought
of was travel restrictions. There is a Supreme Court decision which
makes those illegal anyway. Point 3 - to permit grain shipment, not
fertilizers. Mundt said that would be one that would give some trouble.
K said we don't want to propose something that they can reject. We are
trying to needle the Russians. To make them believe something is
going on. What can the Chicomos say.

Mundt said again that the first two were o.k. but the third one could
get a lot of cirticixom. K said we would like to get something done on
this before leaving on the trp.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958
By DS NARA Date 4/15/66

7-18-69 11:20 AM

K said he has not talked to President yet on Chinese business
but he thinks decision will be to go along with end of travel restrictions,
tourist thing and will hold the grain one too. K asked if R could get
machinery into motion to get those things announced Monday.
K added that he wants to talk to President again. K said we do
not want to get an answer from Moscow on SALT and do this right away.
R referred to problem on Mongolia and said he thinks it would be bad
to notify Taipei and then pull back. K said he would talk to Pres right
away. R said on travel thing would be all travel or travel for
designated groups. K said he would say designated groups. R said
they can amend regulations for individual groups as a whole.
R said he thinks we should be sure we are going to do it before we go
back to Hill or Taipei. K said he has talked to Mundt and will
support two things. R said Macomber feels there are people who should
hear this before they read it in the newspaper. K said that's his job
to feel that way. R said he thought we should do it if we could. K asked
how much time Macomber needs. R said it could be done today and could
be announced tomorrow. K said he would let R know in an hour.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O.12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCOM

Minister Tcherniakov
Mr. Kissinger
7-18-69 12:00 N 11:50 AM

K said he was calling about our astronaut Frank Borman who called Keldish the other day to ask about Soviet lunar mission and he received a telegram in reply that gives him a few details about it. K said it is not of very great significance - just when it went into orbit, etc. K said we wanted to announce from NSA the fact that this exchange had taken place. K asked if there was any objection on T's part. T said he did not know anything about this. K said it is good exchange of technical cooperation. K said he does not even understand the telegram - you have to be a space scientist. K said all that would be announced is that Col Borman telephoned Keldish and received tel in reply. T said there was no objection in his personal opinion and thanked K for calling. K said it will be announced in low-key as technical exchange. T said he was looking forward to meeting K on Monday and K said he was too.

jm

DECLASSIFIED
Authority E.O.12958
By DS NARA Date 4/15/66

TELCONE
Attorney General Mitchell
Mr. Kissinger
7-18-69 12:20 PM

K said Pres wanted him at M's convenience to go over that cable
so M would have it in mind when he has that conversation. K said
he would give M essence. M asked if he had changed his mind about
it being done after trip. K said no, but it may be after the trip that it
can be said what is this about. M said he did not follow that.
K said nothing may have happened four weeks while we are all traveling.
M said he thinks it is deeper than that. K said o.k. - at any rate
it tends to put on basis to make everyone speak with the same voice.
Should not see Soviet Amb without telling President even if we say the
same thing. M said that is his point - not speaking with the same voice
at all and have to show just who is running the show. K said it should
not take more than 15 minutes and they agreed to meet at 4:30 today.
K said he has a meeting at that time but person could wait.

K said there was another private talk with Hanoi today. They are more
forthcoming than they have been in a long time - suggested very specific
procedures re technical commission and asked what does President
mean by this, this, this, etc. K said he was not too eager to let Billl
Sullivan run negotiations while everyone is traveling. M agreed.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

TELCON
The President
Mr. Kissinger

7-18-69 12:30 PM

K said he was `gx` calling about Chinese thing and would be useful if we could announce tomorrow. E Richardson has now recommended three things - tourist purchases, easing travel restrictions for certain categories and grain sales. K said he has checked with Mundt who agrees to first two but not third. Pres said first two were o.k. but not the third.

Pres said he wanted K to call Mansfield personally on that. K said he would
do so.

K said secondly, a private meeting took place today which indicated that perhaps the last private meeting of six weeks ago may have been a response to note to Dobrynin as K suspected it might have been. They were very specific and asked 12 questions about P's speech of May 14. K told P the questions. K said he has `taxx` talked to some people and mood in Congress has shifted very much in favor of P. P and K discussed Rogers' appearance on hill. K said he talked to someone who accompanied Rogers and they were supposed by degree to which FAC took position in P's favor.

P said `theyxixk` it could be they have gone too far. K said they propse establishment of working group and what we will have to watch now is to make sure State will not run with this enterprise. K said message P sent this week was very well timed. P asked if he would deliver it Monday and K said he told him he would call him tonight to let him know whether he could go ahead.

P said in K's backgrounder if question comes up, be sure to say we have been disappointed in Russians insofar as ME and VN are concerned. K filled President in on Borman-Keldish exchange.

Pres asked if Shakespeare called on K. K said not yet, he will see him this afternoon. P filled in K on what Shakespeare had told him. Discussed ABM and K said it may be that opponents of ABM are getting worried.

Mathias called for appt with K and is coming in today - said he had to see
him today. P said he heard Jackson was superb in private session -
demoralized Symington. P and K agreed Senators are getting scared
after hearing intelligence briefgins. Opponents have shifted line on SS9.

P said he thinks intelligence community is shaping up - K agreed, saying we have them scared. K said both `xx` he and Mitchell have refused to go over drafts - we do not want them to accept our dictates.

P said for K to call Mansfield and say Pres personally asked him to call and say when we return P will fill M in on conversation with Yaya.

DECLASSIFIED

*

-2-

P and K discussed China thing again and P said to go along on first two but not the wheat. Tell Richardson this would pose Congressional problems. K said R will go along with whatever P decides.

P and K discussed trip. K said he talked to Romanian Amb and Sunday morning program is now locked in. P said in K's backgrounder one thing that P expects to say in his if asked about one-day visit and whether it means anything. P said his answer is and has been for years - you learn as much in one day as you do in one month. Ohly if you are going to stay a year, do you learn more than you do in one day. K might point out that P has been to all these countries and most important thing is serious substantive talks. Another thing the P has knocked off is time spent with American Community - have to be priorities. American side will be done by SecState and others. Most important thing is face-to-face talk to leaders. K brought up P's arrival back here - everyone thinks should be 10:00 at Andrews. P agreed. K said he is tentatively planning subject to P's approval to meet with some intellectuals in P's name. This would be done in order to conserve Presidents time and energy. P agreed. P said finally, re VN they have now come in with plan to visit, three different military units within 10 minutes of palace - in same base area and security is adequate. P said fine, let's do it. P asked how long and K said 1 and 1/2 hrs. P asked about announcement and K said we will not announce it at all. P and K talked about what themes of trip should be

jm

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O.12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

7-18-69

12:30 PM

K said he was <u>gx</u> calling about Chinese thing and would be useful if we could announce tomorrow. E Richardson has now recommended three things - tourist purchases, easing travel restrictions for certain categories and grain sales. K said he has checked with Mundt who agrees to first two but not third. Pres said first two were o.k. but not the third.
Pres said he wanted K to call Mansfield personally on that. K said he would do so.

K said secondly, a private meeting took place today which indicated that perhaps the last private meeting of six weeks ago may have been a response to note to Dobrynin as K suspected it might have been. They were very specific and asked 12 questions about P's speech of May 14. K told P the questions. K said he has <u>taxx</u> talked to some people and mood in Congress has shifted very much in favor of P. P and K discussed Rogers' appearance on hill. K said he talked to someone who accompanied Rogers and they were surposed by degree to which FAC took position in P's favor.

P said <u>theyxu andk</u> it could be they have gone too far. K said they propse establishment of working group and what we will have to watch now is to make sure State will not run with this enterprise. K said message P sent this week was very well timed. P asked if he would deliver it Monday and K said he told him he would call him tonight to let him know whether he could go ahead.

Pres asked if Shakespeare called on K. K said not yet, he will see him this afternoon. P filled in K on what Shakespeare had told him. Discussed ABM and K said it may be that opponents of ABM are getting worried. Mathias called for appt with K and is coming in today - said he had to see him today. P said he heard Jackson was superb in private session - demoralized Symington. P and K agreed Senators are getting scared after hearing intelligence briefgins. Opponents have shifted line on SS9. P said he thinks intelligence community is shaping up - K agreed, saying we have them scared. K said both <u>an</u> he and Mitchell have refused to go over drafts - we do not want them to accept our dictates.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.0.12958
By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

-2-

P and K discussed trip. K said he talked to Romanian Amb and Sunday morning program is now locked in. P said in K's backgrounder one thing that P expects to say in his if asked about one-day visit and whether it means anything. P said his answer is and has been for years - you learn as much in one day as you do in one month. Ohly if you are going to stay a year, do you learn more than you do in one day. K might point out that P has been to all these countries and most important thing is serious substantive talks. Another thing the P has knocked off is time spent with American Community - have to be priorities. American side will be done by SecState and others. Most important thing is face-to-face talk to leaders. K brought up P's arrival back here - everyone thinks should be 10:00 at Andrews. P agreed. K said he is tentatively planning subject to P's approval to meet with some intellectuals in P's name. This would be done in order to conserve Presidents time and energy. P agreed. P said finally, re VN they have now come in with plan to visit three different military units within 10 minutes of palace - in same base area and security is adequate. P said fine, let's do it. P asked how long and K said 1 and 1/2 hrs. P asked about announcement and K said we will not announce it at all. P and K talked about what themes of trip should be

jm

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

Telecon
Secretary Rogers
5:00 p.m. 7/18/69

Rogers said he was sure K was disturbed about the chemical leak. K said disturbed is no expression. He explained it happened when a painter decided to paint the canisters white; the shot blasted to get a smooth surface and it punctured a hole in it. Rogers said this was a stupid move that McNamara made by deciding to deploy new gas overseas. K said he didn't see any sense in it; they could have put it on Guam.

Rogers said if K would be talking to the President tonight, he wanted K to mention that they have talked to Resor(?) and have urged them to get it off the island so that when Rogers arrives, this won't be too bad. He said they tried to get them to move it immediately and then they could say it happened during the move. They both agreed this possibility still existed but K said he would have authorized the move if they had called.

K mentioned his press backgrounder. Other than the trip material, the only thing he mentioned was that we were disappointed that the Soviets hadn't given us much strategic help in settling the Vietnam war. He thought Rogers' comments before Foreign Affairs Committee were very good. Rogers thought it was one of his best appearances.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O.12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCON
Senator Mansfield
Mr. Kissinger
7-18-69 5:45 PM

K said Pres wanted him to call M about some of the moves we are thinking of making toward Communist China in next day or two.
K said we would have made them today but some problem about ship they may have picked up. K said measures themselves are not of spectacular significance but we are looking for things we can do unilaterally which they cannot reject. K said we are lifting tourist purchases of Communist chinese goods, lifting travel restrictions for specified groups (journalists, students, etc), and we will tell them we would be glad to give visas to similar category of people.
K said Pres was eager for M to know this. K said it is signal to them of our intention and there are a number of other things in the works which we will develop during the course of the year - inching toward a different relationship but not giving them a chance to blast us. K said he did not know if M agreed with this approach. M said he does. M said you are removing second boycott what about first boycott. M said there is also unilateral boycott against trade with China - maybe that is later move. K said for M's personal info, this is move that will be made before too much time is out. M said he has not heard a thing.
M said he is delighted - good first move

jm

DECLASSIFIED

Telecon
The President
5:45 p.m 7/18/69

The President was asking about the press briefing. K said he mentioned all the things they discussed. K said there were about 200 people there and it was held in the East Room. The President asked if there were any questions regarding Soviet security in ________. They asked if we were going to try to prevent that. K told them we were ________ going to participate in that. The Pres. suggested we might get into the idea of developing policies now ________ so we don't get bogged down in another Vietnam. In every one of these countries, there is the potential. K thought that was a very effective point.

K told Richardson to proceed and now but there was word that the Chinese may have captured an American yacht. K thought we should wait until we have determined the status of this. The President thought we might put it out anyway since the yacht story hadn't hit the papers yet. We would come out with ours first.

The P wanted to know if K had talked to Mansfield about this. K wanted to wait also until the yacht status was cleared. The P thought K should explain it to Mansfield.

K mentioned his meeting with Mitchell. p The P wanted to know how he felt about the reaction to Dobrynin move. K said State got hung up. When K read the telephone report, they still asked for colition government and unconditional withdrawal. K said they have asked us certain questions that they would have to ask if they wanted to settle. It is more precise than anything they have asked before.

The President was happy with what Rogers said on Hanoi. It was the first time he has said anything hard. He liked K's point that some of these Senators may begin to realize that the other side is being intransigent. We have to look and talk very peaceful. K said to them, you (the P) is a terribly frustrating phenomenon; they can't set you up. The P has stayed ahead of the public opinion curve. The people are now being more reasonable, they can't think of things anymore that we should be doing that we are not doing.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/69

- 2 -

K told him of his visit with Katzenbach today. Even Katz. couldn't think of anything more we should be doing.

On the tripp books, the P said he wasn't going to go into them as much as he did in Europe since he will only be spending a very short time in each place. K suggested that if he reads the cover memo that should be sufficient. If he wants anymore information, the backup will be there.

The President asked if K thought the Soviets were really reaching for something. K said they may not know what to do, in fairness, with Hanoi. They can't get caught up in it. The P said he thought they needed good relations with us this time. We have done enough to give them a good reason and they haven't kicked us around. They haven't even said anything unkind. K said they want good relations with us for the appearance. P agreed saying the appearances to help them with their <u>other</u> enemies. K said they want to keep things quite so they can concentrate on isolating China. It would be in our interest so long as we don't do it together with them. The P said by the time we get through with this trip, they are going to be out of their minds, that we are playing a Chinese game.

The President mentioned again for K to call Mansfield

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O.12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCON
President
Mr. Kissinger
7-18-69 7:25 PM

K said he has talked to Mansfield and he is delighted and asked K to
tell Pres personally how much he appreciates policy P is following.
P asked if K had told him about boat and fact P has said the hell with
it. K said he had and Mansfield agreed. K said now it will have to
go until Monday.

K said PM Sato sent personal representative to see K with message
for P on Okinawa question. In effect if P would be willing to use that
sort of channel on big policy issues involved and keep technical
issues in diplomatic channel. K said in other words he would come
with proposition which goes beyond what P has already approved -
would like to come to understanding with P in principle first. K said
if P is willing to do this, he will keep man here until Monday. P said
lets try to get it done and not fool around with State Dept. K said
then with P's permission he will keep the man here until he has a
chance to present to P on Monday.

K said he has Mathias with him and he may switch over to us on ABM.
P said he could not believe it - keep after him. P said if he could
move that could have a dramatic effect - let him be a hero. P said K
is authorized to tell him we will work out whatever he wants. K said
he would let P know if it turns out favorably.

jm

Telecon
Secretary Laird
8:00 p.m. 7/18/69

K apologized for not getting back to L sooner but said that he was doing his work for him. He just was talking to Mathias and he might come over. K said he had to promise him an ABM site in his state.

K asked what L was going to do on the guy who put the idle in the canisters? Laird said that was why he was calling. L said, as K probably knows, there is a lot of sentiment that the DOD should announce where we have gas stored. K didn't think there was any advantage in that. Laird agreed but he wanted to inform K that he had taken the position that until we had completed the study, we shouldn't announce anything. K wanted to know if we should store the gas in Okinawa. L said we could put it in on Guam. It was a mistake to put it on Ok in the first place. K mentioned that it was McNamara's move. Laird said if we put it on Guam we would be a military requirement of construction for storage facilities which will take some time. We could also dump it in the ocean but the National Academy of Scientists object to that. We could burn it, but that would cost a million to build the facilities. K said we should consider an announcement along the lines that it will be removed from Oki as soon as alternative storage facilities have been constructed elsewhere. L said it would take at least a year and that they would have to go to Congress for the money. K asked if L minded if he took this up with the President. L said no. L said for now we are saying that we prefer not to comment. If they push, we can say who put it there. The JC feels they need storage some place because of the quantity that is in the hands of the Soviets. They both agreed to wait until Monday to do anything. L said State wanted to put something out saying today. K said that was panicking. He said the President appreciated that L's careful and maticulous way in which he checked out everything.

K said he would mention this to the President tomorrow.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELECON

The President
Mr. Kissinger

7/18/69, 10:15 p.m.

P asked what happened to that Biafra thing. K said it was supposed to have been released this morning and that he approved the release. P said it is a very important release and he wanted to be sure they understood that we are shifting from State, and writing letters to both parties. K said re P's question of how letter was delivered to Biafra, it was delivered to the President of the Ivory Coast. K said we announced that letters were sent to both parties. P said tell Harlow that he ought to call Buzz and Goodell (?) telling them we are doing this. K said he would make sure that they got all of this information. P said tell Flanigan to get to the Pope and a few other people. K said we have included a letter to the Pope informing him of some of these actions. The President said if it comes up tomorrow, tell them Haile Selassie urged him to do this when he was here. P said Selassie said this is the time for American intervention. P said we have to use everything we have to get this over with and asked K if he agreed. K said these tribal hatreds run so deep. It is the same as Chinese for Southeast Asians. K said the trouble is that Nigeria can't win but whether they are ready to settle is a real question. P said we have to do more than State does. P said we have to stop all support of Nigerian Government. P said it won't work -- they can't win. P said we have to talk cold turkey to Wilson. K said that it is important and then he would see Pompidou. P said that's what I think we should do. Pompidou should step up support for Biafra. P said he would run herd on Wilson and tell Palmer to keep his mouth shut.

K said the Indian Ambassador called to say he had a message from
Delhi assuring us it is going to be very warm welcome. P said good.

K said he has read transcript of private talk and he thinks our boys
were a little optimistic. They asked a number of serious questions.
K said Lodge did make your speech finally and of course there was no
occasion for rebuttal and K said he thought it was a good thing to have
it done. P said especially since they are going to get message from
Saintenny (?). K said if we can keep agencies from leaking and giving
away all capital we have earned we might still make it.

P asked about number of casualties and asked if they were down. K
said about 150. P said not enough and then asked about summer offensive.
K said he didn't know anything about it but said they are going to get into
a box. K said P has positioned himself now very well as moderate.

DECLASSIFIED

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By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

-2-

P said too moderate. K said as long as we know where we are heading, it is okay to be moderate. As long as we don't push Saigon off the brink. P said the visit will help a lot.

P said he was glad that Mansfield was pleased. K said Mansfield wanted to make sure that K expressed that personally and immediately to P. K said Mansfield said that is exactly the right attitude to have.

K said he talked to Mathias and he thinks with the Stennis letter we will get him. President said really!! K said he got the impression that Mathias came in aching to get off the hook. K said Mathias wanted to know difference between sentinEL and safeguard. Mathias said he opposed sentinEL and now wondered how he could support safeguard. K said he explained the differences and K said he didn't want to be optimistic but he thinks we may get to him. P said we have to move. We are not going to compromise. P said we are going to use Stennis letter only if we get votes out of it.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O.12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCONE
Ambassador Green
Mr. Kissinger

9:10 a. m., July 19, 1969

HAK said Marshall, they did not get you out of bed did they? G
said no, I have been at work for 2 hours.

HAK said two things Marshall - (1) I noticed in the digest of State
Department reports that Bill told DM yesterday that we were not
much in favor of expanding Vietnamese military security forces.
The President when he talked to Thieu at Midway certainly talked
as if that was not excluded. In fact, if Thieu came away with the
impression that we would help, he would not be stretching realities.
HAK said, secondly, on this nerve gas business - Laird called
yesterday and he feels very strongly that we should not do anything
precipitous. What he is willing to go along with is that we say on
Monday that orders have been given to move this gas as soon as
alternative storage has been constructed elsewhere.

G said I think that is alright. That is about half-way between
position A and position B in my letter. HAK said but Laird thinks
it will take about a year to get this done. HAK said my own position
would be to nail him to the idea of this first. If we start arguing
now whether they can do it in six months we may run into problems.
G said can't we speed that up. One way I was thinking we could stay
out of Okinawa indefinitely.

HAK said I think we should say on Monday that this equipment was (1)
put there in 1963 and 1964 and (2) this Administration had ordered
a complete review of chemical and biological warfare equipment and
(3) this was part of the review and will be moved as soon as alternative
storage is available. G said we will certainly buy that. HAK said
this is what I will present to the President. G said my point is one
of the catalysts would be to draft a wire to Tokyo telling them to
inform the Japanese this is what we will do. HAK said after I talk
to Laird, I am going to suggest to the President that you will draft a
cable to Japan. G said this is one of those issues where it is best
to start out as critical issues of the government. HAK said your
judgment is like mine. We can't possibly keep that stuff there now.
G said that is right - I realize getting it out is difficult. What I will
do is draft something and then just wait to hear from you. HAK said
that is fine.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority

E.O. 12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/1969

Ambassador Green (contd)

-2-

G said did you get my letter on ADB? HAK said yes but I don't know
how we will do it. G said the point is to make that bow. I am worried
about these Philippine newsmen's pundits. Anything we can do to
focus on something positive would be good. HAK asked if the
Secretary was going there. G said yes. G said if the President
could somehow see Watanabi it would be a good idea. HAK said
if there was a function there that we could be sure Watanabi is
invited to - if you can get Watanabi within reach of the President,
I will undertake to get the President to Watanabi. G said I will go
out with a personal wire and see if Watanabi will be there.

HAK said one final thing on these private talks - what is your idea
of how they will be continued in the next two weeks. G said I think
we have an opening. The order of questions was very interesting.
I have not talked to Bill but I think Lodge will be coming in with re-
commendations. HAK said I don't think he should have said we are
willing to shorten the period of the pullout. I don't mind shortening
it after the twelfth month but if they steamroller us out, the whole
thing might collapse. Twelve months is not an unreasonable period
to get 500,000 men out of the country. HAK said we don't want to
collapse the whole thing by the speed of our withdrawal. G said I
think the withdrawal is a measured one. I would hope that our
next announcement would be sooner than we thought. HAK said
there is a chance of doing it the middle of August.

mlh

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O.12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCORN

Bryce Harlow

9:25 a. m., 7-19-69

H said I am calling to check on your meeting with Mathias. HAK
said I devoted an hour of my time to him. H said which way did
he choose? HAK said "he said I will be the man I am". HAK
said I had the impression he will go along with the Stennis thing.
HAK said Mathias said what compromise can you make. HAK
said we cannot make any. HAK said I am not authorized to give
you any hint and if you say I did, I will disavow it but if you say no
missiles will be deployed next year that will be consistent with the
national interest. HAK said Mathias said that is all I want. HAK
asked H if he had done it wrong.

H said you did it just right. You almost converted him into a
guided missile. HAK said I had the impression he was looking for
a way out. He certainly was agonizing. He ran through questions
on what do the Allies think. HAK told H I said they are totally
confused - I am telling you it is right and that if you were the
President you would do nothing else. HAK said then we went then
we went through: will it work - and I gave him all the arguments
there; and that Soviets cannot know whether it will work or not.
He was really looking for confirmation.

H said OK, I was just taking a test.

mlh

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCON
Secretary Packard
Mr. Kissinger
9:35 a.m., 7-19-69

HAK said on that nerve gas business, I hope you are promoting
the General that decided to paint those things. I wonder if he went
through the National War College? I think that this thing is being
going to build.

P said we got together yesterday and we are preparing a program
that includes the fact that this gas is going to be removed. We
want to do this. If you have any other ideas, I would like to have
them. HAK said I was going to call the President on this and I
wondered if the following would be agreeable to you. If said (1)
that this gas was moved there in 1963 and 1964, (2) this Administration
had ordered a full NSC of this whole range of problems and (3) the
Administration had decided to move this equipment from Okinawa
as soon as other storage facilities can be built and in accordance
with Scientific Adviser's recommendations, as to safe disposal.
Would that be agreeable with you?

P said Dan Henkin was supposed to have something on that this morning.
Why don't I find out about it and call you back? K said would you do
that?

mlh

DECLASSIFIED

TELCON
John Whitaker
Mr. Kissinger
10:00 a. m., 7-19-69

W said in Bangkok when the President meets with Vargas the President will be in his residence. W said the advance man has asked if the President should come downstairs and meet Vargas. W said here is what I favor - Vargas comes into the room and we allow a photograph opportunity. Question is whether President should come downstairs to meet Vargas. W said if he comes down, it opens him to press conference. W said I favor having Vargas go up to the residence and allowing a photo opportunity. W asked HAK if he thought Vargas would be offended. HAK said no, I will meet him downstairs and go up with him.

W said OK. HAK said President had agreed we should have a reception at Andrews and at 10:00 a. m. W said yes, but Dwight still thinks that is going to cancel. W said, however, that he would write the scenario that way. HAK said, actually that way he would get two shots. Anyway, he is willing to leave at 3:30.

mlh

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCONE
Ambassador Sullivan
Mr. Kissinger
10:07 a.m., 7-19-69

HAK said, hello Bill, how are you? Since my initial call to you
I have talked to Marshall about my problem. S said, yes, he talked
to me about the phone conversation you had. HAK said - one point is
that I don't think we should give too quickly on that 12 month with-
drawal thing. I don't think that should them so much as to withdraw
afterward. We should not give that away too quickly. And the
other question was the working group thing.

S said Phil Habib talked to me on the phone yesterday about that.
Ed Walsh was down here yesterday on these things and Lodge's
intention is to put Phil in charge of that. It could cause some
jurisdictional problem. I think Phil would be better man to do it.
HAK said I do too. S said I am not too sure what real interest Ed
may have in doing it.

HAK said do you mean that you think they are willing to move toward
Paris talks. S said yes but I don't think we should believe that any
desire for talks means anything significant on their part. The one
thing Phil said was that they would be sending in some recommenda-
tions today and would involve the idea of a second meeting some time
next week. This will involve a turnaround with Ellsworth and (?).
The other interesting thing that I discussed with him was that I was
fascinated by the order of the 12 points in which he put ceasefire so
high - whether it is chronological thing or whether things are highest
in his mind at the moment. That is a bit of a reverse since last
discussion with us. I don't know whether that is significant or not.
HAK said we could try to suggest another order and see if they put
it back in.

S said I would assume the order is their proposed agenda. S said
I will be in touch with you Monday about what the recommendations
are. HAK said I think we should have a talk before we all scatter.
Why don't we aim for a talk on Monday morning.

S said, good, I will see you.

DECLASSIFIED

TELCOM
Secretary Packard
Mr. Kissinger
10:20 a.m., 7-19-69

HAK asked Secy Packard if he had had a chance to look at gas thing. P said we are right in the middle of looking at this thing now. HAK said I don't need the statement now but I want to know if you agree in principle. P said let me tell you some of the problems. (P read proposed statement). P said as far as the operating situation, we would not have any problem in implementing a program in accordance with the statement but it raises a lot of questions. For example, how many tons do we have in Okinawa? Where are you going to take the stuff and there we do not have an answer. Where else do you have nerve gas positioned. P said we have not faced up to how much information we will give out. How much is stored overseas?

HAK said wherever we have it we have it with the approval of the government. I would avoid saying these things. P said we would like to but the press is very pressing on these things. Our people think we should stand where we are and not come out with a statement of any kind. We are going to go ahead and implement a program in due course. P said it is just a question of whether we make a public statement or sit tight on the thing. It is a public relations problem now. HAK said they will probably want to say something in Japan. P said I think so too. P said I have reviewed this carefully this morning and I would be inclined to say we should make a statement along this line but the questions will be tough. If you make a statement like this, you lead into a whole lot of statements. HAK said maybe you should not make a statement but permit State Department to inform Japanese and let it leak out that way. P said let me try that one out (went off the line to talk to his people in office). P said we have given the statement to the State Department which authorizes them to notify Japanese Government that we have gas there and that it is not lethal in its bulk quantities but not to say anything about removal.

HAK said my problem is that I should say to the President that it is your position that you are opposed to such a statement. P said after looking at all possible problems, we think such a statement would open up so many questions we believe on balance we should not make such a statement. HAK said how much anguish would it cause you if we notify the Japanese along the lines of the statement? P said we essentially agreed with what they recommended, that there is lethal gas there but not to say anything about removal. I think we should be careful and not say anything until we see how far we have to go.

mlh

DECLASSIFIED

TELCORN

Secy Laird
Mr. Kissinger

7-21-69 12:55 PM

L said there are a couple of things he should discuss with President
before he leaves. One, possible change of orders. L said we have some
language. K said Pres wants to see Wheeler and should not see him
alone in any event. K will make it a joint meeting. L said o.k. but
he should see Pres before he sees Wheeler. There are a few changes
to be made and Pres should understand those before he runs into them
cold. K said it will certainly be arranged - only question is when.
L asked when Pres would be seeing Wheeler and K said it would not
be before tomorrow afternoon. L said he should talk to Pres before
he sees Wheeler or go over it with K so he understands it.
L said maybe K does not want to make those changes yet. K said
he is seeing Pres at 3:00 on internal business and will take matter
up re Laird being in on Wheeler meeting and also find out if Pres
wants L to see K.

L said the next thing he wanted to discuss is mining problem.
L said he did not think it was imminent but asked if K would like to
take the contingency plans with him. K said he should look at them.
L said he had two copies and would send one over to K this after-
noon and hold the other copy.

L said last problem is manner in which we respond as far as gas problem.
K said he tried to reach L on Saturday and when he could not
talked with Packard. L said he did not understand why he could not
be reached - he, Mitchell and Rogers played golf at 9:00 AM. His
office knew where he was but the WH kept calling his home/
L went on to say he thought it would present some problem particularly
if we put it on the back of Dubridge. L said the wire to Japan indicates
this, according to procedures laid out by the Science Adviser.
L read K an AP story. L said he thinks we should try to keep the
President out of it as much as we can and L thinks we put Presiden t
in it by using President's scientific adviser. K said he agrees.
L said Defense should take the rap for it rather than the White House.
K and L agreed to meet for breakfast tomorrow morning at the
Pentagon at 7:30 in order to discuss various things.

L also brought up rebuilding of Situation Room - first request was for
2,340,000 and another request for 2,461,000. L said on these
WH requests, Senators have asked for personal limits. L said they
do have to give transfers used out of Defense Budget and there is
request for 36 more personnel spaces. L said he thought he and K should

DECLASSIFIED

-2-

go over this and K asked if he would like to do it at breakfast
in the morning. L said he supposed money would have to be
transferred soon on computerized communications equipment.
K said they should look it over. L said he would get
contingency plans to K later on this afternoon and also send over
a memo on VN thing so K would have in advance of their breakfast.

K said he would let L know about meeting with Wheeler and L asked if it could be as late as possible - he has problems before 4:00 and would have to know today if meeting is scheduled before then.
K said we would try to let L know before the end of the day.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O.12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

Telecon
Jose Sisco

2:55 p.m.

7/21/69

S called to say he was transmitting an information memo for HAK, the President and the Secretary, summarizing the whole Moscow talk business and where he thought we stood. He thought K might like to take it on the trip just to read.

K said from the cables it went rather well. S said it came out just as he thought it woud. The ball is in their court and we have to stay cool. K thought the Russians were very businesslike. He asked if Dobrynin was there. S said no, he was in a hospital somewhere so he sent him an xx a note wishing him a speedy recovery. K complimented S on the Moscow proposals.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O.12958
By DS NARA Date 4/15/69

TELCORN

Mr. Elliot Richardson
Mr. Kissinger

7-21-69 5:10 PM

K said he was calling about Verification Panel scheduled for
tomorrow. K does not anticipate that it will be a very long
meeting but K said he did not think R had worked with this intelligence
stuff as much as he had. One of problems K has had is he has never
gone into it without finding extraordinary ambiguities. K said
Pres asked him to chair this panel and in K's absence he wondered
if R could keep a benevolent eye on the operation - or a
rigorous eye. R said he would be glad to. K said he does not think
the President can be asked to make a decision on basis of
"you must take a chance for peace," etc. K said he thinks we should
tell him what an intelligent evader would do and then let him decide.
K said also, what you can do with the information politically if you
get some. K cited example of someone coming in today re
upgrading of some of our air defense for missile defense with very
minor changes. K said if you can do it on our side you have to
assume same may be possible on the other.

K said his recommendation tomorrow is going to be that we get a working
group together to make a report in a week or so of what
the state of our intelligence is, what the manueuvering ? capabilities
are with respect to major elements of retaliatory forces, and then,
then, with particular reference to MIRV and AN/MK ABM, what
verification capabilities are and where the disagreements are.
R said he also thinks we should be sure that there are not any
devices for dealing with - in MIRV question particularly - --
are there techniques without opening up the warhead that could
tell us what is in there.

K asked R what he would think of Larry Lynn chairing the working
group for K's staff. R said he did not know him well but think
highly of him from what he has heard of him and it's o.k. with him.
K said in his absence, he would ask Larry to deal with R as
chairman. R said he takes it that the evolution of this is such that
Gerry should not be chairman. K said right - besides Pres has
put into NSC in such a way. K and R discussed Smith and K said he
gathered R had had a word with him. K said Pres was more forthcoming
that he would ever have been otherwise, at their meeting today.

R referred to Israeli thing and whether he and Packard should do
anything along the lines of their previous conversation. K said he has

DECLASSIFIED

Authority

E.O. 12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

TELCONE
Gov Rockefeller
Mr. Kissinger
7-22-69 12:25 PM

R said he just wanted to touch base with K before his departure. K said
he is looking forward to receiving R's report. R said he will have some
more of those individual memos for K and asked whether he should send
them in K's absence. K said yes, they can be staffed during his absence.
R said on the individual country reports, he is sure Pres does not want to
take anything like that on his trip. R will just have them in California
for him when he is there. R asked if K had gotten any reaction on participation
in Caribbean Regional Bank conference. K said no - he would look into it.
R said the meeting is today and all that is needed is just statement at
the meeting that the US will give consideration to participation.
R said George Woods is one who stopped it but he has now changed his mind.
R said it is absolutely sound. R said he did not know if we had a representative
at that meeting today or not. K said he would look into it immediately.

K said he would not break his back on the report - what we are shooting for
is early October for Presidential speech; put before NSC early September.

K brought up FIAB matter and asked if R wanted K to tell Taylor R wanted
some staff person to be cleared for that. R asked whether anyone else
had assistants and K said no. K said the asst may have to come down here to
review papers. R said Nancy would be tremendous if she would consider it.
K said he might tell Taylor to start clearing her so that there will be no time
lag if she decides to do it.

R asked when K was returning and K said no later than the fifth - then
will go to Calif with the President on the 9th or 10th. K said Haig will always
know where to get him if R wants him.

jm

TELCON
The Vice President
Mr. Kissinger
7-22-69 2:40 PM

K said President returned to him the memo VP wrote about peace activists some days ago. VP said only point he wanted to get over was this thought about possible effect on morale of other POWs.

K said that is sentence the Pres underlined and said he agreed completely and VP should raise directly with Rogers and Laird. VP said he would do so. K said he could tell them he is not speaking alone on this. VP said he would follow through on it.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

TELCOM
Gerard Smith

Mr. Kissinger

7-22-69 2:55 PM

S said he has letter from K's principal and asked if K could give him any guidance on
to whom he could show it - whether copies had been send to anyone. K said
copies were not sent to anyone. K said he thought it could certainly
be shown to the Secretary and the Under Secretary of State. S asked about
other members of the SALT, as well as Packard, Laird and Wheeler.

S said letter is very illuminating and would help them in approaching their
problems if they had a copy. K said he would check with the President.

K asked S what he thought of it and S said it was first-rate - he is delighted.

K said he would check with President and let S know by end of day what
circulation could be given to it. K said he hopes S feels we have not treated
him too badly and S said no, it is response to his concerns.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

TELCON
Dr. Dirge
Mr. Kissinger
7-22-69 4:15 PM

TELCON questions

K said he has gone over suggestions and has a few changes.

In #7B, K suggested leaving out heavy bombing and focus on blockade side - something to effect "as last week resort selective bombing."

On 10B, K asked if that was necessary - D said it can come out but helps in sense that we compare the reaction of this with A thru H. K suggested adding "If necessary against the wishes of the existing Government."

K said only other problem he has is first part of 14. First question

K said "accept a coalition govt including communists against the wishes" K said or if D wanted to say "impose a coalition govt including Communists." D said he would ask the second part only if they got no opinion. K said he understood that.

K said questions are dam good and very helpful - very pleased with them. D said they will get out and have report to K by Aug 15 at latest - perhaps sooner.

DECLASSIFIED

TELCON
David Nevin
Mr. Kissinger
7-22-69 4:35 PM

K said the quotes are o.k. and that he appreciated the way N was handling
everything. N said the story will be out the end of Aug or the beginning
of September. N said they have a space problem at LIFE and the story
is not as long as N had hoped but he is happy with the way it reads in
general. N said the pictures also look great and will send copies to K
soon.

N said when he comes to Washington again, he will come in to call on K.
K said he would like that.

jm

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E.O. 12958

By DS NARA Date 4/15/06

Telecon
Minister Tompkins (British Embassy)

5:20 p.m.

7/22/69

K said he wanted to mention the agenda at Mildenhall. You have
an intensive discussion of SALT, MIRV AND ABM. This was
scheduled as a courtesy visit. I am not saying it is discourteous
to discuss these things. It is just that it is the end of a long day
exhausting trip for the President....He appreciated the Prime
Minister coming there. We would like to tell you about our
impressions of the trip and handle SALT some other way.

Tompkins said between you and me, what has happen is that
after our (W U.S.) presentation in Brussels, they realized that
there are certain problems implied which they have not faced
clearly before.

K said it is hard to come to decisions in bne hour. The President
will have had a three-hour time change and it will be a long day
for him. I wonder if this is the best occasion. Tompkins said
he didn't think the Prime Minister wanted any decisions reached.
He wanted to tell the President of the concerns he had so he will
be aware firsthand before decisions are taken. K said the two
principles know and respect each other. If we could make this a
low key session in which each side is free to express concerns.
This was a personal communication and would not be for publication.
Tompkins understood.

Tompkins also understood that the President didn't want any
sendoff at Andrews because of the flexible sDeparture.

DECLASSIFIED