E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By NARA, Date 5/97

TELCONE
Laird/Kissinger

4:56 p.m.

8/5/71

L: I have the meeting going on logistic matter. We got that Sept. 30 date there. We can move -- we are moving.

K: 15 days make a difference?

L: This will probably surface about the first of Sept. There are 7,000 wheeled vehicles moving into those ports in addition to the tanks.

K: Do the Vietnamese know?

L: They are studying it. They don't know about deliveries. They know about tanks. But they are not scheduling --

K: If you want to stretch it beyond Vietnamese election, no problem.

L: Those ports in VN will be busy.

K: What's the problem?

L: This will surface and publicity over the fact that shipments have increased.

K: Say total problem (?) has been increased. Just technical and it's rate of delivery. Say we are taking out more and using ships to bring in more.

L: We can but I want you to know because I don't want you to say on the 15th we are screwing up the election.

K: Why?

L: Because ? ? ? ? ? ? ?

K: Extending to mid-Oct. would give you more lee-way?

L: And not if large amount in there.

K: Push it to Oct. 15.

L: We won't say anything about it and just do it.

K: That's wise. Thanks, Mel.

DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By CCO NARA, Date 5/27

Telecon
Mr. Kissinger
Cong. Frelinghuysen
8/5/71; 6:55 p.m.

K: Peter.

F: You are nice to call back at this hour. I was leaving town and I wanted to thank you for coming over. I am miffed that I did not hear your views. It was nice of you to do it.

K: Aren't you nice. You and I have worked together for a very long time and I like these groups.

F: My disappointment was that I did not get to hear it.

K: Don't you start in on the Fulbright line.

F: It was not meant as a complaint. I have a young friend -- a Lt. who went to the Naval War College -- he is getting out in October and is interested in politico-military side of life. He is about 26-27. He was working before he went to the Navy. He was working at Johns Hopkins.

K: Why don't you have him send his curriculum vitae.

F: How?

K: To me or General Haig.

F: He is now in town. He has been under Admiral Colbert and he has been doing research for him.

K: Why doesn't he call in tomorrow and see if we can interview him.

F: Do you want his name -- Eric Hayden. Thanks, Henry.

K: Have a great summer.

TELECON (Tape)
The President/Mr. Kissinger
[Brought in 8/5/71]

P: Hello.

K: Mr. President.

P: Hi, Henry. What is that story about the Swedes?

K: There is absolutely nothing to it that I have been able to discover.

P: Gerry Warren came in and told me in the middle of Theatre and I just said my God and see what Kissinger says and put it out that way. It seems to me they are not going to be foolish to do anything silly like that.

K: Well, I don't exclude, Mr. President, that they may make a gesture on something like that day which is just four days before their meeting with me.

P: Well, yeah, they might make a gesture.

K: But not of that magnitude.

P: Yeah. I didn't know -- Oh, they were going to do it on what day? Have they said?

K: On the 12th.

P: And your meeting is when?

K: The 16th. But for them to let 183 go is a pretty big step.

P: Yeah. For what reason would they be doing it then?

K: Supposing they come back to us with an offer on Thieu that is not yet acceptable but is a small step in our direction. If they were to say that as a sign of their goodwill and their eagerness to get the thing settled they are letting these go and then even made it public, It would put us into a pretty tough spot.

P: Yep.

DECLASSIFIED

MD F0 12958
Authority
By: NARA Date 6/4/04

Telecon
The President/Mr. Kissinger
(Brought in 8/5/71)

-2-

K: But that's the only plausible way I can see it.

P: What is this? This is a report that somebody chartered a plane?

K: Well, the story came from a Swedish newspaper and we are trying to track that down.

P: The minute I hear that I become suspicious.

K: Exactly! It was from a Swedish newspaper which gave no sources, which said that through super-secret negotiations, 183 prisoners are going to be released on August 12. That these are going to leave on a chartered SAS plane that had been secretly chartered at the request of the U. S. military. Well, of course, we immediately had checked with Saigon; we checked with every conceivable agency, then I thought maybe Perot had pulled a little deal.

P: Yeah, hell yeah.

K: And we called him and there is nothing to that. So any base that we are familiar with has been covered. Of course, they also might have thought that this is the way to get themselves back on the front page.

P: That's a pretty cheap way; I mean that's a way that isn't going to help them.

K: That's what I think.

P: Unless they can produce.

K: Oh, no -- if they were going to do it. If they don't do it then I think it will hurt them to play like this.

P: Sure.

K: So we have put out a statement because we didn't want these wives climbing walls. That we have no information about this report, no U. S. agency has been involved and that no plane from SAS or any other line has been chartered by the Government.

DECLASSIFIED

MAY 12958
Authority

By NARA Date 6/1/64

-3-

P: And that we still continue to work for the release of all the prisoners.

K: Exactly.

P: It would be a horrible thing to put . . .

K: This is verbatim, Mr. President, of what we put into the statement.

P: Yeah, that's what Warren told me. He gave it to me briefly. That was fine. You handled it just right. Just right.

K: Well, tomorrow we will go after the Swedes. We didn't want to call there in the middle of their night.

P: No. Of course you have such a jackass government there that you don't know what they are up to.

K: Well, then it is not totally impossible that they'll do something like this.

P: Yeah.

K: Cause in which case -- something is clearly going on, Mr. President, there is just no doubt.

P: Let me say this, I don't think this is what they are going to do though. This just sounds phony to me, I may be totally wrong.

K: No, I would not have predicted this.

P: 90%, I think. If it comes off, I'll be 90% surprised.

K: Yeah.

P: 10% chance but I don't think so.

K: I would not have predicted this.

P: On the other hand may be looking for a clever move and that could be a clever move.

K: Well, you know, this Chinese move has knocked them off the front pages.

DECLASSIFIED

MFO 12958

By NARA Date 6/4/71