Reproduced from the open files
of the Nixon Presidential
Materials Staff

DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By KHLU NARA, Dale 5/12/04

TELCOM
Laird/Kissinger
9:52 am 4/14/70

K: Two things -- in the light of the space problem, do you think we should go with the announcement on the Joint Chiefs today?

L: We have to because we have told the Senate today. The space thing are very routine from the WH. I got Mrs. Smith and Stennis aboard this morning at 8:30 -- it will leak. I got Rivers -- everybody aboard.

K: The President is upset re these articles of 60 - 70,000

L: I haven't seen it.

K: That you were overruling the Joint Chiefs and he had to back you up.

L: We denied over here that this was discussed. Ron mentioned it but I don't think we should say we discussed it.

K: If you would shut it off. He may not be able to make his speech on Th and may have to wait until next week.

L: Nothing with the Joint Chiefs so long as we move out by June 15.

K: ? ? ? ? ?

L: I asked you if I should go into detail.

K: Your memo came down for 40. No problem with that.

L: If we program that out before the 15th -- If they enter the DMZ it's a difficult problem. They won't come across that.

K: The meeting yesterday brought that into sharp focus. ? ? ? ?

L: We are not doing that over here. We are holding down on that thing We should deny that VN was discussed. But Ron indicated that it was something we wanted to discuss.

K: It was primarily to pay tribute to the Chiefs and give you some support. wanted me after the meeting yesterday --

L: My problem was that Ehrlichman wanted me to bring up at that meeting the fact that Mitchell, Rogers, and myself met on nuclear storage. They came down on the fact that I should brief the Foreign Relations Committee where

By KHL NARA, Date 5/12/04

Laird/Kissinger

9:52 am

4/14/70

-2-

K: They're crazy. Ehrlichman came on that?

L: I told them I couldn't say where in the countries they are stored but that i wanted me to give the names of the countries where they were, I would. The Soviets already know that. But that won't satisfy them.

K: They want to know the agreements.

L: I will be glad to give them the countries -- you understand that that won't satisfy them. I will tell Ehrlichman that I didn't bring them up.

K: I will talk to Ehrlichman. That's not right.

L: I have a briefing I can put together but I said then to understand it's not what the Committee is interested in.

K: They want to know under what conditions we have them there.

L: Yesterday was not the proper forum.

K: You were right. OK, I will talk to Ehrlichman.

L: I have a call into him so I may speak to him.

K: What do you think of the space problem?

L: It's serious. We maybe able to bring if off. There's enough oxygen to bring them back but they will have to be very careful.

K: The electricity.

L: It's the oxygen. They have to get into the re-entry vehicle.

K: We shouldn't go on Thurs. night, should we?

L: I don't think so off the top of my head.

K: Hold it that he is even thinking of delaying it.

L: As far as these stories are concerned I don't know who is doing things like that.

K: I will call Bill too for security. You know what the numbers are going to they will be in the range you suggested.

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By: K.L. NARA, Date: 5/12/04

Laird/Kissinger

9:52 am 4/14/70

-3-

K: I will talk to him.

L: Make it a pleasant thing. I have met with him every Monday and the President came yesterday because his retirement is to be announced today. That wasn't a fight.

K: The President wanted it as a tribute to Wheeler and you. He wasn't refereeing any fight.

L: There is no fight.

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By KCL NARA, Dato 5/12/04

Telcon
Secy Laird

Apr 14, 1970; 10:15 a.m.

L: I checked on that story. It was by Ted Sell in the Los Angeles Times and carried by CBS. Ted Sell wrote the story 30 days ago and just resurrected it. He was trying to justify his figure. We don't have a figure like that.

K: That is what the President is worried about - maybe somebody multiplied two times the figure we are thinking about.

L: CBS used his story as the basis for their report.

K: I have talked to Ziegler. He is going to discourage any speculation on our side. We are making it clear that was not the purpose.

L: Yes, and that is what we are doing here too.

ms

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By: KHL NARA, Date: 5/12/04

Telcon

Ron Ziegler

April 14, 1970; 10:20 a.m.

K: I talked to your friend at Defense. He is not making any more charges like he did. The only thing if you get asked at your press briefing, say the meeting with the Chiefs yesterday was not in order to arbitrate a dispute on force withdrawal numbers. Just a general review which the President has periodically. Say it was a general review which the President has periodically.

Z: I can say it was to provide the President an opportunity to pay tribute to Wheeler and have a general review.

K: OK, Ron.

ms

By KCLY

NARA, Dalo

5/13/04

TELECON

Professor Stephen Graubard
Mr. Kissinger

11:00 a.m., April 14, 1970

K: I'm sorry I couldn't come yesterday.

G: Can you today?

K: My understanding is it doesn't make any sense.

G: Everyone would be delighted to have you for dinner and any talk you might want to give. It would be wonderful. Cyrus Vance and Chip Bohlen have left.

K: I am not eager to give a talk.

G: I think it would be amusing for you anyway, to have drinks and dinner -- stay as long as you want and go when you want to. There won't be any after-dinner meeting. It would mean a great deal to me if you came.

K: Let me see. We have this space problem.

G: It would relax you. There are several members of Parliament from France -- a nice group. You would give great pleasure.

K: I will let you know by early afternoon. None of your plans depend on it, do they?

G: Fred Wild said he went ahead and had dinner Sunday knowing you wouldn't show. I have a 25¢ bet with him you will show tonight. It would be easy for you -- nothing except your pleasure and the pleasure you would give.

K: I will let you know by 2:30. I do want to come.

G: You will find the French delegation is interesting. The Americans are mostly people you know: Dick Wall, Stanley Hoffman, Martin Meyerson David McKecklin(?), Frank Sutton, Francis Bator (though he may not be able to make it because of some meeting), and Mariam Camps.

K: I will do my best.

G: Then, I will hear by 2:30. I would personally regard it as a great favor. More than that, I believe you would enjoy it. That was as much the motive as any other.

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By KHL

NARA, Dalo

5/12/04

Professor Graubard

11:00 a.m., April 14, 1970

K: Let me see what crises we are going to have surface during the next few hours. Where is the dinner?

G: Brandeis House (?) -- House of the Academy.

K: I know vaguely where it is. I will have a driver from Bedford AFB.

G: It is right near Faulkner Hospital. We could put someone in touch with your driver and give him directions.

K: How do you get there from Rout 128.

G: Go down 128 to NEWYORKEXCELX the Newton turn-off, which is very close. About 2-1/2 miles from Newton, you turn off to the House.

lds

By KCL- U

NARA, Dato.

5/12/04

TELCORN

Frank Borman/Kissinger

11:10 am

4/14/70

K: How are things?

In

B: Stable. All hours we will have a large burn. The problem is to keep the platform up and get an accurate burn. That requires electricity supply which requires water. So we have to keep the water up.

K: You don't need ? ? ? ?

B: Not in the Lem.

K: Right. So water is your big problem. When will you know more? Tonight?

B: Now it looks all right and if everything goes like this, it will go all right.

K: Haldeman says if your attitude is moderate, it will be all right -- that you are a natural born optimist.

B: I say it just the way I see it.

K: The burn tonight is the big problem.

B: They are also looking into jettying the service module but we have never burned the module without the Lem.

K: We are thinking of you.

B: I will keep you informed.

you?

K: We have other things to consider so I would appreciate that.

B: This is an informal line of communication between you and me. I hope none of your feelings are getting hurt.

K: No, they are talking with Paine and getting the dope but

B: it's important that you get the information. I will keep you informed

K: Good. Call me when anything happens.

By: KHLN NARA, Dalo 5/12/04

TELCOM

Bob Haldeman
Dr. Kissinger
2:19 p.m., 4-14-70

H: The President has talked to Rogers and told him that he was cancelling the Thursday nite statement and that they were to say nothing - that there would be no speculation. The thought is that he definitely cannot do it Thursday night and that he will say so tomorrow. In other words, Ron will say that the Thursday announcement has been postponed and he will not give a date. Then we get the question of SALT. We could move that up to Thursday. We can't leave it until Friday afternoon but could do it Thursday morning.

K: We can do it Thursday morning. Let me ponder it a bit. We don't want to give the whole position away before we present it.

H: When are you going to present it?

K: Next week. The President was afraid of leaks. I think we might do it on Thursday. Let me ponder it. I will let you know.

mlh

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By KCLW NARA, Date 5/12/04

Telecon
Mr. Kissinger
U. Alexis Johnson
4/14/70; 6:50 p.m.

J: I have this message to Phnom Penh -- we should get it to him before 9:00 p.m. our time here. I would like to read it to you.

(Mr. Johnson read the message quickly and I could not take it all down.)

K: If you could look at the paragraph where you talk about navigation...I though the last paragraph sort of shows more coolness than the President feels. I have no objection...it lists a whole lot of reasons why we really should not be doing anything. Look, I am not going to fall on my sword on this. He has been bugging me everyday about whether anything has been moving. I have been urging him to go through regular procedures and do something that everyone can believe in. I am being very candid with you.

J: Let's look at it.

K: Basically, it is fine.

By: KWL NARA, Dalo 5/13/04

TELCORN

Bob Haldeman
Mr. Kissinger
7:10 p.m., 4-14-70

(did not hear first few sentences - something about notifying Rogers & Laird about announcement not being ma

K: On that SALT meeting, we can do it (on Thursday?) and I see nothing wrong with it as long as he does not say too much. I think on the whole it is a good time to do it. What do you hear on the astronauts?

H: I don't know. Somehow they have not called me.

K: It is going to be the first landing on Mars.

H: Henry, that's terrible.

K: Really, I think in this case no news is good news. How was the Space Center?

H: It was OK. They gave him a little briefing.

K: OK - are you going to be at the dinner?

H: No.

K: Lucky.

mlh

By KMLV NARA, Dato 5/12/04

Telecon
Senator Fulbright
4/15/70 9:35 a.m.

K: How are you?

F: In my usual disturbed and distracted frame of mind.

K: I noticed you don't like Metternich.

F: Well, if you are going to play it you ought to plan it intelligently.

K: I don't look to Matternich for guidance.

F: He's a symbol. He himself was quite a fellow.

K: I agree but I feel this particular type of policy is neither feasible nor desirable in the nuclear age.

F: If you had time for another private session I thought that was very useful.

K: I'd love it. Should we do it at your house again?

F: If you'd like to.

K: Yes, I thought it was a very civilized setting.

F: I did too. They did everything I expected them to do from my point of view.

K: I found it very helpful. These are gentlemen I respect very much. Maybe if we could talk about other things . . . it's up to you.

F: I'd love to talk about SALT.

K: Good, but you are the one to decide which topics are of most interest to you and your colleagues.

F: We're having hearings now and I would think . . . Of course, we will want to know about Vietnam, but . . . Do you want to have your secretary call about dates?

K: No, we can do it now. What time frame were you thinking of?

F: Let me see. Did you read Mark Childs this morning? Do you read those damned columnists?

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By KHLW NARA, Date 5/12/04

page 2

K: I read them, but haven't read him this morning.

F: It was very good. On the SALT talks. Any time in the
next 10 to 15 days. What looks good to you?

K: Well, I might be able to do it this Saturday. I have the White
House Correspondents Dinner I have to go to. But at 5:00 . . .

F: That's fine.

K: Either this Saturday or next Wednesday.

F: I think Saturday is fine. I'm not sure about my colleagues;
some of them go out of town for the weekend. I'm not going out of town.
Instead of having the same people, would you mind if I had some new
people. Men like Saxby maybe . . .

K: I'd leave it up to you as long as you give it a reasonable spec-
trum and have people sincerely interested in getting . . .

F: People like Mathias and Saxby.

K: I have a lot of confidence in your judgment. I would like to
leave it up to you.

F: I was thinking about two or three off the committee and try to
balance the parties.

K: Is Gore on your committee?

F: Yes.

K: He should be asked, shouldn't he?

F: Yes, he's a senior member. But the only trouble with him is
he's campaigning and he may be out of town.

K: I could do it next Wednesday or I suppose I could do it on
Tuesday.

F: That's all right. I think I could get better attendance then.

By KMLV

NARA, Dated 5/12/04

TELCOM
Harlow/Kissinger
10:15 am 4/15/70

K: You should be flattered that you are called by one of the President's assistants.

H: I'm standing but I have myself braced.

K: I had a call from Fulbright to meet with his colleagues and himself at his house.

H: I would do it.

K: I think I should. Would you be willing to come along?

H: If you would like. It gives you protection so they can't quote you.

K: I want to have someone there and they should see that when they meet me someone on the Congressional side is along.

H: Who would be there?

K: Same group as before with someone like Saxbe.

H: It's a high compliment to you and good.

K: It would diffuse them as well as they can. Why is it flattering?

H: Because if they didn't

K: They suggested Sat. or Tues. Would you be clear Saturday at 4:00? It's the WH dinner.

H: Sally, am I free at 4:00? -- If Newport News is cancelled then I'm free. The WH correspondents dinner is at 6:30. That might be cancelled because Merriman Smith. The alternative is Tues.? Lets try that. No, I will be in New Orleans.

K: It would be 5:00 Tues.

H: Then on that basis, let's find out about these engagements on Sat.

K: It would be 4:30.

H: Let's hold out and see what the latest is on Sat.

K: The WH is 6:30 cocktails and dinner at 7:30. I didn't plan on cocktails he

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By KML NARA, Date 5/12/04

Harlow/Kissinger

10:15 am

4/15/70

-2-

H: That's right.

K: You are on the dias, now that you're on the Cabinet. I'm still with the Hoi-poloi and I'm beginning to resent it.

H: That's good for you. Sitting with the masses gives you perspective.

K: I may fall off the high wire.

H: Not you.

K: I will aim for Sat. unless you can't do it.

H: These things may be cancelled.

(Harlow's office later called and said he could make it at 4:00 or 4:30 on Sat. HAK said he would let him know.)

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By: KML NARA, Date: 5/12/04

TELCON

U. A. Johnson/Kissinger

11:15 am

4/15/70

K: I have got that Kendall coming in this afternoon. I take it there's no res of any kind.

J: No, and there's nothing changed. I don't expect to here anything soon.

Telcon

Ziegler

4/15/70;11:25 a.m.

Z: .... on stage like you are in the morning meetings. How should I handle the Cambodian arms situation?

K: Say we haven't had a formal request yet. We are in favor of neutrality. Waffle it. I wouldn't indicate we are going to give any. The less visible we do it the better it is.

Z: Just play it loose and screw it up.

K: What is the mood of the press these days?

Z: Overworked and agitated. Why? Are you supposed to do a background

K: I will whenever we give that speech.

Z: Good, will you let me prepare the figures for you?

K: What figures?

Z: The ones you are going to use. So you won't get them screwed up this time.

K: Oh, of course. I might also give one on SALT sometime.

Z: Good. Will you let me also prepare that one for you?

K: Yes, but why?

Z: Only that I am very sensitive about this.

K: Oh, of course.

Z: Good, Henry.

ms

By KHLW NARA, Dato 5/12/04

Telcon
Secy Packard
4/15/70; 11:45 a.m.

P: Re artillery package for Jordon. I have it. Are you familiar with it?

K: No.

P: Working with State on a rather substantial package, mostly artillery, for Jordon - 21 55-mm artillery guns, 150 40-mm essentially anti-aircraft guns, mortars, radio equipment, amounts to about $50 million. I am a little concerned about how to handle it.

K: Why did that never come over here first?

P: That is why I called you. State is pushing hard. They want us to go to Jordan and tell them we can supply the package before Sisco gets over there. Want to get a message over today.

K: That is out of the question.

P: In view of the President's announcement on the Mid East the other day this would be a hell of a time to make an announcement like this.

K: I must talk to the President about it but I don't see how they can do this having just turned down the Israelis.

P: That is why I called you, Henry.

K: I am just giving you my off-the-cuff opinion. Do you want me to raise it with the President?

RX

P: I think you should. Johnson called me this morning. Maybe you ought to take it up directly with the President before we send a message over.

K: Thank you, David. This is the sort of thing that shouldn't come over here and then we have to reverse everybody.

P: It is a $48.7 million package. We are supposed to sell it to them. 21 55-mm artillery guns, 150 40-mm antiaircraft guns, mortars, radios and other equipment. They are pushing very hard to get this. They claim if they don't get it from us they will go to the Soviets.

By KCLW NARA, Date 5/12/04

-Z-

K: We sent some over to them a few months ago.

P: That was small arms for insurgency.

K: We may decide to do this, but we can't do it on the basis of do it on the basis of an Assistant Secretary paying a visit -- on a 24-hour clearance.

P: If we decide to go ahead we ought to know what the problems are. I will talk to Alex and suggest that we get some word from you before we go ahead.

ms

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By KHW NARA, Dato 5/12/04

TELCOM

Marshall Wright/Kissinger

12:07 pm

4/15/70

K: I don't know if Haig got back to you.

W: No.

K: I would like it very much if you would join us but if you leave it up to three weeks which is most useful to us, does it make a difference?

W: I don't understand.

K: I would like to wait on the assignment until you return from Europe.

W: The Asia job or the Middle East?

K: Those are the two I am thinking of but if we re-organize it might even be Europe.

W: That would be wonderful. I would like to study Europe under you. Is this firm -- one of the three jobs?

K: Let me talk to Elliot Richardson at lunch.

W: Shakespeare wanted me to come over on Monday. So Frank is expecting me on June 3 as an associate director.

K: That's up to you.

W: I want to work for you.

K: It can be maddening to work for me.

W: That's one of the charms and challenges. It would be good if someone could call since I'm going to Europe. I will be in touch on May 6.

K: I will have Haig call Shakespeare.

TELCONE
Secy. Kennedy/Kissinger
12:22 pm 4/15/70

By: K.L. NARA, Dato' S/12/04

K: I am just back from Asia to Japan and Korea. Have you had a report on Sato?

HAK: I saw the State Department's report.

K: I think he is willing to do so. He is faced with what he told the President. He thinks there are too many people involved.

HAK: That's the truth.

K: He said if on a top secret basis we would send -- he had three people himself and two others -- if one of our men with one of his we could get to the textile people. I thought it was a very helpful discussion. We talked about economic and financial matters but he kept going back to textiles. I tried to keep out of the details. I told him it would be done and done properly because it could be bad for the Japanese and us.

HAK: He doesn't want to deal with Stans.

K: He said indicated that -- he used the State Dept. man -- Johnson, I guess.

HAK: You think he wants to deal with him?

K: That's my guess but I don't know. At one point I thought he was inviting me but I kept out of it.

HAK: You behaved with delicacy.

K: I called and gave Johnson the details on Japan and Korea. Park is getting edgy. One thing I didn't tell Johnson about -- the Ambassador had talked with Park on withdrawal and he was ready to go and then Tydings gave out some story. It was a leak, I understand.

HAK: I didn't know

K: So then he pulled back.

HAK: Damn it.

K: Park is ready to go but the timing is up in the air based on Tydings or some other Senator. Fulbright, maybe.

HAK: I will check on that. Thanks very much and all this is very helpful.

DECLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

TELCON

Haldeman/Kissinger

1:00 pm

4/15/70

K: I wanted to ask you this. This fellow that the President talked to cannot get his wife to change her mind and he is leaving.

H: Who are you talking about ?

K: Larry Lynn. He is leaving at the end of August.

H: Do you want the President to call again?

K: No. I wouldn't ask him again. If the President of the United States asks you to stay and you don't have the responsibility to stay then I don't want him. I wouldn't keep him if he asked me, now. He tells me that Tom White! who works for Flanigan could be brought along. Haig says Whitehead is underemployed.

H: That's true and I will look into it. Question: How much desireableness is there in the President meeting with Thieu or Abrams and Bunker before the VN announcement?

K: Not with Thieu.

H: That figures. Very astute, my friend.

K: Not with Abrams and Bunker either. That just confuses the issue.

H: What if we need an excuse for him to be in Hawaii? How would you like to make the announcement from Honolulu?

K: So he can be there for the astronauts?

H: ? ? ? ? ? ?

K: My suggestion is that he go to see the astronauts and then he sees Bunker.

H: We could take Moorer.

K: Then it's a war pow-wow.

H: And you want a peace pow-wow. Then not Abrams either. You are right Habib?

K: Habib is coming back early May anyway. We don't want to cover this.

By KHC

NARA, Dato

5/12/04

-2-

K: (cont) even Byroade over from the Phillipines.

H: Don't discuss this with anyone. I don't think it would work out.

K: When would he go? Saturday? Would I go with him?

H: Yes. He is not leaving for the West Coast until the 29th.

K: Good. It fits in beautifully with my plans.

H: Anything to help you out.

By KHC NARA, Dato

5/12/04

Telecon
Secretary Rogers
3/15/70 4:00 p.m.

E47

R: This SALT briefing for Congress. The President decided to do it tomorrow?

K: Right. You have been invited, haven't you?

R: I don't know.

K: I am sure you were.

R: It's all laid on now? It was supposed to be next week.

KX: It would have been better.

K: That was my own preference but he was afraid it would leak out over the weekend.

R: Because of the meeting?

K: Yes.

R: But it's going to be ceremonial at the beginning. Who's going to be there? Gore?

K: Yes.

R: Oh God.

K: If you can change his mind . . .

R: I'm afraid it's too late.

K: I have urged him to be general and talk about categories and not details and to urge them not to talk about it.

R: What time is it?

K: 8:30.

R: I should be there.

K: Yes. You are invited.

R: This Danish Prime Minister is leaving at 8:30. I'm going to