TELECON

Senator Mike Mansfield/Secretary Kissinger

June 1, 1974

11:39 AM

M: Henry.

K: How are you?

M: How are you? I'm out in Montana.

K: I know you are and I really just wanted to call you to tell you how touched I was by your note yesterday.

M: Well, I appreciate it. I said if you could come back with the dove pulled out of the hat I'd been at the airport to meet you.

K: That's what really moved me. When are you going to be back.

M: I'll be back late Monday night. I've got to give a commencement address at the -- at my old school, the school of ____ which is now the Montana College of Science and Technology on Tomorrow.

K: May we call you office. I wonder whether we could have breakfast or get together at the end of the day sometime.

M: You pick the day.

K: I'll call your office.

M: OK. Take care of yourself, Henry and get some sleep and my best to your wife.

K: Thank you and thank you really for -- it was such a touching thought.

M: Thank you for what you've done, Henry. We all appreciate it. Take care.

K: Bye.

M: Bye.

END

DECLASSIFIED
Authority E012958
By J.A. NARA Date 6/14

TELECON
The President/Secretary Kissinger

June 2, 1974

12:10 P.M.

P: Hello, Henry.

K: Mr. President

P: I just called to see if you got a good night's sleep.

K: I'm catching up, but it is beginning to be noticeable.

P: Everything seems to be on course at the moment.

K: Yes we have had answers from all of the countries and the schedule is now all set for you.

P: Al is working on it with the advance men now. And so that is good.

K: Right.

P: The countries seemed to be pleased about we're going to come.

K: Oh, most eager.

P: I think we will even get a good reception in Jerusalem. Don't you?

K: I think you will get a very good reception in Jerusalem. They know what is good for them.

.....

K: But it will add two days to your trip. If you want to go to Algiers

P: I think it is important that we not do Algiers now having seen him here. I would say to him however what I would like to do is to get a message to Algeria/Morocco. Morocco is coming here, ... is coming here. It is best for later time to avoid travel to the North African countries. I want to be fair to them. I think it is important in announcing this that our Ambassadors be informed. That the President has in mind a later time in year. How does that sound to you.

K: Good.

P: And I think we could do it. I mean after the Russian trip some time bounce through those countries.

K: What is your thought, Mr. President, about stopping in Europe?

DECLASSIFIED
Authority
E012958
By NARA Date 6/7/74

DECLASSIFIED

2012958

Authority

By J. M. NARA Date 5/10

J.M.

P: Well, you mean after Russia or the Middle East.

K: No, no, not after the Middle East. Either before or after Russia.

P: After Russia or before?

K: We will have NATO declaration which will be ready to sign and if you were going to stop we could arrange some kind of summit meeting in which it gets signed.

P: Well, would your point be that we do that before we go Moscow or after?

K: I frankly would have a slight preference before.

P: That sorta cuts down our preparation plan. But that is OK. Could we do it in Brussels or London?

K: No, it would have to be in Brussels.

P: Yea.

K: This doesn't preclude your stopping in London on the way back.

P: Yea.

P: I am thinking of stopping in London or France. You know what I mean. But we could do with France, we should give Giscard D Estaing an early stop point you know before the next one.

K: Yea.

P: But I don't know. Provided it was just a pure business meeting, I don't want to stop and have two or three days horsing around with those people.

K: No, no it would only take about day or day and a half. Either on the way to or on the way back.

P: On the way to, I just don't know. I just wonder if things we have to talk to the Russians about that we just arent going to want to answer a lot of questions. You know or discuss.

K: On the other hand afterwards you have to explained what you did.

P: Well they have to be briefed.

-2-

P: What is the effect on the Russians if we stop before the meeting?

K: Well, they won't be crazy about it either before or afterward.

P: I understand.

K: I don't think it makes a lot of difference whether it is before or afterward.

P: My own inclination is that if we do it at all and coming back from Russia we could come back with only a rest stop and then back. Because I think we want the Russian thing to be an over-ride.

K: That would be my view. That is why I am slightly in favor of doing it on the way over. On the other hand signing the declaration can be a fairly solemn ceremony. And it is a good document.

P: But not thinking, Henry, in terms of a day or day and a half or anything like that.

K: You know, you don't need a rest stop on the way back from Russia. It is only a 10 hour flight.

P: That's true.

P: Although I may want to say something when I get off the plane. I don't know. On, now it doesn't make any difference. Do you think maybe we could stop in London on the way back?

K: The trouble is you stop in one capital and not in the others.

P: But I mean not stop in the capital now, is there some base in Northern Scotland or something like that.

K: Oh yea, but you would still have to see Wilson.

P: Yea, but that is still a problem, stop there the others are angry. So Iceland is out. You can't think of any other place that we could stop. I kinda like the idea of just stopping and getting some sleep even for six hours and getting on the plane and coming home.

K: Europe is only three hours from Russia.

DECLASSIFIED

E012958

Authority

By J.A. NARA Date 9/19

["DECLASSIFIED\nAuthority\nE012958", "-3-", "K: That is the problem and you still have 7 1/2 hours to go there.", "P: And it is out of the way if you stop in the Azores unless we you were at the South of Russia. Suppose you were down at the Black Sea, Henry, is there any place we could stop at on the way back. Could we stop at that delightful place in Morocco not in Rabat or Casablanca.", "K: You mean Malicas(sp?) for example oh sure you can do that.", "X X X X_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x_x

TELECON

John Dunlap/Secretary Kissinger

June 1, 1974

10:27 PM

K: How are you?

D: Fine.

K: I have assumed from you silence that may be you were not as interested in the economic job as I was hoping you'd be. I wanted to take another run at you anyway.

D: Since we last talked, what happened was I thought it (inaudible) I didn't think I should take a job for less than two or three years and that seemed difficult. In the meantime, Haig talked to me at length about various aspects of the matter which became Rush's business and then currently Bill is talking to me on hard terms about a short term as deputy secretary of Treasury. So I find myself in a somewhat corner, I'm being very candid.

K: Yes, I appreciate that.

D: And on the grounds of maybe 7 or 8 months might be possible.

K: As deputy secretary of Treasury?

D: Deputy secretary.

K: Yes.

D: There's a number two spot there.

K: Yes, I know.

D: And I said to Haig, I said to Rush, Bill.....

K: I just wish those SOB's would tell me the truth sometime. Excuse me. Haig told me he tried to persuade you to take my job.

D: Well, look, Henry, I don't want to get in the middle of this.

K: That's all right, let's not worry about that.

D: The truth is he strongly advised me against it. You know, no reason for me to play games.

K: No. On what grounds did he advise you?

By NARA Date 9749
DECLASSIFIED

DECLASSIFIED
Authority E012958
By NARA Date 9/7/94

Dunlap - page 2

D: Well, I think he was trying to persuade me to do something else. That was the only thing I could -- now the -- so that has what was going on. I've told Haig, I told Rush, I told Bill that the matter that had the greatest intellectual challenge to me was, as I said to you when you and I talked about. The real problem there is this time question and I think that was the reason and also because you were away and I didn't feel I should hold up anything more, that I got in touch with both him and, well, he got in tough with me on this other matter, Haig and then also Scowcroft and I told him that he could communicate with you and under those circumstances ____.

K: That under what?

D: That under these circumstances of (A) the probability and time I ought not to take such a job for less than two or three years and I was somewhat ____ to commit myself to that point in view of my _____. That he should try and find somebody else.

K: You see, John, what I need is somebody in whom I can have enough ____ confidence to turn over economic affairs to and given the particularly ____ structure in Washington right now, I really think State is in the best position to do it if it had the personnel. I just don't believe that these other organizations are going to be able to manage a coherent foreign policy or a coherent foreign economic policy. They can pick at it. Besides my relation with Simon are so good that particularly if you were here we could get almost anything done that needs to be done.

D: Well, my ____ relations with Bill are very good.

K: That's what I mean. And Simon isn't disposed to ____ make jurisdictional dispute.

D: No, he is not. He and I work very well together and have for years.

K: And you would be overwhelmingly my first choice and it isn't a subject, you know, I would want to be able to say what I want to accomplish in a foreign policy sense. But how that would get translated into economic policy, except in the most general way, I would leave to the man I put into that job. I haven't made another move until I had a chance to talk to you.

D: Well, I've been very candid with you on what's happened since you've been away.

K: I wouldn't worry about what Haig says. I think once you were over here it would work out very good.

D: Oh, I'm sure. Well, Bill had a run at me yesterday afternoon before I left, ____ Rush was talking to him yesterday about his problems ____ and then I

NARA Date 6/7/84
By A.J.

Dunlap - page 3

came back up here at the end of the day.

K: I don't believe that I could in good conscience tell you that 7 to 8 months......

D: Is the job, that's the problem.

K: Would do the job here. What the Department needs is somebody to re-organize its whole economic aparatas and to establish a cordial relationship with the xxx other economic agencies, that's other then just a negotiating relationship.

D: Absolutely. I know that.

K: You know, I would like to lure you here and then figure you wouldn't want to leave in 7 months. Frankly, I don't believe you could leave as deputy secretary of Treasury in 7 months.

D: That's a very candid____.

K: I think you could do it in a year and a half if Harvard were extended for a year.

D: Let me do this, I have got to take the weekend to really get my own self in order on this matter. I find myself in somewhat in a peculiar position with all that's going on.

K: Of course.

D: I would have preferred to be candid with you, to stay and work on some domestic inflation problems. ____ if the Congress had extended that legislation but they did not. That I was prepared to do for 8 months to a year. That sort of thing. With that -- that's was interested mewhen I was down there, you know, ..

K: But I think you could do a major job here.

D: That's nice of you to say so and you certainly deserve all the help you can get. Let me do this, I need a little -- let me give you a ring on Monday.

K: I think. Would you do that? When you think about it, really think of it in terms of that sometimes the best jobs to move into are those in which you can build everything from scratch.

D: I'm well aware of that.

K: I think what the country needs most, given in the foreign policy field isn't really the sort of diplomacy I do now which in a funny way is transatory, but to build into the area of economic policy where if you look

Dunlap - page 4

ten, fifteen years ahead...

D: I couldn't agree with you more.

K: ...we're going to have our most massive problems.

D: I left a memo with Rush about his job in which I indicated that that is somewhat of the same thing ____ real problems. Just as it is in the domestic side, on the inflation side, you're not going to solve this thing except over ten or 20 years in developing institutions that are much less inflationary than the present time. Well, let me be in touch with you on Monday.

K: John, think about it and I would really consider a great privilege to be able to work with you.

D: Quite the contrary.

K: You could consider that you'd have substantial carte blanch here.

D: Nothing would please me more than to work in the job.

K: Give it some thought.

D: I will give it a good deal of powerful thought, sir.

K: Thank you, John.

D: Bye.

END

By NARA Date 6/7/58

DECLASSIFIED
Authority
E012958
By
NARA Date 9/7/79

TELECON
Senator Fulbright/Secretary Kissinger

June 2, 1974

12:48PM

F: Henry, how are you.

K: How are you Mr. Chairman?

F: Fine. I just read you very fine letter. You are very nice.

K: And I want to tell you that I am heartbroken about the outcome.

F: Well, I was associated with you know what. They call it the mess in Washington among other things.

K: There is one consolation when the outcome takes this form you can't blame yourself that you have left anything undone.

F: No. It was so one-sided that the courage portray was just too powerful to overcome.

K: Exactly. And it makes you wonder whethere all incumbents may not be in trouble. this year.

F: This fellow is unusually good. He has all that Billy Graham has plus a lot. He is a x very clever man. He could be good and he could be one of those fellows who could be dangerous too. Because he is without any inhibitions that are associated with normal contact. He is a driving ambitious fellow.

K: Well, it is a great loss for the country. But I want to talk to you when you come back to see how we can work together even after you retire from the Senate.

F: Well, I will be glad to, I am planning to come back Thursday. And I believe you are scheduled to have a meeting on Friday.

K: That is right. It is not your favorit subject, so if you wanted to take the weekend off, I wouldn't mind.

F: OK

K: No, I'm joking.

F: I thought about that at the time.

K: No, No.

By A.J. NARA Date 5-27-58

(Inaudible)

F: Between now and the first of the year is to help you on your detente and overall policy. I must say I think you did a great job in the Middle East. You know that.

K: Well, now we come to the hard part on the Middle East. I do want to talk to you as soon as you are back about where we go from here and of course on the detente policy maybe we can have those hearings you talked about before the elections.

F: I am ready any time you are. Anything I can do, I'm ready to do it you know.

K: You will be a major source in foreign policy no matter where you are:

F: And I will be uninhibited in whatever I can show to help you in this whole area.

K: Well, I look forward to working closely with you and I want you to know that I was very sad by the outcome.

F: I appreciate that very much. You did all you could possibly do in which you did in the period. It was good but I don't think anything we could have done ..

K: When you have an outcome like this as I said the consolation is that it makes absolutely no difference. You campaigned as hard as any one could, your friends helped you, but this is one of those things beyond human endeavor.

F: I think that is true.

K: That is absolutely true and it has nothing to do with individuals either.

F: I think that is right.

I'll be back and will be glad to work with you. We welcome any suggestions you have about the hearings and whenever you are free to do it we'll be free to do it.

K: Terrific. And we will work as closely together as before.

F: Of course.

K: I am a little tired now.

F: I would think so.

TELECON

John Dunlop/Secretary Kissinger

June 3, 1974

12:07 PM

K: Hello?

D: Yes, Henry.

K: John, how are you?

D: How are you. Did you get my note?

K: N.

D: I sent you a note a while ago saying I think I better go back to the University. I knew you would be very busy and I was trying to minimize your telephone time. Let me read to you what I said to you because I had thought about it a little bit. I said, I reflected hard and prayerfully again over the weekend on the flattering opportunity to work directly with you over the next several years. There is no more important economic challenge than to help design economic institutions and policies, x here and internationally, to deal with the new political and strategic world that the President and you are creating. For a variety of personal and professional reasons, however, I have resolutely decided to return to the University now.

K: You know, I can't tell you how much I regret that.

D: That you would be even interested is flattering beyond measure.

K: Well, you strick me as a man who doesn't change his mind.

D: That is correct, Dr.

K: _ dream of every Harvard faculty members to get the dean fxx working for him someday.

D: As a matter of fact, you have made me sufficiently interested about this problem that I'm going go do some work on it. Maybe I'll want to come and talk to you when I've done a little work on it.

K: Good.

D: The problem that I defined in that note to you, just now. What are the economic institutions here and internationally, to deal with the kind of political world and strategic world which you and the President have been creating for us.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority

E012958

By NARA Date 9/7/74

Dunko - page 2

K: That's exactly the problem. That's exactly what I need done.
You think that if you won't do it -- that's exactly what Dick Cooper could do this?

D: He would be pretty good at it. I know him very well and I have high regards for him.

K: He lacks wisdom in my judgment.

D: He has not had the kind, if I may say so, operating experience which I have had although he was __ but didn't like it apparently and got out of it.
Although most of my operating experience was with those glorious fellows who even at times matched some of your Arabs friends, my building trade friends. I call them the local Arabs.

K: Well, John, I think you would have been the ideal man for this job.

D: I know you're very busy. Someday I'm going to put my ideas down on paper because you have challenged me about it and I'll be back with you.

K: Terrific.

D: Fine.

K: Good.

D: Thank you.

END

DECLASSIFIED
Authority E012958
By NARA Date 9/7/69

TELECON

Winston Lord/Secretary Kissinger

June 3, 1974

12:15 PM

K: Win?

L: Yes.

K: To go through these things, on the phrase, of the parties, that meant that
Australians....

L: That's right. Third countries would be included in the prisoner thing.

K: The return of Vietnamese civilian personnel, that just pledged our best
effort.

L: Maximum influence, sir. To get the majority out in 60 days and all in 90
days.

K: Yes, but that was always known.

L: The only one that's a problem is C, that's the only one.

K: Are you the one for....

L: I never understood it at the time. Few articles the word (inaudible)
was used. And they wanted to be sure that meant all the parties. Of course
it does.

K: The relationship between the international commission on control received
the national conference. What did that....

L: That was to leave open the possibility that we could at the international
conference set it up so that the ICCS reported to the international conference.

K: Regarding Laos and Cambodia, Cambodia?

L: That was the long one which included the exchange of messages on that.

K: Alright, that was one of their assurances.

L: That's right. What it said in the effect was, cease fire within 60 days then
when we slipped we moved it within 15 days. It said all prisoners out 60 days
after the cease fire. It said there were no captive Americans in Cambodia.

and the DRV said they've used their maximum influence on the Cambodians.

K: We have no problem with any of these.

DECLASSIFIED
Authority
By NARA Date 6/2/58

Lord - page xk 2

L: Except C, which is a problem.

K: Why is it a problem?
all

L: So that we can get them out within a year.

K: But also it's a statement of intention.

L: We agreed to do it. I don't remember the exact same language. It looks pret (inaudible) in writing as I remember it.

K: But all of these were unsigned? Isn't that right?

L: That's right.

K: And not initialed.

L: I don't have the files here, but I'm 99 % sure they were not. Just typed up and exchanged.

K: That's exactly right. That's my recollection. OK, fine.

END

DECLARED
Authority
EC012958

By M. NARA Date 6/7/68

DECLASSIFIED
Authority
2012958
By NARA Date 9/7/79

TELECON

Professor Cooper/Secretary Kissinger

Monday, June 3, 1974

4:10 P. M.

K: Hello

C: Hello

K: Dick, how are you.

C: Fine.

K: I wanted to talk to you. I have been giving some thought to some of the discussions we had at lunch the other day.

K: Hello. We have a very poor connection.

And as you know, I have this position open here as Under Secretary and I was wondering whether you might be interested in that.

C: That is a very hard question. In some sense yes and in some sense no. That's my own sorting out that I have to do.

K: Yea.

C: Can I give it some thought?

K: Certainly.

C: And get back to you.

K: Look.

C: Or do you think it would be useful to talk about it.

K: Well we can do either.

C: I am going to be in Washington, in any case on Wednesday and Thursday morning of this week. Your schedule I know is just terribly.

K: Let's talk about it then and oh, God, my schedule is never sane. How about six o'clock?

C: On Wednesday?

K: Yea.

C

["DECLASSIFIED\nAuthority\nE012958\nBy NARA Date 9/7/8", "", "C: That's fine.", "K: Good. Let's say 6 o'clock on Wednesday.", "C: O.K. I'll check with your office before then just to double check it.\nBut I plan to be there.", "K: Good.", "Let me tell you what I have in mind. What I need. First of all, some\nof the things you mentioned the other day, but secondly what I need ix\nis the relationship between foreign policy and foreign economic policy\nso it cannot be simply a purely economic exercise.", "C: I understand.", "K: On the other hand, at this point the connection between these two\nis such an <u>inextricable and intricate</u> one and I think one\nwould have a great opportunity in the two years <u>ax</u> that are left in\nthis Administration. To try to get it headed in the right way.", "C: Well, let me give it some thought and I'll see you on Wednesday.", "K: You know, as far as I am concerned I haven't enough <u>><u>><u><u>><u><u><u><u><u><u><u><u><u><u><u

TELECON
Gen. Scowcroft/Secretary Kissinger

Monday, June 3, 1974

4:30 PM

K: Are they attending a meeting at the White House?

S: If they are, I don't know anything about it.
What kind of a meeting?

K: That is what I would like to know.

S: Me too. I don't know anything about it.

K: Are they planning the Soviet trip without me?

S: (Laughter) No, I don't know anything about it. I will find out.

K: OK.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority

E012958

By

NARA Date 9/7/74

DECLASSIFIED

E012958

Authority

TELECON

Mr. McNamara/Secretary Kissinger

Monday, June 3, 1974

4:35 PM

K: I'm meeting with Cooper on Wednesday.

Mc: Good, I'll call him right now.

K: He is worried about having responsibility. That is not the problem.

Mc: He is going to have more than he can handle.

K: Exactly. That is not the problem. A. I can't do it and B. and I have to have confidence in the people.

Mc: I couldn't agree with you more.

K: The problem is jurisdiction of assignment.

Mc: I can understand that Henry, and I'll talk to him about that. You needn't worry about that problem.

K: It is not a problem.

Mc: The problem of getting something done in this Government is a hell of a complicated problem. Part of it, his real problem, Henry, is going to be to find an answer to these things. Assuming that he had a completely free hand and could be a dictator of the world.

K: He can assume that he has a free hand on this economic side. I just want to have enough in put on the foreign policy side.

hesitancy

Mc: I have no hesitancy in telling him that. I'll call him right away.

K: Good, many thanks.

TELECON

Golda Meir/Secretary Kissinger

June 3, 1974

6:45 PM

K: How are you?

M: Fine thank you. How are you?

K: Alright. I just wanted to call you now that you are a private citizen to tell you that our interest in you is as great as it always was.

M: Henry, did you get some rest?

K: I got some rest this weekend, yes.

M: That's good.

K: How do you feel?

M: Wonferful. I feel so light-hearted and light headed. It's a good feeling. Some worry.

K: I can imagine.

M: But, hope for the best.

K: Well, I cannot tell you how much I appreciated our working together this last month. It was really inspiring.

M: You know this evening I was talking to my children and some friends. The thing in Geneva went off so beautifully. It was beyond anything I could ever imagine.

K: We're getting some telegrams now from the Syrians which are, you know, at least shows some interest in a more rational dialogue.

M: Everything went off smoothly. There was one problem, I suppose you know about, ______ which we solved immediately and no problems at all.

K: Really.

M: I was scared as who ______ knows what will happen.

K: I expected they would treat you the way they treated me. And that it would go on for days endlessly.

DELEGATED
Authority
ECI/2958

By NARA Date 6/7/74

Meir - page 2

M: Yes. But look at how kind they are to us. It's because they don't speak to us, I guess. But really everything we hoped that the day after tomorrow and Thursday we get our men back.

K: That would be wonderful.

M: I saw the wounded ones last yesterday.

K: Did you? How are they?

M: Pretty good but they have problems. It's better than they thought they would be.

K: I think it is wonderful that you had an opportunity to do this as your last act.

M: There isn't a day that, actually several times during the day, that somebody doesn't mention you. And everybody's still wondering, wondering. No explanation explains how it happened and how you could do it. Everybody's very satisfied.

K: Well, let's all pray that it works out well and I really want you to know that all of us who were there think of you with so much affection.

M: Tell me, how's Nancy?

K: She's fine.

M: When are you coming?

K: To Israel?

M: Yes.

K: Oh, I'm coming with the President, whenever he's coming. I forget the date. 16th?

M: The 16th I think.

K: On the 16th, yes. And I'm sure you'll be present at some affairs.

M: Oh, I suppose. They can't forget me so quickly.

K: It is unavoidable.

M: Oh, I'm sure. I thought that I would ask the Foreign Office whoever is making the arrangements that if only for a few minutes I would come to the hotel to pay a courtesy call.

DECLASSIFIED
Authority E012958
By NARA Date 5-14

DECLASSIFIED

Authority

2012958

NARA Date 9/7/74

By

TELECON

Mr. Clayton Fritchie/Secretary Kissinger

Monday, June 3, 1974

10:50 AM

K: Hello.

F: Good morning Mr. President.

Laughter.

K: Clayton how are you?

F: In connection with our conversation with the Jackson amendment the other day night. Couple further thoughts. How, Have you given very much personal attention to Russell Long?

K: No.

F: He is Chairman of the Finance Committee and that is where everything is lodged now. And he is very old friend of mine and he is and he is susceptible to personal attention. Almost everything he has done in his life is done on that kind of basis. And he is strictly a quid pro quo guy. And as you know he has tremendous power up there. And other senators look to him very strongly and then number three on that Finance Committee is Gaylord Nelson. Who Russell looks up to him more than any other Senator and I had a long talk with Gaylord just about a week ago on this subject and he is very sympathetic to your position. He can do wonders with Russell.

K: You're right, he talked to him. Yea. Him I have talked to and

F: He is a marvelous senator and all the other senators think highly of him. But I tell you a little private session with Russell, drink or lunch or something like that I think would be well worth the effort. There are two other guys on that committee who were co-sponsors with Jackson. But whom I have second thoughts and one is Mondale and the other is Benson of kTexas and they are both highly respected by the other senators.

K: Well, let me look into that because both of those are good ideas.

F: Vance Harkie as you know is taking the lead on going back to Hyde Terrace, but he last week, while you were away, gave a little private dinner for the Russian political delegation. And I was quite surprised in view of the position he has taken up to now. Also, I went to the dinner and he was critical of State Dept. for not giving this group enough attention. I don't know if there is any merit to that or not. He seemed to think you should have been giving dinner instead of him.

-2-

F: Any case, I don't know if you know that fellow or not, but he too

K: What dinner was that again.

F: Last week Vance gave a dinner at the Georgetown Club for this
group of 8 or 9 Russian politicians who came over.

K: Oh, oh. well I was away.

F: Yes. But I was surprised to see how friendly he was considering
the fact that he has been making things difficult on the Trade Reform
Act. So maybe he may be worth a little attention.

K: What do you think of Cranston?

F: Oh, highest. Absolutely.

K: Cause he has offered to help and I just wanted to

F: Absolutely. He is just fine. He doesn't carry the weight with the
other senators that Gaylord does you know or Mondale. But he is
very well respected man and he is a man of great character.
I have highest regarad for him.

K: I like him personally.

F: He is intelligent man too.

K: I just didn't know whether he could deliver anything.

F: I don't know. He sure would be worth having, but I don't think he
could deliver like Gaylord or Russell, of course Russell could do
anything. He is the real power house and everything depends on
what that Committee does on the Jackson amendment.

K: Yea.

F: IBut if you had Nelson. The reason Gaylord is so important here
not only because he is third or fourth ranking, but Russell really does
consult him on everything. I know them both well.

K: I'm having breakfast with Jackson.

F: Good luck. I think maybe in the light of last weeks publicity
he may be a little more amenable.

-3-

K: I was just going to say. I think if he is going to. This is not his best week to take me on.

F: No, no, it couldn't be better time for you.

But he is pretty cocky right now, but I think maybe. Of course Stu is pretty good at sensing movement of things up on the hill and he must have noticed that some of his sponsors are getting uneasy.

And that's why he may be amenable to some kind of formula that could work out a compromise here.

K: Yea.

F: I think it is worth pursuing any way. That is all for today.

K: Clayton, you've been a good friend and I appreciate it.

F: Keep on.

K: See you soon.

F: Bye.

K: Bye.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority

E012958

By NARA Date 9/14

Telcon
Secretary Kissinger
Amb. McCloskey
6/4/74; 9:13 a.m.

K: Hello.

M: Good morning.

K: Yes.

M: Your friend Khaddam scooped us this morning.

K: I don't know what he is talking about.

M: Yeah, neither do we. But since you will be out of pocket all morning we will need some guidance as to how to handle it.

K: Say that this is the general intention but just tell the truth. This is the general intention but the specifics haven't been worked out yet.

M: Uh-huh.

K: Don't you think?

M: I think we can't do anything less.

K: Say it is true that we have agreed on that in principle and we are in touch with them now about the specifics.

M: All right.

K: Okay?

M: Yeah. And I will just have to say timing has not been agreed upon.

K: No, but it is a question of a short period. And then get Sisco to send an urgent cable to Scotes to find out -- to say we think we ought to announce it when the President is there but if they want to announce it before we would like to know.

M: All right. He is right here I will tell him that.

K: Okay.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority

2012958

NARA Date 9/7/68

By

Telcon
Secretary Kissinger
Amb. McCloskey (& Joe Sisco)
6/4/74; 9:13 a.m.

- 2 -

S: Good morning.

K: Joe?

S: Yes, sir.

K: You better find out -- I've got to run to one of my fifty committees --
get a cable off to Scotes and find out what the Syrians have in mind --
whether they want to announce it before the President gets there.

S: I see.

K: Or when he is there.

S: When you say announce it you mean the --

K: Resumption.

S: The resumption in view of this report. All right, I will find that
out. One other quick thing -- can I send a cable to Atherton merely
telling him what really I said to him over the phone: that ______ you
have taken up that matter with the Israelis.

K: Yes.

S: My point is do you think the Israelis are going to do anything?

K: I don't know. I have urged it.

S: All right.

K: Good. Thank you.

NARA Date 9/7/74
By A.L.