September 13, 1972, 1:00 p.m.

President's Desk

DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 12958, Secl. 3.6

By: K.L. V. NAFU, Date: 5/12/84

TELCOM
Secretary Peterson/Mr. Kissinger
3:00 p.m., June 30, 1972

K: Pete, I have two problems. One is Flanigan has raised all kinds of hell with Haldeman and the President. So I've cut him in on this thing.

P: Right. Did you get my message yesterday, I hope.

K: Yeah. Which I should give him some technical authority over it. You know, just saying you handle the economic White House backstopping of it. Secondly, Dobrynin called me and he said two things. One, your proposal of holding this announcement up until you return just isn't very practical for her. Incidentally, independently the President expressed the same view. But the reason it isn't practical for them is because they made a decision in response to Presidential requests. You know, to move fast and it's sort of embarrassing for them and they've got their team over here to do some negotiating.

P: Right. They want to negotiate for the first batch of purchases.

K: So I told Dobrynin I would talk to you. I think we should let them go ahead with it.

P: I'm glad you called because I've got more than one item. We are now working on a draft of an agreement. I had Butz over here today for an hour meeting with him. It's very interesting, they are talking up to $500 million in their conversations.

K: Of cash?

P: Immediately. No, of grain this year. You remember, my proposition was $750 and two this year for political reasons. They are now talking about $500 million.

K: Right.

P: This year.

K: Right.

P: Now we get on to the timing and how to do it. The problems we have on a public announcement, aside from the fact that I assume the President would want to do this post-convention as you discussed.

K: Well, he would like to do it on the 18th or 19th. Somewhere in there.

P: 18th or 19th. All right. We'll see how we can arrange that. The

The official telephone report of the
President, Senate, and House of
Representatives, etc.

DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 12958, Sec. 3.6

By: KHLW NASA Date: 5/13/74

TELCON
Secretary Peterson/Mr. Kissinger
3:00 p.m., June 30, 1972

- 2 -

P: (cont'd) second problem we have is the Labor Union thing. And we've now got Gibson meeting up in New York trying to bring them aboard.

K: Right.

P: We think it's bad strategy. You know, to go around and make a lot of noises until that thing is buttoned down. We not only have them to get aboard but we've got this goddamn freight-rate differential problem to get aboard.

K: Right.

P: So there we are. We thought the following. We thought that they could go ahead and start buying the stuff for the first year. And they were willing to go and say cash or credit, one or the other. Then they could buy it with the full assurance that the buyer wouldn't have to know that the U.S. Government was behind it.

K: Right.

P: And then on that basis, they would go ahead and make their initial commitments. We don't know, frankly, Henry, whether it's for the $500 million or $400 or $100 but it will be a substantial amount for the first year. They do not have any reason to go into the three-year aspect and frankly, we would just as soon at this point not, you know, elevate this thing too much cause it may make the price of grain go up. So they would just as soon peddle out their orders one at a time.

K: All right. But when do you think we can announce the three-year deal?

P: I think we can announce the three-year deal when we have got the maritime problems and the freight-rate problems. Just a moment -- We can sign it but you're talking about announcing it, right?

K: Yeah.

P: And I would hope sometime in the next two or three weeks we can do that.

K: That's fine. Well, then let's proceed on that basis.

P: Now they came here saying they wanted to sign it at the summit, this isn't our idea. They said they wanted to sign it at the -- I mean, announce the whole deal as a concrete achievement of the Commission. I then said and Jim Lynn said, well, we don't know how the President

H. W. Taft, Pres. and
S. M. N. T. and J. M. S. M.
President and Vice-Chairmen

By: K.L. V. NASA Date: 5/12/72

- 5 -

TELCON
Secretary/Peterson/Mr. Kissinger
3:00 p.m., June 30, 1972

P: (cont'd) will want to do this. I was half thinking, Henry, we could come back; have some kind of a hangup and then, you know, he could announce that he broke the deadlock, if that's the way you want to do it.

K: Well, apparently they prefer to do it a little faster now if I understood Dobrynin correctly. And the President would prefer to do it faster.

P: Yeah. Is Dobrynin talking about the announcement of the total deal?

K: Yes.

P: The three-year deal?

[Break in Tapes]

P: ... they would agree they would tell their customers go ahead, we told them to do it. And they will tell them they will be paid either in cash or by cash. So quote is the deal.

K: Pete, my problem right now is I'm trying to get off to the West Coast and I'm already an hour late.

P: Yeah. Okay.

K: Can I just tell Dobrynin that we're all aboard on this and that if the three-year deal gets concluded and if we get the maritime thing settled, one possibility is to announce it the week of the 17th.

P: That's a possibility, right.

K: Good.

P: And do you think that will suit the President better?

K: That seems to suit him better right now.

P: Yeah. All right. Well, we'll just leave that option open.

K: Okay.

P: Yeah.

K: Good, bye.

P: All right, thank you, Henry.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E12828
By CNAR Date 6/2/82
Stet

TELCORN

Amb. Dobrynin/Mr. Kissinger

3:10 p.m., June 30, 1972

D: Hello, Henry

K: Anatol, I have cleared it up and you can start negotiating for the
cash purchases immediately.

D: Yes.

K: On the agreement itself, you should go ahead and negotiate it and then
we would like to announce it sometime the week of July 17th if we
have the maritime question solved by then.

D: When Peterson will be there?

K: No, no; we can announce it here before Peterson goes.

D: Oh, before even.

K: Yes.

D: I see. By that time you hope you will get this --

K: We will have it solved.

D: Yes, to do it. But you have in mind to announce about the whole deal
about long-term? I mean, for three years in all, yes?

K: Yes.

D: Yes, I understand. It is all right with us.

K: I think it's the sensible way of completing. Because if we settle it
in July and hold it up till August when Peterson is back and it comes
out that we've done that, it really doesn't look very good.

D: Yeah, I understand. You have a Convention next week and so on.

K: So I think we should announce it whenever we can agree on it as long
as it isn't during the week of the Democratic Convention because then
it would look like a stunt.

D: I understand. But do you really think it would be possible to prepare
right now within a reasonable time without waiting until the 18th of July
really because as a matter of principle, I mean, on a government to
government basis because Mr. Kuzmin says he leaves rather quickly.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority F012587
By: L. NARASARAYA Date: 05/25/87

TELCORN

Amb. Dobrynin/Mr. Kissinger

3:10 p.m., June 30, 1972

- 2 -

K: Yes.

D: And at the same time we could pursue without mentioning to the private companies.

K: You can begin negotiating your cash purchases.

D: On this year.

K: On this year.

D: Yes, without mentioning anything for the other things.

K: Exactly.

D: This is a point I would like to clear.

K: No, you can begin negotiations on the cash purchases. We can even say for cash or credit but it would be better to say cash so there is no speculation.

D: For one year without mentioning anything what we could discuss up on.

K: Right.

D: And meanwhile Mr. Kuzmin will [make sure] that as soon as possible this agreement on three years and with understanding we will publish around the 18th.

K: Exactly.

D: This is a good decision.

K: That's the businesslike way of doing it.

D: Exactly. I . . . is quite good for us . . . to go ahead with this understanding. You will notify Pete about it?

K: I have notified Pete and he's agreed. The only other thing is we have some jurisdictional problems here.

D: What kind?

K: In the White House Peter Flanigan looks after the economic aspects of this so --

DECLASSIFIED

Authority Folsome
By CAPRA Date 6/26/62

TELCONE

Amb. Dobrynin/Mr. Kissinger

3:10 p.m., June 30, 1972

- 3 -

D: So you would like --

K: No, no; I will inform him. No, no; you don't have to. If there is a problem, he may get involved in the thing and I just wanted you to be aware that I am in close touch with him.

D: Yeah, I see. In case, for instance . . . . . while you're in California, I have to contact him then if something --

K: Contact me and I may ask you then to contact him.

D: But you will tell me when to contact him?

K: Right.

D: For the time being, I'm still doing this particular business with you not with him?

K: Right. Once it is reduced to a purely economic thing, I will move it over to him.

D: Okay.

K: But this way we could move it faster.

D: Yeah, because this is the thing, not to delay what they could do. The whole team to have another man there --

K: No, your team can start working immediately. It will take them a week or two to get the agreements.

D: Yeah, I understand. But it would be good if we could do it simultaneously so to speak.

K: Exactly.

D: Particularly to discuss it with you on a government level and at the same time discussing it with them on a one-year term and with you a long-term.

K: Exactly right.

D: This is really what you wanted.

DECLASSIFIED

TELCORN

Amb. Dobrynin/Mr. Kissinger

3:10 p.m., June 30, 1972

-4-

K: Did you ever not get what you want out of my office?

D: (laughter) Well, well, you're going to receive almost a billion dollars, I should say. Doesn't it sound enough?

K: (laughter)

D: And the time is not inconvenient as Mr. Gromyko would like to say; it is not inconvenient.

K: It is not inconvenient.

D: (laughter) For your side when you put it this way.

K: That is correct. So you tell Mr. Gromyko, incidentally, that he got me unawares last time but I'm sharpening my double negatives.

D: Well, you seem to because this is his favorite way sometimes to those who doesn't know him very well, even our own foreign ministers they're puzzled, but he uses formal and they don't know whether he's positive or he's negative.

K: He is masterful in the use of double negatives.

D: Yes, sometimes. Well, I know him for many years so for me it's easier but for many people, it is still difficult to understand.

K: Well, I'll tell you, you know, people -- I had dinner with Kay Graham yesterday and I said to her I've developed a real personal affection for Gromyko and she looked at me as if I had absolutely lost my mind.

D: Well, I think he . . . . . . . . a great majority of people, not only in your country but in my own think the same way.

K: They think he is a dollar. Then I said the other day to a television person -- not on television but I had dinner with her -- I said in general Russians have a good sense of humor but the man who has a really delightful sense of humor is Gromyko. She looked at me and I knew she thought I had absolutely lost my marbles.

D: Henry, this is a mystery. (laughter) I apologize for . . . .
You see, you have better protection so you are quite safe but the other
men who would say the same thing, they will not believe completely.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority E012352
By LJB NARA Date 5/20/72

TELCON

Amb. Dobrynin/Mr. Kissinger

3:10 p.m., June 30, 1972

K: He has a great sense of humor.

D: He has but only in rare cases when he really has the full confidence of the man. . . . . . So you developed this kind of relationship with him.

K: Well, I look forward to seeing in September.

D: Yeah, in September you will. It's approximately the same date as it was.

K: About the 9th I will get there. Is that all right?

D: About what?

K: About September 9th.

D: Yes. Well, I don't specifically have in mind the 9th but the first 10 days. I checked it with Brezhnev two weeks ago. He said the first 10 days is quite all right. So when it comes a little bit closer, I will recheck because now it is foolish.

K: Will you recheck? You know, what I frankly want to do is go to the Olympic Games on the 7th and 8th and then arrive on the 9th in Moscow.

D: No, I'm sure there will be no problem because if he will not be there it would be arranged for you to go to the Crimea or __________. He'll probably go to the Crimea; he hasn't decided yet but in this case you could go there. It's a nice place to be there.

K: I would love it.

D: There would be people like Mr. Brandt and Mr. Kissinger and the Secretary General.

K: Except that I'm not so afraid of him as Mr. Brandt is.

D: (laughter) Well, I think that now he is used to.

K: Okay.

D: Okay, Henry.

DECLASSIFIED

Authority

By L/C NARA Date 06-26-72

TELCORN

Amb. Dobrynin/Mr. Kissinger

3:10 p.m., June 30, 1972

K: I'll see you on the 11th in California.

D: Yes. And I will give a call before.

K: If you could confirm it for me as early next week as possible.

D: Okay. I will do it something around maybe Tuesday or Wednesday, all right?

K: Good. Because I would like to arrange the movie studios and also the dinner.

D: Not later than Wednesday I will give you a call.

K: Right. Bye.

D: Bye, bye.

Huyghe, M., and J. de Looze, 1973, in: *Huyghe, M. and J. de Looze, 1973, in: Proc. 4th Int'l Conf. on Comm. Syst. Prog. Comput. Syst.*

CLASSIFIED

E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By: K.M.L. NAFU Date: 5/12/84

TELCOM

Bob Toth/Mr. Kissinger

4:30 p.m., June 30, 1972

T: Hello, how have you been?

K: Okay.

T: Travelling.

K: Right.

T: I wonder if you could give me any guidance on this decision to go back to Paris beyond what was publically said. It doesn't seem still to be on the face of it any reason to expect they're going to be more forthcoming.

K: Well, if not, it will end like it did the last time.

T: Yeah, but in the meantime until July 13th obviously the South Vietnamese are going to have to do their bit. Are you anymore hopeful than in the past that they are going to be able to retake Quang Tri or something like that?

K: The two are not necessarily connected.

T: They're not?

K: No.

T: Well, are you personally anymore hopeful than you were say in May?

K: Well, the May situation was really quite different. I think this is the time in which we are going to find out whether there can be serious talks ever this year.

T: Serious talks this year.

K: Yeah.

T: This is as a result of Paris and Peking and so forth? I mean, the Moscow and Peking?

K: I just don't want to speculate what it was. I know I'm not being enormously helpful to you but I just don't -- I think there is too much talking as it is.

T: Yeah. Well, it's inevitable in this situation. I was told that you had made some sort of an elliptical comment about the war resolution on

The President's Office in Washington, D.C.

The State Department

U.S. Department of State

DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 12958, Sept. 3.6

TELCORN

Bob Toth/Mr. Kissinger

4:30 p.m., June 30, 1972

By: K.H.Y
NASA Date: 5/12/72

T: (cont'd) the Hill, that if they don't get it through this time, there will be no point in doing it before -- I mean, afterwards, implying that the war --

K: Oh, nonsense. I mean, I said, now, while we're setting this thing up is a bad time to do it. Afterwards we will have to see how these negotiations develop. It would be absolutely wrong for me to predict exactly what they're going to do. We'll wait and see. They certainly can have no doubt about our view.

T: Well, can you say anything about the channels? I don't mean literally but in more general terms.

K: We've been dealing with them through many channels as usual.

T: Was Moscow particularly --

K: I just don't want to talk about that. And the people who will talk about it won't know.

T: (laughter) That's good guidance. Did you hear about the incident in Kiev where Tkach took the picture of the President?

K: No.

T: (laughter) I was reminded of you when I heard it because I thought you would appreciate it. The President after the Ukrainian State Dinner decided he wanted his picture taken with the entertainers and he turned to Haldeman and said, 'Get the photographers back in.'' Then he began to arrange the picture. Haldeman meanwhile turned to one of his agents and said get the photographers back in. But it turned out the photographers had gone home two hours ago so Tkach ran out to his car and got his camera. As the President turned with all these people, there was his doctor only with his little brownie. He took a picture and the President said I think you better take another one, Walter. He took the second one and after it was all over, Haldeman said you know, you've been following us around for three and a half years waiting for an emergency, that was it.

K: (laughter) That's very good. Well, you know, I just want to wait and see what actually will happen and I don't want to speculate what the chances are. I have to see what they come up with.

Hanoi, June 13, 1972

U.S. Navy's confidential

Publicity Note!

By: KHL NASA, Date: 5/12/72

TELCONE
Bob Toth/Mr. Kissinger
4:30 p.m., June 30, 1972

T: Well, would you think what happens on the battlefield will be at this point still more important --

K: Not what happens between now and then. Marginal.

T: Not what happens between now and July 13th. It's more the political decisions that have taken place, if any, in Hanoi then.

K: That's right. And the fact that the offensive is not going the way it was going in May when I last met them.

T: Okay. I thank you very much for this. I'm sorry I'm not going out to California this trip.

K: Well, I'll see you when I get back.

T: I hope so.

K: Good. I talked to Kraslow today. I told him I would meet with the LA Times Group after I come back.

T: Good. It was very news about David.

K: Oh, I'm delighted. He deserved it.

T: Yeah. Pierpoint said sometimes the White House wins.

K: Yeah, yeah. I'm delighted.

T: Thanks again.

To speculate what it was. I know I was to you but I just don't -- I think

I, it's inevitable in this situation. I was on some sort of an elliptical comment about the world.

The President's Office of the Vice President for Academic Affairs

TELCONE
Peter Flanigan/Mr. Kissinger

5:37 p.m., June 30, 1972

K: Yes, Pete.

F: On this proposal regarding Poland, what we are in fact doing is by delaying this PL 480 stuff giving the Poles ____ % money instead of giving them equitable --

K: Well, can you find a way of getting the President off it or doing part of it or doing something in the PL 480 field.

F: I'm suggesting the latter, part of it. The question is did the President agree to 5 years when he was over there or just agree to a delay because --

K: He agreed to a delay.

F: Why don't we delay two or three years worth?

K: That is fine.

F: Good.

K: That is good.

F: Thank you. I'll work with Sonnenfeldt on it.

K: Oh, you lucky man. He's the one guy who is a worse pain in the ass than I am.

F: Now, Henry, it's just that he doesn't have your sense of humor. You called Peterson?

K: Right. I did and it's all set.

F: Thanks very much.

K: Bye.

F: Bye, bye.