DECLASSIFIED
E.O. 12958, Sect. 3.6

By. NARA, Dale 5/26

TELCORN
President/Kissinger

3:02 p.m.

1/14/72

P: Do you missbox Calif. ?

K: It was certainly lovely out there. It warmed up.

P: I am between drafts and wondered what's new.

K: I sent a copy of the draft. It sent this morning. It should be there or on the way.

P: I k won't be able to get it until tomorrow.

K: First page won't have the punch you will give it but relative for ____.

P: I will not get to it until after tomorrow afternoon.

K: I told Stans to start slowly on negotiating grain deal. Yesterday they had a reception at the Embassy. I want and they fell all over me. Dobrynin coming back on Sunday. They have a special message for me. He was having long talks with Brezhnev before coming back. Appreciate we let them come back on trade. We drank vodka. The minister said can we drink to the summit. I said of course. She said it will be a success. A lot of press standing around while this going on. Vorontsov took me aside and said we are eager and ready.

P: Any talk about txx rhetoric?

K: I told Stans and reported back to Moscow. No use to say anything to Vorontsov with Dobrynin coming back. We will get that grain deal. I hox never thought there was any question. When we are tough it improves our relationship. They went out of their way to stres how much looking forward to it and getpress in.

Why

P: How do you think they were asking about the summit?

K: Probably scared that we were teed off at them. We have reason to be but we have shown our fangs and made our point and no sense carrying it on. They stressed the trade. Vorontsov said he will want to discuss M.E. Has a full plate.

P: The only problem we have with these poepole is we have been on this track before. They postpone things.

K: They haven't come this far and postponed it.

P: That's right.

K: I think I can read it pretty well. Getting concerned. Now they have made a policy decision to go all out. She wouldn't have talked this way.

By. NARA, Dalo 5/26

TELCOM
President/Kissinger

3:02 p.m. 1/14/72

-2-

P: She is probably informed.

K: Ministers of the Soviet Union don't talk idly. Charge d'affaires even less.

P: We did something nice at the WH.

K: That was appreciated. That's on track.

P: The troop thing well handled.

K: Well played in press. O'Brien on TV says VN will not be an issue.

P: He doesn't want it to be.

K: If it were a plus for them -- he knows it will be a negative.

P: Not an issue because the issue would be they started it and we ended it.
Laird handled it well.

K: Came out very well.

P: Haldeman says it was a break in lead in all 3 networks.

K: I didn't see the evening news but on 11:00 it played well.

P: How on papers.

K: Front page everywhere.

P: As we have always found on withdrawals with hemming and hawing it doesn't
make any difference.

K: We could have had it lower.

P: More story but as it was we didn't need to add anything. 75 wouldn't have
made a difference.

K: It would have given less in April to play with.

P: I will look forward to reading the draft. I won't work on it until tomorrow.
Domestic stuff is complicated.

K: And have to do the whole speech.

P: We have about 18 programs. Foreign things are more direct.

By. NARA, Date 5/26

President/Kissinger

3:02 p.m.

1/14/72

-3-

K: That's right.

P: How's your State of the World?

K: We have broken the back.

P: You will make the 8th.

K: No question.

P: I am thinking of a p____ on the 10th. Extra ______ that way.

K: Znd leaving the 15th or 16th.

P: 10th last time to meet these people. We will have the day we leave the leaders
____ or that morning. By Bipartisan group of leaders. An hour with them.

K: Nice symbolic gesture.

P: Asking questions. Having them pledge support. You might talk with Bob about that and tell him he might inform leaders of that meeting soon. It's good one to have them over them. Good for Mansfield.

K: Good idea. I don't have the right judgment how far ahead to tell them.

P: Many times people get a hell of a lot out of looking forward to something. They say, I am going to be briefed. Then confuse the idea of being concerned. Tell him to put it out well in advance. What are you going to do?

K: Work on the World Report. And a lot of accumulated stuff.

Kx P: Haig better? Over his stomach ailment?

K: Yes. Rough trip and hell of a stay. After those two speeches get a maximum of rest.

P: I will. Two weekends of rest if they don't drive me crazy on the domestic stuff.

K: You need your reserves.

P: Florida is the place.

K: I won't call unless it's overwhelmingly important.

P: I need to know. Don't hestitate to call.Connally says Japanese and

By. NARA, Dato 5/26

President/Kissinger
3:02 p. m. 1/14/72

-4-

European being tough on trade. You might touch base with him on that. You met with McNamara yesterday. I am seeing him and Connally after the 20th. $15 billion in World Bank to toss around. Going to India, Pakistan --

K: I wanted to see him before that.

P: I understand. McNamara is willing to play ball?

K: Yes. You might consider seeing him every 3 months or so.

P: Yes. Can be told by Connally. I wanted to see him before the trip but I can't. We have supported him on that.

K: He is grateful. He has supported us too. Never said anything publicly but privately with Democrats.

P: They can't say a hell of a lot.

K: I haven't seen a thing.

P: The best decision we made was the decision to announce only two months before. Three or four months gaps.

K: 6 months we would have been naked now.

P: It's always a question of what are you doing for us lately.

K: Exactly right. Until opening of Congressional session. Done in low key way. McGovern pulled out we reduced by 50%. Taking out more then we are leaving.

P: Never thought of that but true. Problems rough in Laos and Cambodia.

K: Cambodia isn't but Laos is.

P: We cannot fight in Laos forever.

K: We can keep bombing them. The things we should do we cannot do. If we could launch into Kampong area we would break their back. But in present circumstances we can do that.

P: VN will be able to do that next year.

K: If they survive.

By. NARA, Dato

5/26

-5-

P: They will survive.

K: We have to be sure they are not being forsaken. For a Peace plan next week and ?? ?? ?? But with domestic support puts them in long term ?? ??

P: ?? ?? ?? is long term survival.

K: It makes it impossible for Democrats to do launch an attack in Congress and then Peking trip and then we will see.

P: What can be said for 1972 in ____ State of the Union. We can say ?? .

K: In VN? Or around the world.

P: Peace for U.S.

K: We cannot say we are going to have it. We can say we will bring the day measurably closer. A sentence on the speech two nights before.

P: I am not putting anything in that. I will add that Wed. I will say it on such and such. Have Lord or someone draft a brief papagraph referring to the speech. For my confidential information.

K: Price will have to be sure not to leak his draft around.

P: For myself only. I am going to try to summarize the Nixon Doctrine. I will summarize the Nixon and what we have done in India and Pakistan and around the world. Just about 5 sentences. The main point being we will keep all of the treaty commitments and others to defend themselves. If we once fail use influence to stop it, and when it stops, help, but where treaty commitments or interests involved we will not be involved. Got to put interest in to the M.E.

K: Sounds fine.

P: I will put it down so you can see it.

K: If I could get a quick look at it.

P: I haven't finalized it. Only other reference is speech. I want you to see foreign policy stuff.

K: I will have that paragraph to you tomorrow.

By.

NARA, Dato

5/26

TELCON

Stans/Kissinger

5:35 p.m.

1/14/72

K: What have you given away now?

S: 50 million.

K: The Russians at the Embassy yesterday were so happy with you that you could/ have been following our instructions.

S: I read book on how to win friends and influence people.

K: That's what we did not want. They actually caught the tone in Moscow and they are shaken.

S: When is Dobrynin coming back?

K: Mon.

S: Good. We can see him before these fellows go back. I met with these fellows Wed. afternoon. He said what to do you have in mind on the agricultural agreement. My govt. wants you to know we are ready to negotiate along the lines Kosygin mentioned and we are ready whenever you are and where. We want to know who will represent you and who will represent us. They are waiting on that.

K: Let's wait until I talk with Dobrynin.

S: Secondly, he said what about lend-lease matter. My govt. is ready to negotiate settlement of lend-lease matter. We want to know who your negotiators will be and where and when.

K: Both of these things will be done and not next month.

S: Great. What kind of plan and I said we would like to have both negotiated so they could be announced when the President visits Moscow.

K: Also their view.

S: But we think we should start early because of possible complications. We only have to tell them when we are ready to negotiate.

K: Can you hold on that for 10 days?

S: Leaving Tues. Dobrynin is back on Mon.

K: Find out where we can reach them. We have to work out bureaucratic angle here. We will be in touch and we will be positive. Before the end of the month.

By. NARA, Date 5/26

Stans/Kissinger

5:35 p.m.

1/14/72

S: Give you time to talk with Dobrynin.

K: We give us 3 weeks. By Feb. 10 we will let them know about time and place.

S: OK. That doesn't mean we have to wait that long?

K: No. In my judgment it will be settled by Feb. 1. But if we say that and it slips a day we are worse off then if we say later. We can settle it in a week of Dobrynin's return. I have the impression talking with that lady that they are ______ in direction they were before.

S: In the meantime they are pointed out that the Intourist office in NY was attacked by the Jewish Defense League. So it's not one-sided.

K: It makes a difference what the JDL does and what they say or ______. Give us until Feb. 10. The answer if positive will be before then.

S: If you read the papers there's an indication I would not be around. If it's done it will be the 15th of Feb. I would like to settle it before that.

K: It's practically settled. We want it undersigned before Peking. I want to settle these other things. It will be done. You did exactly what we wanted.

TELECON

The President

1/14/72 6:00 p.m.

BY NARA, Date 5/26

P: I just XXX finished the eighth draft. It's coming along better than I had hoped. I think I'll get to the other tomorrow morning.

K: Terrific. It should be up there by now.

P: No, no problem. Ray is bringing in the next draft at 10:00 so I won't get to it until about noon.

K: Well, I found out that Safire is now at the Superbowl.

P: Oh, that's fine. You didn't send it to him there?

K: No.

P: I am leaving blank the foreign policy section. I said I wanted to write that myself -- I'm speaking of the State of the Union. We are spending only three or four hundred words on it. It's primarily a domestic speech. But I want to run this text by you. I will get it in a form I think *delikke* do-able tomorrow. And then will you take a look at it. It will be very general and the *Satz* State of the World more specific.

K: The thing on Tuesday and the State of the World within two weeks of the other one.

P: It will say something about not getting involved in every war around the world, but keeping our treaty commitments. It's a narrow road, but one we have got to stay on. I will say except where treaty commitments are concerned we won't get involved. Is that okay?

K: Yes, no problem.

P: But you think it's okay.

K: I would like to see it on context but it sounds good to me.

P: It makes points with the people we need to. I've worked on it very carefully and I'll ship it to you.

K: I talked to Maury Stans. The Soviets are prepared to discuss a five-year agricultural agreement ______ billion dollars. They want to sign it when you are in Moscow.

P: Well, that's the news.

K: We should designate time and place to begin negotiations. I told him to tell them we will let them know by January 25. That will give me time to talk to Dobrynin. They're also willing to settle lend-lease from the war.

TELECON
The President

1/14/72 6:00 p.m. p. 2

By. NARA, Date 5/26

P: . . . . . . . . . . . people will play it up big now that the withdrawal rate has been announced. But that's to be expected, isn't it? I mean, Laos we know is serious. But in casualties, sure our figures are down, but the South Vietnamese are too, aren't they?

K: Yes.

P: And infiltrations are still just what they were last year.

K: No, they're higher.

P: At the moment they are higher . . .

K: They have only up to now infiltrated half of what they did at the dry season last year.

P: That's what I was trying to say.

K: So around February 1 they will give us a pop; no question.

P: But don't you think PR-wise we are well-positioned on that?

K: Oh yes, and Froehlke actually turned out to have done a useful thing by predicting it and what we are doing next week will put them on the defensive.

P: I think that will be ______ to matter.

K: I'm going to have a serious talk with Dobrynin and say he has got to use his influence.

P: Well, if it even looks hoepless, you know what I'm going to do. That's why the pop I gave them ______ helped. Don't you think?

K: I think so. No question. Not only because of the damage it did but also because of the psychological pressure.

P: Okay, well the State of the Union is coming better than I had hoped.

K: I'm delighted.

P: You've got to get these guys away from their shops sometimes.

K: I did more in four days in San Clemente on the World Report than I could have done in two weeks here.¹

P: Do you plan to do a briefing on that?

By. NARA, Dalo 5/26

TELECON
The President

1/14/72 6:00 p. m. p. 3

K: I think I'd better.

P: I think you should. I'll go out with you. What hypoed . . . . the troop withdrawal thing, I went out and said one sentence which made TV. They everything Laird got also played. You could give me about three minutes and then go on.

K: I think that's superb. It's your report, not mine.

P: But you know how people are.

K: I think it's important for you to do it.

P: We can do it in the East Room, build it up. Work out a three or four minute statement for me on it. That will make TV with you standing there and they your stuff will make reams of copy.

K: I can explain what's in it; you can give the philosophy of it. Yours should be an academic approach which you can give in three or four minutes.

P: I'll send this to you, but it's not being circulated.

K: I won't show it to anyone.

P: No, I don't mean you, but it's not going to be anyone else's. I don't want it nit-picked to death. But I want you to look at it and be sure it's okay.

By. NARA, Dale 5/26

TELCON
Mrs. Cerf/Kissinger

6:37 p.m.

1/29 14/72

C: They have really had you on the coals.

K: ?????

C: People are so envious. I hate to see it to you. You are too good and too important.

K: A lot of my friends called.

C: A lot of people say good things about you. Andrews and Gerhardt were the one reason they would vote for Nixon.

K: They didn't have me on the run.

C: On the griddle.

K: I decided not to answer it because it does no good. It's distorted but doesn't do any good.

C: A lot of it is anti-semitic and you know it is lying under there. Use the first chance that they can to get at it. Hit them again!

K: When are you coming down?

C: I might come down for the press dinner because you are speaking.

K: Then we will have lunch. I will compromise you at the Sans Souci. I will ruin you so see all your respectable friends before that.

C: I would love that. If it works.

K: Of course.

C: Then I will definitely come.

K: We will have lunch on the 27th.

C: You have friends everywhere and don't listen to your enemies. They don't do good and they can't harm you.

K: The people who have been rallied most are Democrats and Rockefeller people.

C: Because your enemies are in the Republican party. I am sure the President is with you.

By. NARA, Dato 5/26

Mrs. Cerf/Kissinger
6:37 pm 1/14/72

-2-

K: He is fine. I have no complaints. It's my sex life that gets them. Harvard will forgive me India and Pakistan much sooner then Jill St. John.

C: Nancy Dickerson said that you are only one in Administration with charisma. You are such good company. Are you depressed?

K: Not at all.

C: Having any fun?

K: Yeah. Just back from the W. Coast. Had lunch with Frank. He may come East in the next couple of weeks. He is getting so bored with retirement. It's a dumb thing. He should find a graceful way of unretiring.

C: Did you tell him that?

K: In a subtler way. Don't you think it?

C: Yes. Has nothing to do but sit there.

K: He is too talented.

C: For many reasons. I am doing much to much but it's better to be busy.

K: How are you?

C: I am doing very well.

K: You sound better. You can always cut down.

C: I am like an old baggy debutante. Out every night and lunch. And when you make my reputation by taking me to lunch, my God.

K: The only ones who will speak to you -- not necessarily Republicans.

C: I want to introduce you to Charlotte Ford.

K: We will arrange that in NY.

C: She might come down with me. Nancy Dickerson is finding her a place at the table. We will stay at the Ford apartment and give you a drink.

K: Let's plan on that.

C: Plan for 27th. See you on the 26th.

By.

NARA, Date 5/26

TELECON

Mr. Kissinger/Frank Shakespeare

8:25 a.m., January 15, 1972

K: I hope I didn't wake you up.

S: No, I'm fine.

K: I think I did. Frank, Bob Haldeman told me yesterday you were thinking of leaving. I wanted to have an opportunity to talk with you before you did this.

S: I'm leaving this weekend for Romania and the Soviet Union.

K: Could you leave open your final decision until we have a chance to talk? I have certainly been one of the causes of your unhappiness unintentionally -- partly because I have so many sons of bitches to take care of. People you can trust seem to slide to the bottom of the list. Your leaving at this stage when you have been one of the few loyalists here and one of the few who did what the President promised in 1968 would be symbolically and substantively a disaster. I can understand your dissatisfaction about being excluded from some of the meetings. This call is my idea -- nobody asked me to do this.

S: It's a complicated situation. I very much appreciate your talking to me. Why don't we hold it until I return.

K: That is all I am asking. I want you to know -- thought I haven't shown it in my actions -- the presence of one decent, loyal person has meant a lot. Above all, we need you for the country. Whatever I can do to make you more effective will be done.

S: As I said, it is a complicated situation. But I appreciate your call.

K: Don't do anything until you come back and you and I talk.

S: All right.

K: But that doesn't commit you not to go through with your plans. I understand that you will not make a final decision until you talk to me but that you are not going to reverse it. Is that a fair statement?

S: Yes. Henry, at the tag-end of this trip, we will be having the annual German/American talks. Is there anything that occurred in the Brandt Meetings at Key Biscayne that is particularly relevant?

By NARA, Dato 5/26

- 2 -

K: I was flat on my back.

S: I knew you had the flu.

K: The reports I got -- I never read the minutes -- don't indicate anything. The radios did not come up to the best of my knowledge.

S: Nothing on the radios or VOA?

K: Let me talk to Haig who was there, and I will get a message to you.

S: I don't know what else would necessarily relate to those meetings. The agenda was drawn up by the Germans, and they have included the Conference on European Security, SALT, the Berlin talks, ratification of the two treaties -- mostly as to attitudinal considerations.

K: Don't give the European Security Conference any steam. The Germans want us to but we don't.

S: Keep it as far in the distance as possible?

K: Right.

S: On the question of SALT, Gerry gave me a good briefing. I saw him in Vienna 10 days ago, but there's nothing on SALT at this particular point.

K: You might get across to the Soviets that their press campaign against the U.S. doesn't make it any easier to proceed here along the lines of detente.

S: Press campaign in what sense?

K: Their consistent attack on Sino/U.S. cooperation and their behavior on Vietnam.

S: Okay, Henry, thanks very much.

lds

By. NARA, Dato

5/26

TELECON

Mr. Kissinger/David Packard

8:36 a.m., January 15, 1972

K: Dave, how are you? You mentioned yesterday that if there is something you can do... They have you and me in a confrontation on the front page today.

P: What we said yesterday?

K: No; they claim on the front page of the New York Times -- another set of minutes is out -- that I allegedly wanted to go in and you held me back. It was my recollection...

P: I was with you on it. The only question is what might be done. My general feeling on these things is you don't benefit by a denial. If you think it would be helpful, I would do that.

K: I don't think we should comment on substance.

P: I think the better way to do it would be for me to take the occasion a little later and make the point you and I XXXX did work together.

K: That is fine.

P: That would do more good in the long-run. If you have other thoughts or would like to have me do something, let me know. Let me look at the article -- I haven't seen it yet. Where are you?

K: In the office.

P: Let me look at it and I will talk to the PA people. My inclination would be not to respond to this particular situation -- but to say something at an appropriate time.

K: But then I don't need it. Okay. Thank you.

lds

By. NARA, Date 5/26

TELCORN

Mr. Kissinger/Len Lyons

January 15, 1972 9:00 a.m.

LL: You are in early. You are working harder than the Democrats.

HAK: I have got to get here before they steal my papers. That's the
only time I see them. I was wondering if you could come to my
office today around 11:45. We are having a showing of a film that
Gen. Haig brought back from his trip of my trip (second) to Peking.

LL: I think we will be busy.

HAK: Nancy and I are busy for lunch, but can you come around 11:45?

LL: Leave my name at the door. I will try.

HAK: Will you call me? And bring you wife.

LL: I think we can come.

By.

NARA, Date 5/26

TELCOM

Mr. Kissinger/The President

1/15/72 1:00

RN: I was thinking about this Tuesday speech.

HAK: We are having some problem with Thieu now with the text.

RN: As to the resignation....

HAK: He is willing to say he will resign when the whole thing is done.

RN: I am not sure that.... HAK interrupts...

HAK: That is what he wants to say on a series of issues--neutrality, who will sign the agreement, etc.

RN: He is understanding the publication (President inaudible)

HAK: Publication will affect his domestic position. We have a long cable from Bunker.

RN: We can fuzz them. We don't have to worry about crossing our "t's" and dotting our "fs". We just have to put out our points.

HAK: It is the actual proposal that bothers him. It is premature though.

RN: It always presents a problem when you make one of these offers. Right now our problem is greater than his. If we don't do it now we will have to wait a long time. You have cabled him back. Right?

HAK: Yes, Mr. President. We have got 72 hours-- there is plenty of time for exchanges. We will notify the networks before Tuesday morning.

RN: I just don't want to do the work if we are not doing it.

HAK: Just proceed on the assumption that we are doing it.

RN: Bob raised one point. He didn't think we should put the whole gives and takes. We didn't intend to that

HAK: No

RN: Yes, they would just nit-pick and

By. NARA, Dato 5/26

Page 2
Mr. Kissinger/The President
1/15/72 1:00

HAK: Just what the major proposals of each side were is all we will put.

RN: Another problem if you put the whole thing, they will look at the points that are not even relevant.¹

HAK: Right. No exchanges at all--a paraphrase on one or two things but that is all.

RN: Relating to Thieu again. Assuming the weather is okay and the Air Force can do it, why not give them a 24 hour pop before Tuesday?

HAK: I don't think so.

RN: There is no chance? We have troop building. We have offered a troop withdrawal....

HAK: The Chinese have made a strong statement.

RN: That would buy us a week. Well, we'll keep track of the weather. We can't be here in the position of appearing to be backing off the world when we are going to China and the other side of the world. We must be sure to state that we are keeping our commitments. The Nixon Doctrine is not withdrawing from commitments. If our interests are involved we will fight any place.

HAK: The Nixon Doctrine is your way of staying in the world--not getting out.

RN: Exactly. We are fighting with most of the country--they want out of the world. We have to find a way to stay in -- it is just terribly difficult. Did Bob tell you about the Israelis' poll?

HAK: That you are Number 3.

RN: Isn't that amusing--they read everything about us and still--what do you attribute it to?

HAK: I think Mrs. Meir has passed the word around.

RN: Well, then the reason is that it would cause a problem with the Chinese?

HAK: Yes.

RN: We will let it go and on the Thieu thing, will give Thieu what is necessary to get him on board.

HAK: Yes.

By NARA, Date 5/26

Telcon
The President

January 15, 1972; 1:30 pm

P: Hello. Wondered what your schedule was this afternoon. What is your situation?

K: I was going to go to lunch and later on to dinner.

P: Well, that is all right. We can work tomorrow.

K: Did you want me to come up?

P: I was thinking we might have a talk on this thing as we get along. Wanted to get a feel on it but if you are tied up for lunch. We could if you like. I could have a helicopter bring you up now. Who is your lunch?

K: It was with Joe Alsop but I can cancel it.

P: Well, I hate to do that, but if you could. We never bring newspaper men here or I would have you index invite him to lunch here.

K: He has also invited a friend of mine.

P: I think maybe x you should stay to that. That is important.

K: I think it is more important for me to be helpful if I can.

P: I just hate to have you break a date. You could set your time then to have lunch with him tomorrow?

K: I can find some other time.

P: He will understand, won't he?

K: Yes.

P: I will have the helicopter by soon. I had to check with you. I am going to have Julie and David come up with you on the helicopter. We can sit and have a good talk. I can get a real feel how I can get this across. I am under a heavy deadline. We can also helicopter you back in time for your dinner engagement. You tell Joe I am sorry and we will make it up to him.

By. NARA, Dato 5/26

TELCOM
Vorotnsov/Kissinger

10:12 a.m.

1/17/72

V: I have just received a cable from Mr. Gromyko who says to tell you Dobrynin
delayed but coming on the 19th. Done with special meaning, I suppose.

K: I see. I appreciate it. Tell your Foreign Minister I appreciate his courtesy.

V: I have just got a message on India/Pakistan. It's the original signed thing.
I will send it now with one of my people.

By. NARA. Dale 5/26

TELCORN

Mrs. Javits/Kissinger
11:00 a.m. 1/17/72

Mrs. J. invited HAK to a dinner on Sat. evening -- sit down with some friends from Europe. HAK asked if he could bring a friend and Mrs. J. said of course. HAK said he would let her know in the afternoon.

(A further conversation ensued in which HAK agreed to the dinner at 8:15 and black tie, with Nancy M'aginnes.)

By. NARA, Dalo 5/26

TELCON
Ron Zeigler/Kissinger

11:27 a. m. 1/17/72

Z: I am going to say today that foreign policy report will be released on the 8th.

K: It could change to 9th but no problem.

Z: I will say around.

K: I am thinking now of the 9th. 8th is Tues. When would we give it to the press?

Z: On the weekend. But if on the 9th we could give it out on Mon.

K: We have to brief on it.

Z: After they have had it awhile. Give it them on the 6th and you could brief on the 7th and let it go public on the 8th.

K: If you don't have to do the briefing on the day released.

Z: The President this morning indicated he wants to brief you to brief on the day it's released.

K: I think he should on TV with the report.

Z: And then turn it over to you.

K: Say around the 8th.

By. NARA, Date 5/26

TELCOM
B. Safire/Kissinger
2:13 p. m. 1/17/72

S: Can you talk?

K: No.

S: Listen?

K: Yes.

S: Is what we are putting forward publicly the same as privately?

K: Slightly modified.

S: No change in the end that sweetens it a little bit?

K: I wouldn't get into that. Let's sweeten what you have after. The private
could wrack the whole thing. It's beyond the limit. Say with slight modifi-
cation or something. How's it coming?

S: Slowly but surely. We are getting there.

K: You are a slow worker.

S: You are just saying that to hear my heart pound.

By NARA, Dato 5/26

TELCOM
Marshall Green/Kissinger
2:57 p.m. 1/17/72

G: I don't want to bother you on this. The Secy. had a call from Haig and wanted to know who would be going. Al Jenkins.

K: That's all I know of.

G: He said something about an aide.

K: I don't know about that. It may be that a new arrangement was made. We will let you know by the end of the day or early tomorrow.

TELCON
R. Zeigler/Kissinger
4:45 p.m. 1/17/72

By NARA, Date 5/26

Z: I was asked and I knew the question would come if the President was concerned on the leak and Anderson. I said of course. (People can't discuss things freely in these meetings if they feel it's going immediately to the press.) What I also said which I was willing to say 3 weeks ago is that the President is behind whatever Dr. Kissinger does. I didn't bring it up but I am doing it on background basis. The ice is so think that I didn't know what to answer on the President.

K: (That's terrible or unbelievable)

Z: I said the President has always encouraged policy options. You run a risk when things are taken out of policy context. Is that all right?

K: Fine and I appreciate it, Ron.

By NARA, Date 5/26

TELCON
B. Safire/Kissinger
4:50 p. m. 1/17/72

K: You said you would have the draft tomorrow night or tonight?

S: Tomorrow night. I have to work through tonight.

K: I have a dinner tomorrow night but I can read it after dinner.

S: I will give it to x whomever you designate.

K: I will let you know tomorrow.

By NARA, Date 5/26

TELCON
F. Kraemer/Kissinger
5:10 p. m. 1/17/72

HAK: I guess you followed my activities in the press.

K: In my mind I went through the papers with red, green and blue pencil and you came out extremely well. Fools write headlines and only quote half. Also on quotes on Pakistan and how long they can hold you came out splendidly.

HAK: I am not concerned about this. There's a good chance I could get away around 8:00. Are you free?

K: I am there alone. You will find me very much reduced. You may not see it.

HAK: Shall we make it another time?

K: There's no other time. When you have an evening, we will use that possibility. What time?

HAK: 8:30?

K: You will find me there. Bertold will probably be there but she will probably be in bed and we will under any circumstances be alone.

HAK: OK. At 8:30.

By. NARA, Dale 5/26

telecon
ambassador Rabin
1/17/72 a.m.

R: ... two calls for me here, but otherwise not so bad. I got instructions from home to ask for more planes. ... suggested by Joe Sisco to say ______ for three months no plans of delivery have been made. Every month two planes I told him. Second, I told him I am not prepared to discuss the paper before Wednesday.

K: Make it later. What is the interview of Dayan; I don't understand.

R: I don't understand it either.

K: Can you get an explanation? It makes things tough here.

R: I will do it. Three, I have been asked ... we don't see any purpose in our talks with the ______. We ... will not be accused that we brought about the ______ of his mission. ______ wants you to know we will not change our position as it was formulated in the 26 February paper.

K: I understand.

R: I need your help on the question of planes.

K: I told you what the President decided and the Attorney General in support of it and as soon as we know there is a deadlock we will press it.

R: Now there is no deadlock.

K: You will have more help and you will see he will move back a step next time you see him. This is a decided issue. You will see it every meeting he gives. We'll take care of it.

R: January '73 is the only month we haven't got it.

K: Well, as I told you, the President has decided that and it will be done.

R: The people back home don't understand the relation -- or try to forget the relations -- between the political and military issue.

K: That's a mistake.

R: All right. I'll try to make sure.

K: Especially the political issue you and I have been discussing.

R: No, this is fine . . . .

K: But not the way it was done in your Defense Minister's speech.

By NARA, Date 5/26

TELECON

Amb. Rabin

1/17/72 a.m. p. 2

R: He said general statements with no real substance.

K: That's all right. I just want to make sure I understand it.

R: I will get a clarification if I read it rightly. And I will be in another
contact with Joe on Thursday.

K: All right. Thank you very much.

TELECON

Bill Safire

1/18/72 9:00am

By NARA, Dale 5/26

S: One point, for my own understanding of the situation. Does this mean the end of the secret negotiations?

K: No, in fact you should have a sentence saying he is willing to send me back any time it's thought to be useful.

S: Publicly or privately?

K: Yes.

S: Good.

K: We have no choice. Look at what Kennedy did last night. It means we have to explain that we've done it.

S: I see that point, but I just wanted to know whether we wanted to keep the door open to secret negotiations.

K: Yes. Any chance of your getting this by 7:00?

S: I don't want to promise it.

K: You got your wife working on it too?

S: Me and Rose Woods. I'm about half done. It's complicated.

K: It is. But it's got to be precise. You can condense some of the stuff but there's got to be enough in it to show we made the effort. I will look at it. The only problem I know of is he wants to go away Thursday or Friday.

S: I didn't know that. I'll get it done in 24 hours. 2400 words tonight. Then you can add or subtract.

K: I won't subtract.

S: Wait till you see my stuff.

K: No, you usually make it simpler.

S: That's what I'm trying to do.

By NARA, Date 5/26

TELCONE

Amb. Sullivan/Kissinger

10:15 a.m. - 1/18/72

K: Hello, Bill.

S: I have a cable in from Ellsworth. He would like to come in for
consultation starting February 1 and leaving February 10. Is
that all right?

K: That sounds good. He hasn't been back for quite a while, has he?

S: No.

K: The only caveat I would have are whatever our assessment is on
the impact of the offensives.

S: He says he wants to be back before TET.

K: Yes, well, we can always get him back in a hurry.

S: This way we could get him back on the 12th. He wants to return
by way of Paris to see Porter.

K: Good. Fine, Bill.

By NARA, Dato 5/26

TELCORN

Sen. Javits/Kissinger

10:30 a.m. 1/18/72

J: I have an imminent ~~max~~ matter and then a word about why I didn't go to Cairo. We would have done business with (people) who had no authority.

K: You did right.

J: He did see Sadat. Did you get the essence from John on what he thought?

K: I talked more with Lorrain.

J: Should I bring him over there?

K: Sure. Maybe breakfast this week. How about Friday.

J: I will check with him. It sounds good to me. U Thant is having a big dinner tonight. I want to know if there's a WH message. It's a ~~max~~ policy matter. Someone should decide on an alternative matter. It's a ______ of Man group. Cronkite, Phil Jessup, me and Ted Kennedy speaking and request to ask the WH for message.

K: I will see what I can do.

J: It's a policy question. I don't know if you want to.

K: It's the first I heard of it.

J: I know that. Someone should make the decision. I will try to work out the breakfast and get back to you.

By NARA, Dalo 5/26

TELECON

Fred Brisson

1/18/72 11:50 a.m.

B: It's been a long time.

K: Much too long.

B: It's an uphill fight all the way but you are doing a terrific job so don't let them get at you.

K: You are terrific. I haven't made any public reply because these things are so taken out of context and by the time I gave the context I would have given away more secrets.

B: I am coming down on the 26th.

K: Are you?

B: Yes. I have to see the opening of "Sugar."

K: Do you want to have lunch on the 26th?

B: Yes, let's. You want to see "Sugar" with me on the 27th?

K: I was going to go . . . What time is it?

B: 7:30.

K: The TODAY Show is having a cocktail party and I ought to drop in on that for an hour, but I ought to be able to do it. Why don't we aim for it.

B: Good. I'll hold a kxx ticket for you. What time is lunch, 1:30 or 1:15?

K: Sure, makes no difference to me. Why don't we meet here and then decide where to eat.

B: All right. But which gate wxx should I use?

K: Northwest Gate on Pennsylvania Avenue.

B: I'll be there between 1:15 and 1:30.

K: Terrific.

By. NARA, Dalo 5/26

TELCOM
Amb. Rabin/Kissinger

3:35 p.m.

1/18/72

R: I got my instructions back from home about the press release paper I got on Friday from Joe. There's one point that I was asked to talk to you because it's dealing in the relations of the interim agreement and the overall agreement. What we are ready to say is that any definition concerning linkage between interim agreement and over all settlement requires Israel agreement. The U.S. will not propose this without Israel's prior agreement. If accepted then ?? ? ? advancing agreement within Security Council Resolution 242 Israel agrees to enter into agreement with Egypt --

K: The second part again please?

R: With a view to advancing the peace agreement within the framework of SC Resolution 242 Israel will enter into agreement with Egypt as proposed by the U.S.

K: The first seems inconsistent with the second.

R: It's not in conflict with that contradiction.

K: I have something very urgent. Let me call you back.

By NARA, Dalo 5/26

Telecon
Mr. Kissinger
Ambassador Rabin
1/18/72; 6:40 p. m.

K: I was called into a meeting from which I did not come out . . .

R: It's that I have got instructions -- everything is fine now -- nothing will be finished. What we have got now is -- I expect some answer from him about the increase of the number of planes. I doubt if I will get it. I will see what will happen tomorrow.

K: I find your two answers inconsistent with each other.

R: Yeah. All the papers that I showed you -- certain parts he will not accept and it will cause another delay. The last one in regard to the part on overall settlement -- I would try to get permission from my country to try to clearly separate -- a general statement that we don't want any linkage to be done without our prior agreement and the second part . . .

K: The first part was fine. It is the second one which I have trouble understanding. The first part if fine. I think you should stick with the first part.

R: All right.

K: But I have trouble enough advising one government . . .

R: I will tell you what I will suggest unless it is inconsistent with what you think -- it is the understanding between us -- there will be no linkage -- we are ready to enter into talks. Of course as time passes will have to be consulted on a later date.

K: If you can delay that until I have a chance to talk to Dobrynin -- he is not back until tomorrow.

R: And can you help us also on the rate of deliveries?

K: Certainly, I will get that done. Why don't you call me after your talk and let me know what happens and then if you want to later this week you can perhaps give him that message that you are ready to talk. But go one more round on the airplanes.

R: I can start on this -- veto right (?)

K: That's okay. I have trouble with the second part.

R: I understand. I will keep the second point out of the conversation tomorrow. I will call you immediately after the meeting tomorrow.

By NARA, Date 5/26

TELCORN

Secretary Laird/Mr. Kissinger

7:40 p.m., January 18, 1972

K: I got your weekly letter on SALT.

L: Oh, you got it. I just wanted to make sure you had it so that we can
talk about it on Thursday.

K: On Thursday -- What's on Thursday? Oh, the breakfast.

L: I really wanted to get to it the other night but you were on your
way to the airport. The only copy anyplace is the copy you have,
Henry. I have gone over the State of the Union Message. Everything
is just great. One thing though I thought I ought to call your attention
to is the pledge of superiority for the Navy. That's fine with me,
Henry, but --

K: Where the hell did that come from?

L: It's in the State of the Union Message. It says that we are guaranting
-- I left the text at the office; I have just gotten home -- and that
strong pledge for superiority on the seas. That's okay with me but
that means a hell of a lot in the minds -- I am all for superiority but
to just put in for the Navy we will run into a little bit of a problem.
Do you follow me, Henry?

K: Yeah.

L: We should maintain a superior position in technology but stick with
your ______ as far as the President is concerned.

K: Let me take a look at it.

L: I can live with it but the President ought to know what he is saying.
But if we have to do it all U. S., it makes it rather difficult.
I hate to call it to your attention but you may have to live with it.

K: You and I are going to go into politics together. If you are going to
get the California Electoral votes, you have got to let me go to
Hollywood.

L: I just wanted to call that to your attention. The Seamans story that
leaked -- I did not say I would resign if Seamans was not appointed.

K: I haven't seen it.

By NARA, Date 5/26

TELCONE

Bayless Manning/Kissinger

morning

1/18/72

M: Calling because of an opportunity that came up and you might want a staff member to do something. April 27 the American Society of International Law is having its annual meeting in Washington. Panel from 8:30-10:30 pm dealing with the secrety of information and conduct of foreign policy. I have been dragooned to being moderator for that discussion and it will be well attended. Lawyers and people actively involved. I thought of having someone from the press... side -- Max Frankel or someone.

K: He is good.

M: And Joe Califano who has seen the President's office and someone from the Hill and probably someone from the military, perhaps Steadman or Warnke. I am making this as the first call because I thought you might have some general thoughts and I thought you might want someone there to keep it from running away.

K: I don't want to participate.

M: I didn't think you would.

K: I will think about whether I want someone from the staff.

M: A probable candidate would be someone who has been on your staff but who isn't talking officially.

K: Like who?

M: I don't have any names.

K: Let me think about it 48 hours and let you know.

M: I am not trying to pressure you. I thought you might like to know.

K: I will call you.