In article <1qk3jm$9sh@transfer.stratus.com> cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares) writes: >In article <1993Apr14.221646.2332@gnv.ifas.ufl.edu>, jrm@gnv.ifas.ufl.edu writes: [ ... ] >> 	Why are 'good' neighborhoods 'good' ? It isn't because every >> 	person is armed to the teeth. It is because of (1) attitude >> 	and (2) cooperation. In the 'good' neighborhoods, the residents >> 	make themselves aware of their neighbors and notice when >> 	strangers are lurking around. 'Good' neighborhoods form groups >> 	like 'crime-watch' to increase this effect, and the relative >> 	effectiveness of the police. When hostiles are arrested, the >> 	good neighbors step up and say "THAT'S the one officer ! He >> 	was robbing Mr. Jones' house".  > >Sometimes this works.  Sometimes it just lands your good neighbors  >on the dance card for the next wave of drive-bys.  Someone here once >told a story about LA gangs moving into Phoenix.  I've misplaced the  Here'a a copy, cdt: ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,ou.politics >Path: dg-rtp!psinntp!uunet!sun-barr!ames!haven.umd.edu!darwin.sura.net!wupost!csus.edu!netcom.com!mvp >From: mvp@netcom.com (Mike Van Pelt) >Subject: The difference an armed civilian population makes >Message-ID: <y52n_tc.mvp@netcom.com> >Date: Thu, 17 Sep 92 23:42:42 GMT >Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest) >References: <swood.716099748@vela> >Lines: 84 > >Along the lines of "The Armed Citizen", here's a story that >some of you may find amusing.  It's a story about Arizona >house-hunting, from Leslie Fish, musician and author... > >---- >     ... One of the reasons I'm planning to move to Arizona is that -- >despite its lousy economy, 4-way race problems, simmering religious >problems and hopelessly bad government -- Arizona has one of the lowest >violent- crime rates in the country. Is it just coincidence that >Arizona is also one of the few remaining no-gun- control states in the >country? > >    Well, consider this funny story. Last time I was in Phoenix, >staying with Liz Burnham, I did some checking on the local real-estate >market (that's when I discovered that, with my income -- as provable by >my tax returns -- I can qualify for every low-income housing loan in >the book, with the exception of VA), and I came across an astonishing >ad in the local market-paper. It offered a three-bedroom house in the >Phoenix area for -- are you ready for this -- all of $10,000. No money >down. $100 per month total payments. Christ on a Harley-Davidson! I >called up the real-estate office making this offer, made it clear that >I was only checking the local market, and asked about that house. Were >the walls, roof and foundation structurally sound? Yes. Were the >plumbing and electrical systems functional and up to code? Yes. Did the >air-conditioning system (an absolute necessity in Phoenix) work?  Yes, >again.  Okay, so what was wrong with the house?  Well, it needed lots >of plastering, painting, yard work, and some patching of the roof -- >and yes, low-interest repair loans were available.  Okay, sez I. If >that's all that's wrong with it, just why are you selling a 3-bedroom >house for all of $10,000? Well, squirms the agent, it's in kind of a >bad neighborhood. How bad? sez I, remembering some of the neighborhoods >I've seen in Chicago and Oakland.  Worst in the city, the agent sighs, >and then he told me this amazing story. > >    Every few years, it seems, the big vice-gangs in Los Angeles notice >that there's no gang presence in Phoenix -- which is just a quick >5-hour drive from LA -- and get the idea of setting up a subsidiary >there. Well, a couple years ago, the colonizing force came to this >neighborhood -- it being poor and Spanish, they figured they could move >right in and take over -- bought this house and started operations. >Unfortunately for them, the neighbors not only didn't like this -- they >didn't care for whores trotting up and down their streets all night, >pimps soliciting their kids, dope- deals on the corners in broad >daylight, and so on -- they weren't afraid to do something about it. >The neighbors called the cops (for some reason, the Phoenix police are >remarkably honest, capable, polite and prompt), and the cops promptly >came and swept up all the whores, pimps and pushers off the street and >away to jail. The remaining gang members decided to retaliate in the >fashion they usually use in LA; they got the complainant's name and >address off the court records, and did a drive-by shooting at his >house.  Well, this wasn't Los Angeles. The moment the neighbors heard >the first gunshots fired, they all ran out their front doors with their >own guns -- rifles, shotguns, pistols, everything -- and shot back. > >    The car didn't make it to the end of the block. It coasted to a >stop, riddled with more holes than the famous Bonnie and Clyde getaway >car (which I've seen; it's on display in a casino in a casino in Las >Vegas).  The gas tank and fuel lines had been ruptured, so the car >caught fire. The neighbors waited a good 15 minutes -- making sure >nobody got out of that car -- before they called the fire department to >come put out the fire and tow the wreck away. By that time, the asphalt >under the car had melted and caught fire too, which subsequently left a >large and nasty pot-hole in the street. The city is slow about >repairing small streets, so the hole stayed there providing a traffic >hazard for several months. All this was two years ago, the agent >concluded, and there's been no trouble since, but the house and the >neighborhood still have a bad reputation -- and that's why the house >was so cheap. > >    Hearing this story, I nearly laughed my ass off. I told the agent >that if I had the money at the moment, I'd by-god buy the house; this >was _nothing_ compared to bad neighborhoods I'd seen here in >California, where drive-by shootings go unchecked by the well-armed >cops, let alone by the unarmed neighbors. If that's the absolute worst >you'll find in Phoenix, then that's the city for me. > >    That's the difference that an armed civilian population makes. >Think about it. > > >--  >Mike Van Pelt                                When guns are outlawed, >mvp@netcom.com                               only Carl Rowan will have guns. >mvp@hsv3.lsil.com