In article <1993May10.211316.28455@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU> adams@bellini.berkeley.edu (Adam L. Schwartz) writes: >In article <1smbma$8mr@cville-srv.wam.umd.edu> aap@wam.umd.edu (Alberto Adolfo Pinkas) writes: >>3) If I decided to go back to the land from which my relatives had been  >>expelled 2000 years ago, but first I convert to any other religion, can I  >>apply to the law of Return as a member of the Jewish Nation or should I  >>apply as someone whose mother is Jewish? > >I'm not sure about this but I hope the answer is that you can't apply under >the law of return.  By conversion, you've elected not to be a part of the >Jewish nation. >  Which was my point. By converting to another religion I do not loose my cultural identity, I just loose my religious identification. I consider that defining the belonging to a nation that claims the  right to have a State based on religious belief is a form of racism.  > >>5) What has change in me between the day before and the day after I converted >>to loose my being part of the Jewish Nation? > >At the moment you converted, you officially anounced to the world that *you* do not >consider yourself to be part of the Jewish Nation.  So, why should the Jewish Nation >consider you to be a member?  To be a part or not of the Jeish Nation is defined by my culture and not by my religion. Actually, if I am an atheist, which is in fact like  converting into a non-Jewish in terms of religion, I am still considered as part of the Jewish Nation. I can be proud of my Jewish culture while not giving any importance to the Jewish religion. Or, even more, I can be proud of my Jewish culture while still be convinced that the real god is another one. I do not know anyone who lost his memebership to the American nation  because he changed of god. > > >>Suppose my father is Arab. Suppose he was born in Palestine, in some place  >>which now is part of Israel. Suppose that his father, and his grandfather as >>well as 20 or 30 generations before him were born in that place. >>Now suppose there is a war of independence and my father, scared by all the >>fighting going on, tries to take his family to a place more secure, among  >>people he knows, who speak a language he understands, who worship the same >>god. Now, suppose that that place is some other Arab country.  >>And, now suppose that the war is over and that there is a new country created >>where my father used to live, and that that country is called Israel. >>And, that in that country, Jews from all over the world are received. And >>that people whose family left thet country 200 generation ago are recieved and >>granted full-citizenship. >>Should I, if I decided to go back to my father's land, where he was born as >>20 or 30 generations of my family were born, have the right to go back and >>ask to be recognized in the same way those who are returning after 2000 >>years? > >No.  As a result of wars brought by the Arabs against the Jews in an attempt to >annihilate Israel, the Arabs have lost their claim to land there.  Attacking Israel >is/was illegal and they now have to pay the price.  Do I feel sorry for the >Palestinians?  Yes I do.  But I blame the Arab nations for their problems, not >Israel.  I still believe that we should never confusse the actions of States with the individuals who happen to live there. In the same way that I do not think it is right to blame all Israelis for the human rights violations of Israel, I do not think that we should assume that all Arabs are guilty of the actions of the Arab States. Some people fled their homes because they were scared. Now they are in there, still suffering for what they are not responsible. And, remember that we also were told the same at some point. We ended in the diaspora. And, of course, I am not for doing to others what I did not want done to me.  > > >-Adam Schwartz >adams@robotics.berkeley.edu