well objectively pkk militants trained at northern iraq pkk military bases which are daily informed to u s and iraq governments to do some action against by turkey entered from northern iraq carrying heavy weapons blew up a bridge attacked a military base on the other side killed but some says took hostages but some says then bunch of soldiers were injured and unlike in zar'it shtula pkk militants weren't trying to free anyone they were just attacking a military base because it is their daily regular job i mean if you don't want to call it an attack a battle could be called because there was a battle and out of about were killed i wrote the article in turkish wikipedia and i called it october hakkari pkk battle because this what you call incident happens regularly just like the th october rnak pkk battle where another dozen of turkish soldiers were killed too incident occurs once not regularly if slovenia regularly attacked croatia and let's say their troops came from the sea with heavy weapons blew up a military base's bridge killed croatian soldiers and took hostages would you call it an incident and how about slovenia regularly attacked let's say since almost all cities of croatia would it look like an incident to you or would it look like a battle or an attack don't get me wrong dear korku tanr s i believe you're writing amazing articles on battles and military and your contributions are wonderful for wikipedia in all languages since all of them are translated in many languages and actually i'm one of the translators of your articles to turkish i believe that you are a very intelligent person yet on this case of npov i don't think you're right on the incident issue this thing could be called at worst october hakkari pkk battle which i called in turkish yet it would be unjust to not call it an attack some people who have military bases in another country which is controlled by anarchy who happens to be your neighbor is attacking your country quite heavily equipped with weapons is called an attack and as a military base and a country what you have against them is a battle i'm removing the npov tag if you don't find it vicious and i would love to discuss with you this issue and your knowledge on middle east because i completely worship your articles privately on msn or e mail or even here cheers onur