response much appreciated thanks well i'm trying to retain as much of your text as possible there's a lot of good stuff in there which simply needs sourcing and updating in with the other material that's why i abandoned the sandbox idea and thought it best to just run with what we have the article is going to get massive in the next few weeks though to make it comprehensive as possible but it'll be split and condensed later i really do need your help if possible though on tracing the source of the unsourced material i'll try to do what i can but i'll approach you if i can't find a source for something