thank you for the welcome i've decided to come in on this as there seems to be some very silly arguments going on i do know lk through the english history circuit and he is not the kind of person to wind up this stems from the fact that he does have an awful lot of knowledge on the subject but sometimes finds it irritating when people appear to trample his work i remember him at one heritage weekend when he clearly showed that he doesn't suffer fools gladly i do think that there's obviously been some sort of winding up going on and they are both at an impasse having read the templars website history briefly it does seem a very good source and is very well presented but i intend to read through it all and try and see what it is that elona doesn't like she says on the dicussion that she claims it as not reliable but fails to mention exactly what is not reliable i will therefore check it all