ok sure but if you read this book referred to by ps atiyah these are precisely the questions raised the reason i moved the page to us tort reform and inserted the text on what has been going on in australia nz and the uk is precisely because the issues are much wider than may be apparent from the political discourse of the us remember these issues were never raised on the talk page if they had been i would've done something but thf wasn't interested in doing that just blanking the thing putting up something he'd done about the states and that was it