the thing is just because some nomenclature has a historical pov does not mean that it has a current pov for example i can use the terms holy roman empire thursday or queen elizabeth ii without implying that i believe that the empire was holy or that i worship the norse god of thunder or that i recognize the authority of the british monarch interesting note about the quakers in the thursday article though should we scrub wikipedia of thursday regardless of the historical origins of the abbreviations bc and ad they now mean little more than indicating the point at which the english speaking world stops counting years backward and starts counting them forward seriously how many people read bc and think that the messiahship of jesus is being proclaimed or that ad means they accept jesus as lord construing bc and ad as statements of religious devotion may have been valid when the terms were first introduced but to reject bc and ad now in the face of centuries of tradition and widespread usage seems to be justifiable only under two premises either that any term with historical origins in religious devotion carries an eternal pov taint and should be excised from wikipedia or that the abbreviations still so strongly communicate religious meaning to the majority of users as to make the terminology indeed pov the first premise is itself pov by singling out religion as an unacceptable originator of terminology and thus should not justify rejecting bc ad the second premise though is where i think slrubenstein and others are coming from do correct me if i'm wrong if this premise can be validated then the pov ness of bc ad is established and use of these abbreviations should be abandoned throughout wikipedia in favor of bce ce on the other hand if bc ad is shown not to convey religious meaning to the majority of wikipedia users then it should be the favored usage in most articles based on its familiarity to readers perhaps another poll could be taken to address the simple yes no question does modern usage of bc ad convey a religious point of view to you assuming a sufficiently representative response by wikipedians the results may be a better indication of how to resolve this controversy than simply asking for people's preferences between bc ad and bce ce