Consumer complaint received 2024-11-13 00:00:00
Product: Credit card — General-purpose credit card or charge card
Issue: Other features, terms, or problems — Problem with cash advances
Company: AMERICAN EXPRESS COMPANY
State: FL

Complaint narrative:
Below is the Chat from American Express 's website that details my problem. 

XX/XX/XXXX Welcome back XXXX! In a few words tell me what you need help with or select one of these topics : I'm traveling to XXXX in a couple weeks and want to know if I'll be charged any foreign transaction fee 's while using my card there? Also can I use my card to withdrawal cash from an ATM? If so what ATM fee 's, cash withdrawal fee 's, what would be the daily withdrawal limit and what foreign ATM fee 's would I be charged? 
A Customer Care Professional will be with you shortly. 
Hi XXXX! My name is XXXX. 
We appreciate you for bringing American Express to your travel! 
Your card, Delta SkyMiles XXXX XXXX does not have foreign transaction fees. Feel free to use this anywhere in the world without worrying about getting charged with fees. 
Your card also allows you to use Cash Advance withdrawals at ATMs. But, I would like to set your expectation that there's a {$10.00} Cash Advance fee + the amount that the bank or ATM may charge you for using it in XXXX. 
Cash Advance limit for this card is {$3900.00}.

Maximum Cash Advance withdrawal per 24-hours period is {$1000.00}.

I hope I covered everything. Will that be all for today? 
Yes that covered everything, thanks for your help with this So just to make sure I understand the atm charges, If I want to use my card to withdraw {$700.00} at an atm in XXXX then I would be charged {$710.00} from American express and a separate charge from the atm, is that correct? 
You're welcome, XXXX! 
Yes, you are correct. Apparently, different banks, specially outside the USA may charge the user differently based on their policy, Alright thanks again for your help that answers all my questions You're most welcome, and it is a pleasure assisting you! Glad I am able to answer your questions about your card 's usage outside the USA. 
Again, my name 's XXXX, and we appreciate your 5 years of partnership with American Express. Have an amazing day and safe travel ahead, XXXX! 
XX/XX/XXXX Welcome back XXXX! In a few words tell me what you need help with or select one of these topics : I'm leaving for XXXX tomorrow and just realized I'm not sure if my card has a pin or not. My wife thinks she may have set one up on my card but isn't sure. Can you help me verify this or setup a pin for my card? 
We are planning on using our amex for cash withdrawl at the atm 's so I really need to get a pin for this card. 
Thanks for any help you can provide with this Thank you for contacting us, XXXX! You can manage your ATM PIN online. 

Manage PIN Ask about dining reservations Today Welcome back XXXX! In a few words tell me what you need help with or select one of these topics : Dispute a charge Choose the transaction you'd like to review and select " Dispute This Charge. '' If a charge is still pending, you wont be able to dispute it until after it posts to your account. 
View Charges If you need additional help with your dispute, you can chat with a Customer Care Professional who can assist you.

Chat with a Customer Care Professional A Customer Care Professional will be with you shortly. 
Greetings XXXX! This is XXXX, I see that you are contacting us to dispute a transaction. 
Please help me with more information on the transaction, so that I can check and provide you with the best resolution. 
Are you still with me? 
I was charged {$32.00} interest on charge on cash advances on XX/XX/XXXX. 
I have previous chats regarding using cash advances and all the fee 's were discussed but this interest was never mentioned. I paid on the cash advance charges before my bill date as well.

I see that you are chatting about the interest fee on Cash advance.

Just to let you know, Your APR for Cash is a variable rate of 29.74 % And see that you have made a Cash Advance of {$2300.00}.

I dont intend to rush you however just checking in, are you still with me? 
Yes sorry I'm looking for the screenshots from my chat before. 
I went to XXXX and knew I'd be using the atms for cash and contacted American Express to see if I would use it or my bank card while overseas. 
I screenshoted the chat that explained there would only be a {$10.00} fee and any charges from the atms but no interest or other hidden fee 's were mentioned A Customer Care Professional will be with you shortly. 
Hi XXXX! My name is XXXX. Thank you for getting back to us. 

Please allow me a moment to review the previous conversation. 
Hi XXXX I understand you're contacting about the XXXXash Advance Interest fee.

Please allow me a moment to check on this When you enrolled with cash advance, this information was provided at the time of your enrollment.

You may be able to obtain a cash advance at an ATM up to the available Limit on Cash Advances at participating ATM locations worldwide. You must use your Personal Identification Number ( PIN ) along with your Card when obtaining cash from an ATM. You can obtain or change your PIN at any time by logging into your online account and going to the Card Management section or by calling XXXX. If you call to change your PIN, you can also request to have your PIN mailed to you and it should arrive within 5 to 7 business days.

When you withdraw cash, we charge a cash advance fee of 5 % of the total amount of your transaction ( inclusive of any ATM operator or network fees ) or {$10.00}, whichever is greater. You may also be subject to ATM operator or network fees.

Cash Advances are subject to the Cash Advance APR which can be found in your Card Member Agreement and on your billing statement. Finance charges on each cash advance transaction begin to accrue on the date of the cash advance. American Express may impose limits, in addition to the Limit on Cash Advances on your Card account, on the amount of each cash withdrawal. Each ATM owner may charge additional fees and may impose its own limits on the amount of each cash withdrawal.

By enrolling your card to Cash Advance, you are subject to get charged with the fee stated on the enrollment disclosure.

I also checked and the previous specialist did not mention that you will get charged only by the cash advance fee and ATM fee. 
Are you talking about the previous rep from today or XX/XX/XXXX? 
I reviwed both chats. 
" Your card also allows you to use Cash Advance withdrawals at ATMs. But, I would like to set your expectation that there's a {$10.00} Cash Advance fee + the amount that the bank or ATM may charge you for using it in XXXX. '' Correct The specialist mentioned the fee getting charges, however it was not specified that ONLY these fees will get charged We did provide the information about the Cash Advances are subject to the Cash Advance APR which can be found in your Card Member Agreement and on your billing statement. 
This information was still provided accordingly No it wasn't. I clearly asked what charges I would have overseas. 
I then I clarified in my next message that I would only be charged {$710.00} in the example. That wasn't specific enough? 
" Yes that covered everything, thanks for your help with this So just to make sure I understand the atm charges, If I want to use my card to withdraw {$700.00} at an atm in XXXX then I would be charged {$710.00} from American express and a separate charge from the atm, is that correct? '' The specialist only answered your inquiry about your withdrawal and the Cash Advance fee.

You did not specifically ask if there are no other fees to get charges *charged Also, we already provided the information about the Cash Advances are subject to the Cash Advance APR which can be found in your Card Member Agreement and on your billing statement Hi just checking in, are you still with me?

Yeah just typing a lot Got it. 
Thank you for being understanding. Would that be all for today? 
No to be clear I'm still typing regarding this issue. 
All right. What further assistance do you need on the cash advance interest fee? 
I will be navigating away from this chat for now. We appreciate your understanding and your Card Membership with us.

So I reach out before taking an international trip to verify charges. 
I even clarify that I would be charged {$10.00} from American express and anything else would be from the banks in XXXX. 
At no point was interest mentioned or was I advised to refer to an agreement regarding any additional charges related to the cash advance. 
I was charged {$17.00} per atm transaction not {$10.00}. I also now have an interest fee of {$33.00}. I don't think I've ever paid interest on this card since I always pay it off. 
I would've used my bank card had the previous rep given me the correct information. 
Saying I wasn't specific in my questioning is a poor attempt at deflection. 
It might've been just bad customer service and I move on but this reasoning is ridiculous to me. 
If you're standing by the charges please send me the information on canceling our account, pro-rating the previous renewal payment from last month and please email me the chat history for my account. 
XX/XX/XXXX Glad to have you back, XXXX I understand this is how you viewed the conversation you had with the previous specialist. I carefully reviewed your conversation and the specialist indeed did not state that you will only get charged with the ATM fee and cash advanced fee. 
Also, the cash advance interest is already provided on the disclosure you agree to when you submitted your enrolllment to cash advance. 
This information was laid out and not a hidden charge Chat transcripts, if available, are business records of American Express that can only be provided in response to a lawfully issued subpoena. However, you can view your chat transcripts for the previous 12 months by scrolling up in the chat window. 

For more information on subpoena submissions, please visit our website : americanexpress.com/us/content/subpoena-response-unit. 
Hi just checking in, are you still with me? 
They didn't say only but I was very clearly looking to get all information on any charges I could Incur. 
I get your going to stand by the agreement from before that conversation and save the extra {$90.00} you got from me. 
I understand your resolution but don't agree with it and I am far from satisfied with it. 
All right, we respect your opinion on this, XXXX. I sincerely understand your view, however if you also read it on the specialist 's end, they were only answering the question you asked.

They did not specify that only those fees you asked will be the only fees to get charged.

May I know if you have any further concern or request on the finance charge for the cash advance?

I will be navigating away from this chat for now. We appreciate your understanding and your Card Membership with us. 
How do you read the example of me asking if I would be charged {$710.00} and then the rep confirming yes but not clarifying also there would be more charges and not think that's misleading? 
I've spent enough time on these {$90.00} worth of charges and just need the requested information minus the chat transcripts. 
Chat transcripts, if available, are business records of American Express that can only be provided in response to a lawfully issued subpoena. However, you can view your chat transcripts for the previous 12 months by scrolling up in the chat window. 

For more information on subpoena submissions, please visit our website : americanexpress.com/us/content/subpoena-response-unit. 
Got that already. I do not need the chat transcripts. 
Thank you for understanding. 
May I know if we're all set for now?

No can I get the other information I requested?

What information please?

please send me the information on canceling our account and pro-rating the previous renewal payment from last month I can help cancel the card for you To complete the cancellation process, we need your consent. If we experience a disconnect or no response, we wont be able to cancel the Card unless you re-initiate the chat or call XXXX. 
May I have the reason for cancellation please? 
As for the membership fee, we only provide a refund if the cancellation is made within 30 days since the fee was billed to the card. 
Upon checking, the fee was billed on XX/XX/XXXX. If the cancellation will get processed, we won't be providing any refund on the annual fee Can you please provide any all terms and conditions related to cancelling our card and the refund process for the renewal payment that was made? I would like to avoid any other charges that aren't hidden but aren't " going to be relayed to me if I only ask about them generally and not specifically As an alternative, you may choose to downgrade your card to the Delta Skymiles XXXX card which has no annual fee. A pro-rated refund on the annual fee will be provided based on the remaining number of months until your next renewal date Those are the terms for the annual fee if you cancel the card I can send you the cancellation disclosure if you would like to proceed. 
We haven't heard from you ; I will be navigating away from this chat for now. Please reconnect once you are available and we will be happy to assist you. 
Please send me all policies, terms and conditions available to the customer that you have regarding cancelling the card, the annual fee and refunds. 
XX/XX/XXXX A Customer Care Professional will be with you shortly. 
Please allow me a moment and I'll pick up from where we left off Please correct me if I'm wrong that you're looking for card cancellation right? 
Looking for the information on it Had some issues with clarity so just to be clear. 
Please send me all policies, terms and c onditions available to the customer that you have regarding cancelling the card, the annual fee and refunds. 
XX/XX/XXXX I see Be assured I'll definitely check and confirm you regarding the card cancellation I see youve been with American Express for 5 years. Thats a long time indeed and I would like to emphasize that your membership means a lot to us. 
I would like to confirm that the annual fee only get refunded if the card gets canceleld within 30 days from the date the annual fee got charged If that's true please review the whole chat history. 
I'm getting screwed over for not hidden fee 's but fee 's I wasn't told about when I asked about them May I know which hidden fee you're referring here? 
I can type it again but it will take a minute No problem Take your time I'm here Thanks. 
Back on XX/XX/XXXX I asked about travel fee 's I was told {$10.00} is what I would be charged from American Express. 
I even provided an example of {$700.00} would be a {$710.00} charge on my card. 
The rep confirmed this. 
No interest was mentioned. 
I was charged {$17.00} per atm transaction and was hit with {$33.00} in interest. 
I see I can confirm that you've made a cash transaction on the card and that is why the fee that has been charged. 
So, it'a valid fee. 
So, could you please confirm how you want me to help you today? 
That's what the last rep said. 
I understand you're going to stand by the agreement that was not mentioned when I asked about the charges, I don't agree with and am not satisfied with it so Please send me all policies, terms and c onditions available to the customer that you have regarding cancelling the card, the annual fee and refunds. 
These information are mentioned in the monthly statements that you get Can you send it to me anyways? 
I can definitely send you the statements however it will get issued to you on the mail and it will take 7-10 business days however if you want you can also download the statements online as well, I can share the steps as well, let me know if you want the steps Can you email me the requested information?

or am I required to go to the statements to retrieve the requested information?

There's no such particular letter regarding this, this information is mentioned in the monthly statements that you get every month Hi just checking in, are you still with me? 
We haven't heard from you ; I will be navigating away from this chat for now. Please reconnect once you are available, and we will be happy to assist you and close. 
The agent has left Close the Chat or continue typing to reconnect

Company response to consumer: Closed with monetary relief