Consumer complaint received 2020-12-11 00:00:00
Product: Vehicle loan or lease — Loan
Issue: Managing the loan or lease — Problem with fees charged
Company: ALLY FINANCIAL INC.
State: AZ

Complaint narrative:
My 3 concerns : 1. Change in language to my billing statements from account number to agreement number without any prior notice and without my authorization. I am concerned this is a legal change or modification to the loan I ORIGINALLY signed. This could also indicate the sale of my loan to another company. 
2. I was never told what the state of origin of my loan, until about a week ago. I had some questions about the percentage rate I am being charged ( 8.89 % ). I do garage my car in the state of Arizona. According to ALLY bank, the Arizona garaging means my loan was originated in Maryland. I would like the usury law examined to ensure I am not being overcharged in my percentage rate. What is also strange to me is that my payments go to Minnesota, Allly coroporate offices are in Texas and Michigan. Yet ... my loan came out of Maryland. I have seen no evidence of this loan origin location. It is most confusing. 
XXXX. This is my largest issue. I was considering re-financing my loan with another bank. So I asked Ally for the TRUE ORIGINAL loan contract documents. I want to know exact amount due. I provided them the legally appropriate 30 days to provide my original. THEY DO NOT HAVE IT. I keep getting photo copies.What is worse is three company employees have stated verbally that they do NOT have my original!!!!! Now, I have a company letter in writing stating they do not have my original!!! THERE IS NO LEGAL EVIDENCE OF MY LOAN! The most important question now is why am I paying on a loan that does not exist? This is crazy. The lender is supposed to have LEGAL ORIGINAL documents. 
4. The letter I received from Ally was confusing to me so I called them on XX/XX/2020 at XXXXXXXX XXXX and asked if they are even my leinholder. I was not given an answer. I specifically asked to hear from their legal department. 

Now I will copy and paste here the letter I sent them on XX/XX/2020 so you can read the details of who I spoke to and when and what was said to me. 
XX/XX/2020 From : XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXXXXXX XXXX, AZ XXXX Cell phone XXXX XXXX TO : ALLY FINANCIAL- AUTO DIVISION Re : FRAUD on agreement number XXXX To Whom It May Concern : I have three MAJOR fraud concerns regarding my auto loan. I have spoken to three members of your management staff and my concerns are unanswered and unresolved. 
1. There was a change in language as it pertains to my auto loan. I have no comprehension or explanation as to the full ramifications of the change in language. The change occurred in XXXX of 2020. My statements prior to XXXX of 2020 had an account number on them and suddenly in XXXX of 2020, the tracking number changed to an agreement number. Any change of modification to any legal contract has to be fully disclosed in writing, prior to that change. I was given no notice ( written or otherwise ) of this very specific language change, no explanation as to why the language changed and most importantly, I did NOT consent or authorize the change you made to the loan or the tracking of the loan. This was a legal change to the loan without my knowledge. This is fraud. None of three managers I spoke to could provide an explanation about this language change. I do not know what I am paying on at this point. Your change could mean I am paying on something other than what I initially intended. Further to the point, I have continued making payments on this agreement since XXXX ( 11 months times {$490.00} = {$5400.00} ) 2020. My account is current and in good standing but, I reiterate here, I do not know what I am paying on right now. What happened to my account? How did I get an agreement without my knowledge, consent, or authorization? 
I found this statement language change while investigating the possibility of refinancing my loan. My interest rate is too high 8.89 % given my credit score ( XXXX ) and debt to income ratio. I could not find my original loan documents, so I had no way to verify how much money was allegedly owed on my car. I am not going to refinance without the ability to verify the original amount of the loan and verify the payments I have made and ensure the numbers are all accurate! 
2. Now we arrive at fraud issue number two. In order to verify my original loan amount, I called to obtain my true and original loan contract. I called at XXXXXXXX XXXX Arizona time on XX/XX/2020 and spoke to XXXX, a manager, in the Customer Solution Team. I requested my true, original contract documents and sadly I had to explain to your manager the difference between a copy and an original. Your manager XXXX promised me I would have the original documents in my hands via certified mail within 7 calendar days. I received a copy, not an original, 15 days after my request. During my call with XXXX, he had the audacity to ask me why I wanted my legal documents and why I did not have my original. According to the law, the lender is legally liable to retain and produce true, original contract documents at any time requested or questioned within 30 days. Your company has failed to produce the true, original contract loan documents within the legally allotted 30 days. I requested the address where records requests are handled and I was given the address. I did send in a written records request. So, I requested my documents both verbally and in writing on XX/XX/2020. 
Since XXXX sent me a copy, I called again on XX/XX/2020 at XXXXXXXX XXXX  Arizona time and spoke to another manager named XXXX in the Customer Solution Team. I asked again for the true, original loan contract, after explaining to him the difference between a copy and an original ( second manager who did not know ). He told me your company Does NOT have ANY original documents, only copies. I was in total shock hearing this, so I asked to speak to someone at the corporate office. 
This makes no sense to me, contracts are important legal evidence/documents, I can not conceive as to why your company would not have originals! XXXX refused to provide any corporate contact information saying you only have an internal email system. He said he could and would send an email on my behalf marked urgent and someone would be calling or emailing me from the corporate office within 24 hours. He gave me reference number XXXX. 
Eight days later, on XX/XX/2020 I spoke to XXXX in the Executive Relations Team. I asked her if she was at the corporate office. She said yes one of them, there are two, one in Texas and one in Michigan. The phone number I called her on was XXXX. She asked my concerns, I told her about all three concerns I have about fraud. I specifically asked her what happens to the true original loan contract documents your company receives from the dealerships. Her reply at XXXX was we scan them and destroy them. I asked her why and she had no answer. I said does your legal team know this is happening because it is also illegal to destroy legal evidence. She again had no answer. She provided me an email address and I specifically asked for this letter to be send to the legal department. Fraud is very serious. 
I am wondering, where is the proof of my loan? Two of your managers have told me there is no evidence of my loan. Why am I paying on a loan which does not exist? 
A scan or a photocopy is NOT an original. I requested the true original contract documents. According to the law Secondary evidence is not competent to prove the contents of an original writing ( meaning a copy is not admissible to court as legal evidence ). 

3. The third issue is the interest rate. I spoke to XXXX, XXXX and XXXX. None of them could tell me the origination point/location of the loan. Is the origination location where the loan is processed, or where I bought the car, or based on where I live? I purchased the car in Iowa, the payments go to Minnesota, you have corporate offices in Michigan and Texas. Maybe you have loan approval locations in a different state I have not yet covered. Which state law is applicable to my finance percentage amount? Which state is the loan origination state? 

If I go according to Minnesota law, where the payments go, then my finance percentage is higher than the maximum allowable by their state law. Minnesotas written contract percentage maximum is 8 % and I am paying 8.89 %. 

What the heck is going on? XXXX managers, no answers, and no legal documents/ evidence of this loan. I am also disappointed there is no one immediately available at the corporate office to manage serious fraud issues like I have. A month has gone by and multiple calls, on my part, just to try and access someone who can actually help resolve this compliant. 

In conclusion, I have given your company the legally appropriate 30 days both written and verbal notice to provide the true, original loan contract documents as it pertains to agreement number XXXX. The original can not be produced. Very simply put, no proof of loan, no loan. 
Here is what I want. I want this situation resolved immediately! 
There is no evidence of this loan, so the loan is null and void. Thereby, I do not owe any money on this loan. I want the title sent to me immediately along with a check for the amount I have overpaid since the language change your company made fraudulently. The check amount, at this time, for my overpayment is {$5400.00} made out to XXXX XXXX XXXX. Send both the title and check to me at : XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX, XXXX, AZ XXXX. 
You have my permission, for the time being, to reach out to me via email if you wish to communicate with me to remedy this situation swiftly and amicably. My email is : XXXX. Any possible phone conversations will have to be booked via email. 
I expect a reply on or before XX/XX/2020. One again, todays date, the day of notice is XX/XX/2020. 
Sincerely, XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX last note, it is crazy to me that customer service people will not provide any phone numbers or names or emails to anyone specifically who can actually make a decision. It is a continuous chain to non-descrip people who listen and take notes but do NOT solve problems. I twice requested to be in touch with their legal team.

Company public response: Company has responded to the consumer and the CFPB and chooses not to provide a public response
Company response to consumer: Closed with explanation