debates/debates2025-05-19b conversation_8
Source: hansard.parliament.uk (2025-05-19)

UK Parliament Hansard data: debates/debates2025-05-19b conversation_8

Andrew Lewin:What recent discussions he has had with NATO allies on European security. \p Luke Pollard: The Secretary of State and I are in regular and close contact with our NATO allies on strengthening Euro-Atlantic security. Last week, the Secretary of State and I were both in Germany discussing closer co-operation and how to further enhance bilateral defence co-operation. The Secretary of State attended a meeting of the E5 Defence Ministers driving European leadership in Ukraine, and next month will meet allies in preparation for the Hague summit in June. \p Uma Kumaran: NATO has never been more vital for Britain’s defence and security than in this era of global instability and volatility. I was therefore alarmed that certain Green party politicians have suggested that the UK leave NATO, abandoning our commitment to our allies, including other European nations, and the defence of Ukraine and of our shared democratic values. Will the Minister reassure this House that this Labour Government will recommit to working even more closely with our allies for our collective defence, and will he confirm that unlike certain other parties, Labour will always put the security of our citizens first? \p Luke Pollard: Let me be absolutely clear with the House: NATO is the cornerstone of our security, and this Government’s commitment to the alliance is unshakeable. The Greens, if that is the case, would be out of step with the British people, who recognise the importance of NATO membership. We should also be clear that the only person who would benefit from taking apart the NATO alliance sits in the Kremlin: President Putin. That is a victory we will not give him. \p Andrew Lewin: The Ukrainian military’s response to Putin’s invasion has been formidable. One of the ways it has been so impressive is through its innovation in drone technology, with Ukraine now a world leader in strategic and tactical drones. Does the Minister agree that it is important that the UK, along with our NATO allies, continues to invest in the Ukrainian military, so that it can continue its fight for freedom and so that we can benefit from the advances in technology that the Ukrainian military has brought forward? \p Luke Pollard: I absolutely agree. The UK is co-leading the drone capability coalition with Latvia, and we are improving and learning from the experiences of our friends in Ukraine. Drone technology in Ukraine iterates every two to three weeks, so it is absolutely vital not only that we create the environment for new investments in drone technology, but that the UK military looks at those lessons learned. I would expect a large part of the strategic defence review to be looking at the lessons that we can learn from Ukraine and applying them to our own military. \p Julian Lewis: Unlike certain other institutions, NATO is an alliance of separate sovereign countries. I thank the Minister for his strong support of NATO, but does he agree that we should follow the example of the frontline NATO states like Estonia and Poland, which recognise that the difference between deterring a hostile Russia and actually having to fight a war is the difference between spending 4% or 5% of GDP on defence, as we did in the 1980s, and 40% or 50% if, God forbid, we ever have to engage in open hostilities? \p Luke Pollard: I thank the right hon. Gentleman for that question. This Government are delivering for defence with increased defence spending. By April 2027, we will be spending 2.5% of our GDP on defence, which includes an extra £5 billion for defence in this financial year; that will rise to 3% in the next Parliament, when economic conditions allow. What we spend that money on is just as important, and that is what the strategic defence review, when it is published, will set out. \p Richard Foord: At the end of March, the US Secretary of State told the Foreign Ministers of the Baltic states that the US wanted to continue participating in EU defence procurement initiatives. What has the UK discussed with the EU about any exclusion of US companies linked to the security and defence pact? \p Luke Pollard: It is certainly true that right across Europe, there are European and American firms providing the capabilities we need to keep our people safe. It is right that we continue those discussions with our European  friends to look at how UK firms can participate, because UK firms are already present around Europe, providing resources, as indeed are our American friends. We all need to spend more on defence and we all need to renew our capabilities. We are working together to ensure that we have the frameworks and structures to enable that renewal of our forces to take place.