English: Gosh, that was a lot of new taxes from Mike Hedges. I'm not sure whether the diesel tax would operate quite in Swansea as it might in Newport or Monmouth. But I first looked at today's motion and read 'it will be necessary to test this new aspect of the devolution machinery.' My first reaction was: 'Why?' Surely a prerequisite is wanting to impose a new tax, and many people in Wales feel they're paying quite enough tax already. When the Cabinet Secretary told the Finance Committee in Newport on 23 March he wanted to test the machinery during this term, I asked him, 'What does that mean?' The Cabinet Secretary told us: 'We have to propose things and those propositions will have to be tested in front of two Houses of Parliament.' But why do we have to? The Wales Act provides us with a power, not a duty. Yet the Cabinet Secretary told the Finance Committee 'the job of this Assemblyis to flesh out the machinery that is currently there for us to test this possibility We would learn how that proposition would be then tested at the other end of the M4, and we would learn a lot by doing it.' So, is the Welsh Government keen to impose a new tax because it potentially can, or is it keen to practice, to pull some levers, and press some buttons and see what happens - a bit like my three year old when I let him in the front of our car? And how does the Cabinet Secretary - ? [Interruption.] When it's stationary, I hasten to add. And how does the Cabinet Secretary expect Westminster to respond to this approach for testing in front of two Houses of Parliament? Won't Westminster expect us to be seeking, actually, to impose a new tax, not just experimenting to test this new aspect of the devolution machinery, as our motion says? The Cabinet Secretary said he wants 'a subsequent Assembly to have the legacy of the learning', so, can he clarify: will this be an academic learning exercise or does he expect the Welsh people to pay a new tax in consequence? In Newport, the Cabinet Secretary referred approvingly to the Bevan commission report, talking about a tourism tax, a sunbed tax and the takeaway packaging tax. Just now, he didn't mention quite as many as Mike Hedges, but he did say also a land or garden tax and a water tax. But aren't we trying to encourage tourism and aren't we in danger of forgetting the purpose of tax? Surely it is to raise money when necessary, not to experiment or punish people for using sunbeds or eating takeaways.
Welsh: Wel wir, roedd hynna'n llawer o drethi newydd gan Mike Hedges. Nid wyf yn siŵr a fyddai'r dreth diesel yn gweithio yr un fath yn Abertawe ag y byddai yng Nghasnewydd neu Drefynwy. Ond edrychais gyntaf ar gynnig heddiw a darllen 'bydd angen profi'r agwedd newydd hon ar y system datganoli.' Fy ymateb cyntaf oedd: 'Pam?' Siawns bod yr awydd i osod treth newydd yn rhagofyniad, ac mae llawer o bobl yng Nghymru'n teimlo eu bod yn talu hen ddigon o dreth eisoes. Pan ddywedodd Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet wrth y Pwyllgor Cyllid yng Nghasnewydd ar 23 Mawrth ei fod am brofi'r system yn ystod y tymor hwn, gofynnais iddo, 'Beth mae hynny'n ei olygu?' Dywedodd Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet wrthym: 'Mae'n rhaid inni gynnig pethau a bydd rhaid profi'r cynigion hynny o flaen dau Dŷ'r Senedd.' Ond pam mae'n rhaid inni? Mae Deddf Cymru'n rhoi pŵer inni, nid dyletswydd. Eto dywedodd Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet wrth y Pwyllgor Cyllid 'gwaith y Cynulliad hwnyw rhoi cnawd ar esgyrn y system sydd yno ar hyn o bryd inni i brofi'r posibilrwydd hwn Byddem yn dysgu sut y câi'r cynnig hwnnw ei brofi wedyn ym mhen arall yr M4, a byddem yn dysgu llawer drwy wneud hynny.' Felly, a yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn awyddus i osod treth newydd am ei bod o bosibl yn gallu, ynteu a yw'n awyddus i ymarfer, i dynnu rhai liferi, a phwyso rhai botymau a gweld beth sy'n digwydd - yn debyg i fy mhlentyn tair oed pan fyddaf yn gadael iddo eistedd yn sedd flaen ein car? A sut y mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet - ? [Torri ar draws.] Pan mae'n llonydd, brysiaf i ychwanegu. A sut y mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn disgwyl i San Steffan ymateb i'r ymagwedd hon at brofi o flaen dau Dŷ'r Senedd? Oni fydd San Steffan yn disgwyl inni fod yn ceisio, mewn gwirionedd, gosod treth newydd, nid dim ond arbrofi i brofi'r agwedd newydd hon ar y system datganoli, fel y mae ein cynnig yn ei ddweud? Dywedodd Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yr hoffai i 'Gynulliad dilynol gael etifeddiaeth y dysg', felly, a all egluro: ai ymarfer dysgu academaidd fydd hyn ynteu a yw'n disgwyl i bobl Cymru dalu treth newydd o ganlyniad iddo? Yng Nghasnewydd, cyfeiriodd yr Ysgrifennydd Cabinet yn gymeradwyol at adroddiad comisiwn Bevan, sy'n sôn am dreth twristiaeth, treth gwelyau haul a'r dreth pecynnu bwyd parod. Nawr, ni wnaeth sôn am gynifer â Mike Hedges, ond dywedodd hefyd treth dir neu ardd a threth dŵr. Ond onid ydym yn ceisio annog twristiaeth ac onid ydym mewn perygl o anghofio pwrpas treth? Does bosib mai pwrpas treth yw codi arian pan fo ei angen, nid arbrofi neu gosbi pobl am ddefnyddio gwelyau haul neu fwyta cludfwyd.