English: I always welcome a contribution from the Member for Swansea East to the debate on reconfiguration of local services, and the consistency he shows in his contributions is sometimes to be welcomed. Can I say - ? Can I say that I agree with the points that he's made? And can I say also that, in many ways, we have inherited systems and structures from the past and that it is our duty and responsibility to ensure that they are fit for the future? And it is our responsibility, therefore, to look at those processes and structures to ensure that, periodically, we do have the opportunity to give the sort of considered thinking that these matters demand of us. In terms of the suggestions he's made over reports to scrutiny committees of local authorities, I very much would welcome that. Do you know, one of the debates and discussions we have around the powers held in local government and elsewhere forgets that the power of a local authority isn't simply the powers that are provided to it by statute, but the power it has as an elected body to represent the interests of the people it serves? As such, it can demand those reports, it can demand that people appear to give evidence, it can create the structures of scrutiny, and it doesn't need statute to do that, and it certainly doesn't need a Minister's blessing in order to do that. That is a matter for local government and I would encourage all local authorities across the whole of the country to ensure that they take forward their scrutiny function with that creative approach, if you like, which isn't delineated simply by what they're able to do or compelled to do by law. So, I'd certainly welcome that. In terms of the points that he makes - and I will try to make good time, Deputy Presiding Officer - I have considered the issue of boundaries, and it was a point raised, of course, by the Plaid Cymru spokesperson as well. At the moment, I do not believe that the case has been made for a significant change to any of the boundaries or the numbers of the current fire and rescue authorities. But what I am not doing is closing the door to such change, were that case to be made. Now, it is clearly possible to point to communities either side of any border and to say that those communities should work together in order to deliver services. That's the easiest thing in the world to do, and I accept that, clearly, in the example quoted, those authorities would, I would anticipate, work together to deliver the services they require. What we're talking about here is a different matter; it's about governance, and I'm yet to be convinced that there is a case for change along the lines that have been described by the Member, but my mind is not closed to that, and if he's able to present the arguments for the change he suggests, then I'm very happy to give that due consideration in the future. In terms - . This is my final point, Deputy Presiding Officer. In terms of the point he makes on the additional I think it's two or three members that would sit on reformed boards in order to provide accountability, scrutiny and challenge, we are looking to ensure that we have the right mix of locally elected, locally accountable members who are able to provide challenge to the management of the authorities, but also to ensure that we have the skills mix within the new boards of fire and rescue authorities to ensure that we have the people there who are able to provide challenge to that board as well. That is the role of a non-executive director in many businesses up and down the country. It is a role that I would want to see performed within these new boards, but, again, this is the beginning of a consultation, not the end of a consultation, so I'd be very happy to join the debate if Members wish to contribute further over the coming months.
Welsh: Rwyf wastad yn croesawu cyfraniad gan yr Aelod dros Ddwyrain Abertawe i'r ddadl ar ad-drefnu gwasanaethau lleol, ac mae'r cysondeb y mae'n ei ddangos yn ei gyfraniadau yn rhywbeth i'w groesawu. A gaf i ddweud - ? A gaf i ddweud fy mod i'n cytuno â'r sylwadau y mae wedi eu gwneud? Ac a gaf i ddweud hefyd ein bod ni, mewn sawl ffordd, wedi etifeddu systemau a strwythurau o'r gorffennol a'i bod hi'n ddyletswydd ac yn gyfrifoldeb arnom ni i sicrhau eu bod yn addas ar gyfer y dyfodol? A'n cyfrifoldeb ni, felly, yw edrych ar y prosesau a'r strwythurau i sicrhau, o bryd i'w gilydd, bod gennym ni'r cyfle i roi'r ystyriaeth ddwys sy'n ddyledus i'r materion hyn. O ran yr awgrymiadau y mae wedi eu gwneud o ran adroddiadau i bwyllgorau craffu awdurdodau lleol, byddwn yn croesawu hynny'n fawr iawn. Wyddoch chi, mae un o'r dadleuon a'r trafodaethau a gawsom ni o ran y pwerau sydd wedi eu crynhoi mewn llywodraeth leol a mannau eraill yn anghofio nad dim ond y pwerau a roddir drwy statud yw pwerau awdurdod lleol, ond y pŵer sydd ganddo fel corff etholedig i gynrychioli buddiannau'r bobl y mae'n eu gwasanaethu? Fel y cyfryw, gall fynnu'r adroddiadau hynny, gall alw ar bobl i ymddangos i roi tystiolaeth, gall greu strwythurau craffu, ac nid oes angen statud i wneud hynny, ac yn sicr nid oes angen sêl bendith Gweinidog arno er mwyn gwneud hynny. Mae hynny'n fater i lywodraeth leol ac rwy'n annog pob awdurdod lleol ledled y wlad i sicrhau eu bod yn defnyddio eu swyddogaeth graffu yn y modd creadigol hwnnw, os mynnwch chi, sydd ddim yn gaeth i'r hyn y maen nhw'n gallu ei wneud neu dan orfodaeth i'w wneud gan y gyfraith. Felly, rwy'n sicr yn croesawu hynny. O ran y pwyntiau y mae'n eu gwneud - a byddaf yn ceisio cadw o fewn yr amser, Dirprwy Lywydd - rwyf wedi ystyried y mater o ffiniau, ac roedd yn bwynt a godwyd, wrth gwrs, gan lefarydd Plaid Cymru. Ar hyn o bryd, nid wyf yn credu bod dadl dros wneud newidiadau sylweddol i unrhyw un o'r ffiniau na niferoedd presennol awdurdodau tân ac achub. Ond nid wyf yn diystyru newid o'r fath yn llwyr, pe byddai dadl o'r fath yn cael ei chyflwyno. Nawr, mae hi'n amlwg yn bosib pwyntio at gymunedau ar y naill ochr i unrhyw ffin a dweud y dylai'r cymunedau hynny weithio gyda'i gilydd i ddarparu gwasanaethau. Dyna'r peth hawsaf yn y byd i'w wneud, ac rwy'n derbyn, yn amlwg, yn yr enghraifft a roddwyd, y byddai'r awdurdodau hynny, rwy'n rhagweld, yn gweithio gyda'i gilydd i ddarparu'r gwasanaethau y mae arnyn nhw eu hangen. Mae'r hyn yr ydym ni'n sôn amdano yma yn fater gwahanol; mae'n ymwneud â llywodraethu, ac rwyf eto i gael fy argyhoeddi bod dadl dros newid yn y modd a ddisgrifiwyd gan yr Aelod, ond nid wyf wedi diystyru hynny, ac os yw'n gallu cyflwyno'r dadleuon o blaid y newid y mae'n ei awgrymu, yna rwy'n hapus iawn i roi ystyriaeth briodol i hynny yn y dyfodol. O ran - . Hwn yw fy mhwynt olaf, Dirprwy Lywydd. O ran y pwynt y maen ei wneud ynglŷn â'r ddau neu dri aelod ychwanegol rwy'n credu a fyddai'n eistedd ar fyrddau diwygiedig er mwyn eu dwyn i gyfrif, craffu a herio, rydym ni'n edrych i sicrhau bod gennym ni'r cyfuniad cywir o aelodau wedi eu hethol yn lleol, sy'n atebol yn lleol sy'n gallu herio rheolwyr yr awdurdodau, ond hefyd i sicrhau bod gennym ni'r cyfuniad o sgiliau ar fyrddau newydd yr awdurdodau tân ac achub i sicrhau bod gennym ni'r bobl yno sy'n gallu herio'r bwrdd hwnnw hefyd. Dyna swyddogaeth cyfarwyddwr anweithredol mewn llawer o fusnesau ar hyd a lled y wlad. Mae'n swyddogaeth yr wyf eisiau gweld ei chyflawni ar y byrddau newydd hyn, ond, unwaith eto, dyma ddechrau ymgynghoriad, nid diwedd ymgynghoriad, felly rwy'n hapus iawn i ymuno yn y ddadl os yw Aelodau yn dymuno cyfrannu ymhellach dros y misoedd nesaf.