English: I hope and I think that this afternoon marks a debate on the M4 where we've actually been debating solutions to it and not simply rehearsing arguments on whether we would support either the black route or the blue route. If I think back to the debates that I've participated in and listened to in this place over the last decade or so, they've basically been debates not on the issues facing the M4 corridor transport in south-east Wales but debates on the black route, and I think those debates have been addressing the wrong issues. I agree with those in this debate - I agree with Jayne Bryant and with Huw Irranca-Davies, who've said that the issues that we have are certainly focused on and in and around Newport, but the solutions have to be focused in and around Newport and elsewhere. And certainly when I look at some of these issues it is clear to me that it is insufficient simply to point to the M4 itself, point at the traffic jams, and say, 'That is the problem.' I believe the problem goes further than that. I understand and I do agree that the current M4 is no longer fit for purpose, but then again neither is the rail infrastructure in the area either, and neither is the trunk road network and neither is the public transport system serving communities in the south-east or enabling people to move through the area as part of a longer journey. So, this certainly requires addressing these particular issues but in a far wider and bigger way. So, I do welcome the announcement of the First Minister on the establishment of the commission to look at a wider and bigger response, and I hope that the Minister, in responding to the debate today, can give us further information on the timetable and the budget available to this commission. I did notice in his earlier opening remarks that he said that the £1.4 billion would not be available to the commission, but I think we do need to understand how much money is available to the commission, and we also need to understand what the timescale is that he seeks to provide answers in. But when we look at where we've been over the last few years, we do have a comprehensive analysis of the capacity of not only the local and regional motorway, trunk and network system but also the capacity of the rail network, and I have, Presiding Officer, some real concerns about the capacity of the rail network to fulfil the role that many people have seen for it in providing an alternative to road transport. And I've heard what's been said this afternoon, but I am not convinced we have the rail network in place in this part of the world that's able to deliver on the ambitions and the visions that have been outlined today and at other times. I hope, Minister, that you will be able to persuade Lord Burns to speak to Keith Williams about the importance and urgency of the devolution of rail infrastructure investment, and investment in signals, in stations, and to ensure that we have the services that we require on the infrastructure that we need. And, in doing so, I hope we'll also set some very clear objectives in solving these problems and putting in place alternative transport networks. One of the reasons I opposed the black route was certainly because of the extraordinary environmental and ecological damage it would've done, but for what benefit? When I looked at those economic heat maps and I saw the impact on Blaenau Gwent, it made my blood run cold because we were going to spend £1.4 billion on a road that would have no impact at all on the economy and the poverty in one of the poorest parts of Wales. And why would we do that? When I look at the issues, and when I look at the solutions that the commission will be delivering and developing, I will be looking at the economic impact on the whole region and not simply looking at a very narrow impact along the M4 corridor in Cardiff, Newport and Bristol. I believe that if we are making investments of this sort, then it has to have a much wider and broader economic impact. And a final point I'd wish to make in this debate today is that on regional connectivity and the integration of public transport services. We are focused in this debate, and we focus all too often in our debates, on the hard infrastructure, on the investment in the railway line or a road, or wherever it happens to be. But I want to see us invest as well in the services that will enable people to make public transport a realistic choice in exactly the way that Huw Irranca-Davies described earlier. All too often in Blaenau Gwent we are seeing fewer bus services and not more bus services. We are not seeing the same urgency in investment in additional rail services that other parts of the Valleys networks are seeing. And consequently, many of the people who I represent listen to speeches on active travel and making these choices with a sense of incredulity and disbelief because we simply don't have those services available to us. So, I hope that there will be the investment that we need in the infrastructure, which will allow a far bigger answer and a better answer to the questions we face. But I hope, also, that in making the investments in the infrastructure, we will also make investments in bus services, make investments in rail services, and also, Minister, take advantage of the legislation that you're currently considering in terms of the regulation of public transport to ensure that we do have a south-eastern travel authority or executive established by statute to manage the integration of public transport services. People will know that I disagreed with the abolition of the South East Wales Transport Alliance when it took place at the time, and I think since then we've seen a real diminution in the connectivity of transport services serving the communities of south-east Wales. And if we are to achieve the ambitions that I agree with and that we've shared this afternoon, then we need the management of those transport services as well as wishing for them. Thank you.
Welsh: Rwy'n gobeithio ac rwy'n credu bod y prynhawn yma yn nodi dadl ar yr M4 ble buom ni'n trafod atebion iddi mewn gwirionedd ac nid dim ond yn ailadrodd dadleuon ynghylch a fyddem yn cefnogi un ai'r llwybr du ynteu'r llwybr glas. Os meddyliaf yn ôl i'r dadleuon yr wyf wedi cymryd rhan ynddynt ac wedi gwrando arnynt yn y lle hwn dros y degawd diwethaf, yn y bôn buont yn ddadleuon, nid ar y materion sy'n wynebu trafnidiaeth coridor yr M4 yn ne-ddwyrain Cymru ond dadleuon ar y llwybr du, a chredaf fod y dadleuon hynny wedi mynd i'r afael â'r materion anghywir. Cytunaf â'r rheini yn y ddadl hon - cytunaf â Jayne Bryant a chyda Huw Irranca-Davies, sydd wedi dweud bod y problemau sydd gennym ni'n sicr wedi eu canolbwyntio ar Gasnewydd a'r cyffiniau, ond mae'n rhaid i'r atebion ganolbwyntio ar Gasnewydd ac o amgylch Casnewydd a mannau eraill. Ac yn sicr, wrth edrych ar rai o'r materion hyn, mae'n amlwg i mi nad yw'n ddigon i gyfeirio at yr M4 ei hun yn unig, pwyntio bys at y tagfeydd traffig, a dweud, 'Dyna'r broblem.' Credaf fod y broblem yn mynd ymhellach na hynny. Deallaf a chytunaf nad yw'r M4 presennol yn addas at y diben bellach, ond eto nid yw'r seilwaith rheilffyrdd yn yr ardal chwaith, na chwaith y rhwydwaith cefnffyrdd na'r system drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus sy'n gwasanaethu cymunedau yn y de-ddwyrain nac yn galluogi pobl i deithio drwy'r ardal yn rhan o daith hirach. Felly, mae angen mynd i'r afael â'r materion penodol hyn ond mewn ffordd llawer ehangach. Felly, rwy'n croesawu'r cyhoeddiad gan y Prif Weinidog ynghylch sefydlu'r comisiwn i edrych ar ymateb ehangach a mwy sylweddol, a gobeithiaf y bydd y Gweinidog, wrth ymateb i'r ddadl heddiw, yn gallu rhoi rhagor o wybodaeth inni am yr amserlen a'r gyllideb sydd ar gael i'r comisiwn hwn. Fe sylwais yn ei sylwadau agoriadol yn gynharach iddo ddweud na fyddai'r £1.4 biliwn ar gael i'r comisiwn, ond credaf fod angen inni ddeall faint o arian sydd ar gael i'r comisiwn, ac mae angen inni ddeall hefyd beth yw'r amserlen ar gyfer ei atebion. Ond pan edrychwn ni ar y sefyllfa a fu dros y blynyddoedd diwethaf, mae gennym ni ddadansoddiad cynhwysfawr o gapasiti, nid yn unig y system draffyrdd, cefnffyrdd a rhwydwaith lleol a rhanbarthol ond hefyd capasiti'r rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd, ac mae gennyf i, Llywydd, rai pryderon gwirioneddol ynghylch gallu'r rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd i gyflawni'r swyddogaeth y disgwylir iddo ei chyflawni gan lawer, sef darparu dewis arall yn lle trafnidiaeth ffyrdd. Ac rwyf wedi clywed beth sydd wedi cael ei ddweud y prynhawn yma, ond dydw i ddim wedi fy narbwyllo bod gennym ni'r rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd yn y rhan hon o'r wlad sy'n gallu gwireddu'r uchelgeisiau a'r gweledigaethau sydd wedi'u hamlinellu heddiw ac ar adegau eraill. Rwy'n gobeithio, Gweinidog, y byddwch yn gallu perswadio'r Arglwydd Burns i siarad â Keith Williams ynghylch pwysigrwydd a brys datganoli buddsoddi yn y seilwaith rheilffyrdd, a buddsoddi mewn signalau, mewn gorsafoedd, a sicrhau bod gennym ni'r gwasanaethau y mae arnom ni eu hangen ar y seilwaith y mae ei arnom ni ei angen. Ac, wrth wneud hynny, rwy'n gobeithio y byddwn ni hefyd yn gosod rhai amcanion clir iawn wrth ddatrys y problemau hyn ac yn sefydlu rhwydweithiau trafnidiaeth amgen. Un o'r rhesymau pam roeddwn yn gwrthwynebu'r llwybr du oedd yn sicr oherwydd y niwed amgylcheddol ac ecolegol rhyfeddol y byddai wedi'i achosi, ac er budd beth? Pan edrychais ar y mapiau gwres economaidd hynny, a gwelais yr effaith ar Flaenau Gwent, fe oerodd fy ngwaed oherwydd roeddem ni'n mynd i wario £1.4 biliwn ar ffordd na fyddai'n cael unrhyw effaith o gwbl ar yr economi a'r tlodi yn un o ardaloedd tlotaf Cymru. A pham fyddem ni'n gwneud hynny? Pan edrychaf ar y materion dan sylw, a phan edrychaf ar yr atebion y bydd y Comisiwn yn eu darparu ac yn eu datblygu, byddaf yn ystyried yr effaith economaidd ar y rhanbarth cyfan ac nid dim ond edrych ar effaith gyfyng iawn ar hyd coridor yr M4 yng Nghaerdydd, Casnewydd a Bryste. Os ydym ni'n gwneud buddsoddiadau o'r math hwn, credaf fod yn rhaid cael effaith economaidd ehangach. Y pwynt olaf yr hoffwn ei wneud yn y ddadl hon heddiw yw hwnnw am gysylltedd rhanbarthol ac ar integreiddio gwasanaethau trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. Rydym ni'n canolbwyntio yn y ddadl hon, ac rydym ni'n canolbwyntio'n rhy aml yn ein dadleuon, ar y seilwaith caled, ar y buddsoddiad yn y rheilffordd neu ar ffordd, neu le bynnag y mae'n digwydd bod. Ond rwyf eisiau ein gweld ni'n buddsoddi hefyd yn y gwasanaethau a fydd yn galluogi trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus i fod yn ddewis realistig i bobl yn union fel y disgrifiodd Huw Irranca-Davies yn gynharach. Yn rhy aml o lawer ym Mlaenau Gwent rydym ni'n gweld llai o wasanaethau bysiau ac nid mwy o wasanaethau bysiau. Nid ydym ni'n gweld yr un brys o ran buddsoddi mewn gwasanaethau rheilffyrdd ychwanegol y mae rhannau eraill o rwydweithiau'r Cymoedd yn ei weld. Ac o'r herwydd, mae llawer o'r bobl yr wyf yn eu cynrychioli yn gwrando ar areithiau am deithio llesol ac yn gwneud y dewisiadau hyn gydag ymdeimlad o anghrediniaeth oherwydd, yn syml, nid yw'r gwasanaethau hynny ar gael i ni. Felly, gobeithiaf y gwelwn ni'r buddsoddiad y mae ei angen arnom ni yn y seilwaith, a fydd yn rhoi ateb mwy o lawer ac ateb gwell i'r cwestiynau yr ydym ni'n eu hwynebu. Ond gobeithiaf hefyd, wrth fuddsoddi yn y seilwaith, y byddwn hefyd yn buddsoddi mewn gwasanaethau bysiau, yn buddsoddi mewn gwasanaethau rheilffyrdd, a hefyd, Gweinidog, yn manteisio ar y ddeddfwriaeth yr ydych chi'n ei hystyried ar hyn o bryd o ran rheoleiddio trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus i sicrhau bod gennym ni awdurdod teithio neu weithrediaeth yn y de-ddwyrain wedi ei sefydlu drwy statud i reoli'r broses o integreiddio gwasanaethau trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. Bydd pobl yn gwybod fy mod yn anghytuno â diddymu Cynghrair Trafnidiaeth De-ddwyrain Cymru pan ddigwyddodd hynny ar y pryd, a chredaf ers hynny ein bod wedi gweld gostyngiad gwirioneddol yng nghysylltedd y gwasanaethau trafnidiaeth sy'n gwasanaethu cymunedau'r de-ddwyrain. Ac os ydym ni am gyflawni'r uchelgeisiau yr wyf yn cytuno â hwy ac a gafodd eu rhannu y prynhawn yma, yna mae angen i ni reoli'r gwasanaethau trafnidiaeth hynny yn ogystal â dymuno'u cael nhw. Diolch.