English: Diolch. Can I thank David Melding for his comments this afternoon, for his contribution to the debate, and for his contribution during the committee? I can say that you will be missed in the committee when we discuss housing. He raises that quality assurance is important. People need to be assured that, if they are buying something, the quality that they've got is such that they are not paying money out like people have done for other things that they've had that were meant to help their homes and didn't. Older properties are lived in by people who are on low incomes and are low-income house owners. That's by definition. Your five-bedroomed detached houses tend not to be lived in by low-income householders; it's the two/three-bedroomed terraced houses that are lived in by low-income owner-occupiers, and it's important that these properties are retrofitted. This is probably the biggest group of people who could benefit in terms of not just fuel poverty, but actually benefit from retrofitting. Llyr Gruffydd - again, the importance of having a method of reducing carbon, and housing has to be part of it. Scale and pace need increasing - I think that's something we've said about an awful lot of things from our reports from time to time, but it's, I think, if you can sum up an awful lot of things here, moving in the right direction but not quickly enough. I think that's probably - . I don't think anybody criticised the direction in which the Welsh Government is going. Nobody criticised the fact that the Welsh Government is moving to reduce fuel poverty. They are moving to reduce carbon. I think the concern is, from the committee - and any of the members of the committee can tell me if I'm wrong - it's not happening fast enough. New jobs - we've talked a lot about the fact, and we've had Lee Waters, who is not in here, tell us regularly about the effects of automation, but other jobs will be created. This retrofitting is unlikely to be automated, certainly in the short term. So, it's really important that we skill people up to do this. Gareth Bennett came on and talked about that we need skills. We need the colleges to train people, but people will not undertake training, colleges will not undertake courses, unless they know there's a market and there is an assurance of continuity, that they know - the people going on a training course - that there's going to be 10, 15 years' worth of work to retrofit, rather than in three years' time there will be a change of policy, a change in direction and their skill will be outdated. I thank the Cabinet Secretary for her response. I very much welcome many of the comments she said. And there are many different ways of reducing emissions. I do not see - and perhaps the Cabinet Secretary can explain to me - why tenure affects the method of retrofitting. I can understand how the type of property affects it, but I can't understand how a house being privately rented, owner occupied, or owned by a housing association would actually affect the type of retrofitting you needed. Perhaps the Cabinet - I'm quite happy to receive an intervention for that to be explained to me. Decarbonisation is a priority - and the Cabinet Secretary highlighted reductions. We're going to have milestones and targets to be set; I think that most Members in here would like to know when. Consider more stringent standards - yes, that's the direction we want to move in. Review of Part L - I think that's something that needs to be changed. We all welcome Nest and Arbed 3, and I'm sure that whoever stands here in about five or six years' time will welcome Nest and Arbed 4. But, at some stage, we need to be making progress to such an extent that we don't need Nest and Arbed 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 and 10. Fuel poverty is a huge problem. I'll finish on this - a story of one of my constituents. She goes to bed at 7 o'clock at night with her daughter. Why? That's the only way they can keep warm. They live in a house that is privately rented, probably because they spend more on keeping cold than most people in here spend on their houses keeping them warm. And I think that that is the problem. We have this level of fuel poverty, and it's the poorest people who are suffering, not just because of the cost of fuel, but because of the type of property they live in - the single glaze with gaps that means that they're doing very well at heating the world, but not such a good job of heating their own houses. Really, fuel poverty has got to be a top priority. I know the Welsh Government wants to reduce it, but we need to be really committed to eliminating it.
Welsh: Diolch. A gaf fi ddiolch i David Melding am ei sylwadau y prynhawn yma, am ei gyfraniad i'r ddadl, ac am ei gyfraniad yn ystod y pwyllgor? Gallaf ddweud y byddwn yn gweld eich colli yn y pwyllgor pan fyddwn yn trafod tai. Mae'n nodi bod sicrwydd ansawdd yn bwysig. Mae angen i bobl gael sicrwydd os ydynt yn prynu rhywbeth, fod yr ansawdd sydd ganddynt yn golygu nad ydynt yn talu arian fel y mae pobl wedi'i wneud am bethau eraill a gawsant a oedd i fod i helpu eu cartrefi ac na wnaeth hynny. Pobl ar incwm isel ac sy'n berchnogion tai ar incwm isel sy'n byw mewn eiddo hŷn, drwy ddiffiniad. Nid deiliaid tai ar incwm isel sy'n tueddu i fyw yn eich tai sengl pum ystafell wely; mewn tai teras dwy/tair ystafell wely y mae perchen-feddianwyr ar incwm isel yn tueddu i fyw, ac mae'n bwysig fod ôl-osod yn digwydd i eiddo o'r fath. Mae'n debyg mai dyma'r grŵp mwyaf o bobl a allai elwa nid yn unig o ran tlodi tanwydd, ond gallent elwa o ôl-osod mewn gwirionedd. Llyr Gruffydd - unwaith eto, pwysigrwydd cael dull o leihau allyriadau carbon, a rhaid i dai fod yn rhan ohono. Mae angen cynyddu graddfa a chyflymder - credaf fod hynny'n rhywbeth rydym wedi'i ddweud am lawer iawn o bethau yn ein hadroddiadau o bryd i'w gilydd, ond credaf ei fod, os gallwch grynhoi llawer iawn o bethau yma, yn symud i'r cyfeiriad cywir ond heb fod yn ddigon yn gyflym. Credaf fod hynny mwy na thebyg - . Nid wyf yn meddwl bod unrhyw un wedi beirniadu'r cyfeiriad y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn mynd iddo. Ni feirniadodd neb y ffaith bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn symud i leihau tlodi tanwydd. Maent yn symud i leihau carbon. Credaf mai pryder y pwyllgor - a gall unrhyw un o aelodau'r pwyllgor ddweud wrthyf os wyf yn anghywir - yw nad yw'n digwydd yn ddigon cyflym. Swyddi newydd - rydym wedi sôn llawer am y ffaith, ac rydym wedi cael Lee Waters, nad yw i mewn yma, yn dweud wrthym yn rheolaidd am effeithiau awtomatiaeth, ond bydd swyddi eraill yn cael eu creu. Bydd y gwaith ôl-osod yn annhebygol o fod wedi'i awtomeiddio, yn sicr yn y tymor byr. Felly, mae'n wirioneddol bwysig ein bod yn gwella sgiliau pobl i allu gwneud hyn. Soniodd Gareth Bennett ein bod angen sgiliau. Mae angen i'r colegau hyfforddi pobl, ond ni fydd pobl yn cael hyfforddiant, ni fydd colegau'n rhoi cyrsiau, oni bai eu bod yn gwybod bod yna farchnad a bod sicrwydd o barhad, y gwyddant - y bobl sy'n mynd ar gwrs hyfforddi - fod yna werth 10, 15 mlynedd o waith i'w ôl-osod, yn hytrach na bod newid polisi ymhen tair blynedd, newid cyfeiriad a bod eu sgiliau'n hen ffasiwn. Diolch i Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet am ei hymateb. Rwy'n croesawu llawer o'r sylwadau a wnaeth yn fawr. Ac mae nifer o wahanol ffyrdd o leihau allyriadau. Nid wyf yn gweld - ac efallai y gall Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet egluro wrthyf - pam y mae deiliadaeth yn effeithio ar y dull o ôl-osod. Gallaf ddeall sut y mae'r math o eiddo yn effeithio arno, ond ni allaf ddeall sut y byddai tŷ sy'n cael ei rentu'n breifat, neu sy'n eiddo i berchen-feddianwyr, neu i gymdeithas dai yn effeithio ar y math o ôl-osod y byddai ei angen arnoch. Efallai y gall y Cabinet - rwy'n eithaf hapus i dderbyn ymyriad i gael hynny wedi'i egluro i mi. Mae datgarboneiddio'n flaenoriaeth - a nododd Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet ostyngiadau. Rydym yn mynd i gael cerrig milltir a thargedau wedi'u gosod; credaf y byddai'r rhan fwyaf o'r Aelodau yma yn hoffi gwybod pryd. Ystyried safonau llymach - ie, dyna'r cyfeiriad rydym eisiau symud iddo. Adolygu Rhan L - credaf fod hynny'n rhywbeth sydd angen ei newid. Mae pawb ohonom yn croesawu Nyth ac Arbed 3, ac rwy'n siŵr y bydd pwy bynnag fydd yn sefyll yma mewn pum neu chwe blynedd yn croesawu Nyth ac Arbed 4. Ond ar ryw gam, mae angen inni fod yn gwneud cynnydd i'r fath raddau fel na fydd angen Nyth ac Arbed 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 a 10 arnom. Mae tlodi tanwydd yn broblem enfawr. Rwyf am orffen gyda hyn - stori am un o fy etholwyr. Mae'n mynd i'r gwely am 7 o'r gloch o'r nos gyda'i merch. Pam? Dyna'r unig ffordd y gallant gadw'n gynnes. Maent yn byw mewn tŷ ar rent preifat, mae'n debyg oherwydd eu bod yn gwario mwy ar gadw'n oer nag y mae'r rhan fwyaf o bobl yma'n ei wario ar eu tai i'w cadw'n gynnes. A chredaf mai dyna'r broblem. Mae gennym y lefel hon o dlodi tanwydd, a'r bobl dlotaf sy'n dioddef, nid yn unig oherwydd cost tanwydd, ond oherwydd y math o eiddo y maent yn byw ynddo - ffenestri sengl gyda bylchau sy'n golygu eu bod yn gwresogi'r byd yn dda iawn, ond heb fod cystal am wresogi eu tai eu hunain. O ddifrif, rhaid i dlodi tanwydd fod yn brif flaenoriaeth. Gwn fod Llywodraeth Cymru am ei leihau, ond mae angen inni fod yn wirioneddol ymrwymedig i'w ddileu.