English: Well, Llywydd, I feel sure that when the Member has an opportunity to study what has been agreed, that some of the anxiety he has expressed this afternoon will be assuaged. He is a reasonable individual, I know, and I genuinely believe that when he comes to look at the detail, some of the points that he has made he will feel can be regarded differently. He said that inversion of clause 11 was not enough, and of course he's right, and of course we agreed with that. And then he asked what had happened yesterday to reach such a rapid agreement. Yesterday was a very rapid day of to-ing and fro-ing between all three participants in the Joint Ministerial Committee. It was a judgment: it was a judgment that this Government made, that if we had not indicated yesterday that we were prepared to bring a legislative consent motion before this National Assembly, that everything that we had achieved during these negotiations, everything that I've set out this afternoon that is different and an advance for devolution on the original clause 11, that without an agreement with ourselves and without an agreement with the Scottish Government, the UK Government would simply revert to the original amendment that it had put down in the House of Lords. Everything that we had achieved, everything that the Scottish First Minister refers to as 'substantial advances': none of that would have been secured. And that's what changed yesterday: the statement from the Scottish Minister; further negotiations and discussions between ourselves and the UK Government; and the securing by this Government of everything that jointly we had secured over weeks and months of painful and detailed negotiation. I think that that is why I think of this as a major achievement. Dr Lloyd asked a very important question about who decides on the frameworks that will emerge as powers are handed back to the devolved administrations. Well, decision making will happen in two different ways. First of all, we have secured a parity set of arrangements in which all three - and if we have a devolved administration in Northern Ireland, all four - Governments will jointly work to secure those frameworks. It will not be a matter, as it far too often has been in the past, of the UK Government working on these things alone and producing a piece of paper at the eleventh hour and saying to us, 'There it is, you can have it if you want it.' No. This is completely different. We all work together on the frameworks, and that's how they are agreed. And then, who decides? The National Assembly for Wales decides. Because where these frameworks require a legislative underpinning, whether that is through primary or secondary legislation, the Sewel convention will apply. And that, as well, is a major step forward in this agreement. For the first time, Sewel is guaranteed in regulations. It's always applied to primary legislation, and it will if frameworks need primary legislation. Now, it will apply to frameworks that require regulation making as well, and that will come here, to the floor of this National Assembly to decide. That's why, in the end, if you are negotiating in good faith with other governments, trust has to be allowed to operate. It's not a trust, of course it's not a trust in the policy programme of a Government with which we have so many profound disagreements, but it is a trust-based arrangement between Governments when those arrangements are set out in legislation, when they are accompanied by an inter-governmental agreement, and to which all parties that are prepared and able to do so have formally and publicly signed up.
Welsh: Wel, Lywydd, rwy'n teimlo'n sicr pan fydd yr Aelod yn cael cyfle i astudio'r hyn a gytunwyd y bydd peth o'r pryder y mae wedi'i fynegi y prynhawn yma'n cael ei liniaru. Mae'n unigolyn rhesymol, rwy'n gwybod, ac rwy'n credu o ddifrif pan ddaw i edrych ar y manylion, y bydd yn teimlo y gall edrych yn wahanol ar rai o'r pwyntiau a wnaeth. Dywedodd nad oedd gwrthdroi cymal 11 yn ddigon, ac wrth gwrs mae'n iawn, ac wrth gwrs roeddem yn cytuno â hynny. Ac yna gofynnodd beth oedd wedi digwydd ddoe i ddod i gytundeb mor gyflym. Roedd ddoe yn ddiwrnod cyflym iawn o symud yn ôl ac ymlaen rhwng y tri chyfranogwr yn y Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion. Dyfarniad ydoedd: dyfarniad ar ran y Llywodraeth hon, pe na baem wedi dynodi ddoe ein bod yn barod i gyflwyno cynnig cydsyniad deddfwriaethol gerbron y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol hwn, y byddai popeth a gyflawnwyd gennym yn ystod y negodiadau hyn, popeth a amlinellais y prynhawn yma sy'n wahanol ac yn gam ymlaen i ddatganoli ar y cymal 11 gwreiddiol, heb gytundeb gyda ni a heb gytundeb gyda Llywodraeth yr Alban, y byddai Llywodraeth y DU yn dychwelyd at y gwelliant gwreiddiol a gyflwynodd yn Nhŷ'r Arglwyddi. Popeth a gyflawnwyd gennym, popeth y mae Prif Weinidog yr Alban yn cyfeirio atynt fel 'datblygiadau sylweddol': ni fyddai dim o hynny wedi'i sicrhau. A dyna a newidiodd ddoe: y datganiad gan Weinidog yr Alban; negodiadau a thrafodaethau pellach rhyngom ni a Llywodraeth y DU; a'r Llywodraeth hon yn sicrhau popeth a sicrhawyd gennym dros wythnosau a misoedd o negodi poenus a manwl. Credaf mai dyna pam yr ystyriaf hyn yn gyflawniad mawr. Gofynnodd Dr Lloyd gwestiwn pwysig iawn ynglŷn â phwy sy'n penderfynu ar y fframweithiau a ddaw i'r amlwg wrth i bwerau ddychwelyd i'r gweinyddiaethau datganoledig. Wel, bydd penderfyniadau'n digwydd mewn dwy ffordd wahanol. Yn gyntaf oll, rydym wedi sicrhau set gyfartal o drefniadau lle bydd y tair - ac os oes gennym weinyddiaeth ddatganoledig yng Ngogledd Iwerddon, pedair - Llywodraeth yn gweithio ar y cyd i sicrhau'r fframweithiau hynny. Ni fydd yn fater, fel sydd wedi digwydd yn rhy aml o lawer yn y gorffennol, o Lywodraeth y DU yn gweithio ar y pethau hyn ar ei phen ei hun a chynhyrchu darn o bapur ar yr unfed awr ar ddeg a dweud wrthym, 'Dyna fe, gallwch ei gael os ydych ei eisiau.' Na. Mae hyn yn hollol wahanol. Mae pawb ohonom yn gweithio gyda'n gilydd ar y fframweithiau, a dyna sut y cânt eu cytuno. Wedyn, pwy sy'n penderfynu? Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru sy'n penderfynu. Oherwydd lle bydd gofyn cael sail ddeddfwriaethol i'r fframweithiau hyn, boed drwy ddeddfwriaeth sylfaenol neu is-ddeddfwriaeth, cymhwysir Confensiwn Sewel. Ac mae hynny hefyd yn gam mawr ymlaen yn y cytundeb hwn. Am y tro cyntaf, caiff Sewel ei warantu yn y rheoliadau. Caiff ei gymhwyso i ddeddfwriaeth sylfaenol bob amser, a bydd yn digwydd os oes angen deddfwriaeth sylfaenol ar fframweithiau. Nawr, bydd yn gymwys i fframweithiau sy'n galw am wneud rheoliadau yn ogystal, a bydd hynny'n dod yma, i lawr y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol hwn i'w benderfynu. Dyna pam, yn y pen draw, os ydych yn negodi'n ddidwyll â llywodraethau eraill, rhaid caniatáu i ymddiriedaeth weithredu. Nid ymddiriedaeth ydyw, wrth gwrs, yn rhaglen bolisi Llywodraeth y cawsom gymaint o anghytundeb dwfn â hi, ond trefniant sy'n seiliedig ar ymddiriedaeth rhwng Llywodraethau pan fydd y trefniadau hynny wedi'u nodi mewn deddfwriaeth, pan geir cytundeb rhynglywodraethol i gyd-fynd â hwy y bydd pob parti sy'n barod ac yn abl i wneud hynny wedi'i gefnogi'n ffurfiol ac yn gyhoeddus.