English: I'd like to congratulate Suzy Davies for bringing this motion to annul today, and also for alerting me to this motion in the Chamber when I raised this, I think two weeks ago, at First Minister's questions, when I did bring it to the Chamber in another context. Generally, I support what Suzy has said about making it easier and more accessible for spokespeople and, indeed, other Assembly Members to note what is proposed, particularly when what is proposed is significant. In this case, I was aware of these regulations, hence why I raised them with the First Minister. I don't actually recall what it was I read, or what I saw that happened to make me aware of them - I'm very pleased I was. But I also support arrangements to make it easier for us to be aware of the important issues that we really should debate in this Chamber, as we are today, thank you to you, Suzy. I disagree, though, I think, with a couple of points that you raise - or I at least have a difference in emphasis. I would challenge the overall direction of travel from this Government in terms of school performance targets. I think there is a real issue in Wales, and a real issue - whether it's a Labour-led Government, or having a Lib Dem in the post, there may be differences of opinions. But there is a lack of accountability, there is a lack of ability for parents to make meaningful comparisons between schools, in a way that is taken for granted in England. And when you compare the trajectory and overall performance of the school system in England versus Wales, and note that that has taken place against a background where there has been significantly more information published in England, and presented in a way that parents and others, including elected representatives, can compare, to hold schools and Government to account - I think that is too much to consider that to be a coincidence. Suzy put the emphasis on the English or Welsh and the maths. And yes, that's part of the threshold too, but it's also five good GCSEs at grade C or above, including English or Welsh and maths. And it is that threshold that's perhaps been the key driver in terms of the targets that have been set in England, and have seen such performance in overall performances against those targets, but most especially in London. Unfortunately, we haven't seen that in Wales. And to move away from this, the one area where schools are required to set a target, on a specified threshold, where we can actually compare them, where there can be pressure put on different schools as to how they are doing, and why it's not better, or how it compares to other schools - . If we lose that, we lose a hugely important lever in driving up, hopefully, school performance. It hasn't been happening in Wales, and I fear that the key reason it hasn't been happening is the refusal to publish information on a consistent basis, to set targets on a consistent basis and to hold schools to account. I also think that the C/D threshold is a very important one. I have sympathy with arguments around gaming and I think particularly the early entry and the steps that the Minister has taken to at least limit that compared to what we were seeing are good. But actually if you get a C or a D it is very, very significant for that individual. In many jobs, you are required to have at least a level C pass at English or Welsh and maths, and if you don't have that, opportunities may not be available that otherwise would. So, actually, if there is a significant emphasis on schools on trying to get children through that to get five good GCSEs and make sure they're at least the level they need to have in those key subjects, then I think that's something to be welcomed. It is a target that we should have for schools. I greatly regret that the Government is proposing to do away with at least the compulsory setting of that target, and we look forward to supporting Suzy Davies's motion to annul.
Welsh: Hoffwn longyfarch Suzy Davies am gyflwyno'r cynnig hwn i ddirymu heddiw, a hefyd am dynnu fy sylw at y cynnig hwn yn y Siambr pan godais hyn, bythefnos yn ôl rwy'n credu, yn y cwestiynau i'r Prif Weinidog, pan ddeuthum ag ef i'r Siambr mewn cyd-destun arall. Yn gyffredinol, rwy'n cefnogi'r hyn a ddywedodd Suzy am ei gwneud yn haws ac yn fwy hygyrch i lefarwyr, ac yn wir, i Aelodau eraill y Cynulliad nodi'r hyn a gynigir, yn enwedig pan fo'r hyn a gynigir yn bwysig. Yn yr achos hwn, roeddwn yn ymwybodol o'r rheoliadau hyn, a dyna pam y'u codais gyda'r Prif Weinidog. Ni allaf gofio beth a ddarllenais, mewn gwirionedd, neu beth a welais a'm gwnaeth yn ymwybodol ohonynt - rwy'n falch iawn fod hynny wedi digwydd. Ond rwyf hefyd yn cefnogi trefniadau i'w gwneud yn haws i ni fod yn ymwybodol o'r materion pwysig y dylem eu trafod yn y Siambr hon, fel rydym yn ei wneud heddiw, diolch i chi, Suzy. Credaf fy mod yn anghytuno, fodd bynnag, gydag un neu ddau o'r pwyntiau a godwch - neu o leiaf mae fy mhwyslais yn wahanol. Buaswn yn herio cyfeiriad teithio cyffredinol y Llywodraeth hon o ran targedau perfformiad ysgolion. Credaf fod problem wirioneddol yng Nghymru, a phroblem wirioneddol - boed yn Llywodraeth Lafur, neu'r ffaith bod Democrat Rhyddfrydol yn y swydd, gall fod gwahaniaeth barn. Ond ceir diffyg atebolrwydd, diffyg gallu i rieni wneud cymariaethau ystyrlon rhwng ysgolion mewn ffordd sy'n cael ei chymryd yn ganiataol yn Lloegr. A phan fyddwch yn cymharu trywydd a pherfformiad cyffredinol y system ysgolion yn Lloegr o gymharu â Chymru, ac yn nodi bod hynny wedi digwydd yn erbyn cefndir lle mae mwy o wybodaeth o lawer wedi'i chyhoeddi yn Lloegr, a'i chyflwyno mewn ffordd lle gall rhieni ac eraill, gan gynnwys cynrychiolwyr etholedig, ei chymharu er mwyn dwyn ysgolion a'r Llywodraeth i gyfrif - credaf ei bod yn ormod ystyried bod hynny'n gyd-ddigwyddiad. Rhoddodd Suzy y pwyslais ar y Gymraeg neu'r Saesneg a mathemateg. Ac ydy, mae hynny'n rhan o'r trothwy hefyd, ond mae hefyd yn bum TGAU da ar radd C neu uwch, gan gynnwys Saesneg neu Gymraeg a mathemateg. A'r trothwy hwnnw, efallai, oedd y prif sbardun o ran y targedau a osodwyd yn Lloegr, ac sydd wedi arwain at berfformiad o'r fath mewn perfformiadau cyffredinol yn erbyn y targedau hynny, ond yn enwedig yn Llundain. Yn anffodus, nid ydym wedi gweld hynny yng Nghymru. A byddai symud oddi wrth hyn, yr un maes lle mae gofyn i ysgolion osod targed, ar drothwy penodedig, lle gallwn eu cymharu, lle gellir rhoi pwysau ar wahanol ysgolion o ran eu perfformiad, a pham nad yw'n well, neu sut y mae'n cymharu ag ysgolion eraill - . Os byddwn yn colli hynny, byddwn yn colli dull pwysig iawn o wella, gobeithio, perfformiad ysgolion. Nid yw hyn wedi bod yn digwydd yng Nghymru, ac rwy'n ofni mai'r rheswm allweddol nad yw wedi bod yn digwydd yw'r methiant i gyhoeddi gwybodaeth yn gyson, i osod targedau yn gyson ac i ddwyn ysgolion i gyfrif. Credaf hefyd fod y trothwy C/D yn un pwysig iawn. Cydymdeimlaf â'r dadleuon ynghylch chwarae'r system, ac yn benodol, credaf fod cyflwyno disgyblion yn gynnar ar gyfer arholiadau a'r camau y mae'r Gweinidog wedi'u cymryd i gyfyngu ar hynny o leiaf, o gymharu â'r hyn a welwn, yn dda. Ond mewn gwirionedd, os ydych yn cael C neu D, mae hynny'n bwysig iawn i'r unigolyn hwnnw. Mewn llawer o swyddi, mae'n ofynnol fod gennych lefel C o leiaf mewn Saesneg neu Gymraeg a mathemateg, ac os nad oes gennych hynny, efallai na fydd cyfleoedd ar gael a fyddai ar gael fel arall. Felly, mewn gwirionedd, os oes pwyslais sylweddol ar ysgolion i geisio sicrhau bod plant yn cael pum TGAU da a sicrhau eu bod o leiaf ar y lefel y mae angen iddynt fod arni yn y pynciau allweddol hynny, credaf fod hynny'n rhywbeth i'w groesawu. Mae'n darged y dylem ei gael ar gyfer ysgolion. Gresynaf yn fawr at y ffaith bod y Llywodraeth yn argymell cael gwared â'r gofyniad gorfodol i osod y targed hwnnw o leiaf, ac edrychwn ymlaen at gefnogi cynnig Suzy Davies i ddirymu.