English: I find myself agreeing also, like Jenny Rathbone, with the Conservatives in this debate. I know, a historical moment: the first time I've said those words. [ Laughter. ] But I think this shows that we can be united when things matter, and too much of our heritage has disappeared. Beautiful buildings across Wales have been left to rot until, inevitably, local planning authorities are told by developers that they cannot be saved. And Jenny Rathbone's point is extremely important in terms of the carbon emissions as well. We should be re-imagining these beautiful and historic buildings to give them a new lease of life. I am fed up of seeing, also, important buildings being listed, but not then being saved and protected, and left to rot. This is not acceptable. Whenever I travel into Cowbridge, I am always struck by the beauty of the buildings in question, which are reminiscent of Coed-y-Lan school near my home in Pontypridd, which has also been left to dilapidate. It's a very sad situation, and especially when you think about the history of this specific building. I won't repeat those statistics, but I agree with you, Joel: in terms of the role with women in science, this is a building that is of significance. And, clearly, I am not alone in my appreciation of the building and its historic significance. In fact, on the website set up by the campaign group, there is a list of 20 prominent historic buildings specialists, historians and architects, all of whom support listing the building and sensitively converting it. These include Dr Eurwyn Wiliam, former National Museum Wales historic building expert, former council member of the Historic Buildings Council for Wales and former chairman of the Royal Commission on the Ancient and Historical Monuments of Wales, and who has often advised Cadw on such matters. Yet, it seems that their views and those of local residents have been disregarded, leading to Cadw refusing to list the building. I understand all too well the need for affordable social housing in Cowbridge - a point made by the one letter I have received that supports the demolition of the building. But, as illustrated in the tens of letters I've received in support of saving the building, it isn't an either/or, and there is a way where we can achieve the best of both worlds: saving the building and converting and repurposing it. Save Britain's Heritage, working with the architect Philip Tilbury, has produced an alternative scheme, showing ample space to create 23 apartments within the school, as well as 12 new apartments and two new houses on the adjacent land. I urge the Deputy Minister to ask her officials to look further into this matter, as well as the alternative plans put forward. Historic Scotland and Historic England both have procedures established when there are such disputes, which allow for an independent external peer review in such circumstances - something that I believe is merited in this case. This is an opportunity to reimagine a historic building to meet local need. I very much support the petition and thank all constituents that have contacted me on this matter.
Welsh: Rwy'n cytuno hefyd, fel Jenny Rathbone, â'r Ceidwadwyr yn y ddadl hon. Rwy'n gwybod, eiliad hanesyddol: y tro cyntaf i mi ddweud y geiriau hynny. [ Chwerthin. ] Ond rwy'n credu bod hyn yn dangos y gallwn fod yn unedig pan fydd pethau'n bwysig, ac mae gormod o'n treftadaeth wedi diflannu. Mae adeiladau hardd ledled Cymru wedi cael eu gadael i bydru tan y bydd datblygwyr, yn anochel, yn dweud wrth awdurdodau cynllunio lleol na ellir eu hachub. Ac mae pwynt Jenny Rathbone yn eithriadol o bwysig am yr allyriadau carbon hefyd. Dylem fod yn ail-ddychmygu'r adeiladau hardd a hanesyddol hyn i roi bywyd newydd iddynt. Hefyd, rwyf wedi cael llond bol ar weld adeiladau pwysig yn cael eu rhestru, ond heb gael eu hachub a'u gwarchod wedyn, ac yn cael eu gadael i bydru. Nid yw hyn yn dderbyniol. Pryd bynnag y byddaf yn teithio i'r Bont-faen, mae harddwch yr adeiladau dan sylw bob amser yn creu argraff arnaf, adeiladau sy'n atgoffa o ysgol Coed-y-Lan ger fy nghartref ym Mhontypridd, sydd hefyd wedi'i gadael i ddadfeilio. Mae'n sefyllfa drist iawn, ac yn enwedig pan fyddwch yn meddwl am hanes yr adeilad penodol hwn. Nid af i ailadrodd yr ystadegau hynny, ond rwy'n cytuno â chi, Joel: mewn perthynas â rôl menywod mewn gwyddoniaeth, mae hwn yn adeilad o bwys. Ac yn amlwg, nid fi yw'r unig un sy'n gweld gwerth yr adeilad a'i arwyddocâd hanesyddol. Yn wir, ar y wefan a sefydlwyd gan y grŵp ymgyrchu, ceir rhestr o 20 o arbenigwyr blaenllaw ar adeiladau hanesyddol, haneswyr a phenseiri, a phob un ohonynt yn cefnogi rhestru'r adeilad a'i drawsnewid yn sensitif. Mae'r rhain yn cynnwys Dr Eurwyn Wiliam, arbenigwr ar adeiladau hanesyddol yn Amgueddfa Cymru yn flaenorol, cyn-aelod o Gyngor Adeiladau Hanesyddol Cymru a chyn-gadeirydd Comisiwn Brenhinol Henebion Cymru, sy'n aml wedi cynghori Cadw ar faterion o'r fath. Eto i gyd, mae'n ymddangos bod eu barn hwy a barn trigolion lleol wedi'u diystyru, gan arwain at Cadw yn gwrthod rhestru'r adeilad. Deallaf yn iawn yr angen am dai cymdeithasol fforddiadwy yn y Bont-faen - pwynt a wnaed gan yr un llythyr a gefais sy'n cefnogi dymchwel yr adeilad. Ond fel y dangosir yn y degau o lythyrau a gefais yn cefnogi achub yr adeilad, nid yw'n fater o naill ai/neu, ac mae yna ffordd y gallwn gyflawni'r gorau o'r ddau fyd: achub yr adeilad a'i addasu at ddiben gwahanol. Mae Save Britain's Heritage, sy'n gweithio gyda'r pensaer Philip Tilbury, wedi cynhyrchu cynllun amgen, sy'n dangos digon o le i greu 23 o fflatiau o fewn yr ysgol, yn ogystal â 12 o fflatiau newydd a dau dŷ newydd ar y tir cyfagos. Rwy'n annog y Dirprwy Weinidog i ofyn i'w swyddogion ymchwilio ymhellach i'r mater hwn, yn ogystal â'r cynlluniau amgen a gyflwynwyd. Mae gan Historic Scotland a Historic England weithdrefnau sefydledig pan geir anghydfodau tebyg i hyn, sy'n caniatáu ar gyfer adolygiad annibynnol gan gymheiriaid allanol mewn amgylchiadau o'r fath - rhywbeth y credaf y byddai o fudd yn yr achos hwn. Dyma gyfle i ail-ddychmygu adeilad hanesyddol i ddiwallu anghenion lleol. Rwy'n cefnogi'r ddeiseb yn bendant iawn ac yn diolch i'r holl etholwyr sydd wedi cysylltu â mi ar y mater hwn.