English: Can I thank the Minister for bringing forward this important debate and also put on record my thanks to the children's commissioner, Sally Holland, and her team for the excellent work that they do on behalf of children and young people here in Wales? I think it's a sad fact that, in 2018, many children and young people in our country don't enjoy the same safety and privileges that we in this Chamber were blessed to be growing up with. So, I welcome some of the key recommendations in Sally Holland's report, which of course were aimed at getting vulnerable young people and children access to the help and support that they need. I did note the references that the commissioner made to the work of the Children, Young People and Education Committee on mental health, and I think it is important that we ensure that there is access, as Suzy Davies has quite rightly said, to ensure that people can get access to those services in a very timely manner. And I picked up of course on her references to bullying also and the need to ensure that that is tackled, quite rightly as has already been discussed this afternoon. But, Presiding Officer, we've got much to do for our children and young people. The youngsters of today are the Assembly Members of tomorrow, and we must ask ourselves what legacy we are leaving to them. Will they be looking back in gratitude when they sit in this Chamber in the future or will they be wishing that we had done more? A key part of our advocacy will be making the right policy decisions. When there is so much to do it's vital that we do the right thing for our children and young people, and I have to say that one thing I'm disappointed about in the commissioner's report is the recommendation to remove the defence of reasonable chastisement. It seems to me to be the wrong course of action when you consider the actual harms that children are indeed facing. The report states that children in Wales do not have equal protection from assault in law compared to adults, but, of course, that is misleading and inaccurate. The law clearly protects young children and all children, indeed, from violence, but it also recognises that light physical discipline, such as a smack on the hand or the backside, should not be a criminal offence. And removing the defence of reasonable chastisement, I think, will destroy this distinction and leave many loving parents across Wales who smack their children at risk of arrest, conviction and even prosecution. The report goes on to say, of course, that the Government has an obligation to take action where there's a potential risk of harm to children in Wales, and I agree with that absolutely. But there are people out there who do abuse children, and we should be empowering social services and the police to track them down and bring them to justice, not wasting the time of the police and social services by sending them after ordinary, hard-working mums and dads who choose to occasionally smack their children as a form of discipline. The evidence does not show that light smacking does any harm to children. The Government consultation on abolishing reasonable chastisement admits this. In fact, it stated, and I quote: 'there is unlikely to be any research evidence which specifically shows the effects of a light and infrequent smack as being harmful to children.' And I would urge all of the Assembly Members present in this Chamber to read the work of Professor Robert Larzelere, one of the leading academics in this area of child discipline. His evidence to the Government's consultation on this matter is very compelling. So, will the Government also commit to following that evidence on this matter, rather than trying to take up what they believe is a fashionable thing? And I have to contend that it's not particularly fashionable either. We know that the results of a Welsh poll back in 2017 concluded that 76 per cent of the Welsh public don't think that smacking should be a criminal offence; 77 per cent are concerned that a smacking ban may well flood the police and social workers with trivial cases and make it more difficult for them to target their resources, their limited resources, to stop serious child abusers; and 77 per cent of the Welsh public also think that it should be the role of parents and guardians, not the state, to decide whether to smack their children. So, I think it is absolutely vital that we do what we can to improve the lot of children and young people here in Wales and that we pursue measures that will genuinely help children, but this particular proposal, in terms of a smacking ban, is not the right way forward, and I would urge the Minister in his response to consider the weight of evidence, which is absolutely against the Government's plans.
Welsh: Diolch i'r Gweinidog am gyflwyno'r ddadl bwysig hon, ac rwyf hefyd am ddiolch ar goedd i'r Comisiynydd Plant, Sally Holland, a'i thîm am y gwaith ardderchog y maen nhw'n ei wneud ar ran plant a phobl ifanc yma yng Nghymru? Rwy'n credu ei bod yn ffaith drist, yn 2018, bod llawer o blant a phobl ifanc yn ein gwlad nad ydynt yn mwynhau'r un diogelwch a breintiau a gawsom ni yn y Siambr hon wrth i ni dyfu'n oedolion. Felly, rwyf yn croesawu rhai o'r argymhellion allweddol yn adroddiad Sally Holland, a oedd wrth gwrs â'r nod o'i gwneud hi'n bosibl i bobl ifanc a phlant sy'n agored i niwed gael y cymorth a'r gefnogaeth sydd eu hangen arnynt. Nodais y cyfeiriadau a wnaed gan y Comisiynydd i waith y Pwyllgor Plant, Pobl Ifanc ac Addysg ar iechyd meddwl, ac mae'n bwysig ein bod yn sicrhau bod mynediad, fel y dywedodd Suzy Davies yn hollol gywir, i sicrhau y gall pobl gael gafael ar y gwasanaethau hynny mewn modd prydlon iawn. Ac fe sylwais wrth gwrs ar ei chyfeiriadau at fwlio hefyd a'r angen i sicrhau ein bod yn mynd i'r afael â hynny, yn gwbl briodol fel y trafodwyd eisoes y prynhawn yma. Ond, Llywydd, mae gennym ni lawer i'w wneud ar gyfer ein plant a'n pobl ifanc. Pobl ifanc heddiw yw Aelodau'r Cynulliad yfory, ac mae'n rhaid inni ofyn i ni'n hunain beth yw'r etifeddiaeth yr ydym yn ei adael iddyn nhw. A fyddan nhw'n edrych yn ôl gyda diolch pan fyddan nhw'n eistedd yn y Siambr hon yn y dyfodol neu a fyddan nhw'n dymuno i ni fod wedi gwneud mwy? Rhan allweddol o'n heiriolaeth fydd gwneud y penderfyniadau polisi cywir. Pan fo cymaint i'w wneud, y mae'n hanfodol inni wneud yr hyn sy'n iawn ar gyfer ein plant a'n pobl ifanc, ac mae'n rhaid imi ddweud mai un peth sydd wedi fy siomi yn adroddiad y Comisiynydd yw'r argymhelliad i ddileu'r amddiffyniad o gosb resymol. I mi dyma'r camau gweithredu anghywir pan ystyriwch y niwed gwirioneddol sy'n wynebu plant. Dywed yr adroddiad nad yw plant yng Nghymru, o dan y gyfraith yn cael eu diogelu rhag ymosodiad yn yr un modd ag oedolion, ond, wrth gwrs, mae hynny'n anghywir ac yn gamarweiniol. Mae'r gyfraith yn amlwg yn diogelu plant ifanc a phob plentyn, mewn gwirionedd, rhag trais, ond y mae hefyd yn cydnabod na ddylid ystyried disgyblu corfforol ysgafn, megis slap ar y llaw neu chwip-din, yn drosedd. A bydd cael gwared ar yr amddiffyniad o gosb resymol, rwy'n credu, yn cymylu'r gwahaniaeth hwn a gadael llawer o rieni cariadus ledled Cymru sy'n smacio eu plant, mewn perygl o gael eu harestio, eu collfarnu a hyd yn oed eu herlyn. Aiff yr adroddiad ymlaen i ddweud, wrth gwrs, bod gan y Llywodraeth ymrwymiad i gymryd camau pan fo perygl posibl o niwed i blant yng Nghymru, ac rwy'n cytuno'n llwyr â hynny. Ond fe geir pobl sydd yn cam-drin plant, a dylem ni rymuso ein gwasanaethau cymdeithasol a'r heddlu i ddod o hyd iddyn nhw a'u dwyn i gyfraith, yn hytrach na gwastraffu amser yr heddlu a'r gwasanaethau cymdeithasol drwy eu hanfon ar ôl tadau a mamau cyffredin, sy'n gweithio'n galed ac yn dewis weithiau i smacio eu plant fel math o ddisgyblaeth. Nid yw'r dystiolaeth yn dangos bod smacio ysgafn yn gwneud unrhyw niwed i blant. Mae ymgynghoriad y Llywodraeth ar ddiddymu cosb resymol yn cyfaddef hyn. Yn wir, dywedodd, a dyfynnaf: 'mae'n annhebygol y ceir unrhyw dystiolaeth ymchwil sy'n benodol yn dangos bod effeithiau smac ysgafn ac anfynych yn niweidiol i blant.' Ac fe fyddwn i'n annog holl Aelodau'r Cynulliad sy'n bresennol yn y Siambr hon i ddarllen gwaith yr Athro Robert Larzelere, un o'r academyddion blaenllaw yn y maes hwn o ddisgyblu plant. Mae ei dystiolaeth i ymgynghoriad y Llywodraeth ar y mater hwn yn rymus iawn. Felly, a wnaiff y Llywodraeth hefyd ymrwymo i ddilyn y dystiolaeth honno ar y mater hwn, yn hytrach nag ymgymryd â'r hyn sydd yn ei barn hi yn rhywbeth ffasiynol? Ac mae'n rhaid imi ddadlau hefyd nad yw'n arbennig o ffasiynol ychwaith. Rydym ni'n gwybod bod canlyniadau pôl yng Nghymru yn ôl yn 2017 wedi dangos nad yw 76 y cant o'r cyhoedd yng Nghymru yn credu y dylid gwneud smacio yn drosedd; mae 77 y cant yn pryderu y gallai gwahardd smacio orlwytho heddlu a gweithwyr cymdeithasol ag achosion dibwys a'i gwneud yn fwy anodd iddyn nhw dargedu eu hadnoddau, eu hadnoddau prin, i atal y camdrinwyr plant mwyaf difrifol; ac mae 77 y cant o bobl Cymru yn credu hefyd mai swyddogaeth rhieni a gwarcheidwaid, nid y wladwriaeth, yw penderfynu smacio eu plant neu beidio. Rwy'n credu felly, ei bod yn gwbl hanfodol inni wneud ein gorau glas i wella byd plant a phobl ifanc yma yng Nghymru a'n bod yn mynd ar drywydd mesurau sydd o ddifrif yn helpu plant, ond nid y cynnig penodol hwn, o ran gwahardd smacio plant, yw'r ffordd iawn ymlaen, ac fe fyddwn i'n annog y Gweinidog, yn ei ymateb, i ystyried yr holl dystiolaeth, sy'n bendant yn erbyn cynlluniau'r Llywodraeth.