English: I thank Members for their comments and I recognise that we may rehearse a number of points in the next groups of amendments. I want to return directly to the points made about the independence or otherwise of the citizen voice body, as opposed to the current community health councils. Hearing the phrase, 'however you spin it, you can't have a body having its independence questioned', well, actually, if we look at the current group of community health councils that are being lionised by Members in this Chamber for their independence, it is worth us reflecting on the fact that they are a hosted body by Powys health board. The staff of community health councils are employees of Powys health board. We are creating a separate body where the leadership will be appointed through a public appointments process overseen by the Commissioner for Public Appointments. That is significantly more independent than the current process. Now, people may disagree with that, but to try and suggest that this somehow introduces an extra element of Government control just doesn't hold water from a logical point of view, and if you think about our current public appointments process, think about our commissioners, appointed by the Government. Well, I have never thought that any of the commissioners we have, whether the children's commissioner, the older person's commissioner or the future generations commissioner, ever felt restrained in the comments they wanted to make about the Government in public or private, and I can tell you that from a fairly long experience of dealing with people who've held all of those roles. I'm happy to take an intervention when I complete -
Welsh: Diolch i'r Aelodau am eu sylwadau ac rwy'n cydnabod y gallwn ni ailadrodd nifer o bwyntiau yn y grwpiau nesaf o welliannau. Rwyf eisiau dychwelyd yn uniongyrchol at y pwyntiau a wnaed am annibyniaeth neu ddiffyg annibyniaeth corff llais y dinesydd, yn hytrach na'r cynghorau iechyd cymuned presennol. Wrth glywed yr ymadrodd, 'pa ffordd bynnag yr ydych yn ei ddehongli, ni allwch gael sefyllfa lle caiff annibyniaeth corff ei amau', wel, mewn gwirionedd, os edrychwn ni ar y grŵp presennol o gynghorau iechyd cymuned sy'n cael eu canmol i'r cymylau gan Aelodau yn y Siambr hon am eu hannibyniaeth, mae'n werth inni fyfyrio ar y ffaith mai corff a gynhelir gan fwrdd iechyd Powys ydyw. Caiff staff cynghorau iechyd cymuned eu cyflogi gan fwrdd iechyd Powys. Rydym yn creu corff ar wahân lle penodir yr arweinyddiaeth drwy broses o benodiadau cyhoeddus a oruchwylir gan y Comisiynydd Penodiadau Cyhoeddus. Mae hynny'n llawer mwy annibynnol na'r broses bresennol. Nawr, efallai bod pobl yn anghytuno â hynny, ond nid yw ceisio awgrymu bod hyn rywsut yn cyflwyno elfen ychwanegol o reolaeth gan y Llywodraeth yn dal dŵr o safbwynt rhesymegol, ac os ydych chi'n meddwl am ein proses bresennol o benodiadau cyhoeddus, meddyliwch am ein comisiynwyr, a benodir gan y Llywodraeth. Wel, nid wyf erioed wedi credu bod unrhyw un o'r comisiynwyr sydd gennym ni, boed y comisiynydd plant, y comisiynydd pobl hŷn na chomisiynydd cenedlaethau'r dyfodol, wedi teimlo eu bod yn cael eu ffrwyno erioed o ran y sylwadau yr oeddent eisiau eu gwneud am y Llywodraeth yn gyhoeddus neu'n breifat, a gallaf ddweud hynny wrthych o brofiad gweddol hir o ymdrin â phobl sydd wedi bod ym mhob un o'r swyddi hynny. Rwy'n hapus i dderbyn ymyriad ar ôl cwblhau -