English: So, I want to reiterate, really, many of the points that have been made here by my colleagues today. But, in particular, two weeks ago - I think it was about two weeks ago - David Ramsbotham, the former chief inspector of prisons, talked about this issue on Sunday Supplement. I believe David Rees was on the same programme. His remarks, unfortunately, were misinterpreted by the media, and they were reported as saying it was a call for a women's prison here in Wales, which is exactly the opposite of what he said. Certainly, the last thing that we want is a women's prison here in Wales, because there's absolutely no doubt that the number of women who are at such a risk to the public that they need to be locked up, with all the consequent trauma to their families, is just not sufficient to justify a women's prison in Wales. In fact, the number that are actually a risk to society is probably one or two. So, I think it is absolutely essential that we move away from this misconception that having a women's prison here in Wales would be a good thing for women, because as far as I'm concerned, it would set back the cause of penal reform hugely were we to have a women's prison here in Wales, and would certainly have to be filled up with women from England in a way that would mean that they wouldn't be able to have any chance of having close family links. What David Ramsbotham was actually calling for was women's centres, which have been mentioned here by a number of contributors today. We've never had one of this particular type of women's centre here in Wales, but there have been a number in England. They have been evaluated, they do appear to work, and evidence-based policy development would mean that we would develop these women's centres in Wales. I would like to see the opportunity for that to happen. It's worth restating that, in fact, women make up only 5 per cent of the overall prison population, and the vast majority only serve very short sentences. The issue of women prisoners is a graspable policy. The numbers are not so great that you struggle to make a change. It is possible to change the policy for women prisoners, and many of the issues that apply to women prisoners also apply to male prisoners. I think if we could make the move with women's prisons, that would lead us on to do the same with male prisons, because I do want to reiterate the fact of the mental health issues, because I think that is so important. We know that the vast majority of prisoners do have mental health issues that have got to be addressed. I think we have to go back to the effect on children. We've been told by Jenny Rathbone about the thousands of children - I know the Prison Reform Trust have put forward a figure of thousands of children who are affected by custodial sentences - and 95 per cent of them have to leave their homes if their mother's imprisonment leaves them without an adult to take care of them. So, there is huge disruption to family life. I don't think we can reiterate that enough. The evidence as far as I'm concerned on women's centres is clear and compelling. They're important for maintaining family links, we know that the reoffending rate is lower, and, in fact, they cost less than the very expensive option of building prisons. So, I hope that we will get criminal justice devolved to Wales. It was recommended in the Silk report, and we haven't seen much sign of it happening since then, but I think it is something that we could tackle and where we could make a real change. Jenny mentioned the Visiting Mum project, and I just want to briefly end by saying that I took part in one of the visits to Eastwood Park. I went with the Visiting Mum volunteers who take the children to Eastwood Park, and I can't tell you how heartbreaking it was actually to see those children being reunited with their mothers in a room that wasn't like a prison, where they had toys, where they had food, where every effort was made by the project to ensure that there were two hours when they could have a normal relationship with their mother. But seeing that, I thought that, really, nothing can justify this. When you saw the reasons why those women were in prison, it is just not justified them being there.
Welsh: Felly, rwyf am ailadrodd llawer o'r pwyntiau a wnaed yma gan fy nghyd-Aelodau heddiw. Ond yn benodol, bythefnos yn ôl - credaf mai tua phythefnos yn ôl oedd hi - soniodd David Ramsbotham, y cyn-brif arolygydd carchardai, am y mater hwn ar Sunday Supplement. Rwy'n credu bod David Rees ar yr un rhaglen. Yn anffodus, cafodd ei sylwadau eu camddehongli gan y cyfryngau, a dywedwyd eu bod yn dweud mai galwad oedd hi am garchar i fenywod yma yng Nghymru, sef y gwrthwyneb llwyr i'r hyn a ddywedodd. Yn sicr, y peth olaf a ddymunwn yw carchar i fenywod yma yng Nghymru, oherwydd yn ddiamau, nid yw nifer y menywod sy'n creu'r fath berygl i'r cyhoedd fel bod angen iddynt fod dan glo, gyda'r holl drawma i'w teuluoedd o ganlyniad i hynny, yn ddigon i gyfiawnhau carchar i fenywod yng Nghymru. Mewn gwirionedd, mae'r nifer sy'n berygl i gymdeithas yn un neu ddwy yn ôl pob tebyg. Felly, rwy'n credu ei bod yn gwbl hanfodol ein bod yn symud oddi wrth y camsyniad hwn y byddai cael carchar i fenywod yma yng Nghymru yn beth da i fenywod, oherwydd yn fy marn i, byddai'n atal y broses o ddiwygio'r system gosbi yn helaeth pe bai gennym garchar i fenywod yma yng Nghymru, a byddai'n rhaid ei lenwi â menywod o Loegr mewn ffordd a fyddai'n sicr yn golygu na fyddai unrhyw obaith iddynt hwy gael cysylltiad agos â'u teuluoedd. Yr hyn y galwodd David Ramsbotham amdano mewn gwirionedd oedd canolfannau i fenywod, sydd wedi'u crybwyll yma gan nifer o gyfranwyr heddiw. Ni chawsom ganolfan i fenywod o'r math arbennig hwn yng Nghymru erioed, ond gwelwyd nifer ohonynt yn Lloegr. Maent wedi cael eu gwerthuso, ymddengys eu bod yn gweithio, a byddai datblygu polisi yn seiliedig ar dystiolaeth yn golygu y byddem yn datblygu'r canolfannau menywod hyn yng Nghymru. Hoffwn weld cyfle i hynny ddigwydd. Mae'n werth ailddatgan, mewn gwirionedd, mai 5 y cant yn unig o holl boblogaeth y carchardai sy'n fenywod, ac nid yw'r mwyafrif helaeth ond yn bwrw dedfryd fer iawn. Mae mater carcharorion benywaidd yn bolisi sydd o fewn gafael. Nid yw'r niferoedd mor fawr fel eich bod yn cael trafferth i newid. Mae'n bosibl newid y polisi ar gyfer carcharorion benywaidd, ac mae llawer o'r materion sy'n berthnasol i garcharorion benywaidd hefyd yn berthnasol i garcharorion gwrywaidd. Pe gallem sicrhau newid gyda charchardai i fenywod, rwy'n credu y byddai hynny'n ein harwain i wneud yr un peth gyda charchardai i ddynion, oherwydd hoffwn ailadrodd y ffaith am broblemau iechyd meddwl, oherwydd rwy'n credu ei fod mor bwysig. Gwyddom fod gan y mwyafrif helaeth o garcharorion broblemau iechyd meddwl sy'n rhaid rhoi sylw iddynt. Rwy'n meddwl bod yn rhaid inni ddychwelyd at yr effaith ar blant. Dywedodd Jenny Rathbone wrthym am y miloedd o blant - gwn fod Ymddiriedolaeth Diwygio'r Carchardai wedi cyflwyno ffigur o filoedd o blant yr effeithir arnynt gan ddedfrydau o garchar - ac mae 95 y cant ohonynt yn gorfod gadael eu cartrefi os yw carchariad eu mam yn eu gadael heb oedolyn i ofalu amdanynt. Felly, ceir amharu enfawr ar fywyd y teulu. Nid wyf yn credu y gallwn ailadrodd hynny ddigon. Yn fy marn i, mae'r dystiolaeth ynghylch canolfannau menywod yn glir ac yn rymus. Maent yn bwysig ar gyfer cynnal cysylltiadau teuluol, gwyddom fod y gyfradd aildroseddu'n is, ac yn wir, maent yn costio llai na'r opsiwn drud iawn o adeiladu carchardai. Felly, rwy'n gobeithio y bydd cyfiawnder troseddol yn cael ei ddatganoli i Gymru. Argymhellwyd hynny yn adroddiad Silk, ac nid ydym wedi gweld llawer o arwydd o hynny'n digwydd ers hynny, ond mae'n rhywbeth y gallem fynd i'r afael ag ef ac yn rhywbeth lle y gallem sicrhau newid go iawn. Soniodd Jenny am y prosiect Ymweld â Mam, a hoffwn orffen yn fyr drwy ddweud fy mod wedi cymryd rhan yn un o'r ymweliadau i Eastwood Park. Euthum gyda gwirfoddolwyr Ymweld â Mam sy'n mynd â'r plant i Eastwood Park, ac ni allaf ddweud wrthych pa mor dorcalonnus oedd gweld y plant hynny'n cael eu haduno gyda'u mamau mewn ystafell nad oedd fel carchar, lle roedd ganddynt deganau, lle roedd ganddynt fwyd, lle y gwnaed pob ymdrech gan y prosiect i sicrhau bod yna ddwy awr pan allent gael perthynas normal gyda'u mam. Ond wrth weld hynny, roeddwn yn meddwl na all dim gyfiawnhau hyn mewn gwirionedd. Pan welech y rhesymau pam roedd y menywod hynny yn y carchar, ni ellir cyfiawnhau eu bod yno o gwbl.