techiaith/cofnodycynulliad_en-cy huggingface dataset:
English: It's about ensuring that new providers find a space in this environment of public service broadcasting and that the system continues to be transformed. We want to ensure that the system is sustainable, that it provides for audiences over the coming years, but I think that it is important to note that any new providers in this environment - that there is new funding that comes with those new providers, that we don't cut what is available to the current broadcasters in welcoming those new players into the environment. The issue is to ensure that there are more providers being able to provide some of the genres that aren't as prominent as that, perhaps, and that we then ensure that there is close collaboration between the broadcasters as well.
Welsh: Mae hi'n ymwneud â sicrhau bod dyfodiaid newydd yn cael lle yn yr amgylchedd ddarlledu gwasanaeth cyhoeddus a bod y system yn parhau i drawsnewid. Rŷn ni eisiau sicrhau bod y system yn gynaliadwy, ei fod e'n darparu ar gyfer cynulleidfaoedd dros y blynyddoedd nesaf, ond dwi'n credu ei bod hi'n bwysig nodi bod unrhyw newydd-ddyfodiad i mewn i'r system ddarlledu gwasanaeth cyhoeddus - bod yna arian newydd yn dod gyda fe, ein bod ni ddim yn cwtogi ar yr hyn sydd ar gael i'r darlledwyr presennol wrth groesawu chwaraewyr newydd i mewn i'r amgylchedd. Dyna'r broblem: sicrhau bod mwy o ddarparwyr, efallai, yn gallu mynd i'r afael â rhai o'r genres sydd ddim mor amlwg â hynny, efallai, a'n bod ni'n sicrhau bod yna gydweithio agos rhwng y darlledwyr.
English: Thank you very much for that, Elinor. I'm sorry, but we've run out of time. We've heard a great deal of information. A draft of the transcript will be sent to you; if you could check that for accuracy. Perhaps there may be some things that we will want to catch up with you on via letter, but thank you very much for joining us today. I'm sure we'll be in touch very soon. Members, we will take a short break now. Can I ask all of you to return by a quarter past, please? We will go into private during the break.
Welsh: Diolch yn fawr iawn am hynna, Elinor. Mae'n flin gen i, ond rŷn ni mas o amser. Dŷn ni wedi cael lot o wybodaeth i mewn yn fanna. Bydd drafft o'r transgript yn cael ei ddanfon atoch chi; os allech chi wirio hynny, plis. Efallai bydd yna rai pethau y byddwn ni eisiau dal lan gyda chi arnyn nhw drwy lythyr, ond diolch yn fawr iawn ichi am ddod atom ni heddiw. Rwy'n siŵr byddwn ni mewn cysylltiad yn fuan iawn. Aelodau, byddwn ni'n cymryd egwyl fach. Allaf i ofyn ein bod ni'n dod nôl erbyn chwarter wedi, os gwelwch yn dda? Byddwn ni'n symud i mewn i breifat yn ystod yr egwyl.
English: Welcome back to this session this morning. We're moving on to item 3, which is a session with the public service broadcasters in Wales. May I ask the witnesses to introduce themselves for the Record please? I'll go to Rhuanedd Richards first.
Welsh: Croeso nôl i'r sesiwn yma'r bore yma. Dŷn ni'n symud ymlaen at eitem 3, sef sesiwn gyda'r darlledwyr gwasanaeth cyhoeddus yng Nghymru. A gaf i ofyn i'r tystion plîs i gyflwyno'u hunain ar gyfer y Cofnod? Fe wnaf i fynd at Rhuanedd Richards yn gyntaf.
English: Good morning. I'm Rhuanedd Richards. I'm director of programmes and services for BBC Cymru Wales.
Welsh: Helo. Bore da. Rhuanedd Richards ydw i, cyfarwyddwr gwasanaethau a chynnwys BBC Cymru.
English: Good morning. Thank you for the invitation to come here this morning.
Welsh: Bore da, a diolch am y gwahoddiad i ddod yma heddiw.
English: Hello. I'm Owen Evans. Thank you for the welcome. I'm the chief executive of S4C.
Welsh: Helo. Owen Evans. Diolch am y croeso. Prif weithredwr S4C.
English: Great. Thank you very much for that. We have a whole host of issues that we want to discuss with you this morning. So, if I could ask for responses that are as succinct as possible please, and I'll ask a question to begin with. A number - [ Interruption.] If it's possible, when you want to speak, would you just raise your hand physically, please? You've now been muted. That's excellent. Thank you. What changes in terms of what has been proposed recently by Ofcom will be most far-reaching, most significant for audiences in Wales? I'll go to Owen first of all. No, I see that Phil has put his hand up. Right, we'll go to Phil, then to Owen, and then to Rhuanedd.
Welsh: Grêt. Diolch yn fawr iawn i chi am hynny. Mae gennym ni nifer fawr iawn o bynciau dŷn ni eisiau eu codi gyda chi'r bore yma. Felly, os gallwn ni ofyn am atebion mor fyr ag y maen nhw'n gallu bod, mor gryno â phosibl, ac fe wnaf i ofyn cwestiwn i gychwyn. Mae nifer - [ Torri ar draws.] Ydy e'n bosibl, plîs, os dŷch chi eisiau siarad, ichi jest godi llaw am nawr? Dŷch chi wedi cael eich 'mute-io'; mae hynny'n ffantastig. Pa newidiadau o ran beth sydd wedi cael ei grybwyll yn ddiweddar gan Ofcom fydd yn fwyaf pellgyrhaeddol, yn fwyaf arwyddocaol ar gyfer cynulleidfaoedd yng Nghymru? Mi wnaf i fynd at Owen yn gyntaf. Na, mae Phil wedi rhoi ei law i fyny. Ocê, mi wnawn ni fynd at Phil, wedyn at Owen, a wedyn at Rhuanedd. Phil.
English: Thank you, Phil. Owen.
Welsh: Diolch, Phil. Owen.
English: Thank you very much. I would echo what Phil has said of course. But, looking forward, viewing patterns are changing. The way that older people still access broadcasting is quite traditional, but people my age and younger, and then very young people, are very diverse in their habits, and one of the things that's very difficult to think about for the future is how people are going to access Welsh content, particularly through the medium of Welsh in future. Ofcom has done a good job I think in terms of linear and the electronic programme guide, where they've ensured that our brands as PSBs are visible. But, in future, if you imagine a world where brands or tiles or apps for S4C, ITV and BBC are just not available to people, and that the major players - from the United States usually, but we'll see what happens with China as well - mean there is no opportunity for people to find the content in the first instance. And the example that Phil mentioned of, 'Do a search for 'Wales' and find marine mammals', might well be possible in future. And what we're now seeing is that there are areas where these corporations could take over just snippets of what the PSBs are doing in Wales. And the important question for politicians is, are those little snippets enough for the audience? Because, as Phil said, all of us here today have very strong audiences in Wales today, but, step by step, these major players might divorce us from the audiences that we are trying to reach.
Welsh: Diolch yn fawr. Buaswn i'n amlwg yn atgyfnerthu beth mae Phil wedi'i ddweud. Ond, o edrych ymlaen, mae patrymau gwylio yn newid. Mae ffordd pobl hŷn, wrth gwrs, yn dal i fod yn eithaf traddodiadol, ond mae ffordd pobl fy oedran i ac iau, a wedyn pobl ifanc iawn, yn wasgaredig iawn. Ac un o'r pethau sy'n anodd iawn i feddwl amdano at y dyfodol yw sut mae pobl yn mynd i ddod at gynnwys Cymreig, ac yn enwedig yn yr iaith Gymraeg yn y dyfodol. Mae Ofcom wedi gwneud jobyn da, rwy'n credu, o gwmpas yr EPG a llinol, ble maen nhw wedi gwneud yn siŵr bod ein brandiau ni fel PSBs yn weledol. Ond, i'r dyfodol, os gallwch chi ddychmygu byd ble dyw brandiau neu apiau neu deils S4C, BBC, ITV jest ddim ar gael i bobl, a bod y cwmnïau mawr - o'r Unol Daleithiau fel arfer, ond cawn ni weld beth ddigwyddiff yn Tsieina a llefydd fel hynny yn y byd, i ddod - yn golygu does dim siawns i bobl ffeindio cynnwys yn y lle cyntaf. Mae'r esiampl roedd Phil yn sôn amboutu, ' Do a search for 'Wales' and find marine mammals ', yn hollol bosib yn y dyfodol. A beth dŷn ni'n ei weld hefyd yw bod yna gamau nawr ble gall y cwmnïau yma ddechrau cymryd drosodd jest snips bach o beth mae'r PSBs yn ei wneud yng Nghymru. A'r cwestiwn pwysig i wleidyddion wedyn yw, a yw'r snips yna'n ddigon o gynulleidfa? Achos fel y dywedodd Phil, mae pob un ohonom ni yma heddiw â chynulleidfaoedd cryf yng Nghymru heddiw, ond mae'n bosib, fesul cam, y gwnaiff y cwmnïau yma ein pellhau ni oddi wrth y gynulleidfa dŷn ni'n trio mynd ati.
English: Well, there's a danger that we'll all be in agreement here. But there's a major number of these proposed changes that are important for the audiences in Wales, because they deal directly with the choices in terms of content in the services that are available for the people of Wales, and involved with how audiences in Wales, as Owen and Phil said, can access content that reflects their interests, their ways of living, and content that's relevant to their lives. And the context is important here: the success of PSBs on these isles is a cause of envy across the world. And I think the message here is that the current system of public bodies working side by side with commercial providers does work well for audiences, but we need a system that has been reformed for the market as it currently is. We've talked about the major structural change that we're seeing in the media world. We can talk about our own personal experiences in that regard - my children too; they only watch sport on linear television. The change is vast, and audiences in Wales are part of that revolution. And I think that, amongst this exciting development, we need to create a regulatory process that is appropriate and relevant, and that's what's important with all of this.
Welsh: Mae yna berig i ni i gyd gytuno fan hyn. Ond mae yna nifer fawr, onid oes e, o'r newidiadau arfaethedig yma'n bwysig i gynulleidfaoedd Cymru, achos maen nhw'n ymwneud yn uniongyrchol â'r dewisiadau cynnwys a'r gwasanaethau sydd ar gael i bobl Cymru, ac yn ymwneud â sut mae cynulleidfaoedd Cymru, fel dywedodd Owen a Phil, yn medru dod o hyd i gynnwys sy'n adlewyrchu eu diddordebau nhw, eu ffordd nhw o fyw, a chynnwys sy'n berthnasol i'w bywydau nhw. Ac mae'r cyd-destun yn bwysig fan hyn: mae llwyddiant darlledu gwasanaeth cyhoeddus yn yr ynysoedd hyn yn destun cenfigen i'r byd. A dwi'n credu mai'r neges fan hyn yw bod y system bresennol o gyrff cyhoeddus yn gweithio ochr yn ochr â darparwyr masnachol yn gweithio'n dda i gynulleidfaoedd, ond mae angen trefn sydd wedi ei diwygio ar gyfer y farchnad fel ag y mae hi heddiw. Dŷn ni wedi sôn am y newid strwythurol enfawr dŷn ni'n ei weld yn y byd cyfryngol. Dŷn ni i gyd yn gallu sôn am ein straeon personol ni yn hynny o beth, a fy mhlant i hefyd - erbyn hyn ddim ond yn gwylio chwaraeon ar deledu llinol. Mae'r newid yn rhyfeddol, ac mae cynulleidfaoedd Cymru yn rhan o'r chwyldro yna, a dwi'n credu, yng nghanol y datblygiad cyffrous hwn, fod angen creu proses reoleiddio sy'n addas ac sy'n berthnasol, a dyna sy'n bwysig gyda hyn oll.
English: We'll move now to Alun Davies. He wants to come in on this, and so we'll move to his questions as well.
Welsh: Fe wnawn ni symud nawr at Alun Davies. Roedd e eisiau dod i mewn ar hyn, ac fe wnawn ni symud at ei gwestiynau fe nawr.
English: Owen wants to come in here as well.
Welsh: Mae Owen eisiau dod i mewn fan hyn hefyd.
English: Before we come back to Alun, Rhuanedd wanted to come in - but briefly, if possible.
Welsh: Cyn inni fynd nôl at Alun, roedd Rhuanedd eisiau dod nôl mewn - yn gryno, os yn bosib, achos dŷn ni'n brin iawn o amser.
English: Yes, very briefly. I agree in terms of the financial climate - it's vital and it's vital for us here in Wales. People think about the licence fee in a British context, but it's vital for the future of services through the medium of Welsh and English here in Wales too. And that's why I wanted to give a word of warning, perhaps, about the one of the recommendations, namely the idea of creating more providers in the sphere of PSBs and whether that would come from the licence fee. Ofcom itself acknowledges that, in order to compete with these major providers, we need organisations that are of a large scale and have weight behind them, so that they can compete effectively. So, I think we need to be careful lest we create many providers that can't compete with the other players in the market that are on that larger scale.
Welsh: Yn gryno iawn, ie. Rwy'n cytuno o ran yr hinsawdd arianol - mae'n allweddol, ac mae'n allweddol i ni yma yng Nghymru. Mae pobl yn meddwl am y ffi drwydded mewn cyd-destun Prydeinig; mae hi'n hanfodol ar gyfer dyfodol ein gwasanaethau Saesneg a Chymraeg yma yng Nghymru hefyd. A dyna pam dwi jest eisiau rhoi gair, efallai, o rybudd am un o'r argymhellion, sef y syniad o greu mwy o ddarparwyr yn y maes gwasanaethau cyhoeddus a phe byddai hynny'n dod o'r ffi drwydded. Mae Ofcom ei hunan yn cydnabod, er mwyn cystadlu gyda'r darparwyr mawr yma, fod angen sefydliadau o raddfa uchel sydd â thipyn o swmp yn perthyn iddyn nhw er mwyn cystadlu'n effeithiol. Ac mae jest rhaid bod yn ofalus, dwi'n meddwl, rhag ofn ein bod ni'n creu llawer o ddarparwyr ond dŷn ni'n methu â chystadlu gyda'r bobl eraill yn y farchnad sydd ar y raddfa fwy yma.
English: Yes, and I understand that message, Rhuanedd, about the licence fee. May I ask Mr Evans about the licence? You share your funding now with the BBC, through the licence fee. So, as a broadcaster, and as a chief executive - perhaps you have more freedom now that you have said that you are leaving the broadcaster - have you seen your independence become problematic in the way that you plan and make the editorial decisions that you do as a broadcaster because the funding comes through the licence fee rather than directly from DCMS?
Welsh: Ie, a dwi'n deall y neges, Rhuanedd, amboutu'r drwydded. Ond gaf i ofyn Mr Evans amboutu'r drwydded? Dŷch chi'n rhannu eich cyllid nawr gyda'r BBC trwy'r drwydded. Fel darlledwr, ac fel prif weithredwr - ac efallai fod gyda chi fwy o ryddid nawr eich bod chi wedi datgan eich bod chi'n gadael y darlledwr - ydych chi wedi gweld, o ran eich annibyniaeth, fod yna broblemau wedi bod yn y ffordd dŷch chi'n cynllunio y penderfyniadau golygyddol dŷch chi'n eu gwneud fel darlledwr oherwydd bod y cyllid yn dod trwy'r drwydded yn lle dod yn uniongyrchol o DCMS?
English: 'No' is the simple answer. But I think one of the most important things that we did in the beginning was when the Government in London decided that S4C was going to be funded entirely through the licence fee, we set out clear asks of the Government and its civil servants so that there would be a separate process for S4C to discuss funding in future. Because what S4C was concerned about was that we would be a kind of sub-item in the debates that the BBC would have. And, of course, the BBC and S4C are now competing for the same funding, and we have to admit that. Therefore, of course, the BBC ensures that their slice of the pie is bigger than ours. But it's important, and one of the things that I'm very pleased about is that Ministers in London did take that argument on board as regards having a separate discussion for S4C, and that's why S4C set out its own plan for the Government, and the BBC submitted its plan separately. So, when we get a statement, hopefully in the next month -
Welsh: 'Naddo' yw'r ateb syml. Ond dwi'n credu mai un o'r pethau pwysicaf, i ddechrau, wnaethon ni oedd, pan wnaeth y Llywodraeth yn Llundain benderfynu bod S4C yn mynd i gael ei gyllido yn hollol trwy'r ffi drwydded, fe wnaethon ni ofynion eithaf cryf i'r Gweinidog bryd hynny, a gweision sifil fanna, fel bod proses ar wahân i S4C i drafod cyllid y dyfodol. Achos beth roedd S4C yn becso amdano oedd ein bod ni'n rhyw fath o sub-item mas o'r dadleuon buasai'r BBC yn eu rhoi. Ac, wrth gwrs, mae'r BBC ac S4C nawr yn cystadlu am yr un pres, ac mae'n rhaid inni gyfaddef hynny. Felly, wrth gwrs bydd y BBC eisiau gwneud yn siŵr bod eu sleisen nhw o'r pei yn fwy na'n sleisen ni. Ond, mae'n bwysig, ac un o'r pethau dwi'n falch amdano yw bod Gweinidogion yn Llundain wedi cymryd y ddadl y dylid cael trafodaeth ar wahân i S4C, a dyna pam y gwnaeth S4C roi ei gynllun ei hun i mewn i'r Llywodraeth, a gwnaeth y BBC roi eu cynllun nhw ar wahân i mewn. Felly, pan gawn ni ddatganiad, gobeithio yn y mis nesaf -
English: Sorry, I just wanted to come back to you, Rhuanedd, as we are short of time. I don't think it's a secret, but, when I worked for S4C, I was arguing for this set-up, because I thought it would provide greater assurance for S4C, so I was very pleased to hear your comments on that. But the three of you, when you responded to Delyth's previous question, mentioned due prominence and how that is changing. In the old days, of course, people were talking about the EPGs and what number each broadcaster had on the EPG. But, as I was saying to Ofcom before, I use my mobile phone and I use apps more often than I do the EPG. I agree with you, by the way, that the broadcasters need this, but how do you see that those broadcasters will have that prominence when these changes aren't about to happen but have already happened?
Welsh: Sori, dwi eisiau dod nôl atoch chi, Rhuanedd; dŷn ni'n brin o amser y bore yma. Dwi ddim yn credu ei bod hi'n gyfrinach, ond pan oeddwn i'n gweithio i S4C, roeddwn i'n dadlau am y set-up yma, achos roeddwn i'n meddwl ei fod e'n cynnig mwy o sicrwydd i S4C, so dwi'n falch iawn o glywed eich geiriau. Ond, roedd y tri ohonoch chi hefyd, pan oeddech chi'n ateb cwestiwn blaenorol Delyth, wedi sôn am due prominence - yr amlygrwydd yma - a sut mae hynny'n newid. Yn yr hen ddyddiau, wrth gwrs, roedd pobl yn sôn ambout EPGs a pha rif oedd pob darlledwr ar yr EPG. Ond, fel roeddwn i'n dweud with Ofcom o'r blaen, dwi'n defnyddio'r ffôn symudol fan hyn, a dwi'n defnyddio aps yr un mor aml ag ydw i'n defnyddio'r EPG. Dwi'n cytuno gyda chi, gyda llaw, fod angen hyn ar y darlledwyr, ond sut ydych chi'n gweld bod hynny yn mynd i ddigwydd mewn byd ble dydy'r newidiadau yma ddim ar fin digwydd, ond wedi bod?
English: Can I ask for succinct answers, if possible, because we'll have to move on after this to another Member? But I know that this is a huge question. Who wants to go first? Owen.
Welsh: Alla i ofyn am atebion eithaf cryno, plîs, achos bydd rhaid i ni symud ymlaen ar ôl hyn i Aelod arall - os ydy hynny'n bosibl; dwi'n gwybod bod hwn yn gwestiwn mawr? Pwy sydd eisiau mynd yn gyntaf? Owen.
English: I think it's vital. There is a degree of viewership over phones, but a great deal of viewership happens over on the main television screen - through apps, through Netflix, and so on. What we discovered, when we were lower down the EPG, was that going up 30 places on the EPG increased the number of people who watched your services, because you were visible. In the same way, when you pick up the remote control, Netflix and Amazon are there, but BBC, S4C and ITV aren't there. When you turn the smart tv on, there's a list of apps. Somebody picks where those apps go, and if S4C, ITV and BBC aren't on that list and aren't prominent on that list, then people will choose something else. So, it's vital that the PSBs have the right to have their apps on these devices, but with the same kind of prominence as is given in the EPG, or people are just going to walk on by. And we have the problem, as S4C and with the Welsh language, where our funding is relatively small as compared to ITV and the BBC, and we can't afford today to place our app on all kinds of devices and all kinds of televisions. And what that means is that people have to go through web browsers, and that's a pain in the backside. So, just having that challenge as regards viewing our content means that people will go elsewhere. It's vital, therefore, that we have that prominence in future.
Welsh: Dwi'n credu ei bod hi'n hanfodol. Mae rhywfaint o wylio ar draws ffôns, ond mae lot o wylio yn dal yn digwydd dros y prif sgrin - trwy aps, trwy Netflix, trwy beth bynnag. Beth ffeindion ni mas pan oedden ni ar yr EPG yn isel lawr oedd bod mynd lan tua 30 lle yn yr EPG yn codi faint o bobl oedd yn eich gwylio chi, achos roeddech chi'n weledol. Nawr, yn yr un ffordd, pan fyddwch chi'n pigo lan remote control, mae Netflix, mae Amazon, does dim BBC, does dim ITV, does dim S4C. Rydych chi'n troi'r teledu ymlaen a rhoi'r smart tv ymlaen, ac mae rhestr o aps. Mae rhywun yn dewis ble mae'r aps yna'n mynd, ac os nad yw S4C, os nad yw'r BBC, os nad yw ITV yn y rhestr yna yn amlwg, mae pobl yn mynd i ddewis rhywbeth arall, ac felly mae hi'n hollol bwysig bod yr hawl gan y PSBs i gael eu aps nhw ar y dyfeisiadau yma, ond hefyd gyda'r un math o prominence ag sydd ar gael ar EPGs, neu bydd pobl jest yn camu heibio i ni. Ac rydyn ni'n cael y broblem, fel S4C a'r iaith Gymraeg, ble mae ein cyllid ni'n gymharol fach o'i gymharu ag ITV a'r BBC, ble allwn ni ddim fforddio heddiw rhoi ein ap ni ar bob math o deledu a phob math o declyn. A beth mae hynny'n meddwl yw bod pobl yn gorfod mynd drwy web browser, ac mae hynny'n boen yn y pen ôl. Felly, mae jest yr her fach yna i wylio'n cynnwys ni yn meddwl y bydd pobl yn troi bant, ac felly mae'n hollol bwysig i ni ein bod ni'n cael yr amlygrwydd yma i'r dyfodol.
English: I promise to keep this short, because I don't want to repeat what's already been said, but the truth is that there are forecasts that the major technological companies that are already responsible for content will also generate television content over the coming years. They'll control and manage the content. So, do you think seriously think that they would consider the needs of the Welsh language in that, or the needs of public service broadcasting in Wales? No. And that's why we need this legislation. Now, we as the BBC aren't going to tell these companies how they should look, be that a tile or an app or whatever, but our aim is to ensure that it is visible and prominent, and that's why this is so important.
Welsh: Mi wna i addo cadw hyn yn fyr, achos dwi ddim eisiau ailadrodd, ond y gwir amdani yw bod yna ddarogan y bydd y cwmnïau mawr technolegol yma sydd eisoes yn gyfrifol am gynnwys hefyd yn cynhyrchu teledu dros y blynyddoedd nesaf yma. Nhw fydd yn rheoli'r cynnwys felly. Ydych chi'n meddwl o ddifri y byddan nhw'n ystyried anghenion y Gymraeg yn hynny, neu anghenion darlledu cyhoeddus yng Nghymru? Na. A dyna pam mae angen y ddeddfwriaeth yma. Nawr, dŷn ni fel y BBC ddim yn mynd i ddweud wrth y cwmnïau yma sut yn union ddylai hyn edrych, boed fel teil neu ap neu beth bynnag, ond sicrhau ei fod e'n amlwg, ei fod e'n flaenllaw yw'r nod, a dyna pam mae hyn mor bwysig.
English: Okay. Unfortunately, we will have to move on or we won't have any time for the other topics that we want to discuss, but thank you for that. We'll move to Heledd Fychan.
Welsh: Ocê. Yn anffodus, bydd rhaid inni symud ymlaen neu fydd dim amser i'r pynciau eraill, ond diolch yn fawr iawn am hynny. Fe wnawn ni symud at Heledd Fychan.