English: Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd. I'd first of all like to thank the Minister for Social Justice very much for her approach to these matters, the work that she's done on this Bill, in terms of how it would affect Wales and communities within Wales, and separating out our consideration today into the two motions. I'd very much like to support the withholding of consent as far as motion 2 is concerned and for many of the reasons that we've already heard, Llywydd. And as far as Part 4 is concerned, I would like, as Jenny Rathbone did, and as others have mentioned, to concentrate on the effect on Gypsy, Roma and Traveller communities in Wales, because it would be a very serious effect indeed. We already know that, over many years, the way of life of these people has been made difficult and eroded by creeping urbanisation, a lack of stopping places, and the lack of provision of necessary sites as, again, Jenny Rathbone referred to earlier. It is a test of a society and of a state and a country, I think, Llywydd, that we should not just tolerate but encourage and facilitate different ways of life. People have a right to live differently, different to the majority, different to the norm. That should be respected and understood and facilitated. And that isn't the case in Wales at the moment, and we know we have some work to do to put our own house in order in terms of provision of sites, with Welsh Government working with local authorities. But we also know that this legislation, as proposed, would make that situation far worse. It would criminalise Gypsy, Roma and Traveller people when they stop somewhere without a legal alternative to use in that locality, and it would allow local authorities to seize their homes and seize vehicles. So, that would prevent families living as they live at the moment and having a roof over their head at a particular time, and it would prevent them having the means to pursue their living at a particular time. And already these families suffer considerable disadvantage in terms of the provision of public services, in economic and social terms, and that would be made much worse by these draconian measures, which, in an instant, would allow the confiscation of homes and means to pursue a living. It really, really is a very serious set of consequences that would follow if this legislation is allowed to take effect in Wales. And it would go against the grain of Welsh Government policy over many years and legislation that we've enacted here in Wales through the Assembly and Senedd. And even though there are shortcomings, as I've already said, in terms of provision of sites, we do know the Welsh Government is very committed to working with local authorities to remedy those shortcomings, and that, again, would be made much more difficult if these enactments were to take place in Wales. So, I very much support the stance of the Minister and those who have similarly opposed motion 2 in this debate today, Llywydd, and I hope that Members will vote accordingly.
Welsh: Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd. Hoffwn ddiolch yn gyntaf i'r Gweinidog Cyfiawnder Cymdeithasol am ei hagwedd at y materion hyn, y gwaith y mae hi wedi'i wneud ar y Bil hwn, o ran sut y byddai'n effeithio ar Gymru a chymunedau yng Nghymru, ac yn gwahanu ein hystyriaeth heddiw i'r ddau gynnig. Hoffwn gefnogi atal cydsyniad o ran cynnig 2 ac am lawer o'r rhesymau yr ydym ni eisoes wedi'u clywed, Llywydd. Ac o ran Rhan 4, hoffwn, fel y soniodd Jenny Rathbone, ac fel y mae eraill wedi sôn, ganolbwyntio ar yr effaith ar gymunedau Sipsiwn, Roma a Theithwyr yng Nghymru, oherwydd byddai'n effaith ddifrifol iawn yn wir. Gwyddom eisoes fod ffordd o fyw'r bobl hyn, dros nifer o flynyddoedd, wedi'i gwneud yn anodd ac wedi'i herydu gan drefoli graddol, diffyg mannau aros, a diffyg darpariaeth safleoedd angenrheidiol fel y cyfeiriodd Jenny Rathbone ato'n gynharach, unwaith eto. Mae'n brawf o gymdeithas a gwladwriaeth a gwlad, rwy'n meddwl, Llywydd, na ddylem oddef ond annog a hwyluso gwahanol ffyrdd o fyw. Mae gan bobl hawl i fyw'n wahanol, yn wahanol i'r mwyafrif, yn wahanol i'r norm. Dylid parchu a deall hynny a'i hwyluso. Ac nid yw hynny'n wir yng Nghymru ar hyn o bryd, a gwyddom fod gennym ni rywfaint o waith i'w wneud i roi trefn ar ein tŷ ein hunain o ran darparu safleoedd, gyda Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio gydag awdurdodau lleol. Ond gwyddom hefyd y byddai'r ddeddfwriaeth hon, fel y'i cynigiwyd, yn gwneud y sefyllfa honno'n llawer gwaeth. Byddai'n troi pobl Sipsiwn, Roma a Theithwyr yn droseddwyr pan fyddan nhw'n stopio yn rhywle heb ddewis cyfreithiol arall i'w defnyddio yn yr ardal honno, a byddai'n caniatáu i awdurdodau lleol atafaelu eu cartrefi ac atafaelu cerbydau. Felly, byddai hynny'n atal teuluoedd rhag byw fel y maen nhw'n byw ar hyn o bryd a chael to uwch eu pen ar adeg benodol, a byddai'n eu hatal rhag cael y modd i arfer eu bywoliaeth ar adeg benodol. Ac eisoes mae'r teuluoedd hyn yn dioddef cryn anfantais o ran darpariaeth gwasanaethau cyhoeddus, yn economaidd ac yn gymdeithasol, a byddai hynny'n cael ei wneud yn llawer gwaeth gan y mesurau didostur hyn, a fyddai, ar amrantiad, yn caniatáu atafaelu cartrefi a'r modd o ennill bywoliaeth. Mewn gwirionedd, byddai cyfres ddifrifol iawn o ganlyniadau yn dilyn os caniateir i'r ddeddfwriaeth hon ddod i rym yng Nghymru. A byddai'n mynd yn groes i bolisi Llywodraeth Cymru dros flynyddoedd lawer a deddfwriaeth yr ydym ni wedi'i deddfu yma yng Nghymru drwy'r Cynulliad a'r Senedd. Ac er bod diffygion, fel y dywedais i eisoes, o ran darparu safleoedd, gwyddom fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi ymrwymo'n fawr i weithio gydag awdurdodau lleol i unioni'r diffygion hynny, ac y byddai hynny, unwaith eto, yn cael ei wneud yn llawer anoddach pe bai'r deddfiadau hyn yn dod i rym yng Nghymru. Felly, rwy'n llwyr gefnogi safbwynt y Gweinidog a'r rhai sydd wedi gwrthwynebu cynnig 2 yn y ddadl hon heddiw, Llywydd, a gobeithiaf y bydd yr Aelodau'n pleidleisio yn unol â hynny.