English: May I also declare an interest as a school governor at the outset? Now, clearly, Plaid Cymru has supported the demand for legislation for a number of years, and therefore we will support the general principles of the Bill this afternoon. That's not to say, of course, that there isn't a need to improve and strengthen the Bill in parts, as is reflected in the committee's report, where there are 48 recommendations. Clearly, there is some work still to be done to get the Bill to where we would want to see it. May I also endorse the thanks expressed to my fellow committee members, the committee officials, and the hundreds of stakeholders who contributed to the scrutiny process to date? I want to share some of the frustration, while acknowledging that the Minister has been happy to sit down and to discuss these issues, and to share various supplementary documents with us. It has been frustrating in terms of the patchy way in which these have appeared - the Bill itself, and then we received the code, then the guidance on the healthcare needs, and then we received various details on the financial requirements. I don't think this is the ideal scrutiny process for a Bill, if truth be told. Within a few minutes, I can't address all of the 48 recommendations in the report, but I would endorse the comments already made on enhancing the definition of additional learning need to include medical needs. It's extremely important that medical needs of pupils in schools are effectively managed and that details and robust guidance are available to ensure that that happens. I do acknowledge, and I'm pleased, that the Minister has published a statutory guidance for schools and local authorities during this process, but there are questions remaining, as we've heard, in terms of capturing the full age range in the ALN Bill. And I do welcome the fact, of course, that the Minister has committed to look again at amending the definition in section 2 of the Bill to make it clear on the face of the Bill that someone would have an additional learning need if they have a medical condition that would mean that they have significant learning difficulties more than most other pupils of the same age. I believe it's a mistake not to include those who undertake work-based learning, such as apprenticeships, within the scope of this Bill. Young people with additional learning needs are more likely to take this learning pathway, rather than continue with more academic courses. I hear the Minister's point, or he's made the point in the past, that he doesn't necessarily want to draw the private sector into the Bill. Well, the truth is that they do receive public funds from Government to provide these services. At the other end of the spectrum, private sector nurseries that receive public funding from the Welsh Government are included within the remit of the Bill. So, I would be eager to see greater consistency in that regard. I have to agree with the aim at the heart of this Bill in creating a regime that is person centred and a more transparent system that is more accessible. But again, the Government is seeking to keep two separate appeals systems, which are completely separate, for education and health. I heard the Minister's comments on continuing the debate around that issue, but I do think that even the evidence of the health board seems to accept that there is scope for one tribunal and one appeals system, as long as the relevant expertise is part of that process in ensuring that decisions are taken on the correct clinical basis. There are a number of references to be welcomed in terms of advocacy in the Bill, and I would be eager to go further. There is mention in the report of looking at those key transitional periods when it comes to ensuring that people are aware of the advocacy services available, and not just at times when there is a breakdown in the process, or where there's some dispute. In terms of the Welsh language, I do feel that the Bill has been strengthened. I think there is scope to go further. There is talk that it would be desirable to provide services through the medium of Welsh in some parts of the Bill. Well, we should at least say that it would be expected to be provided where it is available. But on the broader point, for decades now, we've regretted the fact that there isn't the capacity within the service to provide what we would want to see provided through the medium of Welsh across the spectrum of services. One suggestion that I've made is that we do need some sort of sunrise clause in the Bill. Yes, we need to be pragmatic and say, 'Where possible, the service should be provided', but to say that, by some particular point in the future, let's say in 10 years' time, then there will be an expectation that those services should be available. I think that would create an impetus to take decisive action on this agenda once and for all and to ensure that workforce planning and the necessary training is in place, rather than us coming back to this issue again in 10 or 20 years with the same complaint and facing the same problems. Finally, I don't agree with the Minister on the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child. I am of the same view as the rest of the committee members and the children's commissioner that the duties to give due regard to the convention should be on the face of the Bill. The social services and well-being Act does that, and not doing so here would be inconsistent and would send the wrong message on the Welsh Government's commitment to the rights of the child.
Welsh: A gaf innau ddatgan diddordeb fel llywodraethwr ysgol hefyd, ar y cychwyn fel hyn? Yn amlwg, mae Plaid Cymru wedi cefnogi'r alwad am ddeddfwriaeth o'r fath ers nifer o flynyddoedd, ac felly rydym ni am gefnogi egwyddorion cyffredinol y Bil y prynhawn yma. Ond nid yw hynny yn dweud, wrth gwrs, nad oes angen gwella a chryfhau'r Bil mewn mannau, fel sydd yn cael ei adlewyrchu yn adroddiad y pwyllgor. A lle mae yna 48 o argymhellion, mae'n amlwg bod yna dipyn bach o waith ar ôl i'w wneud i gael y Bil i lle byddem ni am ei weld e. Ac a gaf innau hefyd ategu'r diolch sydd wedi cael ei roi i'm cyd-Aelodau ar y pwyllgor, swyddogion y pwyllgor a'r cannoedd lawer o randdeiliaid sydd wedi cyfrannu at y broses graffu hyd yma? Rydw innau hefyd am rannu ychydig o'r rhwystredigaeth, tra'n cydnabod bod y Gweinidog wedi bod yn hapus iawn i eistedd i lawr a thrafod a rhannu gwahanol ddogfennau atodol gyda ni. Mae wedi bod yn rhwystredig, y modd darniog y mae nifer o'r rhain wedi dod ger ein bron ni. Mae'r Bil ei hun wrth gwrs, mi ddaeth y cod, mi ddaeth y canllawiau ar anghenion gofal iechyd wedyn ac mi ydym ni wedi cael gwahanol fersiynau o'r manylion cyllidol ac yn y blaen, ac rydw i'n teimlo nad dyma'r ffordd ddelfrydol i graffu ar Bil mewn gwirionedd. O ran y gwelliannau, yn amlwg, o fewn ychydig funudau, mae'n amhosib gwneud cyfiawnder â phob un o'r 48 argymhelliad sydd yn yr adroddiad, ond mi fyddwn i'n ategu'r sylwadau sydd wedi cael eu gwneud ynglŷn ag ehangu'r diffiniad o 'anghenion dysgu ychwanegol' i gynnwys anghenion meddygol. Mae'n hynod bwysig bod anghenion meddygol disgyblion mewn ysgolion yn cael eu rheoli'n effeithiol a bod canllawiau manwl a chadarn ar gael i sicrhau bod hynny'n digwydd. Rwy'n cydnabod, ac yn falch, bod y Gweinidog wedi cyhoeddi'r canllawiau statudol i ysgolion ac awdurdodau lleol yn ystod y broses yma, ond mae yna gwestiynau, fel rydym ni wedi clywed, yn aros ynglŷn â dal yr ystod oedran llawn a fydd o fewn y Bil anghenion dysgu ychwanegol. Rydw i'n croesawu'r ffaith, wrth gwrs, fod y Gweinidog wedi ymrwymo i edrych eto ar ddiwygio'r diffiniad yn adran 2 o'r Bil i'w gwneud hi'n glir ar wyneb y Bil yma y bydd gan rywun angen addysgol ychwanegol os bydd ganddyn nhw gyflwr meddygol sy'n golygu bod ganddyn nhw anhawster dysgu sylweddol fwy na'r rhan fwyaf o bobl o'r un oed. Rydw i'n meddwl ei bod hi'n gamgymeriad peidio â chynnwys y rhai sy'n ymgymryd â dysgu yn seiliedig ar waith, er enghraifft prentisiaethau, o fewn y Bil yma. Mae pobl ifanc ag anghenion dysgu ychwanegol yn fwy tebygol o gymryd y llwybr dysgu yma yn hytrach nag, efallai, parhau ar gyrsiau mwy academaidd. Rydw i'n clywed pwynt y Gweinidog, neu mae e wedi gwneud y pwynt yn y gorffennol, ei fod e ddim o reidrwydd eisiau tynnu'r sector breifat i fewn i'r Bil. Wel, y gwir yw, maen nhw'n derbyn arian cyhoeddus gan y Llywodraeth, wrth gwrs, i ddarparu'r gwasanaethau yma. Ar ben arall y sbectrwm oed, mae meithrinfeydd sector breifat sy'n derbyn cyllid gan Lywodraeth Cymru neu arian cyhoeddus yn cael eu cynnwys o fewn dyletswyddau'r Bil. Felly, fe fyddwn i'n awyddus i weld mwy o gysondeb yn hynny o beth. Mae'n rhaid cytuno, wrth gwrs, gyda'r nod sydd wrth galon y Bil yma o greu cyfundrefn sydd wedi'i chanoli ar y person: system fwy tryloyw, haws i'w ymwneud â hi. Ond eto, mae'r Llywodraeth yn edrych i gadw dwy gyfundrefn gwbl ar wahân o apeliadau ar gyfer addysg ac iechyd. Rydw i'n clywed yr hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog ynglŷn â pharhau â'r drafodaeth o gwmpas hynny, ond roedd hyd yn oed tystiolaeth y byrddau iechyd, i bob golwg, yn derbyn bod yna le i un tribiwnlys ac un system apelio, cyhyd â bod yr arbenigedd perthnasol yn rhan o'r broses honno, i sicrhau bod y penderfyniadau yn cael eu gwneud ar y sail glinigol gywir. Mae yna lawer o gyfeiriadau i'w croesawu at eiriolaeth yn y Bil, ac mi fuaswn i'n awyddus i fynd ymhellach. Mae yna sôn yn yr adroddiad ynglŷn ag edrych ar y cyfnodau pontio allweddol yna pan mae'n dod i sicrhau bod pobl yn ymwybodol o'r gwasanaethau eiriolaeth, ac nid dim ond ar adegau pan fo torri lawr yn y broses neu pan fo anghydfod. O ran y Gymraeg, rydw i yn teimlo bod y Bil wedi'i gryfhau. Rydw i'n meddwl bod yna le i fynd ymhellach. Mae yna sôn y byddai hi'n ddymunol darparu gwasanaethau drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg mewn rhai llefydd yn y Bil. Wel, fe ddylem ni o leiaf ddweud bod yna ddisgwyl iddo fe gael ei ddarparu lle mae e ar gael. Ond, ar bwynt ehangach, ers degawdau rydym ni'n gwarafun nad oes y capasiti o fewn y gwasanaeth i ddarparu'r hyn y byddem ni ei eisiau drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg ar draws y sbectrwm o wasanaethau, ac rydw i yn teimlo - . Un awgrym rydw i wedi'i roi yw bod angen rhyw fath o gymal gwawrio, neu 'sunrise clause', yn y Bil. Ie, bod yn bragmataidd a dweud, 'Lle y bo hi'n bosib, darparu'r gwasanaeth,' ond erbyn rhyw bwynt penodol yn y dyfodol, dyweder mewn 10 mlynedd, yna mi fydd disgwyl bod y gwasanaethau yna ar gael. Rydw i'n meddwl y byddai hynny'n creu 'impetus' i weithredu'n bendant ar yr agenda yma unwaith ac am byth, a sicrhau bod y cynllunio gweithlu a'r hyfforddi angenrheidiol, ac yn y blaen, yn digwydd, yn lle ein bod ni yn dod nôl i fan hyn eto mewn 10, 20 mlynedd arall, gyda'r un gŵyn a'r un broblem. Yn olaf, nid ydw i'n cytuno â'r Gweinidog ynglŷn â Chonfensiwn y Cenhedloedd Unedig ar Hawliau'r Plentyn. Rydw i o'r un farn â gweddill aelodau'r pwyllgor a'r comisiynydd plant y dylid gosod dyletswyddau i roi sylw dyladwy i'r confensiwn ar wyneb y Bil. Mae'r Ddeddf gwasanaethau cymdeithasol a llesiant yn gwneud hynny. Mi fuasai peidio â gwneud hynny fan hyn yn anghyson ac yn anfon y neges anghywir am ymrwymiad Llywodraeth Cymru i hawliau'r plentyn.