English: Thank you, Presiding Officer, and I'd like to thank everyone who's contributed to the debate this afternoon. A debate was tabled not because we lack faith in the UK inquiry - we do not - and that has been echoed by many speakers today, that the UK inquiry is an important vehicle for us to understand how decisions were taken, to test those decisions and to come to a conclusion on the outcomes of those decisions. And on that point, I agree with the First Minister that the UK inquiry is an important vehicle that the Welsh Government and, indeed, others within Wales need to engage with. But, as the Scottish Government has highlighted, it is possible to run a Scottish-specific inquiry in parallel with the UK-wide inquiry to get to the nub of this here, which is things were done differently in Wales, as they were done in Scotland. We do need, as speaker after speaker emphasised, a separate inquiry route, and, in this case, the motion seeks permission for the Welsh Parliament to form that special purpose vehicle. Surely, that's what we should be doing as parliamentarians: looking at the most momentous decisions, as other speakers have touched on, that have ever been taken by a Welsh Government and Welsh civic society. This isn't about deflecting from the UK Government and some of the decisions they've taken, as the Member for North Wales on the Labour benches highlighted; the UK Government do need to be held to account, and ultimately look at decisions that were good and bad, quite rightly so. But, as we've heard from the chair of the UK-wide inquiry, there are areas of the inquiry that they will not be able to look at as closely as they would like on Welsh decision making. When you look at the structures in Wales here, local government is quite different from local government in England. We have unitary authorities across the whole of Wales. They were important partners in delivering some of the Welsh Government's decisions and support measures that were put in place in social care, for example, and in education. The health service is structured quite differently in Wales, because of decisions that the Welsh Government have taken, to how it is structured in England. Those are unique positions that are taken here in Wales that we need a Welsh decision to look at, and that decision needs to be taken here this evening, ultimately to give empowerment to a committee to be formed by the Welsh Parliament. If we as parliamentarians cannot form a committee to look at these issues and report in a timely manner before the 2026 election, then what is the point of having a Welsh Parliament? That surely is the fundamental question here. If this is voted down and the Government use their Government votes to vote that down - . And I implore the Labour backbench to consider that. As parliamentarians, you are being asked to vote down the ability to have a committee that would be in the control of Parliament, not a political party, in the control of Parliament - [ Interruption.] - in the control of Parliament, not to defer - . [ Interruption.] I've run out of time, sorry, Alun. I'll happily take the intervention, but - [ Inaudible. ]
Welsh: Diolch, Lywydd, a hoffwn ddiolch i bawb sydd wedi cyfrannu at y ddadl y prynhawn yma. Cyflwynwyd dadl nid oherwydd nad oes gennym ffydd yn ymchwiliad y DU - nid yw hynny'n wir - ac mae hynny wedi cael ei adleisio gan lawer o siaradwyr heddiw, fod ymchwiliad y DU yn gyfrwng pwysig inni ddeall sut y gwnaed penderfyniadau, i brofi'r penderfyniadau hynny a dod i gasgliad ynghylch canlyniadau'r penderfyniadau hynny. Ac ar y pwynt hwnnw, rwy'n cytuno â Phrif Weinidog Cymru fod ymchwiliad y DU yn gyfrwng pwysig y mae angen i Lywodraeth Cymru, ac eraill yng Nghymru yn wir, gymryd rhan ynddo. Ond fel y mae Llywodraeth yr Alban wedi dangos, mae'n bosibl cynnal ymchwiliad penodol i'r Alban ochr yn ochr ag ymchwiliad ledled y DU i fynd at wraidd hyn, sef bod pethau wedi eu gwneud yn wahanol yng Nghymru, fel y cawsant eu gwneud yn yr Alban. Fel y pwysleisiodd siaradwr ar ôl siaradwr, rydym angen llwybr ymchwilio ar wahân, ac yn yr achos hwn, mae'r cynnig yn gofyn am ganiatâd i Senedd Cymru ffurfio'r cyfrwng diben arbennig hwnnw. Dyna y dylem ei wneud fel seneddwyr: edrych ar y penderfyniadau mwyaf arwyddocaol a wnaed erioed gan Lywodraeth Cymru a chymdeithas ddinesig yng Nghymru, fel y mae siaradwyr eraill wedi nodi. Nid oes a wnelo hyn â gwyro oddi wrth Lywodraeth y DU a rhai o'r penderfyniadau a wnaethant hwy, fel y nododd yr Aelod dros Ogledd Cymru ar y meinciau Llafur; mae angen dwyn Llywodraeth y DU i gyfrif, ac yn y pen draw mae angen edrych ar benderfyniadau a oedd yn dda ac yn ddrwg, yn gwbl briodol felly. Ond fel y clywsom gan gadeirydd yr ymchwiliad ar draws y DU, ceir meysydd o'r ymchwiliad na fyddant yn gallu edrych arnynt mor fanwl ag y byddent yn ei hoffi mewn perthynas â phenderfyniadau Cymreig. Pan edrychwch ar y strwythurau yma yng Nghymru, mae llywodraeth leol yn hollol wahanol i lywodraeth leol yn Lloegr. Mae gennym awdurdodau unedol ar draws Cymru gyfan. Roeddent yn bartneriaid pwysig ar gyfer cyflawni rhai o benderfyniadau Llywodraeth Cymru a'r mesurau cymorth a gafodd eu rhoi ar waith ym maes gofal cymdeithasol, er enghraifft, ac ym myd addysg. Mae'r gwasanaeth iechyd wedi'i strwythuro yn wahanol iawn yng Nghymru i'r modd y mae wedi'i strwythuro yn Lloegr, oherwydd penderfyniadau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'u gwneud. Mae'r rheini'n safbwyntiau unigryw a wneir yma yng Nghymru ac mae angen gwneud penderfyniad yng Nghymru i edrych arnynt, ac mae angen gwneud y penderfyniad hwnnw yma heno, i'w gwneud hi'n bosibl y y pen draw i ffurfio pwyllgor gan Senedd Cymru. Os na allwn ni fel seneddwyr ffurfio pwyllgor i edrych ar y materion hyn a chyflwyno adroddiad yn amserol cyn etholiad 2026, beth yw pwynt cael Senedd Gymreig? Dyna'r cwestiwn sylfaenol yma. Os caiff hyn ei wrthod a bod y Llywodraeth yn defnyddio eu pleidleisiau Llywodraeth i wrthod hynny - . Ac rwy'n erfyn ar y meinciau cefn Llafur i ystyried hynny. Fel seneddwyr, gofynnir i chi wrthod y gallu i gael pwyllgor a fyddai dan reolaeth y Senedd, nid plaid wleidyddol, dan reolaeth y Senedd - [ Torri ar draws. ] - dan reolaeth y Senedd, nid gohirio - . [ Torri ar draws.] Mae fy amser wedi dod i ben, mae'n ddrwg gennyf, Alun. Rwy'n hapus i dderbyn yr ymyriad, ond - [ Anghlywadwy. ]