English: Well, I can quote back to you the LSE, but I'll share the link with you, and it's pretty clear that the first claim often made is that the use of STV led to low turnout, and that's palpably untrue. So, I suppose it's lies, damned lies, and statistics on both of our accounts, then, isn't it? I hear what people are saying about the sizes of wards, but, do you know what, look at what happened in Anglesey? Now, I know this isn't proportional representation, but because of the situation that Anglesey found itself in years ago, with single-member wards et cetera, and the kind of fiefdoms that were really dragging the council down, it's this Labour Government that intervened. They didn't give them the choice to move or to change. They were taken into, effectively, special measures as a council, and they were forced to introduce multimember wards on a much bigger footprint. And do you know what? The council has been transformed in terms of democracy. It has been transformed. It has slightly improved in terms of representation - it's not where it needs to be. And you have, you know, three-member wards. They are bigger, but Anglesey is a pretty rural area as well, so I don't think that needs to be the sole reason for not moving towards a different kind of footprint, and I think that maybe we need to reflect on some decisions that previous Labour Governments have made when it comes to this debate as well. Jane Dodds started off asking, 'Surely none of us want a system that guarantees safe seats.' It sounds a little bit like that to me, at times, but - .
Welsh: Wel, gallaf ddyfynnu Ysgol Economeg Llundain yn ôl atoch, ond fe rannaf y ddolen â chi, ac mae'n eithaf clir mai'r honiad cyntaf a wneir yn aml yw bod y defnydd o'r bleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy wedi arwain at nifer isel o bleidleiswyr, ac mae hynny'n gwbl anghywir. Felly, mae'n debyg ei fod yn fater o gelwyddau, celwyddau melltigedig, ac ystadegau yn ein hachos ni'n dau, felly, onid yw? Clywaf yr hyn y mae pobl yn ei ddweud am faint wardiau, ond wyddoch chi beth, edrychwch ar yr hyn a ddigwyddodd yn Ynys Môn? Nawr, gwn nad yw'n gynrychiolaeth gyfrannol, ond oherwydd y sefyllfa yr oedd Ynys Môn ynddi flynyddoedd yn ôl, gyda wardiau un aelod ac yn y blaen, a'r math o faenoriaethau a oedd yn llesteirio'r cyngor mewn gwirionedd, y Llywodraeth Lafur hon a ymyrrodd. Ni roesant ddewis iddynt symud neu newid. I bob pwrpas, cawsant eu rhoi dan drefn mesurau arbennig fel cyngor, ac fe'u gorfodwyd i gyflwyno wardiau aml-aelod ar ôl troed llawer mwy. A wyddoch chi beth? Mae'r cyngor wedi'i drawsnewid o ran democratiaeth. Mae wedi'i drawsnewid. Mae wedi gwella ychydig o ran cynrychiolaeth - nid yw lle mae angen iddo fod. Ac mae gennych chi wardiau tri aelod. Maent yn fwy, ond mae Ynys Môn yn ardal eithaf gwledig hefyd, felly nid wyf yn credu bod angen i hynny fod yn unig reswm dros beidio â symud tuag at fath gwahanol o ôl troed, a chredaf efallai fod angen inni ystyried rhai o'r penderfyniadau a wnaeth Llywodraethau Llafur blaenorol yn y ddadl hon hefyd. Dechreuodd Jane Dodds drwy ofyn, 'Nid oes yr un ohonom am gael system sy'n gwarantu seddi diogel.' Mae'n swnio yn debyg i hynny i mi ar adegau, braidd, ond - .