English: Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd. I am grateful to the Conservatives for, once again, tabling an opportunity for us to discuss the economy. There are two things, I think, that are worrying our constituents across Wales at the moment. One of them is their health and the other is future prosperity and jobs, and I think it's really valuable for us to have these discussions. Of course, we don't disagree with everything in the Conservative motion by any means. That any effects of measures to do with the virus should be proportionate on businesses is obviously essential. I think Russell George's points about ward-level data are well made - people need to know what the situation is. It has been put to me that it's difficult for that to be published because individuals could be identified. Well, to be quite honest, if the sample is small enough that individuals might be identified, the ward probably doesn't need to be in lockdown. So, I really think that that's something - and it could, of course, help with compliance. If people understand why they're being asked to stay at home, they're more likely to do it. However, where we can't agree is the perspective about what the UK Government has done so far. Now, the furlough scheme was good, though there were people who were left out, there were people who were not helped. Those people are still campaigning, and I'd ask Members to look at the ExcludedUK campaign's website to see how those people being left out - how it has affected them. But, on the whole, it was a very powerful scheme and it did work very well. And one of the reasons why it worked very well is that it worked for smaller companies as well as for larger ones. I want to talk about amendments 2 and 3 in one breath, Llywydd, because they support each other. In terms of the UK Government's support, we know that the job support scheme, as it's now being brought forward, does not work for many Welsh companies. It doesn't work for hospitality; it doesn't work for food wholesale; it doesn't work for health and beauty; it doesn't work for tourism; it doesn't work for small businesses. And those are just people who've spoken to me this week about support that they can't access. Now, one could argue, Llywydd, that this is understandable. You know, if the UK Government is acting as the Government of England, we must acknowledge that the Welsh economy is very different from the English economy, and it may be appropriate for them to bring that forward. But it doesn't work very well for many of our businesses. So, hence our amendment 2, pressing again the point about the Welsh Government needing to have the borrowing powers to be able to act on some of this themselves. The Welsh Government keep saying that they lack firepower. Well, I think what they need is a bit of backbone to demand that firepower. They should ask for the borrowing powers instead of complaining, as they do in their amendment, about what the UK Government has not done. Why are they not asking for the power to get the money to do it themselves? Because, of course, this is how the UK Government is funding it. They haven't got a magic money tree; they're borrowing on the international markets, which is a perfectly sensible way to proceed. The Welsh Government should be demanding the right to do the same. Now, with regard to our amendment 5 - and to a certain extent, I agree with Russell George here - the Welsh Government does need to look again at elements of the new phase of the economic resilience fund. There's a lot of emphasis, in the new scheme, on calls for development bids for companies to be able to move on, and perhaps that was the appropriate thing to do, given the position of the virus when this scheme was being devised late in the summer. But time has changed. As more and more areas are going into local restrictions, I believe we need more emergency support. And I do agree with the point that Russell George has made about companies not having money in their back pockets to contribute to this kind of thing, especially not small and medium-sized businesses. As the gaps in UK Government become clearer, Welsh Government must stand ready to respond, and that must mean responding to changed circumstances. The Government amendment - oh dear, here we go again. Of course, we agree with some of it; it would be difficult to disagree, and we obviously agree with point 4 about the UK Government job support scheme. But we heard this afternoon the Minister for local government and housing saying very clearly, as I've heard her say before, 'We don't know it all as a Government; we're not the fount of all wisdom'. Well you'd never know that, Llywydd, from their habit of 'delete all' amendments. I would submit to this Senedd that that is not a respectful way to proceed, and, at the very least, if we're going to spend our time on these opposition debates, the very least the Government ought to do is to give us the courtesy of line-by-line amendments.
Welsh: Diolch yn fawr, Lywydd. Rwy'n ddiolchgar i'r Ceidwadwyr, unwaith eto, am gyflwyno cyfle inni drafod yr economi. Credaf fod dau beth sy'n peri pryder i'n hetholwyr ledled Cymru ar hyn o bryd. Un ohonynt yw eu hiechyd a'r llall yw ffyniant a swyddi yn y dyfodol, ac rwy'n credu ei bod yn werthfawr iawn i ni gael y trafodaethau hyn. Wrth gwrs, nid ydym yn anghytuno â phopeth yng nghynnig y Ceidwadwyr o bell ffordd. Mae'n amlwg yn allweddol y dylai unrhyw effeithiau ar fusnesau yn sgil mesurau sy'n ymwneud â'r feirws fod yn gymesur. Credaf fod pwyntiau Russell George am ddata ar lefel wardiau yn rhai da - mae angen i bobl wybod beth yw'r sefyllfa. Dywedwyd wrthyf ei bod yn anodd cyhoeddi hynny oherwydd gellid adnabod unigolion. Wel, a bod yn gwbl onest, os yw'r sampl yn ddigon bach i allu adnabod unigolion, mae'n debyg nad oes angen i'r ward fod dan gyfyngiadau. Felly, rwy'n credu bod hynny'n rhywbeth - a gallai helpu gyda chydymffurfiaeth wrth gwrs. Os yw pobl yn deall pam y gofynnir iddynt aros gartref, maent yn fwy tebygol o wneud hynny. Fodd bynnag, lle na allwn gytuno yw'r safbwynt ynglŷn â'r hyn y mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi'i wneud hyd yma. Nawr, roedd y cynllun ffyrlo'n dda, er bod rhai pobl wedi'u gadael allan, roedd yna rai pobl na chafodd gymorth. Mae'r bobl hynny'n dal i ymgyrchu, a hoffwn ofyn i'r Aelodau edrych ar wefan ymgyrch ExcludedUK i weld sut y mae'r bobl hynny'n cael eu gadael allan - sut y mae wedi effeithio arnynt. Ond ar y cyfan, roedd yn gynllun pwerus iawn ac roedd yn gweithio'n dda iawn. Ac un o'r rhesymau pam y gweithiodd yn dda iawn yw ei fod wedi gweithio i gwmnïau llai yn ogystal ag i rai mwy o faint. Hoffwn sôn am welliannau 2 a 3 gyda'i gilydd, Lywydd, oherwydd maent yn cefnogi ei gilydd. O ran cymorth Llywodraeth y DU, gwyddom nad yw'r cynllun cefnogi swyddi, fel y mae'n cael ei gyflwyno ar hyn o bryd, yn gweithio i lawer o gwmnïau yng Nghymru. Nid yw'n gweithio ym maes lletygarwch; nid yw'n gweithio ym maes bwyd sy'n cael ei werthu drwy gyfanwerthwyr; nid yw'n gweithio i iechyd a harddwch; nid yw'n gweithio i dwristiaeth; nid yw'n gweithio i fusnesau bach. A dim ond pobl sydd wedi siarad â mi yr wythnos hon am gymorth na allant ei gael yw'r rheini. Nawr, gellid dadlau, Lywydd, fod hyn yn ddealladwy. Wyddoch chi, os yw Llywodraeth y DU yn gweithredu fel Llywodraeth Lloegr, rhaid inni gydnabod bod economi Cymru'n wahanol iawn i economi Lloegr, ac efallai y byddai'n briodol iddynt gyflwyno hynny. Ond nid yw'n gweithio'n dda iawn i lawer o'n busnesau ni. Felly, dyna'r rheswm dros ein gwelliant 2, sy'n pwysleisio'r pwynt unwaith eto fod angen i Lywodraeth Cymru gael pwerau benthyca i allu gweithredu ar rywfaint o hyn eu hunain. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru'n dweud o hyd nad oes ganddynt bŵer. Wel, credaf mai'r hyn sydd ei angen arnynt yw ychydig o asgwrn cefn i fynnu'r pŵer hwnnw. Dylent ofyn am y pwerau benthyca yn hytrach na chwyno, fel y gwnânt yn eu gwelliant, am yr hyn nad yw Llywodraeth y DU wedi'i wneud. Pam nad ydynt yn gofyn am y pŵer i gael yr arian i'w wneud eu hunain? Oherwydd, wrth gwrs, dyma sut y mae Llywodraeth y DU yn ei ariannu. Nid oes ganddynt goeden arian hud; maent yn benthyca ar y marchnadoedd rhyngwladol, sy'n ffordd gwbl synhwyrol o fwrw ymlaen. Dylai Llywodraeth Cymru fynnu'r hawl i wneud yr un peth. Nawr, o ran ein gwelliant 5 - ac i ryw raddau, rwy'n cytuno â Russell George yma - mae angen i Lywodraeth Cymru edrych eto ar elfennau o gyfnod newydd y gronfa cadernid economaidd. Mae llawer o bwyslais, yn y cynllun newydd, ar alwadau am geisiadau datblygu i gwmnïau allu symud ymlaen, ac efallai mai dyna'r peth priodol i'w wneud, o ystyried sefyllfa'r feirws pan oedd y cynllun hwn yn cael ei ddyfeisio'n hwyr yn yr haf. Ond mae pethau wedi newid. Wrth i fwy a mwy o ardaloedd fynd o dan gyfyngiadau lleol, credaf fod arnom angen fwy o gymorth brys. Ac rwy'n cytuno â'r pwynt y mae Russell George wedi'i wneud am gwmnïau heb arian yn eu poced ôl i gyfrannu at y math hwn o beth, yn enwedig busnesau bach a chanolig eu maint. Wrth i'r bylchau yn Llywodraeth y DU ddod yn gliriach, rhaid i Lywodraeth Cymru fod yn barod i ymateb, a rhaid i hynny olygu ymateb i amgylchiadau sydd wedi newid. Gwelliant y Llywodraeth - o diar, dyma ni eto. Wrth gwrs, rydym yn cytuno â rhywfaint ohono; byddai'n anodd anghytuno, ac rydym yn amlwg yn cytuno â phwynt 4 am gynllun cefnogi swyddi Llywodraeth y DU. Ond clywsom y prynhawn yma y Gweinidog llywodraeth leol a thai yn dweud yn glir iawn, fel y'i clywais yn dweud o'r blaen, 'Nid ydym yn gwybod y cyfan fel Llywodraeth; nid ni yw ffynnon pob doethineb'. Wel, ni fyddech chi byth yn meddwl hynny, Lywydd, o'u harfer o gyflwyno gwelliannau 'dileu popeth'. Hoffwn nodi wrth y Senedd hon nad yw honno'n ffordd anrhydeddus o fwrw ymlaen, a fan lleiaf, os ydym am dreulio ein hamser ar ddadleuon y gwrthbleidiau, y peth lleiaf y dylai'r Llywodraeth ei wneud yw dangos cwrteisi drwy roi gwelliannau fesul llinell i ni.