English: If you have a disability, you are more likely to be unemployed, and if you're in employment, you're more likely to be on the minimum wage. That's the reality for people with disabilities in Wales today. Whilst there are organisations like Barod - a community interest company based in Swansea, specialising in innovative training and information, where the owners and the workforce are an equal mix of disabled and non-disabled people, who specialise in bridging the gap between public and private sector organisations and people with learning disabilities - there are nowhere near enough companies of this type in order to get people with learning disabilities into employment. I'm old enough to remember when we used to have the green-card system. Companies were expected to employ a certain proportion of people with green cards and the percentage was reported. This disappeared, unfortunately, with the Disability Discrimination Act 1995, and I think that's done far more harm than it's actually done good, because then, you could hold employers to account. At the moment, it's very difficult to hold employers to account. I've got one further comment and two questions. We talk about disability as if it's one thing. There's a whole range of disabilities of varying degrees and problems for the people suffering from them. There are people who have very minor disabilities, who you wouldn't know were disabled if you saw them walking down the street, except that they might be walking a little slowly, to those who have very serious disabilities and multiple disabilities. So, I think we do tend to talk about disabled people as if they were one amorphous mass; they're not, they're a group of people with entirely different problems and different needs. Dai Lloyd mentioned the deaf community. My sister is profoundly deaf, which I've mentioned on more than one occasion in here, and it's incredibly difficult. An employer gets around any Act by saying 'the ability to answer the telephone.' That excludes anybody who is profoundly deaf. Many people would describe it as not an unreasonable thing to expect somebody to be able to do, but once you put that in, you exclude anybody who is deaf from working there. I've got two questions. What's the Welsh Government going to do to promote the employment of people with disabilities in Welsh Government, and, more importantly, in Welsh Government-funded bodies? That's something you've got direct control over, and you've also got direct control over those bodies you fund. He who pays the piper calls the tune. Although, he who gives the funding to an organisation can give them instructions. What more can be done to support organisations such as Barod, who are doing such a good job in treating people with disabilities and those who haven't as exactly the same? One of the problems we have is that, too often, we treat them differently. They may have a disability, but they must be treated and should be treated the same. So, what can we do to help organisations like that?
Welsh: Os oes gennych chi anabledd, rydych chi'n fwy tebygol o fod yn ddi-waith, ac os ydych chi mewn gwaith, rydych chi'n fwy tebygol o fod ar yr isafswm cyflog. Dyna'r realiti i bobl ag anableddau yng Nghymru heddiw. Er bod sefydliadau fel Barod - cwmni buddiannau cymunedol wedi'i leoli yn Abertawe, yn arbenigo mewn hyfforddiant a gwybodaeth arloesol, lle mae'r perchenogion a'r gweithlu yn gymysgedd gyfartal o bobl anabl a phobl nad ydynt yn anabl, sy'n arbenigo mewn pontio'r bwlch rhwng sefydliadau yn y sector cyhoeddus a phreifat a phobl ag anableddau dysgu - nid oes digon o bell ffordd o gwmnïau o'r math hwn er mwyn cael pobl ag anableddau dysgu i mewn i gyflogaeth. Rwy'n ddigon hen i gofio pan roedd gennym ni'r system cerdyn gwyrdd. Roedd disgwyl i gwmnïau gyflogi cyfran benodol o bobl gyda chardiau gwyrdd ac adroddwyd ar y ganran. Diflannodd hyn, yn anffodus, gyda'r Ddeddf Gwahaniaethu ar Sail Anabledd 1995, ac rwy'n credu bod hynny wedi gwneud llawer mwy o niwed na daioni, oherwydd bryd hynny, fe allech chi ddwyn cyflogwyr i gyfrif. Ar hyn o bryd, mae'n anodd iawn dwyn cyflogwyr i gyfrif. Mae gennyf i un sylw pellach a dau gwestiwn. Soniwn am anabledd fel pe bai'n un peth. Mae yna ystod eang o anableddau sy'n amrywio o ran eu graddau a'u problemau i'r bobl sy'n dioddef ohonynt. Mae pobl sydd ag anableddau bach iawn, na fyddech yn gwybod eu bod yn anabl pe byddech yn eu gweld yn cerdded i lawr y stryd, ac eithrio y gallent fod yn cerdded ychydig yn araf, i'r rheini sydd ag anableddau lluosog ac anableddau difrifol iawn. Felly, rwy'n credu ein bod yn tueddu i siarad am bobl anabl fel petaent yn un corff; dydyn nhw ddim, maen nhw'n grŵp o bobl sydd â phroblemau hollol wahanol ac anghenion gwahanol. Soniodd Dai Lloyd am y gymuned fyddar. Mae fy chwaer yn hollol fyddar, yr wyf wedi sôn amdani ar fwy nag un achlysur yn y fan yma, ac mae'n anhygoel o anodd. Mae cyflogwr yn gallu anwybyddu unrhyw Ddeddf drwy ddweud 'y gallu i ateb y ffôn'. Mae hynny'n eithrio unrhyw un sy'n hollol fyddar. Byddai llawer o bobl yn ei ddisgrifio fel rhywbeth nad yw'n afresymol disgwyl i rywun allu ei wneud, ond ar ôl ichi gynnwys hynny, rydych chi'n eithrio unrhyw un sy'n fyddar rhag gweithio yno. Mae gennyf i ddau gwestiwn. Beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn mynd i'w wneud i hyrwyddo cyflogi pobl ag anableddau yn Llywodraeth Cymru, ac, yn bwysicach, mewn cyrff a ariennir gan Lywodraeth Cymru? Mae hynny'n rhywbeth y mae gennych chi reolaeth uniongyrchol drosto, ac mae gennych chi reolaeth uniongyrchol hefyd dros y cyrff rydych yn eu hariannu. Y sawl sy'n talu'r delyn sy'n gofyn am y gân. Er hynny, gall yr hwn sy'n ariannu mudiad roi cyfarwyddyd. Beth arall gellir ei wneud i gefnogi sefydliadau fel Barod, sy'n gwneud gwaith mor dda o ran trin pobl ag anableddau a'r rhai nad oes ganddynt anableddau, yr un fath yn union? Un o'r problemau sydd gennym ni yw ein bod, yn rhy aml, yn eu trin yn wahanol. Efallai bod ganddyn nhw anabledd, ond mae'n rhaid eu trin a dylid eu trin yr un fath. Felly, beth allwn ni ei wneud i helpu sefydliadau fel hynny?