English: I rise to speak in this debate not because I have a particular interest in the important building in Cowbridge that has been referred to, but because I wanted to make some more general points about the significant impact that not listing important buildings of local and national heritage is having in other parts of the country. In my own constituency, there's a very prominent art deco property on the seafront in Rhos-on-Sea, which, unfortunately, is likely to be demolished because of a similar exchange of correspondence with Cadw and, indeed, the Minister. I know there's some sympathy from the Minister and others in this Chamber for trying to overhaul the system to make sure that we can afford properties like 57 Marine Drive in Rhos-on-Sea with the proper protection that they deserve. And it's not only that property that prompts me to speak today either. I also am involved - and I will declare an interest - with a charity, a small charity, called the Evan Roberts Institute. We acquired - . And I'm a trustee of the institute; I just want to put that on the record for interest purposes. We acquired a chapel in Loughor in south Wales called Pisgah. Now, Pisgah has absolutely no architectural merit whatsoever, but it is extremely important to the people of Wales because of its history and because of its association with the revivalist Evan Roberts. And if it hadn't been for the fact that we were able to acquire the building, that building would have been demolished and a bungalow would be sitting in its place right now. And I do fear, I am afraid to say, that there is a problem with Cadw in terms of the way it lists our buildings. It doesn't always look at the historical importance; it rather looks at the design of the building, whether there are any unique features and the architecture rather than the history and the things that are associated with it. And I think it's a tragedy, because we're going to lose more and more of these important parts of what Wales has emerged from, if you like, what makes the modern Wales we love, in the future. [ Interruption.] Yes, I'll happily take an intervention.
Welsh: Rwy'n codi i siarad yn y ddadl hon nid am fod gennyf ddiddordeb arbennig yn yr adeilad pwysig yn y Bont-faen y cyfeiriwyd ato, ond oherwydd fy mod am wneud rhai pwyntiau mwy cyffredinol am yr effaith sylweddol y mae peidio â rhestru adeiladau sy'n bwysig o ran treftadaeth leol a chenedlaethol yn ei chael mewn rhannau eraill o'r wlad. Yn fy etholaeth i, mae eiddo art déco amlwg iawn ar lan y môr yn Llandrillo-yn-Rhos yn debygol o gael ei ddymchwel, yn anffodus, yn sgil gohebiaeth debyg â Cadw, a'r Gweinidog yn wir. Gwn fod rhywfaint o gydymdeimlad gan y Gweinidog ac eraill yn y Siambr hon i geisio ailwampio'r system er mwyn sicrhau y gallwn roi'r warchodaeth y mae yn ei haeddu i eiddo fel 57 Marine Drive yn Llandrillo-yn-Rhos. Ac nid yr eiddo hwnnw'n unig sy'n fy annog i siarad heddiw ychwaith. Rwyf hefyd yn gysylltiedig - ac rwy'n datgan buddiant - ag elusen, elusen fach, o'r enw Sefydliad Evan Roberts. Fe wnaethom gaffael - . Ac rwy'n ymddiriedolwr i'r sefydliad; rwyf am gofnodi hynny er mwyn datgan buddiant. Rydym wedi caffael capel yng Nghasllwchwr yn ne Cymru o'r enw Pisgah. Nawr, nid oes unrhyw rinwedd pensaernïol o gwbl yn perthyn i Pisgah, ond mae'n eithriadol o bwysig i bobl Cymru oherwydd ei hanes ac oherwydd ei gysylltiad â'r diwygiwr Evan Roberts. A phe na byddem wedi gallu caffael yr adeilad, byddai'r adeilad hwnnw wedi'i ddymchwel a byddai byngalo wedi ei godi yn ei le erbyn hyn. Ac mae arnaf ofn fod problem gyda Cadw o ran y ffordd y mae'n rhestru ein hadeiladau. Nid yw bob amser yn edrych ar y pwysigrwydd hanesyddol; mae'n edrych yn hytrach ar gynllun yr adeilad, a oes unrhyw nodweddion unigryw, a'r bensaernïaeth yn hytrach na'r hanes a'r pethau sy'n gysylltiedig ag ef. Ac rwy'n credu bod hynny'n drasiedi, oherwydd yn y dyfodol rydym yn mynd i golli mwy a mwy o rannau pwysig o'r hyn y mae Cymru wedi codi ohono, os mynnwch, yr hyn sydd wedi esgor ar y Gymru fodern yr ydym yn ei charu. [ Torri ar draws.] Iawn, rwy'n hapus i dderbyn ymyriad.