input: Grad B: 
  Grad D: How many batteries do you go through ?
  Grad B: Thank you .
  Professor C: Alright .
  PhD A: Sure .
  Professor C: Good . Yeah . OK so , let 's get started . Nancy said she 's coming and that means she will be . Um . My suggestion is that Robert and Johno sort of give us a report on last week 's adventures uh to start . So everybody knows there were these guys f uh from Heidelber - uh , uh , actually from uh DFKI uh , part of the German SmartKom project , who were here for the week and , I think got a lot done .
  Grad E: Yeah , I think so too . Um . The {disfmarker} we got to the point where we can now speak into the SmartKom system , and it 'll go all the way through and then say something like " Roman numeral one , am Smarticus . " It actually says , " Roemisch einz , am Smarticus , "
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: which means it 's just using a German sythesis module for English sentences .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: So uh ,
  Professor C: It doesn't know " I " .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: Um , the uh
  Grad B: Oh , Am Spartacus . "
  Grad D: " I am Sm - I am Smarticus " is what it 's saying .
  PhD A: Right .
  Grad B: Verstehe . OK .
  Grad D: I gue
  Grad E: The uh sythesis is just a question of um , hopefully it 's just a question of exchanging a couple of files , once we have them . And , um , it 's not going to be a problem because we decided to stick to the so - called concept to speech approach . So I 'm {disfmarker} I 'm {disfmarker} I 'm going backwards now , so " synthesis " is where you sort of make this {disfmarker} uh , make these sounds , and " concept to speech " is feeding into this synthesis module giving it what needs to be said , and the whole syntactic structure so it can pronounce things better , presumably . Then , just with text to speech .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: And , uh , Johno learned how to write XML tags . Uh , and did write the tree adjoining grammar for some {disfmarker} some sentences . No , right ?
  Grad D: Yeah .
  Grad E: Yeah , for a couple {disfmarker}
  Grad D: So . Bu - Uh , i The way the uh , the dialogue manager works is it dumps out what it wants to know , or what it wants to tell the person , to a {disfmarker} er in XML and there 's a conversion system for different uh , to go from XML to something else . And th so , the knowledge base for the system , that generates the syntasti syntactic structures for the ge generation is uh , in a LISP - like {disfmarker} the knowledge base is in a LISP - like form . And then the thing that actually builds these syntactic structures is something based on Prolog . So , you have a {disfmarker} basically , a goal and it , you know , says " OK , well I 'm gonna try to do the Greet - the - person goal ,
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad D: so it just starts {disfmarker} uh , it binds some variables and it just decides to , you know , do some subscold . Basically , it just means " build the tree . "
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad D: And then it passes the tree onto , uh , the ge the generation module .
  Grad E: But I think that the point is that out of the twelve possible utterances that the German system can do , we 've already written the {disfmarker} the syntax trees for three or four .
  Grad D: We yeah . So , the syntax trees are very simple . It 's like most of the sentences in one tree ,
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad D: and instead of , you know , breaking down to , like , small units and building back up , they basically took the sentences , and basically cut them in half , or you know , into thirds or something like that , and made trees out of those . And so uh , uh Tilman wrote a little tool that you could take LISP notation and generate an XML , uh , tree . Uh , S what do ca structure from the {disfmarker} from the LISP . And so basically you just say , you know , " noun goes to " , you know , Er , nah , I don't re I 've never been good at those . So there 's like the VP goes to N and those things in LISP , and it will generate for you .
  Grad B: OK . N , N , V yeah , OK . Alright .
  Grad E: And because we 're sticking to that structure , the synthesis module doesn't need to be changed . So all that f fancy stuff , and the Texas speech version of it , which is actually the simpler version , is gonna be done in October which is much too late for us . So . This way we {disfmarker} we worked around that . The , uh {disfmarker} the system , um {disfmarker} I can show you the system . I actually want , at least , maybe , you should be able to start it on your own . If you wanna play around with it , in th in the future . Right now it 's brittle and you need to ch start it up and then make ts twenty changes on {disfmarker} on {disfmarker} on {disfmarker} on seventeen modules before they actually can stomach it , anything . And send in a {disfmarker} a {disfmarker} a couple of side queries on some dummy center set - up program so that it actually works because it 's designed for this seevit thing , where you have the gestural recognition running with this s Siemens virtual touch screen , which we don't have here .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: And so we 're doing it via mouse , but the whole system was designed to work with this thing and it was {disfmarker} It was a lot of engineering stuff . No science in there whatsoever , but it 's working now , and um , that 's the good news . So everything else actually did prove to be language independent except for the parsing and the generation .
  Grad D: Why {disfmarker} I had {disfmarker} I did need to chan generate different trees than the German ones , mainly because you know like uh , the gerund in {disfmarker} in German is automatically taken care of with just a regular verb ,
  Grad E: You have to switch it on .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad D: so I 'd uh have to add " am walking , "
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad D: or I 'd have to add a little stem for the " am " , when I build the {disfmarker} built the tree .
  Grad B: OK . Yeah , I noticed that um , that some of the examples they had , had you know , non - English word orders and so on , you know . And then all that good stuff . So .
  Professor C: Alright .
  Grad D: Yeah .
  Grad B: Like .
  Professor C: So it might be worth , Keith , you looking at this ,
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: um
  Grad B: I {disfmarker} I still don't {disfmarker} I still don't really understand e like {disfmarker}
  Grad D: Well Tilman s
  Grad B: I mean we sort of say , um {disfmarker} You know , I {disfmarker} I still don't exactly understand sort of the information flow uh in {disfmarker} in this thing , or what the modules are and so on . So , you know , like just that such - and - such module uh um decides that it wants to achieve the goal of greeting the user , and then magically it sort of s
  Professor C: Yeah {disfmarker}
  Grad B: I mean , how does it know which syntactic structure to pull out , and all that ?
  Professor C: I thi Yeah . So . I think it 's not worth going over in the group ,
  Grad B: R uh Sure .
  Professor C: but sort of when you get free and you have the time uh either Robert or Johno or I can walk you through it .
  Grad B: Yeah , soon . OK .
  Professor C: And you can ask all the questions about how this all fits together .
  Grad B: That 's fine .
  Professor C: It 's eee {comment} messy but once you understand it you understand it . It 's {disfmarker} it 's {disfmarker} There 's nothing really complicated about it .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: No .
  Grad B: And I remember one thing that {disfmarker} that came up in the talk last Wednesday . Um , was this , I {disfmarker} I think he talked about the idea of like , um {disfmarker} He was talking about these lexicalized uh , uh , tree adjoining grammars where you sort of {disfmarker} for each word you , um {disfmarker}
  Grad D: OK , you know how to do it ?
  Grad B: For each lexical item , the lexical entry says what all the uh trees are that it can appear in . And of course , that 's not v That 's the opposite of constructional . That 's , you know , that 's {disfmarker} that 's HPSG or whatever .
  Professor C: Right .
  Grad B: You know ?
  Professor C: Right . Now , we 're {disfmarker} we 're not committed for our research to {pause} do any of those things .
  Grad B: Yeah . Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: So uh we are committed for our funding .
  Grad B: Right .
  Professor C: OK ? to {pause} uh {disfmarker}
  Grad B: Make our stuff fit to that .
  Professor C: Yeah , to {disfmarker} n no , to just get the dem get the demos they need .
  Grad B: Uh - huh .
  Professor C: OK ? So between us all we have t to get th the demos they need . If it turns out we can also give them lots more than that by , you know , tapping into other things we do , that 's great .
  Grad D: You should probably move the microphone closer to your face .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: But i it turns out not to be in an any of the contracts
  Grad D: There 's like a little {disfmarker} The twisty thing , you can move it with .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: and , s deliberately . So , the reason I 'd like you to understand uh what 's going on in this demo system is not because it 's important to the research . It 's just for closure . So that if we come up with a question of " could we fit this deeper stuff in there ? " or something . You know what the hell we we 're talking about fitting in .
  Grad B: Right . OK .
  Professor C: So it 's just , uh in the sam same actually with the rest of us we just need to really understand what 's there . Is there anything we can make use of ? Uh , is there anything we can give back , beyond th the sort of minimum requirements ? But none of that has a short time fuse .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: So th the demo the demo requirements for this Fall are sort of taken care of as of later this week or something . And then {disfmarker} So , it 's probably fifteen months or something until there 's another serious demo requirement .
  Grad B: Oh OK .
  Professor C: That doesn't mean we don't think about it for fifteen months ,
  Grad B: Right .
  Professor C: but it means we can not think about it for six months .
  Grad B: Right , yeah .
  Professor C: So . The plan for this summer uh , really is to step back from the applied project ,
  Grad E: Right .
  Professor C: keep the d keep the context open , but actually go after the basic issues .
  Grad B: Hmm . Oh OK .
  Professor C: And , so The idea is there 's this uh , other subgroup that 's worrying about formalizing the nota getting a notation . But sort of in parallel with that , uh , the hope is tha in particularly you will work on constructions in English Ge - and German for this domain ,
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: but y not worry about parsing them or fitting them into SmartKom or any of the other {disfmarker} anything lik any other constraints for the time being .
  Grad B: Yeah . OK . Got it .
  Professor C: It 's hard enough to get it semantically and syntactically right and then {disfmarker} and get the constructions in their form and stuff .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: And , I don I don't want you f feeling that you have to somehow meet all these other constraints .
  Grad B: Right , OK .
  Professor C: Um . And similarly with the parsing , uh we 're gonna worry about parsing uh , the general case you know , construction parser for general constructions . And , if we need a cut - down version for something , or whatever , we 'll worry about that later .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: So I 'd like to , for the summer turn into science mode .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: And I assume that 's also , uh , your plan as well .
  Grad B: So I mean , the {disfmarker} the point is that like the meetings um so far that I 've been at have been {disfmarker} sort of been geared towards this demo ,
  Professor C: Right . Yeah . Yeah .
  Grad B: and then that 's going to go away pretty soon .
  Professor C: But {disfmarker} but we we 're swit
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: Right .
  Grad B: And then we 'll sort of shift gears a Fairly substantially ,
  Professor C: Yeah .
  Grad E: It 's {disfmarker}
  Professor C: Yeah .
  Grad B: huh ?
  Professor C: Yeah .
  Grad E: It 's got . What I {disfmarker} what I think is {disfmarker} is a good idea that I can {disfmarker} can show to anyone who 's interested , we can even make a {disfmarker} sort of an internal demo , and I {disfmarker} I show you what I do ,
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: I speak into it and you hear it talk ,
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: and I can sort of walk f through the information . So , this is like in half hour or forty - five minutes . Just fun .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: And so you {disfmarker} when somebody on the streets com comes up to you and asks you what is SmartKom so you can , sort of , give a sensible answer .
  Grad B: Right . OK .
  Professor C: So , c sh we could set that up as actually an institute wide thing ? Just give a talk in the big room , and {disfmarker} and so peo people know what 's going on ? when you 're ready ?
  Grad E: Absolutely .
  Professor C: Yeah I mean , that 's the kind of thing {disfmarker} That 's the level at which you know we can just li invite everybody and say " this is a project that we 've been working on and here 's a demo version of it " and stuff like that .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Grad E: OK . Well d we {disfmarker} we do wanna have all the bugs out b where you have to sort of pipe in extra XML messages from left and right before you 're {disfmarker}
  Grad B: Uh - huh .
  Professor C: Indeed .
  Grad E: Yeah . OK . Makes sense .
  Professor C: But any so that {disfmarker} e e It 's clear , then , I think . Actually , roughly starting uh let 's say , nex next meeting , cuz this meeting we have one other thing to tie up besides the trip report .
  Grad B: Yeah . OK .
  Professor C: But uh starting next meeting I think we want to flip into this mode where {disfmarker} Uh . I mean there are a lot of issues , what 's the ontology look like ,
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: you know what do the constructions look like , what 's the execution engine look like , mmm lots of things .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: But , more focused on uh an idealized version than just getting the demo out . Now before we do that , let 's get back in {disfmarker} Oh ! But , it 's still , I think , useful for you to understand the demo version enough , so that you can {disfmarker} can see what {disfmarker} what it is that {disfmarker} that uh it might eventually get retro - fitted into or something .
  Grad B: Yeah . OK , right .
  Professor C: And Johno 's already done that , uh , looked at the dem uh the {disfmarker} looked at the SmartKom stuff .
  Grad D: Wa uh {disfmarker} To some de uh what {disfmarker} what part of th the SmartKom stuff ?
  Professor C: Well , the parser , and that stuff .
  Grad D: Oh yeah {disfmarker} yeah .
  Professor C: OK . Anyway . So , the trip {disfmarker} the report on these {disfmarker} the last we we sort of interrupted you guys telling us about what happened last week .
  Grad B: Yeah . It 's alright .
  Grad E: Um . {vocalsound} Well it was just amazing to {disfmarker} to see uh how {disfmarker} how instable the whole thing is ,
  Professor C: Maybe you 're done , then .
  Grad E: and if you just take the {disfmarker} And I g I got the feeling that we are {pause} the only ones right now who have a running system . I don't know what the guys in Kaiserslautern have running because e the version {disfmarker} that is , the full version that 's on the server d does not work . And you need to do a lot of stuff to make it work . And so it 's {disfmarker} And even Tilman and Ralf sort of said " yeah there never was a really working version that uh did it without th all the shortcuts that they built in for the uh October @ @ version " . So we 're actually maybe ahead of the System Gruppe by now , the system {disfmarker} the integration group . And it was , uh {disfmarker} It was fun to some extent , but the uh the outcome that is sort of of scientific interest is that I think both Ralf and Tilman {disfmarker} um , I know that they enjoyed it here , and they r they {disfmarker} they liked , uh , a lot of the stuff they saw here , what {disfmarker} what we have been thinking about , and they 're more than willing to {disfmarker} to um , cooperate , by all means . And um , part of my responsibility is uh to use our internal " group - ware " server at EML , make that open to all of us and them , so that whatever we discuss in terms of parsing and {disfmarker} and generating and constructions w we {disfmarker} we sort of uh put it in there and they put what they do in there and maybe we can even um , get some overlap , get some synergy out of that . And um , the , uh {disfmarker} If I find someone at {disfmarker} in EML that is interested in that , um I {disfmarker} I may even think that we could look {disfmarker} take constructions and {disfmarker} and generate from them because the tree adjoining grammars that {disfmarker} that Tilman is using is as you said nothing but a mathematical formalism . And you can just do anything with it , whether it 's syntactic trees , H P S G - like stuff , or whether it 's construction . So if you ever get to the generation side of constructing things and there might be something of interest there , but in the moment we 're of course definitely focused on the understanding , um , pipeline .
  Professor C: Anyth - any other {vocalsound} {comment} uh repo visit reports sort of stories ? uh we {disfmarker} so we now know I think , what the landscape is like .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: And so we just push on and {disfmarker} and uh , do what we need to do . And one of the things we need to do is the um , and this I think is relatively tight {disfmarker} tightly constrained , is to finish up this belief - net stuff . So . Uh . And I was going to switch to start talking about that unless there 're m other more general questions . OK so here 's where we are on the belief - net stuff as far as I understand it . Um . Going back I guess two weeks ago uh Robert had laid out this belief - net , missing only the connections . Right ? That is {disfmarker} {comment} So , he 'd put all th all the dots down , and we went through this , and , I think , more or less convinced ourselves that at least the vast majority of the nodes that we needed for the demo level we were thinking of , were in there . Yeah {comment} we may run across one or two more . But of course the connections weren't . So , uh Bhaskara and I went off and looked at some technical questions about were certain operations sort of legitimate belief - net computations and was there some known problem with them or had someone already uh , solved you know how to do this and stuff . And so Bhaskara tracked that down . The answer seems to be uh , " no , no one has done it , but yes it 's a perfectly reasonable thing to do if that 's what you set out to do " . And , so the current state of things is that , again , starting now , um we 'd like to actually get a running belief - net for this particular subdomain done in the next few weeks . So Bhaskara is switching projects as of the first of June , and uh , he 's gonna leave us an inheritance , which is a uh {disfmarker} hopefully a belief - net that does these things . And there 're two aspects to it , one of which is , you know , technical , getting the coding right , and making it run , and uh stuff like that . And the other is the actual semantics . OK ? What all {disfmarker} you know , what are the considerations and how and what are the ways in which they relate . So he doe h he doesn't need help from this group on the technical aspects or if he does uh we 'll do that separately .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: But in terms of what are the decisions and stuff like that , that 's something that we all have to work out . Is {disfmarker} is that right ? I mean that 's {disfmarker} that 's both you guys ' understanding of where we are ?
  Grad E: Absolutely .
  Professor C: OK .
  Grad G: So , I guess , um {disfmarker} Is there like a latest version of the belief - net {disfmarker} of the proposed belief - net ? Like {disfmarker}
  Grad E: We had um decided {disfmarker}
  Grad G: like {disfmarker}
  Grad E: Um . Well , no , we didn't decide . We wanted to look into maybe getting it , the visualization , a bit clearer , but I think if we do it , um , sort of a paper version of all the nodes and then the connections between them , that should suffice .
  Grad G: Mm - hmm . Yeah , that should be fine .
  Professor C: Yeah I mean , that 's a separate problem .
  Grad D: Yeah , I {disfmarker}
  Professor C: We do in the long run wanna do better visualization and all that stuff .
  Grad E: Yeah .
  Professor C: That 's separable , yeah .
  Grad D: I did look into that , uh in terms of , you know , exploding the nodes out and down ag
  Professor C: Yep . Right .
  Grad D: JavaBayes does not support that . I can imagine a way of hacking at the code to do that . It 'd probably take two weeks or so to actually go through and do it ,
  Professor C: Not {disfmarker} not at this point .
  Grad D: and I went through all the other packages on Murph - Kevin Murphy 's page ,
  Professor C: Right .
  Grad D: and I couldn't find the necessary mix of free and uh with the GUI and , with this thing that we want .
  Professor C: Well , we can p If it 's {disfmarker} If we can pay {disfmarker} Yeah . If you know it 's paying a thousand dollars or something we can do that . OK ? So {disfmarker} so don't view free as {disfmarker} as a absolute constraint .
  Grad D: OK . OK , so then I 'll go back and look at the ones on the list that {disfmarker}
  Professor C: OK . And you can ask Kevin .
  Grad E: But {disfmarker}
  Grad G: Yeah .
  Grad D: Mmm .
  Grad E: But {disfmarker}
  Grad G: Yeah , the one that uh people seem to use is uh Hugin or whatever ?
  Professor C: Hugin , yeah that 's free .
  Grad G: How exp I don't think it 's {disfmarker} Is it free ? Because I 've seen it advertised in places so I {disfmarker} it seems to {disfmarker}
  Professor C: Uh , it may be free to academics . Like I {disfmarker} I don't know . I have a co {comment} I have a copy {comment} that I l I downloaded .
  Grad G: OK .
  Professor C: So , at one point it was free .
  Grad G: OK .
  Professor C: Uh but yo I noticed people do use Hugin so um ,
  Grad D: How do you spell that ?
  Professor C: HUGIN .
  Grad F: Why
  Professor C: And Bhaskara can give you a pointer . So then , in any case , um {disfmarker} But paying a lit You know , if i if it 's uh {disfmarker} Probably for university , it 's {disfmarker} it 's gonna be real cheap anyway . But um , you know , if it 's fifty thousand dollars we aren't gonna do it . I 'm mean , we have no need for that .
  Grad E: I {disfmarker} I also s would suggest not to d spend two weeks in {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} in changing the {disfmarker} the JavaBayes code .
  Professor C: No ,
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: he 's not gonna do that .
  Grad D: OK .
  Grad E: I {disfmarker} I will send you a pointer to a Java applet that does that , it 's sort of a fish - eye . You {disfmarker} you have a node , and you click on it , and it shows you all the connections ,
  Grad D: Mmm .
  Grad E: and then if you click on something else that moves away , that goes into the middle . And maybe there is an easy way of interfacing those two . If that doesn't work , it 's not a problem we {disfmarker} we need to solve right now . What I 'm {disfmarker} what my job is , I will , um , give you the input in terms of {disfmarker} of the internal structure . Maybe node by node , or something like this ? Or should I collect it all
  Grad G: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: and {disfmarker}
  Professor C: Doesn't matter .
  Grad G: Um , just any like {disfmarker} like sort of rough representation of the entire belief - net is probably best .
  Grad E: OK . And um you 're gonna be around ? t again , always Tuesdays and Thursdays afternoon - ish ? As usual ? Or will that change ?
  Grad G: Yeah {disfmarker} I mean , yeah , I can {disfmarker} like I c Um . This week I guess um , kind of {disfmarker} I have a lot of projects and stuff but after that I will generally be more free . So yes , I might {disfmarker} I can be around . And g I mean , generally if you email me also I can be around on other days .
  Grad E: Yeah . OK .
  Professor C: Yeah and this is not a crisis that {disfmarker} I mean , you do , e everybody who 's a student should , you know do their work , get their c courses all in good shape and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} and then we 'll dig {disfmarker} d dig down on this .
  Grad E: Yeah , that 's {disfmarker} Yeah . OK . No , that 's good . That means I have I h I can spend this week doing it . So .
  Grad G: OK .
  Grad B: How do you go about this process of deciding what these connections are ? I know that there 's an issue of how to weight the different things too , and stuff . Right ? I mean do you just sort of guess and see if it sort of {disfmarker}
  Professor C: Right . Well there {disfmarker} there {disfmarker} there There 're two different things you do .
  Grad E: It 's {disfmarker}
  Professor C: One is you design and the other is you learn . OK ? So uh what we 're gonna do initially is {disfmarker} is do design , and , i if you will , guess .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: OK . Uh that is you know use your best knowledge of {disfmarker} of the domain to uh , hypothesize what the dependencies are and stuff .
  Grad B: Right . OK .
  Professor C: If it 's done right , and if you have data then , there are techniques for learning the numbers given the structure
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: and there are even techniques for learning the structure , although that takes a lot more data , and it 's not as @ @ and so forth and so on . So uh but for the limited amount of stuff we have for this particular exercise I think we 'll just design it .
  Grad B: Alright .
  Grad E: Yeah . Fo - Hopefully as time passes we 'll get more and more data from Heidelberg and from people actually using it and stuff .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: So but this is the {pause} {vocalsound} {comment} {pause} long run .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Grad E: But to solve our problems ag uh a mediocre design will do I think in the beginning .
  Grad B: Yeah , that 's right . Yeah , oh , and by the way , speaking of data , um , are there I could swore {disfmarker} uh , I could swear I saw it sitting on someone 's desk at some point , but is there a {disfmarker} um a transcript of any of the , sort of , initial interactions of people with the {disfmarker} with the system ? Cuz you know , I 'm still sort of itching to {disfmarker} to look at what {disfmarker} look at the stuff , and see what people are saying .
  Professor C: Mm - hmm . Yeah . Yeah make yourself a note . So and {disfmarker} and , of course Keith would like the German as well as the English , so whatever you guys can get .
  Grad E: The German . Oh yeah , of course , German . Yeah .
  Professor C: Yeah , the y your native language , right ? You remember that one .
  Grad E: OK . That 's important , yeah .
  Grad B: Yeah ,
  Professor C: So he 'll get you some data .
  Grad B: u OK . Yeah , I mean I {disfmarker} I sort of um found the uh , uh the audio of some of those , and um , it kind of sounded like I didn't want to trudge through that , you know .
  Grad E: Hmm .
  Grad B: It was just {disfmarker} Strange , but .
  Professor C: Yep .
  Grad E: We probably will not get those to describe because they were trial runs .
  Grad B: Oh yeah , OK .
  Grad E: Um , but uh that 's th but we have data in English and German already .
  Grad B: OK , yeah , I mean .
  Grad E: So . {disfmarker} Transcribed . I will send you that . OK .
  Professor C: OK , so while we 're still at this sort of top level , anything else that we oughta talk about today ?
  Grad E: Ho - how was your thingy .
  Grad B: Oh , um , I just wanted to , uh , s like mention as an issue , um , you know last meeting I wasn't here because I went to a linguistics colloquium on the fictive motion stuff ,
  Professor C: Oh right .
  Grad B: and that was pretty interesting and you know , I mean , seems to me that that will fairly obviously be of relevance to uh {disfmarker} to what we 're doing here because you know people are likely to give descriptions like you know , " What 's that thing uh right where you start to go up the hill , " or something like that , you know , meaning a few feet up the hill or whatever from some reference point and all that stuff so I mean , I 'm sure in terms of you know , people trying to state locations or , you know , all that kind of stuff , this is gonna be very relevant . So , um , now that was {disfmarker} the talk was about English versus Japanese , um , which obviously the Japanese doesn't affect us directly , except that , um , some of the construction {disfmarker} he 'd {disfmarker} what he talked about was that you know in English we say things like th you know , " your bike is parked across the street " and we use these prepositional phrases , you know , " well , if you were to move across the street you would be at the bike " , but um in {disfmarker} in Japanese the {disfmarker} the more conventionalized tendency is to use a {disfmarker} sort of a description of " where one has crossed to the river , there is a tree " . Um , and you know , you can actually say things like , um , " there 's a tree where one has crossed the river , but no one has ever crossed the river " , or something like that . So the idea is that this really is you know that 's supposed show that 's it 's really fictive and so on . But um {disfmarker} But the point is that that kind of construction is also used in English , you know , like " right where you start to go up the hill " , or " just when you get off the train " , or something like that to {disfmarker} uh , to indicate where something is .
  Professor C: Mmm .
  Grad B: So we 'll have to think about {disfmarker}
  Professor C: So {disfmarker} how much is that used in German ?
  Grad E: Um . The uh {disfmarker} Well {disfmarker} I wa I was on a uh {disfmarker} on a {disfmarker} on a different sidetrack .
  Professor C: Oh , OK .
  Grad E: I mean , the {disfmarker} the Deep Map project which um is undergoing some renovation at {disfmarker} at the moment , but this is a {disfmarker} a three language project : German , English , Japanese .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: And um , we have a uh , uh {disfmarker} I have taken care that we have the {disfmarker} the Japanese generation and stuff . And so I looked into uh spatial description . So we can generate spatial descriptions , how to get from A to B . And {disfmarker} and information on objects , in German , English , and Japanese .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: And there is a huge uh project on spatial descriptions uh {disfmarker} differences in spatial descriptions . Well , if yo if you 're interested in that , so how {disfmarker} how , I mean it does sort of go d all the way down to the conceptual level to some extent .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: So . Um .
  Professor C: So , where is this huge project ?
  Grad E: It 's KLEIST . It 's the uh Bielefeld generation of uh spatial descriptions and whatever .
  Professor C: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: 
  Professor C: Well , that may be another thing that Keith wants to look at .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: But um , I {disfmarker} I think we should leave Japanese constructions maybe outside of the scope for {disfmarker} for now ,
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Grad E: but um definitely it 's interesting to look at {disfmarker} at cross the bordered there .
  Professor C: Mm - hmm .
  PhD A: Are {disfmarker} are you going to p pay any attention to the relative position {disfmarker} of {disfmarker} of the direction relative {disfmarker} relative to the speaker ? For example , there are some differences between Hebrew and English . We can say um " park in front of the car " as you come beh you drive behind the car . In Hebrew it means " park behind the car " , because to follow the car is defined as it faces you .
  Grad E: Mm - hmm . Intrinsic , yeah .
  PhD A: While in English , front of the car is the absolute front of the car .
  Grad B: OK .
  PhD A: So .
  Grad B: Right , so the canonical direction of motion determines where the front is .
  PhD A: Right . Right .
  Grad B: OK .
  PhD A: So , i i i is German uh closer to {disfmarker} to E uh , uh , uh , uh {disfmarker} to E I mean uh
  Grad E: Mm - hmm .
  PhD A: I don't think it {disfmarker} it 's related to syntax , though , so it may be entirely different .
  Grad E: Um , as a matter of fact {disfmarker}
  Professor C: No , it 's not .
  Grad B: Right .
  PhD A: Yeah .
  Grad E: Um . Did you ever get to look at the {disfmarker} the rou paper that I sent you on the {disfmarker} on that problem in English and German ?
  Grad B: I think {disfmarker}
  Grad E: Carroll , ninety - three . Um . I {disfmarker} There is a {disfmarker} a study on the differences between English and German on exactly that problem .
  PhD A: Hmm .
  Grad E: So it 's {disfmarker} they actually say " the monkey in front of the car , where 's the monkey ? "
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: And , um , they found statistically very significant differences in English and German , so I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} It might be , since there are only a finite number of ways of doing it , that {disfmarker} that German might be more like Hebrew in that respect .
  Grad B: Hmm .
  Grad E: The solution they proposed was that it was due to syntactic factors .
  PhD A: That {disfmarker} but it wasn't {disfmarker} was {disfmarker}
  Grad E: That syntactic facto factors do {disfmarker} do play a role there , wh whether you 're more likely , you know , to develop uh , choices that lead you towards using uh intrinsic versus extrinsic reference frames .
  PhD A: Right . Mm - hmm . Right .
  Grad B: I mean , it seems to me that you can get both in {disfmarker} in English depending o
  Professor C: Hmm .
  Grad B: You know , like , " in front of the car " could you know {disfmarker} Like , here 's the car sideways to me in between me and the car or something 's in front of the car , or whatever . I could see that ,
  Professor C: Absolutely .
  Grad B: but {disfmarker} But anyway , so you know , I mean , this was {disfmarker} this was a {disfmarker} a very good talk on those kinds of issues and so on . So uh .
  Grad E: I can also give you uh , a pointer to a paper of mine which is the {disfmarker} the ultimate taxonomy of reference frames .
  Grad B: Alright ! Cool !
  Grad E: So .
  Professor C: Oh .
  Grad E: I 'm the only person in the world who actually knows how it works .
  Professor C: Oh .
  Grad E: Not really .
  Professor C: Great . No , I 've not seen that .
  PhD A: What do you mean . Um . " reference frames " ?
  Grad E: It 's called a {disfmarker}
  PhD A: uh uh
  Grad E: It 's {disfmarker} it 's spatial reference frames . You actually have only {disfmarker} Um . If you wanna have a {disfmarker} This is usually um {disfmarker} I should {disfmarker} there should be an " L " , though . Well actually you have {disfmarker} only have two choices . You can either do a two - point or a three - point which is you You 're familiar with th with the " origo " ? where that 's the center {disfmarker} " Origo " is the center of the f frame of reference .
  Grad B: Hmm .
  Grad E: And then you have the reference object and the object to be localized .
  Grad B: Hmm .
  PhD A: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: OK ? In some cases the origo is the same as the reference object .
  Professor C: So that would be " origin " in English ,
  Grad F: This was like {disfmarker}
  Grad B: The origin .
  PhD A: Right
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: right ?
  Grad E: " Origo " is a Terminus technikus . in that sense , that 's even used in the English literature . " Origo . "
  Grad B: Oh , OK . I never heard it .
  Professor C: Alright .
  PhD A: OK .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: And um , so , this video tape is in front of me .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: I 'm the origo and I 'm also the reference object .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  PhD A: Right .
  Grad E: Those are two - point .
  Professor C: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: And three - point relations is if something has an intrinsic front side like this chair then your f shoe is behind the chair .
  Professor C: Yeah .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: And , reference object and {disfmarker} Um . No , from {disfmarker} from my point of view your shoe is left of the chair .
  Grad B: Right . You {disfmarker} you can actually say things like , um , " it 's behind the tree from me " or something like that , I think , in {disfmarker} in {disfmarker} in certain circumstances in English , right ? As sort of " from where I 'm standing it would appear that " {disfmarker}
  Grad E: Yeah . Yeah . So ,
  Grad F: Looks a little bit like Reichenbach for time .
  Professor C: Yeah , it sounds like it , doesn't it ,
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: yeah .
  Grad F: It 's a lot like it .
  Grad E: And then {disfmarker} and then here you {disfmarker}
  Grad F: Um .
  Grad E: On this scale , you have it either be ego or allocentric .
  Professor C: Mm - hmm .
  Grad E: And that 's {comment} {disfmarker} that 's basically it . So . Egocentric two - point , egocentric three - point , or you can have allocentric .
  Grad B: Oh , OK .
  Grad E: So , " as seen from the church , the town hall is right of that um , fire station " . aa - huh {comment} It 's hardly ever used but it 's w
  PhD A: I 'd love to see it if you {disfmarker} if you have a copy kind of . Uh .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: Yeah . I see this is {disfmarker} this is getting into Ami 's thing .
  PhD A: Here
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: He 's {disfmarker} he 's very interested in that .
  Grad E: OK .
  Professor C: So .
  Grad B: Me too .
  Professor C: Uh . Yeah . Well , why don't you just put it on the web page ? There 's this EDU {disfmarker} Right ?
  Grad E: Yeah it 's {disfmarker} or {disfmarker} or just {disfmarker} Yeah .
  Professor C: Or a link to it .
  Grad E: It 's also all on my {disfmarker} my home page at EML . It 's called " An Anatomy of a Spatial Description " .
  Professor C: Just
  Grad E: But I 'll send that link .
  PhD A: OK , great .
  Professor C: Maybe just put a link on . Yeah .
  Grad E: Yep .
  Professor C: By the way , there {disfmarker} something that I didn't know until about a week ago or so , is apparently , there are separate brain areas for things within reach , and things that are out of reach .
  Grad E: Yep .
  Grad B: Huh .
  Professor C: So there 's {disfmarker} there 's uh all this linguistic stuff about you know , near and far , or yon and {disfmarker} and so forth .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: So this is all {disfmarker} This is {disfmarker} There 's this linguistic facts . But apparently , the {disfmarker} Uh . Here 's the way the findings go . That , you know they do MRI , and {disfmarker} and if you 're uh {disfmarker} got something within reach then there 's one of your areas lights up , and if something 's out of reach uh a different one . But here 's the {disfmarker} the amazing result , um , they say . You get someone with a {disfmarker} with a deficit so that they have a perfectly normal ability at distance things . So the s typical task is subdivision . So there 's a {disfmarker} a line on the wall over there , and you give them a laser pointer , and you say , " Where 's the midpoint ? " And they do fine . If you give them the line , and they have to touch it , they can't . There 's just that part of the brain isn't functioning , so they can't do that . Here 's the real experiment . The same thing on the wall , you give them a laser , " where is it ? " ,
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: they do it . Give them a stick , long stick , and say " do it " , they can't do it . So there 's a remapping of distant space into nearby space .
  PhD A: Right . So they doubled {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the end {disfmarker} the end of this {disfmarker}
  Grad F: Because it 's within reach now ?
  Grad B: Yeah ,
  Professor C: It 's not within reach and you use the Within - Reach uh , mechanism .
  Grad B: yeah .
  Grad F: Oh . Wow .
  Grad B: Circuits .
  PhD A: Right .
  Professor C: So I 'll d I 'll dig you up this reference .
  Grad B: That 's cool .
  Professor C: And so this doe This is , uh {disfmarker} First of all , it explains something that I 've always wondered about and I 'll do this {disfmarker} this test on you guys as well . So . Uh . How - I have had an experience , not often , but a certain number of times , when , for example , I 'm working with a tool , a screwdriver or something , for a long time , I start feeling the tip directly . Not indirectly , but you actually can feel the tip .
  Grad B: Yeah yeah .
  Professor C: And people who are uh accomplished violinists and stuff like that , claim they also have this kind of thing where you get a direct sensation of , physical sensation , of the end affector .
  Grad B: Yeah . What 's going on at the end of the tool ,
  PhD A: The ext the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} The extension ,
  Grad B: yeah .
  Professor C: Huh ?
  Grad B: What 's going on at the end of the tool , or whatever .
  Professor C: Yeah , within {disfmarker}
  PhD A: right .
  Professor C: Huh ?
  PhD A: The extension of {disfmarker} of your hand , right .
  Professor C: Yeah , right . Have you hav y h had this ?
  PhD A: The {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I think so . I mean i i it 's not exactly the th same thing , but {disfmarker} but s it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} it 's getting close to that .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Grad F: W what does it feel like ?
  Professor C: Oh i it feels like your {disfmarker} as if your uh neurons had extended themselves out to this tool , and you 're feeling forces on it and so forth and {disfmarker} and you deal directly with it .
  PhD A: I once {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} I was playing you know with those um uh devices that allow you to manipulate objects when it 's dangerous to get close ? So you can insert your hand something
  Grad B: Oh , OK .
  Professor C: Right , yeah {disfmarker} yeah {disfmarker} yeah . Yeah .
  PhD A: and there 's a correspondence between {disfmarker}
  Professor C: Yeah .
  PhD A: So I played with it . After a while , you don't feel the difference anymore . I {disfmarker} I mean it 's kind of {disfmarker}
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: Yeah , right .
  PhD A: Very {disfmarker} kind of {disfmarker} you stop back and suddenly it goes away and you have to kind of work again to recapture it , but yeah .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: Right , Yeah , so anyway , so {disfmarker} So this was the first actual experimental evidence I 'd seen that was consistent with this anecdotal stuff .
  Grad B: That 's cool .
  Professor C: And of course it makes a lovely def uh story about why languages uh , make this distinction . Of course there are behavioral differences too . Things you can reach are really quite different than things you can't .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: But there seems to be an actu really deep embodied neural difference . And i this is , um {disfmarker} So . In addition to the e
  Grad E: This is more proximal - distal .
  Professor C: Yeah uh exactly . So in addition to e ego and allocentric uh which appear all over the place , you also apparently have this proximal - distal thing which is very deeply uh embedded . S
  Grad E: Well , Dan Montello sort of , he {disfmarker} he does the uh uh {disfmarker} th the cognitive map world , down in Santa Barbara . And he {disfmarker} he always talks about these {disfmarker} He {disfmarker} he already {disfmarker} well {disfmarker} i probably most likely without knowing this {disfmarker} this evidence uh is talking about these small scale spaces that you can manipulate versus large scale environmental spaces .
  Professor C: Yeah . Well there 's {disfmarker} there 's uh been a lot of behavioral things o on this , but that was the first neur neuro - physiological thing I saw . Anyway yeah , so we 'll {disfmarker} we 'll look at this . And . So , all of these issues now {disfmarker} are now starting to come up . So , now {disfmarker} we 're now done with demos . We 're starting to do science , right ? And so these issues about uh , reference , and {disfmarker} spatial {comment} reference , discourse reference , uh - uh - uh - uh {comment} all this sort of stuff , uh , deixis which is part of what you were talking about ,
  Grad B: Mm - hmm . Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: um {disfmarker} So , all of this stuff is coming up essentially starting now . So we gotta do all this . So there 's that . And then there 's also a set of system things that come up . So " OK , we 're not using their system . That means we need our system . "
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: Right ?
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: It {disfmarker} it follows . And so , uh , in addition to the business about just getting the linguistics right , and the formalism and stuff , we 're actually gonna build something and uh , Johno is point person on the parser , analyzer , whatever that is , and we 're gonna start on that in parallel with the um , the grammar stuff .
  Grad B: Alright .
  Professor C: But to do that we 're gonna need to make some decisions like ontology , so , um {disfmarker} And so this is another thing where we 're gonna , you know , have to get involved and make s relatively early I think , make some decisions on uh , " is there an ontology API that {disfmarker} that " {disfmarker} There 's a sort of standard way of getting things from ontologies and we build the parser and stuff around that , or is there a particular ontology that we 're gonna standardize on , and if so {disfmarker} For example , is there something that we can use there . i Does uh either the uh SmartKom project or one of the projects at EML have something that we can just p pull out , for that . Uh , so there are gonna be some {disfmarker} some {disfmarker} some things like that , which are not science but system . But we aren't gonna ignore those cuz we 're {disfmarker} we 're not only going {disfmarker} The plan is not only to lay out this thing , but to actually uh build some of it . And how much we build , and {disfmarker} and so forth .
  Grad B: I {disfmarker}
  Professor C: Uh . Part of it , if it works right , is wh It looks like we 're now in a position that the construction analyzer that we want for this applied project can be the same as the construction analyzer that Nancy needs for the child language modeling . So . It 's always been out of phase but it now seems that um , there 's a good shot at that . So we 've talked about it , and the hope is that we can make these things the same thing ,
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: and of course it 's only w In both cases it 's only one piece of a bigger system .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: But it would be nice if that piece were exactly the same piece .
  Grad B: Right .
  Professor C: It was just this uh construction analyzer . And so we think {disfmarker} we think we have a shot at {disfmarker} at that .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: So . The for So . To {disfmarker} to come full circle on that , this formalization task , OK ? is trying to get the formalism into {disfmarker} into a shape where it can actually uh
  Grad B: Yeah . Be of use to someone who 's trying to do this , right ?
  Professor C: d Well , yeah , where it actually is {disfmarker} is {disfmarker} covers the whole range of things . And the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the {disfmarker} the thing that got Mark into the worst trouble is he had a very ambitious thing he was trying to do , and he insisted on trying to do it with a limited set of mechanisms . It turned out , inherently not to cover the space .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: And it just {disfmarker} it was just terribly frustrating for him ,
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: and he seemed fully committed to both sides of this i i irreconcilable thing .
  Grad B: I see . Right .
  Professor C: And . Uh . Johno is much more pragmatic .
  Grad B: OK . Good to know .
  Professor C: Uh . Huh ? Is {disfmarker} This is true , is it not ?
  Grad D: Yes .
  Professor C: OK . So there 's you know sort of , yeah , deep , really deep , emotional commitment to a certain theory being uh , complete .
  Grad B: Oh , OK .
  Grad F: You don't have a hidden purist streak ?
  Grad D: Oh no .
  Professor C: We - well it hasn't it {disfmarker} it certainly hasn't been observed , in any case .
  Grad F: OK . Just checking .
  Grad D: No sir .
  Grad B: Alright .
  Professor C: Um . Now , you do , but that 's OK . Uh . So . For {disfmarker} for {disfmarker}
  Grad B: Cuz I don't have to implement anything .
  Professor C: Exactly right . Exactly .
  Grad F: I have a problem , then . It 's {disfmarker} So . Whether I do depends on whether I 'm talking to him or him probably .
  PhD A: Hmm .
  Grad B: Yeah , right .
  Professor C: Right . Why {disfmarker} a actually , uh , the thing is , you {disfmarker} you do but , th the thing you have to im implement is so small that {disfmarker} Uh .
  Grad F: Which meeting I 'm in . It 's OK to be purist within that context .
  Professor C: Within that , yeah ,
  Grad F: Yes ,
  Professor C: and uh , it 's {disfmarker} a and still , I think , you know , get something done .
  Grad F: good .
  Grad B: Cool !
  Professor C: But to try to do something upscale and purist Particularly if {disfmarker} if um what you 're purist about doesn't actually work , {vocalsound} is real hard .
  Grad F: Yay .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm . Yeah .
  Professor C: OK . And then the other thing is while we 're doing this uh Robert 's gonna pick a piece of this space ,
  PhD A: It 's possible yeah .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: OK , uh , for his absentee thesis . I think you all know that {disfmarker} that you can just , in Germany {disfmarker} almost just send in your thesis .
  Grad B: Just a drive up . Ca - chuk !
  PhD A: Um
  Professor C: Yeah right .
  Grad B: There you go .
  Professor C: OK .
  Grad E: The - th There {disfmarker} there 's a drive - in thesis uh sh {vocalsound} joint over in Saarbruecken .
  Grad B: Exactly . Drive through , yeah .
  Professor C: It costs a lot . The {disfmarker} the amount {disfmarker} You put in your credit card and {disfmarker} {vocalsound} as well . But , uh , {disfmarker} But anyway , so , uh , that 's um , also gotta be worked out , hopefully over the next few weeks , so that {disfmarker} that it becomes clear uh , what piece uh , Robert wants to jump into . And , while we 're at this level , uh , there 's at least one new doctoral student in computer science who will be joining the project , either next week or the first of August , depending on the blandishments of Microsoft .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: So , de Uh . And her name is Eva .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: It really is . Nobody believed th th that {disfmarker}
  Grad F: Yeah , I thought it had to be a joke , of your part , you know
  Professor C: Yeah .
  Grad F: like {disfmarker} {comment} " Johno made it up , I 'm sure . "
  Grad G: Is this person someone who 's in first - year this year ,
  Professor C: No , first year coming .
  Grad G: or
  Professor C: So , she 's {disfmarker} she 's now out here she 's moved , and she 'll be a student as of then .
  Grad G: OK .
  Professor C: And probably she 'll pick up from you on the belief - net stuff , so sh she 'll be chasing you down and stuff like that .
  Grad G: OK .
  Professor C: Uh .
  Grad E: Document .
  Grad G: Right .
  Professor C: Uh , against all traditions . And actually I talked today to a uh undergraduate who wants to do an honors thesis on this . Uh {disfmarker}
  Grad F: Someone from the class ?
  Professor C: No , interestingly enough .
  Grad F: We always get these people who are not in the class , who {disfmarker}
  Professor C: Some of th some of them , yeah .
  Grad F: It 's interesting .
  Professor C: So anyway , uh , but uh she 's another one of these ones with a three point nine average and so forth and so on .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: Uh , so , um , I 've give I 've given her some things to read . So we 'll see how this goes . Oh there 's yet another one of the incoming first {disfmarker} {comment} incoming first - year graduate students who 's expressed interest , so we 'll see how that goes . Um , anyway , so , I think as far as this group goes , um , it 's certainly worth continuing for the next few weeks to get closure on the uh belief - net and the ideas that are involved in that , and what are th what are the concepts . We 'll see whether it 's gonna make sense to have this be separate from the other bigger effort with the formalization stuff or not , I 'm not sure . It partly depends on w what your thesis turns out to be and how that goes . S so , we 'll see . And then , Ami , you can decide , you know , how much time you wanna put into it and uh , it it 's beginning to take shap shape ,
  PhD A: OK .
  Professor C: so uh and ,
  PhD A: Right
  Professor C: I think you will find that if you want to look technically at some of the {disfmarker} your traditional questions in this light , uh Keith , who 's buil building constructions , will be quite happy to uh see what , you know , you envision as the issues and the problems and um , how they might uh get reflected in constructions .
  Grad B: Sure .
  Professor C: I suspect that 's right .
  Grad B: Yeah . Yeah .
  PhD A: I {disfmarker} I may have to go to Switzerland for {disfmarker} in June or beginning of July for between two weeks and four weeks , but uh , after that or before that .
  Professor C: OK , fine . And , um , if it 's useful we can probably arrange for you to drop by and visit either at Heidelberg or at the German AI center , while you 're in {disfmarker} in the neighborhood .
  PhD A: Right . Yeah be uh actu actually I 'm invited to do some consulting with a bank in Geneva which has an affiliation with a research institute in Geneva , which I forgot the name of .
  Professor C: Yeah . Yep . E o do y
  PhD A: Yeah .
  Professor C: Well , we we 're connected to uh {disfmarker} There 's a {disfmarker} there 's a {disfmarker} a very significant connection between {disfmarker} We 'll {disfmarker} we 'll go through this ,
  PhD A: Yeah .
  Professor C: ICSI and EPFL , which is the , uh {disfmarker} It 's the {disfmarker} Fr Ge - Germany 's got two big technical institutes . There 's one in {disfmarker} in Zurich ,
  PhD A: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: E T and then there 's one , the French speaking one , in Lausanne ,
  Grad B: Oh , so in Switzerland .
  Professor C: OK ? which is uh E P
  PhD A: Great .
  Professor C: F L . So find out who they are associated with in Geneva .
  PhD A: Right .
  Professor C: Probably we 're connected to them .
  PhD A: Great . I 'll let you know . S I 'll send you email .
  Professor C: OK . Yeah , and so anyway we c uh {disfmarker} We can m undoubtedly get Ami uh to give a talk at uh EML or something like that . While he 's in {disfmarker} in uh {disfmarker}
  Grad E: Hmm . Uh . I {disfmarker} I think the one you {disfmarker} you gave here a couple of weeks ago would be of interest there , too .
  PhD A: Sure , yeah .
  Professor C: A lot of interest . Actually , either place , DFKI or uh {disfmarker} Yeah , so , and {disfmarker} and if there is a book , that you 'll be building up some audience for it .
  PhD A: Yeah . Right .
  Professor C: And you 'll get feedback from these guys .
  PhD A: Great , yeah .
  Professor C: Cuz they 've actually {disfmarker} these DFKI guys have done as much as anyone over the last decade in trying to build them . So we 'll set that up .
  PhD A: Cool .
  Professor C: OK . So , uh , unless we wanna start digging into the {disfmarker} uh the belief - net and the decisions now , which would be fine , it 's probably {disfmarker}
  Grad E: I {disfmarker} I tho It 's probably better if I come next week with the um version O point nine of the structure .
  Professor C: OK . So , how about if you two guys between now and next week come up with something that is partially proposal , and partially questions , saying " here 's what we think we understand , here are the things we think we don't understand " . And that we as a group will try to {disfmarker} to finish it . What I 'd like to do is shoot f for finishing all this next Monday .
  Grad G: Sure .
  Professor C: OK ? Uh , " these are the decisions " {disfmarker} I don't think we 're gonna get lots more information . It 's a design problem .
  Grad B: Mm - hmm .
  Professor C: You know . We {disfmarker}
  Grad G: Yeah .
  Professor C: Yeah . And let 's come up with a first cut at what this should look like . And then finish it up .
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: Does that so make sense ?
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad E: And um , the {disfmarker} the sem semester will be over next week but then you have projects for one more week to come ?
  Grad G: No , I {disfmarker} I think I 'll be done {disfmarker} everything by this uh {disfmarker} by the end of this week .
  Grad E: Same with you ? No .
  Grad D: Nnn . This {disfmarker} Well , I 've {disfmarker} I have projects , but then the {disfmarker} my prof professor of one of my classes also wa has a final that he 's giving us . And he 's giving us five days to do it which means it going to be hard .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: Yeah . Oh . is it a take - home final ? Who 's doing this ?
  Grad D: Yeah . Aikin , Alex , yeah .
  Professor C: Yeah , figured . That would have been i my guess .
  Grad G: Hmm .
  Professor C: Right . Um , But anyway , yeah .
  Grad B: Pretty soon .
  Grad E: OK .
  Professor C: OK , so I guess that 's
  Grad D: So , the seventeenth will definitely be the last day , like it or not for me .
  Professor C: Right . right . So let 's do this , and then we we well there 's gonna be some separate co these guys are talking , uh we have a group on the formalization , uh Nancy and Johno and I are gonna talk about parsers . So there 're various kinds of uh {disfmarker}
  Grad B: OK .
  Professor C: Of course , nothing gets done even in a meeting of seven people ,
  Grad B: Right .
  Professor C: right ? So , um , two or three people is the size in which actual work gets done .
  Grad E: Mmm .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: So we 'll do that . Great . Oh , the other thing we wanna do is catch up with uh , Ellen and see what she 's doing because the um image schemas are going to be um , an important pa
  Grad B: Yeah . Quite relevant , yeah .
  Professor C: We {disfmarker} we want those ,
  Grad B: Yeah , oh yeah .
  Professor C: right ? And we want them formalized and stuff like that .
  Grad B: Yeah .
  Professor C: So let me {disfmarker} let me make a note to do that .
  Grad B: OK . Yeah , I 'm actually probably going to be in contact with her uh pretty soon anyway because of various of us students were going to have a reading group about precisely that sort of thing over the summer ,
  Grad D: OK .
  Professor C: Oh right ! Right right right !
  Grad B: so .
  Professor C: That 's great ! Yeah , I {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} Shweta mentioned that , although she said it 's a secret .
  Grad B: OK .
  Grad D: Hi
  Grad B: Right , no faculty !
  Professor C: Th - the faculty aren't {disfmarker} faculty aren't supposed to know .
  Grad D: Wednesday 's much better for me , yeah .
  Professor C: But um , I 'm sufficiently clueless that I count as a {disfmarker}
  Grad B: Yeah , right . It 's as if we didn't tell anyone at all ,
  Grad D: Bhaskara .
  Grad B: right .
input_prefix: What would happen after the demo?
output: After the demo, the focus of research can switch towards purely scientific goals, including issues on ontology, deep semantic constructions, execution engines etc. Moreover, a new system will be designed for the project and at least some parts of it should be built.