We'll wait for that to finish. And we'll be right back. Alright, so we have our multi-sig address is after a little bit of time.


Creating a Quantum Resistant Multisig Wallet

It has been confirmed by the network. So, what we're going to do is we're going to go into tools, multi-sig, and that multi-sig address that we created has 25 quantity in it.


And what we're going to do is I'm going to create a multi-sig transaction. So, this is going to, this is asking me where I want to send Quanta from. And then after I type after I create this transaction, then two or two out of the three of us need to vote on it.


And once that vote finally meets the threshold, then it just gets spent. So, Jack, I'm going to send this back to you.


Oh, thanks. Here we're welcome. I'll give you all 25 of them back. And double check everything here.


Actually, I probably need a little bit for a 24.5 transaction fee. And I'll click on confirm. And there we go.


So, we've, so under create up here, we created the multi-sig address, which is a multi-sig wallet.


Then we went to spend and we created a multi-sig transaction. And that transaction is now being processed by the network. And once that transaction is finished to processed, processed by the QRL nodes on the network.


Then we can have Ryan and Jack who will vote on it. And then that'll meet the, that'll meet the waiting of two. And then that transaction will automatically go through and Jack should get that 25 quanta back.


So, that's right. Transaction is complete. It looks like it's been confirmed.


Nice. And then I'll just select in here. Looks like that's the transaction right there 24.5. It shows up automatically for you. So, I'm going to hand it over to you now. Jack, why don't you, you don't do the first vote.


All right, yeah. So I'll share my screen here. I have a wallet open here. I'm going to go to the tools tab multi-sig vote and select the transaction you vote on and then click it.


And it's going to give me the details to the transaction and I want to approve it. Not rejected, especially since it's going to back into my wallet.


So, you can get across one quanta and I can confirm. Now, the OTS key is for my own wallet. So it shares the same OTS index and send now wait for that to get posted to the network.


So, I'm going to get this up will be right turn to confirm or prove to transaction. Okay, so I'm here as well in the tools box here. We're going to hit multi-sig. I am here. You're going to hit the vote.


So, I'm going to click the same one. Scroll down and here doing the same thing, making sure that I'm approving it, not rejecting. There's the small fee there we're going to confirm.


So, it's time to click the send approved and it will push through. So, there you go. There's a multi-sig create transactions transaction, which was created by Michael and then I voted as well as Ryan and I received it from the multi-sig spent transaction because the threshold of two was met.


So, 26-cloner that I can spend anywhere I want.


Awesome, Jack. Well, that kind of wraps up the multi-sig address walkthrough. In closing of this part, strike, can you just go over where kind of like a starting point or a first step would be for someone that maybe is familiar with multi-sigs for Bitcoin or they've done it before or if it's someone that is learning about multi-sigs for the first time.


So, the first step maybe today they don't want to set something up that's all official for personal or business reasons but what should they take, what actions should they take now to do this themselves as opposed to just watching us do it in the YouTube episode.


So, multi-sigs can be a little confusing up front. The best way to do that is just run through the steps that we just did on the video and just learning how to do it so that it's fresh in your head.


So, there's a lot of resources, there's different multi-sig, different blockchain projects that support multi-sig as well. It's also does exist as features of blockchains and a lot of network participants don't even know that it's there.


So, if you've got a favorite coin, do a search for multi-sig or multi-sig and on your favorite coin and you may be very well find out that your favorite coin, which is QRL or is not QRL, it is right.


If you have a second favorite coin, I should say, it may have multi-sigs part and you may not even know.


So, let's go to cover in that part and if you haven't explored this already, make sure that you go to wallet-up-curel.org and if you haven't already done so, make sure that you subscribe to our YouTube channel.


That way each video will come out with you are the first to know VIP section to be able to know when we come out with new content.


Thank you for joining Strikeny to do the multi-sig. Obviously, you can't do a multi-sig with two people on a call. You need three companies. So, thank you for joining us as well and today's episode.


Good job. Have a good beer.


The QRL Show | Bitcoin vs Gold vs Quantum Computers? (LIVE May 20th at 1pm CST)

Hey everyone, in today's episode we are going to be discussing Gold vs. Bitcoin vs.


Quantum Computers, which is superior? Let's dive in and find out in today's episode.


Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of the Quantum Resistant Ledger channel,


the place where you come for the crypto and stay for the quantum.


I'm really excited about today's episode. With me is our director of outreach at the QRL.


Michael Strike, it's good to have you here, Michael.


Hey, thanks for having me back again.


Today we're going to talk about some things that I'm passionate about.


Blockchain, Bitcoin, precious metals, quantum, all that fun stuff, how it ties together and what that all looks like and what the future may hold. We'll find out.


Awesome, sounds great. What we're going to do first is I want to go in and order a little bit,


but what I'd like to do starting point is I want to go back a little bit in history.


Obviously, you have the longest standing of those three being gold since 2009. You have Bitcoin.


And then right now it's being worked on in the Quantum Realm and beyond. You have that.


But as a starting point, what I would like to do as a framework for our conversation is I want to go back in time,


centuries and centuries ago, whether we're talking Roman Empire or the 13th century in England,


or we talk about the gold standard, wherever we need to in that conversation, going back in time,


what initially gives gold value and then we can lead the conversation from here.


I would like to go back in time about three days ago and just put some things in the state of the college.


Joking aside, yeah, what gets gold is value.


So we all know that gold has this long history of being a symbol of power, health, wealth, prosperity.


In fact, I used to be a precious metal stacker. And they followed the teachings of Mike Maloney and Peter Schiff.


One of which I don't pay is quite much attention to anymore. The audience probably knows which one.


But we used to have a say in gold is the currency of kings, silver is the currency of gentlemen and debt is the currency of peasants.


Nowadays, I kind of almost wonder if that's true if you're talking about Bitcoin, Ethereum, and Dogecoin perhaps?


I don't know, future will tell.


So gold is the most malleable element. And ounce of gold can be stretched for something like 30 or 50 miles to corrosion resistant.


It's a great, amazing, thermal, and electrical conductor. There's enough of it that can be made into coins, but not enough so that everyone gets multiple coins or possibly even one.


But besides all of that, we have what's called scarcity.


Now, despite what alchemists and flat earthers might stay, I still believe that it can't be conjured out of thin air.


And I think that scarcity is probably its most important quality.


All the gold mine that has ever been mined basically still exists. But the problem is it's a mobile and it's stored and with the movement of the electronic and digital age.


The whole thing has been papered over so much that it's very, very, it would be very, very difficult to completely acuate price on what an ounce of gold actually is.


Because it's been papered over so much by the financial system.


So yeah, I mean, and it takes a lot of work, obviously, in the mining out of the ground. In fact, there's this old joke that if there were aliens watching from above,


I wonder why were they looking at them wondering why we're mining it up out of the ground and then putting it back in the ground.


But, you know, joking aside, I hope that does answer your question.


Yeah, kind of. And then I think this leads through to a part where we're going to be talking about with Bitcoin, obviously, you know, gold 2.0 is some opponents of Bitcoin say that Bitcoin does not have intrinsic value.


So I'd like to dive into this. Maybe we start with like definition first and then we can kind of talk about, you know, the comparisons of one verse the other.


And also just not to say, you know, if one is amazing, the other one, you know, can't be talk about some of the similarities and then some of the add-ons of what makes it, you know, a stepped up version of that.


So let's first talk about the intrinsic value part. I know we talked about this before off camera, but I think this would be a good place for this part.


Absolutely. So let's first off, let's define what is what is intrinsic mean. If you look it up in the Miriam Web Sedictionary, it's listed as belonging to the essential nature or constitution of something or everything.


For example, what are the signs intrinsic value as it gives off light which maintains all the life. That's pretty high intrinsic value.


Gold has intrinsic values that we've talked about.


For the silver bugs, I'll give them some credit. They're that's high industrial.


Industrial applications.


And honestly, I've always, honestly, I've always had a precious or a fondness for precious metals. In fact, I like to fact that you can hold them in your hand.


The problem is here, the biggest problem with precious metals is you just can't send them to the other side of the world in six minutes. You know, that's unless Musk can drop the price of spaceflight as much as he's raised the price of Dogecoin, right?


But what is intrinsic value, what intrinsic value does Bitcoin bring. So that's really what that's really what the question is.


We talked about precious metal intrinsic values and we've talked about what they can do that other things cannot do.


Bitcoin in blockchain bring trust.


They bring that that is that's one of the most fundamental intrinsic values behind Bitcoin. You can trust that you know that there are not more bitcoins being minted than what the protocol allows.


You can trust that you're using the same open source code, you know, the same open source course that everyone else is. And if you break the rules outside of what the protocol allows your transactions will be disregarded by the network, right?


So essentially, all of the flaws of of human governments that's repeated itself throughout history is being is is we're watching it take place that it's being replaced by code.


And this has never been possible before we didn't have, you know, we didn't have the internet. We didn't have the same amazing open source movement. We didn't have the telecommunications. We didn't have the ability to talk around the world in real time.


You know, that's not always existed while money has exist. So for the first time, we can all.


We're all under the same set of rules. So that's really where trust comes in. So when you were growing up, you know, but mom and dad may have had a favorite but not Bitcoin, not you writing not you i'm talking to the audience.


Everybody loves you.


So yeah, gold does drip has tremendous value, but at the end of the day it's a mobile and it's expensive to move to move. When i'm talking about expensive guys i'm not talking about ethereum gas fees expensive i'm talking about really, really expensive right.


You have to ship you got to you got to think of even edge cases of okay, someone is fleeing from a guada mala and Argentina and they're about to get on a plane. Is it going to be easier for them to have a hardware wallet or a mnemonic phrase in their head and you know flee.


Or if it's an elastic stream situation where you're just going from one place to another, where is if you are shipping gold the portability it's it's completely different night and day.


You and you brought this up something about this if you were if you are refugee if you were fleeing a country if you were fleeing you know out of fear of your life or for whatever reason, you could essentially memorize 24 words that mnemonic phrase and carry.


Nearly infinite amount of wealth with you in your head, you would do what you would do what's it's nomenclernia forgot the exact phrase of a bit. Okay, you have like a month you make like you can do it a few ways but one can be you have like a mine cascade where you kind of like you you paint you paint it to a story.


People do it different ways depending on how you learn but that is one of the main ways that they go about it is that where you're going to say kind of.


Yes, exactly because our brain were a lot of people most people are visual learners are in our brain stores it's very good it's storing stories, but it's not as good as storing building a schema for something that are just random abstract things but if you can put them into something coherent you could cross borders with a trillion dollars just stuck right here stored by all chemically right in to me to me that's that's never been possible for that's amazing.


Yeah, the term is a memory palace but you can call it. Yeah, I think so. Keep going though.


All right, so you're with me so far. So back to gold gold trust for the right.


Kind of Bitcoin's trust of being compromised of being compromised is really a lot less there's more trust in Bitcoin than there is in gold and I'll explain why first of all.


Gold were completely trustworthy there'd be no reason to issue them serial numbers or stamp where it came from and to package it up there'd be no reason to keep track.


I mean, it was a serial number really even I'm going to go online and I'm going to cross reference the serial number I mean all I know is that what I'm holding in my hand is stamped to that serial number.


So some some myths like Royal Canadian men one of my favorites has gotten really good creating intricate coins and shading and stuff like that that with silver.


That they've done a fantastic job but when it comes to gold gold pretty much always looks the same and it's really hard to tell you remember you might remember the New York scandal from a year's ago I think I've got a link here I'm going to share my screen.


Oh, one second.


Let me know when you can see it can you see this yeah we can all see it now.


All right this is something that's kind of stuck in my memory here.


This is if you look here there was New York City and what you had was counterfeit gold being replaced by tungsten bars about 11 years ago and the reason they use tungsten is as close as same weight in the same density and these were these were being circulated.


This was being circulated by reputable gold dealers and I remember thinking at about the time it's like I'm trying to put my wealth somewhere is like what is the most thing what is the most you know I've not had much 10 years ago really had anything but I want to put something that I can trust okay gold well then I realize it it's like now I can't even I can't even trust gold because these are reputable dealers and somehow you know they ended up being like 80% tungsten in tungsten is very close to gold in in mass and weight so.


No one you know it nobody nobody realized it for a while.


So yeah I think that covers that.


Yeah no that covers that well and I think we're going to probably do this a little bit more of a deep dive in an upcoming episode or two as far as like market capitalization if we're looking at gold or Bitcoin but.


As of now you have Bitcoin currently I know it's fluctuating up or down it's a bit under one trillion about 10x that you have the whole gold market cap total.


Where I kind of want to move into now we've been covering you know gold and Bitcoin a little bit and what makes you know what did what differentiates between the two what I want to do now is we also I want to add quantum computers and quantum computing to the equation.


You have one that's been around for a very long time you have one that is you know a dozen years since Satoshi had the first you know jettison block and that's led up to 2021 and like now moving forward.


What if you know if Bitcoin let's say I don't know at what point I think this my personal opinion I think it keeps moving up you know closer and closer to getting towards you know gold market cap and then exceeding that you know I'm not a my reader obviously we don't know the timetable on that.


But as that keeps moving forward and as that market capitalization gets higher there's going to be more and more reason that you want to you know there to be no security flaws and vulnerabilities obviously it has not been attacked at this point.


And so what's going to be more quantum computing in the future what what's capable or you know what people are capable of doing today it's going to change in five years it's going to change even more so in 10 years.


And so we're going to be in this whole conversation that we've been having about gold Bitcoin quantum computers where stuff is being happening right now whether it be IBM's the world the honey wells whether it be governments tons of money getting put into the space venture capital money being poured in each week each month.


And so we're going to be doing a little bit more on this and I know this is probably a few questions broken into one but let's let's use this as a starting point with this question.


So what's some of this content on some of the other previous previous yeah and and I think I've used the viewer audience has heard me use the iceberg analogy of hundreds of millions of dollars that we know about that's being pumped into this so you really you have to ask yourself a question first question.


I think should be asked is do you believe that the cryptocurrencies are sustainable right in general are they sustainable are they going to be around in 10 years okay.


Then look at what's been done in quantum and understand that with the amount of capital that's been pushed into it.


And so in are you seeing just the tip of the iceberg are you actually seeing the big picture I definitely argue the latter because of the threat that quantum can pose to security.


But so yeah but let's talk about let's talk about how curl all ties into this.


Yeah one truly market caps trillion for Bitcoin just under two trill for the entire crypto space right obviously that's enormous amount of capital not so much as it was due three days ago still enormous amount of capital.


But here's what my here's what my opinion is this is long term this is five five maybe five ten years out gold's going to devour Fiat but Bitcoin will eventually devour both Fiat and gold but at the end of the day quantum trumps all of it.


Let me explain why I'm saying that you have to ask yourself yet there's problems sure there's people in our audience that understand this topic probably better than I do is have to tell what money really is and it's only a basic question.


But it's really not it should there's certain qualities first off I'm going to give I'm going to give four right up front it should be durable you don't want your money disintegrating going through the dryer right.


That would be Fiat which isn't money well loan he's going to sing me for that one I know where you're going to keep going to the other main main ones.


Durable it should be recognizable okay it should be stable and it should be divisible okay those are for great properties of money.


But there's more there is actually three more that at least the more that I can think of first of all fungible coins in the US haven't been fungible since 1965 and what fun jubility means essentially that if you have a quarter and I have a quarter that quarter should be worth the same thing so up until 1964.


And US quarters were made out of 90% silver which means that your 1964 in previous quarters would be worth several dollars it's like between from four dollars something like that right now.


Which you could you could sell to you know news new mr.


And that's in accordance with what's called Gresham's law all pre-1965 coins are now they've been hoarded for decades so any of the listeners out there go through you know just how to create


go through your change star your pocket if I would be really surprised if you found a nickel or excuse me a dime or a quarter before 1965 not nickels dimes in quarters.


So so it has to be fungible if that's not really if that's not fungible okay it's had it hasn't really been since since 65 it's not a store of value.


Money real money should be a store of value I should be able to hold it and know that it's still going to be it's still going to be worth something you know in the coming years.


So I guess if he at if he at makes six of those but where but where bitcoin in blockchain really comes in is portability okay so bitcoin has all of those previous


aforementioned qualities of money that I've talked about but it also has tremendous portability I can send it across the world in minutes assuming you know assuming assuming clean bases up in the price isn't skyrocketing right but bitcoin meets all those criteria and that's why it makes it superior money so how does quantum tie into this.


So there's this quantum threat which which there's this quantum threat to the address scheme of bitcoin and all the other altcoins that use.


A asymmetric encryption during their address in scheme and this addressing scheme is based on factorization and it's essentially the scaffold it's not a subroutine of the code it's the fun it's the fundamental it's the scaffolding.


For the cryptocurrency it's not just something that could be forklift in and forklift out it's not a modular piece.


And that's what and that's what our project comes in you know we we provide essentially block it's a blockchain quantum insurance insurance policy right so if if you have if you have QRL you were based on NISD's hash based.


You know recommended hash based signature scheme it's hash based it's not encrypted it's uses hashes so and hashes are known to be shot 256 and other iterations of hashes are being known to be quantum secure.


So that in our developing ecosystem with enclave that we're putting together which you'll which we're working on.


Being able to pulse quantum securing essentially retrofit other blockchains like ethereum with post quantum security.


That's where QRL steps in.


So we're going to be doing is we're going to be doing two things now first off in a minute or two we're going to open it up to AMA so if you have some questions in mind whether it's something on the topic that we're talking about right now with the whole Bitcoin versus


quantum computers debate or if it's more of a particular QRL question that you might have throw those into the chat will be happening there in a minute and one other fun thing in the meantime if you have your screen shot capability right now what I'm doing is I'm throwing up an


automatic phrase and if you want to if the first person that goes to this mnemonic phrase right now we just dropped a little bit of quanta and in this QRL address so I'll leave it on the screen for about five more five and ten more seconds so striking I will smile.


So if anyone wants to grab that first one to pull this mnemonic phrase real quick here is the taker of this and a strike lower waiting for a couple AMA questions to come through here.


What I would like to do is can you give some of the viewers at home I know some of you that are viewing this are familiar with the project I've been around the block for a little while but for some people that are maybe a little bit newer to the channel or they're maybe heard about QRL through a friend.


Where is a good starting place for them to kind of dip their feet in a little water a little bit to learn a little bit more about the quantum threat or just even going to the deep end a little bit if we're talking about.


Different like even different ways that the quantum threat can potentially impact them down the road but where's a good starting place or two and then after that I have no pair of the AMA.


So I think that the overall is one of the innovative leaders in the space at this intersection of blockchain and quantum right I mean this it's these are two pretty niche markets so there is a little bit of advantage and there's not a ton of material as to where these two.


In fact, there's really only just a few books on the topic so what I would recommend is definitely go through our go to our YouTube channel there's a lot of content that we've produced on there we break down.


The fundamental threat from generating a 256 bit random number for your Bitcoin public address using elliptical curve multiplication to get to your private address and then hashing that in order to get to your.


Private address, elliptical curve to public address and then to your Bitcoin address now that last last part being of the hashing is secure but the.


The part of where you go from private key and then you use elliptical curve multiplication get to your public key that's all explained in the video and why that's how that's based on.


The factorization elliptical curve multiplication and I would recommend doing it going there there's also a lot of information I think docs that the info info docs that get which one is it.


docs dot the ql.org and and I mean if you want to do you want to do more live research or more in real time jump into our discord channel should be a link at the end of this at the end of this YouTube video so there's a lot of quantum and blockchain passionate people in there that I'm sure are watching right now so.


Yeah, and we'll open it up I don't know today's AMA is a little bit different in that there's not like a strong ask as far as questions on the topic.


Whereas last week's was a little bit more and I think our upcoming video on with consensus protocols is going to have a lot more but strike how we hop in the chat just to see we'll see if there's any at the moment.


Stephen McGee says I'll pop it up once you read it.


Yeah, I think it said I've never seen anyone restore their gold from from a seed phrase right and you know and that's and that's a real thing because the executive order there's a number of it when the United States actually confiscated all gold hoarding right at the time.


Yeah, you wouldn't be able to you can't restore gold from a seed phrase.


Can you talk more about enclave and how that all will work with you in a swap a little yeah so I can talk a little bit I can't speak for the developers enclave that's by Stephen s.


Yeah, on close that IO still still stuff's being worked on but yeah if you want to dive into that for a second strike briefly yeah thanks for bringing up the website.


So to talk a little bit more essentially what it's going to do is going to be able to take ethereum and a subset of ERC 20 tokens and being able to XMSS wrapped them store them on chain via smart contract and oracle on the Ethereum blockchain so it'll be.


It's kind of like it's it's a wrap it's a vault essentially that you're wrapping your ethereum around and you can store it you'll be able to store that as being quantum secure and a subset of.


ERC 20s like I said now that now the tech itself isn't specific to just ethereum.


What is it in theory it could be it could be applied to any blockchain that has smart contract capability.


So I hope that answers that question.


Good question Stephen we got one other one down here on the role of native tokens playing post quantum securing of other blockchains.


How about that one strike or is that.


I'll pop it up right here and see if it's.


Can you explain what if any will the role true al native place in them well.


Well the role of QRL native native token native coin right play yeah also quite of securing of other blockchains.


So QRL being being a native coin you know not a like a token on like in ethereum.


Is it's own blockchain so if we are we are we have we have our own mainnet our own no it's our own blockchain that's been running.


So I think that's a good idea for years now that that that coin by itself acts as a quantum insurance hedge.


So with the young the difference in contrast to enclave enclave is post quantum securing ethereum.


The QRL native coin is like like in a quantum insurance policy.


Yeah.


So I just saw this kind of more of a fun one Craig posted if I'm guessing Peter Schiff wasn't available as a guest speaker for today's show actually you know we'd love to have him on the show Peter if if you're out there watching if you're not busy you know keeping us keeping your gold safe.


I'd actually we'd like to probably talk to a son a little bit more about my stuff but.


I'd love I'd love to have a conversation with either of them and any any realm so.


Well that's your fear listening go ahead and ping us.


And though that's good if I get on board.


Yeah if anybody else has any questions we're going to probably maybe maybe do one or maybe one more we'll see we'll give it another minute or sort of see if anybody else.


Here let's see we got one more at the bottom.


Let's do one by Steven's.


I think this one up real quick.


Can you specifically in layman terms explain why the scheme of URL will survive post quantum computing as opposed to ECC so.


And for those of you that like you know that's whoa it's way over my head picture you know.


Public key private key able to you know put the two together.


Let's see we got a few from the discord community here.


Strike you want to dive into.


We got two here let's pop this one up here.


What is the status of the ephemeral messaging system is this one we can dive into I know this has to do with the development team as well.


Anything else might be able to I'm going to finish the last part of that last question was we asked the contrast Bitcoin against QRL.


Yeah.


The difference is that QRL is based on a hash based signature scheme.


I think that's a very confusing term but essentially what I hash is is you give you give X amount of input it gets scrambled and then you get a deterministic output so.


And it's very very difficult to take that hash classically and quantum lead.


It's very difficult classically and post quantum to be able to take that hash and get back to the original input values it just it just there's no way human kind of just not know how to do that.


So go ahead.


There's there's two that kind of tie together.


So here on ephemeral messaging we got one from a 45 day good question and then Vessie's got one to I'll pull up let's pull up this one first and then I'll just read out the other.


So the first one here being what's the status of the ephemeral messaging system and then just to be able to answer it you know two birds one stone.


One after that is can you share anything about some of the potential use cases of the federal messaging layer so whichever of these you kind of want to just touch on briefly here to meet or maybe wrap the answer together both these.


Yeah let's talk about EMS.


I don't have the latest I don't have the developers latest update on that.


It's probably discord on the development section is a good place finally.


Essentially what is going to be is it's going to be a quantum secure platform for which other third parties are going to be able to build on top of in order to be able to do what they want.


So what you do is you'll use you use the QRL native chain basically to prove identities and then you'd be able to hand those identities off to third party and have them be able to communicate.


Like the peer to peer.


So for example an application could use the QRL network to verify two people quantum secure leave orify two people are who they say they are right it would do that asymmetrically through the through the through the keys right and then hand off that communication to.


Peer to peer communication then they can just talk to them with self once they trust each other that this can be text this could be video yeah I still want to do things like baseline in the amount of video but it's going to be it's going to be symmetric end to end peer to peer so we're we're expecting positive results on that.


But it's going to be it's kind of like it's kind of like how and layman's terms right if it if it in like a smart phone is what you build applications on top of you'll be able to build on top of EMS.


Okay so you'll be able to use that in you'll be able to use that and develop your own code for it in order to create pulse quantum secure communications.


Might even go beyond communications I mean this is we have some UK I have use cases in mind but and there's a few that we probably haven't even thought of yet there there's a lot of possibilities.


EMS is basically the quantum secure solution that is looking for problems quantum problems.


Yeah, and the second question on femoral messaging is this is there anything else that needs to be brought on here share anything about some of the use kit yeah this kind of ties right to it.


chat quantum secure video any type of symmetricly any type of symmetric communication in other words any have encrypted communication anything could be exchanged back and forth once identities have been confirmed through 3MS.


Yep, I'm just showing this nomadic phrase once more I'm sure it's already been grabbed by one of you cure others out there but I just wanted to pop it up there in the screen for 3 more seconds what we wait and see if we have maybe one more question but I think.


Okay, yep see here.


Just double check and I'm seeing a couple through.


Okay, the last one the Mister test.


Okay, well, we're maybe one or two more questions to go I'll pop it up right here for you any updates on privacy features for QRL and then we have one more underneath that maybe they'll be a good rack but.


So, touch on this one just a little bit maybe for you know 30 to 60 seconds right.


Sure, so privacy features are in ongoing discussion within the team there's pros and cons to both of them on one hand you have certain exchanges that won't miss privacy coins out of regulatory concerns.


But on the other hand you have you know you have complete almost complete financial sovereignty right almost complete anonymous anonymity and financial sovereignty and to make that post quantum secure.


What what's missing from that recipe I can't think of anything as far as as far as the as far as the sovereignty the security and the anonymity which are tenants of blockchain and crypto right so.


It's under consideration I don't know if I don't think a decision's been made yet I don't think it'll be in this next fork.


I still think we're still early in developing this project we've got we've got lots of runway left.


Yeah, maybe in the future.


Yeah and POS transactions per second estimate is that one that.


No no yeah.


If any any last questions we're going to probably be wrapping up in a second if anyone has any last ones feel through throw them in there real quick.


If you haven't done so already make sure that you hit that subscribe button below on that way each week whether myself and my fellow are coming out with a live video such as today's or if we're coming out with other video content that is.


You know schedule the weather we're doing it weekly by weekly we have some guests when we have them coming on you'll be first to be notified about it if you subscribe if you haven't already done so.


And you just the first to hear about our content coming out from the QRL i'm so make sure you do that and we'll just check real quick.


I think I think we answered a lot of questions really good strike.


It was good to chat about you know goal for Bitcoin for squad of computers I know there's a lot of different with this conversation today there's a lot of different lanes and you know you could talk about the gold aspect with myself you members of our community for you know a couple hours on each one of those individually so talking about them together within video form and keeping it in line is it's a bit tricky I know we haven't been able to cover everything but I feel like the differentiating parts and you know the added components of you know.


Goal 2.0 and then moving into work your all ties into it moving forward with quantum computing.


It was nice to be able to discuss it a little bit in today's episode so strike thanks for thanks for chatting on that for everything watching.


Make sure that you tune in next week we're going to have an exciting episode coming up on consensus protocols.


From myself and Michael we appreciate you taking some time out of your day to watch this whether you're watching this now or later in the day whatever time it is for you in the world and myself and Michael will see you in the next episode and lastly make sure to keep those digital assets secure and from myself and the current team have a great day.


Bitcoin and Quantum Computer Predictions for 2021

What is up everybody and welcome back to another episode of the quantum resistant ledger channel


You are video cool into the world of post quantum digital asset security. I am here with strike


I am Ryan the co-host here today. I'm the director of advocacy at the QRL


strike on this side of me over here is our director of outreach


Today get really close to the end of the year


So with that being said today's episode is all about quantum predictions as we head into the new year and beyond


Not only are we going to cover the quantum big predictions coming up


We're also going to be discussing some of the recent news and that surrounding quantum supremacy


We're going to be talking a little bit of a Bitcoin and make sure you stay around to the end. We're going to be doing a little


Quantum contest for the holidays awesome


Well first off, so just to cover an outline so when you're watching at home


You kind of know where we're kind of starting out with and we're going to dive into don't grill me too hard though


Okay, yeah before we dive into quantum predictions and


Supremacy with it being very top of mind for a lot of people right now


I would love to just dive in briefly for a few minutes as an opener


I'd love to dive into Bitcoin for a little bit with it last week


I think BTC hitting an all-time high


Market cap today is somewhere probably when you're watching this it might have fluctuated a little bit it's around


436 billion and I just want to know strike


What are your thoughts in the current state of where Bitcoin is headed in 2021?


What are your thoughts on it? How do you think this affects the


overall industry as a whole and yeah, I just want to kind of hear your thoughts on this go back and forth briefly on this


Yeah, sure so it's hard to it's hard to be on any crypto project nowadays and not talk about Bitcoin


In a lot of ways Bitcoin is the crypto world reserve currency, right?


It's the it's the tide in a lot of ways that keeps


Boy and see to all the other ships so and if you're talking about Bitcoin especially this month


It's almost impossible not to talk about the price. So I'm gonna pre-fix with the standard


None of this is financial advice is my opinions


Let's do this so


okay


A lot of us probably remember the bull run from 2017. I mean if you're not if if you're following crypto Twitter


There's a lot of evidence right now that much of this


2020 price moving is coming from institutional buying and for


From people looking for hedges of hedges against you know unprecedented currency to basement


Stimulus package, you know all of these things are things that


Provide buoyancy to crypto currencies as hedges and we know this because some of them are going public


You know there's some of the companies are going public


They're replacing some of their corporate reserve currencies on hand-cashed with Bitcoin


In fact, just yesterday Michael Saylor who leads the investment firm micro strategy


And he's been purchasing hundreds of million dollars in Bitcoin


Of course you only ever find out after the fact


That he had purchased


He recommend the deal on Musk yesterday that he do the same thing on Twitter to its healer


Excuse me to which Elon asked, you know, is this is possible?


You know presumably asking whether or not there was enough liquidity in the space


In order to you know make make those sizes of purchases without


You know being the make market make yourself and driving the price up


Come in and essentially driving the price up since you're buying so much and increasing the cost of your own Bitcoin so


Mr. Saylor my gawford to show him his playbook


So I mean you're seeing more institutional interest and this is a good thing. It doesn't feel like


2017 to me to me that was a lot of retail buying a lot of FOMO


This feels fundamentally different


All the talk of tulip bulbs, you know his has stopped as we know as we know tulip bulbs never recovered


But there are still a lot of die hard precious metal bugs


The most of which you know the most one of the most well known is probably going to be Peter Schiff


He's probably one of the most outspoken anti-Bitcoin voices in Twitter


Heater's well known for a lot of years now. He's a he's in an eternal


pessimist as far as the state of the economy


I followed him for I followed him for many years


He's anti-Bitcoin for sure


But I think what actually happens is he does own Bitcoin his son Spencer Schiff is a strong


verbal supporter of Bitcoin and with the banter between Peter and a son back in forethon Bitcoin and this is all over Twitter


You know memes galore


Bitcoin it makes up I don't know like 70 to 80% of his feet


If you want to think about Bitcoin you go on to anti-Bitcoin's you know, bitcoins were centimeter


So my suspicion is that even he does own Bitcoin and he's using that as the springboard in order to remain relevant


Yeah, and another point to add on top of that as far as your comments on you know debasement and things of that nature


It's like it's kind of a perfect storm in a sense as well


If like even if you just you know go and look at the most recent, you know M2 with the money supply


If you look at how much fiat money has been getting put into the system


And you think of the long-term effects that is gonna be played downstream


It kind of that adds to it as well as far as


You know how how the climate might look a few years from now, so it's like and


And to add to another part where you're just mentioning, you know with sailor or more institutional money that's gonna be going into it


Another part that's really important to mention is if you think about Bitcoin as an asset class


Once it starts getting higher and higher market capitalized a lot of these bigger


You know whether it's you know pension funds if it's sovereign wealth funds


Over time it's gonna become a much more attractive to them because when they're pouring in hundreds of millions of dollars


It's gonna be a lot easier for them to be able to make that decision on behalf of


You know their LP's and putting that money into Bitcoin as an actual


You know serious move where they think that it can actually


Offer value down the road as a store of value and not just a just only a hedge


So that's a really important part to mention as well. That's a good point


Let me let me add a couple things into that because I like weird going with


So back in 2017 there was all this for all right


We a lot of we hit 19,000 close to 20,000 highs, right?


Bitcoin was all over the news. It was all over Google


In fact, what I'll do is if you look at Bitcoin's search


If you look under the trends of Bitcoin of Google to see where Bitcoin is on the search patterns


It's just a little bump whereas


2017 is all the way up here. This just recently took a little bit right nope all-time highs


You know approaching 24 25,000 you know a cryptocurrency and if you look around there's nothing on mainstream news anywhere


The it still it still feels very very like it hasn't like it's still under the radar. It hasn't which is incredible to me


So for the I have the Google Edge search chart maybe future Ryan can just overlay it like right up here somewhere


But it shows the the interest based on Google searches and I use that I use that as kind of a metric


To gauge you know how how interested people are in different things


So do I my opinion


So going higher yeah, I think it's going I think Bitcoin's going higher which also improves the use case


For QRL as a hedge, you know against Y2K on a threat


If you look at two of the most bullish models


for Bitcoin which are two of the most exciting


You've got plan B stock the flow model which puts Bitcoin at a hundred K by the end of 2021 and


You have a he's pseudo he's pseudo anonymous, but he's pretty well known on Twitter


And you also have


City Bank analyst when public with putting


Bitcoin potentially at 300 K USD USD by the end of December 2021 now


Granted, these are very optimistic. So I think that they'll reach these levels


I don't know, but this is crypto anything can happen


Bitcoin going up. Yeah, Bitcoin's going up


It's shown resiliency against being a bubble in unprecedented instal and unprecedented institutional players


And now using third parties like Coinbase in order to accumulate under the radar


They're not just buying on the open market. They have to be smart about this throw in the Fed to your point


Is essentially


With the currency debasement and essentially socializing the private sector through open market purchases


You know, this is the amount of stimulus and currency is unprecedented in human history


Within you know, now we have the always at 900 billion stimulus package coming out


Then I know today. Yes, all of these provide buoyancy for the use case for crypto and


Bitcoin in general


Yeah, no, and I think that that's kind of a perfect segue into our next topic, which is


Talking about quantum supremacy. I know that we're gonna be diving into some of predictions and go a little bit more in depth there


But when it comes to quantum supremacy


Probably most of us and if you haven't heard the news yet


We'll be filling in on this as kind of a you know macro overview of what occurred


China recently a few weeks ago earlier in December


Has stated that you know, they have quantum supremacy and so what I want to ask you strike is


With their case of what happened a few weeks ago is this a one task type simulation or is this something that is a bigger step


That we should really take notice of so is it you know one task type simulation or is a bit more


Hey, this is something that actually could be programmable


So I want to get your take on more of a technical level of


You know, is it more serious or is it like okay? I can just kind of do one thing. It's not anywhere near real life application yet


Yeah, so


China's announcement was


a little unexpected and it was also interesting. I think they actually use the term quantum advantage over quantum supremacy this time


It could be mistaken


But they put together what's you know, it's an optical of boson sampling quantum computer


And I think this is good news for the industry mostly in that shows it shows continued innovation in the field, right?


No one's saying that this machine is gonna, you know, break the internet or break encryption or still


From the federal reserve you anything like that


But I'm gonna call it I'm gonna call out they were able to perform a function that might be that might have practical applications


in the future of


Solving some sort of solving some problems


That would have been that would that are essentially impossible for classical computers to do but it is it is a very specialized


Use case what they did do with for boson sampling


It's not a template for a


Universal quantum computer which you know as we know is the holy grail I suppose of


computing


And it's history you know history repeats itself


Research is an IBM and a few others came out with contrary narratives and


Different sides to the same story, you know as to what China but China had done so there's you know


There's a lot of there's still a lot of controversy. Yeah, I don't know that exists in the field and I think that it will stay that way


But what that means that what a powerful takeaway is that we are getting better and better at the manipulation of single


Photons particles of light which are which are which are very good stepping stones for future advancements in quantum computing


Not just for quantum secure communications, but also for different flavors of optical quantum computing


So these are to me these feel like


Organic stepping stones all right


So far ion trap machines seem to be the most universally accepted machine


But there's also other types, you know that are that are on the radar


but I so far I think


Ionic ionic traps are the most well-known popular and promising and


Other flavors of photonic quantum computers are under the radar in a bit less known because there's very little information on bottom


But as with all things time will tell


Now I appreciate it kind of diving into the second part of this and I want to kind of break it up


Into I'm just thinking about this


I want to break it up to in a few sections


Because I think we can kind of get a better answer that's a little bit more clear


So break it up into we'll talk about funding


What quantum your volume is and then talk a little bit about some resources for people to kind of go further down the rabbit holes


So I want to start out with funding so there's a lot of money getting put into the space around quantum computing people trying to


solve the problem getting ahead


What I want to ask is where do you see over the next 18 or 12 to 18 months?


Where do you see?


Prediction wise where do you see a lot of money entering the space in your opinion?


Sure in my opinion


I think we'll continue to see more corporate capital more government funding


Companies are starting to look for specific use cases in which quantum computers could give them a you know strategic advantage


You know as the number of qubits grows the air rates from systemic systemic noise start to drop better


Algorithms are developed, you know possibly even through the use of AI. I think that's a tremendous opportunity for the future


AI teaching quantum computers how to solve certain problems. I mean this is this is a real


This is a really exciting field and I think that I think that that specifically is inevitable


But a manufacturing processes that improve their you know improving that quality


I think all of these are coming together to show continued progress and it's going to


You know it's going to


Allow other investors and more and more investors to become involved in the field right now


It's still you know there's right now. There's still a lot of speculation a lot of confusion


We don't have a universal quantum computer yet


I think thermal dynamics and dilution refrigeration. I think those are pretty close to as good as they're gonna get


So the noise the systemic noise problems would have to be solved


Some other way, but I honestly believe that they'll get past these


So I don't think there's any more innovation in that area, but


Government you know governments venture capitalists


You know private money. I think that that's only gonna increase from here in January the US for example


The in January the US Department of Energy announced the national quantum initiative which


Put


625 million dollars of funds over the next five years to establish


I think they said two to five multi-dissignate multi-dissignate plenary quantum information science research centers


Like I see that again other you know other countries corporations and venture capitalists are doing the same so


Everywhere


Yeah, yeah, it's very it was kind of a broad question


I just kind of wanted to see where you were thinking kind of you know lane wise where it would be or whether it's you know several lanes


But


Moving on from that one. Let's talk about QD or you know quantum volume. So essentially I know you know the main components


number of qubits air array connectivity of qubits


Can you dive in and explain much better than I just did of what is QV and if we had to break it down for someone that maybe


Is either either new to hearing about it or maybe even someone that has a little bit more of an understanding?


What's QV strike?


Yeah, so if you're if you're new to QV QV is IBM's way of measuring the performance of a quantum processor


Back in the day, you know, we had


100 megahertz 200 megahertz three-hour dating myself


Let's say gigahertz


One gigahertz two gigahertz


And eventually we beat they came up with multi-core process and it so it wasn't just the speed


You know, you also had and you also had additional instruction sets and the max instruction set


There were so many different factors same thing exist with quantum computers except I would say that there's many many more variables


So what IBM did is they did this because a transistor from a classical machine in a qubit machine


Have pretty much nothing in common as far as how they work the quantum volume


A protocol takes a series of variables into consideration and just gives you an integer


Which represents quantum value?


That might integer might be like this quantum processor as a QV of 64 or 128 and what it tries to do is speak to the quality of the


QVits so the more quantum volume that you have the more complex problems you can solve


If you are if you're interested in what it makes up quantum volume, there's a bunch of different metrics


Error calibration circuit optimization gay fidelity cross-talk errors decoherence times these are all things that make up QV


So I'm not the expert on the QV topic per se but at all but


It's it's probably one of the best metrics that we have right now in order to at least get a rough gauge as to the


performance of a machine


You know, but like anything data can data can be manipulated, right?


So you may start I suspect next year another prediction I suspect next year you'll start seeing quantum computers come up with astronomical quantum volume


statements and


That will all that will all be based around being able to


suppose


Manipulate the metrics of the algorithm in order to goal seek the quantum volume number that you want in order to make the news in order to keep people


And shareholders happy. I think that that's probably that's something that will come up quite a bit next year


Yeah, that leads into my next question, which is another one that kind of we're talking you know


Bitcoin of you know, no one can predict the future


As far as what it will exactly look like down the road


But speaking of QV and some of these projects and you know, then making a lot of progress


I just want to ask you this is not to say this is anything that's gonna be set in stone


But what are some projects some of the bold projects in the space?


You know from your honey well is your IBM's your D-Wave through Google


first off


Where are they at now and where do you see them heading through 2021 and beyond?


You can either pick out one or two of them if you want to highlight those or just maybe a few where you think hey


They're gonna be making quite a bit of progress these next six to 12 months. So I mean the major players we know about IBM Honeywell


I on Q


these are


Relatively transparent projects


I


Mean we've talked about this before Honeywell claims to have a quantum volume of I think it was


640,000 within the next


Four and a half years as they scale up their ion traps


Which is which is powerful


IBM's getting IBM's now getting into manufacturing its own dilution refrigerators because they're


Commercial refrigerators and off the part you know off the shelf parts aren't quite cutting it


You can't exactly get one at best by right so I think I think when you have large companies such as these far-reaching


Forecast should be taken a little bit with a grain of salt because


Progress in the lab is really just one component of the press release. I mean, you know


People corporations need to show progress for various reasons


And sometimes when you throw progress out for a number of years in the past


How many people actually look back and see you know and critique what was said five years ago?


So I take a lot of that with a grain of salt to me. It's it's to me. It's really the biggest questions to me are really the stuff that we don't know


Who's


Who's who's making the progress that we don't know about and there are


100 reasons I can think of in which you know


Great strides in quantum computing why that information would be


Wouldn't be chair secret


Yeah, no kind of an in closing on on this part at least before we dive into you know


The little quonset contest that we're gonna have is I want to ask you and this kind of is really important


With us starting out today's episode we're talking about Bitcoin


us diving into quantum supremacy


some talk there and just on you know some of the more technical aspects


But one of the most you know a common theme and why this matters is that as more and more both capital and


Interest is being put into the space


with all of that


You know capital and importance of people putting their precious money and not only that just resources and a lot more going into the space


One part I want to talk about is that it's really important for people to get a better baseline


Understanding of the quantum threat in general for


Being able to understand it better. Why should they even care? So what I want to ask


Tric is what are the holidays or if you're watching this after the holidays?


I want to ask right what are a few next steps or recommendations you have for people whether it be books


resources articles that someone can take a few hours of time and


Get a little bit of better understanding of the quantum threat


So that they're more on the know now so that in order to be prepared for later


They're an immoral


Inform to citizen now and they can have that with them moving forward as the crypto industry grows over this next decade


Yeah, so


Myself person I started off with the fundamentals


And from you know turn of the century with Einstein and bars


You know the early physicists, but I understand that everyone's gonna take not everyone wants to take that route


If you really just want to keep up to date on the news


Subscribing to Google Trends with certain keywords is a really good thing. I do that


Also, I'll give a shout out to quantum computing report.com


They send out


News automatically to your email address. They've got a good newsletter


But and if you want to do a little bit more research and quantum you know in quantum mechanics and other areas


I got a I got to give a shout out to Matt O'Dowd of space time on PBS


He's got a really interesting show that I just love. It's probably one of my favorites


But specifically just to get where quantum computers are at I'm going to say obviously this channel


You know like and subscribe and


quantum quantum computer new port.com and also


Google Trends with keywords in order to get them sent to your mailbox. Those are good places start


There's also some discord groups


That are available where they talk specifically just about quantum theory quantum quantum computer programming and quantum computers


And then there's the old fashioned


Do IIR so do your own research?


Do I appreciate it?


What I want to do now? I appreciate strike diving into the few those areas


What we want to do now is since we've been talking for a little bit about


Quantum predictions on our side kind of what we're seeing in the industry as a whole and certainly on our team


What we want to do is we want to be able to hear from you to see


What do you think is going to be happening over the next 12 to 18 months with your quantum predictions?


So we're going to be running a little bit of a QRL contest so to speak and


The rules super easy. There's three steps for it


First one will just be if you want to be involved in the contest to win


Potentially 500 quanta


Number one is subscribe to our channel that way you can listen and be informed or whenever


Strike and myself come out with a new video content that is pertaining to


Not only the crypto industry as a whole


But also just on the quantum threat is we dive into that each week


So first part is make sure you subscribe to the channel if you've already done this


The second step is the most important


We want you to write a comment below this video and YouTube


Tell us in a few sentences or less. Let us know what you think


Your prediction is of the quantum threat moving forward


Share is little or as much as you want and then third


So we can associate your comment to who you actually are place either your discord or your twiddle


Twitter and that your twiddle your Twitter handle alongside with that


With your comment so that we can associate the two and over this next week older holidays


We will be putting together


Pick and winners for each of those based on the comments and we just not only do we want to run a little fun little


QRL contest amongst the whole community


But we also just want to see what your thoughts are and then we can help incorporate in


What you think on the quantum threat moving forward?


We can cover this in future episodes that way the communities involved but


Strike again. I appreciate you taking the time to answer some of these questions


You at home if you are watching this throughout the holidays or not have a have a great time heading into the new year


If you're watching this after hope your holidays were great and from strike and I


We will both see you in the next video and


You keep your digital assets safe and secure and strike and I will see you soon


QRL Quick Qlip - Bitcoin is too slow for small transactions, right? NO.

Here's one thing. You'll see a lot of critics that are talking about this.


It's like, this is a stupid move. Why would they do this?


Bitcoin's too slow. I want to address this one thing first off about Bitcoin's speed.


Because I don't think we've ever even mentioned this.


First off, Bitcoin's not too slow. I'll give you an example.


I send a Bitcoin transaction. I submit it to a node, which looks at the current blockchain.


It invalidates whether or not that's a valid transaction based on the current state of the ledger.


Now, for small transactions, even for things like coffee, you could easily,


a company could easily just run a Bitcoin node, receive the transaction, verify that at that point in time it is a valid transaction.


That doesn't mean there are going to be the ones that solve the cryptographic puzzle and get the build the next block.


But they can at least see the ledger, see the transaction, and see that that person has, they have funds available in order to spend that amount of Bitcoin.


So, that's a low risk. I mean, I can't think of anyone who's going to try and do a double spend on a cup of coffee.


So, I'm going to dispel that rumor right now that Bitcoin's too slow.


And if you look at CEXs that are waiting for one, two, three, sometimes more than three confirmations,


which can take upwards of 20 minutes. They're just doing that because that's an umbrella amount.


They're covering an umbrella of transactions of which could be any amount.


QRL, Geometry Labs, & NIST Working in Parallel to Create Quantum-Resistant Cryptographic Algorithms

Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of the QRL Show, the place where you come for the crypto and stay for the quantum on today's episode


We have Mitchell Crabbiet's there and Brandon Goodell of geometry labs with us to discuss a macro episode on techniques for efficient post-quantum finance


And this conversation stems from a blog series that we've published over the past several months


And so any point in this conversation when we mention a blog a part one a part two etc


We'll have a link to each of these that's easily accessible within the show notes for you to easily reference and


I'm really excited for you guys to be here


Also with me is Michael Streink who is the director of outreach at the QRL and Michael


I'm gonna hand it out to you as we dive into this full-filling conversation


Yeah, thank you Ryan


Where I want to start is if you're not familiar with our project


The quantum resistant ledger is a post quantum secure


Crypto blockchain project. We're purpose built to be secure against the future


progression of quantum quantum computers and


We just had our four year mainnet anniversary


so we've been running for four years successfully and


I think that's a that's a pretty important milestone


One of the things that we're going to cover today with Brandon Mitchell are some of the work


We've been doing from our education arm of the QRL foundation and which we're trying to


create


you know create and propose new post quantum


cryptography schemes and


Solutions so they're gonna talk a little bit about that if you're not familiar with our project you can find us on dub dub dub dub dot qRL


dot org


And quite simply that is it and I'm gonna hand this off to Mitchell and bread it so


Just kind of set an overview in addition to all of these blog posts. It will be referencing


We have open source


Refen implementation that are freely available on GitHub and PyPice so if anything we're talking about sounds fun


And you want to play with it


You absolutely can so


This whole kind of arc started with building out led to salvage a breath which was a meth package really that can be used for a variety of cryptographic applications


and this automatically kind of implements best practices


Constantized math things like that and


It allows cryptography developers to really just focus on building up the crypto applications and not getting mired in like


Coating up polynomial representations and stuff like that and so that library went out a couple months ago


And then we've been using that to build reference implementations for various cryptographic applications


So random I don't know if you want to try to talk a little bit about the digital series digital signature series


Yeah, so I believe that the digital signature series


Actually started describing the lattice algebra package. Is that correct or do it? Am I missing?


Miss remembering we've been calling it like zero for lattice algebra and the gosh


Three four for the signatures gotcha. Okay. Yeah, so


The lattice algebra package is a really neat way of very fluidly


building the mathematics of these cryptography schemes into your computer so that


most developers can just pick it up and program a crypto scheme without


Fear of implementation mistakes and they can just kind of like put the algebra directly into the code


And so that was our our our zeroth article was describing the lattice algebra package which I'm pretty proud of


After that we we started talking about aggregatable signatures


And I believe aggregatable one-time signatures


And one of the interesting things about aggregatable signatures is that you're able to basically


I don't want to say compress because that has this certain implication


But you're combining several signatures into only one


So in order to publish a transaction


Normally you have to assign a check


Right if you're broadcasting a transaction on some sort of financial network


Or you have to provide a signature if the check is the model but like the bank note check


Is the model for what a how a cryptocurrency transaction is supposed to be?


Right you have like a timestamp on it you have an amount you have a from into into signature on it


Um


If you could combine checks


So that the signatures smushed together or just add together like literally


A plus B right


Then what you end up with is being able to throw out all of this extra data of all of the signatures that are on each check


And being able to basically write only a little tiny


aggregate signature to cover the whole set of transactions which is a really really neat way of saving space


Gosh, and then after that yeah go ahead Mitchell


I was just gonna


Comment on the on the use cases for signature aggregation


So once we have these methods for reducing the on chain footprint by storing one signature plus verification keys


That becomes useful in situations like multi signature wallets right where you can do the non interactive


Aggravation off signature and then just put one


One signature on chain to unlock something


Additionally, you can imagine that this would also have use cases for on chain governance


Right so again, you can do some of the coordination offline


You could have a you know M of N sign off on some governments proposal


So there's a lot of applications


But we've been looking at it primarily with the motivation for proof of stake signatures


But there's a lot of potentially uses beyond that


Trying to think of I'll go ahead Michael


Oh


I'm trying to think of an analogy in which we could describe to our users and I'm gonna take for a moment


I'm gonna use a


This is what's coming to mind a credit union analogy


You have a check and you deposit into your


Bank there you let's say you have five locations you deposit into one and in that entry in the log or blockchain


You have your signature you've got the date you've got the time you've got maybe


Other details and then all of the other credit unions get consensus


They all agree that that check at some point


Was deposited correct


Because they are they are the same and it basically happens instantaneously from a consensus perspective and it


Almost a decentralized perspective


That's an analogy for that. I guess one question that I have is once you aggregate those signatures


Blockchain has this great immutability aspect right but immutability just means that the data will always be there


It doesn't say what data will always be there so when we aggregate signatures this allows us to be able to scale


The scale the chain and the signing and keep everything with a lower


Data footprint so is my understanding so far so the question I have is what is what's lost as far as being able to as far as being able to


Use the immutability and read back the entire chain and get all the data


There has to be some sort of sacrifice


I'm curious as to what that is and if I had to think of what our users might ask that might be a question that they would ask


Actually, that's a really good question that I haven't thought too much about


But I meet the first thing that jumps to mind is


Since people are basically erasing their own signatures and they're combining signatures with other people signatures


It may be hard for somebody to go back and prove that they actually


Let's see here


In my second question is going to be along the lines of anonymity


You know a private you know that seems to me that there's some privacy based


I guess I'm gonna put features in a quote there


You know


So actually no, there's no privacy here and the reason that there's no privacy here is that you're gonna be able to identify each key that contributed


Right, so if if Alice and Bob both signed signatures and then they combine those signatures


You're the point of verifying those is to be able to say ah Alice and Bob signed these


It's not Alice or Bob. It's Alice and Bob


So because of that there's no real privacy thing there


On the other hand, yeah, the only real loss for aggregatable signatures is


That you can't go back and find your original signature


Because on the blockchain the only thing that's written down is the aggregate signatures


But this isn't actually a problem if the signature scheme is


Unforgible then the aggregate signature can't verify unless the original key was used


And so as a consequence you don't need to go back and prove that you signed something the existence of that signature


Is that proof people can verify it the fact that consensus was already reached is that information because


Well, actually consensus so we're talking about a couple of different things here, right?


Talking about authentication versus what people are


agreeing about what's been authenticated


Right so for an authentication you and I don't need to agree whether or not a signature is valid


I can put it through my own verification algorithm and you can put it through your own verification algorithm. There's no consensus there


I mean


There's like a trivial sort of consensus there


The real thing that's going on here is that


basically


Sort of in the sense that


Gosh, let me think of a good. I really haven't analogy. Oh, perfect. I saw that. This is a really interesting question because it's like information


Theoretic right it's like you have this many bits of signatures and then you combine them into fewer bits


So what what bits went away right what information did? I think it's lost what are interesting


I think it's lossless the notion is let's say I have a classroom and everyone has like a bad and marvelous


And I want to know what the different colors distribution of marvels is


The nonaggregated version is where everyone comes up dump some rebels out on my desk if you track a person a


And then we do this for each person the aggregate if there's just kind of like we should have them all


Up in a bucket and then we save the bucket now with same number of marbles with the point being we've made it more convenient


But what we've lost is knowing which marbles belong to who right and this is kind of a signature


So we smash them all together we can still do all the numbers make sure everything checks everything verifies


It's lossless and they're like bits of info that went away are the like


Individual signatures. I could be totally wrong brain by the way. Go for it. And that and that okay signatures belong to whom is kind of the privacy piece


That I was kind of leaning in towards I have however, I have a really absurd analogy


Really shoot you away. She's doing one of my best one of my best friends once told me that I


I do a disservice to analogies in general


So this may be useless imagine you have a


Soc community factor and


Everybody has their socks with their names on it


but you roll up the socks and all of a sudden you have


One pair of socks again


So you take two pairs of socks you can roll them up together and you just only have one pair of socks


But now instead of saying Alice Bob on two different pairs of socks you have one pair of socks. It says Alice and Bob


And and they fit both of their feet


Okay, I know that this is like a really really silly way to look at it, but in terms of


In terms of like the information loss the verify of ability is still there


You know which keys verified signatures. It's all you're doing is you're glomming these signatures together


And and just you're not even gluing them together


You're just kind of like overlaying them some drivers licenses in some states have a little transparent window with a picture of your face on it


Have you seen these?


Yeah depending on the state. Yeah, yeah, you can kind of think of these aggregate signatures as having


128 of these faces overlaid on top of each other and


And you can tell if a face is contributed to it because like if some dude has like a weird


Like he has bubonic plague and he has a booboh hanging off of his head like this


You can see the outline of that dude's head


Right, and so you can kind of in a certain sense see which faces have contributed to it


But it's difficult to pull the specific faces out of it


And it's not necessary because you can tell that the guy with a booboh on his head is in the picture


Um, those are those are the two best analogies. I have is transparent like laying photos on top of each other with Photoshop


And gluing socks together. So it's so as far as SIGAG goes. I think we get there's four analogies there. I think that's sufficient


Right


I think yeah, I think I know there are but we should probably move on


Yeah, let's lead into the next part. Yeah


Um, so after we after we were talking about aggregatable signatures, which I'm really excited about by the way


Those are all one-time signatures


Which make them really hard to compare to things like crystals dilithium and like the NIST competitor signatures


Which are many time signatures Mitchell and I were having this conversation earlier


Um, but after after the aggregatable signature article


We did an adapter signature article the way adapter signatures work is that one person wants a secret one person wants a signature


The person who wants the signature


Constructs a so-called pre signature which is sort of like a promise to a signature and it contains the secret they want


Rather contains the public version of the secret. They want the public key


So then they hand that over to the person who knows the secret and they check the pre signature


They check this promise of a signature and if it's valid


They can adapt that that's why they're called the adapter signatures to a signature


They can adapt the pre signature into a signature and when they do they can go publish it on a book public


Bolts and forward somewhere


But the minute they do the person who gave them the pre signature in the first place


knows enough information to extract the secret out of the published signature


So verifiably encrypted signatures are sort of a way of swapping a secret for a signature


which is really really interesting because there's a duality and cryptography between encryptions and signatures and


And if you can't so like I'm one end of the spectrum you have


Encryption where I encrypt it with my secret and then I decrypt it with my secret and I'm the only person who knows the secret and can do the decrypting


The other hand for signatures. We all know what those do. We're authenticating ourselves


They're sort of dual in this respect and as a consequence attached your signature sort of like


straddle the fence


So one party is interested in one end of the duality and the other parties


That just the other end of the duality and it makes for a really fun swap


Yeah, and they got to come together in that way. Yeah, what would be the use cases Brandon on the for blockchain


Oh, this is the coolest part about use


I figured you got a feeling you wanted that question


Yeah, of course. So the the most important use case is offchain atomic swaps


So I can swap with a Bitcoin


without


Any information really like the box chains don't ever need to interact or talk computer on one network doesn't have to talk to a computer on


The other except for the two parties who are swapping


Um


And it either goes through entirely or it fails entirely so neither nobody loses anything or everybody gets what they want


Which is why it's called atomic so it's only settles then when the base let when it's when it's needed that


um


Well, you said these timers in the end of the whole transaction so that it's after a certain period of time


If the if it hasn't settled original person can get their money back in the client refund model. Yep. Yeah, that's set up within that


Yep, I'd say that else and it turns out that that


Oh, no, please, please


So it turns out that claim a refund model is helpful in constructing a whole bunch of


Sort of smart contract these sort of blockchain applications and I don't want to say smart contract yet


I should just say flexible blockchain applications for example off


Payment channels


Doing a lightning network a multi-hop lightning network. You can do with adapter signatures


So if you were to theoretically design a post-conum


Cryptography or cryptocurrency scheme


Using aggregatable adapters signatures


You would automatically insert of naively be able to support off-chain Islamic swaps and paint lightning-style payment channels without actually having to program any of that in


People could just do it on their own


Really really cool feature. I


What would be the secret that would get exchanged?


Curious would that be the private key that gets exchanged for a specific transaction?


So that would if you're interfacing with with with Bitcoin. Okay with Bitcoin example


Bitcoin or it would be a shot 256 preimage


And then and then the on the Bitcoin end of things you'd have a pay to preimage thing. Okay, so yeah, so


So in the end like if I owned QRL I could like come up with a shot 256 preimage and


And you could do like a pay to preimage sort of thing. I'm gonna get the prep the


Which party it does what swapped if I talk too much just like I did earlier. I always get Allison Bob swapped


but


Yeah, so it would be something like a shot 256 preimage if you're doing Monero


You would probably do something like a key-check


Kekkek preimage or


even


Like you might be able to do Monero keys


I remember a couple months ago


I was thinking about it and there's a couple ways that you can do it for


In a really general sense that are extremely wasteful


So the parties who communicate might be blowing a lot of bandwidth on this


But you could get it done. So with almost any


Any other blockchain, which is really cool. So if I were to kind of summarize for our users


I think I agree with you


I think that you brought up cross chain community


Communication atomic so I think that's arguably one of the most difficult and frustrating things of all blockchain


Right now it'd be able to do that decentralized


You know without being part of a specific specific project like a parachene on Polkadot or


Or in ERC20 and using Uniswap or whatever to stay decentralized obviously see X's have it handled but


If I were to summarize privately over wire, right like if you can accomplish it privately over wire


Or like signal or some other sort of encrypted chat app do it that way


Right, so we're building in the functionality but on the other end


That functionality would need to be integrated as well in order to in order to communicate


And communicate the signatures and the requested data information back and forth


So I guess the other end of the other end at the app like that


I'll just call the


the GRPC layer is that


Communication established it well at that higher layer on the OSI or is that just the functionality so far built in?


I believe it's the case


Correct me if I'm wrong Brandon that to


Implement say Bitcoin QRL swaps the work that we need to be happen is peripheral to the chains, right?


Oh, yeah, we don't need to modify QRL's protocol


We don't need to modify bitcoins protocol just engineer a little bit of like a P2P layer


Let's let's be careful here because QRL as it currently is is not capable of doing these things. Oh, yeah


Sorry if we if we if we implemented this like in you know imaginary lattice face version of


Future QRL then then yes, that would be like natively built in and so anybody could come in and write an app that handled


Like the front end of things and the chains wouldn't have to interact or be altered in any way


Was that what you were asking Michael so still some work to do? I just want to be making sure we're giving you know an objective perspective


Is holistically as possible for our users


Yeah, awesome. Thank you. And I've seen I've seen a couple dev teams work on swaps like you know


Manero Bitcoin and it seems like generally a good dev team can implement it in six to 12 months


They're like surrounding infrastructure. Yeah


And that actually brings us to I think the most exciting


Which isn't doesn't have much to do with cryptography at all, but it has to do with coding theory and that's this on the


Storage architecture. Yeah, I want to go into this. Yeah, the secure fountain architecture is so cool. So


You can visualize the process as new nodes wanting to join the network


They can hold out a bucket and old nodes


turn on a faucet and


They the new bucket nodes collect droplets in their bucket and once their bucket is full


They can extract a sequence of blocks


Yeah, and no well, and while we're on this one for anyone that's watching for reference


This is and park floor of this year. So just gonna show notes is your referencing that's by thumb. No continue, Brandon


I yeah, absolutely so so for the secure fountain architecture


All the different nodes that want to this is entirely optional


They can encode their blockchain into droplets and when new nodes join the network they can hand over their droplets and


These new nodes these bucket nodes can extract the blockchain from the droplets in a way that allows them to verify it as they go


so that they can discard block or data droplets from peers who are acting maliciously and


In the end, it's very very difficult to convince a new node to decode the incorrect blockchain


So what the real value of this is that each droplet is about the size of the block and


And so if you can store fewer droplets


Then you can't blocks


Then you can help new nodes bootstrap and still


Verify transactions after they bootstrapped without actually storing the whole blockchain locally a


Lot of different blockchains attempt this striping method of


Pruning and there's actually a variety of pruning methods. I shouldn't I shouldn't pick on striping specifically


But striping one way that you can look at it is like okay, you throw out one out of every or seven out of every eight blocks


You pick an index from zero to seven and then you keep every block height that is


Conger it's zero mod eight


Or excuse me that index mod eight


So you're only keeping like one out of every eight blocks, but then you can't verify your transactions out of seven eighths of the blockchain


Which is a lot?


It's too much. But someone else could generally verify someone else could


However with this droplet method you can verify out of a significant portion of the blocks in your epic


You can still hand out droplets to new nodes and the numbers that we're seeing right now in the original paper


The paper like provided ridiculous space savings claims like 10,000 per you know 10,000 fold


We're seeing something like 68% space savings in practice


In our numbers so we're looking at like nodes being able to throw up throw out up to 60% of the blockchain


68% of the blockchain and still be able to validate transactions and still be able to help new nodes both bootstrap


It's super cool analogy time


I have one I'll just say at a real quick high level the


kind of the big fundamental trade-off that's being made here is


Dramatically reducing storage requirements and increasing bandwidth right?


So if you have like an old iPad around the house that doesn't have a lot of storage


But you're on Wi-Fi and you have plenty of bandwidth that you know that be the kind of application


It's that it's that trade-off. Sorry. Go ahead. No, that was good


So for the again for the users


Most I think most of our users have a hardware you know a hardware background of some degree


I'm picturing as you're describing this. I'm picturing the


Blockchain itself the entire ledger on it's on a RAID 0 set


Whereas where it's striped like this not just not just three disks, but maybe a


thousand 10,000 disks


With the exception being that in a rates in a you know in a in a RAID set that there's not any duplication of data


But in in the blockchain there would be duplication of those droplets as you say could be a little block


So statistically somewhere at some point


Someone is certain certainly to have the information information that you're that you're looking for and this distributed architecture


So not only is consensus distributed and not only is the


I don't even know how I'm gonna say this not only is the blockchain itself distributed, but the blockchain


ledger


It's distributed as well. What are the words? Someone say the correct words? It's like it's almost like decentralizing the dissemination


Exactly this it's going on. You know what?


You know what it's it's not too dissimilar from BitTorrent in


certain ways and


I was gonna say where it was well. Yeah, exactly I swarm a bit towards swarm of


Yeah, yeah drops this is this is really cool stuff


And I actually have to thank the author of the secure fountain architecture paper


I'm gonna look it up really quick because I always forget it because first off. I've never met this person before


but


Sorry


The only thing I could think of is you'd have to have a sufficiently large number of nodes


right in it in order to it's statistically ensure that you have all pieces of the ledger because they don't all


Please you you may need to cut contact a large or larger or like a decent number of nodes


But the numbers that we're looking at we're designing it so that if you can contact four honest nodes


Then you can reconstruct the blockchain is that statistically you're guaranteed in


Expectation, so it's just statistical


Okay, so but real quick. I want to thank


The authors of the secure fountain architecture. I don't I'm going to butcher their names Kadei Chung and Raman Chandran


Who basically employed the Lubi transform code the LT code for?


By bootstrapping the hash chain, right?


So the reason that this works is that you can throw out droplets from malicious


Nodes and the reason that you can do that is because you maintain the hash chain


So once you've decoded a block you have that blocks payload


You can compute the Merkel route you can compare it to the hash header


That you're expecting and you can see if all the hashes are working out and if that didn't work then you can throw it up


drop it out and this is like a really really brilliant observation and


It was actually introduced to me by a mathematician named Feliche


Man Janello at Clemson University


And when I was at a Bitcoin conference in Toronto at the fields institute a couple of years ago and I've literally been trying to like figure out


Exactly how efficient this paper could get for for a while and then QRO was finding like okay


How about you tell us how efficient this can be?


So I find they had a reason to like look into it. Um, so yeah, anyway, I'll stop rambling now


And Michael back to your question about how to couch this in terms of like centralization and decentralization


I think the like thought experiment that comes to mind for me is if you imagine


Something with a five terabyte blockchain


That's gonna have a massively centralizing force in if you don't have secure fountain architecture


And every full note has to have five terabytes at the time of recording. That's a lot of disk space for like a regular commercial laptop


or something


Whereas if you switch to secure fountain architecture and you've tuned it for like high space savings high bandwidth usage


Now you can actually run all these full nodes on much lighter devices


You know your laptop and it's just on the fly getting in discarding data that it needs


So that's where they're saying nearly full nodes nearly full. Yeah, yeah, yeah, really full look and so that's an where the kind of


Decentralizing comes into place you've dramatically lowered the space requirements and you know


Made a more excessive more skin and also what one


One interesting observation


I made just the other day is that the bandwidth cost of this method actually goes away if there are still full nodes around


Just serving up droplets


So people can earth give me just serving up blocks because people can just download the blocks instead of the droplets


So the overhead actually vanishes so as we're talking about which sorry


68% storage savings with no overhead like


So as we're talking about bandwidth saving bandwidth


We're talking about reducing the reducing the payloads and reduce possibly reducing the sides of the packets with that being said


Ben with isn't really I mean


It's not really a big problem today as it is


Right, but we are making creasing bandwidth


We are with this method. We increase bandwidth. We're trading storage space for bandwidth. So we're increasing


Correct and exit for storage space right right now


This is actually arguably


Sort of a useless method if we've site the the incorrect Moore's law, right?


Storage is getting cheaper and cheaper and cheaper. So there really isn't a good reason to


Offload storage onto bandwidth because in the end bandwidth is going to be what's expensive


Which is what I think you were getting at Michael is that


Like, you know 25 years from now


I'll be able to have you know five terabyte the hard drives like just on little SD cards all over the place, but


The price of the internet is going to be you know the real cost is there. There's also Nielsen's law, which is that


High end user connection speed grows about 50% year over year


Okay, well, there's also nothing there's both laws and there's nothing's lost which is why we're all here yeah


And then there's Jevan's paradox, which I love are you guys familiar this actually bothers the crap out of me


I might when you reference, but it's not jog my memory


I'd believe that a lot of viewers may know this because this is a famous


This is sort of a famous economic


issue or economic paradox that cryptocurrency people like


Jevan's paradox basically says that if you increase the efficiency of the system


The usage of the system will increase until the efficiency is maxed out like hard drives


It's the reason that adding more highway lanes just leads to more traffic


And so actually every time that I every time that we do one of these efficiency improvements


Jevan's paradox is sitting on the back of my mind. I'm like oh, this just means people are going to be using the space a lot more


Which is a good thing right?


And that's true


I mean if we all had one terabyte terabyte drives


Chia probably wouldn't have taken off as it did, right?


We use what we're giving we'll always find use ways to use resources


That's very wise Michael, you know, we live in the worlds that we build for ourselves


we use what we get


where I kind of like to wrap up and close things now that we touched on the


you know storage requirements art and part four there is before we you know close out this episode


We're gonna be doing an upcoming episode, which is gonna be yet, you know an AMA episode on the entire series


But wrapping up this episode. I'd like to


Give either you know any key takeaways for those who are watching to you know


Kind of walk away with either as like you know


Reminder of a few things to keep in mind or maybe just some you know


Lanes to potentially go down. I know that there's a lot of complexity


You know as people go into each part


But really where is maybe a couple of you takeaways or parts where they can maybe at least build their own rabbit hole service


Be gone Brandon or Mitchell


All that Mitchell start


And just as an added part Mitchell


I know we talked on you know, this is kind of there's an there's parts of part


You know zero through four, but also you know, it's a continuation. So I kind of want to keep people's you know


Intree going as far as you know, this is a continued thing. We don't just stop here


This is an evolution to it so wherever wherever you want to you know, the yours


I would say if I had to give a


One to two sentence comment on the various portions. I would say like to me one of the exciting takeaways


Over the kind of signature portion of the series


Is that these new


Ladder salvageable techniques based on quantum hard assumptions


Are really cool not just in that they are quantum secure, but also


Hopefully scalable also you can bring in all this extra functionality


It's just a really cool


Really active field of research a lot of this there's all these now, you know zero knowledge arguments being built on top of that all of that


So if there's like cryptoners out there


This is I think a really cool thing to kind of drill into and just start learning about and then in terms of the secure phone architecture


I would say


I think the big exciting takeaway here is that this is just kind of a general tool that could be applied to any blockchain


Can be tuned for whether you want to like really drive down to space storage or not collect any peers


And I really think that this could become like a pretty standard second layer


And so stay tuned for that. I think we'll have a lot of cool developments there and


Who knows the articles will have coming out after this


Now I appreciate it. I appreciate that. Yeah


Yeah, I think that for


For people interested in signatures and cryptography


They can keep an eye on the latest NIST competitors and the the competition winners that just came out. I believe Falcon Sphinx and


Crystals where the signature schemes that came out of that as far as I know none of those are aggregatable right now


So keeping an eye on aggregatable versions of those guys would be an interesting thing


Um Falcon has a ring signature version of itself that somebody used a couple of years ago to design


Post quantum version of Monero


Which was kind of an interesting thing


Let's see here


As far as adapter signatures go


That honestly has such so many different names in the in the literature and stuff that


Like literally we've consulted with cryptographers to like look through articles and they're like


I've never heard of adapter signatures. What are these? I'm like well, what about they're if I have any encrypted signatures from this paper? They're like


It's it's real inside baseball


As far as secure fountain architecture stuff goes


Coding theory is an area of mathematics that deals with basically compression and decompression


I don't want to like oversimplify things but you can think of what we're doing here as compressing the blockchain and do a couple of droplets


Right


Coding theory is a field of mathematics that doesn't deal with trying to keep information secret


But there's things like error correcting codes so that if I'm transmitting information over a noisy channel