Year: 1876

In the course of an interview with Genera


B. +. Butler, a correspondent of the New


York ''rlr:td extracted the following trench


ant criticism on the positions assumed b.


John Sherman d Co., Of New Orleans, as t


the merely clerical functions of Vice Presi


dent Ferry. 1t will be seen that Butler take


issue with Sherman, and that while he doe


not believe a revolution possible d result o


the refusal OF the two houses, or either 0
them. to count in Hayes or Tilden, he doe


think that bankruptcy. private and national


would result.


Admitting for the mDinent said General Butler
their assumption that the president OF the seIIae
TO count the electoral votes i'm the presence Of tht
two houses, they make very significant admission
that he is ministerial or clerical officer only
that Is that he has no other prwer than simply Il
count The votes tat are certified to him without an
power to adiudlcate whether the certificates are gen
une or forged or whether the votes have been prop
eTly or Improperly east, so that II the President
knew that an electOr had voted for a given man a;
President for Il bribe paid In hand Of many thou
sand dollars he would have no other right or dutI
but 10 count hiSsYOte. Taking their assumption
also and considering that the Republicans have the
president OF the senate, this IS most remarkable
giving up of power In the president of the senate
and an Invitation as 1t seems to me, to ANYBODY &c
get electoral votes before him OF any sort, and they
VIII be available and counted. by no means agree
that the president of the senate has the counting OF
the votes The words of the constitution dre "They
(he ceTfcates) shall be opened by the president OF
the senate In the presence of both houses and the
votes shall then be counted" If the constitution
meant that the president OF the senate should count
the votes, why, it IS very easy to say
He shall open the certificates and count the
votes In the presence Of both houses" The uni
form practice Of the government has been since its
formation that the votes should be counted by the
tellers appointed by both houses, acting of course
as the eyes and ears OF both houses under their in
SpectOn; and thus we have a cOntempOraneOus con-
strctiOn Of this clause of the constitution by the
frslV ffUnTNn afrn
all parties. There is but one dictum against this
that know Of, and that Is by Chancellor Kent Who
when speaking of the danger and possible trouble
that might arise under this constitutional provision,
SAYS: THE votes are to be counted by the president
of the senate, presume, but enters into reason
Ing upon the question, and evidently has not given
II thought OF course, acting under the cOnStitu-


Onal provision, II the president of the senate has
right TO count the votes at all, it must be pFerOga-
tive or power given him by the constitution. There
fore, 1t IS no answer to the continuous usage in
counting the votes by both I'd say that that was done
under joint rule, because If the president OF the
senate has the power under the constitution, no joint
rule OF the two houses could deprive him of Ii. In
fact, that joint rule OF the two houses was only a
declaration OF convenient mode by those bodies of
doing the counting OF the electoral votes which they
assumed the pTeTOgltiGe to do.


Rep0rer-D0 you Think then, that the two houses
must agree on the votes before they can be counted?


General Butler-If any instrument says that A and
b are to do a thing-fOr example, to make an award
or enter ludgInent-cdn do 1t without b, or 3
without A? II both houses dTe to count by the con-
Stltution can one count without the other? If so,
which? III our Republican friends In Louisiana, In
their letter, had claimed the right I'm the president
OF the senate TO adjudcate as to the prOpriety or
rtghtfuHeSs OF the electoral vote when they made
the claim that he was to count them, | should have
thought it very significant but they have insisted
that he is merely a machine or clerk to register
what may be sent him, ! DO not think the Demo-
cratic party will be likely to be much moved By their
which certainly leaves the president of
the senate about harmless piece of clOckWOrk as
could be imagined 1t being his only duty to tick out
Is In I hali hat tKhp
ever has the counting of the vote in the last resort
10 determine an election has the right to scuItnlze
that vote ascertain its legality its fairness dtrath
7ote by proxy, the electors are, the will of the
people who are their constituents. All that of course
,ann0t be done by the president OF the senate and
therefore must be done by the two houses If It can
be done by the president of the senate, then the
most alarming stride against the rights of the people
has been taken when the claim Is made that the
president OF the senate is TO count the votes. FOr'
unately however, the claim thus made by this very
respectable body of Republicans In Louisiana Is EN-
rey emasculated by the cOncomtant assertion that
he president of the senate is to be simple ma
,hine ministerial officer or clerk.


RepOrter-Well, what Is to be the outcome Of all
his if the two houses do not agree In the count of
he votes?


General Butler-I cannot for moment cOnterl-
plate or entertain the idea that if there Is fairly
expressed majority of the vote of the electoral col
ege, properly and justly shown for either OF the
that either house or senate Will fract
,usly take any step TO prevent the counting and de-





,hOSen. The people OF this country would hurl to
any party which should undertake so
TOSS an outrage. One vote majority fairly thrown
md properly counted Is as good as one thousand un
Ter our system of determining elections can con-
eiye of no greater danger to our frame OF govern
nent, nay. to the very government itself, than the
dea, If it be entertained that the will Of the maiO
may be overcome by force, or fraud. or chicanery
Il any sort.


Reporter-Then you believe that If the houses
hOuld divide on the counting OF the votes it would
eSult in revolution?


General Butler mo, Il doubt that but it would In
'ankuptcy, national and private. Mr.. Belmont
aid, and probably rightly enough that the result OF
IN election would not affect the price Of our bonds in
europe or course he meant fair election, But
le has not given his opinion what the effect would
,e on OuT bonds In Europe OF nOn-electiOn, leaving
he country exposed TO anarchy Indeed, this Is Il
natter for very grave contemplation, The c0nStitIl-
Ion has disclosed defect in our frame Of govern
nent not well understood even by ourselves, and one
which probably never came to the attention OF any
Oreigner who OWLS our bOnds-that Is the pOSSibil-
ty, and, perhaps not distant probability, that the
WO houses might divide upon the counting OF the
OteS, and the executive government lapse for want
II constitutional provision as to who shall be at
IS head after the fourth OF March, as the President
an only hold over il at all, By an assumption of
,Ower, because of the necessity Of the case. II We
et into this dilemma, not only the funding of our
ebt would be stopped, but our bonds would be re-
uTned upon us by millions because an unknown
nd unforeseen danger Is always the most tTighttul
nd most fruitful In panic. The sagaciOus and
atri0dc statesmen OF the country will pause and





dangerous and unknown sea OF political and gov
action.


Reporter do you see any way out of this?
General Butler-It is always easier to foresee
anger or appreciate difficulty than II Is to lind
emedy. II requires i'm so grave q matter everything
the most careful investigation and thought and
he coolest reflection. l. however, may suggest, as
leanS OF getting as near regular government uIl
our constitution possible to which there is
institutional objection that | know OF, General
rants calling meeting of both houses of con-
TeSs on the fifth day of March to act upon and deal
18th the problems that shall then be presented.
rue, no President has ever called meeting to be
eld In the term of his successor, although, as /
ave said there Is nothing In the constitution lnhib
Ing it that am aware of. The reason why il has
Ot been done is that no emergency like the present
as ever arisen 10 call for II, and that an outgoing
resident would be naturally reluctant to take any
ctl0n which might embarraSs his successor, which
sufficient cause OF want of precedent Both
Ouses of congress being in session some action
hight be taken in which all would agree to keep a
oyernment af0at until successor to the President
Ould be elected.
Reporter-It has been suggested that the president
the senate might act after the fourth of March.
General Butler-AS he can only act I'm case of a
acancy by DEATH resignation or removal of Pres-
ent, and as there willb no death, resignation or
omOyal on the fourth day OF March, when the Pres
lent goes out do not see how the president OF the
hOuld resign on the first Of March, and the presl-
ent of the senate should become acting President
think his term would expire with the term of the
resident for whom he was acting.
At this point General Butler seemed impatient to
itend TO a large pile OF letters and papers on his
lble, and to a large crowd OF callers who were walt
lg for him, and the reporter left
IumOred InsurrectiOn in Poland Con-


tradirted.
LONDON, November 22.-Princc Czartory-
1i, the acknowledged head of the Polish ref
gees in France, in Il letter to a friend, which
published in this mornings Post, says there
not the slightest foundation for the reports
+ an impending insurrection in Poland. He
.ates that the country IS perfectly tranquil, !
nd that the emigration Is less disposed than
yer to encourage an insmTectionary move
lent
TNoTE.-The 'emigation' is the name of
large body of influential refugees settled in
aris