I mean one big issue with the equipment still which is um ultimately gonna well the idea is to have any number of these wired headsets but this amplification problem I built this thing very noisy actually recording going through it at the moment but so noisy that I am not using for this designed to be used for the for the desktop meeting as well But using running that through my uh damp machine as a as an alternative Well we should be able to just go buy some preamps I would think Yeah just it eh You see how clumsy this is right I have to use these batteries to bias them And only get two channels and a bunch of There are like three connectors in the circuit The thing is like not s not that the thing doesn't exist commercially but there isn't one unit which does the whole thing in one in one swoop So it seemed like it was a good idea to make one um And still not sure I mean I think Yeah I probably know how to fix this I can probably build it better so it doesn't have such noise but Well ultimately buy gonna need to build one anyway Are we Sure we Because just we gonna have to put it in a PDA Well Right If we have microphones in a PDA gonna need bias and a I guess sort of figured that that Jim would do that at some point Right Yeah Well n Yeah Jim is busy at the moment the problem I was kind of hoping that Jim was going to build this box But Yeah um but he hasn't had time Well I think I think he is quite interested in doing it But OK Well If too noisy and if something we can buy again for you know moderate amount of price even Yeah takes a couple boxes Yeah something maybe we should just do it And then and then later we can uh replace it with Because there may be other considerations that will go into the design I mean uh our getting some experience with this may help to determine some of things that are I don't know might change this design Right So There was uh a statement made uh which I don't think is right by the way but there was a statement made at the uh DARPA Communicator meeting I was at recently that um microphone multiple microphones at a distance of less than three feet or something like that were totally useless completely irrelevant Oh Yeah You you mean for noise cancelling for or nois noise cancelling Um my counter argument is is an uh uh um a white rat uh which has th two microphones exceedingly close together and it works pretty well Um but OK Yeah This happened Do they mean omnidirectional is that their point I mean all the noise cancelling mikes you know a few m millimeters away from each other pointing in different directions I think But I mean uh my guess is that means just that if if near field the mathematics of beam beam steering is different Oh I see If the f if the wavefronts are not approximately planar then you can't just do delay and sum and expect it to work OK so not talking about how far apart the mikes are talking about how far they are from the speaker I guess Yeah Right But I think that if my point is I guess if you if you have a um a uh s a volume in between the two the two uh uh sensors Yeah and you do something cleverer there Yeah clearly are ways Yeah to get yeah more out of it Right right right I mean the Yeah The the weird thing is that actually delay in some is not is not the clever thing to do The the the underwater guys do this stuff which is different And it actually means that you should get the microphones as close together as possible Rather than trying to get them far apart so you can get separation you sort of you want them very close And And the math is too difficult for me to understand but Yeah but there Well there are various points in meeting where people were making uh uh very strong statements as a matter of fact like one shouldn't even question it and this was one of them that was kind of funny Um but I I I what I take it to mean is doing doing the dumb thing uh with two microphones would be very difficult to get too much out of it but I think it will be interesting to do other things that aren't dumb So I I still think potentially Hmm interesting to do that Although we have to be uh a aware of this if writing proposals about it wherever that there may well be reviewers who will say well everyone knows that you can't get anything out of it if if Yeah close Do they believe you can get speaker location out of it Cuz one way we could sneak it in Uh that is an interesting point Yeah Yeah Certainly you can Well we could get some I mean By the time have have data so we can actually Yeah know demonstrate that Well Hopefully mean for location Yeah OK Depends some we getting some right now Yeah right but someone has to write some software to Right Right But I Well to actually someone it might Someone interested in in it Oh uh I was just thinking one thing we may wanna do is put the fake PDA right in front of someone instead of in the middle of the table like we have it now Yeah the thought that my vision of it is you know each of us will have our little PDA in front of us and so the acoustics uh you might want to try to match the acoustics Maybe Yeah on the other hand suppose that uh the only one uh who is advanced enough in this thinking to actually bring such a PDA to No a and meeting don't need to meet with those and people and and therefore you bring it in and you probably want it to be as near to people as possible so you might in fact shove it to the middle of the table Well Yep yep For those those we can make several several more of these and then we can have actual recording with you know three Yeah Well I think we should I mean I think at least with two Right Right Because uh one of the th one of the fantasies that was at least fun to talk about was that uh uh OK maybe you th the range of things you can do with multiple microphones is limited if a few inches apart but what if you have two of these things Yeah And you know we have this this idea of the handshake back