skysight-inc/HackerNews huggingface dataset:
This argument by Penrose using Godel's theorem has been discussed (or, depending on who you ask, refuted) before in various places, it's very old. The first time I've seen it was in Hofstadter's "Godel, Escher, Bach", but a more accessible version is this lecture[1] by Scott Aaronson. There's also an interview with Aaronson with Lex Friedman where he talks about it some more[2].

Basically, Penrose's argument hinges on Godel's theorem showing that a computer is unable to "see" that something is true without being able to prove it (something he claims humans are able to do).

To see how the argument makes no sense, one only has to note that even if you believe humans can "see" truth, it's undeniable that sometimes humans can also "see" things that are not true (i.e., sometimes people truly believe they're right when they're wrong).

In the end, stripping away all talk about consciousness and other stuff we "know" makes humans different from machines, and confine the discussion entirely over what Godel's theorem can say about this stuff, humans are no different from machines, and we're left with very little of substance: both humans and computers can say things that are true but unprovable (humans can "see" unprovable truths, and LLMs can hallucinate), and both also sometimes say things that are wrong (humans are sometimes wrong, and LLMs hallucinate).

By the way "LLMs hallucinate" is a modern take on this: you just need a computer running a program that answers something that is not computable (to make interesting, think of a program that randomly responds "halts" or "doesn't halt" when asked whether some given Turing machine halts).

(ETA: if you don't find my argument convincing, just read Aaronson's notes, they're much better).

[1] https://www.scottaaronson.com/democritus/lec10.5.html

[2] https://youtu.be/nAMjv0NAESM?si=Hr5kwa7M4JuAdobI&t=2553
We can't drill anywhere near the mantle, geothermal extracts energy from the upper part of the crust.
Penrose believes that consciousness originates from quantum mechanics and the collapse of the wavefunction. Obviously you couldn't (effectively) simulate that with a classical computer. It's a very unconventional position, but it's not circular.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emperor%27s_New_Mind

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shadows_of_the_Mind
Enhanced geothermal uses fracking to expose absolutely massive amounts of m^2 through fracking between two parallel, long, horizontally drilled bore holes. Current efforts seem to show a minimum of 30 years before there will be loss of heat quality.

The sorts of drilling talked about for enhanced geothermal are on the scale far far above the needs of a house, IIRC about 5MW per bore hole pair, with many connecting from a single point on the surface. It's also at distances kilometers into the earth.
Isn't there some way you could calculate the signal density you'd need in any of PDM/PWM/PCM to roughly equate to the quality of signal reproduction of a given tape media, given known tape surface/speed/magnetic density?

It turns out there is https://www.electricity-magnetism.org/magnetic-storage-devic... -- its a bit more complicated than what I'm more familiar with, which is film-grain-to-digital-equivalent resolution.

Anyway, you could do the work to work out the bit depth/signal rate you'd need to equate to reproduction of a given fluxdensity/recording rate. I would bet the numbers for classic PCM/PDM devices line up surprisingly close to certain tape systems.

On the flipside, once you know those numbers, you could also calculate what the expected analog equivalents could be, sample existing analog media/playback systems and use those to systematically characterize their quality, instead of going by earfeel, as it were.
That's not how it works in countries with fully subsidized healtcare. It seems you are biased towards some intents that have been done in USA to subsidize some part, in a perverse, privatized and corrupt system.

In Spain it is the privatization of the healthcare that is "given to themselves and call it patient care", making politician friends (and politicians themselves) richer and corrupt, and selling it as a way to "fix the healthcare" that they are breaking.
Solar and wind energy has a problem, which is storage. We have not yet developed a competitive solution to store energy on commercial scale that works everywhere.

Nuclear energy is stable but generally quite costly per kWh compared to renewable energy.

Nuclear energy and renewables in combination balances out disadvantages. Nuclear energy reduces the need for energy storage solutions in renewables by providing a base load, while renewables would enable cost-efficiency in even quite energy demanding uses (e.g. carbon capture, generating methane etc.).
Ahh yes, the internet. Teaching babies about cursed Elsa, young children about alternative history, frustrated young men to blame women and minorities for their problem, and women that they will never be pretty enough without consuming product. Oh and the practically unlimited porn along all stages.

Crassness aside.

1. the internet is getting more and more pay walls too. So proper education isn't even free on the internet without months of curation.

2. People who make this claim must not have seen studies about homseschooled kids. That social element in being around a group of peers is crucial development that you can't really simulate anywhere else (without again, a crap ton of money for camps or something). Especially these days when everything is trying to isolate off.
My mistake, thanks.
Yet, Google is a lot more specific im what, how and why you license the content to Google. And it is not for anything that Firefox does.

Plus:

> Some of our services are designed to let you upload, submit, store, send, receive, or share your content. You have no obligation to provide any content to our services and you’re free to choose the content that you want to provide.
> His intent at the time was to open a physical explanation for free will by taking the recourse to quantum nano-tubules magnifying true randomness to the level of human cognition. As much as I'm also skeptical that this actually moves the needle on whether or not we have free will (...vs occasionally having access to statistically-certain nondeterminism? Ok...) the computable stuff was just in service of this end.

Free will is a useful abstraction. Just like life and continuity of self are.

> I strongly suspect he just hasn't grasped how powerful heuristics are at overcoming general restrictions on computation.

Allowing approximations or "I don't know" is what's helpful. The bpf verifier can work despite the halting problem being unsolvable, not because it makes guesses (uses heuristics) but because it's allowed to lump in "I don't know" with "no".
> the executives will always act in their own self-interest;

Yes, and so does everyone else, including me, including you.

> since their compensation is mostly stock, that means they will sacrifice the future of tomorrow for the stock bump of today, every single time.

When investors discover that a company is eating its seed corn for short term gain, the stock crashes.
I am not a programmer and i don't use Linux. I've been working on a python script for a raspberry pi for a few months. Chatgpt has been really helpful in showing me how to do things or debug errors.

Now I am at the point that I am cleaning up the code and making it pretty. My script is less than 300 lines and Chatgpt regularly just leaves out whole chunks of the script when it suggests improvements. The first couple times this led to tons of head scratching over why some small change to make one thing more resilient would make something totally unrelated break.

Now I've learned to take Chatgpt's changes and diff it with the working version before I try to run it.
Penrose is a dualist, he believes the mind is detached from the material world.

He has been desperately seeking proof of quantum phenomenons in the brain, so he may have something to point to when asked how this mind, supposedly external to the physical realm, can pilot our bodies.

I am not a dualist, and I don't think what Penrose has to say about AI or consciousness holds much value.
Analogizing this to human hallucination is silly. In the instance you're talking about, the human isn't hallucinating, they're lying.
That’s odd because DNS is the quintessential UDP-based protocol. “From the time of its origin in 1983 the DNS has used the User Datagram Protocol (UDP) for transport over IP.”. DNS over TCP was only introduced as a later addition (admittedly, in 1989).
EU spends more on Russian oil and gas than financial aid to Ukraine
Not just that, “it works” is a very, very low bar to have for your code. To illustrate, the other day I tested an LLM by having it create a REST API. I asked for an end point where I could update a particular field of the record (think liking a post).

Then I decided to add on more functionality and asked for the ability to update all the other fields…

As you can guess, it gave me one endpoint per field for that entity. Sure, “it works”…
They're not bothering to draw a distinction that almost nobody cares about, yes.
Because it saves lives. https://folklore.org/Saving_Lives.html:

"Well, let's say you can shave 10 seconds off of the boot time. Multiply that by five million users and thats 50 million seconds, every single day. Over a year, that's probably dozens of lifetimes. So if you make it boot ten seconds faster, you've saved a dozen lives. That's really worth it, don't you think?”
I just had to check when these vaccines became available. I remember my Mum being strict about getting all my shots, but I still managed to get measles, and chickenpox twice. I just had to ask GPT why the nurse gave me a sugar lump to eat, and apparently that was polio vaccine.

I predate the chickenpox vaccine and I predate the advice to get two measles shots.
I only tenuously understand this so feel free to ignore the question if it's too asinine but:

> (What about ×5? If you can compute ×3, you can subtract that from ×8 to get ×5.)

Why can't you do the same to subtract x4 from x7 to get x3?
You should trust that the readme is up to date
Since people are apparently interested in minimal VPNs, here's one I built in Rust recently: https://github.com/atereshkin/nanovpn

My goal there was to have as little code as possible so that one could look at it and immediately grasp what goes into establishing a VPN.
Been using it for years and absolutely love and highly recommend it.

Single executable you just download and put in your path. Sane, well-documented interface. Full repo in a single SQLite file. Highly intelligent and efficient diff-based storage and compression (including network transfers). Rock-solid code.

I think it's kind of a tragedy the dev world got so stuck on git. Maybe not too late!
In this analogy, how many ditches do you think need to be dug? Each company only has a limited number of ditches they need done. The unnecessary human diggers will be let go.
I'm not sure about it makes sense to apply Gödel's theorem to AI. Personally, I prefer to think about it in terms of basic computability theory:

We think, that is a fact.

Therefore, there is a function capable of transforming information into "thinked information", or what we usually call reasoning. We know that function exists, because we ourselves are an example of such function.

Now, the question is: can we create a smaller function capable of performing the same feat?

If we assume that that function is computable in the Turing sense then, kinda yes, there are an infinite number of turing machines that given enough time will be able to produce the expected results. Basically we need to find something between our own brain and the Kolmogorov complexity limit. That lower bound is not computable, but given that my cats understands when we are discussing to take them to the vet then... maybe we don't really need a full sized human brain for language understanding.

We can run Turing machines ourselves, so we are at least Turing equivalent machines.

Now, the question is: are we at most just Turing machines or something else? If we are something else, then our own CoT won't be computable, no matter how much scale we throw at it. But if we are then it is just matter of time until we can replicate ourselves.
I will definitely check this out, thanks.
I've seen the latter two, but they are most certainly very rewatchable. I saw Schindler's List again with my wife about a year ago and enjoyed it just as thoroughly as the first time.

>I also gain a lot from a rewatchable piece of content, but you might be shorting yourself by always watching things designed to tickle the dopamine receptors.

Now this I just do not understand. Things designed to be good on primarily the first watch, and allowed to degrade on future experiences, seem much worse for this.
> I feel like Penrose presupposes the human mind is non computable.

Yes. He has also written books about it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Penrose#Consciousness
Maybe consciousness is just what lives in the floating-point annoyances
Yes, why do we have "const" at the beginning AND end?
I struggled to get private crowd feedback without groupthink but now I ask Rally
Some free code review of the first file I clicked into - https://github.com/williamcotton/webdsl/blob/92762fb724a9035... among other places should probably be doing the conditional "lexer->line++"; thing. Quite a weird decision to force all code paths to manually do that whenever a newline char is encountered. Could've at least made a "advance_maybe_newline(lexer);" or so. But I guess LLMs give you copy-paste garbage.

Even the article of this thread says:

> Just because code looks good and runs without errors doesn’t mean it’s actually doing the right thing.
the doi is https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jasrep.2025.105020

I haven't found the actual paper yet tho
The ground loop just needs to be deep enough to be in a zone with relatively stable temperatures. Apparently 6 to 8 feet in Minnesota: https://www.minnesotageothermalheatpumpassociation.com/geoth...

(note, the 6 to 8 feet is for a closed loop, horizontal system)
I've been using magit for almost a decade now and it directly contradicts what you're saying simply by existing and being as awesome as it is
> by not participating we are handing complete control to the 'enemies'.

That's fine. Our enemies are in search of a legitimate currency, Americans are not. Spending government money on these endeavors will exacerbate debt and facilitate the very criminal enterprises America opposes, like human trafficking, child exploitation and narcotics production.

America doesn't need more avenues for fraud. We need stronger consumer protections.
Your logic is completely incomprehensible.

Since Mozilla _may_ sell your data, your going to abandon it for Goggle? Who will _definitely_ sell your data?

This is irrational.

There is LibreWolf, Brave, Palemoon, just to name a few browsers that have not made the terms of use statements that the Mozilla foundation has just made, and that the goggle corps has made all along.

Supporting the "Google monopoly" is not good for user rights. People who don't understand these issues run it because they don't know any better. People who do know better shouldn't use it, at all.
There are many good solar system scale model videos including that one! You get a feel for different aspects at the various scales, I’m aiming for grokking galactic scale factors.

The “Sun is a beach ball” is great for solar system understanding, etc…
Universities try to hire grad students as TAs to help them out, but sometimes hire outsiders as TAs. It could be because the undergrad major has lots of students but the corresponding graduate major has few.

Obviously this varies from university to university and I know nothing about Cornell.
> since Kagi subscriptions also help fund Orion (according to the Orion website), Kagi users that don't have Apple products can't actually verify the functionality of the browser they're helping to fund

Well yes, if you don’t use Orion Kagi won’t be accountable to you as an Orion user.

> the idea that Orion is solely accountable to users of Orion doesn't seem to be true

Nobody claimed as much. The point is Kagi has some accountability to Orion users where Mozilla has almost none to Firefox users beyond their eyeballs.
…but that’s how it’s always worked. Moore’a law is dead, we’re at the limit of everything, oh hey, Moore’s lawn limps by again because someone did something clever.
Such "hallucinations" can also be plausible & useful APIs that oughtta exist – de facto feature requests.
What would you suggest instead of git, if a hypothetical organization came and asked you which vcs to use other than git? Assume git interoperability is not necessary, to obviate the “we must be compatible with what our dependencies/upstreams use” argument.
Google Map shows me nothing. I see an empty pin in the middle of the UK forest.

What is interesting there?

How does this finish in HN top without anything apparent?
Sort of repeating a nested comment, but - I've been using fossil ( https://fossil-scm.org/home/doc/trunk/www/index.wiki ) for years and absolutely love it.

Single executable you just download and put in your path. Sane, well-documented interface (CLI, API and web). Full repo in a single SQLite file. Highly intelligent and efficient diff-based storage and compression (including network transfers). Rock-solid code. Easy exports to git/github.

I think it's kind of a tragedy the dev world got so stuck on git.
With private companies there's a lot of inefficiency that comes from having to have competition. Without competition you'll have monopolies, and combined with the profit motive those are a disaster. But to enable competition you need to have multiple organizations doing exactly the same thing. That's a lot of unnecessary "overhead cost" that you get by having duplicate products, duplicate management, duplicate HR, duplicate everything. You also have to build a brand, do marketing and other competition related things that don't actually contribute to the product itself and which would be mostly unnecessary without competition. Add to all that the overhead cost that is profit and the amount of waste in a public organization whose goal is not profit and that doesn't need to compete doesn't sound so bad.
Since the entire original image is converted to a UIImage and then modified, the exif data gets destroyed. However, I could add a setting to write the exif data back into the saved image.
> Do you think there should be a permanent bureaucracy that is totally unaffected by elections?

I don't think you have a good grasp on what is happening, both in form and extent. You're making it sound like the Trump administration is refreshing bureaucrats, where in reality it's completely dismantling the whole federal state while imposing a totalitarian agenda. It's destroying public health services, education services, security services, even R&D. To top things off, the Trump administration caused irreversible damage to decades-old alliances, if they aren't destroyed already, which where at the core of US's global hegemony.

You're talking about bureaucracy as if the only impact this has is some pencil pushers losing a job. It's not. It's the death by suicide of the United States as an ideal, and a global leader. The Trump admin leaves behind a huge power vacuum that will inevitably be filled by another party, and odds are it ain't pushing freedom nor peace.
I hope this is true. I don't know how to maintain a web browser, hopefully those that do are willing to do the work to keep it running.
>Terrible policy.

And unfortunately one not exclusive to OpenAI. Anthropic credits also expire after 1 year.
I assume it's the same as shower water
This is the most boomer comment I’ve ever read. On what planet are these any child’s role model? Elie Wiesel? Desmond Tutu? Those are like NPR lifetime achievement award winners, they have no social capital among any generic guy under 18. 0
https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2023/8/3/hbs-prof-lawsuit...
With 'normal' DNS, UDP with the default and TCP is used if the packet size becomes too large. There are other TCP-only variants such as DoT (DNS over TLS) and DoH (DNS over HTTPS).

I don't think the performance would matter much with some basic caching (or even just OS-level caching), but there is limited memory in an ESP so maybe that is it. I have never noticed issues with DoT and DoH which are theoretically much heavier protocols.
Ironically one of the clearest signals of being out of touch is feeling that your noticing how out of touch you are is noteworthy. It's like "Gosh, I'm rich! How interesting!"

> This is not a screed against executive wealth.

And that again shows how out of touch he still is. You haven't fully accepted how out-of-touch wealthy you are until you've made the decision to actively oppose allowing anyone to reach that situation.
> I’ll help my friends fight back and frankly ensure the court battle costs Mozilla more than anything they recover.

Again, you're of course allowed to be as spiteful as you wish within the limits of the law, but I sincerely hope that your money never touches any open source project I care about if it comes with such strings attached as a substitute for prior due diligence.

I really wonder what it is about Mozilla that makes them subject to significantly more vicious rhetoric on this site than their for-profit competitors... Personally I'm also conflicted and as a result I'm not donating to them, but this is a completely different level.
I’m not sure what you’re referring to. Blazor, along with Razor pages, was developed to simplify front-end development in dotnet. It’s essentially the React of the C# world, enabling the embedding of both C# and HTML into Razor pages, both on the client and server sides.

Its most impressive feature, however, is LiveView, which is akin to server-side rendering. It’s more sophisticated than that. It does a diff on the state changes and only the diffed DOM node states are transmitted over the network, resulting in lightning-fast performance. In other words, if a value changes from <p>5</p> to <p>10</p>, only the 10 gets sent from the server (along with sufficient information to locate the correct location of the replacement).
What is "understanding transcendently"? Just because Penrose is an authority on some subjects in theoretical physics doesn't mean he is a universal genius and that his ideas on consciousness or AI hold any value.

We gotta stop making infaillible super heroes/geniuses of people.

In this particular case, Penrose is a convinced dualist and his theories are unscientific. There are very good reasons to not be a dualist, a minority view in philosophy, which I would encourage anyone to seek if they want to better understand Penrose's position and where it came from.
GPT-4 was rumored to be 1.8T params...not 1.2

And the successor model was called "Orion", not "Omni".
I found 2. One is an ongoing lawsuit and the other seems mostly like stupidity because people keep falling for the stupid AI grift. I can barely trust AI to produce basic boilerplate and they are trying to verify novel research with it?
Not guaranteeing I got these conversions correct, but I believe the rough estimate for the thermal energy of the Earth is on the order of 10^31 Joules.[0] while the rough estimate for human energy use is 10^20 Joules per year.[0]

So if we switched to 100% geothermal (a few orders of magnitude more than we're actually discussing using), we'd be using on the order of a hundred trillionth of the energy per year?

[0] https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/51920/amount-of-...

[1] https://ourworldindata.org/energy-production-consumption
When Nanoseconds Matter: Ultrafast Trading Systems in C++ [video]