skysight-inc/HackerNews huggingface dataset:
The case turns on the fact that China is formally designated a foreign adversary. The statute doesn't allow the government to simply make up who its adversaries are on the fly, or derive them from some fixed set of first principles. There's a list, and it long predates this case.
I think it's qualitatively different this time.

Unlike with offshoring, this is a technological solution, which understandably is received more enthusiastically on HN. I get it. It's interesting as tech! And it's achieved remarkable things. But unlike with offshoring (which is a people thing) or magical NOCODE/CASE/etc "solutions", it seems the consensus is that AI coding assistants will eventually get there. At least a portion of even HN seems to think so. And some are cheering!

The coping mechanism seems to be "it won't happen to me" or "my knowledge is too specialized" but I think this will become increasingly false. And even if your knoweldge is too specialized to be replaced by AI, most engineers aren't like that. "Well, become more specialized" is unrealistic advice, and in any case, the employment pool will shrink.

PS: I am offhsoring (in a way). I'm not based in the US but I work remotely for a US company.
this is super fun! still haven't figured out who though
Yeah, no that was clear, that's why I already answered that in my previous comment:

> Items people can just take and leave with, yeah I think it's OK they keep track of the thing while I'm renting it.

Is it a fallacy/bad to think that people have the right to track things they loan/rent out to others, as long as that's clear upfront?
When you come to the programming sphere, the first thing you are interested in is: "getting started with Unity", "how to take your first steps in C++", then you come back, wanting to help the rest of the IT community with what you have learned as a developer ("Creating a NEAT algorithm for Unity", "What is UART and how does it work". This article provides answers to these questions.
Not everyone on HN is a U.S. national. Many are Chinese nationals. So the discussion here has conflict of interest depending on one’s allegiance
I think you would be hard pressed to come up with any evidence for your assertion. First of all the UK is not a foreign adversary (quite the opposite). Secondly Facebook didn't sell data in that case, it was collected by Cambridge Analytica via Facebook's platform APIs (as described in your own link). In general Facebook doesn't sell data, their entire business model is based on having exclusive access to data from its platforms.
Over 200,000 homes were damaged or destroyed in Katrina:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconstruction_of_New_Orleans

Not sure how that is a "tiny fraction" of homes. $125 billion in damage (2005).
...because the government low-balls healthcare providers?

And yet Medicare is widely accepted. Go figure.
That’s a good point. Apparently VPN popularity is already exploding in states that PornHub had to block.

Maybe we will finally get the decentralized computer network we thought we were building in the 1990s (as a combination of software overlays and point to point unlicensed wireless links).
Check out the scandal in Romania, some guy that had less than 5% in polls got 30% because of tiktok. Other candidates had tiktok campaigns too but probably didn't use bots.

Social media is a legitimate threat to any countries democracy if used wisely. It is dangerous to have one of the biggest ones in the hands of your enemy when they can influence your own countries narrative to such an extent.
It's not his identity, though. It's a character that he plays.
Great work Jake! I love the Astro and the “islands of interactivity”. Is it possible to see the repo, if it's public? I couldn't find it anywhere.
After having used Ember for several years I find it very sad they didn't develop a "mobile" offering, the dev experience is fastly superior (especially as it relates to state handling).

Hooks are a bit of a cancer, they leak absolutely everywhere on top of making it quite difficult to reason about re-renders.
Good point. Social media accounts should only be available to people who live in the country where the company is based. Then there's no need to ban Facebook and X elsewhere.
Wow, thank you. This was buried deep (not an accident of course).

"Pay us more money, or be forced into using our feature" is a new sales tactic.
The clock is still "tiking" for TikTok.

As usual, the digital crack / cocaine addicts of this generation are now running to Red note for their next fresh hit in less than 48 hours.

Nothing's changed. Just a new brand of digital crack / cocaine has overtaken another one who's supply is getting cut off by the US.

Although a fine would be better than an outright ban as I said before.
> You cant write a spotify.com or a amazon.com with jQuery and have 100s of engineers collaborate and maintain.

Honestly how many people are writing massive front-ends like these ?

I would argue the number of people using overkill framework for their needs is actually greatly increasing tech debt and slowing things down.
TBF the best example of a program like this that currently exists is the National Flood Insurance Program which covers many sub-multi-million dollar homes and is billions of dollars in the hole.
Ridiculous statement. You must believe they should have political speech then? Maybe they should be able to donate to elections or even vote too? Why stop at corporations?

If they want speech, they should reside in the US, not just own a piece of a company that does.

The rights enforced inside the US are very generous compared to most countries and many apply to both legal and illegal residents, but restricting some rights, especially political ones, is crucial to have a sovereign state
According to CNN, roughly 700,000 people have installed Rednote—though that figure only represents those who have tested the app and doesn’t necessarily reflect sustained usage. By comparison, TikTok is said to have around 110 million users in the United States, meaning 700,000 installs amount to less than 1% of TikTok’s user base.

Meanwhile, YouTube’s user numbers in the U.S. are estimated at 240 million, but it’s unlikely to gain many new downloads since almost everyone already has the app.

In my view, it’s unrealistic to think Rednote will replace TikTok.
Right, its because a law should be passed regulating this sort of data for the good of all citizens, but our congress can't / won't pass that, so they only stepped in when it became an obvious national security concern.

It'll come back as an issue in a less obvious manner next time, and every time until they pass such a law.

Which, imho, won't happen while our overall political environment remains conservatively dominant.
Looks like India set the way here. Wonder what it holds for US India relations.
I wish it were a reckoning for social media, but reading here shows there's plenty of people here who are passionate about "China bad" and see this only through that one lens. And they seem to think it is strictly about TikTok.
Alexa, should voice assistants have a gender?
HTMX is more like "jQuery on steroids", but Nue is a frontend development framework with universal HMR support. Think Next.js but slimmer. Different tools for different needs.
I don't have first-hand experience with it, but I've seen this mentioned a few times: https://choosealicense.com/
It's always felt like the best way to lock myself out of my own machine. While I don't really keep any important data on it that's not backed up, I also don't build my workstation image from a config file or anything, so some time will be lost. The thing that's always bugged me is that before AMD had a TPM built into the CPU, the TPM was just a poorly-secured dongle hanging off the motherboard (at least with Asus motherboards) and it just seems like something that's going to break randomly. That breaks, then what. Meanwhile, the CPU owning the keys also doesn't feel great. Sometimes you swap your CPU and now there is an 800 step process to disable decryption before you do that, which is certain to be forgotten as you excitedly unpack your new CPU purchase. (Even if you're completely rebuilding the computer, the number of times I've put a new disk into a new build is approximately zero.)

Just typing a passphrase at boot seems like a pretty decent compromise. I've done it for years and it's never caused a problem.
China has a constitution mostly like America’s, freedom of speech, religion, press are enshrined even more strongly than in the American constitution. What China lacks is judicial review and an independent judiciary, so the constitution has no enforcement mechanism, and so is meaningless. The Chinese government as formed has no interest in rule of law.
Regularly, you just don't read about them as they don't make news headlines.
People keep coming up with other avenues by which China could get this information, but the court addresses that directly: the legislature is not required to address every instance of a compelling threat in one fell swoop.
Yup I'd be ok with banning TikTok because all of the US web services that are banned China, but this makes it seem like every country should have their own everything
They don't just sell the defective one for cheap though, they have all kinds of tricks and the ratios fit the market.
Al Shugart started Shugart Associates and pretty much created the 5 1/4" floppy market. He sold to Xerox. He later started Shugart Technology and was promptly threatened with a lawsuit because he literally had sold his rights to his own name (in the particular context). He changed the name to Seagate Technology and the rest is history.

Yes, you can be enjoined from using your own name.
>Every Saturn 5 was successful

>Some people are really fetishizing iterative failure

Subassemblies that made up Saturn V went through several hundred (inflation adjusted) billion dollars' worth of iterative failure before the Apollo program was announced.

The only reason it WAS announced was all of the iterative failure that had been paying off.

The day JFK uttered "shall go to the moon in this deck-aid", the F-1 engine had already been exploding and failing for three years.

My memory is hazy, from a brown bag I went to at work 15 years ago, but they blew up around 50 F-1s before one worked right.

And while the Saturn isn't an upgraded Jupiter it is EXTREMELY closely related to Jupiter and Jupiter had a shit-ton of failures before they got it right, turned around, and used all of that knowledge to build Saturn.
optimistically, this is the first step towards banning or at least forcing more transparency for all algorithmic feeds. there's absolutely similar concerns about the leadership of American companies being able to sway public opinion in whatever direction they choose via promotion or demotion of viewpoints. but it's only been possible to convince those with the power to stop them of the danger from China, because while probably none of the companies have "America's best interests" at heart when tuning their algorithms, it's much clearer that China has reason to actively work against American national interests (even just demoting honest critique of China is something to be wary of)
This is about as much foreign commerce as it is me buying a Xiaomi phone.

I know there's court precedent, but corporations aren't people. It's yet another Chinese platform that Americans use to communicate with other western companies.
It's a fair point and since hearing about that I've been in two minds as to whether I could buy another device from them.
Get upset about whatever you want, but my concern about this feature being "forcibly enabled" is about the same as my concern about spellcheck.
It's not really speculation, though. Certain aspects of the intelligence relationships between the US and China are highly asymmetrical already.

For example, Chinese nationals can enter our country and gather information on our infrastructure, corporations, and people with relative ease because English is prevalent, and foreign nationals have, with the exception of certain military/research areas, the same access that US citizens have. On the other hand, foreign nationals in China are closely monitored and have very few rights, assuming they know Chinese, are physically in China (Great Firewall), and know how to get around in the first place.

China has unfettered access to our media ecosystem, research, patents, etc., and they do their best to create an uncompetitive/hostile environment for any other country to attempt the same on their territory. Some of this has to do with trade—to be fair, these are intertwined—but the situation regarding intelligence is bleak.
Tesla states a lot of things, like that their second generation 2020 roadster is going to be ready next year (tm). I wouldn't put a lot of faith in anything they say, all it takes is Musk changing his mind down the line and then anything goes.
The difference is you can easily prosecute Zuck
Friend. I do not worry. I dislike all social media and would not shed one tear if all those were dismantled.

What I shed a tear for is slow decline of US and its founding principles, because George Carlin clearly was right. Even if you barely pay attention, the list your your temporary privileges is slowly getting shorter.

edit: Even the fact that I have to explain it at such a basic level is tremendously sad.
> Would you want to hold collateral that has a high risk of becoming worthless?

Of course not, the problem is that all parties were a-okay with the purchase in the first place, and the banks are trying to change the terms when they realize their hand is a losing one after many turns of the game. Sometimes that’s life, and the corporations should be forced to lose instead of changing the rules so the homeowner loses instead.
Wow, I came back to this thread and it unexpectedly blew up. Looks like my experience is not normal and L.E. is not flaky for anyone else on HN. Who knew my simple 6 line shell script has been buggy for a decade.

I guess if you zoom out, one of the things I bristle with is LetsEncrypt's opinionated way of changing people's behavior. The short certificates were a deliberate decision, done to "get users to do X." They were pretty transparent about it. In my view, computers should do what users want them to do, not what developers want users to do. We've got enough software out there with notifications and consent dialogs begging users to do this and that, and this just adds to the problem.

I get that the software is free (which was a revolution in the PKI world at the time), but the short lifespan seems to be either a behavior modification experiment OR an annoyance to get people to fork over money for the better (better for users, not necessarily for security), longer-lived products.
I doubt those events made it to HN, and the questions are obviously from people outside the US who thought that 'Supreme' means 'Supreme'.
First off, congrats and feel free to share a link to your game here as I got interested.

I totally resonate with your comment about the language not getting in your way. I use all sorts of languages for different kinds of applications for many years and only recently I started creating games.

Whereas in other domains I appreciate complex languages that address necessarily complex tasks, in game development, while the game as a whole is a complex system, you often are handling simpler tasks and mostly thinking about algorithms. At least in my experience tackling these algorithms requires mostly mathematical calculations and for that, you definitely want the language to stay out of your way.

In game dev no matter if you pick an imperative or functional approach, you really need to use all your brain power on your problem domain. Language complexities are often distractions that aren't super useful, since like I already said, the task at hand is mainly algorithmic in nature.
Why should it be? What does ByteDance want that isn't also valuable to Facebook?
It does! You can try it out yourself at https://widgens.com :) Using the microphone you can "talk" to Widgets. The experience should be like you're talking to a "screen assistant". Would love to hear from your experience using it!

Just curious - is the Apple ad you were referring to the genmoji one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XROs4K67Y9Q
So a US court should make decisions not in the US interest because people in other countries use some software?
The idealist and optimist part of technologists tend to block the understanding of the rather simple practicalities at play in geo politics.
Why precisely? Can you elaborate?
Why would they go via the house buyer? They can insure the house themselves.
Clearly the US government would like only US companies to collect this kind of data. Eliminating the biggest competitors for companies like Google, X and Meta is likely just the icing on the cake.
IRS tax withholding calculator down for an entire month for planned maintenance
The 2024 hurricane season damage totaled $128.072 billion.

I couldn't find data for tornadoes in aggregate, only individual storms.

> Economically, tornadoes cause about a tenth as much damage per year, on average, as hurricanes. Hurricanes tend to cause much more overall destruction than tornadoes because of their much larger size, longer duration and their greater variety of ways to damage property. The destructive core in hurricanes can be tens of miles across, last many hours and damage structures through storm surge and rainfall-caused flooding, as well as from wind. Tornadoes, in contrast, tend to be a few hundred yards in diameter, last for minutes and primarily cause damage from their extreme winds

https://www.americangeosciences.org/critical-issues/faq/how-...
I mean, SCOTUS also decided nothing a sitting President does in their official capacity while in office can be considered a crime even if it breaks the law so yeah.
> no good answer on why its bad for a company that is supposedly under Chineese influence to collect this kind of information on us,

In the context of a discussion on a US-specific ban on TikTok I'm taking the "us" in OP's post to mean people in the US. If you aren't in the US the ban doesn't apply to you so the discussion is irrelevant.
Yeah it's not even a point of view that requires nuance; it's pretty clearly a matter of US interests v. adversarial interests. Anecdotally, a lot of people that struggle to understand this are also squarely in the camp of assuming that the US is doing data collection solely for nefarious purposes.

Except:

• the US performs these activities (data collection, algorithm manipulation allegedly, etc) for US interests, which may not always align with the interests of individuals in the US, whereas

• adversarial foreign governments perform these activities for their own interests, which a US person would be wise to assume does not align with US interests and thus very likely doesn't align with the interests of US persons.

If a person's main concern is living in a better United States, start with ensuring that the United States is sticking around for the long run first. Then we can work on improving it.
my wife can yell at me and spend my money and my neighbour can't, because you know different case
China can benefit without doing any influencing. It can simply mine the vast amount of data it gets for sentiment analysis. Say they want to be more aggressive against the Philippines. They can do an analysis to gauge the potential outrage on the part of the American people. If it's low they can go ahead.
"impactful decision" is key here.
Thats not what he said. Unit tests are the first stage, and are very useful at isolating the problem.

Integration tests are the next where multiple units are combined.

Then there is staging.
I've taught programming to beginners, both children and adults, and lua is the worst of the languages I've done it with. It's an amazing technical accomplishment, and CS students should study its implementation. But for actual beginners its "focus on fundamental concepts" and flexibility are liabilities.

The main struggle people have learning to code is getting over the initial frustration hurdle where they can't actually accomplish anything yet. What they have to get them through this is excitement about their actual goals. With lua you burn too much goodwill and beginner spark on debugging string manipulation functions that don't seem important to the actual interest or goal that brought them to programming. Or figuring out how to use luarocks so you can make http requests, or regex, or whatever.

> 1-based indexing could cause beginners to get confused when they move to another language.

This is so far from the problems that beginners actually have. You should teach some programming, it's a really fascinating experience that will mess with your intuitions about how people learn this skill, and what's hard about it.
Good, now do it for the rest of them, from linkd-in to facebook.
In retrospect, they would have some interesting opportunities in high-performance computing. Intel had its family of parallel machines running on x86 processors since the original iPSC running on 80286 processors.
> But realistically I'm just one dude with a home network and a few VPSes doing BGP. How many /48s do I need?

Well, if the VPSes are in seperate sites, at least one per VPS, which means at least 2, which means that according to allocation policies, at least a /44. :)
Cybersecurity is not for beginners. There are almost no jobs for juniors anymore.
The thing is, doing it domestically is also a national security concern. We know that data leaks and breaches don't only happen, they are commonplace. Banning TikTok but continuing to allow domestic social media companies to amass hoards of the same kind of data without any real oversight is like saying, "Sorry, you can't have this on a golden platter, the best we can do is silver."
In addition:

• US data brokers can still sell data to foreign companies (out of control of US and thus indirectly to Chinese companies).

• Chinese companies can buy US companies (thereby obtaining lots of data).

If we killed user-tracking, then that would solve a LOT of problems.
I lean heavily Democratic when it comes to social issues. But let’s be honest, everyone knew that Biden was losing his mental faculties.

The last time we had two smart candidates was 2012.
A non-trivial number of videos I've seen this week mention also being able to find the creator of said video on Rednote. It is also the number 1 downloaded app in the US iOS store this week. The news may be a logical extreme, but it's not fake.
I suspect the dichotomy of the two posts is because productivity comes naturally to many people. Others need a system. Although I do agree that a lot of people tend to overdo it and track meaningless metrics.
I assume: 1) They work at Google Research, not Google DeepMind. The latter seems to be more focused on developing AI products now, but Google Research seems to be still quite research based. 2) Google is overall much more liberal with researchers being able to publish their results, compared to OpenAI. I don't think this is necessarily rational from a business perspective where you get disproportionate payoff if you are a step ahead of everyone else. There is a reason why OpenAI has outpaced Google in terms of AI. Maybe those Google researchers were hired under the condition that they are allowed to publish their results?
Arguing about programming is not the point, in my opinion.

When AI becomes able to do most non-programming tasks too, say design or solving open-ended problems (yeah, except in trivial cases it cannot -- for now) we can have this conversation again...

I think saying "well, programming is not important, what matters is $THING" is a coping mechanism. Eventually AI will do $THING acceptably enough for the bean counters to push for more layoffs.
Is it more dangerous? Facebook has done more harm to the average American than the Chinese Communist Party has.

More dangerous to the US government? Yes, that's true.
Luckily nobody needs TikTok to find out what happened in Gaza.
Wouldn’t an LLM be smart enough to spot a tarpit?