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> I've written PHP for about 3 years and I've never once used the @ to suppress errors.

Is it so wrong to use @? I've always used (@$_REQUEST['foo'] === 'bar') as a shorter way of writing (isset($_REQUEST['foo']) && $_REQUEST['foo'] === 'bar') - I'm curious if there's a problem with that approach.
Wikimedia forces domain owner to give up domain.
We (10gen - I'm the primary author of this integration layer) have had a few people help us do testing with this in production, I don't know who I can name by name at the moment. However, we are happy to help you with any issues you run into and help you integrate cleaner into your stack.

[I can be contacted at my HN name on twitter or brendan at 10gen dot com]
You'll soon learn that a great business has far less to do with the idea, and far more to do with execution. There are probably a dozen other very smart people working on the same thing right now, if it's truly a great idea, so the question isn't whether you can build it better than this other fellow, but whether you can execute better than all the others out there that you don't know about.

If you think he deserves a piece because it's that revolutionary, then cut him in and tell him what your concerns are with his participation. Any great partnership is based on clear lines and responsibilities being drawn. If he refuses to compromise to work with your team, (or vise versa), then you'll have tried, and your conscience will be clear to proceed, and he'll have had the opportunity to walk away.

The other poster was right. Just build something.
Looks like a solution for this is coming down the pipeline: http://www.meteor.com/faq/can-meteor-serve-static-html
Maryland passes bills banning employers from seeking online passwords
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When I moved to the US I was absolutely blown away at how common this practise is. A friend applying for a common office job had to do it- I had assumed it would only be for people handling live firearms and the like. Little did I know...
Thanks for your advise aspir. It seems hard to develop it without telling him given that we regularly meet up with this guy.
It kills its usefulness for proprietary software, unless you're willing to pay the Meteor guys whatever they ask for a license. But I'd like to point out that there's actually a lot of software out there that isn't proprietary, and Meteor looks like a dramatically better way to write it.
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Notch apparently loves amazingly slow VMs, so this is the next logical step after Java :D
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A very good point :-). Just wanted to know what their "official" word is, since I didn't read about it in the docs...

EDIT: I see that they mention OT on the people page: http://www.meteor.com/about/people, so excuse my ignorance about the people behind the work...
From now on, I'm going to start all my questions with "this is either obvious or wrong, but ...".

I hadn't made the connection between dataflow and logic programming. I'm not sure if the programming practices surrounding logic programming would be useful in this context, but I'll certainly look into it. Thanks for the suggestion.
I really hope to have a kid like him
Fun idea. Unfortunately some of us have bosses who tell us what to do.
Does it scale to really heavy javascript pages? Do you have any benchmarks on when it starts to breakdown in terms of performance?

Also have you built a "solid" production app with it?
Personally, I've been using Python for prototyping. It has lots of lexing libraries, and from there I just do recursive descent. I figure I'll switch to C for a "real" implementation, partly because what I'm going for in my current project is as much database as programming language.

I don't think you have to use C++ to target LLVM. I think you can output LLVM IR from anything and then just call LLVM from the shell to get an executable.
The difference being that the burn rate of these companies is minuscule compared to what was going on the late 90s. They built a 30 million user social network with 5 engineers. This changes the dynamic tremendously.
"X is still relevant," much like "I'm not crazy!" is a sentence that nobody believes as soon as you have to say it.
Yep. In my experience, banking and financial websites have much worse password policies than the web at large. E.g., fidelity.com has a maximum password length of 12 characters. USAA has a maximum password length of 12 characters.

What the fuck.
Has it ever worked against these kinds of techniques though?

I only ever thought that windows antivirus software was a sticking plaster for non-sensitive machines to make them get sick a little slower, not something that would you would use to safeguard valuable commercial data.
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You can't train spam filters with 100% spam. Moreover you should train with the spam your users actually receive.
New MRI technique may predict progress of dementias
If all the bitchy python/ruby purists out there want to build a successor to PHP, here is the roadmap:
1) make it as simple to setup a development environment as it is to install MAMP (this is somewhat done - but still hella confusing with both Ruby and Python)
2) start a web host that can offer rails/python hosting as simple AND as CHEAP as shared hosting (6$ per month or less)
3) build the Wordpress/Drupal of Rails/Django
4) make it simple for designers and "site builders" to hack the language. This includes former flash addicts.

Until then, all this anti-PHP hate just seems... pointless. As you said, we create experiences for users who ultimately don't care what is beneath the hood as long as it works and doesn't blow up.

There are a lot of PHP systems out there and there is a lot of money to be made as a developer who focuses on PHP. It may not be the prettiest language, but I know why I focus on it - it makes me money. I use other tech (rails, ObjC), but PHP is my bread and butter - and if you do it right, PHP really isn't that bad.

The only time I've seen PHP apps blow up is when they are past due for re-development anyways - a symptom that is not unique to PHP. Anyone who's seen Rails spaghetti knows what I mean.
Holy crap. The interrobang is awesome! Why have I never heard of it before‽
That puzzled me, too, I started browsing the code and noticed there's not a lot of testing of the project code itself: https://github.com/meteor/meteor/tree/master/tests

So I agree, it would be good to hear from the devs about their opinions and thoughts on testing. (Is there a chance that they think the "realtime-by-default" approach lessens the need for testing?)

I'm no testing zealot, but I've found writing tests useful and it would be a shame to be frustrated by that missing piece in an otherwise great project.
...that's not really inherent in PHP. You can configure Python to be just as easy, and some webhosts do this...

It's very rare to find webhosts that configure Python, Ruby, Node or the rest to be as easy as "upload a file, click reload."

One reason is the wonderful statelessness of mod_php's execution model: it forks a new process for every request, and destroys it at the end. It's inherently a much more stable environment than the competitors -- you can't save anything inside the interpreter for future requests. This makes server administration easy, and probably shared hosting easier to manage.
no starch press most likely :D
Thanks for your reply nickler. I totally agree with all the points you mentioned. Execution is key and you're right that there are probably twenty other teams working on a similar project. We'll probably clear our conscience first (asap) and build after (as fast as possible!).
Are you trolling?

"It looks like the system sends packets to the client computer to process the website posts (signing up for email). The end user is really the person sending the sign ups."

You understand tcp right?
Nope. Its possible to clog a e-mail box for free. It would cost lots of money to do the same kind of attack on a physical box. Lastly, the mailman would stop it. Nobody gonna stop me from spasming Daniel K. Pelosi.
Well, our scrapers take about 2-3 days to complete a loop, so it is indeed possible for you to find dead links here and there...It shouldn't be a large percentage though.

Fortunately, we will have API's from two major source sites within the next few weeks, and that should greatly reduce our dependence on scraping.
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Headline actually understates it. It sounds like the real deal was less microtargeted than the headline implies: according to the article, they banned "requiring or requesting employees or job applicants to disclose electronic passwords, such as for social media sites."
"And that kind of stuff does happen, just look at people who win the lottery :)"

Yes, but creating a business isn't as easy as buying a ticket. That's my point. There is more skill than luck involved in any business success.
Consider 33042, "Summerland Key." This ZIP code covers several other Lower Florida Keys, including Cudjoe Key and Upper Sugarloaf Key. "Summerland Key" is technically correct, since the post office is on that island, but people on the other islands will _never_ write "Summerland Key" as their address, preferring instead to use the ("acceptable") name of their island instead. I'm sure this situation is not unique to the Florida Keys, and I therefore doubt the usefulness of resolving city and state from ZIP code outside of them there fancy big cities.
This is built with Node.js.

From the docs:
"A Meteor application is a mix of JavaScript that runs inside a client web browser, JavaScript that runs on the Meteor server inside a Node.js container..."
It's true. People can't be adults and say "No", so they have to have laws passed to do it for them.

It's a strange world we live in...
It's easier to write bad code in certain languages, as well as vice versa.
Yep, RStudio is GWT driven (https://developers.google.com/web-toolkit/) and uses some very particular configuration tricks to keep you from accessing it with a browser in local mode.
As someone who loves working with uC's, yes, as long as the cost is around the price of Arduino/Cortex M3 board. I've never done a FPGA project, and this is the kind of thing that would get me started working with them.

I'm not sure if HDMI would be on my must-have list though, a serial-USB and console/terminal would be more than adequate for me.
You can't have a "How to Learn Haskell" post without mentioning the Typeclassopedia: http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Typeclassopedia

For those going through LYAH, I highly recommend supplementing chapters 11-13 with this excellent resource.
"In Meteor, your server code runs in a single thread per request, not in the asynchronous callback style typical of Node."

So node's not a cancer now?
I have written, maintained and worked on gigantic PHP codebases, mainly in the realm of ecommerce (not that train wreck, magento). I have a lovehate relationship with the language, and my pet peeve is that it is so easy, we get the lowest ability developers who never take time to learn the theory or any other technologies. Having said that... If it wasn't for the LAMP infrastructure, the ease and speed of development, these codebases could not have been developed.

I think the standard libraries could do with an update, to add the consistency they deserve, and do update them to use modern features. The community for PHP is reaching a point of maturity that it has not seen before (look at composer, PSR-0, symfony2 and ZF2). I think this maturity is making the community a good place right now. I'm not leaving it anytime soon.

Take away PHP, watch the major sites of the Internet disappear. Where would we be with no Wikipedia?
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I would be interested if it had a bunch of toggle switches and a few pushbuttons and some LEDs for programming; input and output.

I don't know if that loses compatibility with Notch's DCPU-16.
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In theory I agree, but for people who are in a situation where jobs are not plentiful, saying "no" is not a realistic option. Unless, of course, one is willing to back-up that "no" with arbitrarily expensive legal wrangling (which also happens to blacklist the individual with other employers).
I actually ventured out Easter Sunday to buy myself the new Nokia. I then discovered that all AT&T stores in my area were closed for the holiday. In the grand scheme of things it probably doesn't matter as far as sales go, but for building buzz it seems odd to schedule your launch when your retail stores are closed. I'd like to know what discussions (or lack thereof) occurred by the various marketing departments leading up to the launch.
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> However, for building applications that might get deployed somewhere, or talk to a database in a secure fashion, it's a nightmare.

In what decade? Ever heard of PDO? Prepared statements? PHP is actually more secure when it comes to database connections than all of the wonderful alternatives you mentioned.
What would you interface to? I thought the idea of DCPU is that it runs the "ship" in 0x10c.

Why not learn real assembly on a living microprocessor and hook it up to real things? There are some instruction sets, like 6809/68000 or 8051, that are very easy to learn and are a good stepping stone to larger architectures.

I'm a big 6809 fan, and you can synthesize a whole '09 system from opencores.org: http://opencores.org/project,system09
Emacs is a great operating system. It just lacks a decent text editor.
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I know. I meant that Node.js itself wasn't the fundamental leap that this is. And previous frameworks based on Node haven't attained "The One" status either.
I would want to have it cost much less than an Arduino in a "DIP package." The basic logic can be implemented in a $10 FPGA, add on cost of boards and connectors and a voltage regulator and it should still be less than $20. The advantage here would be that the user would be completely free to create her own "computer mainboard" with whatever peripherals she chooses. I might also consider doing an all-in-one with common peripherals, and if I did, a CDC/UART type thing would be high on the list. HDMI is easy to implement in recent FPGAs (easier than composite/S-Video/RGB out) which is why I'd want to display video using HDMI.
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I think he's saying this could be the Rails of Node.js.

Node.js is very low level and is more analogous to Ruby than Rails.
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You can. Here's my code as an example:

https://github.com/gigablah/fsphinxphp/blob/master/src/FSphi...

Note the $getter parameter.
I totally agree. And really what is this popularity vote? Is there really a merit to the "popular" brand? The war on Iraq was popular in 2003. If anything Google has done many things to upset the tech-educated population, than inspire them. Personally I think Google represents what Microsoft was in 1999. And I believe, at that time Microsoft, Yahoo were the premiere brands. We all know how they have turned(turning) out.
no. just, no. but go read this, you may find it strangely soothing.

http://ifyoulikeitsomuchwhydontyougolivethere.com/
This is true. However, if you do things fast and wrong, you've got an even bigger problem in figuring it out how to do things right because now you have to do both at the same time, and usually with the same number of people.
I'm that guy. I don't mean I'm "him", but I'm in a similar position. I'm a guy with an idea that's too big for its own plate. That being, my idea isn't an attractive one or a novel one, it's just a twist on something that might even exist without me knowing it..

Anyway, if you can do it, you have to do it. But as candid and stupid that may sound, I'd make sure that guy knows everything about it, either by telling him up front asap - including why he's not even considered as a partner, or I'd pass the message using anonymous means. Thing is, he'll know sooner than later anyway.

It's well documented that the effect of surprise after the fact can trigger irrational moves, while placing the subject in the observer seat, even as an outsider, might reduce the probability for an irrational act from ever happening.

In any case, it will get legal if you get successful. I'd provision for that. But I'd definitely go ahead without hiding from him.
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There's also been an instruction set/specification released for it (http://www.0x10c.com/doc/dcpu-16.txt). And while yes, within the game the DCPU's main function is to run the ship, you'll note that Notch makes reference to playing games "while you're waiting for X to finish" any number of times. People are already getting interested in the possibility, and it seemed like a fun project for me. More than anything, I was curious whether anyone else was thinking along these lines.
You can still say "NO," but when rent is due and you're down to the last pack of diapers, you cannot afford to be that brave. Real life and all
You know, not only that, but this implies that wrong is always fast. That is wrong. Often, wrong goes slower as time goes on. I'd rather have slow, steady progress than explosive growth and eventual failure.
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I see it. It's a strongly intuitive visual search for used cars, as opposed to airplane tickets.
I'm not sure about Meteor, but you may want to look into SocketStream. Last time I checked they were very interested in making web APIs easier to develop.
> It would cost lots of money to do the same kind of attack on a physical box.

Find a couple of professional magazines. Find the "response card" in that magazine. Fill it with victim's name and real world mail address. Tick 10 boxes. Repeat this a few times. (Wear gloves when doing this and carefully destroy the magazines afterwards.) This is free for the person doing it. It's low cost for each company involved.

> the mailman would stop it.

Why would a postal worker not deliver post with a valid name and address?
There's been no "official" memory map released (I don't know if Notch has even thought that out yet), but people on the forums are working on that. There will be various peripheral controllers, add-ons, etc., and as time goes on a "standard deployment" of the computer system (not just the CPU) will likely fall into place.

tl;dr: It doesn't break compatibility 'cos there's no compatibility to be broken yet ^^
Their docs server isn't up, but I'm wondering about all the low-level stuff that I have to deal with every day. Where do I put my files, how can I compress them, does it generate ETAGs correctly, how do I create cookies, and sessions....?

Having a way to inject changes into the client solves only a slice of what you do while creating a modern app. Will this framework be just that slice?
http://www.meteor.com/faq/meteor-is-a-early-preview
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As long as security uses a blacklist, it will be possible to evade it pretty easily. There are products that use a whitelist such as bit9.com, but that approach mostly works in corporate networks where they can set policy about what executable files can be run--period.
Sure, TCP carries the requests, but i think k2h was referring to the javascript running clientside. tear apart the .js on the site. mailbait servers don't fill out any forms. client browsers do.
I guess there's a lot of subjectivity at work. An Apple fan will no doubt see a lot more criticism than someone (and I'll admit I qualify) who is less pleased with the company.

That said: surely you can't be arguing that it's somehow a bad thing or reflects poorly on Google that it's employees are active in our community, can you?
I would add a "only used items" option
Look, I totally get the debt part of the valuation, and what enterprise value is. I also completely understand that enterprise value is an important measure of valuation. All I'm saying is that using market cap to indicate the value of the company is not that misleading either. Enterprise value is just one way to value a business, there are others. It's not precise science.

So in your latest example, and also throughout the thread, you're confusing (or using interchangeably) the concrete sale price and a fuzzy intrinsic value. Why would the buyer of your business pay $300K upfront? All other things being equal, the sale price of the business would still be $60k, and they can be paying off debt for the next 15 years for all I know. The conventional media-reported value of the business would still be $60K, and it won't be very misleading.

In addition, not all debt is created equal. A company like Google can probably easily get, say 1B of super cheap debt on favorable terms, while something like Barnes & Noble would barely get the same 1B at much higher interest rates and repayment schedules. It's still 1B in enterprise value, but it's clearly not the same debt.

You also mentioned cash flows. So to continue with your example, if your business is actually losing money hand over fist, and has negative cash flow on top of $240K of debt, what do you think its value would be? Would it be equal to your simple enterprise value formula? What if the same business is growing at 100% per quarter with super high operating margins? Enterprise value can be just as misleading.
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The point of these "X for Y" little slogans is to elucidate what the site does by analogy. When I think Hipmunk, I think flight scheduling. There is no equivalent for cars, and this is not a car scheduling anything. Thus the "Hipmunk for Cars" line just left me confused... it failed at its purpose and shouldn't be used as it's not a clear analogy.
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Knowing Cantonese isn't going to help you anywhere near as much as knowing Mandarin will (unless you want to move to Hong Kong), and it's arguable that the benefits of knowing Mandarin aren't that great either (given how many people can handle English and Mandarin already). Knowing how to code, though...that'll help mostly anywhere.
Very cool, that's something I'd definitely be interested in.
Yes, it seems like the dataset is so small that one should just download the whole thing and periodically request diffs. Less total bandwidth for everyone, more reliable, and a nice user latency win as well.
> are you really saying you'd choose option #2?

This is such a great point. Because there is a world of difference between saying your time is worth $1k/hr, and walking the talk, as the phrase goes.