> you're giving a ton of money to people who are largely doing very well.

Make more =/= "doing real well".

Some are doing well, some aren't, many are struggling. And the ones who are just getting by aren't having kids, which is really going to bite this nation in the long run.

>One can make a large variety of very stupid life-altering choices at 25

Where's that 25 coming from, eh? People apply to colleges when they're 17. That determines how big of a loan they'll end up with.

>these people should have known better

> I know for myself I took a modest 20,000

When? Did you bother to check tuition costs today?

Better than what? Than not go to a university that aligns with

> I would say, again unless you're trying to be a doctor or a lawyer your student loans should be capped at 100k.

"Should" is a nice word. My double-major undergrad took me five years, and I ended up with over $20K in loans while my tuition was free, because neither dorms (or off-campus housing) nor food were free, and that $25K didn't even cover those expenses.

And no, commute was not an option; and it was, indeed, a good choice of school (not to mention, free tuition).

$100K over 5 years barely covers living expenses[1], but let's be conservative and say the living expenses are paid with $50K over 4 years (by sharing an off-campus room with someone and subsisting on ramen).

Now, the fun part, tuition. Out-of-state tuition can be anywhere from $15K to $40K; it's about $38K in Texas A&M, for example, which is not what people would think is a prestigious school. $27K/year is just about average[2]

So out-of-state school puts us over the $100K for a 4-year degree right away. Tough luck if your state doesn't have great schools for your major!

Fine, let's settle for in-state tuition. Nationwide it's $10K/year on the average, but say, you were unfortunate enough to grow up in Pennsylvania or Illinois, where it's $15K/year[2][3].

Then again, having spent $60K on tuition and $50K on life over 4 years, we are $110K in the red. Bummer.

On the average, living expenses + tuition for a 4 year degree (in-state) is $80K; throw in books, supplies, transportation, and it's $100K[4].

That's average, meaning quite a few people attending public schools in-state end up paying more.

Any private college? Any college out of state? Any of the more expensive states?

Or simply not getting into one of the cheaper public schools in your state?

Or actually choosing a good program?

That's $200K over 4 years very easily.

> I have no sympathy for someone who with a college education decides it would be a good idea to take out another $200,000 in loans in order to get into a low paying field.

Yeah, it's totally reasonable to expect 17-year-olds to estimate correctly how well paid they will be in 4 years in the field of their choice.

We don't trust them with making any adult choices, except this one.

>If you forgive the student loans, the counter argument becomes get rid of the student loans and then people who are responsible with them

That's quite a leap of logic you have there, friend.

The first thing is to make student loans dismissible in bankruptcy. That makes the student loan just like any other loan. Bankruptcy exists for a reason.

Then, canceling the student debt just resets the game that was rigged in 1976 by making student loans different from the others. Education loans are lucrative, especially when given to responsible people like you. The banks won't pass on this opportunity (why would they?).

Finally, see my other comment[5] about how the most likely outcome is that the tuition costs will go drastically down. Availability of these loans is the reason the education is not affordable! You wouldn't need the loans if we didn't allow them.

Before the 1976 legislation, you could pay off your tuition working a part-time job on the weekends.

In 1975, six weeks of work at minimum wage paid your tuition at a public school.

Today, it's 33 weeks. Five times as much. If you're lucky.

We can and must go back to where we were 50 years ago. And the banks have to pay for milking us for those 50 years.

People like us won't be hurt when the banks pay up.

[1]https://www.collegecovered.com/paying-for-college/real-colle...

[2]https://educationdata.org/average-cost-of-college

[3]https://www.businessinsider.com/personal-finance/average-col...

[4]https://www.valuepenguin.com/student-loans/average-cost-of-c...

[5]https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29171278