skysight-inc/HackerNews huggingface dataset:
Title is misleading. When I read "go dark" I think of a service doing the clever thing and burrowing itself in the darkweb where it's nearly impossible to take down (unless it gets DDOSed of course).

But even DDOS'ing can be mitigated by hardening your server, and doing rudimentary things like rate limiting and filtering out bots with captchas. Things are made even easier by using a tricked out NGINX[0] server or even Varnish cache[1].

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nginx

[1] https://www.varnish-cache.org/
You totally misunderstand the way the legal system works in the United States. Let’s go ahead and examine your example.

Say that a law was passed that required Facebook and others to remove posts critical of the US military. In this example, if Facebook fails to comply, people will be arrested.

Facebook would sue the government, saying that the law is unconstitutional as it violates the First Amendment. This would likely become know as something like Facebook et al. vs The United States. Unless we are in a bizarro universe, Facebook would win.

In this example, Facebook’s rights, as a publisher, are the ones being trampled on, not yours. It’s not a people’s case. In this scenario you likely don’t even have standing to sue (debatable, I suppose, but that’s a separate discussion entirely).

It’s worth noting that the closest thing to this scenario was with the ACSS key years ago. Not quite the same, but similar parties involved along a similar line of thinking.

But the issue at hand with Cloudflare isn’t the same. There is no constitutional issue at all. It’s just one business dropping a client.

In fact, the only way this could ever turn into a free speech issue, even in principle, is if a law was passed that forced Cloudflare to continue to host 8chan’s content.

You should really do some reading about what free speech actually means. You are so far off the mark it’s hard to take you seriously.
This article is garbage, many books have been written on the market. Please search for the real classics and pick one up.
Wow. Dose response analysis would be great. I am interested in long term effects too.
Effect is not immediate as most contracts are still written in USD. But the producer would still be paying wages in yuan so that many actually be a short term profit boost
> It is almost always better to first talk to outside legal representation to understand the landscape. If there are actual law violations, they will help properly document and possibly start preparing a case, and if not then you know you should prepare to leave the company.

Assuming you have already agreed to legally binding arbitration as is pretty much standard in all employee contracts (although thankfully a recent law banned this practice in California for employees hired in 2019 or later), how useful is it to go to a lawyer? It just seems like the system is designed to work against you.

I have never actually gone through the binding arbitration process, so my knowledge of this is very limited.
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ok 1Mb down and 10 up means that there is a high speed line - probably capable of 80Mb down which has a problem - my guess would be a shunt or interference (REIN). The provider should know this and should be able to locate and fix. But this is an service issue, not a delivery issue.
So the solution then, should be to socialize people in such a way that such views do get challenged.

The alternatives, where we have gatekeepers like Google and Facebook entirely deciding what is permissible speech, is too far to the other extreme.
JFYI, here (Italy) bonus/malus is a common name for the formula of most car insurance policies, where basically if you have a car accident (of course if it is your fault) you are demoted 2 "classes" (malus) and if you pass one year without accident you are promoted 1 "class" (bonus).

The "entrance class" is the 14th, worst is 18th and best is 1st.
Exactly this. These sort of folk started congregating on 8chan when they got pushed out of 4chan. I certainly don't condone mass shootings, white supremacists, etc., but if you think denying 8chan hosting is going to solve this problem, you are sorely mistaken. All it does is force these people into more concentrated forums where there is less push back and opposing views to their radical ideas. Ultimately, it forces them into corners of the internet that are harder for outside groups to locate and monitor for potential threats.

I'll be quite honest, I don't know what a "good" solution here is, but I really don't think this is it.
>Due process means people will game your policies.

And? If your policies are liable to being "gamed", then either your policies or your enforcement is insufficient. And I say this with a pretty good deal of forum moderation experience. When you find something that your objectively defined rules miss, you update your rules appropriately and continue on.

Life as a mod is about a million times easier, for both you and your users, when you minimize the amount of judgment calls on edge cases that have to be made.
> they handled these reports on a largely reactive basis

I don't see anything wrong with that considering the limited and volunteer-based resources they have. Youtube-style content ID pre-censoring built into everything shouldn't be a goal we're striving for.
None of the companies discontinuing relationships with 8chan are monopolies. In some cases they're just the last in their category to finally drop 8chan.
And they're free to continue their speech elsewhere. Cloudflare and Voxility are within their rights to refuse service to a client on the basis that the client is persistently associated with terrorism and kiddy porn.

Why is that a remotely controversial statement? Nobody is suggesting that chan-tards should be rounded up for unamerican activities, and I'd be the first to speak against that, but CF don't need to tarnish their brand with 8chans bullshit.

They're free to withhold their support and so express an opinion.
> Even very close to big cities like Frankfurt, having an uninterrupted phone call is a difficult thing to have.

The German Minister for Economic Affairs has stopped taking calls with foreign colleagues during car trips because he was too embarassed by the constant interruptions...
Thought it over and you're right, Spark has some SecurityManager glue I've vaguely glanced at, but HDFS relies more on Kerberos than anything in-proc with the workers. IPC into an opaque worker binary would be a lot more painful but can be made to work.
Good and bad is not a binary, it's a spectrum. If you put the cutoff for what is allowed very close to the limit of hwat you think is "good" (i.e. you try to ban everything you would consider "bad"), there will inevitably be people with different viewpoints who can bring up a convincing argument that your cutoff also bans some good tihngs. We need a "buffer" of things generally considered "bad" but not too bad, so that we can ensure that good things really are allowed; allowing good things is more important than banning bad things. That is a key principle of having a free society.
Of course, things wihch are obviously really very bad should be banned. Good news: they already are! Hate speech is banned in virtually every country I can think of. I'm explicitly not arguing against legal action against hate speech here; I'm arguing against private ocmpanies banning things which are not illegal.

Leaving all that aside, even if you think all bad things should be banned, I do not think that Cloudflare of all things should be the arbiter of right and wrong.
Stop Misusing Toggle Switches
Somewhat ironic, given that they're a haven for white supremacists. :)
Its not necessarily you, your post attracted others in this thread that do care more and there isn't a good way to address them all except replying at this level.

I think its completely benign.

I would be a little annoyed if the stranger’s life was a fake feel good story like the ones seen on Linkedin these days, but even then I would just accept the entertainment for what it is: entertainment. Ad supported entertainment.
The vested interest media and political parties have in making it seem like there is an insatiable thirst for white supremacy in America.

It's on average not any worse than it ever was, but showing us how bad its always been right now serves a useful political goal in division and diversion.

Its not a conspiracy, just stupidity and greed. Outrage generates views and votes, no cartel required.
In December 2012, a crazed man entered an elementary school and attacked several staff members and students. He used a kitchen knife and while there were 24 injuries, there were zero deaths:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chenpeng_Village_Primary_Schoo...

A little while later, another crazed man entered a second elementary school and also attacked staff and students. He used an XM15 and Glock 20SF; there were 2 injuries and 28 deaths:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Hook_Elementary_School_s...

> It's the violence that matters, not the weapon.

I'm guessing you have never read Marshal McLuhan. The tools (communication or otherwise) that humans have available shape society and our perception of the world. There are daily examples (both negligent and purposeful) of people acting in a way that they probably would not have if they only had knives or just their fists:

* https://twitter.com/well_regulated_

The effects of different tools are... different. The "Garlic shooter" was able to kill 3 people and injure many more before he was taken out in under 60 seconds:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilroy_Garlic_Festival_shootin...

That kind of carnage is difficult to achieve with a baseball bat or a knife.
Fair, so that implies it doesn't really help, but at least isn't actively making things worse.
Say you (as the US) wanted to keep the same level of trade between the US and China- and the tariffs rose and the yuan fell in such a ratio that this remains true.

The net outcome is good right? The US gets slightly more tax (larger % of a smaller number), Chinese economy has to deal with loss of currency value?
Death Note: L, Anonymity and Eluding Entropy (2017)
Amazing analysis, only problem is n=1.
https://arxiv.org/pdf/1810.07535.pdf - actual paper

https://xiaochunliu.github.io/ - author's GitHub page.
One is censorship and the other isn't. One need not carry a brief for Cloudflare to recognize that, protected categories aside, like any business they have the right to refuse service to anyone. 8chan falling into no protected categories, and there in any case being no shortage of other network service providers, you need first to establish that Cloudflare has acted wrongly, and your arguments thus far fall somewhat short of compelling agreement on that score.
That’s Truffle, not JRuby. There was a plan several years ago to move Sulong support into JRuby based on trialing it in Truffle; it appears to have made no progress since 2016.
The price of Amazon stock is ultimately supported by expectations of future dividends. The same is true for other stocks too, of course.

Whether or not the company has paid out dividends in the past is a good predictor of whether they'll do so in the future, but it's not the only such predictor. Having accumulated a mountain of cash but using it to invest in the business (buildings, equipment, and other productive assets) is another. Probably better, at least in some sense/cases.

The other way in which the stock is supported is by other people's expectations of other people's expectations of future dividends, and so on. I.e., speculation. Still tied to dividends, just in an unhealthy and volatile way.
> People _are_ allowed to shout over protesters. It's legal to do that.

Sometimes. If organizing a rally requires a government permit, then having the government give another permit for the same time and place to people whose aim was to disrupt the rally would probably violate the first amendment rights of the rally organizers. And that's basically what happened in Charlottesville, the rally organizers had permits and the protestors did not.
I was once building a new computer. I got 2x 32MB memory sticks, for something like a grand. When I bought there were a few places listing them for an impossibly low price, like $100. A month or two later, EVERYONE was selling them at $100.

The average investor shouldn't try to outsmart the market. But, if there are indications the price of hens is going to dip dramatically, it may be worth delaying that big purchase.
ISIS is still very much an active organization, even if they don't control physical territory any longer.
>in silico discovery of drugs is still fairly unreliable

Can you elaborate on this? I'm not challenging you on it, just interested in learning more.
> Isn't it just like covering your eyes and pretending the problem isn't there?

Not necessarily - more like taking the megaphone away. You're right that some/many will find a hub to congregate in, but if it's discoverable by the current 8chan users, there's no reason to think it won't be discoverable by media outlets/journalists either.

Like most things, obfuscation/suppression isn't going to solve the issue, but by providing spaces that allow for discussions, the views can be legitimised in the eyes of people who otherwise may not believe them. I'm for the most part against suppression of speech or views, but I do believe there is a line, and to me 4/8chan can (and do) regularly cross this line.
Are they curating otherwise legal content because they don't like it? Isn't that the topic here? Help me understand.
Would you please stop posting unsubstantive comments?

Personal attacks, in particular, will get you banned here, so please don't do that again.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
I mentioned this above. The relevant XKCD
https://xkcd.com/1357/
There's some sort of contradiction here that: you think the speech is bad that CloudFlare should ban it. But not bad enough to be banned from every CDN.
Most of what I buy these days are services not goods. I pay to have the wheels changed on my car twice a year (winter versus summer tyres), insurance, house painting and maintenance, servicing for my car, electricity, water, sewerage, an internet connection.

As for goods, well I buy a new computer about once a decade and a phone perhaps twice as often, fresh bread, fruit, vegetables, meat, butter, biscuits, and tea, every few days or weeks.

No idea if Amazon sells all that but it doesn't seem so from a glance at their web site.
It is, but governments can exercise extreme control over the internet 99% of the population receives.
In 2000, was it obvious that the internet startups were mostly pipe-dreams? In 2007, was the repackaging of bad debt into prime a common knowledge? Maybe it was but I learned about the causes way after the proverbial stuff hit the fan.

This leads me to wonder what may be going on now that I don't yet understand.
OMG this is excellent.
National backbone level internet should be large government infrastructure projects. It’s like roads and railways. Competition works on the roads, but works poorly for constructing them. Infrastructure within cities and to premises can work though.
> all those people who were having fun on 8chan will now see the error of their ways

Sorry but I can't empathize with your statement since bigotry, racism, hatred, and white supremacy don't come off as 'fun'
> Each board is individually ran and the global moderators won't get involved unless it's content that's blatantly illegal.

That's true for almost every other board, but /pol/ isn't individually run. It was seized by the site administration, and they make its rules.
It might not be true in the general case yet, but it's certainly a sentiment I can get behind. Privately-owned toll roads shouldn't be able to ban political opponents - why should the Internet equivalent be different?
Proactively?
I think that was sarcasm / a George W. reference, or least assume it is since I was referring to events circa 2015.
It can be an end itself if you find that any limits are prone enough to corruption to not be tolerated.

Take encryption. It is used for some of the most vile evil content that exists on the internet. But I support encryption because I know that any limits on it will soon be corrupted by those in power to use for reasons far less just than ending the aforementioned content. Thus I see enabling encryption as an end to itself regardless of how it is used because I see any society that does differently as inferior.
It isn't just the USA: India has mass transit construction cost problems and could learn - if only they shared a language. Not to mention France (France is better at controlling costs than the US, but still not cheap)

In the US Spanish speakers tend to be poor and thus not in position to do anything about costs if they did look into it.
What public good are they benefiting from?
Is rideshare an industry standard term or is it just clever?
If I don't play soccer for 4 months I doubt whether i will be selected for the most competitive team after returning.

and 2) you were probably in that position as the 1% of the 1% of the 1% who was willing to sacrifice everything to get that role. If the cards turn they select another 1% of the 1% of the 1%.

So, harsh on personal level however, you should have known before signing likewise Messi knows he is not playing in 10 years team for Barca 1th
>The concept of freedom of speech falls apart if universally reprehensible speech is allowed to be publicaly espoused without being firmly challenged. Forums like 8chan and 4chan effectively incubate hate speech by providing a safe space for anonymized, like-minded individuals to congregate, espouse their basest thoughts and feelings and receive gratification for it -all without challenge. Moderate people are repulsed by such forums and the quantity of hate-speech they generate, which further compounds the negative feedback loop.

These boards do more than allow this hate to fester. They allow hate to grow as they become a recruiting ground that can radicalize people who never would have fallen into this mindset without these boards. 8chan might be compartmentalized in a way that allows it to become an echo chamber of hate, but it also is highly connect to boards about general topics like video games, TV, and movies. This normalizes the hate and it becomes just another thing to talk about.

I would bet a small minority of people who spew hateful things on 8chan sought the site out because of their own hate. Maybe they went there to talk about the new Call of Duty game. Before too long they are ingrained in the whole Gamergate mindset. Then they eventual start hanging out on /pol and before you know it they are a full fledged white nationalist. (A similar thing has been reported about Youtube's recommendation algorithm [1]) This wouldn't happen if the hateful sections of 8chan were sectioned off into their own site. No one accidentally stumbles upon The Daily Stormer and becomes a white nationalist. Just visiting that site genuinely requires a predilection towards hate and a sympathetic ear to white nationalism.

[1] - https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/06/08/technology/yo...
The longest I've stayed at a job since graduating is three years.

If companies had better career paths and gave good raises that might be longer.
This is a bad analogy. Hens are a relatively cheap, rapidly depreciating asset that require constant maintenance and will cease to be productive in a few years. The capital cost of the hen itself is essentially negligible. Of course you don’t mind when they get cheaper.

This is completely unlike stocks, which you can hold forever at no cost, and whose output, on average, goes up over time.

If we need to make an analogy to something non-investors can relate to... well, it’s pretty tough. Which is probably why there are so many different opinions out there about how you should feel in response to various events.
Careful on some of those ETFs. Even the residential one is only 50% residential, (its nearly a third health care.) And the global one is 15% residential (its second biggest sector behind retail, and ahead of office, diversified, industrial, specialized, health care, hotel and resort.)

They are more diversified than their names may imply. You may end up with odd overlaps if you dont look at their underlying sector breakdowns.
I think they only switched to Epik/Voxility for a few hours after being kicked off Cloudflare, but I'm not familiar with where they would have been hosted or what services they used 3-4 years ago.
Also, if I understand correctly, very uneven economic progress in different areas.

Call me a reductionist, but I'm inclined to view social extremism primarily as a symptom of economic decline. When growth falters, the fires always seem to start burning.
Yeah, that appears to be the "Hacker News wisdom" on this topic and it certainly seems plausible to me. I was just wondering if this is a basically universally held opinion, or if some people with relevant experience have a different view.
Well, wait, the question is whether or not internet service is considered a utility, and whether or not that utility is allowed to take a "side" as a result.

I think that 8chan is terrible and I would rather it not exist, but at the same time, I would be pretty against denying its owners water or something, since we've decided that utilities don't get to take sides.
Well yeah since the tariff wars started. This article has a good explanation of what they have been doing.

https://thefederalist.com/2017/07/03/china-secretly-manipula...

China was keen on strengthening the yuan and were doing that for a couple of years, but the trade wars have shifted their calculations. The earlier strengthening gives them some additional leeway.

I think the reason for this drop in the exchanges is because letting the yuan drop is China’s way of saying they’re in for a fight. A stable yuan was basically a precondition for trade talks, and this coming right after the last round means the hope for a resolution seems remote at best.

I still don’t understand how China expects to win the trade war. The US has a lot more firepower. But I guess leadership incentives are not aligned with the country and it’s peoples incentives (which is true in the US as well).
Just to put a date to this: including dividends, it matched its 1929 high again around 1943/1944.
2pm margin call?
one thing i've been thinking about is one issue political parties.

"our mission, once elected, is to..."

US example: thinking about medical care here: what if a political party came out and said, "we don't care about marijuana, gay marriage, federal debt, ...: only getting medical care for all.

you'll say, well that's impossible, people won't vote for them without knowing e.g. what their stance on abortion is.

but... i'm convinced those wedge issues are what keep the 2 party system intact. they'll just ruin you by pitting the other k % of people against you as mortal enemies, demonizing and alienating those voters. easy example is abortion, who probably have a lot of bright line voters.

anyway, it'd be really tough, as would any new political party in the US, would be attacked endlessly by the RepubliCrats. but, seems like an interesting thought nonetheless.