>To be fair, they may well think you are referring to them, because of your words here and how you don't seem to acknowledge the reality of their condition:

I can see that. And I feel that sometimes a slap in the face really is what we need. People don't seem to like that idea, but it happened a few times to me, and some people will take that and turn it into a good thing and others won't.

I am speaking to the people who will accept the possibility that they can change. People who will never accept this will never change, it's that simple. Because they will always blame someone else for their problems. I have had people like this in my life, and they eventually come around to blaming you.

I found that for some people to get out of depression, they need to cut ties with these people, and find friends that will support them, not drag them down. Life is too hard the way it is.

>Sometimes really all the person can do is avoid suicide for another day.

I am intimately familiar with this. And I understand that's there's a point in time where words are meaningless. But if they are reading hacker news, I suspect it's possible they aren't there right now. In fact, by reading comments like this, it indicates they are looking for answers, encouragement or something, who knows.

When I was there, I looked for anything to help me through the day, or the moment. Sometimes it was cutting to make other pain dull, or finding a way to off myself that I think I could go through with. Anything. Drowning is how I would describe it. Logic to a drowning person is pointless.

But then, you have moments, where you are on the beach, you aren't drowning, and your fine. But you know where you will be again soon, and these are the times where you can look for hope. Find something to hold onto when you are drowning again.

One difficult choice I had to make was to not expect the people around me to take the weight of my pain. One of the worst nights of my entire life were when I was on the phone with a girlfriend who hung up to kill herself. I called her family and friends and found out the next day she was fine and she dumped me shortly after.

Despite all the pain I was in, I couldn't believe that someone could hurt you so bad and have no remorse about it. I realized then that if I expected other people to constantly be worried that I was going to off myself, that it would be the worst thing I could do to them.

So, using this knowledge, I started to face my pain, one little bit at a time. I didn't stop looking to suicide as an answer to my problems until I worked at this for many years. Always reminding myself the pain I would cause others.

It's a terrible lie that people believe that other's would be better off without them. And it may take a really long time to convince yourself of the opposite, but I know it's possible. The more you do for others, the more real this becomes. I made myself valuable to my family, with the intentions of doing the opposite of taking care of just myself, and over time I slowing learned to believe they value having me around.

I can say that even today, I don't have the same conviction many other people have of this. But I am not depressed (still have bad days, but I get out of bed and face it) and I no longer consider suicide. I have to say that it's my logic that helps me see the truth, it helps me stay on track, because my feelings can twist me all up, and I no longer want to follow them wherever they go.

I know many people can't afford professional help, but today, you can go on an internet board, call your parents, or a friend anywhere in the world and just ask them to say something encouraging. Anything happy or good.

The therapists I dealt with followed books and rules, my wife would just hold me for an hour. Which do you think made my day better? I know many people don't have a wife, or a friend to get help from. But there are many people out there that will help a random stranger through a moment of darkness.

Sometimes the answer to a problem is to just ask anyone for help.