Document

http://collections.ushmm.org

Contact reference@ushmm.org for further information about this collection TOBY STERN April 16, 1990

Q: Would you tell us your name and where and when you were born?

A: My name is Toby Stern. I was born in Mittelwischo, Romania in 19...the...the month...the month...the 7th month...the 15th, 1920.

Q: Can you tell me about your life before the war?

A: I should tell you my life before the war. That's not so easy, but I'm gonna try. When I was born my father wasn't live. I was born 5 months after he passed away. He had...uh...a scarlet fever. In Europe then wasn't any cure. He was six children. I have five brothers...had when I was a little girl. And we struggled. My mother was 28 years old.

My father was 39 passed away. It wasn't a easy life. But they used to live by my mother's grandma...my mother's mother, and we had some aunts in America and they used to help.

Send the children to Yeshivas. For the holiday they used to send some money. And my grandmother, she was a midwife and she, you know, she had pension and she was our father. My children...my brother went to school, to the Jewish school. I went...I couldn't make. We didn't have money. I couldn't make the Jewish school, so I went to public school. And my brother...he teached me how to read. And we grew up. It was not easy.

(Sigh) And the years passed. I was already then...we went to school. Then I finished school. And then I went to learn to make the...

Q: Dressmaking.

A: Dressmaking. And then I worked a little. And then it came the time...you know, the people want I should get married. I was married in 1939. I was engaged in 1939. I was married to a wonderful husband...was a beautiful man, and I was the happiest in the...in the world. Nobody was...I don't think nobody was so happy like I was. And everybody was envying me what...he was something. It wasn't another person like him. We were married 3 months. He used to live in the Bookavena, and I went with him. He had a very big store. (Sign) And he made a beautiful living. He was a very big businessman. And 3 months after I was married, then it starts a terrible tragedy. It was in...hen...then it started...the...the...you know, some people let out the...all the communists from the...from the jails and they started to hit Jewish people. Jewish people couldn't go in the streets.

Jewish people couldn't go in the trains. Whoever went in a train, they used to take him off the hands. They take him off the...the tongue. They cut him off the ears. They take him out the eyes. A lot of people they killed. And they put them in the windows. You want to...to buy kosher. You want to...to buy kosher meat. Here you could buy kosher meat. It was Jewish meat. You know, the Jewish people. This went on a few weeks and then where we used to live...I used to live in Kominash. This was Lisatravel...not far from there. And on a nice day, some people came and they took out everything from the stores.

He came home. He told me what happened. So was nothing to do. I had there his uncles....very...you know, scholared people. Rabbis. They was very rich. They had very

big stores. They was...uh...you know, with the...uh...they were very big businessman. So they...also they took out everything from the Jewish people. They came to the houses.

They took everything away. And then they start to kill people. I had one uncle. He was a Rabbi. He had two children. They took him out and they asked him, "Which children do you like best?" So he had...one was one was another... he said, This son | like," so they killed first that son. Then they killed the father, and then they killed the first son. And then the...it was in May. It was very hot. He was laying there maybe for 7 days in the heat. And then my husband went in the night and he made them graves and he put them in in the earth. And we thought everything is fine. I mean after this...and it was a few months soldiers came. It was on a Friday. And everybody from us had to leave. We was afraid they shouldn't kill us. About two weeks we was in the...in the woods. We didn't have any water. We didn't have any food. We had one little baby from | year old. He didn't eat for 2 weeks. It was my nephew. Just that he start to cry, his mother put in the finger in the mouth and she said, Menge, Shhh. Be quiet. We was afraid somebody shouldn't hear we are there. So the...the child was even 6, 5 years...5, 6 years, he always said...he was...he had this in his head. He was | year old then, and he said, "Shh. You're not allowed to talk." So we were 2 weeks there and I wasn't with my husband. I was separated. We ran away. He was...it was in the day time. He was by work. I was at home." So we ran in the woods and we didn't know from each other. And...and one Friday we came home. We thought everything is alright. We came home...we should...uh...put out the candles. It was Sabbath. It was a envious. She was very rich. She had money by her. She had a child from 2 years with her. And we didn't have anything in the house to eat or something. But to...to put on the candles, this we came for. And then came 2 soldiers...came in in the house, and he went to my aunt and he told her, "Give me the money what you have." So she said, "I don't have any money." So they...they killed her on the spot. She was almost dead. They killed her in the throat. She had that child was this size. She went over to him and kissed him. (Crying) And the blood was by the child of the...of the clothing. We couldn't wash it. He went with this maybe 2, 3 weeks, without change, without anything. The mother passed away. He survived. And then my husband heard...it was her name was the same like mine, Toby. So they said they killed Toby. So he was...it was 3 months after we were married. So he was...you can imagine.

He was very upset. And he...what can you do, you know. He...he couldn't come to the house. Then after he came home... No., we went...we heard some people out in the woods still, so we went to look for them, and I saw my husband.

Q: Mrs. Stern, they asked if you would remove your necklace cause it's rubbing on your microphone.

A: Okay. So when he saw me, he almost fainted. He thought I'm dead. He said, "Toby, I heard the people killed you." So I said, it was "Auntie Toby." So he...he was happy he have me. So he took me by my hands. He left everybody, his mother, his sister, brothers He had eight sisters and brothers, and he took me to a...to a Gentile house, we should hide where we was still...was afraid. It was 5 in the morning, and we went, just me and him.

We didn't talk. We was afraid somebody shouldn't hear it. We walked like on the air somebody shouldn't hear the walking. So we came to the house where he made business with that guy, my husband and he asked him, "Please, let he hide in your house." He said,

Gadalia, I couldn't do it. I'm afraid." Everybody knew when you hide a Jew, so you have to give your life. He said, "I'm a father. I have children. I couldn't do that." So he begged him. He said, "Look, you know with whom you talk." So he said, "Okay." They put us in the cellars, and they covered us up, you know, with boxes and things people shouldn't...in case somebody comes, they shouldn't see we are there. But I don't know somehow one person saw us and they told us he hided two Jews. So two soldiers came. First, the man came. and he said, "Gadalia, I am sorry. They want to kill me. I have to give you out." And he said, "Try. Tell him you...you know we are not here." He said, "I couldn't.

Please." So we came out, and the soldiers saw us. They took us out, and they just said, "You're Jews. You're not going to live anymore." So they told us we should pick up our hands and they had the bayonets just to kill us. So my husband had a few remain, you know, money, and he had a lot of bills. He didn't have too much money then. They took us away from us. So he put the money on the...you know, on the end, and the bills in the middle and he give them a bunch. They thought they have a lot of money. So they said, "Run away, and go hide of another place. I let you go." So we quickly ran away, and then we came again to the house. Food we didn't have. There was a carton eggs. So my mother-in-law put the eggs in a oven...not even we didn't have a...a.... nothing to cook in it, and she baked the eggs and we ate...everybody had something. You know, for 2 weeks, we didn't have anything. So we were there a few days, and we didn't have what to do. Money we didn't have. The store they took away from us. The houses they took away from us. We went to . It was a little....uh...a town. So my husband went in the morning to...shul in and the" ...uh...

Q: Major

A: The mayor saw him. He was his best friend. He told him, "Mr. " You...now you have a chance. Go to the primary and tell them whatever they took from you and you gonna get em back." So who knew...you know he went and he captured them. The...so they took about 50 people like this and they kept them a few days. I went to them once or twice.

They let me I should see him. And then they said they're gonna kill him. They not going to leave him free. They took him away in a truck and they put him in a concentration camp. Thank God, they didn't kill him then He wrote he some...uh...letters, you know, and I wrote him back. But he could never have my letters. They just tease but I wrote him. He didn't...he was afraid. Maybe something is in the letters. You know, they had....they never give him the letters to him. So he was 6 months in capture. So I went with my mother-in-law. She...you know, she liked me very much. I loved her just like a mother. She was very good to me. And my brother-in-laws, my sister*in-laws. Today, even I married 40...43 years it's gonna be I'm married now, and they still...I'm her sister- in-law. And I...1 came home. I was pregnant. I didn't know. So my brother...there's a in the army. He was in the army, my youngster brother, and he took me to my mother's home in Romania. This was in the Bookerwene, and I was living at my mother's. Well, my husband wasn't there. My mother-in-law she used to go...we didn't have any money...she used to go everyday in the market. She used to bring me...she had her own children. She never give anything for the children. I...I didn't feel good. I didn't know I was pregnant then. She didn't know. But I was laying, and she said, "Toby has to have...she's such a young kin. Gadalia is not here. So she has to take care of me." So it

was too hard for her. So my brother came in and took me from there and he bring me to my mother's. So I came here. Everybody was...you know, they thought he's killed. The people knew, you know, everybody who took away, they killed them. So my friends came, "Poor Toby, she's such a young child. She's pregnant. She doesn't have a husband now." But 6 months after...and one day he came home. And I don't have to tell you....you know, was...when we see each other. So when he came home it was Hungarian. It was 1940. The Hungarian came in. We were Romanian. In 1940, Hungarian took over Romania. And it wasn't such a pleasant thing. It was very rough. They start demonstrate, start the...you know...And he came home and he wasn't registered. It was about 3 or 4 months after the Hungarian was already there. And they said then the people wasn't right away when the Hungarian came, they are...you know, doesn't belong to the...to the Hungarian, they have to go back from where they come. But I wanted...I didn't know where to go. My home was tooken. My store was taken away, so we stayed by...by my mother. So but he wasn't registered. So we didn't know what to do.

We tried. My brother went to whatever place and we paid money and they registered him and he was when the Hungarian came in. So was...we were very happy. And he was...he was...he never went out. He was afraid. He didn't know, you know.. he's allowed to go out. So he was like a capture by me in the house. He was very religious. He went everyday to the synagogue. It was in the winter. He took a...he used to hock, you know.

It was frozen...the water. The windows were broken already, so he took and he opened the ice, and he went into the waters. And he was there until 1942. I had my baby. Was very happy. I was...My baby was born 1940, March 28. It was. It was a very happy day.

He was in the house. I had the baby in the house. Then, you know, there they...we didn't have hospitals like it's here. So I had my baby, and we were very happy. Later, the baby was very sick. We didn't have money from...you know, we went to doctors, but they didn't know what it was. So I had to go to city...to a big city, and I was there a few days. I went to one doctor, to a second doctor, and they said, "What did you do with your baby?

You didn't give him to eat." He was eating right away. He went..I...you know, he didn't catch anything. So I was by my family. And the mother....this is my sister-in-law today, my youngest brother's wife. Her mother...she was a very nice lady. So she said, "Toby, you couldn't lose nothing. Just try and take...it was a very old doctor. And she said, "Call this doctor. If this doctor's not going to help you, nobody would." So the children all was laughing, "Ma, he's such an old man. Why do you want..." So she said, "Just call him." He came to us. We saw the baby. He couldn't believe it. He was skin and bones. So he gave him a medicine. The first thing I gave him the medicine he...the baby was fine. We came home. You know, he survived. He was a beautiful baby. And we were struggling.

You know, my husband couldn't go out. He couldn't make money. He was afraid. And then was...in 1940 was he born. And then again pregnant again. 1942...my...they called him to ...uh...labor...to work. And then we knew it already, it was start...it was a very bad thing we registered him. When we don't register him, they don't know from him, and he would be alive even today. But we didn't know, and we made this. You know, they called him in. And I was pregnant and he went away. So I packed him some stuff. And he forgot some gloves. And it was a very cold...it was in December and I ran after him I should give him the gloves. I catched a cold, and I was very sick then and I lost the baby in the 8th month. I was very upset. I used to cry. My husband went away. He knew, you know, we have a baby. When he comes back I am gonna have another. And then he gonna come

in in the house and he say, "Toby, where is the other baby?" What I'm gonna tell him? I was...I was crying, but I didn't know he will never come back again. (Crying) Then in...in February I heard after...after the liberation he was killed with 35,000 people. But I didn't know. A lot of people get letters. You know, they was missing. a lot of people get letters, you know, he's there. But I didn't get anything, but I never believed he's not alive. So I waited every day I should get something. But it never came. And then it...we came already to 1944. It was holidays. It was...and then in April...it was on a Friday, we cooked a Saturday you know, the meal...everybody. And my child was very sick. He had fevers.

He had very high fever. And soldiers came in the house and they said, "10 minutes I give you. Pack everything. You have to go to the synagogue." So I begged the soldiers that look, my child is so sick. Please leave me here. We knew already they're going to take us to the ghetto. So he took...he hit me, and he called me some names. He said you couldn't stay here. You have to go. He doesn't care the baby is sick. So I didn't have nothing what to do, so I took some stuff and we packed everything in the synagogue. The meal was on the stove. We went away. Over Saturday, we was there in the shul and Sunday they....or Saturday, they took us with a...we didn't have cars...horse and carriages. And every family, they packed, and they took us to the ghetto. So we came in in the ghetto. It was in a room maybe 30, 50, 20 people, but Thank God, we had the family. We had my grandmother, my aunt, my children. We weren't with strangers. But we didn't...we sat in the floor. Food we didn't have. We couldn't take any food. And I had, you know, then my child and my aunt had nine children. My grandmother was old already, and we had to sit on the floor, to sleep on the floor. It was about 4 weeks like that. I went out everyday to old people. I washed them. I cut them the nails. I cut them the hair. I cleaned them up.

And, you know, they begged me...please, we couldn't go out. We didn't have what to do, so I went every single day. And I did it. When I was a young girl...I forget to tell you...in home every week, it wasn't too many rich people by us, so I went every week to take...like to beg for other people, not for me...where we had for ourselves enough. But we was on the first categories, like we weren't so poor. So everybody came and said, "Toby, you could go to take...they're not going to take it, take it for yourself, but other people, they need it and the children are...you know, they are embarrassed to go to beg.

So I went every single week, you know, in the house. They didn't have no money. They give a little potatoes, a little beans, a little flour, you know, until some...one house to houses, we made something and we...they gave this to the poor, you know, that they should have for the...and there was a lot of sick people. Every night there was a young children, I used to go to be I used to be compression.

Q: Compress.

A: Compress, you know, for sick, typhus people. I didn't care I'm gonna get sick or not. I never slept in my house. There was a lot of old people. Everybody came. My mother was a wonderful woman. They said, "Give me Toby for the night." They were afraid to sleep by theirself. Every single night...I don't know, my mother, she let me go from one house to... whoever wanted, she...she wanted to please the people and I went. It wasn't such a clean houses, but I...I still went and I didn't complain. I did a lot for people. I wanted to help, and I did it and I very happy I could do it. And I'm gonna go back from the Auschwitz, you know, from the...from the ghetto. So my child was then 3 and a half years

old. He used to play with my brother the the chess. A...a chess...you know, he was so smart, he was...you couldn't believe it. And my brother was there. Then we had friends.

They came. One friend I had, he asked me, "Toby, what did you do with your jewelry?" I had a lot of jewelry. So I said, "Before we came to the ghetto, I hide this. I make a package. I had my mother's jewelry and my jewelry and I...I put away...not I knew where it is, that nobody can find it. So he said, "Toby, you have a child. Go back. I go with you.

Take your jewelry. For a ring, for a earring, you could buy a bread. You could buy milk.

You...you'll be able to survive." So we went out from the ghetto. When they catch us, they would...uh...shoot us. But we went away four people. I took my jewelry, and I was very happy I brought it to the ghetto. Then we hear the people, before they go to the trains, they take away everything. So I said, "What I'm gonna give them the gold, my jewelry?" So there was a girl. She was a friend with my brother. She was very rich. Her father has a big store. And this house near them was in the ghetto. So the girl told my brother, "You have...I know you have the jewelry." He told her, you know, I have my jewelry here. She said, "GIve it to me." They have a hiding place in the basement and she hides her things and she's gonna hide our things and when we come back, we gonna have it. So she begged my brother. He said, "Booda, please come see where I put it. Nobody knows whose gonna come back. So my brother thought, you know, maybe nobody's gonna take it, they're gonna think he took it. So he didn't want to go. So I met her in Auschwitz, that girl, and I begged her. I said, "Please, tell me where did you put the jewelry." She said, "I'm not gonna tell you." And she never survived. We came back, me and my brother. We went through the whole cellar. We couldn't find it. And we didn't have it. So when I came home...so then in one day...and 4 weeks after they took us to the trains. So they packed us, about 120 people, old people, young people, no water. They gave us a little water. We went about 4. 3 days...3, 4 days...5 days, I don't remember. I had my child. Old, old people. We didn't have a toilet. It was in the cattle cars. People were dying. People were screaming. It was smelling. You could die. You know, it was terrible. We begged a little waters from the SS. Nobody was hearing us. Nothing. So we came to Auschwitz. We came down from this...we were so happy they opened the...the cars. We came down. They start to hit us. Go there, Go there, Go there, Go there.

Everybody wanted to be with their families we should lose each each. We should be together. So I... had my child. I was young. I was really beautiful. And a man then went this side to me. He said, "Give away the child for a older lady." So I asked him why. I told my brother, "Booda, Go and ask why should I give away the baby." He...he start to look. He disappeared. You thought he went into the earth. You didn't see him. Then a second...uh...guy came. And he said, "Give away the baby." And it was almost by Mengele. It wasn't too far there. My...I used to live with my mother, so I give the baby to my...to my mother. And I hear right now (crying) how he cried, "Mommy, I want to go with you. I want to stay with Mommy." So I was by Mengele, and he told he I should go this side. My mother with my child the other side. When I heard him, and I hear him today. I hear him every single day, "Mommy, I want to go with you. I don't want to stay with Bobby." (Crying) I wanted to ran after them. They disappeared. I never saw them.

(Crying) Then they came with the people, with the young people. I had there cousins. I was crying. I wanted to go with my child. So they said, "Why're you crying. Some day, you're gonna be with him." They told us we gonna to work, and all the people with children and they go...you know, they're going to mind the children, and we're gonna

come every Sunday to see them. (Crying) But that Sunday never came. And, you know, that...then we went to...to the C lagers. I was there 3 months. And we waited to see the children. We waited to see the children. They gave us the food. They gave us a little piece of bread. I didn't want to eat it. I said, "With this little bread, I am not going to be satisfied." So every single day I put my bread and I kept it. In the night the people took it away from me. I had there a cousin, and I tell she wouldn't survive. And she saw I am not going to eat. I used to cry, and she said, "You know, Toby, I would like we should be together. You get the bread. You eat it. 1 get mine. We gonna...we're gonna share. She saw that Iam gonna die. So every...so...first of all I didn't want to. Then I said, "Okay." Then every day, the SS came and they asked, "Who is sick? Who is pregnant? They should...uh...present to them. They gonna take us revere. They're gonna give us better food. You know, so I wanted to go. I said, "I'm gonna say I'm pregnant." I wasn't, but I wanted to go to see my baby. I didn't know how I could go out from the C lager. So my brother, "Toby, you're not gonna go. You're not gonna leave me. I don't know who lives.

I want you with me." So I wanted another day. But I am gonna go to see my child. And I was 3 months in C lager. The next lager was B. There was a family camp with the Czech...Czechoslovakia people...families, husbands, wife and children. So they said, "You see, our children live. You have here next lagers, you know, families, so all the people with the children are in a different lager, so we're gonna see them. Three months after we were there and one night we hear screams and was crying and they never let us out from the...from the...when it was a transport came in. We were outside. They told us to go in...in the barracks. When the people came...when they selected the people to go to the crematorium, they didn't want we should see. We saw the fires. You know, we saw the flames until the sky. We smelled the...the...the meat...what they burned in the crematoriums. We weren't too far from there. So we didn't know what it was. So they said, the people die...old people die. You know, we don't...we don't want to make graves.

We burned the people but...uh...people, you know, alive..children, they're not gonna do that. So one day I...I met a friend. I was too...I was very...I was crying. I wanted my baby.

I was missing him very much. I wanted my mother. So she said, "Toby, I heard..." You know, she had seven children. "Don't cry. They give them white bread. They gave them milk. They gave them chicken soup. They give them chicken. They are wonderful the children." So she had seven children there. She's...so I said, "Maybe, you know." We wanted they should live. We didn't think they don't live anymore. For 6 months we didn't know what to think. We saw. We heard. We knew everything, but we didn't believe it.

We didn't want to take it in our heads. You know, people for what? What did they do the children? What do the older people? Why they should kill people they didn't do any...any harm? So after the 3 months when I was in the...the C lager. So the next day when they took out the Czech...the Czech people, the families. They took them to the crematorium.

Nobody...one was alive. So they took us to the baths in the crematorium. They selected us you know, and we went there to work. And 2 or 3 months we didn't do a thing. We went...when we went to the crematorium, so we said...we looked in the back and said, "What...what you think we're gonna come back that way? Or we gonna stay there?" When we came in in the back, the first time when we came, the first time when we came to the crematorium...so when we went in there to the...to the baths what they said we have to be clean. We shouldn't make very...the lagers and then we saw the band there. It was playing Albeit Macht Frei. It was beautiful. It was clean you know. So we went in there.

It was soldiers. So they told...they told us we should take off our clothes. So how could you take off clothes when men are there? So we went...you know, we...we didn't want to do it. So they start to hit us. And we didn't have any choice, and we did it. So the first time when I went in the crematorium I didn't see and I didn't know what's going on, but when we came back I saw already they had them...the knobs. One was for gas. One was for water. It was the same room. (Crying) Excuse me It was the same room, you know, where they kill the people, and we were in there 2 days. So for us they gave the water.

And we came back. We came to the same lager and then they selected us to go to work.

A lot of people went to, you know to the dresses...not to dresses...to all things we were fixing there. People went commando. People went trade...to make grey...you know, like...uh...to hide people, you know, bunkers...built, you know, and it was cold in the winter. We didn't...we didn't have any clothes and we didn't have shoes. They gave us shoes like from...uh...wood. You couldn't bend the feet. It was just a hole and you just...and you know when you put in the feet, the skin went up in them. The blood was running, but who cared. A lot of people they didn't...we didn't think we gonna survive. I wanted to survive. I wanted to see my baby. I wanted to see my husband. And I tried.

One day it was. We had friends, you know. We was religious. Not all of us, but a few girls was fasting. We didn't eat on that day. But one girl found a...a handkerchief, and she washed this. And she...she went, you know, there was the electric...uh...

Q: Fence.

A The fence there. After this was like this, another fence, you know, just a wire. You're not allowed to go the other side. So this wire she put on the top, you know, the handkerchief, it should dry. And I don't know what happened. A wind came and the handkerchief flew off. She went to pick up the handkerchief and she was black like she was electrics...

Q: Electrocuted.

A: Electrocuted. In...in the spot there. A lot...a lot of times I wanted to do that. I said what I have to, you know, but I thought maybe...L...I didn't want nobody should have my husband. I said I am not going to give nobody, you know, he should take away my husband. I want to survive and I didn't do it. So we went every 4 weeks when we were in the, you know, by work to take baths. And...and you know they put us in. We didn't have clothes enough. And Hungarians, the last day they didn't have material enough. So they made papers and I don't know with paper...with some things, they made materials. And they put the materials in the machines to the dis...disinfect them. You know, they shouldn't be lice or something, and the clothes didn't come out. So a lot of people had clothes. And they came to me. I didn't have...1 came home naked like my mother had me when I was born. I was 2 weeks without. I went out in a blanket. I took a blanket, you know. From where I got a dress after, I don't remember, but I got one. Maybe it was in the. I don't know who gave me and I had. Then people didn't have what to wear. They came also who doesn't have dresses, we're gonna give you new dresses. They took them out, and they never came back. They took them to the crematorium, but they didn't have room for them. Every 4 weeks they make selections. Mengele came in, and we had to strip all our clothes. We were naked. We had to pick up one hand and...uh...to...went

through..uh...Mengele to see. When you had anything on your body, a little pimple, you went in the left side and a lot of people went to the ride side. But they separated sisters.

They separated cousins, a mother from a child. It was terrible when they separated the people. One would...you know, one was running to the mother. One was running to the sister. There was a lots of confusion there, but they didn't want, you know. Even they knew they go...they didn't know they go to the crematorium. They thought gonna take us to another place. And when they took away the people, they never came back. One day was there in Auschwitz. It was in a winter day. So one person was missing. So every half hour we went to c'est l'appell. Usually we made twice a day c'est l'appell, the morning and in the evening. And one day we saw SS. They came like they were crazy. A person was missing. We were 32,000 peoples in one...uh...and see was 32 barracks, a thousand people to barrack. You know, to a... And every half hour they took us for c'est l'appell.

And they went like they were crazy. They came and who wasn't, you know...somebody was moving or something and one day, they kneeled us. We had to go on the floors and they put stones under our feet and we had to keep two big heavy stones and we didn't have a move with a eye. When you moved, they killed you on the spot. They were...they were crazy. It was about 3 days. And...and what happened a girl was sick or what. She fall asleep for 3 days and 3 nights. There was some benches outside. She was outside sleeping nobody would know. And this girl was missing. And that's why they made this...this there. And one time the, you know, they count us again and everybody was there. It was, you know...then they said, "Who was missing? Who was missing?" And they found the girl. So they gave her a, you know a whole bread and a salami. We were so jealous you know. Why she get a bread and we get a little bit of bread. A whole salami there. They told her, "Eat how much you want." After she was finished to eat, they hang her. The called us all out to see how somebody runs away what happens to them. (Sigh) And it was 6 months after I...we were there in Auschwitz so the mother from the seven children...So we were there in the crematorium...there in the bath. So there was a man. He was cleaning there. So he told me, "Toby, I go ask the man. You know, mothers, grandmothers to children came to take baths too." So I said, "You're naked. How could you go talk to a man." I was embarrassed to go. She said, "I have to find out. I want to know what's done with my children." So she went. I went to. I had a child. (Crying) So we asked him, "Tell me, when is older people come here with children to take baths." So they start to laugh, the men. They said, "You Hungarians! Dopes! You think Hitler is gonna give food for the children and after the war, you're gonna have big children.

(Crying) The children not there the first day they came with your parent. So we was very upset. I said, "No. It couldn't be. Not with 1944. It's not 1940. 1940 maybe they did it, but we don't do it anymore. I said. "Don't you see the fire. Don't you smell the...the smell.

What you think is there. This is your children. This is your parents. (Crying) So then we knew already what happened to them. (Crying and drinking water). Then we were there until January 18. In Auschwitz. I was 9 months there. January 18th, we get up. We were, you know..terrible how we slept....14 people in one bed. It was like...uh...the...three layers...

Q: Bunks.

A: Three layers. But when I came I always was on top. I was afraid to be in the middle. I was afraid to be well...the people...it wasn't too strong. It was from wood made. And one night they...they used to break, and the people they was killed. They were...the hands broken, feets broken, you know. So I always...when I came, the first I was up. I didn't want to be in the bottom, they should kill me or hit me or what. (Sigh) So January 18, they asked us we should go. We should take a blanket. They give us a whole bread, and a can with meat. This came from America. And they said we gonna evacuate. So we start to walk. It was a lot of people. I mean the whole Auschwitz ran out there. The Russians they came near. They didn't want they should capture us. So they took us further in away from them. So I always...I wasn't...uh...I couldn't say I was sick you know. I always was from the first to the fifth row. Cause when you walk you are in the back, you could never hold with the people. But in the front how much you walk the other people has to walk.

So I... was between first and the fifth always, you know. We were walking in a few...we were walking a few days but every...I don't know how many hours you walked, they gave us a little rest. We should sit. We should rest. So we rest a little, and then... And when they say, you had to be up. If you are not, you were shot. They shot people like you couldn't believe it. You know not everybody could get up. So we went a few days. We came in the night...they gave...you know, we came to a place. It was a very, very big place. It was in the winter, January. The snow was very high there. They don't clean snow like in America. Snow was snow after a snow after a snow. So they said we're gonna rest.

We're gonna sleep. So they put us outside in the snow. We sat in the snow and we just sank. We sank. You know, the snow was soft and we didn't have the blankets. We threw away already. We couldn't carry it. But the bread we kept. The piece of meat we kept.

You know, we should have. But the blanket we didn't have. And we was outside sleeping.

I mean we made a circle and we went so tight each other we should feel the warmth, you know, we shouldn't... So we fall asleep. You're gonna be surprised. The SS went away and they left us the shepherds. Big shepherds. They was our, you know, our guards. And when you were moving, they killed you in the top...in the neck. You know, when somebody was...wanted to go someplace...I mean, don't not to run away...you couldn't do it. The shepherds would kill you. So the more...I don't know how we slept, but we slept.

And in the morning, you know, who waked up...here was a piece of ice, here was a piece of ice. More of half people, they didn't survive. The heart was... They couldn't...they couldn't survive from the cold. So we walked about 5, 7 days and a lot of people was missing. We didn't take off our shoes the whole time. When we take off the shoes, they took it away from you. (Sigh) And then we thought we not gonna... We went to Ausch...Ravensbruck. So they gave us a train. But a open train. It wasn't closed...half...like a...you know the...for the...uh... It was open train. But the snow was full. You know until the...so they go with a 120 girls in a...in a...uh...

Q: Car or taxi.

A: In a carriage. So we went in there and we threw out the snow we should have room. We couldn't sit. We were standing like, you know, we couldn't move. 120 people. We went for a few days. Eat....we didn't get too much. And they had soldiers. For every car, was 4 soldiers with the bayonets and nobody should run away. So we came to Auschwitz. But there they didn't have room for us. There was...uh...uh...camp what people worked.

Q: Which camp?

A: Ravensbruck.

Q: Ravensbruck.

A: So there was a lot of people. So we came and, you know, it was January and it was beautiful, fresh snow. And you know...and we came in there in the camp and they said we should sit out that until they gonna have room where we...they should put us. So we were so thirsty. It wasn't 10 minutes you didn't think it was winter. We...the snow and the earth together...we took it like sugar...the back piece of cake and it was cleaned up. No more snow. Was summer. We were there about 5, 6 days outside. No food. Cause you didn't have food. Cause we weren't counted, you know. We weren't in the count for the food there. We didn't work there. We didn't have where to...to stay. After the Sth or 6th day, they said now they're gonna take us to a barrack. So they...they made a tent. You know what's a tent. They made a...just put in a tent in the floor there...with the snow...with the water, with the...whatever. So was no beds, nothing there. The people was sitting on the floor. There were there about 500 people maybe. And when it came to me, with my cousin and I always want to...was with my cousin, so it's no more room to go in. So we were so happy. So we said, "Oh, the people have already..." We didn't know how it's inside. We were better off outside than they inside. So they said you have to wait until you gonna have room. So we went back and we were another few days outside. And then we came. They have already room. So it was another tent, but there was a Ukrainian. He fixes, you know, he was working there. And they had little carts. They were so...the carts was like this. There was two people there. You know, one was on this side, and one was on this side. So when I came there with the...with the people...so he said, "Whatever you wanna take, you take." So I went the first... was up...I went in to "Ukraines. They wanted to kill me, but I didn't care. I was up. My cousin was there. We had a" *. We had a piece of bread, so we give it to the thing and we said, "You go with your friend, and we took her and another two Jewish people." We shouldn't be in with them. They was so rough to us.

Q: We need to break now. They're going to change the tape.

A: Okay.

Q: We're rolling. We're in Ravensbruck.

A: Oh, ya. We're in Ravensbruck now. So I was there in, you know, with the people. We gave him the bread and we changed over. You know, we should be for Jewish people and the Ukraines they should be together. But food they didn't give us. They didn't have.

Toilets we didn't have. And we were five like sisters. Five girls, my cousin and another three girls. So one girl went out every time when the...the people came with the food. She took a...we had a...a pot and she went and she took out food and she ran away. But one time they hit her. She was dead. She's dead. I mean not...deaf. They hit her so much. We

had this pot. I am gonna tell you. You excuse me. We made in there when we didn't have a toilet, and then we ate from that. We didn't have where to wash it. We didn't have where to wash even our face. And that I...1 wanted to tell you in Auschwitz every day we take...we took a shower...not a shower. It was winter. It was very cold. So my cousin she said, "Toby, we have to go wash. When we not gonna wash, you gonna die." So I said, "It's so cold. I'm not gonna go." "Please," she slapped me like something, "You have to come." We went out. It was 450 toilets. One time...one in the morning, they let us go. It was here a man, here a woman, here a man, you know. Workers. The wasn't man at all.

But the workman came in. So we sat 450 people at one time. And there was water the same thing, in a different...uh...uh...side was the water. Also about 450. So we went to wash. I opened the water. I took the water in my hands and til I brought it to my face I had ice cycles already it was so cold. But after, you know, we washed, it was...I'm high. It was so refreshing. I said, "Why do I have to do this everyday." I didn't want to do it. You know, it...it was so cold. But here our arms break. We had a different...she had a different idea. We had also in a tent. The tent was...and we was on top. And the top was snow in the tent, but there was so many people inside...more than thousand people just in the air...it was sweating the tent, and we took that water and we washed ourselves. We washed our faces. We washed our legs. Aw, we took a bath. I'm higher, you know. We were there 4 weeks. But the first 4 weeks I think was Ravensbruck. And after that came trucks and they said they gonna...they took us to work. They took us it called and it could call. There we came 500 people from our survivors. I mean the concentration camp.

And...uh...there was an air base. I don't know there was a place we came in there in the rooms. The pilots left. It...it was beautiful clean, white beds, with...we didn't see this in a long time, and it was tables and it was frena. I remember today the frena, you know, in...in plates. They were in such a rush they should go away they didn't have...give this for the...for the pilots, but they didn't have time to eat it, so they left it. And we came in.

This I will never forget in my life. Then time from that food it..it...it...you couldn't describe it. So we had there a few days, and then it came out a lady was...she was in Auschwitz. And she recognized my cousin, and she told me you take seven girls, six girls with you and we're gonna open here a you know. So she took me...I mean another five girls, we were like sisters. But the other girls...they took us we should be...we worked for the soldiers. We fixed already not for the haftling, but for the soldiers we worked there.

They didn't want we should have lice or something. There was lice. There was people.

You just...it was so much just took it like this. You know I couldn't believe it. I never saw it in my life such a thing. They were very sick people there. They took us in the kitchen.

We slept there in a basement, but it was you know not bad. Just they gave us like not...uh...it was from straw made.

Q: Mattresses.

A: Mattress. It was but it was like in a sack to push in...uh...the straw or hay. On this we slept there, but my cousin...there we had good food already. My cousin she knew how to sew. And there was the chef had 10 children. And in the night when other people slept she made for the children dresses in the night by hands. She made panties for the...for the...had a lot of children, so he gave us food. You know over there...we had toothbrushes he gave us, you know, to wash the teeth. But she...she made for him the things for the

children. And there was a revere...was a very, like a hospital, very sick people. And there I don't know I should say it or not, I was a. I used to steal, but not for myself. I took out from the kitchen potatoes. I took out beets. I took out butter. And every day when we went out the gate, they always...they...they...

Q: Examined?

A: Examined. But I...they examined like this here. But I put the food here and on the back.

And my cousin she used to cry. She told me, "Toby, you're gonna kill me cause they're gonna kill you. Don't do it. Please?" I said, "Until I could, I will help people. I don't care they gonna kill me. I wanna help people." So they...he gave us...the chef. We had a big can. He gave us every day a coffee or the...uh...the....grease (Pause)

Q: Fat.

A: No. No. No.

Q: Ferena?

A: Ferena. Sweet. I think it was so delicious and this I put in potatoes and beets. They thought it's coffee. You know they said this is. When we worked, they allowed us to take it out. But I put in their stuff. And I ran in the hospital. I left it there. And then we get the food. We had food from them. So we didn't eat the food them already from the....what they gave us. It wasn't salt...it was just water and maybe shells or something. It was just like nothing. No salt. They didn't have nothing. So we took every day. I slept. Other people about 80, 90 or more maybe. We took it out and every day after...in the night when we came back, I bring it back and I left it there and everybody they were so happy to have it, you know. And like this we were there a few months. And then we went again to Mauthausen. We went in houses then. We took food from Germans. It was already to the end you know. And we went and...uh...in Mauthausen we were there a few days. And we slept in a garage...a big garage, you know. And in the night we heard explosions, but it was such. It was trembling the whole...you know, we thought we're gonna...everything is gonna collapse. And in the morning, we were like fight on the line. We should go further. So the...the...the Americans or the Russians came. They want we should go further in. The... You know, they didn't want we should be free. So they set us five in a line and they give us packages, the owner. They gave for...for the haftling there packages.

And we waited there, you know, to...to go out the gate. And at one time the SS disappeared. You didn't see him. So we came. We took out five, four or five packages....by the people. And then the Russians liberate us. When we saw that people, we thought it's...it's God. You know? But the people said we should go away. They shouldn't put dynamite. They said he's not gonna leave us alive. So we went out in a...in a...the wood. A whole day we were there. And in the night we...nothing happened. We came back. We were there a few weeks. And there, you know, we went in...in all the houses. Whatever we wanted we took. They give clothing...to the Germans...food. They were so afraid for us. And then they took us...we were there a few days. But we was very

afraid for the Germans...for the Germans weren't so nice to the girls. I mean they didn't hit the girls, but we were afraid for different things.

Q: Yal.

A: So we went and we hide...uh...we slept in , you know, with the cows. They were there in the top, like in the...

Q: Loft.

A: In the attic we were sleeping there. In the morning, we went a little further, a little further. And I don't know we came to New Brumberg. This letter what I give to that lady, this is the New Bromberg. We came there. It was also Russian...uh...Russian people.

There was a lot of Italian people in civil you know from all the lagers...from all the concentration camps they came there. And we were afraid to go home. We could go home. We were liberated, but we were afraid for the Russians. They molested terrible the...the girls. So they said who wants to stay until there's going to 500 for Romanian people, and then they're going to give us a train special to Romania. You know we should go home. So we were there 6 months to wait for that. And then I found that guy, you know, and I told him I have brothers in America and maybe he could send me a...

Q: The soldier.

A: The soldier from Holland, you know. And he said he would do it gladly. So I gave him...I don't....you know I don't know how the mind and it was lucky but another brother was moved. You know he was...he was also there, but he was moved from that number. First of all I didn't remember it anyway, but that brother I told him I know the address and please take this and send it out.

Q: How did you happen to find this soldier?

A: This soldier. It was there...also New Bromberg. It was the same concentration...it wasn't a concentration...already from the DP. So he wanted to go home already. He was liberated.

He did...he was in the army, you know. So we, you...you know, we met a lot of people there, but he says he goes to Holland and I told him I have brothers in America. He says, "You know something? I could take a letter out for you to send it to...to your brothers." And I write him a letter but I was 6 months...uh...still there why we couldn't go home.

And then we came home. Until there, we didn't kept Sabbath. We ate whatever...you know, you're religious, but we didn't have a choice. But when we came in in Romanian, after the...after the

Q: The border?

A: The border. I said, "Now, we not going eat, and we not gonna Sabbath to go on the trains." So I came to Radiamaria. This is in Romania. So I met there some friends of mine. You know, from my town, from Mittelwischo. So they saw me, they said, "A

husband comes home. The wife is not here. Now the wife comes, the husband is not here." They knew already. I didn't know my husband doesn't live. But they knew. So another husband came home. His wife...I tell you L..I'm the only survivor. A married lady and I am alive in that town. All of them were killed. And...uh...I didn't understand then.

I...L...It didn't go to my head. I heard that but I didn't want to believe. I didn't want to think of it. So I went home first to my...to my home where I used to live in Mittelwischo.

I found there a few cousins and this pictures what I have now here I hide that pictures before I went to Auschwitz. And I forgot to tell you where I give my story. I give a lot of story there. They wanted to take my child. They begged me, "Please leave the baby with us." So I thought to myself, "He's going to eat trace. How can I leave my baby to eat trace. When I leave him there, I would have him. But I didn't want. (Crying) So the pictures I have...I have other few things, and then I went to look for my husband. And I'm in the...I was in the...in a carriage...a horse and carriage. I went to the. There we had to take a autobus, you know, a car to go to...to the Bookerwene. It was very far. So I don't know from where I had a ring. Oh, I made something like a...it wasn't real gold. It was something just...you know, like a band. So my friend said, "Why you need it. Why you wear that band?" I said, "What do you mean why do I wear the band?" And more I didn't want to ask, and she didn't say nothing. So I went to look for my husband. I went to my mother-in-law. I found her. I found all his sister and brothers. They were in...in Transista.

They suffered a lot, but they didn't kill the people there. They just...they perished there, but they didn't have food because of the cold weather. There was a brother of mine also, you know, and he survived in a Transista. I was there about 3 weeks by my mother-in- law and every day when I heard a knock on the door, I said, "Oh, Gadalia is coming." I don't know my mother knew it or not. I never asked her, you know, what happened, you know. Then I went to my brothers. I was there a few weeks, and this brothers...the younger brother...the older brother, they thought I was dead. When my friend came home and they asked, "Maybe did you see Toby?" They said, "Sure, that's where I. And they...I wasn't even with her. And she told both my brothers I am alive. She saw when they killed me. So they thought I'm dead. But when I came home from New Bromberg, I went in secret, you know, where the... is there. There I knew my sister-in-law. I went to their house, and my brother was there. When he saw me he almost fainted. He thought Iam a ghost. He knew I am dead for...for 6 months. I mean 6 months already he's home. He didn't hear anything. People came home and I didn't came home so he said I was married.

Thad...uh...uh....you know, I'm not here. He was white like a sheet. He said, "Toby, I...and he he couldn't talk." So we went in there and we talked and then I went to my brother there. And when he saw me, he also almost fainted. He took me in his hands and his " C/. | wasn't that big. Like a baby he hold me and kissed me. (Crying) I was there until I came...my brother came. He went to look for my cousin. He was a chaplain in the army.

[have also here a picture from him. So he remembered me from when I was a little girl.

He liked me. You know, they're first cousins. And he said to my brother, Please go and bring me Toby. I wanna see Toby." So he came to the Bokivina. He took me home and we wanted to go. He was in Czechoslovakia in Prockatisa. New Procka was a little village Prockatisa. And he said, "I want to see her. Please bring her." So he went home.

He was at the Shushan with my cousin and then he came home to bring me. So I came. I didn't have any shoes. There was a little coat. You know the Shushan time it was cold. I didn't have a coat. I didn't have dresses. I didn't have nothing. There was a boy. When I

went on the train, he took off his shoes. Big shoes. I remember it was with laces like, you know, with...and he said, "Toby, you take the shoes." I said, "I'm not gonna take your shoes. You don't have..." He went home without shoes. He said, "You take the shoes." And that...you know, he didn't want to hear for nothing. So we went to the train we should go to Prockitisa. It wasn't room. There we went without money. It doesn't cost anything. You know, it was free. So we didn't have room on the train. So we were in top...on the top for 3 weeks. You could go in | day. The train I couldn't believe it. And it was cold. I was crying. I thought I'm gonna die. I said, "Booda, I couldn't make it any more." He said, Please...then I knew it already my husband doesn't live. Somebody told...told my brother and my brothers wanted they should tell me. I should know. So I didn't have to wait already for him, so I went with my brother. So after the 3 weeks...we didn't eat, and I was cold. You wouldn't believe it. So we came to that lady where my cousin he was there. He knew where my cousin stayed. He came in the house and she knew my brother. Me she didn't know. So he said I am his sister. We came to see Jack.

So she said, "Jack just...they...they...he went to Germany." You know they located him from Czechoslovakia to Germany. I... started to cry. I didn't know what to do. We were hungry. I didn't see with my eyes. She put in a bread. I tell you I couldn't... Give them this on the table. With two big pots of milk and she said eat. I tell you within 5 minutes we finished everything. We was so hungry. And then we ate my brother said, "I'm gonna pay you. I'm gonna pay. I don't have money now, but you're gonna get paid." And she saw we almost fainted you know. She said, "Don't worry. She knew Jack." You know. And she said, "Don't go away. You stay here. Then it come other...a fifth place came other soldiers. And my brother was sleeping there and I was sleeping in the same room with the soldiers, but she made me with a sheet like, you know, separate....I should have my privacy. And there was...uh...American soldiers. We didn't know a word of English. They wanted to talk to us. They gave us chocolate. They gave us cigarettes. We don't...uh...smoke. I took a dictionary. I want to...you know, we should be able to...to communicate, but we couldn't. So 3-4 days we..., you know, we walk in there. And we came back. We went to. We didn't have anything. We didn't have money, didn't know what we're gonna do. We came back. She said, "Jack came." He came to pick up some mail. You know, well...and when he saw me, he...he was very happy to see me. He was crying and he asked me out from the family and he lost a lot. And we sit a few hours. We talk and he picks up himself and he said, "Now I'm gonna go." I said, "Jack, forget it.

You're not gonna go. You're not gonna leave me here." (Crying) I don't have money. I don't have anything. You brought me here. You take me where you go. I said I have to go three borders. I couldn't take it. You're a civil. He's in the army. So there was another officer with him, a very good friend. He was a Gentile. And he told him, "I don't know what to do with my cousin." He said, "It's no problem. Put her on a hat. Give her a coat.

He's a man. Give him a suit like in the army, and when we passes the borders and they gonna sleep by the borders and we have the passes whatever think you know us as not soldiers. So we went to work. It was very good. And we had to go fix the car. So we went in there. It was one thing we didn't have to go off from the car. We didn't have to be...some soldiers came out to fix it, and then same soldiers came to us and we said, "Lou, We have girls here. We drink here. We dance here. Come on. What're you gonna sleep here. I am sleeping. My brother is sleeping. You know, we're tired. We didn't wanna go, you know, with... So Thank God, we fixed the car. We passed the border, and

we are in Germany. He said, my cousin, "Now you can go and dance, Toby. You can do whatever you want. You're free." So we came to Germany. It was about 2 o'clock in the night. He had there about 5 girls he knew. Jewish girls. He knocked on the window and I have for you. Open the door. We came in. We were there a few days with them in the house and then we was there a few...I was there a long...about 2 years maybe. Yes, until I was married. 1945 until 1947 I was in Tishinroit. So we got a hotel. They gave us 2 rooms. My brother was a Rabbi there. I had my room and the...the owner gave us food but it wasn't kosher you know. A few days we ate there and then, you know, we couldn't eat it. So I made my kitchen in my house by ourselves, you know, kosher food. And whoever passes...I had people from all over who didn't want to eat tras they came to. I mean I was cooking. Was no problem. So then I found another brother. He was in...he also survived, but he lost a woman...a lady, a sister-in-law with five children. He was in Bergen-Belsen, and then we went to Bergen-Belsen. And then he came. He lived also in Tishinroit. Then he was a Rabbi. He went to Shrundas. It was not far maybe here from Ravensbruck, Munich, and it wasn't far from there. So I said, "I will never get married." Well, I...I was...I don't know I was jealous...I hated men and children. I really couldn't look at them. I was...I was...Now I want to say...then I didn't. I was...I was very hurting and I was jealous you know. And...uh...I said I will never get married. Well, a husband like I had I couldn't have and a child I don't have, but my sister-in-law, you know, the he drives the she got a first child. And she broke her bone, by the pelvis and she had to stay 8 months in bed. She shouldn't move even. The doctor explained when you break a foot, a hand, you put it in a cast, but you couldn't put...uh...so she had to lay for 8 months. So I had the baby...she had a so when this child start in the morning to talk, she was a beautiful girl. I...1 thought I'm gonna die. I wanted a child. You know, until then I didn't.

By then I wanted so much I thought I am gonna die. I want a child. I couldn't have a child. I'm not married. So the brothers said for 2 years I should get married. I had a lot of boys...proposed...want me, but I said no. But then L...not this child I don't think it would go so. So then my...my brother went to a...to a convention and he saw my husband. This was. And, of course, I all ready and they said, you know so. Then I decided I want a child and I got married. And thank God we married for 43 years. I have a wonderful husband. I had five children. Etty is the oldest. Then I had another girl. This I had in Germany. Then I came to America in 1950. We had plenty before we came to America. We couldn't came here so fast. So they tell me, you know, I had brothers here. I'm gonna be the first in America. But it take 5 years from 1945 until 1950. So in Germany we saw we couldn't...we couldn't come. So we went to Paris. We were there 18 months and then my husband didn't make a living. And my brothers here didn't have...I don't know. I wrote them a letter we don't have anything. I was pregnant and we couldn't survive. He didn't work. You know, strangers couldn't work in Paris. So we were there...he took...he came before, and he took a room with his brother and I was pregnant with Etty. When they...and took a hotel...when they knew I'm pregnant they would never take em, but they didn't see me. So when I came, they saw me with a...you know, they said, "Oh, you couldn't live here. You gonna have the baby. You're not allowed to have the baby in the hotel. You have to go to a hospital and then after the baby's gonna cry. There's a poor section. I couldn't afford to be in some so they said, You have to move. People work and they...the baby's gonna cry and you couldn't be here." So the baby...nobody...she was such a baby...she never cry. In the morning I used to come out in the corridor, you know,

in the...so they saw a baby...said, "What you do with the baby? She never cries."

Uh... You know, I used to nurse her. Whenever she was crying I and she was alright. And we were there a few months and my husband we didn't have from what to live. So he start to bring people from Vienna to America and he make passport and he brought over people and...uh...

Q: He brought...he brought them to Paris or to Vienna?

A: To Paris. To Paris. And you know from the...there from the hotel, they knew every day when he went, where he went. I don't know how. And we had there a friend. He was Jewish. I thought he was a directress. And one day he tells me, "Toby, you're gonna have trouble. You have something in the house. Give it out. Well...uh..-you know, they catched... He brought a Hungarian family to America. And they wanted a sewing machine to bring. Without a sewing machine would be alright. The machine wouldn't come in the plane. So they send the machine. So when we went to pick up the machine, they asked him, "How did you bring the machine." First he didn't want to tell then said... I wasn't a evening so that guy told me when they're gonna call on the phone don't let...leave your husband to go down. You come down. I came down. They made a mistake. They didn't mean me. So 2 minutes later, they're telephoning us again. I come down. Not me. So maybe...a hundred times they rang whole night and he didn't go while I... So it was 6 in the morning. They knocked on the door. They came in, and they took him out. They hit him, and then I had to go to the bathroom. The soldiers...no, the policemen came with me in the toilet. They thought I shouldn't throw away some things or something you know. And we were there a few days and...uh...it was a...you know, " you know.

Q: She asked you to do it in English.

A: No. No. I mean I talk I don't see.

Q: Good. Talk

A: Yal. So..uh..they hold us for a few days there. But there was a Jewish man there. When he came in, he hit him, and then he told them I had to do it for you what he begged him, you know, we have a child. I was pregnant. And, you know, so he said, "Look. I give you..." It was Sabbath. We should run out from Paris. Sabbath, you couldn't go. You know, we don't travel Sabbath. So he said I give you 12, 48 hours and we should disappear. So she was 18 months old, so we came to Germany and then we changed a visa. And we were in Belgium. We were in...until we came to Germany again. And there we was until 1950 and then we make...we came here to America. And here in America was also not so easy. We worked very hard. I had five children, beautiful five and (pause) I lost others. In 26 years she was married 6 years. We went to Florida for the vacation for the first time in 26 years. We never took any vacation. We worked very hard me and my husband. And my daughter she...she had a husband. He supposed to go for Sabbath, but he couldn't make it then. So we took two rooms. So we came | o'clock in the night. And the...there in the hotel, they didn't have two rooms. They said maybe your daughter could

sleep with you until her husband comes, then they're gonna give her a different room. So they put in a cot, and they had a...air condition high in the ceiling. They took off all the knobs. They made the air conditioning so cold you couldn't adjust it, and the air conditioning went on my daughter a whole night. She catched a cold. And she got...uh...asthma...or bronchitis. She was coughing. She was coughing. Then the people said, "Call a doctor. See what it is." So a doctor came, gave her a needle and he killed her. And we brought her home in a box so flat. It's still tears. (Crying) And since then I was different. I'm not the same person. I lost a lot of my life (Crying). And then I have another son. He should be well. I went to the country. He was fine. He was everything. I went away. Eight days later, they called me up. "Yonki doesn't feel good." So I said, "What happened." He never was sick. He was always a healthy child. He is married.

About 19 years got married. Has four children and has a beautiful wife...a wonderful.

She's lovely. She's 30. They try. You know she's very good to him and she called me up. I talked...I talked with my son. I see something is not...the first word he told me, "Hi Ma." I said, "Son, what's happen to you." So he tells me, "I don't feel good." He's coughing. He's coughing. "What's the matter. Go to a doctor." He never went to a doctor. She's a nurse...my daughter-in-law. Whenever he had a cough or something, she gave him something. That's it. But now he went to a doctor and they find out he has leukemia in the..in the bones. I was in...in bed and my daughter calls me up, "Something is wrong with the blood." I said, "What's the matter?" "Yonki's sick." So I...we went...came back from the country. She called all my children. She's a nurse and thank God she...she made...she called up Seattle. She went to Seattle, Washington, in that...in a hospital. She called up all my children. They took blood test and one son, Thank God, he wasn't married. He was exactly the same match. And Thank God he went to Seattle. He went through a lot. He was 8 months there. And they changed him...they make him a transplant. Thank God. Thank God. And that's...that's my story. I have more stories, but I think.

Q: Do you have anything else you want to add. There's probably about 10 minutes of the tape left.

A: Before I remembered. You know a little I forget you know. Not...I want to do something.

I don't do it right away it...something blocks.

Q: Linda was asking me to ask you about the singing in Auschwitz .

A: I couldn't do it.

Q: Just tell us about it.

A: In Auschwitz, you know, the people weren't too happy there. So every day there was thousand people in my barrack...in all the barracks. It was 500 on one side, 500 on the other side. In the middle they had like a...it supposed to be a...uh...to give us heat, you know...uh...

A: Furnace.

Q: Furnace. But it was... went up on the top there and I used to go and I used to sing every...every day. I used to sing happy songs. I used to sing not so happy songs. People were laughing. People were crying. And...uh...now I couldn't do it. I wouldn't. Since my doctors....it everything went away from me.

Q: You said that an SS man wanted to hear you sing.

A: He came in when I used to sing. I mean he came at one time and I knew them.

Q: You're talking again Yiddish. Speak English.

A: I'm sorry. He came in. I used to sing a song then just of the Germans. How they took together all the people in the ghettos and then they send them to Auschwitz and then they killed them. And I sang...he wanted just...this I sang when he came. I didn't know he's out. He heard me and then he came in and he said, I should sing it again. So there was...uh...you know, a kapo. She came. She said, "How could you do it." "What can I do?" He wants I should sing you know, so I sang. And then she stopped me in the middle.

She didn't let me finish it. And then they made me...the...you know...and I remember it.

So he wanted I should sing there for him too. I says now you could sing. I was crying.

My hand was bleeding. My hand was swollen. And I should sing for him. I said now I couldn't sing. No. (Sigh) I wanted to say something... I couldn't remember.

Q: Is there anything else you'd like to add or...

A: I don't know, you know.. I left out things, you know. that...

Q: Tell me what you left out.

A: From Auschwitz, I don't remember what I wanted to say.

Q: That's all right. Thank you very much.

A: Ihave... have...I...1 went through a lot. This I know. And how I survived like this I really don't know. This is one thing. But Thank God I have a wonderful husband. I have 14 grandchildren. And they keep me going.

Q: Good. Linda's going to come in and we'll hold up the photographs and she'll ask you to identify the different photographs.

A: I'm sorry. I wanted something. It was very...something and I don't remember what. In Auschwitz.

Q: If you...if it comes back to you while you're doing the photos we can stop it and then you can tell them again. You did very well. You spoke very clear. Very animatedly.

A: I tell you the truth. I didn't think I could do it.

Conclusion of Interview.