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MIRIAM FARCUS INGBER October 30, 1989

Q: Would you tell me your name, and when and where you were born?

A: (Sigh) My name is Miriam. Uh...I was born Miriam Farcus, you know, but now it's Miriam Ingber. I was born in Terava--a small town, Terava. It's...it's T-E-R-A-V-A, Tereva...uh...in 1931, July 24th. Uh...We were 10 children. Did I do it right?

Q: Yes. That's fine. Tell me about your family.

A: Okay. Well, ..-uh...we were...my father, mother also got married very young and we lived in Terava. Uh...My father was...uh...uh ...you know...uh...he was buying, selling...uh...horses, cows, used to go on the market and you know, did business that way. And we were not...uh...we were very....we were poor. He had 10 children, 5 brothers, 5 sisters.

But...uh...we managed, you know, and made that...those...those days very comfortable the way we did. We used to get a...uh...dress. Each girl got a dress at Passover or the High Holidays, twice a year, and we were very happy. That's the way I growed up, you know, in this small town which I remember a little bit about it, but whatever I remember it was good things. Poor. One...one sister came in, took off the shoes, another sister put it on. (Laughing)

But it was alright. And...uh...and...uh...

Q: Was there a large Jewish population?

A: Yes. Yes. Large Jewish population and also, you know, with ...uh...Christians. We lived together. You know, they used to...I come from a very orthodox family. My mother wore a shitel you know. And...uh...every Saturday, they came and made fire in the house, you know, and father was very religious. And...uh...it was quite a bit...quite a lot. bit the...the Christians lived down in the hills more you know then...uh ...than where the Jewish people lived. They used...used to go up on the hills more than in the things. But...uh... like I say back home, one child raised another you know. That's the way we were brought up. You have to take care of each other.

Q: Tell me about the school.

A: Uh...Not much. Not much. Maybe 2, 3 grades. I...uh...I was very in...uh...I was about...uh...6 years old...uh... there was a...uh...sickness going around in the town, you know, typhus...uh...dysentery. I don't know. It was...uh... uh...lot of people died then. So I got the...the...you know, the sickness. My brother and I...my brother didn't have it so bad, but I had it very bad which...uh...the doctor didn't believe I'm gonna survive. I was laid up for a long time, you know, and then when I did survive after my father went...uh...somewhere into...to Hungary, and he brought some kind of special medicine and I did survive. I had to learn starting scratch to walk and talk, you know, and all those things. So...uh...not much schooling. No. [ hate to say, but I wish but not much. So...uh...

Q: Did you have many friends?

A: Yes. [had a lot of friends. We used to play outside you know. Jump rope and...and wintertime, we...uh...I skate there in the....Goddess you know, when it was frozen. Yal. I had a lot of friends. Also, we used to help out in the house, you know. Uh...Help raise the little ones or do chores for my...my mother or you know, take care...used to wash the dishes and ____ the dishes, ___ the dishes you know, and busy around the house, but every Saturday afternoon, we used to go out playing and we played whenever we had a chance.

Q: What were the relations like between the Christians and the Jews?

A: Good. Very good. They were so good that my...mine father, he used to come into the house...my father did business, and we used to buy milk from them and...uh...every time they came, they always hug each other. My father with them. They were my father's friends. We were the best relationships you ever saw in your life which I could not understand afterwards. So...uh...when the thing came, start the...[ mean they took out the Czechs...Czechs...you know, the Hungarian took over Czechoslovakian, and they took out the Czechs. They just did to the Czechs the same thing they did to the Jews. In 19339, all the Czechs were evacuated and the Hungarians took over. Uh...That time the problem started the Jews in 1939. They took away mine...half of the town, almost the whole town, Jews already to...uh... Poland...Poland, Ukrainian, my father's whole family. He had a lot of brothers and sisters and my grandparents, they all was taken away. We wanted to...they were going to take us too, but my father was in labor camp of the Hungarian. And my mother went into hiding and we were just walking around on the streets, you know, the kids. That time where we started the problems.

Q: Tell me a little more about that. What...what do you remember? How did it begin to change?

What do you remember?

A: Uh...It was terrible. It was terrible. It was just awful that time the way the....uh... Hungarian came in and you know, and they start putting all the Jews on the big...uh ...uh...trucks, you know, and...uh...everybody saw what...the way they were beating up and...and. I was...it was terrible. And so my mother, she should rest in peace...she...and my father was...was in the labor camp, so somehow, I don't know. They don't touch that, but my mother was in hiding all the time. She just...she had...she had a feeling that what they going to do with the Jews, you know, and she...I don't know what...and she had a fear and they killed all, almost all the whole town Jews then. But the one...the little bit who stayed behind, the...uh...in 1940, they start taking away. Well, in 1940...uh...when the...the whole thing started more, the Jews...was after Passover....I was...I was very...I got sick again. I had...uh...I developed pneumonia, was very sick. So took all the Jews. They came to the house and...uh...they saw I was with a high temperature. I was very sick, so the...the...German...the Hung...the police, they brought a doctor and the doctor said that...uh...I'm not going to survive long. I'm not going to live that long. He should leave me die in...in my bed. So...uh...instead, they took my father, the rest of the children to the ghetto and they left my mother home with me I should die. So she should bury me. So everybody was gone. And my mother... uh...she knew. She, like I tell you, she had feeling that they're gonna kills us. They're gonna kill us. They're gonna kill all the Jews.

They're gonna kill us all. So she decided that we had saved up some money. She paid for this .uh...uh...Christian...uh...to come and bring a horse and buggy and take us up to the hill, you know, to hide us out. On Saturday night, I remember we came down like middle of the night...middle of the night, and they put me on because I...I was very weak and with my mother and they took us to the hills and they put us up in a...on top of the barn, you know the barn. Sunday morning, just like a...can never forget it as long as I live, Sunday morning it was cold you know after a rainy day. It was right after Passover. It was...uh... uh...very miserable outside, Fall, and there was a lot of Jews hiding out in the woods, you know, there in the hills. So...uh...where we were staying, hiding, there was girls you know, girls, and they were...uh...had boyfriends. So Sunday morning the boys came to visit the girls. And the Jews came out from out of the hills to...to sit on the sun to warm up. They were freezing. They were cold. They were wet. So they were sitting under the trees, under the sun, and we could, you know, on the top of the barn where...where there was, you know, between the woods you could see. So when they...they came to visit the girls, they noticed that Jews are hiding or sitting there. So they went and they took a piece of wood, you know, long thing, you know, wood. Went up and they were killing all the Jews, beating on them and killing. And those horrible screams. It still is in my ears. Those screams. Please...they begged. They were screaming. There was a lot of children and crying and screaming. It was just unbelievable.

Unbelievable! So I told my mother...I start feeling a little better. I said to my mother, I said, "Look, whatever is going to happen, it all...my father and all rest of the family and all the rest of the Jews has to happen with us. We're not staying here. We have to go down. We have to go. We have...otherwise, they're going to kill us like....you see what's going on. Those kids...those screaming, those crying. They killed them to death." So the next day, we decided we gonna volunteer go down into the town, walk down to the town. Uh...I was very weak so my mother said...uh...whoever asked us where we're coming from...uh...she's bringing me from the hospital...and there was a hospital in another town. So slowly, slowly, you know, we walked down and took us hours, but I...I had to rest because I was very...uh...nobody would have anything to do with Jews. So one time we stopped exactly like I said with my father how they lived...lived together. We lived...they lived liked brothers. So...uh...sit down on his front, you know, the steps where you into the house. At least my mother...my mother carried a few stuff, a few things on her back, you know, blankets, some clothes. She carried some stuff with her and he...he came out with a piece of wood and he said...uh...he took that stuff from my mother and he said, "You're not going to use...be able to use that. They're going to kill you...before I kill you. Let..". So he wanted ...uh...you know, kill us, beat us up.

He said, "Don't...I want...I don't want to see you here. Don't sit here. He wouldn't let us sit." So we had to walk further. That's..that's why I...every time I remember, you know, I say that...uh..how you live together with friends and everything, but your best friend was your worst enemy. And it's true. And so we finally came down, walked down to town and there was a train coming with the rest...some more Jews. And we went up on a train and they took us to...uh...ghetto, and not the same ghetto where my father was with the children. Different ghetto. We never saw each other. (Sigh) Took us to ghetto. Was the Hungarian ghetto, and...uh..it was terrible there. There was this Hungarian policeman. He went and they throw down a 50 cent piece, you know, on the floor and then picked it and went around and asked who threw this money away, and beat everybody who was...he could lay a hand on. Beat up everybody with a stick, you know. Everybody who could...who could just be there close by him, he beat him up. And my mother got beaten up terrible. "You threw the 50 cents down." My mother said, "No." So he gave her over her face that...uh...blood start pouring you know.

So we were there...uh...about 6 weeks in that ghetto. And then...then they start taking us to Auschwitz, put us in those trains you know, and those...uh...you know what they take the cows.

Q: Cattle cars.

A: Cattle cars. Right. Put...uh...so much people that you couldn't even breath in the train and throw them out you know. (Sigh) And everybody just... they knew, those Jews. They knew that...those crying, those praying, praying and scream to God. Why? Help us my my prayer .

So...uh...lot of people died from heart attacks and was dead by the time they got to...to Auschwitz. We arrived in Auschwitz and...uh...train stopped. So I was, like I say, I very, very...you could see on that picture, young, little weak and you know, very sick for a long time, pneumonia. And you have to live. You live so anyway, we arrived to Auschwitz and...uh...took us...it was some Jewish people came up the train and said to us, "Whatever we do, don't say that we are sick or weak or sick. Don't volunteer that...uh...we are sick." We didn't know what he meant, but...uh....so anyway all everybody came off the train and...uh...we had to leave everything on the train. Naked. You know. They took over all the clothes, everything. Naked. And you stand in the line and Mengele was sitting there, Dr.

Mengele they called him. And...uh...left, right, you know, all the...all the...announced every young woman should take the baby, give their children to the elderly, to the mother, to the elderly people. So that's what the people did. Every child was gone to the...to the mother, to the you know, and to the left, and to the right, to the left. You know there was not...the Gestapos, and the....and to the right, to the left. | was with my mother and...uh...he separated us and he put me to the left and they put her to the right. She was only 39 years old. She was a young woman. So...uh...then when he came in the line, you know, Mengele. He said...uh...he said...on Germany, he talked to us, ....if we are healthy, if are sick, or something, is sorting out. He talked so nice, so soft, you know. So (sigh) we passed that. We said, "No, we're not sick," and all of a sudden I talk a look. My mother's there next to me again. I tell you...I don't know, a miracle cause I couldn't survive without her. So then...uh...you know, they put us in a...in a...took us in a big building and they cut our hair from the top, bottom and and those screaming. Nobody recognized each other. You don't recognize your mother. Your mother didn't recognize you, and after we came out from that place, we stayed..uh... c'est l'appell, they called it c'est l'appell,..-uh...to 5 women in the line and...uh...they count us and they took us to the...to the , you know the barracks to...uh...called a lager. That was in our lager, my mother. So we got in there and I...uh...I got very weak. (Sigh) I got so weak that and all the ____, with all the problems I was lucky to...cause the...the man, you know who took care of . The ___, the Gestapo did. She was...uh...from Czechoslovakian and she was very sweet. She was very good to me. If not her, I wouldn't survive because...uh...when they came to count you, they looked at you and they took you out of there and put you right away in the gas chambers. So she somehow put two...two...uh...split up the people so that I should stay in and start, you know, what I mean.

She always left me out behind so I should...I should survive. I was lucky that way...that, you know. L...uh...I was there and my mother ...uh...a piece of bread that they gave us every 2, 3 days there in Auschwitz. And she didn't eat, but she fed me with it so I should, you know, pull myself together. And...uh...then...uh...(sigh) how much she tried, you know, to be nice to you, but it was not...she was afraid too, you know. She...everybody...everybody was for their own skin there. Everybody tried to survive. It was just terrible. You have to go to the bathroom they...they beat you up. They chopped your head off. They...it didn't mean nothing.

It just didn't mean nothing. So we...uh...we saw, you know, we saw that the screaming...we saw that the crima...crimatorium. They took us one day to see...to the crematorium and they told us, "If you're not going to behave, whatever we tell us to do, we should it. If this Gestapo wants to sleep with you, you better let him sleep with you. Otherwise, you see, the flames," he said. "There you're going be in the flames." So everyday they took us there.

Every day. Everyday and there you could see all the horrible, horrible things. Our...I don't know the manager and what she took care of us there, she said, "The minute there's a...a group that's leaving Auschwitz, I want you to be the first one because you're not going to survive here long. In Auschwitz, it's...it's the worst...uh...uh... crematorium, the worst, so I'm going to put you on the worst...on the first." Uh...We were in Auschwitz 3 months. After this...uh...they...they put together....uh...a transport, you know, and they took us to ...uh...to Stutthof. I don't know if you heard about it. Stuffhof. Yal. And when we got to Stuffhof, it was terrible. It was awful. It was...day by day, we wished, "Why are we...why are we not...you used to see a cat going behind the...the barbed wire you know. We used to thought, "God why didn't you made us a cat or a dog or a worm. Why couldn't I be a worm. Why do you have to be a human being? You used to...you put us to the, you know, threw us...threw the people to...uh...the barbed wires and...and they got electrocuted right there and died.

And...and crawls...there was a man...man...uh...in a man's barracks and winter and it was cold. Naked, they made him run around in the snow up to here, naked, and beat him up and same thing they did to the woman. (Sigh) We were just there...uh...there for a long time and sitting by the barbed wires and every day, they...they came in and they just beat us up, beat us up. They were...they brought the food, you know, that little no-good food. Uh...When you stand in the line with that plate to get some food...uh...you...you look ...uh...uh...don't look straight or you look afraid or you think is no good or this, and you just got beaten up. You just got beaten up or they took you...took you out from the camp and took you to the gas.

It's...just like that was nothing...mean anything. So we was sitting there and by the sand on the...on the outside and praying and crying and screaming, "God, help us. God, help us. Let us die, you know, without..." So all of a sudden, after the...quite a few months, I don't know exactly much...uh...how long we were there...uh...they came and...uh...they told us they're taking so many woman now to...to work, you know, to...uh...landscaping work. So when we heard that everybody who want...who we knew that going to work is gonna live, survive.

And every...every day, you stayed in the camp. You have no chance. You didn't have a chance to survive. So you should see what's...what's going on. Everybody was jumping through the...through the windows and through the doors to be the first to register to go to work, you know. People killed each other. People, like I say, your life wasn't...didn't mean nothing. Everybody wanted to survive. And...uh...it just...everybody on his own. So they took us...uh...they took us away to landscaping and we were, you know, ...uh...digging out potatoes and according 6 weeks. It took us 6 weeks. Uh...It wasn't so bad. Wasn't so bad so at 6 weeks after we finished the landscaping, they took out a thousand woman... thousand woman, they took us there. They took us...they brought us back to ...to Stutthof. They brought us back to Stutthof. It was terrible. Was...uh...uh...going around also typhus, you know, and sickness and...uh...more and more people got...uh...if it came such a death that came that nobody had a chance. And we were just waiting for our death, you know, any minute. One night...uh...one night, you know, there was a girl in our barrack and top...I was always on the lowest. All the way on the top of the bed...bed, there was a girl and she must have had epilepsy, you know, and...uh...middle of the night she got probably a seizure. That's what we come to and she...uh...threw herself down to the floor and it got such a panic inside that they thought...and they came in to kill us. It screaming the dark. It was yelling and screaming and then...uh...the Gestapo came in and put on the lights and...uh...start shooting on everybody. And he made us, you know, hundred times, made us jump, punish us. Say one...one for all and all for one, you know. They made us...uh... jump out the window, jump in the window, jump out the window, jump in the window. Uh...I said to my mother, I said...uh..."I can't go on like this." Says, "I am going to kill myself. I'm going to do it. Touch the wires and I'm gonna kill myself because I can't go on, can't take it." And my mother said to me, she said...uh..."Let's wait." You see, she believed...she believed that...that we're gonna be saved. She believed we gonna survive. She believed we're gonna survive. (Sigh) So...uh...it was the most horrible night you ever can imagine in your life. Then...uh...the next day I tried to kill myself. I went to the wires, you know, next to the wires close by and this...uh..Gestapo, this SS came and saw me and grabbed me and...uh...gave me...uh...25, you know, over mine...uh... I had to lay down in a chair and he gave me 25 with that rubber thing. (crying) The worst thing you can imagine in your life. (crying) My mother tried to...uh...help me so they did the same thing to her. That was even worse. (crying) So...uh...then 2 days later... don't know how I survived, but I survived. A terrible beating! It was awful. I couldn't move, you know. I couldn't, but you try to because otherwise you...they put you in the gas chambers. You didn't have a chance, you know, so you try to survive...to feel, you know, strong and be that you are able to...to move and able to work if you wanted to live. So your...your...uh...power, you know, to survive. My mother for me and me for my mother. You know what I mean. So anyway...uh...2 days later, we heard that they're taking out 12...they're going to select 12 strong girls to..uh...the strongest one....uh...to work, you know, make those...uh...dig those graves where the soldiers hide. How you call?

Q: Trenches.

A: Trenches where the soldiers. They're gonna select thousand woman and take them to...to that work, do those trenches. So don't ask. Everybody wanted to go to work. Nobody wanted to stay behind. And everybody was again running and pushing and was going on so when the...when they stayed in the line, they select you, they put you in a bath. They give you a bath and...and...uh...put you man's clothes, pants, heavy because it was wintertime. Heavy clothes on and belt. You stayed in the line. My mother and I, we were holding hands and we tried to...see you have to register your number, everything. And...uh...we begged those girls in front to let us through because my mother we should be together. We registered. We told them the number. We told them the name, but somehow and we went in. No...uh...we told them everything, but when we came...this was just for registration, you know, from...one Gestapo registered you. The next one looked you over. So they don't like us. They took us away. But three blocks, they took us away, you know, close to the gas chambers. So my mother said, "We have nothing to lose," she says. "We're going to die anyway. Let's run away back to the...to the line." "Okay." We run away back to the line and we asked those...they should let us through. Please let us through. We cried and let us through. We should run into the...to the barrack so there everything was changed so they might not recognize us...uh...anymore so we'd be able to go work. And we ran into the barrack and...uh...we put us...they dressed us like men, you know, and when we came out from the barrack, guess what? Those woman, there was...she was a Gestapo woman, she recognized us, and she told...uh...the...the Gestapo, she said, "Here. These are the ," and took on the side. He says...and he starts you know beating me up and my mother and why and we start begging him and pleading with him and he said, "No, you go on...you go on to be ashes soon." And...uh...my mother, she begged him. She fell on her knees and she said, "Please, I am strong and my daughter. We want to go to work." And she...she...uh...fall on her knees and grabbed the Gestapo with...with her feet and...uh...you know, like stopping him and (crying) and begged him to let us through. We..we...he should see that we tried to go to work, that you know, and so he gave my mother a...you know, with his boots...uh...and grabbed us and slapped us and then... don't know, like God must have changed his mind, you know. I tell you it's (crying)...he stopped in his ____ to wanta see if we...if we had did something wrong. If they registered. We were lucky. We registered. So he let us through.

Went to work. It was...uh...took us on a train. It was...uh...I don't know. I was no where. Was just no where. Snow was up to here. The...you put up your own tents, you know, tent...and...uh...you start digging ditches, you know, things. The next day it was nothing...was snow so you couldn't...you could not...uh...see nothing. You couldn't do nothing. You was frozen to death. If how much you been froze to death, they threw there with the gun and, you know, so they...they just freeze. The snow was higher. We would drown in the snow. We were there and at night, you know, we were cold. We were hungry.

We used to...uh...anyway, they used to...during the daytime, you know, they brought some...

uh...food in those big, big cans like you used to carry milk and they used to bring some water, food, you know, some soup or things. Every time the...uh...whoever they asked to go and put the cans back on that wagon they let...let you lick it out because you were so hungry.

So we had one Gestapo....what I mean...he was the biggest murderer and he had one arm, you know. He...he carried with him a stick. It was this big, and he was a murderer. He was horror. He beat. He hit. So...uh..one afternoon, we were freezing. We were cold. We were standing in the line, you know, getting that little junk, and after we finished he said...uh...points out the red scarf. I wore a red scarf so I thought he meant me...uh..should come and for the...the cans on the wagon. So I went...and I know he meant me, but, you know, I went there to the wagon. So he came towards me and he picked up that big stick, but I start running you know. I start running and I slipped and 1 ...I fell down. He hit me behind here the head. (Sigh) That stick! I fell down. I didn't know for days where I was. For days, I didn't know where...I was had...still have a mark, you know. Uh...Then I had ringing...ringing in my ears. So...uh...we were there, you know, working. How much we worked...we digged out those things and at night, we went in their tents and we was hungry and...uh...one girl find out that not far from here, there was...uh...those..uh... farmers. Farmers and back in Europe they used to...uh...put away for the spring, potatoes and they're in...under the ground you know. That's what they used to do in Europe. Potatoes, all kind of vegetables, you know, keep them for the...for the year. So that one...one girl...I don't know how she did.

She find out that there was a...a place that is...you dig out potatoes and...uh...some start...I don't know...a lot of girls start...uh...going out there and...uh...they brought back some stuff to eat and what do you think? They caught them. It was about 10 girls, and they caught them and they put them outside naked at night, and they asked everybody should come out and they took the machine gun and sounds like this. That's it. Then they took just anything girl.

They hanged her. They hanged her up for nothing to show that if...if they...if this is gonna...if this is gonna happen again, that's gonna happen to us. So...uh...we were there 3 or 4 months, you know. One night my mother, we just went out and my mother said...uh...it was snow. It was terrible cold. And went out and with my mother and I, we were talking and she says...she went out...there was the sky, you know, cold but she said...came back in, she said to me, she said...uh... (sigh) she...she saw a hand. God showed that a hand that she is going to survive. (Crying) Yal. Sure. (Crying) (Crying) I wish she would. Anyway, so she...we were there about 3. 4 months. After that they took us back. Whatever we left from us, they took us back to Stutthof again. And it was even worse than we...before we left. It was terrible. Terrible! Everybody was there skeletons. And it got so bad that...uh..._people died from typhus. Uh...People started... It was just terrible. Nothing to do. Just what's gonna happen, it's gonna happen. We stayed and...uh...months again in Stutthof and all of sudden they start...uh...evacuating us, you know. Uh...We...they start, you know, everybody who was able to walk, evacuating us to another camp. Then we started just walking, you know, at night...just at night, at night we were...they walked us, Gestapos, on the highway, you know.

And...uh...you got to...uh...a camp, got to another camp. It was...the name was something. I don't remember. And these Gestapo, you know what he beat me up. He...he said to me, "I haven't...uh...token care of you yet enough, so he took me in a barrack and...uh...but some electric wires on my head, you know, and...uh...did experiments on me. My head!

(Crying) And he made my mother watch what he was done to me. (Crying) So survive! I'm here. But...uh...my head didn't survive. I mean I have a lot of problems there. My hair never grow back. (Crying) The experiments I was there. I was unconscious, my mother says, for a long, you know. And...uh...after I...uh...1 came to, my mother made sure that, you know, I'm...I'm gonna be all right. A mother. So...uh...they start evacuating that camp too. I guess, you know, the Russians...uh...came closer by and they start taking us in different camps, you know, different camps. So we used to, you know...uh...evacuate. At night, walking the streets and not sleep, and it was cold and we were hungry. And the sight, you know, of the...on the things...the dead people, so many deaths. You would not believe it. Uh...we...we were so hungry. We used to see garbage you know, garbage, and there was cans that the soldiers throw away. They were rusted from sardines or tuna fish, you know, any kind of cans, and we used to kill each other over a can. Who's gonna lick...lick, get...grab it first, and...and lick it out. Uh...It was...we ate whatever garbage we could find on the streets. Potato peels or any garbage. Any garbage! We...we were terrible starving. We were hungry. We were tired, and people just died like flies. Couldn't make it. So we were walking and walking and days and nights and walking and walking and at night, you know...uh...we stopped. The Nazi's stopped and we went in somewhere...who knows...and they...they just, you know, all of the people lay on the...you know, on the ground there and we pulled ourselves together, you know, like this, and we was like this, you know, one on top of the other warming up and we tried to sleep a little bit til they came out and took us further. And that's how it went. For two weeks, we went like this. Finally...uh...we found a barn on the...in of the woods, you know a barn. (Sigh) They took us in there, 5000...5000 women, put us in that barn which there was no room, but that's like herring, you know. They put us all in there and....uh...people grow together. You know, the legs under you, the...you couldn't move. You could not move. So that way, they...they sit you down, that's the way you...uh...were thrown together. Your legs under you, you know, attached. You couldn't straighten out. Put us in there, and the Gestapos were around us, the barn there and...uh...once every other day, they used to bring something you know, for...like not live or not to die, you know, every other day. We were there about 7 months or 8 months, we were there...that barn, and it was terrible. It was awful. It was worst.

People died and the lice...you had so much lice. And my mother...my mother from laying, you know, around there (crying), she...she just gotten eaten up by the bugs you know. It was nothing til the bones left and her...uh...(crying) mind was left. Everything else was eaten up, chew up. She was nothing but, you see, on the...on the television...sometimes they show you those skeleton, those heads, the bones. (Crying) She was laying. The mind was clear all the time that she was sick. I was...I had typhus. People died. People died like...like nothing, like...there was nothing left practically to the end there. It was so bad that...uh...like I say, the lice ate you up alive. Even...and there was nothing wrong with you, you had nice in your mouth and...and everywhere and they...they practically carried you from one place to the next. That's how bad...(Crying) We were there (crying) as I say approximately, you know...exact the dates I...1 don't remember, but we were there a long time and...uh...by the end, my mother...I was...I.... could...1 was okay the last minute. I used to go out and bring her some snow, you know, and rub my mother on the lips and help...help her, but (sigh) (crying) she...she was so strong til the last minute (Crying) til she got eaten up by those...skeleton.

No food. No nothing. Then...uh...to the end, we got free there. I mean...uh...the Russian came, you see. We got free by the Russian, which we didn't know. It was maybe 50 girls...50 people who survived there to the end. Uh...We didn't know we were free, you know. Nobody knew nothing. Everybody who was alive laid there like a...uh...like just like before. Laid and wait to die. The thing should go out. (Crying) (Sigh) See the Russian when they freed us, if they would've come in and take everybody out, you know, like a child. If they would've come and take my mother out, she would have survived. They never came in...inside the barn. Who was able to go out were...ran out and they put in...and who wasn't able to go out stayed there. So...uh..we left behind. We were about 10 girls left behind. And...uh...I remember I...J had such a high fever...uh...and...uh..you know, and I was screaming to my mom, "Mom, help me. The lice are eating me up alive." I was, you know, all of a sudden you wind up one and somewhere in nowhere. You were crawling, you know, and I was crying to my mother to help me, help me. Help me because the lice are eating me up and the lice are taking me away. Then...uh...uh...about 3 days later...uh...a girl came back like I don't know what happened. She came back to find out...she had a feeling that somebody's left...left. So she came with a buggy and horses and...uh...she...but my mother was gone. She said to me, "Let's crawl. Let's crawl." And my mother died already. (Crying) I can never forgive myself.

(Crying) Always bothers me, you know. I said, "Maybe I should have done this. Maybe I should have... She probably would be alive today." Who knows?

Q: We have to stop here. They're going to change the tapes.

A: Okay.

Q: Are you ready to go? Okay. Continue.

A: Anyway...uh...that girl came back and..uh...she, with a...1 mean couple of girls, they took us and my mother she...she was gone. She...uh...you know how she...she hold on. She...(crying) what it kills me....such a strong. She wanted to live so badly so survived all the beating and all the hurting and all the....(Crying).... They took me and those other girls in...in a town, and they start helping me, you know, for myself you know. I couldn't walk for a long time. I couldn't eat for a long time. Uh...It was some nurses, you know, and they tried with baby food and things like this, but tell you the truth, I didn't want to live. (Crying) Tried to kill myself. (Crying) My mother didn't want me survive, I didn't want to survive either.

(Crying) Well...uh...we were in a town, Danzig,...I don't know. Uh...We did...we were there for awhile...uh... They watched over you, but we...like I said, we were freed by the Russians, but Russian...uh...soldiers themselves they were just like...bad as the...the Germans.

But...uh...other people, you know, they tried to be nice to you and nourish you and things. So we were there for awhile...uh...then...uh...few months later, we start to go home, you know.

Go...go home. Go find somebody. So... uh...the trains weren't going yet. Everything was still, you know, ...uh...from the war, we ride in open trains you know, on those hiding out and so we got to..uh...Krak...Krakau. We got to Krakau and stayed there for awhile til some people get together and uh...I was...most of the time, I was in Poland. Uh...Til the people get together and then we...uh...get a transport you know. A group of people, they put us in a train and we went to...uh...they took us back to Hungary. To Hungary, we came there and there was another... The Joint, you know, the community center....uh...took care of us and...uh...gave us some clothes and...uh...tried to feed us and things. And everybody wanted to go find somebody, a sister, your brother, the father, the... maybe somebody survived from the family. So...uh...we went...uh...you know, the rest of the girls...everybody was from different places, different towns. So we......] went on a train. I went home. Middle of the night I came home to my hometown, and...uh...was so miserable. I couldn't wait until they...there was no...nobody there. I slept over one of the Christians which I...I, you know, I...the morning, first thing, was started the first train came by, I left. I couldn't...could not, you know, I could not breath there. I went to a different town, different town. Uh...The train was a small train that we used to go from one town to another that...uh...there were...I found there some boys, you know, young boys. They were in a labor camp and the camps, they were freed. So... uh...I said to them, I said, "We are leaving like the day. I said, "Where are you going?" They said they going to... uh...Bucharest, Rumania to see if they could find somebody or whatever. So I said, "Can I go with you." I was so young, you know, and...uh...I tried to find somebody to hang out...that uh...I... So we went to Rumania and...uh... they went to Rumania. I went to Czechoslovakia. I found somebody else.

The...those guys went to Rumania. I went to Czechoslovakia, to Prague. I thought maybe, you know, I find somebody my father, my brother, my oldest brother, a sister. So I went to...uh...to Prague. I came to Prague, I met some girls and they say they're...uh...going to...uh... Germany, you know, to the Germany. But then L...I...uh... somebody told me that, you know, we think...they...they heard that my brother is alive, that he is in Budapest. So I decided I'm not going to Germany. I'm going to Budapest. It's amazing isn't it the way we were like a gypsy, running around, finding...people finding everybody. Finding...Did you see this? Did you see that? Did you...you saw somebody? You been with somebody? So I went to Budapest and somebody told me yes, my brother is alive, but he left for Germany, you know. So I start myself and...and I went and...I went to Germany, at Poking. It was a place, Poking, you know, because they said that...uh...that if the Russian, you know,,...uh...soon they're gonna be closed down. You're not gonna be able to go nowhere. Uh...So...uh...the Russian ...we decided to...to go away from them. They was just so bad. He was so bad. He take so many Jewish girl and raped them you know. They were in the war for so many years that anywhere they found a girl, you know, they raped her and threw or if she fight them back, they threw her down from the train. It was just...it was awful. There was...just as bad as...as with the Nazis I tell you. You had to hide from them. You had to disappear from them.

It just was terrible. And...uh...overnight, when we passed...call it..-uh...you know from the Russian side to the American side. We passed. We sent to Germany and...uh...I found my brother there. He was in a different camp, you know, and I was in a different camp. Well, I was there in this camp. Uh...I couldn't...I couldn't...uh...I could not (sigh)...I could not find peace with myself. I couldn't make peace with myself. My mother didn't survive. I couldn't...I just couldn't exist. I could not. I tried to kill myself a few times. I could not exist.

We was there and...uh...for a year, you know. One night I met my husband. Was 15 years old. Somehow, I don't know...in the evening, I met and on those and those the next barrack things, and I...uh...he met...we met and, you know, like we're strangers. I...I never met him, and he never met me before and I was so young and so it was a Saturday night and...uh...we met and he said, "I want to marry you." You know. So...(laughing)... you know, coming from Europe...uh...such a naive child, I...you know, want marry...marry me. I was alone, and he had nobody. It was just terrible. He had nobody. We were, you know, just everybody looked...young girls married older men whoever came along, you know. Uh...Friend of mine, girlfriend of mine, she married a man 25 years old than...because she...she survived and her sister survived. The only thing came is...is to commit suicide after that. You had not...nobody to take care of you. You know what I mean? It was just as bad after you survived because what...what should...how should you survive? How...how should you live? You had nobody to take care of you. You needed parents. You needed to live. You needed food, you know. It was very bad so whoever came along, you know. Whoever came along, even a gypsy...it married...wanted to marry you, you marry. Got married because somebody should give you a home and food and clothes on your back and food. It was...it was terrible. Lot of the girls killed themselves. They...they couldn't...they couldn't make it. They couldn't survive. They had nobody to take care of them. It was just as terrible as...as...as before. If, you see, if...if right away, you know, if you would have had somebody come along and say, "Look, we gonna take care of you. You gonna have...make sure you have a home, you have a bed to sleep in..." But young girls, if they survived and they had nobody to take care, it was... I married my husband and after...after 3 days we knew each other. We never knew each other.

I wanted to bring you the...the marriage certificate. Even had a real marriage certificate, you know. (Sigh) So...uh...we got married there in the camps and then...uh...I have to tell you this. Uh...My husband, you know, when he was in the labor camp, he met this girl... Jewish girl, and...uh...he promised her if he's gonna survive and she survives, he's gonna look her up and they're gonna get married. So after...uh...after he got...he got freed, he came home. He went over Germany to find her. He went everywhere in Germany, every he knew there is camps for the Jews to find her and he couldn't find her, so we got married. And the night...the next morning after we got married, her sister knocked on the door and she came to tell him that her sister is alive, you know. So I told...uh...he said, "When he gets married, it's for keeps." So we got married. After a year...uh...1 became pregnant and my son was born there. It was...was very bad...uh...you know. I was very...uh...undeveloped, you know, un...uh...I wasn't ready to have a baby. You think kids today have 12 years old children, but I wasn't developed yet. I was young and became pregnant and had very bad, you know, there in the camps. It was...was no doctors. Was a midwife, and I was 48 hours in labor there, screaming, screaming and screaming and nobody...nobody heard me screaming. Finally, you know, they came and they cut me up, and when they cut me...uh...they must have cut me with a rusted instrument. So after my son was born I got infection between my legs. I almost died. I got such...I was...I had like 10 pounds balloon...uh...between my legs, you know.

Uh...like this infection, and it blowed up, you know, like...uh...I don't know how to explain to you. So I couldn't move. After my baby was born, I couldn't move for 5 weeks. My husband went to...uh...another camp and he brought some...uh...some kind of special medication, penicillin. I don't not knew exactly what it was. Finally, you know, with all kind of compressings...uh...after mine son was born, he was about 6,7 weeks old...uh...L..when I gave birth to him, my breast did develop. I also tore everything in my body, was torn. I bleed a lot. I was very sick so...uh...my husband took me to a doctor, another doctor, and he said I must right away go to a hospital and they gonna do surgery on me and put everything...sew everything...and...and my tubes were torn, my...everything was torn, you know.

And...uh...that's...[ went to Munich. He told me... made arrangements in Munich and I left my baby, you know, with somebody...uh..German nurse, and I...1 was 3 months there in a hospital in Munich, you know. After that, I came back. We were there about a year and...and my son was 9 months old, not a year, but 9 months old, and we start talking about going, you know. One was going to America. A lot of people were going to Israel and Israel was already a country, so I said to my husband, "We're not going to America. We're going to Israel. We're going to our own land where we gonna be safe." So that time, you know...uh...they took woman and children by airplane to...to Israel, and so they put me on the plane with my son. He was 9 months old. (Sigh) We almost died. The...the plane was on fire, you know. (Sigh) We...we landed somewhere on an island and we stayed there for...for 48 hours til they brought another plane. Was a miracle we survived. And I'm still here. We arrived to Israel and my husband's supposed to come, you know, soon after me, but he came by...by...by boat. I arrived to Israel. They put us in a tent there you know, me and my baby.

What shall I tell you? My friend...concentration camp, I mean...it's...the country was just taking. I mean I have...I have...I love Israel you know what I mean, but it was terrible.

Circumstances. A humanbeing didn't mean...they brought so many people...a humanbeing didn't mean nothing. Kids die from the...some kind of sickness was going around. Children died so much over there. I was in this tent with another family, with my baby. Uh...Also my throat start bothering me, you know. So bothered me one day. The next day my throat gets worse. My throat was. So there was a doctor there, doctor. I went over there. I said, "Look, my throat is bad and swollen. My throat is bad and so he looked and he said, "Oh, it's nothing." He gives me a bunch of pills like this in your hands and he said, "Swallow those down and go home," and I went back to my child and it get worst. I'm sick. I developed terrible high temperature and I can't swallow at all. I couldn't wait til the next morning. That family took my baby...and took me to...right away, went the minute he opened, you know. I couldn't talk anymore. So doctor looked and he said, "Oh, she needs a hospital right away." I had diphtheria. You know diphtheria? So they took...and my baby because he was with me the whole time because he probably is very catchy and so instead take him somewhere they put a crib...it was a tent and I was there and he start with me on penicillin and you know, every 4 hours and...and my baby was next to me in crib. Poor thing! So I was there...I don't know, til made me well. My husband didn't get out then until 3 months later. I went from place to place like another gypsy. I didn't know what's...what's happened to my husband. I don't know what happened to anybody. There's...was a...like crazy. Just...that's all you have to do is commit suicide...jump yourself in the ocean. That's it. Finally, after 3 months we found each other. He didn't know where I was. I didn't know where he was, you know. He went...in Israel, there...looking from Netanya to Hadera to Haifa, everywhere to small places where the tents you know. They...nobody could tell him where I am, if] live maybe. He heard that the plane was on fire, that I'm dead. After 3 or 4 months, we finally found each other. Uh...So then, you know, we were there about 8 months. They said they're gonna give you, put on a farm, give you a cow and a horse, make...you know. So they took me and my husband and the child one of those places where the Arabs used to live, in those...uh...uh...

houses from...made from...uh...mud, you know. The Arabs there...used to be the Arabs occupied. Then after Israel was taken, this was near , small town. We went down there and I tell you, there food...food...if you like the ____ on it. There was not a little milk for your child. There is nothing. For Passover, they give you one can of beans for the child, for my husband and me, for the child. That place they gave me...that place there (sigh) I don't know how to describe it to you. I tell you you couldn't see. There was no electricity. There was nothing. You couldn't see a human being if...if you wanted...if you...I don't know what. It was terrible. It was awful. If] tell you it was awful, when my husband got a job and...and...near Tele Aviv, you know. He got a job. Somebody made that he...he worked in those ovens where they burned iron, you know. He got a job there. He used to come home only...uh...the Sabbath. He stayed there. I don't know how he sleeped, how he lived, but that's it. Every Friday afternoon, he came home and Sunday early morning, he left. If I saw him coming home, there was...you couldn't see a decent...you couldn't see....1 was with my child in that house. The Arabs could come in thousand times to kill you and you don't know...you never knew if I'm alive or I'm dead. And that's what they did. They killed every day. The Arabs came in and they killed. If the Arabs didn't kill you, the snakes bite you and killed you. So I just...I said to my husband...one time he came on Friday...he was so exhausted that he went to sleep and he didn't woke til Sunday morning. But...uh...one time he came home and I said, "That's it." I said, "I can't take this anymore. I cannot take...I have a child. I'm scared. I'm scared to death. We have to do something. We have to...I get a job in town. We have to...I can't take this anymore. I can't." So he went down there in that town and talked to this guy and he said to give him a job as a watchman, over night watchman. I said, "Fine.

Fine. As long as you're home every day. I'm scared. I'm here by myself with a child and you couldn't see a neighbor. You couldn't see a humanbeing. You couldn't see nothing. You could not...it's worse than...than...than I don't know what. So...uh...he got a job. Thursday night, he went out on a horse, you know, in the...in the woods, you know. Watched the Arabs come in. Okay, he went out to work. He came back in the morning and I..and he was very upset. I mean scared to death. Poor thing! He was not himself. I saw him. He was not...he was so scared that you could not believe it. It hurt me to see him like that so I said, "Friday night, you supposed to go again." I said, "Look. I'm sorry. I'm not going to let you do it. I see you so scared. You go down and tell them to send somebody else. You're not going." So that night, Friday night, somebody else went and the Arabs came in. They killed everybody.

They killed five families, children, everybody who was the watchman. Everybody! They cut off the head, found them tied to a...to a tree, and the head was cut off. It was...my husband in the morning when we got up, he went into town and he came back to tell me, it's just like...

don't know...if he would have gone that night, you know, he wouldn't survive. He wouldn't live today. He would have been dead just the rest of it. It got worse. So I said to him, I said, "Look. I can't take this anymore. I survived by Hitler. I survived by the Nazis. I'm... can't take this anymore. All...we have to do something. We have to change our lives. We have to.

I can't take it. My child is starving to death. We have no food. We can't get nothing. What's gonna be with us?" Went into Yafel, you know, if you knew...if you what about Yafel. We went there. We found some kind of old_____ people. Can't get no job. There's no food. Was 1949, 1950. Was bad. You can't imagine... didn't...I said, "If I survive, I never bring a family on this earth to have the same...to go through what I went through. Never! I don't want to bring children." But it happened, you know. I had...there was no birth controls. I didn't know what... had...and 1951, my daughter was born. But you love...love them, you know.

Desperate. They're my life. Without them, I...1 wouldn't be here. Uh...Getting worse. I can't take...you know, I...I said to my husband, I said, "We...we can't get no job. You wanta work.

I was gonna something you know. There's no food. At that time, it was so bad you stayed in the line to get a little milk, you know, for your child and it was the country was a new country, you know, and they don't have nothing. We had nobody. They had nothing to give for you but if you don't have. But I could not take it, you see. I already had my share as a young child. How many can you real survive...how many can you take? (Crying) So I said to my husband, I said, "Look. I didn't wanta go to America, but for my children, to make my life better, I'm taking...we have to...we have to leave. We have to do something because we lived in a...uh...uh...aluminum tent, you know. And every morning my daughter woke up...a baby...uh...she was bitten from the bed bugs. She was so chewed up, her whole body. I can't...you can't believe it. It's... we had nothing. We couldn't go nowhere we wanted. There was no...you couldn't get any help. There was no where...there was a lot of people. There was sick people dying. Her sister left her...lost her child. Nobody, you know, came with a...also the same day child and she lost it there. So so you know because some I'm stay there for 10 years, struggled terrible. Terrible struggled...10 years. But I said I have to change it. I have to. He didn't want. I said, "Okay. Taking my children and I'm going and you could stay." But because I am Czechoslovakian and he was from Rumania, my son was born in Germany...I had no trouble. My daughter was born in Israel. They wouldn't let her out. So I said to him, "I'm going with my son. You stay here with the daughter...with the child, with __, and I...then I bring you, I make the papers, but we have to make our lives easier." I came to America with my son. Uh...I started...1 was going to a lawyer right away, you know, making papers for him to come with...with my daughter, but...uh...it took...they wouldn't let him out. It took 6 months. I had to go back and bring him you know. I had to go back to Israel and bring him with...with my daughter. So we are here in America. (Laughing) We start a new life. Start a new life. Another language you know. Couldn't speak a word of...he's a very good tailor my husband. Professional tailor! But he couldn't speak any English so finally we found, also, a refugee. No, he got a job in...uh...I don't know if you heard about ____. ina big company, , you know he got a job as...uh...a tailor, but you know, he wasn't used to work on Sabbath. He worked all week long and Sabbath, he wouldn't work.

So one day the boss...boss came over and he said, "___when is ____ He said, "You want to take out the calendar and show him?" and he said, "No." Then that's when you have to pay a bill. So ___ said, "I cannot." "If you can't work on Sabbath, then I can't keep you all week long." So...uh...so he got...he left. Got another job. A refugee, you know, he made 45 dollars a week. I...] got a job...uh...as...uh...1 worked in a restaurant in a kitchen. I made 35 dollars a week. We were...(sigh) struggled desperate, but I made 35 dollars. I could buy an ice cream for my child. You know what I mean. If my kid say, "Mommy, ____ ice cream, I could go out and...and buy him an ice cream. We lived for 5 years on the Kennedy Street, you know, in 2 rooms. It was...it was the worst, but I said, "If I...if I have to live like this and save up a few dollars, you know, and buy my own home, I'm gonna live like this." But at least I have the... had...I wasn't hungry. A penny. I wasn't hungry a piece of bread. I wasn't hungry. Two days...two years later..-uh...we became pregnant again. You know, with my third child. And 1960...we came in 57. And here I have no...no...uh... hospitalization. We have not a penny in our name. We...we...uh...two children. (Sigh) What shall I do? We lived there in Kennedy Street...uh...on second floor, so there's one way out. I'm jumping over the floor and that's it. I did. Jump over the floor. And...uh...started bleeding terrible you know. They took me right to the hospital , but I was bleeding, bleeding. The doctor examined me. He said, "You're lucky. You're alive and the baby's alive." What shall I do? How should I, you know, have a baby? I have nothing? We have nothing? I even borrowed money, you know, to go back to Israel to bring my husband here with a child. I borrowed from a friend. (Sigh) Somebody said, "Look, Go to this and this doctor. He's Jewish. He's gonna help you." L...I went to him and I said, "Look,"...uh...I speak to him in Jewish, I said, "Look, I make 35 dollars a week. My husband makes 35 dollars a week. Can you help me. All...give me an abortion. I'm pregnant. I have nothing. Help me." I said, "Please help me. I'll pay you. I'll pay you five dollars a week or whatever I can. I pay you, but I have nobody to help." I didn't know what to do. He said...uh... "I'm sorry, Mrs. Ingber. I've...I...1 wish I can help you. I cannot nothing...I can't do nothing for you." I walked out from his office. My...uh...I was...1 got dizzy. I was standing near, you know, near the wall. And I start crying so much. I said, "God, why? Why am I'm living? All the...uh...all the doors of people closing for you? Is that the way it's supposed to be? You know, is that the way it's supposed to be?" I said, "Good people died and...and...and I mean I didn't go ask for help because I hated to go ask for help but when the knife is...the rope is already by your throat, you... Well, somebody said go to the Jewish Social Service. I went to the Jewish Social Service. You know what they told me?

"I'm sorry, Mrs. Ingber. If you have nobody to help you, you have to go back to the old country where you came from." You believe that? That's the way all the...all the doors were closed for me. There's just one way. (Crying) I didn't know what to do? What do you ina time like this? It's...it's bad. I mean I had a father here, there, here, but...uh...my father was not the hand. He was, you know...uh...the kind of man that...uh...his wife controlled him and she wouldn't give us the time of the day. Absolute not! So...uh...I decided...uh...somebody said to me, "There is a clinic for people like me." Washington Hospital Center. So I was going there. I went there one time and I told him, "Look, I have no money. I'm here in this country, new. I have two children. My husband makes so and so, and can you help me?" So he said, "Yes, can you pay $200." I said, "Yes, I could pay $200, but I have to pay you out slowly." "Okay." So I went clinic and...uh...you know, I was only one...I went all those young doctors were teaching, you know, like...what can you at that time, the only white woman. All the prostitutes, the black woman, had ____ fathers which I couldn't understand.

They asked, "Who's the father?" Said, "Which one?" You know that time it was...nine, spent nine months because they thought...they thought that I have a tumor...I'm not pregnant.

I don't have a decent doctor and I was very sick. Blowed up like a balloon and...uh...9 months every day, I spend my time in there in that clinic. So...uh...Finally, you know, mine...uh...my son was born, Maury, which I love dearly, you know. (Sigh) God forgive me.

Uh...He was born in...uh...in that hospital. I had a lot of problems, but after a certain...uh...a certain time, think I needed hysterectomy. Uh...I went back to work and we tried to...uh...save up every penny. My kids helped us out. Everybody helped. We saved up the first thousand dollars and bought us and in Lewis in Hyattsville Lewis, we bought semi- detached house. It was...uh...very hard. Very hard, but after...after 10, 15 years, 20 years, I made it, you know. I...L...I was so bitter. I was so...I was so bitter I cannot begin to tell you how bitter I was. If somebody called me up, "Can you help this? Can you help that?" I said, "Nobody helped me." I used to tell them off. I was very bad. This was in the beginning, you know, because I was so bitter. For a long time. I was so full of pain for such a long time.

Uh...Sometime when I, you know, when I remember I still have this horrible guilt that my mother and the pain, why I'm alive and she's dead, you know. Uh...But we survived. We survived. Have three beautiful children. I worked. Where I used to be I was a maid. I said...if I have to be a maid, clean toilets. I wasn't proud. People gave me handout, clothes. I wasn't ashamed. I thanked them very much. As long as I could give my kids the best education money can buy, send them to private school, and that's all we worked for is...yet is for the kids, which we love very much. They're our whole family and our whole life and...uh... Do you understand? You know, do you understand. I...I think that the one reason that they came out so perfect is because of they used to listen to my husband still cries often in his sleep.

You should hear him at night, you know. He's nightmares. He's fighting and he's crying like a child...like a child. Forty years? Yal. We can't get over it. I wish...I wish I could, you know, get over it sometimes. L...it's...it's getting a little better because when L...uh...came to America...uh...I...[ couldn't. I was so...so hurting. I was so much with wounds that I could not function so...uh...we belong to Group Health. Every time I went there, you know, for a visit I just...before he asked me, "How you doing, Mrs. Ingber," I brought out crying you know. I couldn't talk to nobody. So...uh...the doctor said, "Look, I see something's wrong with...bothering you. I'm gonna send you to this and this doctor." So...uh...she made me an appointment to a psychiatrist and I went there and...uh...I...uh...I told them, I said...he asked me what's bothering me...what's...so I told him the story and I said I was next to my mother and I should have saved her and I didn't...(Crying)...and I feel so guilty. I can't live that guilt.

It kills me. So he said, "Mrs. Ingber, you tried to survive your...you were so sick, you know, and he gave me an example of this and example of that and he said, "You couldn't save your mother. Even if you...if you would have been healthy, you couldn't save her." The way I told him that she looked, the way she was a piece of skeleton and, you know, only her mouth was going....her eyes...I mean talking. Her eyes were gone, eaten up, her eyes...the time I remember to look at that. (Crying) God! Horrible thing. (Crying) She was so eaten up. Her eyes were eaten up. (Crying) (Crying) As a child you know, you remember all those things you see you know like that. When you see...when you see a child hunger, is there any worse or suffering. Is the same...mother...a child sees a mother. (Crying) One time...uh...she...uh...

uh...carried with her a little small gold ring and there was a Jewish girl that somehow she...she was, you know, with the Germans. I don't know she had...she was one of them practically. I called her over and I said to her, "Here's this ring. Bring me...bring me just this much milk for my mother, you know...milk. I'll give you the ring. I'll give you anything you want. Just bring a little milk for her." (Crying) So she said, "Okay." And...uh...she came in and I gave her the ring and she went and (crying, crying) and she took her leg and hit my mother on the head like this and (crying). That's what happen. Instead she should help, she, you know, screamed and cried my mother. (Crying) It's...it's...uh...it's something...uh...that, you know, you...a child, you know, like I say we have three beautiful children and...uh...my grandchildren and they...my oldest grandson knows all about the Holocaust and he comes to tell me and when I used to babysit him and they were little, I told them the whole story about the Holocaust and...uh...one time, you know, my...they...they couldn't understand, you know, what happened to my...I have no hair. What happened? So I told them story. I said the Germans want...want...uh...I have...uh...I forgot to tell you that because they did kind a...they put some kind of light on my head, some...uh...radiation, well I got already twice cancer things, you know, removed from...uh...so I've been under the doctor's care. I have to watch for cancer from that...uh... radiation what they did to me. So I tell my grandchildren and...uh...they...they understand. They're so beautiful. So...uh...my daughter, my kids are very...uh...very understandable the father, to their father...my husband. He is worse than I am. (Crying) He's gonna tell you his story, but he suffered more than I did. Can you imagine? Yal. He...uh...We were married for 43 years, and we have three beautiful children.

We have...uh...he's still working, you know. We have a cleaning store, and he's a tailor and we doing tailoring and cleaning on Piney Branch Road. We have a nice home which I...I'm very happy. I never wanted to have, I mean, luxury things. A car has four wheels that drives me where I need. That's all I'm...never ask for much, and I'm very happy person. I have my kids. I have anything we needed for them. That...that made my life happy. They're healthy and my husband should be healthy. He's not very healthy. So...uh...not complaining anymore. As long as...as long as...a little, the nightmares a little...lets you off you know. We have been both taking Valiums, you know, for a long time, but we're doing all right, you know. Sometimes it gets easier. Sometime it gets harder. The holidays is the worst.

But...uh...like I say, my children mean everything to me, my husband, and you live for that day to see them and to be with them.

Q: Okay. We can stop here. Bonnie is going to come in and do the pictures. Okay.

A: Okay. Thank you.