piebro/osm-data huggingface dataset:
LLlypuk82 (2017-09-07 22:06:56+00:00): You use incorrect analogies. Not simply "the majority of the population speaks another language than the one on the road signs", but  majority of the citizens of the Belarus.
Jay May (2017-09-08 05:07:43+00:00): As soon as I am in front of a computer I will post a screenshot of Yandex (I don't know how to post it over here).
Anyway my point is: OSM is not about politics or personal language preference, but about reflecting the reality and so far we were not doing that in Belarus. I drive there every two weeks, and no matter which language I use on my phone I always see the Russian name below. When I use Russian, I see only the Russian name and no other!. Imagine a tourist from Russia getting confused (that was a perfect example provided by another user) by entirely different names and not being able to see the Belarusian name on his app (Октябрская instead of Кастрычнiцкая, Берёзовая Роща instead of Бярозавы Гай, lots of places with the word "Большой" instead of "Вялiкi "), etc. I am not even mentioning tourists that don't read cyrillic nor speak Russian/Belarusian! Try it, because quite a couple of my ethnic Russian friends (no matter if they are from Lithuania, Latvia, Belarus, Ukraine or Russia) have complained to me personally about all the above each time they had to go to Belarus and used OSM and OSM-based apps. Otherwise I wouldn't highlight this issue and take from my personal time to make such an enormous work...
Ambush (2017-09-08 06:09:38+00:00):  LLlypuk82 OSM is not about language problems of biggest part of country population, it is about reflecting geographical objects in geographical data base. According to law you cited, geographical names assigned in Belarusian, then they are transliterated to Russian because this is the second national language. So Belarusian is the number one in geographical names. And all signs, (topographical, public transport) etc are written in Belarusian with little amount of exceptions.

Of course, if object signed in Russian, it should be named in Russian in OSM. For all other cases it should be named in Belarusian.

OSM is a global project and all local arrangements are not legitimate if they are contrary to main OSM rules.
molind (2017-09-08 06:20:16+00:00): Agreed. "name" tag is for name as it written on sign. name:ru and name:by could be filled too. To let users choose what name they want to read. Same value inside name and name:by is ok. First tolds us what should we expect to see and second in 100% times in Belarusian.
Jay May (2017-09-08 06:39:30+00:00): Screenshots from what I see from my computer on Yandex:
- In English: https://plus.google.com/u/1/photos/116538206482963449572/album/6463292506880436433/6463292504796189858?authkey=CPHviqDkqcGDfw
- In Russian: https://plus.google.com/u/1/photos/116538206482963449572/album/6463292506880436433/6463292506893818850?authkey=CPHviqDkqcGDfw 
As you can see, even Yandex writes those names in Belarusian as main ones. And they are Russian!
Георгий Ильин (2017-09-08 07:27:39+00:00): Напишу по-Английски ))
@Jay May, thank you for highlighting this in pm. I will reply later.
@LLlypuk82: please understand that this is not against Russian language ))) We have to leave the Russian name, but only in the name:ru tag (unless it appears in Russian on-spot, like for instance Белоруснефть, Газпромнефть, etc.). 
Nothing to add to what Jay May, Ambush and mOlind wrote - they explained everything very well. Thank you for cooperation.
soya666 (2017-09-08 15:25:14+00:00): For example Google Maps https://i.imgur.com/V2SFlRN.png use the names of cities, villages and etc in Belarusian language and łacinka. Google have many users on the world, but all ok for tourists and the population of the country
yaugenka (2017-09-08 16:51:07+00:00): @Jay May, if you visit Belarus and ask people for directions, you will hardly get a reply in Belarussian language anywhere. That it the reality of our countly and the name tag must reflect that realy. If somebody wants to have names displayed in Belarussian they are free to use the name:be tag which is available for all or almost all places in our contry.
Moreover introducing such global changes in our country without prior negociation with us is a sign of disrespect.
user_6110846 (2017-09-08 17:31:05+00:00): The main argument is the signs of the names of cities and towns that the driver sees. Seen by the driver, should be in the name. The remaining arguments (the internal language policy of the government, the language of communication of local residents) is for other mapping projects.

If the Russian language in name is due to the fact that someone so wants or where something is written down that is a clear violation of the main concept of the project.

I propose to collect photographs of the signs of the names of cities and towns at the entrance and write in DWG /
The meaning of the complaint. Information in the name / names of settlements / contradicts the information "on-ground".

  The Belarusian community should put information from signage. The desires of a group of people who contradict the principle of "on-ground" --- should be ignored.
yaugenka (2017-09-08 18:06:33+00:00): The "group of people who contradict the principle of "on-ground"" signs comprize 74% of the pupulation of the country. By introducting this change you would abuse the primary users of OSM Belarus - the citizens of the country.
user_6110846 (2017-09-08 19:08:58+00:00): You are plotting with official statistics. 74 percent are the urban population. The rural provincial population - the situation on the contrary - there is approximately the same figure Belarusian-speaking population. So we have parity. Or, in plain language, 50 percent of both languages comes out. Your argument is inappropriate. Read the rules that define the main concept of the project.
Rules created for everyone. All this population throughout the country: the population of the villages, towns, the capital and tourists. All/listed me/see other than in name. You make the Belarusian community to create the map, the value of which is no. A tourist from another country will search "Magìleu" on the sign in reality "Mogilev".

One of the rules of the project at contentious issues need to take into account the opinion of all. A significant number of wants to see in the name of Belarusian. Because exit is used in the name of the two languages. Such a bilingual name has a normal rendering.

For example: in Northwestern China, where the live Chinese Kirgiz, have long been used bilingualism.

I concluded that to defeat the Russian lobby is only possible by emphasize DWG. You should ask the DWG through photos, videos, take a decision that consolidate Belarusian/bilingualism/name Mass complaints foreign cartographers, which tourists will provide a photo. When the complaint will need to emphasize that some cartographers/in some areas/have behavior as samoderžavcì, making decisions that are contrary to the concept of the project "on ground". Forcing all violate the concept of the project, pushing his personal vision in controversial issues.I'm in a personal correspondence will contact the participants in the discussion/who for the Belarusian language/so they collected photos, where signs of the Belarusian language and written complaints to the International DWG with the content, which I described earlier in the text.
yaugenka (2017-09-08 20:31:35+00:00): @Poliakoff Mykhailo, can you provide any proves of your statement that both language are used 50/50? Have you ever been in our country at all? I myself come from a village and can assure you that no one is speaking Belarusian there, those 26% are mostly located in big cities. I'm just wondering why would a foregn person have a right to force us to use the language which the majory of us does not speak!? You are suggesting to sacrifice millions of local people to a couple of thousands or even hundreds of foregn tourists.
user_6110846 (2017-09-08 22:08:19+00:00): In the project's argument is banners/signs/names of settlements. The argument about who what morvoû talks is not the main one. Map of what is done for turitìv. With the tourist will communicate the convenient to him. You do not mind that the plaques with the names of Belarusian. So then if you respect the rules of the project, we must accept that the Belarusian in name/Sorry but I do not understand. You kind of don't mind placards of the Belarusian language, and further express the position that is contrary to the concept of the project. I.e. you exhibit disrespect for rules and propose further to the members community to violate the rules and the concept of the project. That is, it turns out that all must obey the rules and Belarus is the exception because it has the right to ignore rules
Explain why you are against the two languages in the names of settlements? What you personally prevents the emergence at the Russian and Belarusian languages? Then make a case for war edits. Moreover, according to the legislation of your country is officially bilingual. This is also a strong argument for my compromised position.
yaugenka (2017-09-08 23:05:25+00:00): Your suggestion to have two names in one one tag is out of this topic. We are now talking about replacement of russian names by belarusian ones.
The number of local people using the map for business and leisure is by far bigger than the number of foreign tourists and regardless of what is written on signs the majory of local people use Russian and can hardly speak Belarusian.
Ambush (2017-09-09 12:52:43+00:00): yaugenka: one more time: Ground Truth rule is not about local traditions and preferences, it's about Ground Truth. And OSM is not a local Belarusian project. It's world wide. So you can't sacrifice billions of planet Earth people to a couple of millions citizens of one little country.
yaugenka (2017-09-09 12:58:38+00:00): @ambush, it is the question of number of users, not population.
user_6110846 (2017-09-09 13:28:46+00:00): Yaugenka care less on rules and on the arguments. To him, the main thing that the Russian language everywhere won the Belarusian language. The victory should be by humiliation, discrimination of the Belarusian language. His pattern of behavior in these discussions it confirms absolutely.
yaugenka (2017-09-09 14:54:35+00:00): @Poliakoff Mykhailo, if you visit Belarus and talk to people you will hardly find anyone talking against the Belarusian language and me is not an exception. You  guys are giving favor to foreign tourist, whereas I defent the interest of local people nation-wide, not just some minority.
molind (2017-09-09 14:59:44+00:00): I think yaugenka just misses main point. There is no negative effect for russian speaking users. Because most applications let users to change language. Open openstreetmap.by and check it yourself. There is no single reason to keep russian instead belarussian in name tag. Only because it's easier to read for someone. Because readability is solved on the application side, when users select it's language. Galileo, maps.me, OsmAnd allow user to change language. Once you select russian you'll see everything in russian. Name tag is to keep name as it used on-ground. Name:* for translations. That's it. We don't need to put translation into name tag only because it's rendered on osm.org. Most users will see language they need in applications they use.
Ambush (2017-09-09 15:02:24+00:00): Guys, according to what we discussed here and in personal mail I've reverted this reverting changeset. For me it's a very strange situation to discuss should we follow main OSM rules for Belarus or not. I want to propose to ask DWG to help us if we can't find satisfying decision.
LLlypuk82 (2017-09-09 15:25:49+00:00): OK. What will you propose for situation when road signs have bilingual (or more) inscriptions?
Jay May (2017-09-09 20:31:38+00:00): - Village, town and city names: name:* in Belarusian only.
- Street signs: this is the tricky part. In Minsk or Brest, the situation is clear (official street signs are all in Belarusian). However, there are some towns or villages without any official street signs, just the name on the street (usually in Russian) on private houses (or buildings). In this case, except for Minsk and any city where official street signs are in Belarusian, bilingualism in name:* would be a good solution if we are not sure (without forgetting to fill name:be and name:ru). In order to be readable, we could write it like this: BY name - RUS name (ex.: вулiца Савецкач - улица Совецкая)
- Transportation-related infrastructure names: most of them are in Belarusian. Bus stops, metro stations, train stations should have the Belarusian name in name:*. If they are in Russian, then the name:* tag should be in Russian
- Monuments: they are always signed in Belarusian (ex.: Брэсцкая крэпасць), and so they should be on OSM. Unless we are talking about some communist monuments (you know, those "слава героям"). I think it makes no sense to change the name=* tag.
- Commercial names: leave as it is. Белоруснефть, Родны Кут, U Tadeusza, Кинотеатр Мир, etc.) whatever the language and the alphabet.
That was my proposition from the very beginning when I started the discussion a couple of months ago.
yaugenka (2017-09-09 22:24:13+00:00): Can anyone tell the purpose of the name tag in general? is it just for putting sign info into it and remain them whenever signs get changed?
Jay May (2017-09-10 08:13:05+00:00): The "name=*" tag in general is to show what is written on the road, street or shop signs, whatever it is.
Ambush (2017-09-10 13:07:23+00:00): I agree with Jay May. And I want to say that if someone see the name at the road sign in Russian, he can ask local authorities to fix it according to cited law.
yaugenka (2017-09-10 19:32:30+00:00): What are your aguments for renaming according to the on-ground rule except for "just because it is common convention"?
user_6110846 (2017-09-10 20:30:58+00:00): Скажыце калі ласка, калі вы рэгістраваліся ў дадзеным праекце вы гатовыя былі паважаць правілы праекта падабаюцца ці не падабаюцца яны вам? Тым у што ваша пытанне з'яўляецца абсурдным. Вы розумиеть Першае, што ваша пазіцыя пройгрышная і вы проста спрабуеце цягнуць час. Ці чакаеце, што мы вам напішам хамства. І будзе падстава заблакаваць нас. Вы дыскусію рухаеце ў пералівання з пустога ў парожняе і словоблуд. Ужо даўно выслуханыя ўсе бакі канфлікту. Аргументы нашай пазіцыі схілілі шалі вагаў у бок беларускай мовы. Пара брацца да заменьі мовы. Уласна чым я і займаюся ў дадзены момант. Дзякуй усім за дыскусію.  / Tell me please, when you are registered in this project you are ready to respect the rules of the project like, do not you like them? Tom what your question is absurd. You understand that your position is losing and you're just trying to take time. Or expect you to write rudeness to you. And there will be a reason to block us. You are discussing the process of transfusion from the empty to the empty. All sides of the conflict have long been listened to. The arguments of our position inclined the weight of the weights to the Belarusian language. Already take time to replace the language. Actually what I am doing at the moment. Thank you all for the discussion.
yaugenka (2017-09-11 18:50:12+00:00): @Poliakoff Mykhailo,
I stop any communication with you because are not following the conversation and are making provoking comments.

@Jay May, @Ambush, @mOlind, @Григорий Ильин, @Jaŭhien,
Here are our main arguments against the change.
1. There are no official up-to-date printed maps, no official internet resources (http://map.nca.by/, http://gismap.by/) available in the Belarusian language. Almost all official documents like orders, decrees, acts etc. are using geographic names in Russian. Local public service vehicle tickets are in Russian also. The change will make verification of map date against official sources almost impossible.
2. According to local convention, addressing is based on russian names in "name" and "addr" tags. The change will also require renaming all "addr" tags. Moreover there are a lot of objects which are not translated into Belarusian yet and hence it will break addressing to those locations at all.
3. The local convention for using Russian language in the "name" tag exists from the very beginning of the osm project and there are many osm-based project which expect Russian name in that tag and hence those projects will stop working and will need to be rebuild.
4. Both languages are considered official in the country and on-the-ground signs can officially be in Belarusian, Russian or both at the same time. Blind following of the on-the-ground rule will lead to chaos - when some names are in Belarusian and other ones are in Russian or both.
5. According to official statistics, 74% of the population of the country consider Russian their native language. Many of those cannot even speak Belarusian. Since openstreetmap.org and all the key editors display names from the non-localized "name" tag, the change will cause reading and editing difficulties to the majority of the project contributors.

Do you still insist on the change?
yaugenka (2017-09-11 21:32:45+00:00): @Георгий Ильин, first let me apologies for the mistyped name. Secondly, let me clarify the points.
Whatever language you select in your settings you will still get the name from "name" tag displayed on http://www.openstreetmap.org and in editors. I think there is no need to explain that majory of map data is taken from official sources, not from on-the-ground signs. No one is going to visit every street and house to map it. For you it is just place names which make a confusion, for us it is great amount of data which must be compared to official source. In Brussels you can easily find a printed map and other official resource on both languages. In our country we have them in Russian only, no choice. So we first map them in Russian and then translate them into Belarusian. That was the main reason for this local convention. Road signs is the only thing which falls out of this rule. BTY by "local public service vehicle tickets" I meant "railway and bus ticketes" which are printed in Russian only.
OSM is map data first of all  which is used by other applications. And the other applications must decide which languange to display data in. We do our best to translate data into Belarusian but making it the default would mean throughing stones into our own glass house ("пилить сук на котором сидишь").
yaugenka (2017-09-12 00:09:53+00:00): @Mykhailo, you already can be banned for changing the data and open calls to continue changing the data while the discussion is still going on.
The above mentioned official internet resource can freely be used for validation. Can you name any alternatives in the Belarusian language?
yaugenka (2017-09-12 07:59:25+00:00): @Mykhailo,
1. you was writing in Enlish very well previously, so the statement that you don't understand English is a cheat.
2. the statement that official sources cannot be relied on is absolutely illogical. The same thing about replying on wikipedia.
3. it is a shame to here from an attorney that it is prohibited by a license to look at data which is published by govenment in the internet.
4. the main bulk of data including street name and administrative boundaries is taken from maps which can be copied freely. Almost all data that you currently see on OSM Belarus was mapped from Russian sources and then translated to Belarusian by ourselves or looking into the small number of Belarusian publications we have.

You are mainly suggesting to lock us out of key sources and start going to local authoriies begging to privide us data in Belarusian, rebuilds already existing apps to use different tags and (the main point of yours) make us all speak Belarusian regardless of whether we want it or not.
mavl (2017-09-12 09:57:40+00:00): Hello all.  
  
 > The local convention for using Russian language in the "name" tag exists from the very beginning of the osm project...  
  
yaugenka, does OSM wiki contain this convention?  
  
Vladimir Marshinin  
Data Working Group
4004 (2017-09-12 14:21:44+00:00): While most of you here provide convincing arguments in favour of name:be->name, yaugenka is correct in pointing out name:be tags don't even cover some areas. Belarusian OSM community has long wanted/struggled to do the switch, but it would leave a map in disarray and possibly introduce challenges for data users. Following Ground Truth principles is made difficult when two languages are used for addressing/naming interchangeably and with little oversight from the authorities.
Jay May (2017-09-12 15:46:19+00:00): @4004: all transition periods have their own issues and there is no problem without any solution  ;)  Poliakoff Mykhailo seems to know a lot on a similar case: neighboring Ukraine. Anyway, on such technical details I prefer reading your propositions because I'm not as good as you guys yet. But some users (Ambush, etc.) have been on OSM for so many years that I'm confident they will find solutions to the potential issues mentioned above regarding the addr tags. If a name appears only in Russian on OSM, usually the Belarusian equivalent can be found on wikipedia, and can be checked with other sources. If the appropriate Belarusian name is not found for some locations even after verification, I would suggest to leave those names as they already appear.
Ambush (2017-09-12 17:39:50+00:00): And there is not a problem if there will be different languages in name (for objects which haven't name:be filled) because whole OSM name's on the planet are in different languages. If it just haven't any Belarusian alternative, it'll be left in Russian.
LLlypuk82 (2017-09-12 18:08:37+00:00): @mavl
Здесь говорится о соглашении 2009 года:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/RU:Belarus:Map_languages
user_6110846 (2017-09-12 19:36:44+00:00):   You must understand that the further delay matters more complicated will be the solution. Take the similar project of Google, there is a fairly well is in difficulties, you're specifying, the Belarusian version of the map. And done it all for the year and a half: Belarusian street caused caused by translations of objects of nature and water. The same all of the translations are not from the ceiling the same appeared. So there is something all somewhere in your country. When Google launched the Belarusian there activity in Belarusian was high, the project vlilosâ a fresh lot of blood. Wood started the street on the map, replaced with the Belarusian language. I even as a member of Google was surprised by the interest to give the Belarusian. Write for example, that it is on the contrary will give fresh blood in your project. After all, making the conclusion of Forum activity, life in it delicately put it in "hibernation of the bear  ".
yaugenka (2017-09-12 23:22:29+00:00): @Mykhailo, you are again trying to mislead the discussion. The main argument in defence of this change is that our local convention contradicts the common rule of the on-the-ground signs.
If we start following the common rule it will not be a Belarusian map. It will be a mixture of Belarusian and Russian names. Yes, all settlement names will be in Belarusian because there are enough official publications listing them, but many lower level objects like streets, suburbs, squares, small lakes and rivers, commercial areas etc. will be in Russian because they may have signs in Russian or may have no signs at all and are mapped from Russian sources.
Is it really worth the changes required in the map data and existing application as well as the difficulties in data validation the osm contributors will face?