GBAB (2020-09-11 09:19:56+00:00): Thank you, Martin,
I try to be good at translation, among others for freemap.sk
;-)


Dear Aceman444,

thank you for you very kind reminder regarding Hungarian names in Bratislava. My source designation of overpass-turbo was, obviously, a mistake (and, perhaps, my laziness as well). But not a lie. I am a human, far from being perfect, sorry for that.

It is a bit unclear to me, what are "official" and "allowed" sources, I should cite. What is the characteristics which makes a source "official". And how will be a source allowed? Are there any "not allowed" sources? (Beyond for copyright reasons.)

Anyway, I try to make it clear, how I created that changeset though it was more than two years ago so it will not be complete.

First of all: most buildings and objects in Bratislava do not have any "official" Hungarian names at all. I think an official name is when an authority (e.g. a state office or a piece of legislation or the entity itself) defines it. And, therefore, there aren't any official sources either, since the City Council of Bratislavas works in Slovak and, probably, the diocese of Bratislava does not have either an official list of Hungarian church or parish names and so on.

Thus, names are mostly a convention of people that use that name. Sometimes the vast majority of people use the same name sometime there are concurrent names (e.g. for churches you can use the name of the patron of the church, or the name of the neighbourhood where the church is or the name of the religious order running the church or some other characteristics or a combination of these). Often, the official name of the church is absolutely not used since it is so complicated (hence the key <official_name=…>).

As far it concerns historic names (mostly palaces), they belonged to noble families well-known in Hungary. So they are used in Hungary the same way they are in Slovak. (They might have been translated from Hungarian into Slovak.) Of course, there may be alterations (e.g. only one family name is used or perhaps more of them). You can check most here:
http://muemlekem.hu/hatareset?egylapon=500&orszag=&telepules=&szuro%5Bany%5D=&szuro%5Bnev%5D=&szuro%5Bhelyiseg_jelenlegi%5D=&szuro%5Bhelyiseg_magyar%5D=Pozsony&szuro%5Bcim%5D=&ob=&od=&submit_egylapon=OK
(Here you can find some chuches, chapels and statues as well.)

As far it concerns statues, they represent someone who has a name. This may either remain in Slovak (e.g. Ľudovít Štúr) or, since they have a proper Hungarian name, they can be translated (e.g. Liszt Ferenc). If their name was originally written in a non-latin alphabet, they will be transcribed into Hungarian using Hungarian orthography (e.g. Anton Grigorjevics Rubinstejn). Sometimes I also added one or two words explaining who or what it is about. Though this may be not part of the original name but it does not hurt and it helps the use of the map (e.g. "componist").

Then there are memorials which remember to a historic event or to unnamed persons. These objects does not have any official Hungarian translations at all, however, they can be easily and unequivocally translated (e.g. Pamätník Československej republiky or Pontónový most cez Dunaj (1945) or Sovietskym vojakom). It would be difficult to find them any other name in Hungarian than I did, nonetheless, you removed the Hungarian names so now no Hungarian people know what they are all about.

Though, I think even if there are no "official" names for several objects in Hungarian, it nontheless improves ways the quality of the map (at least for Hungarian users) if you translate them, in particular if their meaning is obvious. Otherwise these points will be useful only for those speaking Slovak.

Also in Hungary, you can find many proper (and even common) Slovak names on OSM, and I think it just makes the map better, e.g. http://overpass-turbo.eu/s/XVz

Kind regards,


Gábor Babos