L&SC Regional Championships - 2009

Di

06.01.2009, 20:54

London & Southern Counties Regional Championships  
Championship Section   
Test Piece : Salute to Youth, (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=34837)Gilbert Vinter  
Sunday 22nd March  
(Commences : Following First Section)  
Venue : Gordon Craig Theatre,   
Arts & Leisure Centre, Stevenage  
Adjudicator: Philip Sparke  
  
Participating Bands:   
  
Aveley & Newham, N Taken   
Bedford Town, P Mayes   
City of Cambridge. D Wilson   
Clacton-on-Sea Co-operative, L Morgan   
Ipswich & Norwich Co-op, R Norman   
Kidlington Concert Brass, C Underwood   
KM Medway, M White   
Milton Keynes (Broseley), P Fensom   
Redbridge Brass, J Wise   
Staines Brass, M White   
Wantage Silver "A", P Bailey   
Zone One Brass, tbc  
  
London & Southern Counties Regional Championships  
First Section   
Test Piece : Pentacle, Graham Cole (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=34838)  
Sunday 22nd March  
(Commences : 10:00 am)  
Venue : Gordon Craig Theatre,   
Arts & Leisure Centre, Stevenage  
Adjudicator: Paul Cosh  
  
Participating Bands:   
  
Cawston, C Swaep   
Denham Hendon Brass, G Davies   
Egham, G Green   
Epsom & Ewell Silver, T Howard   
Friary Guildford, C King   
Grimsdyke Brass, S Broughall   
Haverhill Silver, M Ager   
Horsham Borough, K Maxwell   
Jersey Premier Brass, T Pritchard   
Norfolk Brass, D Stowell   
Northfleet Brass, A Austin   
Regent Brass, A Duguid   
Sandhurst Silver, I McElligott   
Soham Comrades, K Schroeter   
St Albans City, D Shead   
Welwyn Garden City, J Marshall  
  
London & Southern Counties Regional Championships  
Second Section  
Test Piece : New World Sketches, Daniel Price (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=34839)  
Saturday 21st March  
(Commences : Following Third Section)  
Venue : Gordon Craig Theatre,   
Arts & Leisure Centre, Stevenage  
Adjudicator: Philip Sparke  
  
Participating Bands :   
  
Alder Valley, R Burke   
Becontree Brass, C Chambers   
Brighton & Hove City, M Hackett   
Chichester City, M Grace   
Chinnor Silver, D Pegram   
Colchester Band, P Ivey   
Crystal Palace, M Gray   
East London Brass, J Murrill   
Epping Forest, M Easener   
Fairlop Brass, K Jordan   
Littleport Brass, N Bramley   
Norfolk Wherry Brass, L Purdy   
Stantonbury Brass, A Jenkin   
Thundersley Brass, R Morris   
Tilbury, D Duguid   
Ware Brass, P Littlemore   
Yiewsley & West Drayton. C Cole  
  
London & Southern Counties Regional Championships  
Third Section  
Test Piece : The Once and Future King, Andrew Baker (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=34840)  
Saturday 21st March  
(Commences : 10:00 am)  
Venue : Gordon Craig Theatre,   
Arts & Leisure Centre, Stevenage  
Adjudicator: Paul Cosh  
  
Participating Bands :   
  
BAE Systems, K Woodger   
Betteshanger Welfare, T Vinall   
Chalgrove, M Pegram   
Croydon Brass, P Martin   
Fulham, S Jones   
Great Yarmouth Brass, S Philpot   
Hangleton, M Pollard   
Hitchin Town, C Patterson   
Hungerford Town, T Crouter   
L.G.B. Brass, I Stewart   
St. Sebastian, Wokingham, J Kelloway   
Tadley Concert, P Chapman   
Waterbeach Brass, J Utting   
  
London & Southern Counties Regional Championships  
Fourth Section   
Test Piece : The Talisman for Brass Band, Frank Hughes (http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/showthread.php?t=34841)  
Sunday 22nd March  
(Commences : 12 noon)  
Venue : Main Concert Hall,  
Arts & Leisure Centre, Stevenage  
Adjudicator: R Roe  
  
Participating Bands:   
  
Amersham, I Hogan   
Battle Town, J Penton   
Bletchington Silver, N Hall   
Bradwell Silver, B Keech   
Charles Church Camberley, R Cherry   
Cobham, D Ruel   
Cold Ash Brass, M Clark   
Harwich R.B.L., A Sanders   
Hemel Hempstead, G Weeks   
Hilgay Silver, K Beckett   
Jubilee Brass (Oxford), C Sadler   
King's Lynn, S Ingham   
Letchworth Garden City, T Welch   
Milton Keynes Development, D Johnston   
Royston Band, S Earley   
Wantage Silver "B", D Dulforce  
Watford Band, R Graves   
Woodbridge Excelsior, G Shaw  


No-one got anything to say about L&SC then?! I'm looking forward to our first year in the Championship section since before I joined the band! And on a great test-piece  
  
Also looking forward to not missing all of the weekend's 6 nations matches 'cos they're all on Saturday! :clap:

No-one got anything to say about L&SC then?! I'm looking forward to our first year in the Championship section since before I joined the band! And on a great test-piece  
  
Also looking forward to not missing all of the weekend's 6 nations matches 'cos they're all on Saturday! :clap:  
  
Good news re the rugby!  
  
OK I'll start.  
  
Which bands are buying in half the British Army musicians based in London to help them this year! Lets get that major annual whinge out of the way early. :wink:  
  
Chunky grins cheekily and removes tongue from cheek!

Good news re the rugby!  
  
OK I'll start.  
  
Which bands are buying in half the British Army musicians based in London to help them this year! Lets get that major annual whinge out of the way early. :wink:  
  
Chunky grins cheekily and removes tongue from cheek!  
  
We are buying in Ex Army uniforms, as we cannot possibly afford the cost of hiring in 25 players plus four percussionists.

John 8:7 ;)

We are buying in Ex Army uniforms, as we cannot possibly afford the cost of hiring in 25 players plus four percussionists.  
  
Are you getting bow ties with the deal? You know how the L &SC rules are specific over neck wear!

John 8:7 ;)  
  
Yea though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death I shall fear no Second section piece at Stevenage (just about on topic LOL)

Are you getting bow ties with the deal? You know how the L &SC rules are specific over neck wear!  
  
Alas not, we will have to make do with last seasons relatively dated, but suspiciously procured, neck wear.

Quite looking forward to my first areas down South. I assume it'll be full of confused looking people with trumpets and french horns.

Why are all the tests the same for all the regionals. it's weird. over in nz regionals, we have a own choice, a hymn, and a 30min concit. :confused:

Quite looking forward to my first areas down South. I assume it'll be full of confused looking people with trumpets and french horns.  
  
They will be holding cornets, but will be back on trumpet the next day:wink:

They will be holding cornets, but will be back on trumpet the next day:wink:  
  
So, not playing them.. just holding them... ???

So, not playing them.. just holding them... ???  
  
Shhh I'm counting......

OK Hands up who's got a full band yet...?  
  
... <wind & tumbleweed >  


OK Hands up who's got a full band yet...?Perhaps some are still saving up for one :rolleyes:

Perhaps some are still saving up for one :rolleyes:  
  
Seem anything good in the sales Geoff?

OK Hands up who's got a full band yet...?  
  
... <wind & tumbleweed >  
  
Yes thanks, we have.

Yes thanks, we have.  
  
To the best of my knowledge we are sorted too!

Seem anything good in the sales Geoff?I wasn't speaking personally :biggrin:

I wasn't speaking personally :biggrin:  
  
Glad to hear it! :tup

On the other hand, I'm thinking of bidding on a shed-builder elsewhere :biggrin:. Can you lend me a quid?

Cheque's in the post :wink:

Quite looking forward to my first areas down South. I assume it'll be full of confused looking people with trumpets and french horns.  
  
And people who think they understand what Brass Bands are all about   
\- with their whippet on their head and trailing a cloth cap on a piece of string and saying 'ecky-thump that last band wer't good-un, tha knows" only in a cockney accent.

It's great having Lynchie back with comedy on full throttle..

Any news on timings venues as yet?

Incomplete information here: http://www.regional-contest.org.uk/london/index.php?page=contest_details

Incomplete information here: http://www.regional-contest.org.uk/london/index.php?page=contest_details  
Thanks Gareth , hence the question!

Thanks Gareth , hence the question!  
  
I think the meeting to decide timings etc was due to be held last weekend, but not sure whether it did take place or not. As Contest Secretary of a band in the area, I've been expecting to receive the information in the post very soon, but haven't seen a postman now since Wednesday, presumably due to the snow, although I don't understand why the website hasn't been updated with the info.

Thanks Gareth , hence the question!  
  
Fair enough; I wasn't sure how much detail you needed. For example, so far as we are concerned, we know we are in the Theatre on Sunday AM, which is as much info as we need for planning at present. I appreciate that other sections need more detail than is currently available.

Timings now confirmed. First dreadful performance will be 10AM Saturday. Plenty more planned for shortly afterwards. Two decent efforts late Sunday. Nuff said.

Timings now confirmed. First dreadful performance will be 10AM Saturday. Plenty more planned for shortly afterwards. Two decent efforts late Sunday. Nuff said.  
I heard that the National Anthem contest will be won by the band that plays No.1

I heard that the National Anthem contest will be won by the band that plays No.1  
  
only if played with a full on Northern Warble and ultra-vibrato, otherwise it will be deemed "not like them northern bands play" and as such be outside the rules and regulations....;)

Timings etc were sent out last week, but for obvious reasons the post has been cr*p round most of our area - we didn't see the postie here until Friday.  
  
This is lifted straight from the organisers' letter:  
  
SAT 21st:  
3rd Section  
Gordon Craig Theatre  
15 bands  
Adjudicator Paul Cosh  
Draw 9am; Starts 10am  
  
2nd Section  
Gordon Craig Theatre  
17 bands  
Adjudicator Philip Sparke  
Draw 2pm; Starts after 3rd section results  
  
SUN 22nd:  
1st Section  
Gordon Craig Theatre  
16 bands  
Adjudicator Paul Cosh  
Draw 9am; Starts 10am  
  
Championship Section  
Gordon Craig Theatre  
12 bands  
Adjudicator Philip Sparke  
Draw 2.30pm; Starts after 1st section results  
  
4th Section  
"Main Concert Hall" (aka the barn/Sports Hall)  
16 bands  
Adjudicator Roy Roe  
Draw 11am; Starts 12 noon  
  
If your contest secs haven't got the info yet, it should arrive in the next few days.

Gosh, only 16 bands in the fourth section... there were 22 bands last year.

Timings etc were sent out last week, but for obvious reasons the post has been cr*p round most of our area - we didn't see the postie here until Friday.  
  
This is lifted straight from the organisers' letter:  
  
SAT 21st:  
3rd Section  
Gordon Craig Theatre  
15 bands  
Adjudicator Paul Cosh  
Draw 9am; Starts 10am  
  
2nd Section  
Gordon Craig Theatre  
17 bands  
Adjudicator Philip Sparke  
Draw 2pm; Starts after 3rd section results  
  
SUN 22nd:  
1st Section  
Gordon Craig Theatre  
16 bands  
  
Draw 9am; Starts 10am  
  
Championship Section  
Gordon Craig Theatre  
12 bands  
Adjudicator Philip Sparke  
Draw 2.30pm; Starts after 1st section results  
  
4th Section  
"Main Concert Hall" (aka the barn/Sports Hall)  
16 bands  
Adjudicator Roy Roe  
Draw 11am; Starts 12 noon  
  
If your contest secs haven't got the info yet, it should arrive in the next few days.  
  
Thanks for this Alex, much appreciated  
  
The theatre being used on the saturday is good news indeed!

Maybe we should all go to Stevenage Wednesday 18th March for this LOL (http://www.stevenage-leisure.co.uk/CentrenbspLocator/StevenageArtsLeisureCentre/GordonCraigTheatre/WhatsOn/WhatsOnEvent/tabid/387/eventid/1182/Default.aspx)

On the other hand, I'm thinking of bidding on a shed-builder elsewhere :biggrin:. Can you lend me a quid?  
  
Percussionists usually cost a lot more than that! Thankfully we have three at zero cost - must be a record!

Maybe we should all go to Stevenage Wednesday 18th March for this LOL (http://www.stevenage-leisure.co.uk/CentrenbspLocator/StevenageArtsLeisureCentre/GordonCraigTheatre/WhatsOn/WhatsOnEvent/tabid/387/eventid/1182/Default.aspx)  
  
Yeah, I can think of several bands that would be absolutely perfect performers for "An evening of Mediumship" ;)

Yeah, I can think of several bands that would be absolutely perfect performers for "An evening of Mediumship" ;)  
  
Won't be there for the medium - however I can assure you that I will be Extra-Larging it in the bar after we have played!

Save me a space at the bar!

Save me a space at the bar!  
  
Just bring your wallet, unlike after the Cathedral concert ;)

Gosh, only 16 bands in the fourth section... there were 22 bands last year.  
  
This could have something to do with the test piece.  
  
In 1997 the test piece was Pennine Moors by Mr D Barry, and there were 8 bands  
  
In 1999 the test piece was Indian Summer by Eric Ball with 33 bands, a split draw, and a very tired adjudicator at the end of the contest.  
  
These two years are, for as long as I've been doing the L&SC, the lowest and highest entries for the fourth section.

Hi,  
  
Has anyone thought about the position of the box in the theatre at the Area in Stevenage...Im not sure if it would mean that you would get lots of cornet sound...?  
I wonder what its like sitting there....I sat near it and thought it was an odd balance..but that might have the band playing!! ha ha

It would be helpful if you specified whether you are talking abou the Gordon Craig Theatre or the Concert hall (Gym).  
  
From your description I would say it was the theatre, and can honestly say that we have never had comments about our Cornet section being overbearing, Trombones though is a different matter and they are facing the other way :biggrin:

Yes i do mean the Gordan Craig....it just seems very odd to have it one side..although we have never had any comments about it also...it must have a bearing on how the balance of the band is...as I said when i listened to a band from there it did..

Rather you than me sit through a load of bands all playing the same thing. I tend to be the other side of the building, setting the temperance movement back about 250 years, with certain other local players who shall remain nameless, you all know who you are.

Just bring your wallet, unlike after the Cathedral concert ;)  
  
See ya at the bar Chunky!!

Rather you than me sit through a load of bands all playing the same thing. I tend to be the other side of the building, setting the temperance movement back about 250 years, with certain other local players who shall remain nameless, you all know who you are.  
  
I would love to join you but for the fact that I will probably be under my own steam.  
  
Any suggestions anybody on how to convince my missus that it's a great idea for her to drive? She doesn't seem too keen...

Treat her out somewhere, BassTrumpet!!

Treat her out somewhere, BassTrumpet!!  
  
What, in Stevenage? :confused:

Non Monsieur!! Beforehand, like this weekend or next!!

Rather you than me sit through a load of bands all playing the same thing. I tend to be the other side of the building, setting the temperance movement back about 250 years, with certain other local players who shall remain nameless, you all know who you are.  
  
Guilty as charged m'lud !!

Rather you than me sit through a load of bands all playing the same thing. I tend to be the other side of the building, setting the temperance movement back about 250 years, with certain other local players who shall remain nameless, you all know who you are.  
  
Guilty as charged m'lud !!  
  
I can't let you take the rap all by yourself, suppose you had better count me in as being there!

See ya at the bar Chunky!!  
  
Unless you are there on Sunday as well as Saturday, you will not see me!

Ah, that's a shame then. I was going to buy you a pint or two!!!

OK Hands up who's got a full band yet...?  
  
denham band down to 24 for this year? i don't believe you. trash talk.

denham band down to 24 for this year? i don't believe you. trash talk.  
  
hahaha - my old friend is back on line I see!

hahaha - my old friend is back on line I see!  
  
Someone's been kicking rocks and letting trolls out :)

denham band down to 24 for this year? i don't believe you. trash talk.  
  
Calm down.

denham band down to 24 for this year? i don't believe you. trash talk.  
  
Take a deep breath - count to 10 and then say very slowly "it's on-ly a bra-ss ba-nd con-test!"

City of Cambridge have a full band and three sheddies and no deps/ringers! Must be a record. Not only that, but we've had to lay off one player as we usually play 5 basses.  
  
Saying that, I realise that this is a luxury. So many bands are struggling for players at the moment that doing a contest turns out to be a logistical nightmare, especially the Areas as nobody can borrow. Perhaps there might be rule change at some point in the future to accommodate this, but I can't see how it would work.

Take a deep breath - count to 10 and then say very slowly "it's on-ly a bra-ss ba-nd con-test!"  
  
ha.. .. I might direct you to this post if your bands come the wrong end of the results :)...  
  
just kidding... :D

See you guys at the pub(isn't there?) just near the theatre?

City of Cambridge have a full band and three sheddies and no deps/ringers! Must be a record. Not only that, but we've had to lay off one player as we usually play 5 basses.   
  
Ditto Ipswich (apart from the laying off of one bit) - Looking forward to it.

Ditto Ipswich (apart from the laying off of one bit) - Looking forward to it.  
  
Best of luck Robin. We'll show them that the carrot-crunching East Anglian bands are just as good as the London boys!  
  
Very interesting that both East Anglian top section band have conductors living in Huntingdonshire. Must be something in the water!

ha.. .. I might direct you to this post if your bands come the wrong end of the results :)...  
  
just kidding... :D  
  
that would be something of a shock given some of the dross that will be on offer

Very interesting that both East Anglian top section band have conductors living in Huntingdonshire. Must be something in the water!  
  
"putting huntingdonshire on the brass band map". quite an achievement - there are good reasons why they took it off the map.

"putting huntingdonshire on the brass band map". quite an achievement - there are good reasons why they took it off the map.  
  
Such as?  
  
You'll be surprised how many bands there are round here. Some have folded, but some are thriving. There is less competition emphasis though, so most bands don't enter.  
  
BTW, no need to be rude :D

I was planning on getting the train up to Stevenage on the Sunday for an early start. If anyone else had that idea, could be a bit of a problem, there is a bus/rail replacement between Welwyn Garden City and Stevenage due to major engineering works.  
  
http://www.firstcapitalconnect.co.uk/Main.php?iCmsPageId=64&sCalDate=2009-03&sViewDate=2009-03-22&sF=1   
  
Chris

City of Cambridge have a full band and three sheddies and no deps/ringers! Must be a record. Not only that, but we've had to lay off one player as we usually play 5 basses.  
  
Saying that, I realise that this is a luxury. So many bands are struggling for players at the moment that doing a contest turns out to be a logistical nightmare, especially the Areas as nobody can borrow. Perhaps there might be rule change at some point in the future to accommodate this, but I can't see how it would work.  
  
what would be better would be if your 'spare' bass was allowed to play with a band that is short of a bass

what would be better would be if your 'spare' bass was allowed to play with a band that is short of a bass  
  
Oh, don't worry, he'll have plenty to do on the day - the other basses have already put in their bar order for when we get off the stage!

I was planning on getting the train up to Stevenage on the Sunday for an early start. If anyone else had that idea, could be a bit of a problem, there is a bus/rail replacement between Welwyn Garden City and Stevenage due to major engineering works.  
  
http://www.firstcapitalconnect.co.uk/Main.php?iCmsPageId=64&sCalDate=2009-03&sViewDate=2009-03-22&sF=1   
  
Chris  
  
Engineering works affect Saturday travel as well: the bus journey itself takes about 20 minutes, but connections add to the delay :(  
  
(I've got engineering works my end as well - longer train journey than usual, fortunately, rather than a bus - so it will mean a 5.53 departure to get there for 9)

Such as?  
  
You'll be surprised how many bands there are round here. Some have folded, but some are thriving. There is less competition emphasis though, so most bands don't enter.  
  
BTW, no need to be rude :D  
  
it makes rutland look consequential

http://www.themouthpiece.com/vb/webchat/attach/jpg.gif

City of Cambridge have a full band and three sheddies and no deps/ringers! Must be a record. Not only that, but we've had to lay off one player as we usually play 5 basses.  
  
Saying that, I realise that this is a luxury. So many bands are struggling for players at the moment that doing a contest turns out to be a logistical nightmare, especially the Areas as nobody can borrow. Perhaps there might be rule change at some point in the future to accommodate this, but I can't see how it would work.  
  
There should be a rule that allows a certain bit of flexibility, it so happens that the struggling bands often find enough players in the knick of time... After the nightmare that is finding and signing!  
  
As for full bands, well one month you have one the next month due to work and all sorts of reasons you might lose a couple and everythings up in the air! So I would touch wood..  
  
Best of luck to all the EA contenders  
  
Matt

No doubt I be corrected by MRSH, but as far as I know, we are taking 4 sheddies to, and no deps.

No doubt I be corrected by MRSH, but as far as I know, we are taking 4 sheddies to, and no deps.Yes indeed we are. And one of the percussionists is one of our cornet players who is a top notch piano player and is making an excellent job of the tuned percussion part.   
  
Plus we have had to drop players and stop players from joining right now as we wouldn't be able to take them to the Areas!!! :eek:

Yes indeed we are. And one of the percussionists is one of our cornet players who is a top notch piano player and is making an excellent job of the tuned percussion part.   
  
Plus we have had to drop players and stop players from joining right now as we wouldn't be able to take them to the Areas!!! :eek:  
  
I thought I was right there! Not bad with other people wanting to join the band as well!

...."An evening of Mediumship" ;)  
  
Just re-read through earlier posts. Not many of my lot could be described as Medium. More like XL Wide Fit :tongue:

There should be a rule that allows a certain bit of flexibility, it so happens that the struggling bands often find enough players in the knick of time... After the nightmare that is finding and signing!  
  
I agree with you there, Matt. The Nationals is the only competition where borrowing isn't allowed, but it never used to be like that. Borrowing only came into effect about 10-12 years ago. Before that, if you were a player short, tough!  
  
Perhaps it might be possible for players to be borrowed, so long as they don't play for anybody else in the Regionals. I singed up to help a band out last year, but I could hardly be described as a member. Under this idea, I could sign an agreement to play with another band, so long as I don't play with the band I'm signed for.  
  
However, this might be hard to enforce over the 8 area contests. Perhaps a whole re-gig of the registration process is needed with on-line forms, password protection, face/fingerprint recognition, DNA samples.....  
  
Ok ,that's a bit far fetched, but I do think it needs to be modernised! Can you imagine giving a DNA sample before going on stage? :oops:

Duncan I hear what you are saying. Perhaps if bands cancelled registrations of players that have either  
  
a) left  
b) they only signed for one contest  
c) they have no intention of using on the day  
  
it would free more players to be 'new signings' for struggling bands rather than having the hassle of transferring a player who is not even playing with a band.  
  
I personally feel you should go to ANY contest with your own band of regular registered players and be judged on your strength as a band, not on the size of your cheque book or the amount of favours you can call in. I maybe a dreamer, but I'm not the only one.

Duncan I hear what you are saying. Perhaps if bands cancelled registrations of players that have either  
  
a) left  
b) they only signed for one contest  
c) they have no intention of using on the day  
  
it would free more players to be 'new signings' for struggling bands rather than having the hassle of transferring a player who is not even playing with a band.  
  
I personally feel you should go to ANY contest with your own band of regular registered players and be judged on your strength as a band, not on the size of your cheque book or the amount of favours you can call in. I maybe a dreamer, but I'm not the only one.  
  
Says you from the fully subscribed band ;)  
  
Good on you for having that luxury, those of us who's bands are struggling to get bands irrespective of contests ( believe me I'd much rather have a full cornet section the rest of the year ) have no option but to use our (ir)regular helpers, they aren't displacing anyone or moving anyone, simply filling the empty seats. Otherwise a number of bands wouldn't be going.

Says you from the fully subscribed band ;)  
  
Good on you for having that luxury, those of us who's bands are struggling to get bands irrespective of contests ( believe me I'd much rather have a full cornet section the rest of the year ) have no option but to use our (ir)regular helpers, they aren't displacing anyone or moving anyone, simply filling the empty seats. Otherwise a number of bands wouldn't be going.  
  
Steve, just to point out that at many times during the 30 years I have been associated with Cawston we have gone to contests under strength, so its a long term belief not purely based on our current situation!

Steve, just to point out that at many times during the 30 years I have been associated with Cawston we have gone to contests under strength, so its a long term belief not purely based on our current situation!  
  
In principle I agree , but theres under strength and then theres not going and unfortunatley too much rides on the areas to risk it.   
  
If a band gets a few players to fill some empty seats I have no problem with that ( we'll have to agree to disagee on that one, your far to nice a bloke to start an argument with over it ;) ) I do object to bands which a) "get people in" and bump down the regulars or b) spend the year trying to sign every player on the planet when they already have a full band.

In principle I agree , but theres under strength and then theres not going and unfortunatley too much rides on the areas to risk it.   
  
What rides on it? Ok yes your National grading can be effected. However if you can't attract the players to say a 1st section band, will it make that much difference if you are relegated? It could actually help, because players who do not consider themselves good enough for the 1st section, maybe attracted to a 2nd section band.  
  
Please note I have only used 1st section as an example, it of course can apply over any section.  
  
If a band gets a few players to fill some empty seats I have no problem with that ( we'll have to agree to disagee on that one, your far to nice a bloke to start an argument with over it ;) ) I do object to bands which a) "get people in" and bump down the regulars or b) spend the year trying to sign every player on the planet when they already have a full band.  
  
Now if you get these players in, and I do understand the reasons behind bands doing it, and you maintain your status, is it not surely a false status within banding circles and what do you gain  
  
Does your section grading ensure:  
  
1) Better paid jobs?  
  
I have never been asked by a concert organisor what our National Grading is so the can pay us accordingly  
  
2) Larger audiences?  
  
No, on the whole the general public listen to a band irrespective of their grading, because on the whole it means nothing to them. They just want to hear a band play.   
  
3) A bigger band?  
  
Well because we are having this conversation that one answers itself!  
  
As for falling out, ditto mate. See you for a cuppa next Sunday! ;)

Pity your not there on Saturday, Chunky. I'd buy you a beer, after I bought my MD one, ofcourse!

Pity your not there on Saturday, Chunky. I'd buy you a beer, after I bought my MD one, ofcourse!You only have to buy him one if you screw up!

You only have to buy him one if you screw up!  
  
Hopefully, we wont scew up Andy!

What rides on it? Ok yes your National grading can be effected. However if you can't attract the players to say a 1st section band, will it make that much difference if you are relegated? It could actually help, because players who do not consider themselves good enough for the 1st section, maybe attracted to a 2nd section band.  
  
Please note I have only used 1st section as an example, it of course can apply over any section.  
  
Now if you get these players in, and I do understand the reasons behind bands doing it, and you maintain your status, is it not surely a false status within banding circles and what do you gain  
  
Does your section grading ensure:  
  
1) Better paid jobs?  
  
I have never been asked by a concert organisor what our National Grading is so the can pay us accordingly  
  
2) Larger audiences?  
  
No, on the whole the general public listen to a band irrespective of their grading, because on the whole it means nothing to them. They just want to hear a band play.   
  
3) A bigger band?  
  
Well because we are having this conversation that one answers itself!  
  
As for falling out, ditto mate. See you for a cuppa next Sunday! ;)  
  
no, but it does mean we might attract more players and fill those gaps ( thats the theory anyway ), not to mention pushing the standard in the bandroom, of course the irony ( in our case ) is that these players are regular helpers/deps so yes it pretty much does represent the standard of the band we put out for concerts...  
  
look forward to that cup of tea, will be good to catch up and chat.

I do object to bands which a) "get people in" and bump down the regulars  
  
Steve -  
  
Denham Hendon Brass Band (http://www.denham-hendon-brass.org.uk/)  
  
really?

really?  
  
Yes. you have a point? or is your blinding ignorance as bad as your manners?

Pity your not there on Saturday, Chunky. I'd buy you a beer, after I bought my MD one, of course!One of many, BBM ;)  
  
You only have to buy him one if you screw up!Not at all, Andy. As you well know anybody can buy me a drink after I buy the first 'full band' round :tup  
  
Hopefully, we wont screw up Andy!I'm hoping so too :eek:

One of many, BBM ;)  
  
Not at all, Andy. As you well know anybody can buy me a drink after I buy the first 'full band' round :tup  
  
I'm hoping so too :eek:I have no doubt that Brighton & Hove City Brass will be up there come the results next week - best of luck chaps!

Thank you, Andy. If MRSH doesn't come on to tmp before tomorrow afternoon, i will pass your 'best of luck' to him and the rest of the band Monday!

Beer-talk aside, I've been studying the results of the 5 area contests so far and it seems there have been quite a few upsets this year. On the face of it, Salute to Youth looks easy, but I know from first-hand experience it isn't.  
  
Perhaps the bands that can already play the notes are trying to tease too much music out of a piece that simply just needs to be played 'right'? Maybe the results in Yorkshire and Lancashire prove that the bands who are willing to respect Gilbert Vinter's score for what it is are the ones that eventually shine through.  
  
I am, of course, going by 2nd hand information. However, most educated reports say that Dyke, Grimethorpe, Leyland etc. were simply trying too hard to find that extra 'something' in a piece that simply needs to be played well.  
  
In the L&SC there are really only 2-3 'big' bands in the top section. By 'big' bands, I don't in any way wish to be disrespectful towards the other bands (one of which I conduct), but I simply mean bands that can challenge the rest of the country. Perhaps this year might just be the year for one of the non-London bands to shine through?  
  
I, for one, am on the edge of my seat. Not because of my own involvement, but I really do think that the choice of STY might throw the contest open for some bands to come unstuck and others to achive stardom.  
  
Best of luck everybody!

I doubt wether any of the 'top bands' in the L&SC region will get a high placing at RAH in October. The South West bands may just.

I doubt wether any of the 'top bands' in the L&SC region will get a high placing at RAH in October. The South West bands may just.  
  
Quite right, they have to qualify first...

Quite right, they have to qualify first...  
  
I know, I wasn't meaning that, was I?

I doubt wether any of the 'top bands' in the L&SC region will get a high placing at RAH in October. The South West bands may just.  
  
One word...BUTLINS :clap:

  
with all due respect I think the lineup at RAH will be a little stronger than Butlins

Why you say Butlins, Goldie Horn?

Why you say Butlins, Goldie Horn?  
  
Because Redbridge won!

Looking forward to this weekend, good luck to everyone but especially our friends at Cawston.

Because Redbridge won!  
  
i should have guess that one was coming. I still think we will have a struggle on our hands in Octbober.

with all due respect I think the lineup at RAH will be a little stronger than Butlins  
  
Yeah, I know the line-up will be very strong at the Albert Hall, but the line-up at Butlins was strong too and they beat many bands who have done well at the areas recently!  
  
Anyway, lets stay positive!!! Just putting my support behind a particular band!!! :oops:  
  
Good Luck to everyone next weekend.

We can only have a positive mind over this, really. Redbridge, I doubt will get higher than 6th, on a good day, IMO, at RAH.

And you play for???..... And on what basis do you make your considered view of how the top bands will get on, in relation to those from around the country?

And you play for???..... And on what basis do you make your considered view of how the top bands will get on, in relation to those from around the country?  
  
past results at RAH perhaps?

past results at RAH perhaps?  
  
Yes.

Sorry, folks. I had no itention of opening a can of worms!

And you play for???..... And on what basis do you make your considered view of how the top bands will get on, in relation to those from around the country?  
let's just call it intuition.

let's just call it intuition.  
  
Maybe 2009 is the year for L&SC bands across all sections to really make an impression on a national stage?? I hope so but time well tell...In the meantime, perhaps players like Super Ph should have more faith in his fellow London based banders!

Wouldn't that be good, SimonHorn. Do you know your band's result's from the Regionals and Nationals, say for the past five years?

The Nationals may not have been the most fertile of hunting grounds for London bands in recent years but both Redbridge and Avely and Newham have consistently represented the region well at the Open and other high profile contests throughout the years . Butlins this year was another excellent set of results across the sections for Southern bands too - Redbridge obviously , and also East London Brass and Fulham doing well .  
  
Obviously us poor benighted southerners realise that we're all rubbish really and can't hold a candle to anything north of the watford gap !!! Luckily many of the adjudicators at successive regionals down here never fail to point out our many shortcomings each year so we can be reminded of our rightful place !! :)

Well, with some of the northerners swelling our ranks, i am surpsied that hasn't come through with the sound that we make. Perhaps we just havn't that je ne c'est pas?

Well, with some of the northerners swelling our ranks, i am surpsied that hasn't come through with the sound that we make. Perhaps we just havn't that je ne c'est pas?  
  
"je ne sais pas"  
  
You'd think being so close to France and all...  
  
Anyway, apparently a band from Luton won the nationals in 1923, so it's about time the trophy stayed down south for longer than a day.

"je ne sais pas"  
  
You'd think being so close to France and all...  
  
Anyway, apparently a band from Luton won the nationals in 1923, so it's about time the trophy stayed down south for longer than a day.  
  
Thank you for that Lynchie, the French bit! I couldn't agree more, re the trophy coming down south for a change!!!

uhm, not that my French is so great, but I think the phrase you're looking for is "je ne sais quoi"

uhm, not that my French is so great, but I think the phrase you're looking for is "je ne sais quoi"  
  
Depends what you're trying to say, innit.

I am looking forward to next weekend - never played in the Championship section before, so it'll be a new experience. One of the best bits is the majority of the band hasn't changed since last year and promotion from the first section (Although a few players are sitting on different seats, myself included), so it'll be interesting seeing how we do!  
  
Talking of interesting, been a few suprising results over the last few weeks in the championship section and I wonder if this weekend will be any different?

The Nationals may not have been the most fertile of hunting grounds for London bands in recent years  
maybe that is just bad luck  
  
but both Redbridge and Avely and Newham have consistently represented the region well at the Open  
you are going to have to explain this one i think. i make it 1 qualification (with immediate relegation) this century. the region's record could hardly be worse.

Good luck all for the weekend

Yes, everyone, good luck and see you all there, well, the saturday people!!

I will put bets on a 3 horse race between Redbridge, Aveley and Zone 1, The rest is anyones game as seen in the past! Good luck with all your interpretations :-P I also hope I & N and Cambridge both do enough to stay up! All the best, be confident :-P   
  
Matt

My old chums at Becontree have received the 4br kiss of death !! Tipped for 3rd place.  
Good to see them do reasonably at Butlins , with a lot of new faces in the band. Best wishes for saturday boys and girls !! :)  
  
The form obviously suggests Redbridge and Avely & Newham for the RAH , but there have been surprises around the country so lets see if we can do the same between the rest of us in the champ section !!  
  
And a "shout" out for Chunky and all at Cawston !!

Yes, pity I wont be there on Sunday to see Cawston play and give Chunky, especially, a cheer.   
  
4barsrest.com, gives us a favourable preview.

Looking forward to this weekend, good luck to everyone but especially our friends at Cawston.  
  
And a "shout" out for Chunky and all at Cawston !!  
  
Thanks for the love guys!  
  
Good luck to all the East Anglian Bands at the weekend in all sections, but especially I & N Co Op.   
  
See you all in the bar!

See you in the bar or the burger wagon Chunky mate.  
  
Ps Rebekah says don't forgot her 2 tickets :tongue::biggrin:

Hmmm, dark horses... let's hope we don't fall at the first fence...   
  
NO, I'm thinking positive... we won't fall at the first fence...

4BR have not got us (Chalgrove) in the top six - would be nice to prove them wrong-but win or lose good luck to all the bands-and also for my old mate Nigel Hall in the 4th section with Bletchingdon on Sunday

My old chums at Becontree have received the 4br kiss of death !! Tipped for 3rd place.  
  
Couldn't agree more. When I played with GUS, we were tipped by 4BR for so many contests and it always proved to be a poison chalice. Mind you, taking that logic to it's conclusion, it'll be an Ipswich/Cambridge one-two then! Doesn't hurt to be positive.:rolleyes:  
  
Nice to see Cawston have got a lot of mates on here. I'll miss them, but my Mum and Dad will be cheering them on!

good luck to milton keynes brass on saturday

Couldn't agree more. Mind you, taking that logic to it's conclusion, it'll be an Ipswich/Cambridge one-two then! Doesn't hurt to be positive.  
  
*sings*  
The championship ( the championship )  
is upside down ( is upside down )  
The championship is upside down  
We're off to London with the Cambridge  
And Redbridge are going down !! :)  
  
I'll get me coat.

Have you started drinking already Phil?

Looks like it!! Not Irish Essex Elvis?

Have you started drinking already Phil?  
  
I did not realise Phil drunk...... until I met him one day when he was sober! ;)

See you in the bar or the burger wagon Chunky mate.  
  
Ps Rebekah says don't forgot her 2 tickets :tongue::biggrin:  
  
Will you be there on Sunday Butty?

Well, not longer to go now. Hope everyone is doing ok for Saturday and that everyone has a great weekend.

Best wishes to all competing this weekend.  
  
I'll be there on the Saturday (and responsible for the 4br retrospective :-?) so if you spot me come up and introduce yourself ;)

Will you be there on Sunday Butty?  
  
Yes to the burger wagon mate, possibly to the contest :biggrin: :biggrin:

I'll be there on the Saturday (and responsible for the 4br retrospective :-?) so if you spot me come up and introduce yourself ;)  
  
Are you doing sunday as well Peter?

All the best to the 1st section bands playing Pentacle this weekend in the London & Southern Counties areas. I am once again hoping to hear all the bands in the 1st section on Sunday - so good luck!  
:)

^What he said ;)  
  
Best wishes to all the 3rd section bands tackling The Once and Future King this weekend - unlike Graham, sadly I can't be there (mixture of rehearsals for Tameside next week, and family commitments), but I'll be keeping a close eye on the results :tup

Are you doing sunday as well Peter?  
  
Not doing Sunday this year (working :(); I think it may be Chris Thomas on Sunday but I don't know for sure.

All the best to the 1st section bands playing Pentacle this weekend in the London & Southern Counties areas. I am once again hoping to hear all the bands in the 1st section on Sunday - so good luck!  
:)  
  
We'll try and do our best :) It has been an enjoyable challenge working on your piece.

Massive congratulations to my brother-in-law Lee Woodward for leading St. Sebastian Wokingham to victory at his first conducting appearance at an Area.   
  
Well done mate, enjoy !!!!!  
  
Paul

obviously no contentious results today at Stevenage?

note to 4BR - as you were told last year and the year before, the name of LGB Brass is NOT LBG - I even wrote to you last year to point this out. This is pure laziness on your part. I am writing this here because you clearly don't read the comments sent in to your site.

And congrats to Simon Jones and Fulham, a well-deserved 4th place! Should have been us up there but hey-ho, that's contesting :-)  
  
Andy

Well, after the 4BR "kiss-of-death" we still managed to finish 4th. I think the audible "Aww" noise from the entire band at the result wasn't really appreciated in the auditorium... :-?  
  
But, it's always nice to be much further away from the relegation places ;-)  
  
Congrats everyone, and see you in Stevenage next year :D

Well done to Lee and St. Sebastian Wokingham, and Chris and Y&WD, good luck to you both in Harrogate.

Well done to all bands this weekend :)  
  
If any of you or anyone in your band found themselves the victim of the clampers in the Leisure Park car park this weekend please make themselves known in a specific thread I've started in this forum. There's a lot of angry bandspersons (including myself) £125 out of pocket! Thanks

Well done to Tim and Hungerford for 2nd place in the third section. May see you in Harrogate.

Well done to all bands this weekend :)  
  
If any of you or anyone in your band found themselves the victim of the clampers in the Leisure Park car park this weekend please make themselves known in a specific thread I've started in this forum. There's a lot of angry bandspersons (including myself) £125 out of pocket! Thanks  
  
A guy in our band got clamped, £125, same thing. Bang out of order, Somehow I dont see the last of this debate! :-P  
  
Well done by the way, I think you were unlucky to come 9th ;-)

Oh well, loose some, you win some. Wasn't our day yesterday(22nd), at Stevange. Onwards and upwards, as the saying goes! Take it onboard and move on to the next one.  
  
ongratulations to the prize winners, in the 2nd Section!

Very happy here! We won the 4th section! :D

1st section Results:  
  
1\. Norfolk   
2\. Sandhurst   
3\. Regent  
4\. Haverhill  
5\. Friary  
6\. Welwyn  
7\. Jersey  
8\. Cawston  
9\. Soham  
10\. Northfleet  
11\. Denham Hendon  
12\. Egham  
13\. St Albans  
14\. Horsham  
15\. Epsom & Ewell  
16\. Grimsdyke  
  
provisional gradings suggest Norfolk & Sandhurst will go up; Denham & Northfleet down.  
  
Congrats to all the prizewinners today and yesterday :clap:

1st section Results:  
  
1\. Norfolk   
2\. Sandhurst   
3\. Regent  
4\. Haverhill  
5\. Friary  
6\. Welwyn  
7\. Jersey  
8\. Cawston  
9\. Soham  
10\. Northfleet  
11\. Denham Hendon  
12\. Egham  
13\. St Albans  
14\. Horsham  
15\. Epsom & Ewell  
16\. Grimsdyke  
  
provisional gradings suggest Norfolk & Sandhurst will go up; Denham & Northfleet down.  
  
Congrats to all the prizewinners today and yesterday :clap:  
  
Stonesfield and Northfleet go down.

Very happy here! We won the 4th section! :D  
  
Harrogate here we come! Well done everyone! :D

Stonesfield and Northfleet go down.  
Oops, sorry! That's goodnews for you guys then.  
I thought Stonesfield were out of the tables now, they must have one more year.

Harrogate here we come! Well done everyone! :D  
  
Well done to all at Battle Town Band:clap:  
John's rigorous rehersal schedule paid-off!!!:tup  
Chris

Oops, sorry! That's goodnews for you guys then.  
I thought Stonesfield were out of the tables now, they must have one more year.  
  
yes thank goodness :D, clinging on by our fingernails. Mind you we've closed the gap a bit so even though we will need a good result next year it's not as bad as it looks at first. That said the bands moving in the right direction and a hopefully if we can get some more players things will improve.

Championship Section:  
  
1\. Redbridge  
2\. Zone One  
3\. Aveley   
4\. Clacton

Excellent weekend as always  
Thanks to all those organising...  
  
Definite highlight for me came late in the whole weekend - Zone One were simply fantastic not heard playing like that from a London band for some time, had to leave shortly after so Redbridge must have been pretty good too.  
  
Well done everyone.......

Well done to winners of 1st section.  
  
To all my chums at WGC band, well done folks... it was a pleasure... :)

Very disappointed off the dreaded no 1 draw but many thanks to David Hobbs and his team for great contest.

Essex Elvis ( Phil ) here on Leyfy's laptop - sorry mods ! Congrats to Redbridge and Zone One , looking forward to supporting you both at RAH. Obviously bit dissapointed in our result but knew we had a bad day around the stands . Many thanks to Robin for all his work with us though , sorry we did not get the result your efforts deserved mate.  
  
Phil

And fair play to Duncan ( BassTrumpet ) and the boys and girls from cambridge - keep the East anglian flag flying !!  
Phil

a few people have commented on us having a bass player doing the whip part today and questioned its legality....   
I clarified the rules with the contest organiser a couple of weeks ago, and the response was that "A brass player may help out on percussion if required, But percussion may not help on brass". I hope that clears things up :wink:

Well done to all the guys & girls a Battle Town Band, a long overdue contest success for you all. Show's that you don't have to have a band full ofhelpful signings in the weeks befor ehte contest to win! Well done to John as well for persisting with a bunch of southerners!  
  
Ta Ta  
  
Fridge

Well done to winners of 1st section.  
  
To all my chums at WGC band, well done folks... it was a pleasure... :)  
  
Right back at you :)  
  
Well done everyone, great first section, really fun and fantastic to see everyone and support the other bands.  
  
:clap:

support other bands? are you sure you've understood the point of this event?

Hopefully, there has been no negative responses from people on here, so far. It makes a change to see this and this coming from somone who didn't do too well on Saturday!

OK then, i'll start. Stevenage is my least favourite event on the entire brass band calendar.

I should have kept my mouth shut, SuperPh!! Well, yes, it's not my favourite either, but I quite enjoyed playing in the theatre. Acoustics not too bad, I thought!

Can I please thank the staff in the 4th section Registration room who looked after a member of my band who was taken ill prior to playing.  
  
Well done to all 4th section bands who tackled "The Tallisman"

Had a really good day (as a spectator) yesterday - and I even stayed sober.  
  
I was very impressed by Zone One and then even more so by Redbridge.  
  
I did'nt hear any of the top 5 in the 1st section so can't comment but I did hear Welwyn and thought they played very well.

by the way if anyone left a harmon mute behind after their celebratory band photograph, i now have 2 so get in touch

a few people have commented on us having a bass player doing the whip part today and questioned its legality....   
I clarified the rules with the contest organiser a couple of weeks ago, and the response was that "A brass player may help out on percussion if required, But percussion may not help on brass". I hope that clears things up :wink:  
  
Thanks again to Phil for his nice crack!

a few people have commented on us having a bass player doing the whip part today and questioned its legality....   
I clarified the rules with the contest organiser a couple of weeks ago, and the response was that "A brass player may help out on percussion if required, But percussion may not help on brass". I hope that clears things up :wink:  
  
Not strictly true - yes a brass player can help with percussion, but also there is nothing stopping a perc player picking up a brass instrument half way through a performance if that same player has been counted as one of the allowed 25 brass musicians beforehand.  
  
Simon

I am looking forward to next weekend - never played in the Championship section before, so it'll be a new experience.   
  
Hope you made the most of it, while it lasted! :p

Anyone got any thoughts on the adjudicator's comments? I thought ours were really MEAN! There was nothing nice in there at all. And none of us thought we'd played THAT badly!

Hearty congratulations to Jon and everyone at Battle on their win yesterday. Long overdue.  
Wish I could have been there. Still, we had a pretty good day ourselves...  
  
Beers all round!

Hope you made the most of it, while it lasted! :p  
  
We'll be back, but cheers for your 'support'.   
  
The most important thing is that we *got* there - as a band - and on Thursday's rehearsal it'll be the same players sitting on the same seats, which is more than I can say for a few other bands in the area.   
  
And no, I don't know who you are or who you play for (suprise, suprise 'newbie') and quite frankly, I don't care, so no - its not a dig at 'your' band, whoever they may be.  
  
Oh, and a big WELL DONE to Zone 1 and Redbridge.

And fair play to Duncan ( BassTrumpet ) and the boys and girls from cambridge - keep the East anglian flag flying !!  
Phil  
  
Many thanks, Phil. We were bitterly disappointed yesterday as I'm sure you were too, but that's contesting for you! I heard a number of bands, but only through the distorted sound system in the bar - mind you it probably wasn't much worse than the sound through a tent!  
  
Come to think of it, my sight was getting slightly distorted as well, by the end of the day. Must be something to do with the lighting, as I'd only had about 10 beers......

Anyone got any thoughts on the adjudicator's comments? I thought ours were really MEAN! There was nothing nice in there at all. And none of us thought we'd played THAT badly!  
  
Completely at odds with his verbal summing up!!

Completely at odds with his verbal summing up!!  
  
Which Adjudictor?  
  
Ours were fine ( no complaints really, though apparently I got ahead of myself at one point....must remember that trick :D )

Which Adjudictor?  
  
Ours were fine ( no complaints really, though apparently I got ahead of myself at one point....must remember that trick :D )  
  
Same as your goodself but in section 3  
  
Verbal: Bands that took second movement too slow where in danger of losing the flow, bands that took third movement too fast lost control.  
  
Written: We were the other way round and got it in the neck for that as well.  
  
Well done yesterday btw Brother in Law played third cornet for you.

Same as your goodself but in section 3  
  
Verbal: Bands that took second movement too slow where in danger of losing the flow, bands that took third movement too fast lost control.  
  
Written: We were the other way round and got it in the neck for that as well.  
  
Well done yesterday btw Brother in Law played third cornet for you.  
  
I've had a few remarks like that in the past ( last year the adjudicator went on about overblowing then slated us for not blowing loud enough! ) some times your damned if you do and damned if you don't  
  
Thanks, and I did't get the chance yesterday so if you could thank him for me when you next see him i'd be grateful:)

Verbal: Bands that took second movement too slow where in danger of losing the flow, bands that took third movement too fast lost control.  
  
Written: We were the other way round and got it in the neck for that as well.  
  
oh no, not one of those adjudicators that wanted everything played at the correct speed?! the very worst kind.

oh no, not one of those adjudicators that wanted everything played at the correct speed?! the very worst kind.  
  
yes afraid so;)  
  
but what was the correct speed we wonder

Anyone got any thoughts on the adjudicator's comments? I thought ours were really MEAN! There was nothing nice in there at all. And none of us thought we'd played THAT badly!  
  
Yes, I have a problem with ours. We didn't have the best of days yesterday and a very dissapointing result, that's all fine, it's contesting. However the adjudicator's comments were disgraceful! There was nothing constructive in there and it was just simply rude!  
  
I've been a fan of that adjudicator most of my life...that all changed yesterday!!!

I clarified the rules with the contest organiser a couple of weeks ago, and the response was that "A brass player may help out on percussion if required, But percussion may not help on brass". I hope that clears things up :wink:  
Not strictly true - yes a brass player can help with percussion, but also there is nothing stopping a perc player picking up a brass instrument half way through a performance if that same player has been counted as one of the allowed 25 brass musicians beforehand.  
  
Thats a very interesting point.... maybe we should test that out next year, lol!  
  
Joking aside though, the point I was trying to make was that we were very definitely within the rules and had confirmed it with the organiser beforehand.

Not strictly true - yes a brass player can help with percussion, but also there is nothing stopping a perc player picking up a brass instrument half way through a performance if that same player has been counted as one of the allowed 25 brass musicians beforehand.  
  
Simon  
  
I am UTTERLY convinced you're speaking from your own experience here...:tongue:

Thats a very interesting point.... maybe we should test that out next year, lol!  
  
Joking aside though, the point I was trying to make was that we were very definitely within the rules and had confirmed it with the organiser beforehand.  
  
Ahh....nothing more heart-warming than the chat of two ultimate band geeks discussing the finer points of contesting...:wink:  
  
Just joking...! Well done Alex yesterday, heard many good things about your performance, didn't hear it myself as didn't want to hear any bands before we played :oops:

I am UTTERLY convinced you're speaking from your own experience here...:tongue:  
  
haha - well there was that time with [UN-NAMED BAND] when I was playing percussion without any proper drum sticks and then I was going to bang in the last 8 bars on soprano with a cornet gob-iron - thank god I didn't!   
  
Memories....:)

Which Adjudictor?  
  
Ours were fine ( no complaints really, though apparently I got ahead of myself at one point....must remember that trick :D )  
Second section, Philip Spark. He just didn't say anything particularly positive in his summing up and our comments were horrible. And I can't believe he didn't mention percussion at all. There was so much in there and we were struggling to cover it with four. I thought we played well, musically, even if not the way he wanted, but no mention of texture, dynamics, etc.  
  
AND - no mention for my bell. OK it wasn't necessarily perfectly in time, but surely points for creativity?

Yes, I have a problem with ours. We didn't have the best of days yesterday and a very dissapointing result, that's all fine, it's contesting. However the adjudicator's comments were disgraceful! There was nothing constructive in there and it was just simply rude!  
  
I've been a fan of that adjudicator most of my life...that all changed yesterday!!!  
  
Well how did they compare to the CD recording...? Think we must have a different bands sheet...haha  
  
Hey ho...another one done...great that they moved the box!!

Ahh....nothing more heart-warming than the chat of two ultimate band geeks discussing the finer points of contesting...:wink:  
  
Just joking...! Well done Alex yesterday, heard many good things about your performance, didn't hear it myself as didn't want to hear any bands before we played :oops:  
cheeky mare! :tongue:  
  
And likewise to you and yours - I didn't hear WGC because I was busy being a beer geek (!) when you played, but it was good to see you get a solid result after the recent upheavals.  
  
As far as the adjudicators remarks go, ours were fine - they were generally very positive, he just didn't like our tempi.... can't argue with that.

AND - no mention for my bell. OK it wasn't necessarily perfectly in time, but surely points for creativity?  
  
I think it was clearly a cursed bell! I wish we'd checked in advance....  
  
Congratulations to all the winners at the weekend - very proud of both bands I was conducting, although still have mixed feelings regarding the results.  
  
Zone One really were excellent in the top section, although I must say I did really enjoy Aveley's performance - the last movement was absolutely the cheekiest one I've ever heard! A fantastically camp rendition!

As far as the adjudicators remarks go, ours were fine - they were generally very positive, he just didn't like our tempi.... can't argue with that.I must say our remarks were rubbish. They told us nothing about our performance, gave no indication where we could improve and, to be honest, were very difficult to relate to our performance on the day. Very disappointed.

cheeky mare! :tongue:  
  
And likewise to you and yours - I didn't hear WGC because I was busy being a beer geek (!) when you played, but it was good to see you get a solid result after the recent upheavals.  
  
As far as the adjudicators remarks go, ours were fine - they were generally very positive, he just didn't like our tempi.... can't argue with that.  
  
Ditto with ours. Tempi.

I must say our remarks were rubbish. They told us nothing about our performance, gave no indication where we could improve and, to be honest, were very difficult to relate to our performance on the day. Very disappointed.  
  
Must say i found our remarks baffling.Good this, good that ,excellent perc and Euph a star player,11TH LOL  
At one point told us it was a little to loud for a p and its mp.GUESS THATS CONTESTING  
WELL DONE ALL THE WINNERS GIVE UM HELL IN HARROGATE

Re comments from the adjudicator , given our poor placing our comments were surprisingly pleasant !! At the risk of a "damned if you do / damned if you don't" scenario for our adjudicators , I personally ( and I'm not speaking for the band here ) would have preferred a more robust critique that showed up where we went wrong so we could go away and work on the weak points. Having said that , I'm a great fan of Mr Sparke and Sunday night was notable in the bar for the fact that , good humoured joshing apart there was no real animosity between bands in the champ section and no-one was having a pop over the adjudicator either !! There must be something wrong with us all down here !!  
  
Again , best of luck to Zone One and Redbridge at the finals. We'll pick ourselves up , dust off and head to Norwich in a few weeks to defend our title up there after I've ritually burnt my hitherto-named ( but sadly innacurate since Harrogate! ) lucky pants.

I played wih Colchester in the second and I have to say that our comments were alright. This was good, that was bad. Can't say fairer than that. A little more detail would have been nice though, about why it was good/bad.  
  
A big well done to Josh, our 'spare' trombone that played percussion on the day, who got the best mention..."nice bell...at last".  
  
It's the first time I've played in the theatre, damn sight better than the sports hall.   
  
Well done to all the winners in all the sections.

I saw Philip Sparke's comments on our performance. There was minimal comments on musicality, mainly tempo, and he did mention the glock player once. All four paragraphs which ended with 'Thanks' underlined. So didn't give much away there!

It wasn't the bell that was cursed, it was the cheese ;op

I saw Philip Sparke's comments on our performance. There was minimal comments on musicality, mainly tempo, and he did mention the glock player once. All four paragraphs which ended with 'Thanks' underlined. So didn't give much away there!  
  
Probably because thats all he could pick you up on! :D ( I take it you're still with East London as you profile states ), I heard you and had you pegged as winners by a country mile, absolutley superb ( play like that in the Finals and your in with a shout ), glad your not getting promoted yet ( finals aside ) :D ;)

In fairness to Mr Sparke , given our placing an in-depth analysis of our shortcomings may have run to several sides of A4 for which he would not have had time !!!:)

Yes, I have a problem with ours. We didn't have the best of days yesterday and a very dissapointing result, that's all fine, it's contesting. However the adjudicator's comments were disgraceful! There was nothing constructive in there and it was just simply rude!  
  
I've been a fan of that adjudicator most of my life...that all changed yesterday!!!  
  
In contrast, our remarks were actually quite complementary with (of course) some criticism, yet we still got 9th place...?!

dont forget luton was runners up in 1922 on freedom and won 1922 on oliver cromwell also won the wills championship in 1972 on promethus unbound at the royal albert hall

In contrast, our remarks were actually quite complementary with (of course) some criticism, yet we still got 9th place...?!  
  
Yes, that was a bit bizarre, after he'd told us all from the stage to expect mainly negative remarks.

I think it was clearly a cursed bell! I wish we'd checked in advance....  
  
Congratulations to all the winners at the weekend - very proud of both bands I was conducting, although still have mixed feelings regarding the results.  
  
Zone One really were excellent in the top section, although I must say I did really enjoy Aveley's performance - the last movement was absolutely the cheekiest one I've ever heard! A fantastically camp rendition!  
  
Really enjoyed listening to Regent Brass on Sunday. Thought it was a good performance. Great solo euph as well ;)

Steve,  
Thank you very much for the compliment. I sure I speak for the whole band when I say that when we came off we were quietly confident that we had done ourselves and the piece justice. However, none of us had any preconceptions as to the outcome. This was the same on a cold January day in Skegness and similar in October 2008 at Folkestone. Both previous wins were totally unexpected. On all occasions we were there, like everybody should be, to give it your best shot and enjoy the moment. We are currently having good days at the 'office'. However, I believe it has been well over a decade since the band got their name on the scoresheet.   
Yes, the finals will mean we are all back on 'foreign' soil (even if the band has, like me some Northerns in it). So, with the other 'Southern sofites' an opportunity to prove that we are all a force to be not underated.

Oooo, 4br retros are up..  
I quite like ours, my sling seemed to provide more amusement to them than it did to me :rolleyes:

dont forget luton was runners up in 1922 on freedom and won 1922 on oliver cromwell also won the wills championship in 1972 on promethus unbound at the royal albert hall  
let's hope this dominance continues in october!

Oooo, 4br retros are up..  
  
All that work and we managed to achieve a sentence.

Look at it this way - you got one sentence and continued survival in the championship section; we got a whole broadly supportive paragraph and are going down. What counts for more?

Agreed, Dave, to your post above. I thought our placing was rather harsh to what barsrest said to. At the most i thought we could be 12th or 11th at a pinch, but still there we go, that's the way the cookie crumbles somethimes at contests.

Look at it this way - you got one sentence and continued survival in the championship section; we got a whole broadly supportive paragraph and are going down. What counts for more?  
  
No dig at anyone intended, sorry if it seemed that way. My dig is at 4BR and probably the laziest reporting I've seen in a long time.  
  
Promotion and relegation in the L&SC is a farce. While they take the average of three years gradings, it ignores the current strength of a band. I am probably the only Championship section conductor who is brave enough to say that we should never have been promoted in the first place after a miserable 8th in the 1st section last year.  
  
While we came 10th last weekend and stay up, you came 9th and go down. Where's the common sense in that? Next year, having survived by the skin of our teeth, we could hypothetically achieve a respectable mid-table result and still be relegated because of this year's result.  
  
I can't quite see what's wrong with a simple two-up-two-down policy like they have in Scotland.

I can't quite see what's wrong with a simple two-up-two-down policy like they have in Scotland.  
  
Could it be that they are trying to encourage consistent bands/adjudicating rather than a 1 off performance/adjudication sending a band up/down ?

Don't we have what is basically a simple two-up-two-down policy? Based on the three-year total? I do support the three-year thing, by the way - it irons out rogue results to some extent - you need to get two successive unlucky years, as we just have, to go down harshly.  
  
From what you say, maybe Cambridge should have appealed against promotion last year - I think an 8th place at the areas would have been good grounds for success; I'm sure Haverhill did the same successfully a few years back.

Could it be that they are trying to encourage consistent bands/adjudicating rather than a 1 off performance/adjudication sending a band up/down ?  
  
More local contests counting towards grading is about the only way you can judge a bands consitency over a year, however I doubt you'll find many bands who would support the idea of having to do more than one contest to support their grading.

Could it be that they are trying to encourage consistent bands/adjudicating rather than a 1 off performance/adjudication sending a band up/down ?  
  
Of course, but by the same system, an improving band could be pulled down by a bad result the previous two years.  
  
The basic year-by-year system seems to work for the British Open. While the L&SC 3-year average has it's merits, I think it has it's faults too. As I said before, even if we turn in a good performance in 2010, we will probably be pulled down by our 2009 result, thus a slowly progressing band is stifled by the very system that got them there in the first place.

Of course, but by the same system, an improving band could be pulled down by a bad result the previous two years.  
  
The basic year-by-year system seems to work for the British Open. While the L&SC 3-year average has it's merits, I think it has it's faults too. As I said before, even if we turn in a good performance in 2010, we will probably be pulled down by our 2009 result, thus a slowly progressing band is stifled by the very system that got them there in the first place.  
  
but an improving band would be in a great position to beat all comers in the section below.  
  
surely the slowly progressing band is stifled more by the quickly progressing bands around it that get better results at the contests than by the system?

Don't we have what is basically a simple two-up-two-down policy? Based on the three-year total? I do support the three-year thing, by the way - it irons out rogue results to some extent - you need to get two successive unlucky years, as we just have, to go down harshly.  
  
From what you say, maybe Cambridge should have appealed against promotion last year - I think an 8th place at the areas would have been good grounds for success; I'm sure Haverhill did the same successfully a few years back.  
As I understand it, Haverhill appealed, for several decent reasons, when they were first promoted, but the appeal failed.

The basic year-by-year system seems to work for the British Open. While the L&SC 3-year average has it's merits, I think it has it's faults too.   
Its the National Championships system, not peculiar to just LSC - every band in every area is subject to the same 3 years aggregate thing. Personally I agree with Dave that scoring over 3 years is better on balance because it does help iron out rogue results, and I also know more than one band that has successfully appealed against 'automatic' promotions/relegations.  
  
Maybe our area's results (and the distribution of the best bands across the First and Champioship sections) would be better improved by things like sticking a 2nd adjudicator in the box and more of the better testpiece choices.

Maybe our area's results (and the distribution of the best bands across the First and Champioship sections) would be better improved by things like sticking a 2nd adjudicator in the box and more of the better testpiece choices.  
  
I agree with my fellow band geek here. But what is the point of having more than one adjudicator in the box if they are allowed to confer and influence each other in the box? I think they only sensible solution is to have 2 adjudicators (perhaps 3 for majors) and each will score independently. An aggregate of the final placings (should) be a better fairer system than what we have a present.

As I understand it, Haverhill appealed, for several decent reasons, when they were first promoted, but the appeal failed.  
  
I was under the impression that they appealed against promotion twice in successive years, the first time successfully, the second time unsuccessfully. Maybe my info was bad?

I was under the impression that they appealed against promotion twice in successive years, the first time successfully, the second time unsuccessfully. Maybe my info was bad?  
You could easily be right Dave, sorry. I was going on one comment from someone I knew who was a member at the time.

Maybe our area's results (and the distribution of the best bands across the First and Champioship sections) would be better improved by things like sticking a 2nd adjudicator in the box and more of the better testpiece choices.  
  
the specific problem here is that in the top two sections down here you have two types of band.   
  
there are "championship" standard bands capable of competing at national contests all year round. these won't ever be relegated.   
  
then you have "the rest" who will bounce up and down at random depending on a variety of factors. they are inconsistent, get different players (and deps) in each year, can play some pieces but not others, etc.  
  
depending on how optimistic you are (or otherwise) you might say there are either 1, 2 or 3 of the former in our area. the remainder of bands (25) fall into the latter category.

the specific problem here is that in the top two sections down here you have two types of band.   
  
there are "championship" standard bands capable of competing at national contests all year round. these won't ever be relegated.   
then you have "the rest" who will bounce up and down   
I actually think that across our championship and first sections there are 3 tiers, not 2, and the bands in the middle tier are pretty much interchangeable - as evidenced by the number of us that yo-yo every few years. Its just one of those things... and at least it means we've got some damn good first section bands who are also capable of competing at national contests all year round.

Just talking about the the current tier system. I still think that there should be another section put in place because there are quite a lot of different standards within the Championship Section alone. Probably have a Premier Section, Championship Section, 1st Section, etc.

it means we've got some damn good first section bands who are also capable of competing at national contests all year round.  
think you might be kidding yourself there

Just talking about the the current tier system. I still think that there should be another section put in place because there are quite a lot of different standards within the Championship Section alone. Probably have a Premier Section, Championship Section, 1st Section, etc.  
  
That's why the 1st section was put in place, but it didn't really make much difference. Whatever you want to call it, the 2nd tier is still the 2nd tier. Look at the football league. No matter how you try and dress it up, the jump from Championship to Premier league is huge and many teams yoyo back down again. As a lifelong Charlton supporter, I am well aware of how cruel this can be :(

think you might be kidding yourself there  
  
res ipsum loquitor...

I'd definatly support a straight 2 up 2 down system.  
In my experience the top few bands and the bottom few are generally agreed upon by all present, including the adjudicators (maybe with slight changes in the order). But how acurately can anyone place the bands in the middle. Under the current system a band that is consistently placed just below average but never in the bottom two could be relegated, and equally, placed just above average without ever getting in the top 2 can go up. To go up you must be 1st or 2nd not 8th as Duncan refered to (bizarely that same year Beccontree came 10th and went down).

That's why the 1st section was put in place, but it didn't really make much difference. Whatever you want to call it, the 2nd tier is still the 2nd tier.   
Agreed. It wasn't a complaint or something I think needs to be addresses, just ann observation really.   
I guess my point was that just because we only have a small handful of 'proper' top section bands doesn't mean we can't be proud of standard of the next 'tier' of bands, or their performances at other contests.   
I can't understand why some people within the LSC region are so determined to diss it all the time - if things are really that bad, maybe they should just give up or move to a different area, then they wouldn't have to waste all that time and energy belittling the rest of us! :rolleyes:

I can't understand why some people within the LSC region are so determined to diss it all the time - if things are really that bad, maybe they should just give up or move to a different area, then they wouldn't have to waste all that time and energy belittling the rest of us! :rolleyes:It's just a theory, you understand, but could it be that the detractors are originally from areas with a "tradition" of banding who, for work or other reasons, have had to move to this musical wasteland we know as the L&SC region and are incensed that hoi polloi should have the temerity to even form a brass band, let alone win anything :confused:

In these credit crunched times I think we should here in rainy London, or generally the south (Im afraid no G20 summit protestors in sight yet with a brass band to march behind!), set up a few bankers welfare bands and so make ourselves feel equal to the north. We could then run our own welfare contest at say, bognor regis or centre parcs and then let the northern band come down to compete. How about that for equaling the north south thing up?????

I can't understand why some people within the LSC region are so determined to diss it all the time  
conversely, i'm not sure why some people always want to bring up the subject of how competitive L&SC bands are nationally - but never seem to be able to deal with the facts of the matter.

conversely, i'm not sure why some people always want to bring up the subject of how competitive L&SC bands are nationally - but never seem to be able to deal with the facts of the matter.If I say "conversely" again, it puts us back to square one, but I'm not sure why some people want to make supposedly authoritative comments on subjects such the National Championships without giving those to whom the remarks are addressed the benefit of knowing on what basis that authority is assumed :rolleyes:.   
  
Perhaps the answer is too obvious - they don't really know what they're talking about.

never seem to be able to deal with the facts of the matter.  
The fact of the matter seems to be that you either don't know what you're talking about, or wilfully ignore those facts that contradict your pet theories. I totally accept that we are a much weaker region than others, but that doesn't mean that all our bands are rubbish and incapable of aquitting themselves well outside the area. Off the top of my head, its worth checking out LSC bands' results over the last couple of years at Pontins, Yeovil, Wychavon, Butlins.....   
  
res ipsum loquitor... :rolleyes:

The fact of the matter seems to be that you either don't know what you're talking about, or wilfully ignore those facts that contradict your pet theories. I totally accept that we are a much weaker region than others, but that doesn't mean that all our bands are rubbish and incapable of aquitting themselves well outside the area. Off the top of my head, its worth checking out LSC bands' results over the last couple of years at Pontins, Yeovil, Wychavon, Butlins.....   
:rolleyes:  
  
Your right Alex, the facts do speak for themselves. I suspect next years 1st section contest will be a toughy with yourselves in pole position plus Kidlington and Staines on the way down. Probably one of the highest standard of line ups L&SC 1st section has seen for some time. I can't wait ;)

Let's hope they set a piece worth getting one's teeth into... It would be frustrating for those of us in this position if the panel compensated for the daftly misjudged selections of the last two years in the obvious way, by giving the top section a cracker and the 1st section something simple...

Off the top of my head, its worth checking out LSC bands' results over the last couple of years at Pontins, Yeovil, Wychavon, Butlins.....   
:rolleyes:  
results at all these second tier contests are much in line with what one would expect  
  
it would be nice one day for a london band to make an impact at the nationals.

results at all these second tier contests are much in line with what one would expect  
  
it would be nice one day for a london band to make an impact at the nationals.  
  
Ha, I don't think anyone's expecting a London band to win the Nationals this year but I don't think Fodens, Desford or Hepworth consider themselves 2nd tier competition and they've all been beaten by the same London band within the past twelve months (Look at the Masters last year for more top ten bands).  
  
Having just joined a London band after years playing out of the area, I've never heard a noise like it south of Coalville. I think there are two or three bone-fide quality bands in London that make the right noise. That, more than the result is why I'm playing where I am (although it is nice to have won two from two).  
  
It's never been a better time to play in Lond, Come on London Bands!!!  
  
Cheers

A little late . . but  
  
Thank you to all the 1st section bands for your performances of Pentacle last weekend. I managed to hear all 16 performances.   
  
Congratulations to Norfolk Brass on their win and to Sandhurst Silver for qualifying. It was a great contest too – with 3 bands (in my opinion) clearly out in front right until bands 13, 14 and 15 (out of 16) took to the stage and messed up my nice clear adjudication! (I actually had Friary, then Regent, then Welwyn, but there we go). By which point I realised adjudication was not for me when trying to compare to band drawn 2nd !!  
  
I had a long chat with the adjudicator (Paul Cosh) afterwards – a really nice guy. After discussing the way he had arrived at his decisions – well hats off, I was very impressed. He used a marking system for each band (as he mentioned on stage) – with grades for tuning, ensemble, balance etc.. etc.. So having a point of reference back he could justify his opinions when sorting out his placing.   
  
I really enjoyed the day – a good venue and a good ‘contest’. I was very impressed with the standard of the top 6 bands - and once again I really enjoyed every performance by all the bands – a real privilege for me, thank you.   
  
All the best to the 2 bands who have qualified for the finals in Harrogate - & to all the bands for the future.

It's never been a better time to play in Lond, Come on London Bands!!!  
Cheers  
  
Amen!

Redbridge and Aveley & Neham have certainly proved their worth at The Masters. i can't remenber, though, the British Open; I think the same was for the latter too. Anyone? It's always the RAH National Finals, that seems to be the cux of our bands.