I'm here with Ian Warton, I'm here for calm on top of the fact building with the lovely Liverpool backdrop behind us. Ian, tell us a little bit about Zolma. Yeah, so I'm the creative director of Zolma. We've been going for about two and a half years now. We are a little different to most companies in that we're a publisher rather than an agency. So all the things we tend to do are our own IP and we take all the risk we invest and we partner with great brands such as Jamie Oliver. Okay, Brunter, there's Jamie Oliver in Liverpool. Personally, what do you think about the Jamie Oliver food? Incredible, actually Jamie Oliver himself, I hand him my heart and say he's one of the most inspiring people I've ever met. Genuinely, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, great guy. What is it you're me talking about today? So today I'm really talking about the way I see it, there's two challenges of this industry. So one of them being digital value, a question of perceived value, are people willing to pay for digital products? And secondly, app discovery. So we all want to build these great businesses, but how do we go about doing that? Because it's so easy to make an app. What can you do in order to kind of get your head above the waves really? As you're perceived value the same way, I was thinking what's better, co-core Pepsi and people perceive this code, but blind taste, that's actually Pepsi. Is that kind of thing? Actually, it's more in the fact that by and large people are more willing to pay 20 pounds on a book from Jamie Oliver, for example, as opposed to a quarter of the price on an app. An app does all the things, gives you video updates itself. So it's really kind of why we have that mindset and how we can help educate our users to assign a value to what we're doing. So the fact that someone's holding something physical, they believe it's worth more value. Is it Jamie Oliver has their own apps as well? He does, yeah. So we've made a range of different apps with Jamie over the past two years, all with varying degrees of success. And, yeah, he has these own things as well, but we, with the main guy, is really trying this lifestyle platform on this industry, yeah. Fantastic. Ian, fantastic talking to you. Brilliant. Thank you very much. Thanks.