Mesh/Archive/2011-10-24

==Agenda==
# Please provide exact details of altered requirements for LOD mesh materials numbers/names/Ids in the latest production viewer. Is there any chance of a debug toggle to get the old behaviour to make hundreds of broken dae file work again? [Drongle McMahon]
# The mesh volunteers group run by charlar and oskar is broken, rarely do my messages ever go thru, and if they do there is a delay of 5 minutes till they post. Different times/days doesn't matter, while all other groups work just fine this one never works. [Echos Remblai]
# How is fixing the nvidia problem going? I still get a BSOD on login with graphics > low (Nvidia GT 440. driver 266.58)[Drongle McMahon]
# The UI of Viewer 3.2.1 changed. Do you have the plan of alteration of the process of Mesh Upload? May I update the tutorial blog and video of upload mesh? [Yuzuru Jewell]
==Meeting Notes==
==Attendees List==
*Charlar Linden (charlar.linden)
*Drongle McMahon (drongle.mcmahon)
*Eleanora Newell (eleanora.newell)
*Imaze Rhiano (imaze.rhiano)
*Mechan Skytower (mechan.skytower)
*Mikki Miles (mikki.miles)
*Nal (nalates.urriah)
*Nyx Linden (nyx.linden)
*Prep Linden (prep.linden)
*davep (runitai.linden)
*Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)
*Vir Linden (vir.linden)
*Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar)
*Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell)
==Transcript for Monday October 24, 2011==
[12:01]	Nyx Linden 	greetings all
[12:01]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	Koli Contepomi waves to Charlar, too.
[12:01]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Nyx, Two weeks passed. Do you have any news?
[12:01]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Hello Charlar.
[12:01]	Mikki Miles 	a tree fell from the sky
[12:01]	Mikki Miles 	hopefully nobody drops a house on me
[12:02]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	Koli Contepomi also waves to Vir.
[12:02]	Mikki Miles 	on the other hand, I am no witch
[12:02]	Vir Linden 	Hello all!
[12:02]	Nyx Linden 	Nyx Linden checks his feet for striped socks
[12:02]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Hello, Vir.
[12:02]	Drongle McMahon 	Hello
[12:02]	Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) 	hey all Lindens
[12:03]	Nyx Linden 	how's everyone today?
[12:03]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	Very tired, heh. 8PM for me.
[12:03]	Eleanora Newell 	how do i get a chat window up in this new viewer? the chat just fades away and i need to scroll in meetings like this?
[12:03]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	Your self?
[12:03]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Vewer 3.2.1 is fine.
[12:03]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	Hey Runitai.
[12:04]	Drongle McMahon 	Where is 3.2.1?
[12:04]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	Welcome back, Charlar. :o
[12:05]	Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) 	you should have a chat button in the bottom bar
[12:05]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Eleanora, please click the Chat button bottom of the viewer.
[12:06]	Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) 	click it and you get the nearby input window then on the right side there is an up arrow
[12:06]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	http://automated-builds-secondlife-com.s3.amazonaws.com/hg/repo/mesh-development/latest.html
[12:06]	Charlar Linden 	ok, ready?
[12:06]	Eleanora Newell 	it only shows me what i am typing, the chat is in single lines and fade away
[12:06]	Eleanora Newell 	oh, i just figured it out
[12:06]	Eleanora Newell 	the arrow
[12:06]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Yes
[12:06]	Charlar Linden 	#1 Please provide exact details of altered requirements for LOD mesh materials numbers/names/Ids in the latest production viewer. Is there any chance of a debug toggle to get the old behaviour to make hundreds of broken dae file work again? [Drongle McMahon]
[12:07]	Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) 	dop you see the arrow on the right side of the input field?
[12:07]	Eleanora Newell 	yep, got it, thanks
[12:07]	Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) 	*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*You're Welcome!!!!*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*
[12:07]	Vir Linden 	drongle, there are some known issues addressed in the project viewer - have you tried with that?
[12:07]	davep (runitai.linden) 	http://automated-builds-secondlife-com.s3.amazonaws.com/hg/repo/mesh-development/rev/243698/index.html
[12:07]	Drongle McMahon 	That's about https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SH-2595
[12:08]	Drongle McMahon 	Not sure if I have the latest...
[12:08]	Drongle McMahon 	But we still need the requirements defined.
[12:09]	Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) 	im waiting for the latest build of the shining-fixes as i see there is hopefuly a fix for it to be able to run on my linux laptop
[12:10]	Drongle McMahon 	It appears the material attributes of corresponding <triangles> taghs have to match between LODs?
[12:10]	Vir Linden 	We should not be looking at materials for physics
[12:10]	Vir Linden 	We need to verify whether the behavior is as intended for the geometry LODs.
[12:11]	Drongle McMahon 	My guess is it is as intended, but that is very different from previous behaviour.
[12:12]	Drongle McMahon 	It would be good to know officially what was intended.
[12:13]	davep (runitai.linden) 	the set of material IDs between LoDs has to either match or have no intersection
[12:13]	Drongle McMahon 	I think the cchanges were to deal with cases of incorrect face/texture assignments when it only depended on the order of the <triangles> tags.
[12:13]	davep (runitai.linden) 	exactly
[12:13]	davep (runitai.linden) 	because the collada exporters are inconsistent with face ordering
[12:14]	davep (runitai.linden) 	er, <triangles> ordering, even
[12:14]	Drongle McMahon 	But Davep, I tried with mismatching ID and name and just the material attribute matched, and that worked!
[12:14]	davep (runitai.linden) 	kk, will pick this up this week and comment on the jira with exactly what the viewer needs
[12:14]	Drongle McMahon 	...that is<triangles> materials attribute
[12:15]	Drongle McMahon 	Thanks.
[12:15]	Charlar Linden 	next
[12:15]	Charlar Linden 	#2 The mesh volunteers group run by charlar and oskar is broken, rarely do my messages ever go thru, and if they do there is a delay of 5 minutes till they post. Different times/days doesn't matter, while all other groups work just fine this one never works. [Echos Remblai]
[12:15]	Drongle McMahon 	I;d like it to be just the attribute .... easier to edit my old files.
[12:15]	Charlar Linden 	I'll look into this today, after the usergroup.
[12:16]	Charlar Linden 	Are others here seeing problems with the mesh volunteers group, worse than other large group lists?
[12:16]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	Yes
[12:16]	Eleanora Newell 	yes
[12:16]	Charlar Linden 	ok - we'll see what can be done. It's possible that it's just too large...
[12:17]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	This has been the worst group for me and I'm in Phoenix groups.
[12:17]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	Big difference
[12:17]	Charlar Linden 	Alrighty, next.
[12:18]	Charlar Linden 	#3 The mesh volunteers group run by charlar and oskar is broken, rarely do my messages ever go thru, and if they do there is a delay of 5 minutes till they post. Different times/days doesn't matter, while all other groups work just fine this one never works. [Echos Remblai]
[12:18]	Charlar Linden 	crap
[12:18]	Charlar Linden 	sorry
[12:18]	Drongle McMahon 	Deja vu !
[12:18]	Charlar Linden 	#3 How is fixing the nvidia problem going? I still get a BSOD on login with graphics > low (Nvidia GT 440. driver 266.58)[Drongle McMahon]
[12:18]	davep (runitai.linden) 	It's coming along quickly
[12:18]	Drongle McMahon 	2023?
[12:19]	davep (runitai.linden) 	been hanging out in #opensl and getting lots of help repro'ing and tracking down regressions
[12:19]	davep (runitai.linden) 	here's a build if you want to try it
[12:19]	davep (runitai.linden) 	http://automated-builds-secondlife-com.s3.amazonaws.com/hg/repo/davep_gl-development/latest.html
[12:19]	Drongle McMahon 	ok, I will. Thanks
[12:19]	davep (runitai.linden) 	that build + 280 or 285 drivers cleared up issues for lots of folks
[12:20]	davep (runitai.linden) 	only regression I'm aware of right now blocking merge down to viewer-development is a black screen on OSX from the FXAA shader
[12:20]	Drongle McMahon 	Oh. I says In progess....
[12:20]	davep (runitai.linden) 	oh, click the "previous build" link
[12:21]	Charlar Linden 	ok, moving on...
[12:21]	Charlar Linden 	#4 The UI of Viewer 3.2.1 changed. Do you have the plan of alteration of the process of Mesh Upload? May I update the tutorial blog and video of upload mesh? [Yuzuru Jewell]
[12:21]	davep (runitai.linden) 	gotta head out, thanks folks!
[12:22]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	Thx
[12:22]	Drongle McMahon 	got it
[12:22]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	he poofed too quickly. >:
[12:22]	Charlar Linden 	We don't have any plans to change the Mesh Upload floater as part of what's in the next release
[12:22]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	OK I will update my tutorial blog and video. Thank you.
[12:23]	Charlar Linden 	cool, thanks
[12:23]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Can I make them on 3.2.1 beta viewer?
[12:24]	Charlar Linden 	you can, although i can't guarantee that the UI changes around the mesh uploader won't change. The uploader itself is very unlikely to change at all.
[12:25]	Charlar Linden 	ok, that was the last item on the agenda. Let's aim for this to end at 30 minutes
[12:25]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Thank you.
[12:25]	Charlar Linden 	ANything else, for the remaining 5 minutes?
[12:26]	Wolfpup (wolfpup.lowenhar) 	im still looking for some people to help me with some CMake scripting help
[12:26]	Imaze Rhiano 	are alpha values iin textures handled differently in meshed that are attached to avatar than rezzed to ground?
[12:26]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Do you have any news about mesh or new project?
[12:27]	Nyx Linden 	Imaze - both attached and non-attached should be using alpha blending, but the content is handled in a separate pass, so there may be subtle differences.
[12:28]	Charlar Linden 	I don't have any announcements on new projects at the moment, Yuzuru.
[12:28]	Imaze Rhiano 	I did notice difference when one mesh for behind of alpha textured mesh
[12:28]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Thank you..
[12:28]	Nyx Linden 	yes, the sorting will work a little differently
[12:28]	Imaze Rhiano 	Imaze Rhiano nods
[12:29]	Charlar Linden 	2 minute warning.... :-)
[12:29]	Charlar Linden 	last call...
[12:29]	Imaze Rhiano 	umm... sometimes when teleporting from sim to another - it seems like that meshes are using wrong lower LOD - or at least vertices are not positioned correctly and there are ....
[12:29]	Imaze Rhiano 	oh well
[12:30]	Nyx Linden 	can you easily reproduce the issue Imaze?
[12:30]	Charlar Linden 	ok, go ahead Imaze
[12:30]	Imaze Rhiano 	I thik I need to test more is that some viwer specific issue -
[12:30]	Imaze Rhiano 	very likely is
[12:31]	Imaze Rhiano 	anyone seeing that metal rings in my corset are transparent?
[12:31]	Imaze Rhiano 	they shoudln't be - but sometimes that that happens with all viewers what I have tested
[12:32]	Imaze Rhiano 	reattaching item then helps
[12:32]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	I can't see half of your body.
[12:32]	Nyx Linden 	definitely if you can get video or screenshots that would help, though a repro would be most helpful
[12:32]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	Rings are transparent... I'm in 3.1.0 (243176)
[12:33]	Charlar Linden 	Imaze, if you right click on them do they appear?
[12:33]	Imaze Rhiano 	okay - I reattached - are they still transparent?
[12:33]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	Now they are opaque
[12:34]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	I can see your body on 3.2.1.
[12:34]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Not transparent.
[12:34]	Imaze Rhiano 	ya... but they looked transparent for some before I reattached
[12:35]	Imaze Rhiano 	anyway - I can't reproduce this yet reliable
[12:35]	Mechan Skytower 	the higher ones are opaque and the lower ones are transparent
[12:36]	Eleanora Newell 	i am on 3.2.0 and i see transparencies on you, imaze
[12:37]	Eleanora Newell 	the breast and hip areas
[12:37]	Imaze Rhiano 	can you see if I reattach them...
[12:37]	Charlar Linden 	ok, well, i think we're done - I'll see about adding a jira for that - please do add one if you can get a repro
[12:37]	Charlar Linden 	This tree needs to be fed.
[12:37]	Eleanora Newell 	yes, i see them on reattach
[12:38]	Koli Contepomi (sahkolihaa.contepomi)	Heh, see you Charlar, Nyx, Prep, Vir.
[12:38]	Prep Linden 	later guy's!
[12:38]	Vir Linden 	Bye all!
[12:38]	Eleanora Newell 	thanks, lindens :)
[12:38]	Nyx Linden 	thanks for coming out all! See you next week!
[12:38]	Charlar Linden 	bye all! Thanks again for coming
[12:38]	Imaze Rhiano 	byyye
[12:38]	Drongle McMahon 	Bye Lindens
[12:38]	Mikki Miles 	bye
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