Podfic Permission

Obtaining permission to podfic a fan writer's fanfic is the norm within the English-language podfic community and within the fanfic fandoms they typically make podfic for.According to a 2017 Auralphonic podcast, this may no longer be true among newer podficcers or in some fandoms; although podficcers continue to ask authors, they are more likely to interpret a non-answer as an implied yes rather than an implied no. Hear the discussion ~44 minutes in: Many podficcers ask permission before starting to work on a podfic, but some ask only when or if they decide they want to post their podfic on the internet.
There have been a number of discussions regarding whether or not permission should be required, especially in cases where the author cannot be reached. There has also been a trend toward more authors posting blanket permission statements to encourage podfic of their work or at least not have to field so many individual inquiries.
==Pre-history in Zine Fandom==
Fan Fiction Audio Recording has been around since long before podfic, but available information about permission etiquette in the past is sparse. 
Started in 1992, The Fanzine-Taping Service for Blind and Print Handicapped Readers recorded zine fanfic with the permission of the publisher, but made it available only to sight-impaired fans with special tape players; the tapes would not play on regular machines.
A discussion that was documented revolved around providing access to zines for blind fans and others with physical difficulties reading the printed page. A 1984 letter in Universal Translator #23 requested feedback on audio sharing without permission: 
A response by Susan Garrett two issues later gives us an early example of a blanket permission statement:
==History on LiveJournal==
When the practice of recording and sharing podfic first spread within LiveJournal fanfic fandom, early discussions and community rules regarding permission indicate that people expected more podfic to be made by the authors themselves. Recording a story by someone else initially seemed to be treated as a special case, and communities had different rules on whether podficcers should get permission.
From sgapodfic in 2006:
From sgapodpeople, 2007:
From sg1podfic, 2007:
==Blanket Permission, etc.==
:See also Blanket Permission to Podfic
Some fanfic authors give blanket permission for anyone to create podfics based on their writing. 
In the 2010s, many LiveJournal and Dreamwidth users started posting their blanket statement on their user profile pages; when users migrated their fic from journal platforms to AO3, some (but not all) also migrated their blanket statements to their AO3 profiles. On AO3 in the 2020s some authors use the Podfic Welcome tag on individual works to indicate permission instead of or in addition to a blanket statement elsewhere.
Before blanket podfic permission statements became widespread, individual enthusiasts or mods for podfic communities would post asking if authors were okay with fans podficcing their works, and authors would leave their permission statements in the comments section of the post. Examples include the Amplificathon postpodmod, permission to record? *\o/*, posted March 29, 2010. and the Multipodicity blanket permission list paraka, Blanket Permission, posted August 3, 2010.. Here is an early example of a podfic community sharing an individual author's blanket permission statement, in 2005:
Sometimes the blanket statement includes caveats or limitations on that permission, such as specific works that are not to be podficced. In 2011 Paraka noted that many blanket statements excluded fanfic that had already been podficced and speculated that the authors might be assuming that podficcers would not want repods.podcast with jenepod, paraka and revolutionaryjo. Pod Aware Day 2 - Blanket Permission. Posted 7 November 2011. Meanwhile, many fan writers post podfic-friendly statements that don't meet the criteria of blanket permission necessary for inclusion on the list — authors would say they liked podfic, but still wanted to be asked first. A very common request is to ask podficcers to link to the original work and alert the author (usually so that they can squee over it); akamine chan suggested in a 2012 Pod Aware for authors to think carefully about whether to mandate or simply encourage conditions such as "Drop me a link to the completed work,"akamine chan. I want 15 minutes of your time. Seriously, this is important. posted to Dreamwidth 14 November 2012. though some people took offense at the implication that authors hadn't already thought through the wording of their permission policies.legionseagle. Re: Recording before permission sought posted to Dreamwidth 27 August 2013.
Very few authors have issued a formal Blanket No to Podfic, although some authors without a blanket permission statement have been known to say no when asked.
==Effects of Permission==
Anecdotal evidence suggests that most authors, when asked, say yes. However, requiring permission is seen as a difficult hurdle for podficcers who are shy about asking and fear rejection.Says fire_juggler, "The angst around asking permission and waiting for permission is deep and unknowable." Pondering Transformative Works, Blanket Permission, and Transformation in General. Posted to LiveJournal 23 June 2012. (Accessed 7 April 2013.)Says Paraka, "I think there's a lot of shy podficcers.... The shy ones are more drawn to the blanket permission authors." podcast with jenepod, paraka and revolutionaryjo. Podfic Awareness Week - Pod Aware Day 2 - Blanket Permission. Posted 7 November 2011. Some have commented that receiving a "no" response actually killed their enjoyment of the original story. Other reasons for podficcers' reluctance include feeling obligated to finish the project if they receive permission and fearing to make the author feel obligated to listenfuckyeahpodficplatypus. .The idea that authors had to at least pretend to like the podfic was widespread enough to prompt at least one Dreamwidth post to announce in giant sparkly letters that "It's totally fine" to not like the podfic. See A note to authors who are not podfic fans, from me, sophinisba, posted 29 March 2012.. Tales of uncomfortable encounters between authors and podficcers have circulated widely in the podfic community — incidents where authors didn't understand what they were agreeing toFor example, one author was very surprised to discover that the November 2010 podfic she gave permission for would be uploaded to the Audiofic Archive and that it was traditional on Amplificathon for a third party to make cover art and convert the file to an mp4 audiobook. Her comments to the post appear to have been deleted, but see these podbook posts: November 22, 2010 livejournal post, dreamwidth mirror or for one reason or another retroactively revoked the permission after the podfic was posted. As a result, authors who have said yes in the past are much more likely to be podficced again as people take note that they are receptive to podfic requests.
On the author side, thefourthvine reported email anxiety as an author when faced with podfic permission requests.thefourthvine. {Meta} Permissions Statements Are Awesome. Dreamwidth post 24 August 2013. It has also been pointed out that authors who particularly don't want podfic may not respond to permission requests due to anxiety about saying no.September 1, 2013 anon comment in Protective Measures: Avoiding Awkward Podfic Situations
One solution to the problem of shy and sensitive podficcers (and authors) that has been championed in many a meta post is to encourage more authors to post a statement of blanket permission to podfic. This solution has been promoted as both a good way to avoid the stress of asking and as a good way for authors who want to be podficced to get more podfic. A comment on Fail Fandomanon points out another benefit of blanket permission:
Starting in 2010Multipodicity's list was created August 3, 2010 and was the first of its kind. Before that, there were posts collecting statements in the comments, but no organized lists. podficcers have been maintaining lists of authors who give blanket permission. (One copy of the multi-fandom masterlist is maintained on Fanlore itself.) After the initial idea of compiling lists of authors who gave blanket permission to podfic, podficcers began encouraging blanket statements other than a straightforward yes; authors could also signal their interest in podfic with a statement of "probably yes, but please ask first". Although a few regard a blanket statement requesting that podficcers ask first as pointless (asking is the default in the absence of a policy), others have pointed out that in an environment where some authors are actively hostile to podfic, such a statement is very useful.
Commentators have noted that this has been a successful campaign, and including a "transformative works statement" has become a standard practice among many authors. (As of August 2013, following many rounds of FFA podfic wank, there appeared to be some backlash as some authors who did not want to give blanket permission perceived a social pressure to conform.legionseagle. Podfic Permissions meta, posted 26 August 2013. However, after the death of the epic wank, this issue hasn't resurfaced. People may also have stopped complaining because podficcers were no longer campaigning as hard for everyone to make a blanket statement. Finally, a lot of these discussions also happened on journal services now inhabited only by a single tumbleweed.)
===In the Context of Fandom's Views of Podfic===
Podfic's status as a niche activity within the larger fanfic community may have a direct impact on what podfic can be produced. Some fan writers are very protective of their fanfic and will withhold permission, given the opportunity. Many fans have simply never heard of podfic. Many do not see podfic as a separate artistic creationFor example, see this anon comment (archived) in a June 9, 2013 Fail Fandomanon thread: "It's hard for me to think of podfic on the same level as fanworks which involve a greater application of creativity...It seems more like a labour intensive way of reformatting a story, like putting it into a better font and indenting the margins and stripping out garish colour scheme choices so it can be read more easily." Same thread, two days later (archived): "Someone else's fanwork? It's their own fanwork, just in a different format. And, yeah, if the author wants a podfic version, they should think about how to host their fanwork." and so do not comprehend the enormity of retroactively removing permission.general_jinjur. untitled Dreamwidth post, 15 June 2010. "there's an attitude with podfic, in some circles, that it is a service that readers should be grateful to be allowed to provide. this is linked to the idea that they are allowed to record stories at the sufferance of the author, that they are recording in order to grab at some piece of reflected glory that by right belongs only to the author.""But there's always the fear that because the author's are only interested in my podfic as it applies to them that they aren't going to... I don't know. Take into consideration what the podfic means to me and others. In some ways, as horrible as it sounds, I almost welcome the indifference from authors because maybe then they'll forget about what I've done and just leave me with it." Paraka. The Fannish Life of a Podficer. Posted to Dreamwidth 18 October 2010. Many do not see the appeal.See, for example, these responses to a Fandom Secrets post decrying overly defensive podficcers and their assertion that podfic is a creative fanwork "on a par with fic or art." The contents of the thread prompted one anon to remark, "For the record, this anon doesn't especially care which "level" vocal performance gets on your ranking of creativity, but I am seriously starting to see where the podficcers are coming from." 22 Jnauary 2013 comment.There are also plenty of reasons why someone might not personally enjoy podfic without declaring that people who enjoy it are weird. See klb. Negative Attitudes About Podfic: A Guided Tour. Posted to podficmeta 8 July 2012. (Accessed 7 April 2013.) Some say it gives them second-hand embarrassment.A Google search for podfic + "second hand embarrassment" gets 2400 results. A September 19, 2012 example on fail_fandomanon (archived). Fic Reading Woes by [[settiai - A dreamwidth discussion on the origin and nature of podfic-related embarrassment squicks. Some have even expressed disgust at the thought of listening to explicit fanfic read aloud."Part of the reason why some people are skeeved by podfic is because they find it too intimate to have someone read porn to them. Or they find podfic funny because they just can’t handle someone reading porn to them." livejournal post by paraka, 2010-12-30.In her 2012 roundup post of negative attitudes toward podfic, klb noted the trend in people thinking that "[t]he idea of reading porn aloud is inherently gross/creepy/laughable/mockable", but remarked that the situation had actually improved; "where once I couldn't go two days without seeing someone, somewhere, calling podfic gross, creepy, disgusting, laughable, I now go months at a time without encountering a single instance of that." klb. Negative Attitudes About Podfic: A Guided Tour. Posted to podficmeta 8 July 2012. (Accessed 7 April 2013.)One commenter in a Fail Fandomanon thread offered an explanation for why they didn't want to listen to porny podfic: "For approximately the same reason I wouldn't go watch a live version of a porn movie being put on at the local community theater, I think. :) I might run into that person at the grocery store! I need some separation!" Re: Podfic's validity as a genre, and AO3's problems as an archive for all fanwork, posted 19 September 2012. (Accessed 8 April 2013.)
For many reasons, not all fanfic writers are on board with podfic, and a few have issued a blanket no. Consequently, the distribution of available podfic is as much an indication of who the podfic-friendly authors are as it is an indication of who the popular authors are.
Some podficcers have responded to fandom's lack of awareness of podfic by trying to educate fandom — making individual meta posts or creating challenges and fests such as Pod Aware. In response to several publicized misunderstandings in 2010, revolutionaryjo started a trend in writing a generic "dear author" letter to clearly outline the podficcer's expectations when an author grants permission.In her original post, dated 18 October 2010, revolutionaryjo remarked, "There have been a lot of discussions floating around about podfic lately that are making me realize just how easily miscommunication can happen between a podficcer and an author." See also paraka's signal-boosting post, dated 21 October 2010. For another example, see lunchy munchy's Dear Author letter, posted 25 October 2010.
==Discussion and Controversies==
There is a range of opinion among podficcers (and fandom as a whole) regarding permission. Whether or not requiring permission in the first place is necessary or good has been a topic of debate in some podfic communities and anon memes like Fail Fandomanon. However, issues of permission are implicated in several different meta discussion topics.
===Unavailable or Unknown Writers===
One recurring topic of discussion among fan creators, and podficcers in particular, is that of grey areas in the norm of asking for permission, such as in the case of stories whose authors are unknown or unavailable to give permission. 
As with many discussions surrounding the further transformation of fanworks, the matter is muddled by the contradictions between, and conflation of, (US) copyright law, AO3 terms of service and informal fannish etiquette.
====Orphan Works====
A problem that is brought up frequently is what to do when permission cannot be obtained because the fan writer is known but cannot be contacted. It can be difficult to determine whether the fanfic is truly abandoned or whether the writer is simply not checking their email. Furthermore, some fan writers have died, email accounts stop working, websites and user accounts disappear, and there is no agreement on whether it is okay to proceed in these cases. 
Permission requirements disproportionately affect fans who want to podfic older fanfic and especially zine ficparaka. comment in general_jinjur's post, posted 16 June 2010.; many zine writers are not online. People have argued that permission prevents the preservation of and fannish engagement with old fanfic. In 2010 zvi commented, 
The rising popularity of anonymous kink memes resulted in questions about whether podficcers should (or could) get permission from anonymous authors, especially when authors frequently "de-anonned" after the fact, but didn't always add a notice at the original URL of the fic.taste of water. Kinkmeme fics, to pod or not to pod? posted in podficmeta, 14 April 2012. In a 2010 podficmeta post, paraka commented, "Not only will I not know if whomever answers my request for permission is the real author, some authors might not be tracking comments to the ficlets so they may never see it. My impulse is to just go ahead without author's permission but, well, it's such a touchy subject."paraka. Author Permission Question posted in podficmeta, 20 August 2010. In a 2012 podficmeta post, anatsuno said, 
A 2014 discussion in a Phoenix Wright kink memeNOT COOL. thread started 2014-08-19 in pw_kink_meme. showed that some memers emphatically did not consider anonymous works to be abandoned works and would rather anonymous works not be podficced at all due to the difficulty of obtaining permission: 
When the question — So what's the best policy when you want to do a podfic, for a fanfic but the author hasn't been seen on the internet for forever — was posed anonymously on Fail Fandomanon in June 2013anonymous June 9, 2013 comment (archived) posted to Fail Fandomanon: So what's the best policy when you want to do a podfic, for a fanfic but the author hasn't been seen on the internet for forever (in this case close to two years) and therefor you're unable to get their approval to create and share said podfic? I've left a comment on their AO3. can't find them on Tumblr. their LJ looks completely dead. whaddo I do?, it generated a diversity of responses, including:
* If you can't contact them, go ahead and post.
* If you can't contact them, go ahead and post, but be prepared to take it down again if they resurface and object.
* If you can't get permission, you can't post.
The question was the spark that set off a multi-platform discussion known on Fail_Fandomanon only as "podfic wank" and among (northern hemisphere) podficcers as "The Summer of Podfic Hate".
====Orphaned Works====
The Archive of Our Own has a feature that enables creators to deliberately orphan their fanworks, that is, remove the work from their account and erase all references to the identity of the creator but leave the work on the archive for posterity. 
During earlier debates regarding "orphan works," there didn't seem to be much discussion of orphaned works, which many podficcers considered fair game with no apparent pushback. 
Still, as of 2022, questions and debates about the permission status of these works remained frequent in podficcing circles,Is it ethical to podfic and (sic) orphaned work? thread on r/AO3, 2022 and some fic writers expressed concern. One example of this debate unfolded in June 2021, when fic writer gnarf posted (original emphasis): 
Podficcers argued their case in response: 
To many podficcers' dismay and chagrin, ambiguity in the AO3 Terms of Service as to the possibility of reversing orphaning, as well as communication from AO3 volunteers, has not supported this view.AO3 Comment of the Day post, 2021
Podficcers highlighted the fact that this policy raised significant issues: 
* Writers who wished to orphan their works may not be aware that by doing so, they were possibly removing any possibility for further transformation of their works; 
* Writers who had previously given blanket permission may not be aware that orphaning effectively removed permission by severing the link between the work and the permission statement. 
They suggested clarifying these issues in the orphaning process: 
* Raising awareness of the orphaning process and encouraging writers to leave their wished re:further transformation in the fic's notes, prior to orphaning;greedydancer reply to gnarf, 2021
* Having writers 'tick a box' to acknowledge that orphaning meant the works became fair game for further transformation; 
* Having writers 'tick a box' to give permission for specific orphaned works to be transformed further.
====Anonymous Works====
As of 2022, most podficcers seemed aware that works posted to the "Anonymous" AO3 collection were still attached to their author's pseud, and that this anonymity could be easily reversed; they considered permission necessary to podfic those works. 
Anonymous works elsewhere on the internet however were more of a grey area.
===Retracting Permission===
At one time (circa 2010?), distressed podficcers were reporting cases where fan writers who had formerly given permission revoked permission and requested that the podfic be taken down. Fans differ on whether the podficcer should honor the author's request. In fact, fans differ on whether the author's reason for making the request is relevant to the podficcer's decision:
*"as a podficcer, I would never ever take my podfic down if asked by an author unless they had a REALLY STELLAR REASON. I'd take their name off, lock it to ao3 members etc, but I wouldn't take it down."10 June 2013 comment on Fail Fandomanon
*"This is horrifying. As a writer, I don't need to justify to anyone why I deserve to remove my own work from the internet."11 June 2013 response on Fail Fandomanon
Podficcers reported that a few authors who were deleting their fanfic have asked them to take down their podfic. In 2010, general jinjur commented that "if an author gafiates from fandom, there is a 50/50 chance that she will ask the podfic of her stories to be pulled down."general jinjur. untitled Dreamwidth post, 15 June 2010. Sometimes the podficcer was able to simply remove references to the author after negotiating with the author.
During the 2013 FFA podfic wank, some fans argued that it shouldn't matter why the author wants a takedown, because the story belongs to that author.12 June 2013 anonymous comment: "I podfic myself, but if someone needed me to take something down I would without question, because it's their story." Others argued that the whole reason for asking permission in the first place was to avoid precisely this situation."I think it's shitty to retract permission after the fact unless you have a super serious reason like a stalky ex or similar. I just don't think it's fair to tell someone to take something down they spent hours working when the only reason they did it is because you said it was okay." anonymous comment posted June 11, 2013 to Fail Fandomanon.
Since then, the permission retraction issue seems to have faded away. In a November 2014 Pod Aware podcast, klb reported that takedowns no longer seemed to be an issue; although takedown requests used to happen on a monthly basis, she hadn't seen any for two and a half years.Pod-Aware Day 1: 10 Changes in Podfic History Since 2009. In an April 2016 Auralphonic podcast, paraka reported that she had tried to get numbers of actual confirmed takedowns and came up with "definitely less than 10, probably no more than 5." There had been two cases total of an author contacting the Audiofic Archive retracting permission (instances where the author contacted the podficcer, and the podficcer contacted the archive were not counted). Paraka explained that the discrepancy between the numbers and the importance of the issue in people's minds was due to early podfic fandom being very small and close-knit.Auralphonic 017: Talking with the AO3, posted 2016-04-14. About 12 minutes into the file.
In 2021, during the controversy about orphaned works, an AO3 Policy & Abuse volunteer communicated that the AO3 would not honor a writer's take-down request about a podfic if the podficcer could prove they had previously obtained permission: 
===Requiring Permission, Pros and Cons===
====Arguments Against Requiring Permission====
Although most podficcers do not actively campaign for wholesale abandonment of asking permissionMany will say they don't think permission should be required, but then hasten to assure everyone that they will continue to ask permission anyway. For example, see aphelant's Pod Aware podcast on 8 November 2011. pod_aware day 2: blanket permission, various arguments have been put forth as to why this practice is questionable. Arguments include: no one should expect control over a fanwork once it is posted publicly on the Internet, it isn't fair to impose restrictions on other people's fan activity, it creates unequal power relations between podficcers and authors, and only fanfiction (as opposed to fan art or fanvids) ever got such privileged treatment in the first place. The inability to podfic orphan fanfics has also been used as an example of why requiring permission at all is bad.
In any discussion about permission and fanworks, some have pointed to the hypocrisy of having to ask permission from another fanwork creator when it is not considered necessary to ask the canon creator's permission. Very few fan writers would consider, for example, the wishes of professional authors to be relevant to whether or not they decide to write fanfic.
====Arguments for Requiring Permission====
One major reason often cited for requiring permission to podfic is that the podfic in a sense is a copy of the fanfic in a different format. Although the podficcer's work in performing and editing and packaging the podfic is creative, podfics normally contain the entire text of the original story and are in a legal sense derivative, rather than transformative, works. Podfics are the fannish equivalent of audiobooks and, like audiobooks, normally cannot be distributed without an agreement with the original copyright holder (there are some exceptions for services to the blind in U.S. copyright law).
There is a similar community norm that opposes the archiving of fic without permission. Reasons for this norm include: it's the polite thing to do; the writer should have the right to control where their fic is published; and if the writer needs to take their fic down for any reason, they can do so easily.aphelant. pod_aware day 2: blanket permission. Pod Aware podcast on 8 November 2011. (In a 2017 podcast on podfic permission, paraka remarked that part of the desire for authorial control in modern fanfic fandom stems from the history of Cease & Desist orders, plus the general attitude that girl hobbies are shameful and need to be hidden., posted 2017-03-27) One notable exception to this norm is Twilight fandom, where authors so frequently pull to publish that at least one archive exists to repost fic without permission; according to giselle, Twilight is a lesson in what not to do, as it has devolved into "a spiral where pulling begets reposting which begets more pulling and that whole situation just leaves authors and readers at each other's throats with pitchforks".comment thread started by giselle_lx, 2011-04-18. 
The importance of maintaining good will within the fandom community is also cited as a reason to ask permission. Unlike the canon creators, fanfic writers move in the same circles as podficcers. It is not even possible in many cases to ask permission of TPTB, but fan writers are in theory just an email away. Even podficcers who question the sense in continuing to require permission have said that they would always ask permission because not doing so would result in hurt feelings and backlash from the community.
kindkit argues that podfic's relationship to fanfic is not comparable to fanfic's relationship to canon.kindkit. podfic, permissions, and false analogies, posted to Dreamwidth 26 August 2013.
==Meta Discussion Links==
* Should readers get permission to make podfic?archived in podficmeta (January 2010)
* An Open Letter to bjewelledarchived by paraka (June 2011)
* blanket permission roundup postarchived in Pod Aware (November 2011)
* Author Permissionarchived in podfic_tips (June 2012)
* Question on Permissionarchived in podfic_tips (September 2012)
*Permission where author has blanket permissionarchived in podfic_tips (October 2012)
* On Permission in Fandom and other Fannish Etiquettearchived by podcath (November 2012)
* Protective Measures: Avoiding Awkward Podfic Situationsarchived in Amplificathon (November 2012)
* Proposalarchived (March 2013) in podficmeta (2012)
* Twitter discussionjedusaur: "Podficcers: I know this has been discussed to death--someone give me the rundown of why y'all ask permission to create transformative works?" archived (June 3, 2013)
* podficing protocol discussion in fail_fandomanon (June 9-12, 2013) and Today's FFA Thread discussion on podficmeta in response (June 10-21?, 2013)
* Permission Statements Are Awesome thefourthvine (August 24, 2013)
*TheFourthVine Weighs in on Podfic Blanket Statementsarchived, 2017-04-09. in fail_fandomanon (August 24, 2013)
* link roundup by narahtarchive.is (August 25, 2013)
*More Pod Fic Wank?archived, 2017-04-09. in fail_fandomanon (August 27, 2013)
*Permissions on older worksarchived in podfic_tips (February 2014)
*Auralphonic episode 027: Podfic Permission (March 2017)
==Permission Masterlist Links==
*FPS List, a searchable database of fanwork permission statements
*Fanlore's Blanket Permission to Podfic
*permission to record? *\o/* (2010 Amplificathon post)
*malnpudl's 2008 poll
*Podfic Welcome tag on Ao3
===Fandom-specific Blanket Permission Lists===
* Avengers
* Bandom
* Glee
* Harry Potter
* Hockey RPF
* Marvel: Steve/Tony
* Merlin
* One Direction/Radio 1/Little Mix
* Sherlock
* Starsky & Hutch
* Supernatural and Supernatural RPF
* Teen Wolf
Fire_juggler also maintains a list of lists here.
==References==
Category:Fanwork Sharing
Category:Podfic Fandom
Category:Discussion