Doc Team/2011-01-05

== Transcript ==
[13:01]	:	Cripes, what happened here?
[13:01]	:	Sombody got a Lego set for Xmas
[13:01]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Snowglobe 1.3.2 (3219) Feb 27 2010 14:30:24 (Snowglobe Release)
 Release Notes
[13:01]	:	(misszee007) is now known as Tiffany.
[13:01]	 	(arawn.spitteler): It looks like someone left this a sandbox
[13:02]	:	Jere,y, perhaps you can clear something up. Search is acting very strangely
[13:02]	:	Probably my fault, when I took ownership from Jon.
[13:02]	:	Hi Mojito. What seems to be happening?
[13:02]	:	Ah, you just answered part of it
[13:02]	:	hey everyone
[13:02]	:	Jon and Kate no longer show up in search
[13:03]	:	I am currently the only full-time member of the Doc Team :-/
[13:03]	:	The odd part is, neither does Torley, but a group he is in shows him logged on
[13:03]	:	But a V2 Viewer search (which works differently) DOES show Torley
[13:03]	:	Torley may have some privacy settings turned on. He's a very popular guy, and sometimes he needs to go "heads-down" to get work done.
[13:03]	:	there's a familiar concept. :-)
[13:04]	:	ok.
[13:04]	:	But you just said you were the only full time member of the doc team. Is Torley something else? (hmm, no wisecracks please)
[13:04]	:	Mojito, that BEGS for wisecracks... but then you knew that.
[13:04]	:	heh
[13:04]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Torley got an upwards transfer, of some sort
[13:04]	:	Hiya
[13:05]	:	Heh. Torley moved over to a different team quite some time ago. I'm not sure what exactly he's working on these days, but to the best of my knowledge, he's still around.
[13:05]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Hey, Marianne,
 what's your game? (can anybody play?)
[13:05]	:	/me giggles
[13:06]	:	Wow. It's like 100 people got together and all decided to each leave one prim on this land.
[13:06]	:	It's probably Candy Land, Arawn
[13:06]	:	's what happenes with no return spots
[13:06]	:	Heh. Fair enough.
[13:06]	:	I didn't think all the settings would change when I took ownership here. My bad :-P
[13:07]	:	Perhaps the extra prims can chip in with the doc writing.
[13:07]	:	dang... all this winterwear... it's making me cold looking at you guys.
[13:07]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Check the documentation?
[13:07]	:	One would hope! Maybe they could form into a big pen and write the old-fashioned way.
[13:07]	:	One assumes then there there is not all thsat much left to document? ;)
[13:07]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Old Fashioned writing is usually a particle effect, but never lasts.
[13:08]	 	(arawn.spitteler): /me filed a new feature request, touching on Jira and Wiki: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-3473
[13:08]	:	You know, I've had that question a few times recently, Mojito. We change and add enough stuff to Second Life that things constantly need to be documented or updated. Plus, we seem to like to keep moving the KB around, which generates a lot of work in itself :-)
[13:09]	:	I got a curious question...
[13:09]	:	Yet the doc staff is reduced in size
[13:09]	:	/me shrugs.
[13:09]	:	Is there any good spot on the wiki detailing IP rights, etc. in SL? A sculpt map seller was told my support today that he has no IP rights (that people are welcome to resell his maps full perm) and that the license he provides his buyers is meaningless. Was hoping to find something that shows otherwise, as I know this is pretty contrary to stuff that texture people have had for ages.
[13:09]	:	by* support
[13:10]	:	I would not take support people as being experts on IP law
[13:10]	:	Exactly, Mojito
[13:10]	 	(arawn.spitteler): How had he set perms? If there's no wiki on IP, there should be somkething on Permissions
[13:10]	:	Hmm... I don't know that the wiki covers IP law, Marianne. You might check the TOS, though.
[13:10]	:	They're full perm sculpt maps, sold with a license to use
[13:10]	:	I am pretty sure the ToS says a creator retains IP rights, but gives LL a free license for certain purposes
[13:10]	:	Hey Nathan
[13:11]	:	well, a few people have suggested "next owner rights" as a property
[13:11]	:	The license, of course, says that they cannot be ressold full permission, but can be used in creations, etc.
[13:11]	:	Hello Mari, what'd I miss? ã‹¡
[13:11]	:	sell something to someone as copy/trans, but the next person after that can only sell copy/no-trans (or vice versa)
[13:11]	:	/me nods
[13:11]	:	Ya, I've heard much on that too
[13:12]	:	it would do a lot of good.
[13:12]	:	Not too much yet, Nathan
[13:12]	:	Interesting.
[13:12]	:	especialy when it comes to sculpt maps.
[13:12]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Is there a jira, for next owner rights?
[13:12]	 	(bronson.blackadder): wow teleport was fast
[13:12]	:	WEll, I'll see what I missed when the transcript goes up in an hour or so
[13:12]	:	I need one done and I have relevant tools, but I just can't stand taking the time to do them.
[13:12]	:	But ya, was somethign I was hoping to find... something out there on, before it really "hits the wire" Could really set off a bit of a firestorm in some circles
[13:13]	 	(arawn.spitteler): In this fcase, I'd've set no-trans, but perms are hard to alpha test
[13:13]	:	Heh. Sorry for missing the last couple weeks... I don't remember if I warned you guys I was going on vacation for the holidays.
[13:13]	:	/me loves bronson's new name! :D
[13:13]	:	Arawn, that's what alts are for. :-)
[13:13]	:	he's not Bronson?
[13:14]	:	oh
[13:14]	 	(bronson.blackadder): who what where?
[13:14]	 	(bronson.blackadder): oh my display name
[13:14]	 	(bronson.blackadder): lol
[13:15]	 	(bronson.blackadder): forgot about that
[13:15]	:	Yeah, love your display name. :D
[13:15]	:	I just keep that switched off
[13:15]	 	(bronson.blackadder): my last one was litterbox leopard
[13:15]	 	(arawn.spitteler): /me's on snowglobe, and only sees undisplayable Bronson
[13:15]	:	Can't see 'em right now, f'r me. Had a bit of a showstopper bug in 2.3 n had do downgrade
[13:15]	:	/me gives a lopsided smile.
[13:15]	:	I'm glad to see people making use of that feature. I'm still trying to figure out the etiquette when addressing someone with a display name, though :-P
[13:15]	:	I'm sticking with Pheonix for the time being at leat.
[13:15]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Am I Arawn Graalrd, to anybody?
[13:15]	:	*least
[13:16]	:	You are to me, Arawn.
[13:16]	 	(bronson.blackadder): I just use the persons user name
[13:16]	 	(bronson.blackadder): it is the one constant
[13:16]	:	Yes, I see dispaly names AND account names.
[13:16]	:	well, I don't like to have the standard user name missing.
[13:16]	 	(arawn.spitteler): CG Linden got tired of me being CG Lindan.
[13:16]	:	that is, account names
[13:16]	:	Aargle, you can set a preference to have account names displayed in tandem with display names.
[13:17]	:	and if I turn on both, chat just looks like a riot of names.
[13:17]	:	BTW, what is up with these stray prims left by some new user? They've been here for weeks.
[13:17]	:	Part of the ambiance
[13:17]	:	Not sure, Nathan. My theory is that all the land restrictions got lifted when I took ownership of this parcel about a month ago.
[13:17]	 	(arawn.spitteler): /me wonders if Jeremy took ownership, before vacation
[13:17]	 	has pinged you.
[13:17]	:	this one in the middle here is by someone only 1 day old
[13:17]	:	and some Blahblah Resident guy used it as his personal sandbox? :D
[13:17]	:	Somehow, it looks like hundreds of people all came and left one prim each. I've been returning them one by one this whole time :-P
[13:18]	:	LOL
[13:18]	:	I know a couple where one of them changed her last name to be the same as their partner. I have not seen any other really useful purposes for that feature.
[13:18]	:	Yeah, I've seen some of those too
[13:18]	:	And some that changed their display name to just their first name. Kinda like some rock stars. :D
[13:18]	:	The Display Names show up on the web version of the Freinds List, which is very confusing
[13:19]	:	Mojito. Yes, I see that a lot. Also fixing and simplifying names (BlahBlah234 Yossarian becomes "Blah Resident")
[13:19]	:	Yeah, that is.
[13:19]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Judging by Ladymoon's arms, I think she's supposed to be wearing a top.
[13:19]	 	(bronson.blackadder): I been having loads of fun with my display names
[13:19]	 	(bronson.blackadder): lol
[13:19]	:	I have a choice whether to see display names inworld, but not on the web
[13:19]	:	It'd be nice if the wenpage gave you rthe option to display the account name along with the display name, or just switch to the account name
[13:19]	:	I jes stick with my ol' name. Folks know me well enough by it
[13:19]	:	yeah.... that would be fantastic.
[13:19]	:	hi sorry was afk
[13:19]	:	webpage, even
[13:20]	:	i cant see me i dont know
[13:20]	:	I was wondering for weeks who someone named "50 ft" was.
[13:20]	:	im never rezd
[13:20]	 	(arawn.spitteler): It seems oddly laggy.
[13:20]	:	it turned out to be Soft Linden. :-)
[13:20]	:	I'm probably not going to change my name from my account name soon, tho... I flew through too many hoops selecting the surname I'm using now to let go of it. :D
[13:20]	:	Heh! Yeah, some of the Lindens have been having fun with display names.
[13:20]	:	yeah... I'm not shifting away from mine at all, either.
[13:21]	:	well, so far, just Soft and CG that I know.
[13:21]	:	That and I go by the same name on two or three OpenSim grids, so... that might confuse ppl too. ã‹¡
[13:21]	:	I've noticed that, Jeremy. I'd say I see it more on Lindens, per capita, than anywhere else
[13:21]	 	has pinged you.
[13:21]	:	hello
[13:21]	:	Some of these display names have been pretty clever, tho.
[13:21]	:	Hey Hope
[13:23]	:	Ahh.... Parcel cleaned.
[13:23]	:	(Sorry if I'm quietish. Reading the IP section of the TOS, and it sounds like someone in support dun goofed)
[13:24]	:	hm... cool... I can rez things here.
[13:24]	:	/me looks for a victim
[13:24]	:	(What sort of goof? Ruh-roh!)
[13:24]	:	Jeremy will do. :-)
[13:24]	 	has pinged you.
[13:24]	:	Doh! I thought it turned that off.
[13:24]	:	Ya, now that Jeremy's cleaned up the place, we all need to leave prims...
[13:24]	 	has pinged you.
[13:24]	:	oh, pooh
[13:24]	:	Just kidding!
[13:24]	:	Er, I thought *I* turned that off.
[13:24]	:	you did
[13:24]	 	(bronson.blackadder): oh noooo some one with the name HACK
[13:24]	:	I was just going to drop an anvil on your head. no big deal. :-)
[13:24]	:	Heh. Snowcrash-style!
[13:25]	:	Wait, that's a safe.
[13:25]	:	( loading) (loading ( loading )
[13:25]	:	If you're not careful, I'll use my Linden snowball fight gear :-P
[13:25]	 	(bronson.blackadder): lol
[13:26]	 	(bronson.blackadder): I tried going to teh snowball fight
[13:26]	:	I don't understand this...humm can anyone tell me why is the freind list going slow?
[13:26]	 	(bronson.blackadder): it was lag fest 2010
[13:26]	:	Reminds me that i got a good shot of your from the fight, Jeremy. Sometime after I got a good shot at you with the snow
[13:26]	 	has pinged you.
[13:26]	:	Yeah, it kinda was, Bronson, but people seemed to be having fun anyway.
[13:27]	:	Not sure about the friends list, Hope. Do you have a very large number of friends?
[13:27]	:	I only managed to hit 25 Lindens this year
[13:27]	:	well, guys, I didn't plan on staying long. I've got a script waiting on me.... but I did want to bring up something I mentioned in the past
[13:27]	:	but it may actually be something to bring up at Nyx's meeting.
[13:27]	:	Go for it, Aargle.
[13:28]	:	is it possible in the viewer to add a warning to the Unlink operation for first use?
[13:28]	:	or Link for that matter.
[13:28]	:	I know too many people who think that's the correct way to group things to move them around.
[13:28]	:	it so ok Linden but thank you
[13:28]	:	Mari: You smacked 25 Lindens??? :D
[13:29]	:	but I routinely find myself dealing with new customers who don't know you're not supposed to link/unlink purchased items
[13:29]	:	Hmm... That isn't really my call, Aargle, but if you make a good case for it in Jira it should get attention.
[13:29]	:	ok, sounds like a plan.
[13:29]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Can you unlink a no mod item/
[13:29]	:	anyways, I'm off. y'all have a good afternoon and a great new year
[13:29]	:	Arawn, I don't think you can... I'll have to test that
[13:32]	:	So, has anyone had any noteworthy documentation experiences lately?
[13:32]	 	(arawn.spitteler): https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-3473
[13:32]	:	Isn't that kinda the POINT behind nomod? That you can't change anything in the build?
[13:33]	:	I used to know for sure, Nathan, but I'm pretty sure you can't unlink, link, or even add inventory to a no-mod item.
[13:35]	 	(arawn.spitteler): What happened to Marianne?
[13:35]	:	wb Mari. Crashed?
[13:35]	:	In other news, there's some documentation stuff happening behind the scenes right now that'll probably be worthy of lots of discussion in the coming months.
[13:36]	:	Ya, SL decided it did not want to work no mo'
[13:36]	:	At the least, I suspect there's a lot yet going on with mesh and TSL stuff
[13:36]	:	I may actually start running this office hour with an actual agenda, as an official feedback forum in the near future. That'll be pretty exciting!
[13:36]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Terminate Stay Linked at Teen Second Life?
[13:37]	 	(arawn.spitteler): That'll take homework
[13:37]	:	Very cool, Jeremy
[13:37]	 	has pinged you.
[13:37]	:	Jeremy at the snowball fight: Man Down! http://www.sluniverse.com/pics/pic.aspx?id=478619
[13:37]	 	has pinged you.
[13:37]	 	(arawn.spitteler): What do we with the Jellotar/
[13:38]	:	Does anyone have a giant spoon?
[13:38]	:	Answer: yes
[13:38]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Contact Sooden Ren, and assure her you are not from Customer Support
[13:39]	:	I managed to miss te snowball fight. I think I was in the middle of some other activity at the time. Might even have been one on anoter grid.
[13:39]	 	(arawn.spitteler): /me was probably struggling with the lag on Mafia Wars
[13:39]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Has Zynga ever tried doing Second Life?
[13:39]	:	Giant spoon, for what... the giant desert-dish over there?
[13:40]	:	Someone wanted to know what we should do with the giant Jellotar.
[13:40]	:	oh
[13:40]	:	/me giggles
[13:40]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Jon Linden no longer exists to be the Green Lantern Jellotar.
[13:40]	:	I think I only once got to see Jon use the dish I made him. Ah, well
[13:41]	:	pity
[13:41]	:	At least Faux-Jon has gotten a lot of use out of it.
[13:41]	:	's true!
[13:41]	:	Didn't realise that dish was made by Mari. It's been staring me in the face for months and I never really inspected it. :D
[13:41]	:	FauxJon Linden
[13:42]	 	to these
[13:42]	:	Welcome to Second Life, spiritwolf
[13:43]	:	I'd say the jellotar is eclectic enough, in line with the overall eclecticness of the rest of this OH platform, that it might as well stay. ã‹¡
[13:43]	:	Hi spiritwolf. This gathering is called Documentation Office Hours. More accurately, I work for Linden Lab, and I make myself available to chat here for one hour each week at this time :-)
[13:43]	 	McCann
[13:43]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Welcome to Second Life! This is documentation office hour, where we discuss the instructions our new residents are supposed to be bewildered by. I hope you find them confusing.
[13:43]	:	Feel free t'call me Mari
[13:44]	 	
[13:44]	:	My expertise lies in technical writing, which means I generally work on such projects as the Second Life Knowledge Base, which currently lives on the Second Life wiki at http://wiki.secondlife.com
[13:45]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Is lindex or billing supposed to have my email addy somewhere? I just had to change.
[13:46]	:	I don't know about billing, Arawn, but don't you need to provide an email address when you sign up for Second Life?
[13:46]	:	There ya go, Jeremy. Perfect for Jellotar
[13:46]	 	has pinged you.
[13:46]	 	(arawn.spitteler): No, we can sign up quite annonymously
[13:46]	:	Thanks, Marianne
[13:47]	 	(arawn.spitteler): At least, we could when I signed up
[13:47]	:	Odd. I know I had to provide an e-mail. It's where all my offlines know where to find me
[13:48]	 	(arawn.spitteler): Maybe I should provide a correct email addy. I just don't recall where.
[13:48]	 	(bronson.blackadder): update contact info
[13:48]	:	left sidebar on your account page
[13:48]	 	(arawn.spitteler): If I look that up, in the wiki, how do I know what to look for?
[13:48]	 	(bronson.blackadder): on your dashboard
[13:48]	:	account page.... dashboard, ya.
[13:48]	:	What they said :-)
[13:49]	 	(bronson.blackadder): lol
[13:49]	 	(bronson.blackadder): thanks for backing us up Jeremy
[13:49]	 	has pinged you.
[13:49]	 	(bronson.blackadder): lol
[13:49]	:	/me snickers
[13:49]	:	/me gives a great big smile.
[13:50]	 	(bronson.blackadder): so Jeremy have you met the new CEO et?
[13:50]	 	has pinged you.
[13:50]	 	(bronson.blackadder): if so whats he like?
[13:50]	 	(bronson.blackadder): et=yet
[13:50]	:	'fraid not, Bronson. I've been on vacation for the past couple weeks, so all I've seen is the public stuff you guys have seen.
[13:50]	 	(bronson.blackadder): hope he has his s**t togethe bette then did
[13:51]	 	(bronson.blackadder): bette=better
[13:51]	:	(rocksrock) is now known as rocky.
[13:51]	 	(bronson.blackadder): ok Im missing letters
[13:51]	:	better than the previous CEO did, you mean?
[13:51]	:	From what I've read, I'm cautiously optimistic. But I usually am...
[13:51]	 	(bronson.blackadder): better then M linden did
[13:52]	:	He certainly has some impressive and relevant credentials. I'm excited to see where his leadership takes us.
[13:52]	:	(artemis.lecker) is now known as ART.
[13:52]	 	(bronson.blackadder): thats what I houghtthe credentials were relevant to SL not facebook
[13:53]	:	Ya. A good, creative background. Some of the stuff out there maybe me feel like he at least gets it.
[13:53]	 	(bronson.blackadder): and here our new CEO is
[13:54]	:	Bronson's new CEO is here?
[13:55]	:	Where? the onlky Linden I see on radar is Jeremy here
[13:55]	 	has pinged you.
[13:55]	:	-k
[13:55]	 	(bronson.blackadder): jesterjax
[13:55]	:	You can see me on radar?
[13:55]	:	NO!
[13:55]	:	Oh I've been outed!
[13:55]	:	(Kidding)
[13:55]	:	hehehe
[13:55]	 	(bronson.blackadder): oddly enough yo are o minimp
[13:56]	 	(bronson.blackadder): and in V2 you show up on nearby people
[13:56]	:	Oh, that's normal. LSL sensors won't returns results for Lindens who are using their admin powers, though.
[13:56]	 	(bronson.blackadder): you are on
[13:56]	:	I wonder what sort of reaction certain sections of SL would have if a prominant kid-av became CEO. Probably have a hissyfit, or even a complete meltdown. I'd pay good money to see that meltdown, too. :D
[13:56]	 	(bronson.blackadder): SL is eating letters
[13:57]	:	/me is pretty sure M Linden was a table avatar at one point.
[13:57]	:	Heh
[13:57]	 	(bronson.blackadder): I have low opinions of him
[13:57]	:	Tables, even those with tea and donuts, are not quite so controversial, though.
[13:57]	:	Is "Tableplay" banned?
[13:57]	:	/me winks
[13:57]	 	(bronson.blackadder): I saw a picture of julian assange and one of M linden, and the two were eerily similer
[13:58]	 	(bronson.blackadder): but it was one specific picture of jukian assange
[13:58]	:	I tihnk they only inanimate object I've ever been as an avatar was a walking trashcan. Never been a table.
[13:58]	 	(bronson.blackadder): julian even
[13:58]	:	You have been online for 1 hours.
[13:58]	 	(arawn.spitteler): With Marianne as CEO, she could bann anyone who claimed Managemant was screwing them over.
[13:58]	 	(bronson.blackadder): I saw oskar linden use a toilet as an avatar
[13:58]	:	Well, at least tables have legs...
[13:58]	 	(bronson.blackadder): had teeth and everything
[13:59]	:	hmmmm.... with a name like oskar, I'd have expected him to show up as a trashcan at least once.
[13:59]	:	And a muppet.
[13:59]	:	/me would likely distance herself form this account an avatar in such a contest. A table, however, sounds fine by me..
[13:59]	 	(bronson.blackadder): and I jst realized, this is going into the wiki transcripts SORRY OSKAR!!!!
[13:59]	:	or a muppet in a trashcan
[14:00]	 	(arawn.spitteler): He might be using the muppet in a trashcan as an alt
[14:00]	:	That's actually why I made this avatar the way I did. My Resident account already looks vaguely like my real-life self. :-X
[14:00]	:	Yeah, but then he wouldn't be playing off his fist name. :D
[14:00]	 	(arawn.spitteler): A table with chair followers might be good for a CEO
[14:01]	:	Time f'r me to scoot. Take care!
[14:01]	:	I know someone who's the equivalent of a Linden on another grid, with Trinity as the first name (and it's because all the accounts like that they use their first REAL name, and hers happens to be Trinity IRL), and she's made hjerself look like the Trinity from the Matrix movies tere
[14:01]	:	Bye Bye!!
[14:01]	:	Ooh, time to cut for the transcript.
[14:01]	:	Yah, she had fun wiuth that
 
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