Open Source Meeting/2010-01-07

== Transcript ==
*[14:00] Merov Linden: there's an agenda that is basically a long list of JIRA records
*[14:00] Ardy Lay: Uhh... Ignore tha picklist at the bottom. I didn't get finished.
*[14:00] Morgaine Dinova: Happy New Year, Merov!
*[14:01] Thickbrick Sleaford: some of that list got fixed today by Soft and Robin
*[14:01] Ardy Lay: I feel a bit awkward writing an agenda when I don't see much discussion in SLDev.
*[14:01] Merov Linden: Happy New Year all
*[14:02] Merov Linden: I things we can start that meeting officially
*[14:02] Merov Linden: the first of 2010
*[14:02] Morgaine Dinova waves to all :-)
*[14:02] Ardy Lay: So it kinda turns into a bug triage list.
*[14:02] Sahkolihaa Contepomi waves.
*[14:02] Merov Linden: sooo, there's this long list of JIRA records aka SNOW bugs in the agenda
*[14:02] Merov Linden: that all hide one single thing: Snowglobe 1.3
*[14:03] Ardy Lay: Can you tell how the plugin API work is progressing?
*[14:04] Merov Linden: Ardy, hold that thought one sec
*[14:04] Ardy Lay: OKay
*[14:04] Merov Linden: so, from a schedule standpoint, the RC for 1.3 is *tomorrow* : http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/SLDev_Viewer_Current_Cycle
*[14:04] Merov Linden: that means that we should push today committing all those pending patches
*[14:04] Morgaine Dinova: Merov, are you allowed to say whether Viewer2.0 is compatible with Snowglobe plugins? (I'd like to think Snowglobe's API was developed with that in mind.)
*[14:05] Merov Linden: and punt all the rest *unless* there are showstoppers in them
*[14:05] Merov Linden: Morgaine: yes, I am allowed to say it :)
*[14:05] Merov Linden: and the answer is yes
*[14:05] Morgaine Dinova: Wooohooo!!!!!
*[14:05] Merov Linden: that's the same API
*[14:05] Morgaine Dinova: Thankees :-)
*[14:05] Ardy Lay: I don't see any open issues labled ShowStopper
*[14:06] Thickbrick Sleaford: I suggest giving commiters a "last notice" a few days before declaring an RC
*[14:06] Merov Linden: one thing though is that viewer 2.0 will make new / more advanced use of pluginapi
*[14:06] Merov Linden: things we don't have in Snowglobe
*[14:06] Thickbrick Sleaford is thinking of Aleric's work on SNOW-129
*[14:06] Select account from list at login
*[14:06] Merov Linden: but, if you were to write a plugin today against Snowglobe
*[14:06] Merov Linden: it will work in Viewer 2.0
*[14:06] Merov Linden: that's the whole point of SNOW-301
*[14:06] Update pluginapi code so to support newest API
*[14:06] Erinyse Planer: any more specific eta yet on 2.0 for snowglobe?
*[14:06] Morgaine Dinova: Excellent
*[14:07] Merov Linden: (which took lots of my time... grr....)
*[14:07] Opensource Obscure: currently snowglobe is quite unusable to me - the webkit plugin (or the plugins support itself) makes load go very very high here (Linux)
*[14:07] Merov Linden: so, that articulates quite nicely with Ardy's question earlier :)
*[14:07] Ardy Lay: I see you commited another patch under SNOW-301 today I should test against my issue described in SNOW-420.
*[14:07] Windows 7 (64-bit edition) issues error "SLPlugin.exe has stopped working" and offers to send 3 files to Microsoft.
*[14:08] Erinyse Planer: my snowglobe keeps telling me some audio plugin is missing -_-
*[14:08] Ardy Lay: I am wondering if 420 is unique to me.
*[14:08] Merov Linden: so yes, this last commit on SNOW-301 should help solve all remaining plugin issues
*[14:08] Merov Linden knocks on wood
*[14:08] Opensource Obscure: : )
*[14:09] Erinyse Planer rubs her skull from the knocking
*[14:09] Merov Linden: at least, now we have a base that we can safely test on and that helps me discuss with the media team effectively
*[14:09] Ardy Lay: Nice
*[14:09] Thickbrick Sleaford: Merov, a question about snow-301: the updated OpenAL package says it's from GIT. Can you say when was it pulled from upstream?
*[14:09] Opensource Obscure: anyone know if is there a JIRA for high load on Snowglobe/Linux due to plugins? it happens even at the login page.
*[14:10] Merov Linden: there is also a doc (yes!) that should come public anytime now on the wiki
*[14:10] Merov Linden: about plugins
*[14:10] Ardy Lay: OO, yes there is.
*[14:10] Opensource Obscure: i saw https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Media_Plugin_System_Message_Definitions got recently updated
*[14:10] Thickbrick Sleaford: OO: SNOW-416
*[14:10] When i open the Search and hit the Search Button one or mere tasks of the SLPlugin start
*[14:11] Opensource Obscure: thanks!
*[14:11] Merov Linden: ok, so, plugin bugs will remain my main focus till we ship 1.3
*[14:11] Merov Linden: please do test with the latest from trunk (may be wait for me to post binaries if you don't build)
*[14:11] Merov Linden: and log new bugs
*[14:12] Merov Linden: please don't reopen old ones: symptoms can be the same but cause different so wading through old threads drive me half crazy and waste lots of my time
*[14:12] Opensource Obscure: re: snow-416, i'd raise priority to critical. i can't use snowglobe at all, currrently. what do you (everybody) think?
*[14:12] Merov Linden sighs
*[14:12] Ardy Lay: OO, also see SNOW-318
*[14:12] Instances of QtWebkit SLPlugin remain in memory after closing (some) browser floaters.
*[14:12] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: SNOW-416
*[14:12] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Oh load you silly thing. >_>
*[14:13] Sahkolihaa Contepomi found it
*[14:13] Merov Linden: Ardy : withe the commit I just did?
*[14:13] Merov Linden: there's new cleanup code for webkit in there
*[14:13] Ardy Lay: Merov, I need to recheck for 420's issue
*[14:13] Merov Linden: hmmm ok...
*[14:13] Ardy Lay: I will update it when I do.
*[14:14] Merov Linden: yes, please retest those old bugs
*[14:14] Merov Linden: some I couldn't repro really :(
*[14:14] Ardy Lay: I sometimes have trouble coraling my helper. ;-)
*[14:15] SL Open Source General Info whispers: Thank you! Your items will be delivered to you soon!
*[14:15] Merov Linden: tell me about it
*[14:15] Erinyse Planer: If im getting 416 its not pushing it as high... the only plugin issue i have is i keep getting message im missing some audio one and need to reinstall it -_-
*[14:16] Merov Linden: when seeing plugin bugs BTW, please attach the log to the JIRA and write in which region the media problem arise
*[14:16] Ardy Lay: Hmm... SHould I be able to play these .mov URLs in the inworld web browser window?
*[14:17] Merov Linden: you should
*[14:17] Merov Linden: I can on Mac and Windows for sire
*[14:17] Merov Linden: sure
*[14:18] Ardy Lay: Hmm... I just get a white page with a horizontal black bar 3/4 down the page.
*[14:19] Merov Linden: are you sure the media is correctly positioned? set?
*[14:19] Merov Linden: we're getting into debug mode here
*[14:20] Merov Linden: I propose that we have a "test sprint" next week once I produce an RC
*[14:20] Ardy Lay: Okay
*[14:20] Merov Linden: should we use that time slot?
*[14:20] Thickbrick Sleaford: BTW, there's a media testing parcel in this sim, over at Robin's headquarters, and also a set of parcels on Bug Island in the North-East corner
*[14:20] Ardy Lay: I am just clicking on the 2 URLs in SNOW-420 that I said worked on a prim inworld using parcel media settings.
*[14:21] Erinyse Planer: wow just totally lost all media when trying to repo 420 -_-
*[14:21] Ardy Lay: What time slot, Merov?
*[14:21] Merov Linden: this one we're in right now: Thurday 2pm PST
*[14:21] Ardy Lay: Fine with me.
*[14:22] Merov Linden: we usually need more than 1 hour for this
*[14:22] Erinyse Planer: I'll try and be here though not being a coder im sure i wont be much help
*[14:22] Merov Linden: I can extend before or after. Will after work for all around here?
*[14:22] Opensource Obscure: fine for me
*[14:22] Merov Linden: Erinyse: you don't need to be a coder to help!
*[14:22] Aimee Trescothick: non-coders can still contribute plenty in a test sprint
*[14:22] Merov Linden: au contraire
*[14:23] Ardy Lay: Either works for me.
*[14:23] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: I can only really be here for the hour since when the hour ends, it's 11PM for me.
*[14:23] Merov Linden: but being around with coders, we can try to see collaboratively what going wrong
*[14:23] Aimee Trescothick: you don't need to know how to write it to find how to break it :D
*[14:23] Ardy Lay: I can break stuff.
*[14:23] Merov Linden: that's... good...
*[14:23] Merov Linden: :)
*[14:24] Sahkolihaa Contepomi can too.
*[14:24] Aimee Trescothick will supply hammers
*[14:24] Opensource Obscure: xD
*[14:24] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Haha
*[14:24] Claw Hammer v0.13i: You can't touch this Thickbrick!
*[14:24] Thickbrick Sleaford: lol
*[14:25] Merov Linden: ok, that's the big chunk again that time around
*[14:25] Merov Linden: then there's Robin's proxy code
*[14:25] Merov Linden: and Cypren multiple accounts login drop down (not committed yet)
*[14:26] Merov Linden phone call
*[14:26] Ardy Lay: Not sure I can use the proxy stuff myself, yet. Multiple accounts I can play with I suppose. Let my help login on my computer.
*[14:26] Aimee Trescothick hangs up just before Merov answers
*[14:26] Ardy Lay: HEhe
*[14:27] Merov Linden back
*[14:27] Merov Linden: sorry about that
*[14:27] Luisa Bourgoin: version 1.3.0(3008) ... font related ... something eats the lowest pixelrow at name tags, hoovertext, chatwindow text lines ... on some characters, not every and anywhere. drives me crazy ... that's a bug? or Windows Vista related?
*[14:27] Merov Linden: so, yes, there are also the whole strings of smallish patches
*[14:27] Merov Linden: dangling and waiting for love... and committers...
*[14:28] Merov Linden: I'll do some but, if you are a committer (you know who you are... :) ), please jump on those, code review and comment
*[14:28] Merov Linden: commit I mean
*[14:28] Merov Linden: unless you don't like them then bring to sldev for discussion
*[14:29] Ardy Lay: Luisa, does playing with UI scale change that?
*[14:29] Luisa Bourgoin tries
*[14:29] Merov Linden: Luisa: screen shot?
*[14:29] Merov Linden: please file a JIRA
*[14:29] Merov Linden: the only test change I'm aware off are on localized versions
*[14:29] Luisa Bourgoin: can create a shot. scaling is 1.000 . btw an F does not get harmed, but the E suffers a lot from this
*[14:30] Merov Linden: which language are you using?
*[14:30] Luisa Bourgoin: english
*[14:30] Merov Linden: hmmm
*[14:31] Merov Linden: well, please log with a screen shot and mention the platform you use and the version you run
*[14:31] Thickbrick Sleaford: Merov, most of the low hanging fruit patches are either waiting on a contributor agreement, or assigned to Soft
*[14:32] Ardy Lay: Luisa, a screenshot of Advanced -> XUI -> Font Test may be helpful.
*[14:32] Merov Linden: on all other bugs (i.e. those with no patch attached), I'll do a triage and keep only a small core of them, like regressions, new crashers
*[14:32] Merov Linden: Thickbrick: yes, some are assigned to me too...
*[14:33] Merov Linden: I'll check for the CLA, I have only 2 in the pipe with questions
*[14:33] Opensource Obscure: another question about using JIRA .. and specifically http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SNOW-416 - "SLPlugin(s) takes high CPU% when i open the Search and hit the Search Button"
*[14:33] takes high CPU% when i open the Search and hit the Search Button
*[14:33] Opensource Obscure: since I experience high CPU% even at the login screen, should I file a new separate issue?
*[14:33] Opensource Obscure: ..or should I add details to the existing one?
*[14:34] Merov Linden: detail the existing one
*[14:34] Opensource Obscure: fine, thanks
*[14:34] Merov Linden: likely the same issue in that case
*[14:34] Merov Linden: or related lets say
*[14:34] Opensource Obscure: webkit
*[14:34] Merov Linden: yes, webkit is used on launch to display the splash screen
*[14:35] Merov Linden: and in search of course to display the web stuff
*[14:37] Ardy Lay: I am wondering if the people that filed the older texture issues that are still open are still having problems.
*[14:37] Merov Linden: that needs to be tested again Ardy
*[14:37] Merov Linden: I was looking at the list of "critical" and "major" bugs
*[14:38] Erinyse Planer: maybe a few of us can go through some of those older issues and ping some of the reporters and commenters to ask for updates?
*[14:38] Merov Linden: I'd appreciate people trying to repro with latest build and add comments
*[14:38] Ardy Lay: There is a list in SNOW-269 for texture issues if somebody can help there.
*[14:38] Meta Issue: Various Texture Fetch and Decode Issues
*[14:38] Thickbrick Sleaford: SNOW-94 has a new repro video - seems to be related to vram being set too low on Mac
*[14:38] Textures keep reloading
*[14:38] Merov Linden: Erinyse: yes please! :)
*[14:39] Erinyse Planer: okay I will try and do that when i get back from moving. I might ask a friend to help too.
*[14:39] Erinyse Planer: cant guarnatee ill get to it before the next official sg release though
*[14:39] Merov Linden: on SNOW-94: I saw that video but I couldn't repro for the life of me
*[14:40] Jonathan Yap: I can try going through those issues in -269
*[14:40] Merov Linden: may be a vram issue as you said
*[14:40] Aimee Trescothick: hmmm, could be related to those letters being a small part of a larger texture
*[14:40] Merov Linden: any help in trying to repro bug is *critical* to us devs
*[14:41] Merov Linden: I spend a lot of time just trying to understand what people are reporting and reproducing the bugs
*[14:41] Erinyse Planer: joanthan want to get with me sometime tomarrow and we can split it up?
*[14:41] Jonathan Yap: Will there be a new version of SG to download tomorrow?
*[14:41] Jonathan Yap: Sure Erinyse
*[14:41] Merov Linden: consistent repro steps are *gold* for devs!
*[14:42] Merov Linden: Jonathan: yes, the plan is to create a new build tomorrow
*[14:43] Merov Linden: Aimee: brilliant! indeed, folks often use texture translation to display small chunks
*[14:43] Merov Linden: I didn't think about this
*[14:43] Aimee Trescothick: yeah, they're indexing into a font effectively
*[14:44] Thickbrick Sleaford: the xyzzy text displays are pretty common, and seems to work well with snowglobe, thgough
*[14:44] Aimee Trescothick: so it will be using small U an Vs
*[14:44] Merov Linden: could be that they need to reload as GL texture all the time
*[14:45] Ardy Lay: 4 characters in the center of the OFF DUTY signs are index from a font sheet.
*[14:46] Merov Linden: ok, another place I could use help in bug repro
*[14:46] Merov Linden: is going through the bugs that are unassigned
*[14:46] Merov Linden: to any version I mean
*[14:47] Erinyse Planer: is there a way to make a filter to detect those automatically?
*[14:47] Ardy Lay: Yes
*[14:47] Merov Linden: yes, use the dashboard
*[14:47] Merov Linden gets a link
*[14:47] Merov Linden: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SNOW
*[14:48] Merov Linden: click on "Unscheduled", that the list of recent and not reviewed/reproed bugs
*[14:48] Merov Linden: that's a long list
*[14:48] Merov Linden: takes time to go through 39 bugs
*[14:49] Lava Inside - Simple Message Board - Widescreen: Initializing, please wait.
*[14:49] Lava Inside - Simple Message Board - Widescreen: Complete.
*[14:49] Erinyse Planer: okey dokey... well if its not a priority, i can try and repo those after i get back from moving and getting set up in my new place... (hoepfully two weeks or less)
*[14:49] Merov Linden: IW or RL?
*[14:50] Erinyse Planer: Rl moving
*[14:50] Erinyse Planer: Sc to Az
*[14:51] Merov Linden: ok, so, we'll have an RC tomorrow (hoefully), clean up the JIRA then test sprint next week
*[14:51] Merov Linden: that's for 1.3
*[14:52] Merov Linden: then, there's the *after* 1.3...
*[14:53] Merov Linden: I can't get into too much details but, as you know, M and Q both alluded to a renewed OS effort
*[14:53] Merov Linden: M in a blog and Q in his office hour
*[14:53] Mm Alder: Renewed? Are we old?
*[14:53] Merov Linden: that is likely to suck up my time in the near (post 1.3) future
*[14:54] Merov Linden: yes, we are as old as this world... which isthe oldest you can get around here :)
*[14:54] Thickbrick Sleaford: that sounds a lot like a 2.0 release
*[14:54] Erinyse Planer: renewed as in not just being the snowglobe project anymore?
*[14:55] Ardy Lay: SNOW-94 is easy to repro if I set "Texture Memory" to 64MB. (adding to JIRA)
*[14:55] Merov Linden: Snowglobe will stay for sure
*[14:55] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: 64MB...eep.
*[14:55] Opensource Obscure: here are some details about what 'renewed' means according to Q Linden http://friendfeed.com/secondlife/aaa75c8a/great-in-world-meeting-with-q-linden-who-gave-us
*[14:56] Thickbrick Sleaford: BTW, when is Q's office hour?
*[14:56] Morgaine Dinova: Hopefully that "renewed OS effort" means that the message got through to M about the last year's secrecy being counterproductive.
*[14:56] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: It's on a Wednesday.
*[14:56] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Let me check my HUD.
*[14:56] Opensource Obscure: Wednesday, 8:00 AM: Q Linden: User experience
 http://slurl.com/secondlife/Longfellow/220/168/25
*[14:56] Erinyse Planer: 8 am i think?
*[14:57] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: OO beat me to it.
*[14:57] Merov Linden: well, I guess I can't add much on Q's writing :)
*[14:57] Mm Alder: Whatever happened to the Hippo awards?
*[14:57] Merov Linden: but, without going into specific, I'll be working on that and that may temporarily hamper my availability on patches
*[14:58] Merov Linden: that's all the good of OS in the end though
*[14:58] Merov Linden: :)
*[14:58] Opensource Obscure: you need to hire someone else!
*[14:58] Erinyse Planer: merov... if you just send me notecards of what you need most done with pjira once in a while i'll try and help out. cant romise ill always be able to do stuff, but if i know what you need i can at least try
*[14:58] Merov Linden: Hippo awards: this is in the hands of marketing and product management
*[14:59] Merov Linden: I need to ping them again
*[14:59] Merov Linden: Erinyse: the way I do communicate with the cmmunity is through sldev as much as possible
*[15:00] Merov Linden: so I'll post on sldev as to which bugs need most attention
*[15:00] Merov Linden: are you subscribed?
*[15:00] Erinyse Planer: im on the mailing list there too but i dont always get the email
*[15:00] Merov Linden: ? strange...
*[15:00] Erinyse Planer: depends how capped both my non work emails get
*[15:00] Opensource Obscure: https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sldev look archives, 1st line
*[15:01] Merov Linden: ok, my Google caledar is telling me I'm late for my next meeting
*[15:01] Erinyse Planer: tc merov :) and ty
*[15:01] Aimee Trescothick: thanks Merov :)
*[15:01] Opensource Obscure: bye everybody
*[15:01] Merov Linden: so, see you guys next week for the test print and stay tune for the RC to drop
*[15:01] Jonathan Yap: Thanks Merov
*[15:02] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: See you Merov.
*[15:02] Merov Linden: bye guys
 
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