Beta Server Office Hours/Minutes/2011-09-08

Category:Beta Server Office Hours - Minutes
This meeting was held on September 08th, 2011
== Agenda ==
* It's September. Christmas is right around the corner. Is your shopping done yet?
* Whats the current status on pivots for mesh? [Motor Loon]
=== Updates ===
* Second Life Server (main channel)
* BlueSteel got promoted this week. 
* This was parcel rezzing bug fixes.
** https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_Server/11#11.08.26.239591
* BlueSteel RC Channel
** This channel matches Trunk
** https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_RC_BlueSteel/11#11.08.26.239591
* LeTigre RC Channel
** This is the same "maint-server" project with a merge from trunk.
** Bug Fixes:
*** Fix for - "Folders are Texture Category Folders"
**** https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7169
*** Fix for - "llSetMemoryLimit - Wrong amount being reserved for memory/Display inconsistance with OBJECT_SCRIPT_MEMORY"
**** https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7192
*** Fix for - "Bounds error when calling PRIM_LINK_TARGET in a child prim"
**** https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SCR-162
** https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_RC_LeTigre/11#1.09.02.239988
* Magnum RC Channel
** We're giving the project in this slot from last week that failed a second chance. There are no new features or bug fixes. Changes were made to the permissions system and to simulator configuration, but should have no impact on existing builds. Additionally we included the changes from BlueSteel.
** https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Release_Notes/Second_Life_RC_Magnum/11#11.09.02.239993
=== Upcoming Stuff ===
* andrew's script performance tweaks
Transcript of Oskar Linden's Beta Server Office Hour for September 08th, 2011:
* [14:59] Jacky Scharf: Gooooood evening ladies and gentlemen. ㋡
* [14:59] Oskar Linden: hi everyone
* [14:59] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:00] Fancy Greeter: Coyot Linden has arrived!
* [15:00] Homeless: hi Oskar
* [15:00] Fancy Greeter: Maestro Linden has arrived!
* [15:00] Oskar Linden: we'll wait a bit and let people rez
* [15:01] Motor Loon: so... all day eh? °͜°
* [15:01] Nalates Urriah: small crowd...
* [15:01] WolfPup Lowenhar: thx just got here my self and still loading
* [15:01] Oskar Linden: how was everyone's week?
* [15:01] Homeless: should be loaded by next thursday
* [15:01] Lares Carter: very busy week :/
* [15:01] Talia Malaspina: Holy farking shiite! Hello
* [15:01] Motor Loon: ey Maestro... could you give me a footrub since you're in here anyway?
* [15:01] Nalates Urriah: Hot in SoCal
* [15:02] Oskar Linden: Seattle finally got summer
* [15:02] Oskar Linden: it's been nice
* [15:02] Jacky ScharfJacky Scharf .oO( Coyot wants to swim away? He needs water? )
* [15:02] Nalates Urriah: It rained and then got hot. Ugh! Not SoCal weather
* [15:02] Motor LoonMotor Loon remembers "summer" from vacations to countries NOT Denmark...
* [15:02] Oskar Linden: ahh summer
* [15:03] Motor Loon: worst summer in over 40 years here °͜°
* [15:03] Oskar Linden: i need to get my car finished soon so I can start cruising
* [15:03] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:03] Oskar Linden: Seattle office had ice cream today
* [15:03] Nalates Urriah: yum
* [15:03] Motor Loon: what flavor?
* [15:03] WolfPup Lowenhar: lucky folks there in Seattle
* [15:03] Oskar Linden: vanilla bean dipped in chocolate
* [15:04] Motor Loon: mmmmh....
* [15:04] Motor LoonMotor Loon drools a little...
* [15:04] Oskar Linden: alright
* [15:04] Oskar Linden: let's get this party started
* [15:04] Oskar Linden: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Server_Beta_User_Group
* [15:04] Rex Cronon: greetings
* [15:04] Oskar Linden: there is the agenda
* [15:04] Coyot Linden: In soviet union, party finds you
* [15:04] Oskar Linden: I had hoped to have a special linden guest today
* [15:05] Motor Loon: pretty big agenda... we'll be here a while
* [15:05] Oskar Linden: well I mean of course all lindens are special
* [15:05] Nalates Urriah: :) right
* [15:05] Coyot Linden: "special"
* [15:05] Oskar Linden: but a new linden you have not met yet
* [15:05] Motor Loon: shortbus will be here in 5
* [15:05] Oskar Linden: he had a meeting he couldn't get out of
* [15:05] Latif Khalifa: falcon is pretty "special" :P
* [15:05] Oskar Linden: so next week we'll have Gez Linden here
* [15:05] Nalates Urriah: He knew he was gona get hazed
* [15:05] Motor Loon: cool name
* [15:06] Rex Cronon: geez?
* [15:06] Homeless: all Lindens are special but some are more special than others?
* [15:06] Oskar Linden: he's just gonna talk about some cool new things we're working on
* [15:06] Rex Cronon: oh gez
* [15:06] Motor Loon: hehe
* [15:06] Motor Loon: we'll have fun with that name
* [15:06] Oskar Linden: he's a sharp guy. I like his projects
* [15:06] Oskar Linden: but that's all I can say
* [15:06] Oskar Linden: ;-)
* [15:06] Nalates Urriah: Is his middle name 'these'
* [15:06] Oskar Linden: and now that I have fueled your curiosity I will evade further questions and jump into the agenda
* [15:07] Oskar Linden: thankfully this week has been fairly tame
* [15:07] Motor Loon: soo.. next week = early xmas presents?
* [15:07] Coyot Linden: It is only Sept. for heaven's sake
* [15:07] Oskar Linden: we've had so many crazy weeks this year it's nice when we can have a week when things just seem to go the way they're supposed to
* [15:07] Motor Loon: never too early for presents
* [15:07] Oskar Linden: right coyot?
* [15:07] Coyot Linden: RIGHT
* [15:07] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:08] Oskar Linden: sometimes this place feels like NASA Mission Control
* [15:08] Oskar Linden: and every week is a moon landing
* [15:08] Motor Loon: True that
* [15:08] TankMaster Finesmith: wouldnt that be something... weekly moon landings...
* [15:08] Coyot Linden: Grand Central. Next deploy leaving the station at noon.
* [15:08] Homeless: and no Apollo 13's
* [15:08] Motor Loon: sometimes the rockets even explode on liftoff °͜°
* [15:08] Oskar Linden: the velocity is great for SL, but managing it is quite a process
* [15:09] Oskar Linden: The BlueSteel code got promoted this week
* [15:09] Coyot Linden: Sometimes you're the windshield...
* [15:09] Oskar Linden: this was a lot of the prim and parcel rezzing fixes
* [15:09] Homeless: Morris should be made into a lunar landscape
* [15:10] Oskar Linden: maestro do you have any details on the changes now that they've shipped and are live
* [15:11] Maestro Linden: Yep, so the promoted bluesteel code had a sim crasher caused by a nasty LSL script that the compiler would hang on
* [15:11] Homeless: and replace the moon with the earth in the sky
* [15:11] Maestro Linden: also there were fixes to several longstanding issues with object entry rules, particularly around region boundaries
* [15:11] Motor Loon: thats a good one to fix, thank you °͜°
* [15:12] Maestro Linden: for example, it was possible to rez an object across a region boundary using a script, even if parcels on both sides disallowed object entry and object rez
* [15:12] WolfPup Lowenhar: hey Tank Master
* [15:12] TankMaster Finesmith: howdy
* [15:12] Nalates Urriah: Was that the Meeroos problem?
* [15:12] Maestro Linden: yep
* [15:12] Maestro Linden: are you familiar with ATM skimmers?
* [15:12] Nalates Urriah: Yes
* [15:13] Maestro Linden: fake card readers that get attached to RL ATMs
* [15:13] Motor Loon: ooh yes... damn clever criminals
* [15:13] Maestro Linden: it was like that with some popular vendors, such as meeroo food vendors
* [15:13] Latif Khalifa: yeah i found those fake transparent vendors on my sim too
* [15:13] Maestro Linden: transparent objects would enter vendors' parcels and try to trick people to give money to them
* [15:13] Flip Idlemind: Someone mentioned (and I've seen) that vehicles (that you're sitting on) can no longer move onto parcels without enough prims to support them. Is that a still-unresolved bug, or expected behavior now?
* [15:13] Maestro Linden: with the fixes, it'll be harder to get those items in a parcel if object entry and build are disabled
* [15:14] Maestro Linden: that's a bug, FLIP
* [15:14] Motor Loon: That should be in the works atleast Flip
* [15:14] Maestro Linden: the vehicle should be ok as long as the avatar sits on it
* [15:14] Homeless: would autoreturn get rid of those objects?
* [15:14] Motor Loon: I was asking about that last week I think it was
* [15:14] Maestro Linden: it should only be returned once the last passenger stands up
* [15:14] Latif Khalifa: well you can still sit on the fake vender and edit move it over into a parcel
* [15:14] Motor Loon: highly annoying bug btw
* [15:15] Latif Khalifa: so if one parcel on the sim is rez, all parcels on the sims are rez
* [15:15] Maestro Linden: that's also fixed in certain cases, Latif
* [15:15] Motor Loon: autoreturn can also sort those cases real easy
* [15:16] Oskar Linden: we did not have a new code candidate ready for BlueSteel
* [15:16] Oskar Linden: so BlueSteel matches trunk
* [15:16] Latif Khalifa: I always had the problem with that. I want my store to be rez with autoreturn so people can unpack, but if I do that then can rez there, sit, and move anywhere else
* [15:16] Jacky Scharf: What's the full name of these vendors?
* [15:17] Maestro Linden: I imagine they take on unlimited kinds of names
* [15:17] Motor Loon: they'd name them like your vendors jacky
* [15:17] Jacky Scharf: Damned.
* [15:17] Motor Loon: when was the "edit freezes physical objects" fix in for deploys?
* [15:17] Jacky Scharf: Ok, thx.
* [15:17] Maestro Linden: ah, that's in the pipeline as well, Motor. that branch might see RC next week.
* [15:17] Motor Loon: thats a God fix too
* [15:17] Motor Loon: I luv' it
* [15:17] Motor Loon: I luv' Lindens
* [15:17] Latif Khalifa: yeah
* [15:18] Rex Cronon: u could have your vendors change name randomly:)
* [15:18] Oskar Linden: a god fix?
* [15:18] Maestro Linden: so that branch also has some other stuff..
* [15:18] Maestro Linden: meshy parameters will be scriptable
* [15:18] Motor Loon: Looking forward to that
* [15:18] Motor Loon: yaay
* [15:18] Talia Malaspina: Wheeeeeee!!
* [15:18] Maestro Linden: like the physics material properties (gravity etc) for an object,
* [15:18] Motor Loon: more than just the "shape" ?
* [15:18] Motor Loon: ah
* [15:18] Motor Loon: goodie
* [15:19] Oskar Linden: that's cool
* [15:19] Maestro Linden: and also a new prim params flag, PRIM_PHYSICS_SHAPE_TYPE
* [15:19] Motor Loon: thats the ubercool one
* [15:19] Motor Loon: I need that one for my big boat project °͜°
* [15:19] Maestro Linden: which, as it turns out, isn't really any worse than llSetPos() on a child prim in linkset, or setting PRIM_TYPE
* [15:19] Maestro Linden: also there's a new function, llGetMassMKS()
* [15:19] Maestro Linden: which returns the mass in kg
* [15:20] Motor Loon: oh... nice
* [15:20] Maestro Linden: we decided that llGetMass() really returns in units of 100kg
* [15:20] Coyot LindenCoyot Linden wants PRIM_PHYSICS_RELATIVISTIC
* [15:20] Maestro Linden: so llGetMassMKS() is basically just a scaled version of llGetMass() =P
* [15:20] Oskar Linden: nice
* [15:20] Maestro Linden: hm let's see, there's also supposed to be a fix for SVC-6955
* [15:20] Flame of Jira: [#SVC-6955] Attempt to rez object failed, item is not returned, missing from database https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-6955
* [15:20] Latif Khalifa: PRIM_PHYSICS_DISABLE_PE? :p
* [15:21] Maestro Linden: and SVC-7169
* [15:21] Flame of Jira: [#SVC-7169] Folders are Texture Category Folders https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7169
* [15:21] Motor Loon: haha
* [15:21] Homeless: I'm looking forward to PRIM_PHYSICS_LIQUID
* [15:21] Maestro Linden: and SCR-53
* [15:21] Flame of Jira: [#SCR-53] llSensorRepeat not triggering no_sensor unless a sensor event handler is present https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SCR-53
* [15:21] Motor Loon: You guys have been busy °͜°
* [15:21] Latif Khalifa: SVC-7169 is really nasty I hope it gets promoted the next week
* [15:21] Flame of Jira: [#SVC-7169] Folders are Texture Category Folders https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7169
* [15:21] Maestro Linden: oh and, llCastRay() is enabled there
* [15:21] Oskar Linden: cast ray
* [15:22] Maestro Linden: (not to be confused with llCastrate())
* [15:22] Oskar Linden: o.O
* [15:22] Motor Loon: lol
* [15:22] Talia MalaspinaTalia Malaspina eeps.
* [15:22] Coyot Linden: See this is why I make those jokes
* [15:22] Talia Malaspina: Noooo!
* [15:22] Coyot Linden: Cause if I don't someone else will. :P
* [15:22] ATechwolf FoxclawATechwolf Foxclaw hides
* [15:22] Rex Cronon: if u make lazers with it...
* [15:22] Maestro Linden: ok, so that's one project
* [15:22] ATechwolf Foxclaw: Me like balls.
* [15:22] Oskar Linden: set AVATAR_GENDER 0;
* [15:23] Maestro Linden: another project is some "mesh maint-server", which has some mesh bugfixes
* [15:23] Nalates Urriah: CastRay is enabled where?
* [15:23] Motor LoonMotor Loon almost wanna do grouphugs for all the fixes there
* [15:23] Oskar Linden: we can group hug
* [15:23] Motor Loon: yaay
* [15:23] Oskar Linden: can we all fit in that tub?
* [15:23] Talia Malaspina: What's worse, plywood balls or a cardboard box?
* [15:23] Maestro Linden: which ahs a fix for SVC-7201, SVC-7231 ..
* [15:23] Flame of Jira: [#SVC-7201] receiving messages from Ozimal bunnies about not being allowed on my sim https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7231
* [15:23] Flame of Jira: [#SVC-7231] Vehicles can no longer enter parcels with not enough prims to support the vehicle even when *not* crossing a sim boundry https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7231
* [15:24] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:24] Maestro Linden: hmm and some other misc. changes
* [15:24] Motor Loon: ah yes, 7231 that was the one
* [15:24] Flip Idlemind: Aha, that's the one was talking about
* [15:24] Maestro Linden: a lot of it's related to parcel resource bugs
* [15:24] Coyot Linden: It's just part and parcel of what we do.
* [15:25] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:26] Maestro Linden: Hm, that's about all we have
* [15:26] Motor Loon: do we have aditi sandboxes with water anywhere btw?
* [15:26] Rex Cronon: rausch has some water
* [15:26] Maestro Linden: Maybe you can rez boats near Murray?
* [15:26] Motor Loon: okies
* [15:26] Maestro Linden: or in that kapor/rosedale lake
* [15:26] Maestro Linden: Mnemosyne looks aquatic
* [15:27] Motor Loon: neat
* [15:27] Oskar Linden: we can make a water sandbox I guess
* [15:27] Motor Loon: mabye just half water would be excellent
* [15:27] Coyot Linden: The top half?
* [15:27] Rex Cronon: put a big lake at sandbox weapons testing:)
* [15:27] Motor Loon: yeah °͜°
* [15:27] Talia MalaspinaTalia Malaspina eeps.
* [15:28] Oskar Linden: there we go
* [15:28] Coyot Linden: tsunami!!!!!
* [15:28] Motor Loon: dont have to be deeper than the bottom
* [15:28] Talia Malaspina: Noooo!
* [15:28] Coyot LindenCoyot Linden is glad he is on higher ground
* [15:28] Homeless: just like Venice!
* [15:28] Motor Loon: just ... with less piss in the water
* [15:28] Coyot Linden: except not as smelly ;)
* [15:28] Motor Loon: °͜°
* [15:28] Latif Khalifa: true that lol
* [15:29] Rex Cronon: need a motorboat?
* [15:29] Homeless: could make the water cloudy and green
* [15:29] Oskar Linden: who has a boat we can finish this meeting in
* [15:29] Motor Loon: I have my mesh boat .. not quite finished though
* [15:29] Coyot Linden: The whole world is a boat sailing through space.
* [15:30] Talia Malaspina: Mesh boat...doesn't sound entirely sea worthy.
* [15:30] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:30] Homeless: I'm also a boatless resident
* [15:30] Coyot Linden: haha
* [15:30] Motor LoonMotor Loon points impatiently to the agenda while jumping up and down trying to hold his breath...
* [15:30] Oskar Linden: hah
* [15:30] Oskar Linden shouts: I'm CAPTAIN
* [15:31] Oskar Linden: no one wants on the boat huh?
* [15:31] Talia MalaspinaTalia Malaspina eeps.
* [15:31] Motor Loon: well, I didnt put a beer cooler on it yet... probably why
* [15:31] Oskar Linden: anyways
* [15:31] Grid Crash Protection Box: Flip Idlemind, you are no longer protected from the vagaries of the Grid - beware!
* [15:31] ATechwolf Foxclaw: What boat? All I see are some prims.
* [15:32] Motor Loon: shame on you
* [15:32] Oskar Linden: i see a huge boat
* [15:32] Talia Malaspina: We're gonna need a bigger boat.
* [15:32] Rex Cronon: mesh?
* [15:32] Oskar Linden: it is a mesh boat
* [15:32] Oskar Linden: it's a nice one
* [15:32] TankMaster Finesmith: not much of a boat if you fall throat hte consol
* [15:33] Oskar Linden: ther ereally isn't too much to announce this week
* [15:33] Oskar Linden: no new projects on the RC's
* [15:33] Flip Idlemind: Not even the super secret stuff?
* [15:34] Lares Carter: is there a changelog available for the 240something server for magnum?
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: next week
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: maybe
* [15:34] Flip Idlemind: You know if there's nothing else to talk about, you automatically have to reveal secret projects
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: :-)
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: hmm
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: ok
* [15:34] Latif Khalifa: promote LeTigre next week :D That inv-folder-as-system-folder is really bugging me ;)
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: we've got this new ********** project
* [15:34] Motor Loon: sounds secret °͜°
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: it will take your ******** and ******** the ******** when you ********
* [15:35] Motor LoonMotor Loon starts up the enigma decoder
* [15:35] Maestro Linden: actually, there is 1 thing that isn't secret in that secret project
* [15:35] Oskar Linden: it's amazing to see a ********** really ************ and **********
* [15:35] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:35] Maestro Linden: llGenerateKey(), which generates a random UUID
* [15:35] Coyot Linden: Damn. I totally read that as llGenerateKelly()
* [15:35] Latif Khalifa: lol
* [15:36] Motor Loon: either very usefull
* [15:36] Motor LoonMotor Loon grins
* [15:36] Talia Malaspina: Only if Kelly knows how to clean my bathroom.
* [15:36] Latif Khalifa: llCloneLinden(string firstName) :P
* [15:36] Oskar Linden: what params would it take?
* [15:36] Oskar Linden: it would have a sleep time of 8 hours though
* [15:36] Oskar Linden: hah
* [15:36] Latif Khalifa: lol
* [15:36] Talia MalaspinaTalia Malaspina eeps.
* [15:37] TankMaster Finesmith: only 8?
* [15:37] Flip Idlemind: Oh speaking of first names, what about getting someone's key by their name, like llRequestAgentKey() or something
* [15:37] Flip Idlemind: Im sure Im not the first person to propose it, but I was just reminded of it
* [15:37] Talia Malaspina: Yes, please, that would be very handy sometimes.
* [15:37] Oskar Linden: llRequestAgentKey(key)
* [15:37] Motor Loon: haha
* [15:38] Oskar Linden: that could work
* [15:38] Motor Loon: sounds tricky to implement °͜°
* [15:38] Oskar Linden: alright. well as far as the agenda goes I am out of updates
* [15:38] Talia Malaspina: There are third-party web sites that provide the service now, but their data is incomplete, and using them depends on THEIR continued existance.
* [15:38] Oskar Linden: if you want to hound coyot or maestro with questions feel free
* [15:38] Motor Loon: oh oh oh
* [15:38] Motor Loon: mesh pivots?
* [15:38] Motor Loon: no?
* [15:38] Motor Loon: yes?
* [15:38] Motor Loon: no?
* [15:39] Maestro Linden: maybe later?
* [15:39] TankMaster Finesmith: maybe
* [15:39] Motor Loon: sighs
* [15:39] Motor Loon: aww
* [15:39] TankMaster Finesmith: perhaps
* [15:39] TankMaster Finesmith: if they fell like it
* [15:39] Motor Loon: I think yes
* [15:39] TankMaster Finesmith: and have time
* [15:39] Motor Loon: yes is good
* [15:39] TankMaster Finesmith: :D
* [15:39] Flip Idlemind: As long as it's picky about requiring your full name I don't see it being much harder than llRequestAgentData(their_key, DATA_NAME)
* [15:39] Coyot Linden: time is finite, work is not
* [15:39] Motor Loon: I'll trade with sparkleponys
* [15:39] Flip Idlemind: But I may not see everything
* [15:39] Oskar Linden: next week I'll be wearing my pony avatar
* [15:40] Coyot Linden: pwny
* [15:40] Motor Loon: I'll bring carrots and promose to pet you then
* [15:40] Flip Idlemind: Viewer 2
* [15:40] Motor Loon: ...in a very manly almost non sexual way ofcourse
* [15:40] Rex Cronon: we already have a page with our key. u could make a nother page with our name, and have one point to the other:)
* [15:40] Oskar Linden: thanks motor
* [15:40] Motor Loon: yw
* [15:41] Flip Idlemind: Who loves how my whole av is Viewer 2-colored
* [15:41] Motor Loon: "So, we got mesh - do you Linden have a sense of how it's being used yet, or too early for that still? Are you happy with it?"
* [15:41] Oskar Linden: it's a little too early
* [15:41] Oskar Linden: but I have seen some good uses
* [15:41] TankMaster Finesmith: v2 has colors? i thought it was just shades of gray :P
* [15:41] Coyot Linden: Rubber ducks
* [15:41] Motor Loon: haven't seen SUPER many products on marketplace yet
* [15:41] Motor Loon: but lots of viewer still dont support it ofcourse
* [15:42] Motor Loon: viewers
* [15:42] Flip Idlemind: I picked up the freebie Mesh Kitty av from the MOTD and I ♥ it...only problem is most people can't see me correctly in it T_T
* [15:42] TankMaster Finesmith: Firestorm is mesh capable now, that should help some
* [15:42] Flip Idlemind: Firestorm
* [15:42] Maestro Linden: I got a mesh suit
* [15:42] Flip Idlemind: Now I'm Firestorm-colored :D
* [15:42] Maestro Linden: which looks a lot better than the suit i'm wearing now
* [15:42] Motor Loon: Firestorm does now... just not uploads yet
* [15:43] Flip Idlemind: Blame the Havok corporation for that
* [15:43] Talia Malaspina: Is the FS upload shortcomming a technical or legal issue?
* [15:43] Opensource Obscure: wrt mesh-capable viewers , Kirstens is no more. project freezed-closed for now.
* [15:43] Motor Loon: Kirstens support it all... just saw today its being discontinued though ;-(
* [15:43] Oskar Linden: this is a nice boat motor
* [15:43] TankMaster Finesmith: licencing issue
* [15:43] Talia Malaspina: ok
* [15:43] Motor Loon: Thank you Oskar
* [15:43] TankMaster Finesmith: the lib LL uses is closed sorce
* [15:43] TankMaster Finesmith: theres work being done on an open source version, but its not ready yet
* [15:44] Talia Malaspina: NIfty. Thank you.
* [15:44] TankMaster Finesmith: kirstian's is using the leaked LL lib
* [15:44] Motor Loon: I had really been whining ALOT about mesh and espicially the PE accounting... but now... after playing with it on a big project for a weeks time... I kinda have changed my views on it
* [15:44] TankMaster Finesmith: thats why his can upload
* [15:44] Flip Idlemind: I'm, like...thinking more clearly than usual right now...we should have all the meetings on a boat
* [15:44] Oskar Linden: why is that motor?
* [15:44] Latif Khalifa: You can get v1 ui viewers with mesh too now. Astra/Singularity adn Cool VL Viewer
* [15:44] Motor Loon: why I was whining or why I changed my mind?
* [15:44] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:44] Oskar Linden: yes
* [15:44] Oskar Linden: :-)
* [15:44] Motor Loon: hehe
* [15:44] Flip Idlemind: Singularity
* [15:44] Flip Idlemind: Now I'm Singularity-colored
* [15:44] TankMaster Finesmith: singularity doesn't yet support mesh
* [15:45] Motor Loon: Was whining because it seems everything got to be way high PE compared to doing things with sculpties
* [15:45] posJump: Hello, Avatar!
* [15:45] Avatar: Hello, posJump!
* [15:45] Motor Loon: Changed my mind, because it really IS possible to get it to a decent level even with the new accounting... its all a tradeoff though ofcourse
* [15:45] Latif Khalifa: PE will be the reason mesh ins't used much for rezzed objects
* [15:45] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:46] Motor Loon: There are minus's and plus's
* [15:46] Flip Idlemind: Kurt30 Tester sure likes to make an entrance...over and over <.<
* [15:46] Motor Loon: I took this whole boat... scaled it way down... ended up with a 7 PE object or so... totally amazing
* [15:46] Oskar Linden: he's indecisive
* [15:46] Latif Khalifa: Motor 1:1 scale to PE ratio simpkly kills mesh
* [15:46] Maestro Linden: there are some pretty good looking mesh vehicles out there, which aren't all that high in PE
* [15:46] TankMaster Finesmith: probbaly on v3 with a nvidia card and crashing :P
* [15:46] Latif Khalifa: for anything that is bigger than a chair
* [15:46] Motor Loon: the LODs is really the killer
* [15:46] Flip Idlemind: Hah, "crashing"? What's that?
* [15:46] Motor Loon: for high PE's
* [15:46] posJump 0: Hello, Avatar!
* [15:46] Avatar: Hello, posJump 0!
* [15:47] Motor Loon: You want good LOD, you pay the price
* [15:47] Motor Loon: Problem with that
* [15:47] Motor Loon: is
* [15:47] Latif Khalifa: you don't pay the price. you go back to prims and sculpts, and mesh doesn't get used
* [15:47] Motor Loon: creators might start to not care about people with lowend systems
* [15:47] Motor Loon: Had those thoughts myself
* [15:48] Oskar Linden: yeah you get that already
* [15:48] Oskar Linden: it's a hard balance though
* [15:48] Motor Loon: yep
* [15:48] TankMaster Finesmith: nice jeep, maestro
* [15:48] Motor Loon: Been going back and forth at lot to figure out what kind of min. system my products should require
* [15:49] Motor Loon: because supporting 1990 hardware with mesh objects... does make them too high PE
* [15:49] Flip Idlemind: Idk if anyone's aware but I make puzzle cubes...big ones
* [15:49] Oskar Linden: orly?
* [15:49] Flip Idlemind: However I'm limited to how big because of how many prims you can link
* [15:49] Latif Khalifa: one really sad thing about PE is that it encourages inefficient content and physics
* [15:49] Flip Idlemind: I was really hoping I could, somehow, make a mesh-cube with .5 PE
* [15:49] Flip Idlemind: Which I did, BUT
* [15:49] Motor Loon: it could go pretty damn big though eh?
* [15:49] Flip Idlemind: If it's scripted
* [15:50] Flip Idlemind: Apparently the minimum PE is the actual number of prims
* [15:50] Flip Idlemind: Made me sad
* [15:50] Flip Idlemind: Oh well
* [15:50] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:50] Flip Idlemind: scramble
* [15:50] Motor Loon: neat
* [15:50] Flip Idlemind: Biggest I have is 7x7x7
* [15:50] Latif KhalifaLatif Khalifa blames falkon for "brilliant" idea of linking PE and scale 1:1
* [15:50] Flip Idlemind: Beyond that it's too many prims to link
* [15:50] Motor Loon: that sounds odd though... 7x7x7.... with 64m linking rules?
* [15:51] Latif Khalifa: i would like to know which other linden came up with equally brilliant "streaming cost" for prims. i bet it's runtai
* [15:51] Latif Khalifa: those tw really need adult supervision ;)
* [15:51] Opensource Obscure: (( not related but .. I can reproduce SVC-5271 here - those interested may try on Agni and comment))
* [15:51] Flip Idlemind: 7x7x7 cube is 219 prims :O
* [15:51] Oskar Linden: ok latif I get the idea
* [15:51] Motor Loon: aah you also have more cubes then
* [15:52] Latif Khalifa: oskar, i know, but with head-in-sand mode it might be difficult to hear, so repeating is needed :P
* [15:52] Oskar Linden: we've got 98 more minutes. anything else you guys want to discuss
* [15:52] Motor Loon: I thought you just meant making the same one bigger °͜°
* [15:52] Oskar Linden: oops
* [15:52] Oskar Linden: 8
* [15:52] Oskar Linden: hah
* [15:52] Oskar Linden: not 98
* [15:52] TankMaster Finesmith: lol
* [15:52] Lares Carter: are there any problems with Magnum you know about, Oskar?
* [15:53] Oskar Linden: not that I know of
* [15:53] Oskar Linden: why?
* [15:53] Motor Loon: Is it totally out of the question that PE accounting will be made less tough down the road?
* [15:53] Talia Malaspina: Was this a scheduled meeting? I happened in here by chance.
* [15:53] Lares Carter: SkyBeam, which is on Magnum was behaving really weird, failing TPs from there and neighbouring regions not showing up.
* [15:53] Flip Idlemind: Thursdays at 3pm SLT
* [15:53] Talia Malaspina: Thank you! :)
* [15:54] Maestro Linden: hm those sound like they might be netowrk issues..
* [15:54] Oskar Linden: thanks for stopping by talia
* [15:54] Flip Idlemind: So, I mentioned this last week, and admittedly it fits the "nice to have" priority, but out of curiosity can anyone think of a reason why this wouldn't be a good idea:
* [15:54] Flip Idlemind: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-7244
* [15:54] Talia Malaspina: Thanks for letting me listen in. :)
* [15:54] Oskar Linden: sure
* [15:54] Motor Loon: That would be nice Flip
* [15:55] Oskar Linden: you're welcome anytime
* [15:55] Flip Idlemind: I want it, selfishly, for my restart countdown thingy that I put in my viewer
* [15:55] TankMaster Finesmith: would it be possible to block entry to a region with say less than a minuet to restart?
* [15:55] Flip Idlemind: But I think it would benefit others too
* [15:55] TankMaster Finesmith: aside from estate owners
* [15:55] Motor Loon: Actually now that you've heard the secret password Talia, you are a member of the club and must attend every time °͜°
* [15:55] Latif Khalifa: region should just disable teleport in in the last 30 seconds anyway :P
* [15:55] Talia MalaspinaTalia Malaspina eeps.
* [15:55] Motor Loon: hehe
* [15:56] Talia Malaspina: Then I want to know the secret handshake too! heehe
* [15:56] Oskar Linden: disabling tp out too?
* [15:56] Oskar Linden: :-)
* [15:56] TankMaster Finesmith: hehe
* [15:56] Motor Loon: Thats not until the 3rd visit Talia
* [15:56] Latif Khalifa: Oskar, perhaps tp out with a small payment :P
* [15:56] TankMaster Finesmith: no, just TP them to the corn field
* [15:56] Talia Malaspina: heehe!
* [15:56] Talia Malaspina: ok
* [15:56] Oskar Linden: monetize restarts!
* [15:56] Oskar Linden: latif is thinking like a linden
* [15:56] Motor Loon: haha
* [15:56] Motor Loon: not bad at all
* [15:56] Flip Idlemind: Viewer 2
* [15:56] TankMaster Finesmith: premium only users can TP out :D
* [15:56] Homeless: eject everyone to an infohub when 5 sec left
* [15:56] Latif Khalifa: monetizing is good.
* [15:56] Motor Loon: whole new kind of "camping"
* [15:57] Rex Cronon: u lindens must be contagious:)
* [15:57] Latif Khalifa: PE isn't monetizing, is just silly
* [15:57] Motor Loon: well, we adapt... we always do
* [15:57] Fancy Greeter: Kurt30 Tester has arrived!
* [15:57] Motor Loon: might cry a little first though
* [15:57] Motor Loon: ;-)=
* [15:58] Talia Malaspina: Is there an official "How to make mesh outfits/avatars" tutorial, or do we need to just skim the web for the generosity of smart users?
* [15:58] Latif Khalifa: But I really want to switch big linksents to new physics. No need to collide 30 prims, 3 would do fine. But then my PE doubles, and if you can make any sense of that you're much smarter than me
* [15:59] Latif Khalifa: you reduce the sim load, make content more efficient, and get penalized
* [15:59] Oskar Linden: alright everyone. thanks for coming out today
* [15:59] Talia Malaspina: Thank you! :)
* [15:59] Opensource Obscure: bye everybody
* [15:59] Motor Loon: yeah, if you link regular prims & sculpties with mesh you do
* [15:59] Oskar Linden: I hope to have a guest linden next week
* [15:59] Rex Cronon: tc oskar
* [15:59] TankMaster Finesmith: thx for coming, oskar, maesreo, cuote
* [15:59] Coyot Linden: yw
* [15:59] Rex Cronon: tc everybody
* [15:59] Motor Loon: okies... back to work
* [15:59] Motor Loon: tc all
* [15:59] Maestro Linden: thanks for coming!
* [15:59] Latif Khalifa: have fun peeps
* [15:59] Motor Loon: groooouphuuug
* [15:59] Lares Carter: thanks for the meeting
* [15:59] Rex Cronon: have a nice day all
* [15:59] Oskar Linden: have a good weekend and I'll see ya around
* [15:59] Coyot Linden: You know, Guest would be an ossm linden name
* [15:59] TankMaster Finesmith: coyot*
* [16:00] Flip Idlemind: Oh, I do have a last minute question. I'm in a certain group and, anytime I send a notice, I get spammed with messages that say "Unable to IM across parent estates"
* [16:00] Talia Malaspina: Bring enough guest lindens for the entire class!
* [16:00] Latif Khalifa: and promote Le Tigre the next week :D
* [16:00] Flip Idlemind: Any idea why? (Unless you're all on your way out)
* [16:00] Motor Loon: hold ya breath... derezzing the boat - dont like to litter °͜°
* [16:00] Talia MalaspinaTalia Malaspina holds breath
* [16:00] Talia MalaspinaTalia Malaspina eeps.
* [16:00] Maestro Linden: Hm, there's probably a group member who's limited to a private estate..
* [16:00] Talia Malaspina: Noooo!
* [16:00] Talia Malaspina: OoOo BAx boots are waterproof??
* [16:00] [aR] Mesh Expedition Station Wagon (Safari) v1.0.7: You aren't the owner.
* [16:00] Maestro Linden: which normally can't happen, because they wouldn't be able to join the group then
* [16:01] Flip Idlemind: Sounds like a reasonable theory
* [16:01] Flip Idlemind: What I think is, people joined it before the whole merge thing
* [16:01] Oskar Linden: *waves*
* [16:01] TankMaster Finesmith: c-ya oskar