Bug triage/2010-03-01/Transcript

* [12:03] Davy Linden: Today's agenda: 
* [12:03] Alexa Linden: waves at Drub & Fisher
* [12:03] Eddi Decosta: hug alexa 
* [12:04] Davy Linden: First up ....
* [12:04] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-5409 - Unix time epoch and llGetUnixTime() is inconsistent between sims. 
* [12:04] Morgaine Dinova: Xugu, stop fidgetting, your lap being on fire is no excuse :P
* [12:04] Fisher Linden: Hey Alexa!
* [12:04] Davy Linden: ok - we had this last week, asked if it's still happening
* [12:04] Drub Linden: wave to Alexa
* [12:04] NeoBokrug Elytis: 5409: I think it may still be happening, it's hard to pin down, and hard to track.
* [12:04] Alexa Linden: Hey Neo :)
* [12:04] NeoBokrug Elytis: Hiya. :)
* [12:05] Alexa Linden: Neo, let me talk to our internal team and talk with you on this
* [12:05] Alexa Linden: and I'll import too
* [12:05] Davy Linden: ok
* [12:05] NeoBokrug Elytis: Awesome, thanks.
* [12:05] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-5428 - High Packet loss, Rubberbanding, Script runtime stops, various other issues since 1.36.2 emergency release. 
* [12:06] Alexa Linden: seems to be resolved
* [12:06] Alexa Linden: Yeah seems it was a short kiccup reoccoured, classify the issue again as resolved. Sorry for the trouble.
* [12:06] Davy Linden: resolve the issue, and ask for it to be reopened if it reoccurs?
* [12:07] Alexa Linden: yup
* [12:07] Davy Linden: ok
* [12:07] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-17467 - Content being copy/mod, yet people unable to mod. 
* [12:08] Alexa Linden: listens to the crickets......
* [12:08] Drone V1.3: Don't touch me noob !
* [12:08] Alexa Linden: pours everyone some coffee :)
* [12:08] Omegadon Aeon: Man I havent had coffe in rl in awhile agin.
* [12:09] Alexa Linden: lol
* [12:09] Bronson Blackadder: how the hell did you know was reaching for my cup/
* [12:09] Xugu Madison: thanks Alexa!
* [12:09] Davy Linden: ANyone have any ideas about this one?
* [12:09] Davy Linden: I'm finding it difficult to follow
* [12:10] Techwolf Lupindo: I think it two issues here. One is user error with the slam bit. Second is network troubles. I've enounderd nomod when it should have been mod and relogging fixed it.
* [12:11] Alexa Linden: ya this is a bit confusing
* [12:11] Drone V1.3: Don't touch me noob !
* [12:11] Alexa Linden: I'll make this needs more info
* [12:12] Alexa Linden: ask for respros and what they observe after each step
* [12:12] Opensource Obscure: loves soft landings.
* [12:12] Skills Hak: ouch :x
* [12:12] Omegadon Aeon: hard landing
* [12:12] Alexa Linden: Hey Skills :)
* [12:12] Skills Hak: hi hi :)
* [12:13] Alexa Linden: next one Davy?
* [12:13] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-5445 - Mono script in Stopped state loses its Mono compiled result (and mono checkbox) after sim restart ! 
* [12:13] Morgaine Dinova: If relogging fixes something, there's a clear bug. And the relogging is certainly not the fix.
* [12:13] Alexa Linden: agreed
* [12:14] Alexa Linden: so harleen couldn't repro
* [12:15] Alexa Linden: and the OP says it's not a constant....
* [12:16] Jonathan Yap: It would be interesting to see if the problem has to do with being on the same or different server after the restart
* [12:16] Alexa Linden: ya, I would like to see a bit more feedback... that's a good question
* [12:17] Drone V1.3: User granted !
* [12:17] Drone V1.3: All Systems are online !
* [12:17] Alexa Linden: I'm going to NMI this and try to ger a solid repro
* [12:17] Davy Linden: ok
* [12:17] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-17034 - HTTP Scripts are not responding 
* [12:17] Morgaine Dinova: Pity that there is no way to select an object and query whether it is in full viewer-sim sync. That would help in getting repros.
* [12:17] Xugu Madison: Full viewer-sim sync?
* [12:18] Morgaine Dinova: All state seen from viewer is the state known to sim.
* [12:18] Davy Linden: I can't repro this... http_response just worked fine.
* [12:18] Davy Linden: Ask for an example script?
* [12:18] Alexa Linden: will do
* [12:19] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-5440 - On logging into Second Life, I recieve an error msg. (Unable to connect to simulator). I am sent to another region due to another msg I recieve (region is not available). This happens whether I am logging back in at last location or at Home Location. 
* [12:19] Tillie Ariantho: Lately connecting to regions is very slow!
* [12:20] Jonathan Yap: Tillie, is it mainland regions, Linden HOmes regions, or all types?
* [12:20] Alexa Linden: we seemed to get quite a few bug reports of this problem last week
* [12:20] Omegadon Aeon: Everyone keeps teling me Linden Homes are lagging bad, they havnet been bad for me though.
* [12:20] Alexa Linden: it was all types Jonathan
* [12:20] Boroondas Gupte: related to https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/technology/blog/2010/03/01/grid-stability-update ?
* [12:20] Alexa Linden: ya, me neither omegadon
* [12:20] Tillie Ariantho: Jonathan: private sims, my own, or elsewhere where I logged out or crashed.
* [12:21] Techwolf Lupindo: Whenever I crash or network connection is killed, I allways log back into the _previous_ location, not last location.
* [12:21] Alexa Linden: yes that may have been part of it Boroondas
* [12:21] Alexa Linden: I will go ahead and follow the rest of the related bugs and ask all the OPs if they are still having the problem
* [12:21] Alexa Linden: so I'll take this one
* [12:22] Davy Linden: techwolf, if you crash/disconnect, how would your last location get stored?
* [12:22] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-12014 - Some Mac keyboard shortcuts are essentially wrong 
* [12:23] Boroondas Gupte: Davy, is last location saved client side?
* [12:23] Davy Linden: I don't think so
* [12:23] Alexa Linden: I like "essentially"
* [12:23] Alexa Linden: this is a year old....
* [12:23] Dedric Mauriac: saved on server, but only when you issue a logout command
* [12:23] Techwolf Lupindo: I used to be that I relogged back into where the system logged me out after a crash/network. But now it seems to log me out to the previous location.
* [12:23] Davy Linden: I think (at least) some of these are fixed in 2.0
* [12:24] Alexa Linden: still a problem and ask them to test on V2?
* [12:25] Alexa Linden: and a quick note on Viewer 2 and triages.....
* [12:25] Davy Linden: but (for example) Ctrl-M will open map on mac, on 1.23. It's only the menu that's showing Cmd-M that's wrong - so I don't think it should be Major
* [12:25] Tillie Ariantho: btw. I got lots of "WARNING: LLInventoryPanel::buildNewViews: LLInventoryPanel::buildNewViews called with objectp->mType == -1 (shouldn't happen)" on login, is that bad? ,) "shouldn't happen" sounds evil. ^^
* [12:25] Alexa Linden: in the next couple of weeks, we will be starting up our Wednesday RC/BETA triages again
* [12:25] Boroondas Gupte: we need reconfigurable shortcuts, really. No combination will ever be free of collisions AND work on all local keyboards
* [12:25] Morgaine Dinova: Does nyone know whether 2.0 does a periodic save of where you are, for crash purposes?
* [12:25] Alexa Linden: this is where we will be triaging all the Viewer 2 bugs
* [12:25] Davy Linden: can you log that please, Tillie (I have no idea how bad it might be - but someone will know)
* [12:26] Tillie Ariantho: log to where?
* [12:26] Morgaine Dinova: Boroondas++
* [12:26] Alexa Linden: please look for an update on the bug wiki page and I will anncounce in this meeting the Monday before they begin :)
* [12:26] Davy Linden: VWR project
* [12:26] Alexa Linden: so on 12014, downgrade from major
* [12:27] Alexa Linden: and ask for them to test on viewer 2?
* [12:27] Davy Linden: + last triaged
* [12:27] Alexa Linden: yup
* [12:27] Alexa Linden: will do
* [12:27] Davy Linden: ok
* [12:27] Aimee Linden: its the same on 2.0
* [12:27] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-12870 - Logging out of linux Viewer hangs computer 
* [12:28] Aimee Linden: oh
* [12:28] Davy Linden: some got fixed?
* [12:28] Aimee Linden: having said that, I think the menus in 2.0 now say ^M for the map etc.
* [12:28] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: This issue was OpenAL in 1.23 not being compatible with PulseAudio.
* [12:29] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Snowglobe 1.3 and viewer 2.0 have OpenAL Soft 1.10/1.11 which fixes it.
* [12:29] Aimee Linden: brain went home from work before my mouth/fingers clearly
* [12:29] Morgaine Dinova: I only use Linux, and I've seen many crashes stop dead in the crash logger. I wonder if it's that. In fact, it's rather rare for the client to exit cleanly even on a logout.
* [12:30] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: Well, I've got voice set to PulseAudio in preferences and PulseAudio's volume control shows it in the applications list - no CPU usage by the process or PulseAudio now.
* [12:30] Boroondas Gupte: Morgaine, that's asnother issue, I think. I don't have pulse audio but also see crashes on logout.
* [12:31] Alexa Linden: suggestions on this one?
* [12:31] Boroondas Gupte: fix pending, I guess
* [12:31] Morgaine Dinova: Yeah, Bor. Hang computer is obviously of a different order. But you really can't crash Linux these days. You can only hang up X11.
* [12:32] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-3005 - Can not sit on unscripted prims inside the bounding box of a phantom prim. 
* [12:32] Sahkolihaa Contepomi: has never crashed X or hung it.
* [12:32] Morgaine Dinova: Sahk: try harder ^_^
* [12:32] Boroondas Gupte: then you have good drivers instead of fast ones, or something :-P
* [12:33] NeoBokrug Elytis: 3005: Idea > Might be the client-raytrace clicking.. thing?
* [12:33] Morgaine Dinova: I play around with GL code occasionally, and crashing X11 isn't particularly rare. Which is why I don't use my main workstation as target when testing graphics.
* [12:34] Boroondas Gupte: sitting on objects without sit target has been wonky since quite a while. This looks more specific, though.
* [12:34] Alexa Linden: yes on both
* [12:35] Fisher Linden: Didn't hang for me
* [12:35] Drub Linden: Nor for me
* [12:36] Tillie Ariantho: Sit on a prim should always place you onto the prim how big / weird shape it ever is.
* [12:36] Davy Linden: this looks very similar to SVC-3945
* [12:36] JIRA-helper: http//jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-3945: 
* [#SVC-3945] to sit: on surfaces which previously were sittable
* [12:36] Davy Linden: which is already imported
* [12:36] Morgaine Dinova: Sculpties excepted, apparently. I often sit embedded in Nyx's couch. It's random.
* [12:37] Alexa Linden: so tie together as a dup?
* [12:38] Davy Linden: I think it's the same issue
* [12:38] Alexa Linden: ok
* [12:38] Boroondas Gupte: one mentions sculpties the other phantom prims ... not quite the same but might be the same cause
* [12:38] Alexa Linden: I'll take care of it
* [12:38] Davy Linden: ok
* [12:38] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-3935 - llKey2Name returns text "(Loading...)" instead of empty string or avatar name 
* [12:38] Davy Linden: ouch
* [12:38] Morgaine Dinova: lol, oh dead
* [12:38] Morgaine Dinova: dear*
* [12:39] NeoBokrug Elytis: That's usually when a sim or avatar is still loading, like a teleport in or log in.
* [12:39] Xugu Madison: Sounds like someone took a shortcut for a display somewhere...
* [12:39] Alexa Linden: :)
* [12:39] Morgaine Dinova: The issue isn't when it happens. The issue is that the error message is going to the wrong file descriptor.
* [12:40] Boroondas Gupte: ?
* [12:40] NeoBokrug Elytis: True. :)
* [12:41] Alexa Linden: I'll import this one
* [12:41] Davy Linden: I think this should be imported
* [12:41] Alexa Linden: chat lag
* [12:41] Davy Linden: lol chat lag
* [12:41] Xugu Madison: For llKey2Name() it should definitely be either empty (which is a clear "I don't know" return, if I remember the spec) or a name. HTTP headers is a more complex case
* [12:41] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-12103 - "Stop all animations" does not stop animations with joint offsets (aka "deformers") 
* [12:42] NeoBokrug Elytis: I'd also add tht I think the http headers sent out to a server sometimes return (loading...) on names and keys, so it's quite possibly related.
* [12:42] Davy Linden: agreed, neo
* [12:42] Morgaine Dinova: Indeed
* [12:42] Alexa Linden: thanks Neo.. I'll add that
* [12:43] Alexa Linden: 12103 is an interesting agruement
* [12:43] Davy Linden: I think 2.0 Stop all animations fixes this - whi ch is great for people stuck in animations, maybe not so great for dragons
* [12:43] Alexa Linden: I've never assumed that stop all animations would unfold me from a crunched avatar shape
* [12:43] Morgaine Dinova: There's no resolution short of subclassing animations really.
* [12:44] Davy Linden: testing...
* [12:44] Boroondas Gupte: two seperate options like Chalice proposes sounds reasonable
* [12:44] Alexa Linden: oh hai!
* [12:44] Alexa Linden: I grew legs
* [12:44] Morgaine Dinova: Alex: :-( The woes of tinies
* [12:44] Davy Linden: yeah - 2.0 really puts you back to "normal"
* [12:44] Xugu Madison: Crunched avatars should be mostly dealt with using the alpha channel, now...
* [12:45] Xugu Madison: I think it's only quadrupeds that are really going to have issues
* [12:45] Davy Linden: resolved / fixed in 2.0?
* [12:45] Alexa Linden: will do
* [12:45] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1416 - Renaming a new inventory item while filtering item names renames parent folder instead. 
* [12:45] Liisa Runo: note that joit offset is not the same thing that folded body parts that tinies use
* [12:46] Alexa Linden: true Liisa :)
* [12:46] Opensource Obscure: tinies will stop using folded bodies tho. correct?
* [12:46] Alexa Linden: that's a good question
* [12:47] Alexa Linden: but then your title may not line up with your avatar size?
* [12:47] Tillie Ariantho: I got that one too. You create 'new folder', but its not really a hit of the filter, so on editing the client renames the parent instead...
* [12:47] ZenMondo Wormser: well they will still probably be folded so the attachments move right.
* [12:47] Morgaine Dinova: Tinie deformations are a bug stemming from the lack of an up/down scalable implementation of size in SL avs. We've hammered this out with Nyx. A proper solution would require a second avatar system to be designed, in parallel with the current one, because changing the scaling range would break current wearable content.
* [12:48] Boroondas Gupte: A funny solution would be 
* [12:48] [[User:JIRA-helper: [#VWR-15471|JIRA-helper: [#VWR-15471]]: 
* [12:48] Alexa Linden: hahahaha
* [12:49] Alexa Linden: so Boroondas, you reopened this issue
* [12:49] Alexa Linden: do you still see this happening?
* [12:49] Xugu Madison: This reads a little like someone went crazy and started typing... (not in a strong position to criticise I'm aware)
* [12:49] Boroondas Gupte: would have to try, that was some time ago
* [12:49] Eddi Decosta: loll
* [12:50] Alexa Linden: shall I mark as NMI and wait for your findings?
* [12:50] Tillie Ariantho: renaming folder with filter on? bugged in snowglobe still. no idea about client 2.0
* [12:50] Alexa Linden: thanks Tillie, can you add your updated comment?
* [12:50] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-16338 - rendervolumeLODfactor default setting of 1.125 is too low 
* [12:50] Tillie Ariantho: ok
* [12:50] Alexa Linden: thanks :)
* [12:51] Davy Linden: I agree 1.125 is too low - but is it still the default?
* [12:51] Davy Linden: looks like 2.0 default is 2.000
* [12:52] Opensource Obscure: not sure about that. don't think so, Davy. It's 1.125 here and I think I didn't touch it. not sure 100% tho
* [12:52] Opensource Obscure: too many reinstalls : )
* [12:52] Alexa Linden: lol
* [12:52] Davy Linden: maybe I changed it - but I don't remember doiung that
* [12:52] Boroondas Gupte: VWR-1416 doesn't repro in Snowglobe 2.0, like described (point 5 doesn't happen). Might be expected behaviour, but not really user-friendly
* [12:52] Alexa Linden: goes to look
* [12:53] Aimee Linden: depends on the Objects slider in graphics settings
* [12:53] Aimee Linden: 2.0 is the highest
* [12:53] Alexa Linden: 1.125 in snowglobe
* [12:53] Alexa Linden: and I know I never touched it
* [12:53] Opensource Obscure: oh, ok. I have objects at Medium (default in my case)
* [12:53] Davy Linden: acj - "reset to default" changes it to 1.0
* [12:53] Alexa Linden: default says it's 1.0
* [12:54] Alexa Linden: jinx
* [12:54] Davy Linden: import?
* [12:54] Alexa Linden: ya
* [12:54] Davy Linden: ok
* [12:54] Bug Triage: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-3198 - Windlight footshadows look strange sometimes 
* [12:54] Opensource Obscure: what's the point of having a global default if the value is automatically changed accordingly to Objects settings?
* [12:54] Alexa Linden: Boroondas, open mic... don't swear :p
* [12:55] Techwolf Lupindo: I check the setting files, it defaulted to 1.125 for all four settings, that sould be 1, 2, 3, 4 for low, Mid, Hight and Ultra.
* [12:55] Boroondas Gupte: hmm VWR-1416 *does* repro when I create a script instead of a note
* [12:55] Opensource Obscure: Bug Triage object, you're too fast for me.
* [12:55] Boroondas Gupte: what? my mic should be off and I haven't said anything IRL.
* [12:55] Opensource Obscure: I'm not sure my question was clear. ...I agree w/ what Tech said, basically.
* [12:55] Omegadon Aeon: it came on a few times, just you typing
* [12:55] Alexa Linden: in viewer 2
* [12:55] Alexa Linden: if you hit the mouse button
* [12:56] Alexa Linden: you turn voice on
* [12:56] Tillie Ariantho: I always disable footshadows. Where I have a request: please make the toggle on/off persistant. ^^
* [12:56] Alexa Linden: you can change that in permissions
* [12:56] Davy Linden: s/permissions/preferences
* [12:56] Alexa Linden: I discovered this weekend while exploring and on a call :\
* [12:56] Opensource Obscure: I hope you mean "middle-mouse button" Alexa?
* [12:56] Alexa Linden: I hang my head in shame
* [12:56] Alexa Linden: yes... sorry OS :p
* [12:57] Boroondas Gupte: hmm ... I had set that to push-to-talk ...
* [12:57] Boroondas Gupte: looks like my settings didn't survive
* [12:57] Alexa Linden: 3 minutes left... and still on 3198
* [12:57] Tillie Ariantho: Its really hard that so many settings are not persisted to config file. I always have to change windlight setting (i know there is a hack torley wrote about), switch off particles, switch off footshadows...
* [12:58] Boroondas Gupte: ok, back to PTT, thanks for pointing out
* [12:58] Tillie Ariantho: Alexa: YOU got that tight timeframe, WE could sit here for some more minutes. :P
* [12:58] Davy Linden: i have a meeting at 1 :(
* [12:58] Alexa Linden: lol I stand corrected Till ie ;)
* [12:58] Xugu Madison: Davy, claim your clock is set with the same code PS3s use, and you got stuck in 1999? Eh, sounded good in my head anyway...
* [12:59] Alexa Linden: I have never seen 3198 before
* [12:59] Morgaine Dinova: "Value not persisting" is so common across a plethora of things. I'm surprised it has to be treated on a case-by-case basis.
* [12:59] Alexa Linden: have any of you?
* [12:59] Tillie Ariantho: And I dont like the footshadows, they often vanish half in the ground etc.
* [12:59] Davy Linden: well, my closk says 9pm ;P
* [12:59] Davy Linden: clock*
* [12:59] Alexa Linden: I will ask for more inf on this one
* [12:59] Davy Linden: so I guess that means I'm alreadu 8 hors late
* [12:59] Davy Linden: and can't type today
* [12:59] Alexa Linden: Thank you all for joining us today
* [13:00] Alexa Linden: I'll be importing these and updating the triage :)
* [13:00] Opensource Obscure: ^^
* [13:00] Xugu Madison: Thanks for hosting Lindens!
* [13:00] Techwolf Lupindo: Due to complaints, all shops now hand out a notecard explaing how to increace the LOD factor. this happen when it was changed to 1.125 somewhere along the 1.23.x sercies.
* [13:00] Davy Linden: thanks all
* [13:00] Tillie Ariantho: Alexa: not seen them like THIS. I would more say this is a fake... but you never know with the client. ^^
* [13:00] Eddi Decosta: welcome Alexa, i do a sequance of test with the windlight 2
* [13:00] Xugu Madison: On a mostly unrelated note, anyone know when 1.38 is meant to hit beta grid?
* [13:00] Alexa Linden: I will ask for others to respond if they have seen this before
* [13:00] Eddi Decosta: im exited about this test 
* [13:00] Davy Linden: I don't know, Xugu - sorry
* [13:01] Jonathan Yap: Xugu, I thought they were on a 6 week release cycle, so in 4 weeks or so?
* [13:01] Opensource Obscure: xugu, andrew or oskar talked about that in recent meetings. it may be in transcripts
* [13:01] Eddi Decosta: well, back with the beta viewer for now
* [13:01] Alexa Linden: Have a great afternoon/evening everyone and thank you again!