User Experience Interest Group/Transcripts/2009-01-29

== Topic & Summary ==
User Experience Interest Group Discussion for January 29, 2009.
Topic: Non-overlapping UI
Morgaine led a discussion about changing the user interface so that it doesn't overlap or obscure the 3D view. Specifically, Morgaine proposed the idea of a frame around all sides of the 3D view, where different parts of the UI could be docked and arranged. This would reduce the number of windows (floaters) that block the view. This concept is similar to the UI paradigm used by Zbrush, for example.
Late in the meeting, the conversation drifted to other topics:
* Movement and camera controls are hard for new users to find if they accidently close them.
* Want to use the mouse for navigation (e.g. right clicking to move your avatar).
* Want customizable keyboard and mouse commands.
* Want an Animation Override, Radar, and other MystiTool functionality built into the viewer.
* Why haven't the Linden's improved the default walk animations?
** The default walk animations are (at least partially) coded into the viewer, and use Inverse Kinematics (IK).
** The current animation system doesn't play well with IK, but it could be made to do that.
** Starsong suggested we discuss the default walk with the Lindens next week.
=== Links ===
* Morgaine's UI Proposal
* Zbrush
* Zbrush screenshot
== Transcript ==
[15:09]	Morgaine Dinova: 	If we have nothing better to discuss, how about radical changes to viewer UI?
[15:09]	Kippie Friedkin: 	lol..that's always a great topic
[15:09]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Sure :D
[15:10]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Did you have anything particular in mind, Morgaine?
[15:11]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I wrote a throwaway post to the forum yesterday, but talking to Sai today makes me wonder if there could actually be something in it: http://imprudenceviewer.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2&p=894#p894
[15:11]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Because Sai replied: "Take a look at Zbrush, because it does just that" --- and he's right, I looked at the Zbrush training video
[15:11]	Roof Doors: 	Geneko Nemeth is at the door.
[15:11]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Very close to my handwaving idea.
[15:12]	Kippie Friedkin is reading the post 	Kippie Friedkin is reading the post
[15:13]	Jacek Antonelli: 	http://www.web3dnews.org/reviews/zbrush1/img3/zbrush-UI.jpg
[15:14]	Jacek Antonelli: 	That sort of UI?
[15:14]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Having things around the sides and top/bottom of the 3D view, instead of overlaid on top?
[15:15]	Kippie Friedkin: 	That would be nice so you aren't constantly moving floaters around to get a peak at the world.
[15:15]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Definitely!
[15:15]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Sort of, but Zbrush's edges expand arbitrarily and in that screenshot they've made them huge by putting entire panels into them. I don't like the idea of whol panels, that's effectively robbing us of 3D real estate too.
[15:15]	Morgaine Dinova: 	If your remove those huge side panels, then Zbrush's UI does approach a thin frame, yes.
[15:16]	Jacek Antonelli looks for a screenshot that demonstrates that 	Jacek Antonelli looks for a screenshot that demonstrates that
[15:16]	Morgaine Dinova: 	As Sai pointed out, the frame should be customizable, one person's "just right" is another person's "too thin, not enough info"
[15:17]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Just looking at the LL viewer bottom line of buttons, they could be each shortened and the media controls placed in the same thin frame.
[15:18]	Kippie Friedkin: 	They could be shortened a bit...I'm wondering how shortening them woudl affect localized viewers though.
[15:18]	Jacek Antonelli: 	I could see things like building tools fitting on the side. But what about stuff like chat or script editing?
[15:19]	Geneko Nemeth: 	Abbreviations could be used or text left at, thereby only icons.
[15:19]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Ah but when you're editing or writing scripts, that's your current activity --- viewing the 3D world isn't :-)
[15:20]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Chat is harder --- dunno
[15:20]	Geneko Nemeth: 	Bubble chat?
[15:20]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Nah, you miss lines if not looking
[15:21]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Maybe fold the chat window and console chat scrolling into one.
[15:21]	Jacek Antonelli: 	I suppose chat could be docked along the bottom or side too.... it'd just have a big impact on the 3D view.
[15:21]	Kippie Friedkin: 	work calls...I'll brb I hope!
[15:22]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Cya Kippie :-)
[15:22]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Aw, bye Kippie!
[15:23]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Or, yeah, something like the chat overlay, but with a scroll bar so it's similar in functionality to the chat history
[15:23]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I think I'd first try adding the chat window along the bottom or top edge, but not overlaid on the 3D view.
[15:24]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Ie. the 3D view shrunk slightly out of the overlap area
[15:24]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Maybe the idea just doesn't work for chat, really don't know.
[15:24]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yeah. I'm just wondering how to balance a usable chat size with a usable 3D area
[15:24]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Aye
[15:25]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Maybe chat should be test-to-speech primarily, hahahaha :-)
[15:25]	Jacek Antonelli: 	hehehe. Hmmmm, there might be some conversations we wouldn't want broadcasted out loud ;)
[15:25]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Hehe
[15:26]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Neighbours might look at you pretty wierd in the morning ...
[15:26]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Maybe there would be some things that need to be overlays, but we could improve the way they're handled. For example, give an easy way to minimize them all, like Windows' "Show Desktop" shortcut
[15:28]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Or use transparency more so that they don't completely obscure the view
[15:28]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Similar to how the scrolling chat has a semi-transparent background, so you can see through it, but stilll get a sense of its boundaries
[15:29]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Or how about this: along the frame you have an auto-updating list of chat participants ... whenever one says something, the name gets lit up and stays lit until that contribution is seen. Quick hotkey displays latest unseen lines.
[15:32]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Mouseover a lit-up name shows you latest line(s) of that participant
[15:33]	Morgaine Dinova: 	The option to display a full window always available of course, because sometimes your main task is chat.
[15:34]	Jacek Antonelli: 	There are other big windows too... Search, Map, Appearance. I suppose some of those can sensibly cover up the main view somewhat, since you're presumably going to be focusing on them anyway.
[15:34]	Morgaine Dinova: 	The goal of the frame idea is to not obscure the 3D view when the main task is the 3D world viewing.
[15:34]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Appearance is easily handled in the frame.
[15:35]	Jacek Antonelli: 	True
[15:35]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Search might be too, but don;t think map is
[15:35]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Web Browser is another large window
[15:35]	Morgaine Dinova: 	A key part of the functionality though would be that anything than appears in a panel can be moved into the frame, because one shoe doesn't fit all.
[15:37]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Any specific control in the Appearances panel out to be moveable out into the frame ... and editing it should not get you into crucified pose :-)
[15:37]	Jacek Antonelli: 	hehehe
[15:38]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yeah, I should be able to make my nose huge whenever I want, without having to stop what I'm doing!
[15:38]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Aye
[15:39]	Jacek Antonelli: 	The snapshot floater is another one that would fit well in a side frame
[15:39]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Anyway, was just an idea. I'm definitely arriving at the conclusion that obscuring the 3D view is wrong though, at any time when the main task is world naviation.
[15:40]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Next topic if you like :-)
[15:40]	Zapper Spizel: 	Whoops, sorry guys
[15:40]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Hiya Star :-)
[15:41]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Hey Star!
[15:41]	Kippie Friedkin: 	whew...back
[15:41]	StarSong Bright: 	hiih
[15:41]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yay, hi again Kippie :)
[15:41]	StarSong Bright: 	totally spaced on day and time
[15:41]	StarSong Bright: 	have i missed all the good bits?
[15:41]	Morgaine Dinova: 	We're just chewing around far-out UI ideas.
[15:42]	Jacek Antonelli: 	We've been talking about Morgaine's idea to move much of the UI into a frame around the main 3D view, so it wouldn't block the view
[15:42]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Not a proposal, just something that popped into the head
[15:42]	StarSong Bright: 	yes!
[15:42]	Morgaine Dinova: 	http://imprudenceviewer.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2&p=894#p894
[15:42]	StarSong Bright: 	i hate that things are flaoting aroudn in the screen
[15:42]	Kippie Friedkin: 	Agreed
[15:43]	StarSong Bright: 	i keep my communicate window open all the time, fairly large becaue i alwyas have half a dozen ims
[15:43]	StarSong Bright: 	all that spce behind is rendered, even though i never see it
[15:43]	Kippie Friedkin: 	Yeah, I think sometimes it's okay to obscure the world...depends what I'm doing.
[15:43]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Speaking of things popping up and blocking your view, here's a far-out UI idea I had...
[15:43]	Kippie Friedkin: 	Sometimes I'll let the communicate window just occupy the whole window.
[15:43]	StarSong Bright: 	i do about 1/3 on average
[15:44]	Jacek Antonelli: 	... when you open up Build mode, an animated cartoon plywood cube should pop up! "Hi, I'm Primmy! I see you're trying to build something! Would you like some help?"
[15:44]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I think it depends on what your main task currently is. Sometimes I completely fill the whole screen with the text window, and the 3D view is irrelevant.
[15:44]	Kippie Friedkin: 	Jacek...LOL
[15:44]	Morgaine Dinova: 	LOL
[15:44]	Jacek Antonelli: 	>:D
[15:45]	StarSong Bright: 	i would like ot have the camera (and maybe movement) controls integrated so i dont have to worry about closing that little box
[15:46]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Or, less funny, the Moral Guardian icon pops up, and says "This was an illegal pixel you added, you have 15 seconds to remove it."
[15:46]	StarSong Bright: 	hhahah omg
[15:46]	Kippie Friedkin: 	ROFL
[15:46]	Jacek Antonelli: 	hah!
[15:46]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Don't laugh .... some people are suggesting that open source may become illegal on day.
[15:46]	StarSong Bright: 	my wishlist is that primmy would ask me what permissions i want set on all the prims i buld with today
[15:46]	Morgaine Dinova: 	one* day
[15:47]	StarSong Bright: 	AND all the scripts inside
[15:47]	StarSong Bright: 	so i could jsut say "primmy make it so everythign is copy no trans" or whatever
[15:47]	Jacek Antonelli: 	hehe, yeah
[15:47]	StarSong Bright: 	and not have to fiddle with every innard of a prim
[15:47]	Kippie Friedkin: 	heh, that's actually kind of a cool
[15:47]	Jacek Antonelli: 	And you should be able to smack Primmy when something goes wrong. *nods*
[15:47]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Just as long as I can say: "/primmy piss off"
[15:47]	Kippie Friedkin: 	lol
[15:48]	StarSong Bright: 	hehehe um, so the question has to be begged, will he have a piss on
[15:48]	StarSong Bright: 	giggles
[15:48]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Hahaha
[15:48]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Oi! >_<
[15:48]	StarSong Bright: 	laughs
[15:49]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Anyway, backtracking a bit... Camera and movement controls are useful for a lot of people. Although power users would balk at having them on screen all the time. So, yeah, it would need to me customizable
[15:49]	StarSong Bright: 	i consider msyelf a power user
[15:49]	StarSong Bright: 	i am also an avid photographer, the keyboard shortcuts wont cut it
[15:49]	StarSong Bright: 	i want the minute controls i get with teh control window
[15:50]	Kisslove Pluvences: 	salut
[15:50]	Kippie Friedkin: 	Agreed..I use the camera controls whenever I'm taking pics
[15:50]	Jacek Antonelli: 	True
[15:50]	Kippie Friedkin: 	And they're useful for new users
[15:50]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Currently we have a one shoe fits all solution, and it's a disaster.
[15:50]	Kippie Friedkin: 	when they can find them
[15:50]	StarSong Bright: 	even if it was possible to hide them on the ui, that would be ok
[15:50]	StarSong Bright: 	so long as the button to get them back never left the ui
[15:51]	StarSong Bright: 	many noobs never realize they are there sinc ethey are hidden in the menus
[15:51]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yeah
[15:52]	StarSong Bright: 	oh i have a tiny wish liste item, move set home to here UNDER teleport home, instead of create lm.. i keep accidentally setting home becuase my mouse is retarded
[15:52]	Kisslove Pluvences: 	morgaine
[15:52]	Kippie Friedkin: 	Darn...sorry for the lack of participation, I've got to run..work beckons
[15:52]	Kisslove Pluvences: 	you petite culot
[15:52]	Kippie Friedkin: 	Cheers all! Good to see you, Jacek!
[15:52]	Morgaine Dinova: 	One of the first things I'll be doing after plugins is providing options to the mouse interface ... for example, being able to disable the current right-click functionality so that I can use the mouse for rapid navitation, like in EQ/AO/GW etc.
[15:52]	StarSong Bright: 	bye morgaine
[15:52]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Take care Kippie! Good to see you :)
[15:52]	Morgaine Dinova: 	See ya Kippie
[15:53]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I'm not going anywhere, that was Kippie
[15:53]	StarSong Bright: 	oh sorry , misread chat
[15:53]	Kisslove Pluvences: 	no petit culot
[15:53]	Jacek Antonelli: 	I discovered a neat trick using the movement controls the other day. If you click and hold on the forward or back arrow, you can move and turn your avatar by moving the mouse around
[15:54]	Kisslove Pluvences: 	s
[15:54]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I'm permanently holding down the right mouse to try to move camera because it's so common in games .... drives me nuts to select things and pie menu come up
[15:54]	StarSong Bright: 	you know i think i keep doing that by accident
[15:55]	Roof Doors: 	Kisslove Pluvences is at the door.
[15:55]	StarSong Bright: 	and inevitibly the msot hideious option is the defualt
[15:55]	StarSong Bright: 	and you end up attachmentless in the middle of a mall or somethign
[15:55]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Aye. One shoe does not fit all in this area.
[15:55]	Camber Front Door: Kisslove Pluvences is at the door. 	Camber Front Door: Kisslove Pluvences is at the door.
[15:55]	Camber Front Door: Kisslove Pluvences is at the door. 	Camber Front Door: Kisslove Pluvences is at the door.
[15:55]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yeah. What if right clicking the avatar while you were left-clicking too would start your avatar walking forward?
[15:56]	Jacek Antonelli: 	That's sort of how WoW does it, although I think you can do it in either order
[15:56]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I'm extremely surprised that mouse and keyboard handling hasn't been made configurable through a map yet.
[15:56]	StarSong Bright: 	i want to be able to turn off the letter movemtn keys
[15:56]	StarSong Bright: 	i am sick to death of fliping in the air when i mean to be typing e lol
[15:56]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Hahaha
[15:56]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Oh, yes. We definitely need a keyboard shortcut configurator
[15:57]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Basically, everyone has different requirements. Not surprised.
[15:57]	Jacek Antonelli gasps! Really? And all this time, I thought everyone used SL in exactly the way I do! ;D	Jacek Antonelli gasps! Really? And all this time, I thought everyone used SL in exactly the way I do! ;D
[15:57]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Hehehehe
[15:57]	StarSong Bright: 	grins
[15:57]	StarSong Bright: 	if only
[15:57]	StarSong Bright: 	i was watchign my husband sl.. and i was amazed
[15:57]	StarSong Bright: 	we have totally differnt approaches
[15:58]	StarSong Bright: 	he drags all his clothign onto himself for example
[15:58]	StarSong Bright: 	i NEVER do that, hate it
[15:58]	StarSong Bright: 	always end up with crap on the floor
[15:58]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I think the first viewer that does k/b+mouse mapping is going to get much love.
[15:58]	Jacek Antonelli: 	hehe, yeah
[15:59]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Imprudence 1.2.0 may have to be multigrid support + keyboard configurator
[15:59]	Morgaine Dinova: 	How's the next RC coming along?
[15:59]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Coo, that would be cool Jacek
[15:59]	StarSong Bright: 	brb
[16:00]	Morgaine Dinova: 	No McCabe, unusual
[16:00]	Jacek Antonelli: 	It's really close. We're planning on releasing Linux and Windows preview builds tomorrow evening (SLT)
[16:00]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Wowm fantastic!
[16:00]	Morgaine Dinova: 	s/m//
[16:00]	StarSong Bright: 	yes, thats why i am late, heh he usually reminds me or sends a tp
[16:00]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yeah, I dunno where McCabe is. Probably sleeping.
[16:01]	StarSong Bright: 	is it possible to build an ao into the browser jacek?
[16:01]	Jacek Antonelli: 	It's possible!
[16:01]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Some day we'll be doing that
[16:01]	StarSong Bright: 	it seems like such a duh thing you know?
[16:01]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yeah
[16:01]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I need to install that Quadro card, as that's the server box I do most x86 development on, and the Matrox card in can't bring up a full GL.
[16:02]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Oooh, nice idea Jacek
[16:02]	StarSong Bright: 	an ao and about 1/3 of the crap in my mystitool should just "be in there"
[16:02]	Jacek Antonelli: 	(afk a bit)
[16:03]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Star: plugins are going to make things like AOs soooooooooo much easier :-)
[16:03]	StarSong Bright: 	yes but.. things like handling sits and things..
[16:03]	StarSong Bright: 	jsut seems like the browser is the best chocie for it
[16:03]	StarSong Bright: 	i cant help bu twonder how much server time is wasted with redundant ao crapola
[16:04]	Morgaine Dinova: 	No hacking in such behaviour into C++ code, ew. So much easier to do it in a higher language in a plugin script.
[16:04]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Yeah, agreed, it's a waste of sim time
[16:05]	StarSong Bright: 	things like a decent radar, and a basic for stands walks sits swims and flies... well it woudl simplify thigns for everyone
[16:05]	StarSong Bright: 	i dont understand why they didnt make it part of the gestures
[16:05]	StarSong Bright: 	call it Attitude heh
[16:05]	Morgaine Dinova: 	And we'll have to work with Opensim folks on next-gen HUD or AO behaviour, as LL isn't going to do it.
[16:06]	StarSong Bright: 	i hate gestures btw but.. seems they go together somehow
[16:06]	StarSong Bright: 	well, i have to say of all the ones i have met only a couple really impressed me with their avatars
[16:06]	StarSong Bright: 	shows me how little value they appear to place on that
[16:06]	StarSong Bright: 	heh note that you NEVER see any of them walk
[16:07]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Gestures are desperatively inflexible ... again, a plugin will allow you to script arbitrarily complex behaviour. The machinima people are going to love it.
[16:07]	StarSong Bright: 	malbers floats
[16:07]	StarSong Bright: 	most of the rest tp in behind their chair, sit, at the end stand and tp away
[16:07]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Hehe
[16:07]	StarSong Bright: 	i am going to have to watch now, i honestly dont think i have seen a single one of them walk
[16:07]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Which is a bamboo ... certainly doesn't walk :-)
[16:08]	Jacek Antonelli: 	hehehe
[16:08]	StarSong Bright: 	do you suppose THAT is why the default walk look slike they have a stick.... heh
[16:08]	Morgaine Dinova: 	lol
[16:08]	Jacek Antonelli: 	rofl
[16:08]	StarSong Bright: 	they never walk so they dont notice? or mabye they dont walk becasue they do
[16:09]	Morgaine Dinova: 	This brings up the question of why they have never improved the default walk anim. It's desperately aweful.
[16:09]	StarSong Bright: 	really its inexcusable
[16:09]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Surely you could have grabbed any of the freebie anims.
[16:09]	StarSong Bright: 	or paid somebody 50 bucks to make a decent one
[16:10]	StarSong Bright: 	ANYTHING
[16:10]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Yeah
[16:10]	Jacek Antonelli: 	I think it's actually coded in the viewer. There's some stuff going on with IK and foot positions
[16:10]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Oh!
[16:10]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Jeez
[16:10]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Like, if you stand on uneven ground, one foot will be higher than the other
[16:10]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Well that sure needs a scalpel applied to it.
[16:10]	StarSong Bright: 	well... i enver really noticed that with mine
[16:11]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Which is a totally understandable tradeoff for looking decent.... *tries to keep a straight face*
[16:11]	StarSong Bright: 	but honestly if my ao wont work i fly, i really detest watchign myself waddle
[16:11]	Morgaine Dinova: 	How would you tackle that with anims? Doing it properly, not having one foot embedded in the ground?
[16:11]	Morgaine Dinova: 	I know current anims can;t.#
[16:11]	StarSong Bright: 	well i dont have one foot in the ground when i have my ao on
[16:11]	StarSong Bright: 	or if i have, i have yet to notice
[16:12]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Sounds like the anim player needs a physical constraints system.
[16:12]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yeah, current anims can't. But if there was a new animation system, or even just a new flag for animations when uploading -- you could use IK to adjust the feet positions automatically
[16:12]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Is there an open-source IK library?
[16:12]	StarSong Bright: 	ah i have to run
[16:13]	StarSong Bright: 	but i am vvery interested in this topic
[16:13]	Morgaine Dinova: 	KK, cya Star, hjave fun :-)
[16:13]	Jacek Antonelli: 	AOs?
[16:13]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Aw, take care Star
[16:13]	StarSong Bright: 	any chance we could have a discussion of the walk on one of the meetings the lindens come to?
[16:13]	StarSong Bright: 	so we can pepper them with qustions about it?
[16:13]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Good idea!
[16:13]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Sure!
[16:13]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Seconded :-)
[16:13]	StarSong Bright: 	i woudl suggest this would be a topic to pass them in advance so they can prepare themselves
[16:13]	Jacek Antonelli: 	I'll remember to bring my bright interrogating lamp, too
[16:13]	StarSong Bright: 	i mean its not a ui thing
[16:13]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Hahahaha
[16:14]	StarSong Bright: 	but serioulsy its a quality of sl experience issue
[16:14]	Jacek Antonelli: 	It is
[16:14]	StarSong Bright: 	my ao is off, look at this
[16:14]	Morgaine Dinova: 	It's not a UI thing, but it's very much a User Experience thing
[16:14]	StarSong Bright: 	i bounce like
[16:14]	StarSong Bright: 	geez i dont even know what
[16:14]	StarSong Bright: 	they cant seriously think anyboyd walks like this?
[16:14]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Talking about bouncing ... we don't, and you know what I mean ;-)
[16:14]	Morgaine Dinova: 	That could do with improiving
[16:15]	Jacek Antonelli: 	I wonder if they bundle AOs in the new newbie avatars... *checks*
[16:15]	StarSong Bright: 	hhah yeah but boob bounce is a bit harder to push at the corporates i think lmao
[16:15]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Aye, political problem
[16:15]	StarSong Bright: 	anyways lol, i better go before i find my soap boax again
[16:15]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Boob bounce would definitely be an imprudence thing to add xD
[16:15]	StarSong Bright: 	hehehhe bye for now
[16:15]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Cya Star :-)
[16:15]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Bye Star!
[16:15]	Jacek Antonelli: 	*imprudent
[16:16]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Hahahaha, yes, definitely imprudent :-)
[16:16]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Oh dear, hate to think how that would be greeted
[16:16]	Jacek Antonelli snickers 	Jacek Antonelli snickers
[16:16]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Seriously, it would be quite an issue
[16:16]	Jacek Antonelli: 	We could add RLV support in the same release, and get ourselves tagged as "the sex viewer"
[16:17]	Morgaine Dinova: 	RLV?
[16:17]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Restrained Life Viewer
[16:17]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Ah, hehe
[16:18]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Okay, I'd better get back to fixing my kernel.
[16:18]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Seeking realism is pretty safe, but you know how people are ... they don't really want realism when it conflicts with something on their agenda
[16:18]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Yeah
[16:18]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Good idea. I should sort out this card ready for you RC
[16:19]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Is the next meeting the all-Linden one?
[16:19]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Some day we need to add a new avatar mesh. You may have to pressure AWG to think about alternative meshes and skeletons, and how they could be supported on the server end
[16:19]	Morgaine Dinova: 	We can take the realXtend one, while LL can't because of licensing.
[16:20]	Jacek Antonelli: 	Ah, true, I forgot RealXtend had done something along those lines
[16:20]	Jacek Antonelli: 	And they're integrating with OpenSim, right?
[16:20]	Jacek Antonelli: 	(And yes, next meeting is Linden day)
[16:20]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Apparently realXtend won't accept LL's contributer agreement (good for them, about time someone stood up to it)
[16:20]	Morgaine Dinova: 	Cool