Mesh/Archive/2012-06-04

==Agenda==
# Even if it makes the stitch of the road into the taper, it is still bumpy. [Yuzuru Jewell] 11:51, 29 May 2012 (SLT)
# Mesh objects lose their static bonus when scripted; for link sets, all objects in the link set lose their bonus even if only one of the objects contains a script. This is a major issue when distributing larger builds in a rezzer box, for example -- since all the rezzed parts must be scripted the (temporary) land impact can practically double, thus exceeding the parcel limit and rendering the build unusable. Would it be possible to only penalize the objects that actually are scripted? One could argue that this is a more accurate way of determining server load. Other solutions, such as "temporary" class of scripts may be possible, but I imagine that would require viewer changes; simply modifying the static bonus logic should be a server-side-only solution. Cain Maven
==Meeting Notes==
==Attendees List==
*Abel Dreamscape (abel.dreamscape)
*Ameshin Yossarian -Not Support- (ameshin.yossarian)
*Asha (ashasekayi.ra)
*Cale Flanagan (cale.flanagan)
*Drongle McMahon (drongle.mcmahon)
*Geenz Spad (geenz.spad)
*JIRA-helper (jira-helper)
*Jonie Fearsum (jonie.fearsum)
*kaizersem Tenk (kaizersem.tenk)
*Kopilo Hallard (kopilo.hallard)
*Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray)
*Motor Loon (motor.loon)
*Myronx Zemenis (myronx.zemenis)
*Nal (nalates.urriah)
*Nyx Linden (nyx.linden)
*Paco Pooley (paco.pooley)
*Robin Lobo (robin.lobo)
*Second Life (second.life)
*Shiro Zapatero (shiro.zapatero)
*Phoenix-FirestormViewer Rocks (tankmaster.finesmith)
*Tiberious Neruda (tiberious.neruda)
*Timmi Allen (timmi.allen)
*Vincent Nacon (vincent.nacon)
*Vivienne Daguerre (vivienne.daguerre)
*WickedWanda (wickedwanda.blackheart)
*Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell)
*Zaggs (zaggs)
==Transcript for Monday June 4, 2012==
[11:58]	Nyx Linden 	greetings all
[11:58]	Vincent Nacon 	heya
[11:58]	Motor Loon 	ey Nyx
[11:58]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	Hiya Nyx :)
[11:58]	WickedWanda (wickedwanda.blackheart) 	Hi Nyx
[11:58]	Paco Pooley 	heyas nyx
[11:59]	kaizersem Tenk 	hi
[11:59]	Timmi Allen 	hi nyx
[11:59]	Nyx Linden 	agenda is here, feel free to add topics: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Content_Creation/Mesh_Import_User_Group
[12:01]	Nyx Linden 	shall we get started?
[12:01]	Motor Loon 	ready when you are
[12:01]	Paco Pooley 	yush
[12:01]	Vincent Nacon 	no, we have to wait for Philip Linden... (of course, go ahead)
[12:01]	Ameshin Yossarian -Not Support- (ameshin.yossarian) 	/me nods
[12:01]	Nyx Linden 	topic 1: "Even if it makes the stitch of the road into the taper, it is still bumpy. [Yuzuru Jewell] 11:51, 29 May 2012 (SLT)"
[12:02]	Vincent Nacon 	she's not even here
[12:03]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	Yuzuru is a guy. lol
[12:03]	Vincent Nacon 	ok he's not here
[12:03]	Motor Loon 	¬∞Õú¬∞
[12:03]	Timmi Allen 	:))
[12:03]	Vincent Nacon 	:P
[12:03]	Nyx Linden 	I believe this is in reference to Yuzuru's road that was longer than the maximum primitive size, when you put them end to end it would cause vehicles to bump at the seams
[12:03]	Vincent Nacon 	yup and they do, even on mesh
[12:03]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	/me nods.
[12:03]	Shiro Zapatero 	Hey everybody
[12:04]	Tiberious Neruda 	yeah, it's a continuation of the item from last week
[12:04]	Vincent Nacon 	but that's more related to physic than mesh or prim itself
[12:04]	Motor Loon 	more a physics problem than a mesh problem really
[12:04]	Shiro Zapatero 	I have a question for everybody
[12:04]	Vincent Nacon 	so he's asking the question to the wrong person
[12:04]	Nyx Linden 	still a valid topic but would help to have yuzuru here with examples
[12:04]	Vincent Nacon 	only if he was here
[12:04]	Vincent Nacon 	next!
[12:04]	Motor Loon 	we'll take it next time then
[12:05]	Nyx Linden 	so, moving on
[12:05]	Nyx Linden 	next topic: "Mesh objects lose their static bonus when scripted; for link sets, all objects in the link set lose their bonus even if only one of the objects contains a script. This is a major issue when distributing larger builds in a rezzer box, for example -- since all the rezzed parts must be scripted the (temporary) land impact can practically double, thus exceeding the parcel limit and rendering the build unusable. Would it be possible to only penalize the objects that actually are scripted? One could argue that this is a more accurate way of determining server load. Other solutions, such as "temporary" class of scripts may be possible, but I imagine that would require viewer changes; simply modifying the static bonus logic should be a server-side-only solution. Cain Maven"
[12:05]	Nyx Linden 	in a word, no.
[12:05]	Motor Loon 	expected behavior
[12:05]	Motor Loon 	and it will change a bit after PF hits rollout
[12:06]	Vincent Nacon 	still a problem for house rezzers
[12:06]	Nyx Linden 	a slightly more in depth answer, once a single prim in a linkset is scripted, that single script can cause properties in any prim in the linkset to be changed
[12:06]	Shiro Zapatero 	What the hell is LL doing to prevent the new bug that gives griefers the ability to tp random people to a sim that they dont want to be in.
[12:06]	Shiro Zapatero 	?
[12:06]	Motor Loon 	a whole house thats not scripted at all?
[12:06]	Motor Loon 	seems unlikely eh
[12:06]	Vincent Nacon 	I mean what if home owners wanted a new mesh house in his/her small parcel but can't rez because of the script?
[12:06]	Nyx Linden 	thus our services have to treat every linkset with even a single script as "dynamic"
[12:06]	Shiro Zapatero 	OH nvm..its a talk about mesh items
[12:07]	Motor Loon 	wrong usergroup Shiro
[12:07]	Nyx Linden 	content creators usergroup, any content creation topics are welcome here
[12:07]	Nyx Linden 	if you have concerns about security bugs please file a SEC jira and/or ping me privately
[12:07]	Motor Loon 	if a script in the mesh house cases a problem, then dont use a rezzing system
[12:08]	Vincent Nacon 	and Shiro... that's currently in closed beta, it's still in progress.
[12:08]	Vincent Nacon 	and no one is allowed to talk about it because of the NDA form
[12:08]	Vincent Nacon 	you're gonna have to wait
[12:09]	Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray) 	Vincent llTeleportAgent is on RC Magnum
[12:09]	Vincent Nacon 	it is?
[12:09]	Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray) 	yeah
[12:09]	Vincent Nacon 	ah well... then that's good
[12:09]	Nyx Linden 	so any questions on topic #2?
[12:10]	Vincent Nacon 	yeah... can we ditch the server cost?
[12:10]	Vincent Nacon 	:P
[12:10]	Nyx Linden 	nope!
[12:10]	Motor Loon 	it really does get better with the new mesh accounting comming with pathfinding
[12:10]	Vincent Nacon 	careful... you're a little person there
[12:10]	Nyx Linden 	new pathfinding accounting is subject to change, but it could help in this scenario.
[12:11]	Vincent Nacon 	oh I know
[12:11]	Nyx Linden 	alright, quickest usergroup meeting ever. Anyone read any good books lately? :D
[12:11]	Vincent Nacon 	still annoyance
[12:11]	Robin Lobo 	lol
[12:11]	Tiberious Neruda 	o.O
[12:11]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	what the?
[12:11]	Paco Pooley 	what the freck?
[12:11]	Tiberious Neruda 	[12:11] Second Life: You have been teleported by the object 'Object' on the parcel 'Pooley Stage'.
[12:11]	Kopilo Hallard 	nyx mind turning scripts off on the parcel?
[12:11]	Kopilo Hallard 	that's someone being a tool
[12:11]	Paco Pooley 	yeah
[12:12]	Robin Lobo 	somebody tried to tp us all
[12:12]	Paco Pooley 	turn script off
[12:19]	Nyx Linden 	apologies all. turning off object entry and scripts for now. We're aware of the issue and are hunting it down
[12:19]	Motor Loon 	excellent
[12:19]	Kopilo Hallard 	thanks
[12:19]	Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray) 	the pooley sim (neighbouring sim) is RC Magnum
[12:19]	Nyx Linden 	and yes I know the object was not in my parcel, but cleaning up here just in case
[12:19]	Vincent Nacon 	yeah
[12:19]	Motor Loon 	yeah we have to keep an eye on that Vincent greifer guy ¬∞Õú¬∞
[12:19]	Nyx Linden 	/me would rather be safe than sorry - I clean up the parcel on regular occasion anyways
[12:19]	Tiberious Neruda 	I hope the little mr. Fremont wannabe gets a swift boot from the grid...
[12:20]	Robin Lobo 	lol @ loon
[12:20]	Motor Loon 	hehe
[12:20]	Abel Dreamscape 	nyx i do have 2 questions ..would you rather me post on the site first?
[12:20]	Vincent Nacon 	I always clean up after myself... just thought it was strange that I had something rezzed here
[12:21]	Shiro Zapatero 	I hope LL fixes this tp thing soon
[12:21]	Drongle McMahon 	Sorry I'm late. If anyone want to give me a transcript-so-far, I would be happy :-)
[12:21]	Tiberious Neruda 	and when I relogged at CF, I found a number of other people who's also been wished away
[12:21]	Vivienne Daguerre 	We are back from the corn field... :P
[12:22]	Motor Loon 	haha if only
[12:22]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	You missed the field trip Drongle. :p
[12:22]	Motor Loon 	anythings better than orientation island
[12:22]	Vincent Nacon 	I was at help island with Motor
[12:22]	Nyx Linden 	topic 1 is waiting on Yuzuru to bring an example, topic 2 we explained why any linkset with even one script is always considered "dynamic"
[12:22]	Vincent Nacon 	and Mikki
[12:22]	Motor Loon 	and 200 nutty spanish noobs
[12:22]	Nyx Linden 	then we broke early for a field trip to the cornfield
[12:22]	Vincent Nacon 	muhaha!
[12:22]	Paco Pooley 	LOL
[12:22]	Robin Lobo 	lol
[12:22]	Second Life 	Now leaving god mode, level 150
[12:22]	Vincent Nacon 	I thought it was Nyx teleporting us elsewhere
[12:22]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	We did the COrnfield trip from Kelly's meeting.
[12:23]	Timmi Allen 	What were these lousy times, when we had another 14 topics.
[12:32]	Nyx Linden 	sorry about that guys
[12:32]	Tiberious Neruda 	did you get the object, Nyx?
[12:32]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	:)
[12:32]	Geenz Spad 	fun times
[12:32]	Ameshin Yossarian -Not Support- (ameshin.yossarian) 	=^.^=
[12:32]	Nyx Linden 	are there any further topics for today?
[12:32]	Motor Loon 	Think we've had enough fun for one day ¬∞Õú¬∞
[12:32]	Vincent Nacon 	where were we?
[12:32]	Cale Flanagan 	setting the vehicle to not owner only in the cornfield maybe?
[12:32]	Tiberious Neruda 	yeah... subtitle this week's meeting 'To Hell and Back' :√û
[12:33]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	Some said they had 2 questions to add before the cornfield.
[12:33]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	*Someone
[12:33]	Phoenix-FirestormViewer Rocks (tankmaster.finesmith)	im with cale, make that tractor ridable by everyone :P
[12:33]	Drongle McMahon 	Nyx, did you show Falcon my question about physics weights?
[12:34]	Nyx Linden 	yes, he said it would take him a while to digest
[12:34]	Cale Flanagan 	@tank:maybe needs a jira:)
[12:34]	Drongle McMahon 	ok
[12:34]	Motor Loon 	Sounds like Falcon...
[12:34]	Nyx Linden 	apologies for the confusion this week, we will get things cleaned up.
[12:35]	Vincent Nacon 	I demand a free sim or I'll sue!
[12:35]	Vincent Nacon 	:P
[12:35]	Motor Loon 	hah
[12:35]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	/me snorts
[12:35]	Nyx Linden 	/me can offer a cookie instead? :)
[12:36]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	I'll take a unicorn, Nyx.
[12:36]	Tiberious Neruda 	Yuzuru!
[12:36]	Vincent Nacon 	I'll sue for mental damages that I had to see and hear newbies at help island think they're in hot spot for picking up girls.
[12:36]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	Heya Yuzuru :)
[12:36]	Nyx Linden 	fresh out of Unicorns I'm afraid
[12:36]	Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray) 	I bet it was some noob in the adjacent (RC Magnum) region who got a tool from a 'friend' and just tried/rezzed it
[12:36]	Motor Loon 	oh there's question #1
[12:36]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	Well...blechh...
[12:36]	Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray) 	(there's an infohub)
[12:36]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	Hello. I am too late..
[12:36]	Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray) 	ah hi Yuzuru
[12:36]	Tiberious Neruda 	n, not yet
[12:36]	Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray) 	you missed the fun
[12:36]	Paco Pooley 	well it is my first meeting and i guess it has been asked before - but is there a way to make the mesh uploader more stabel - it crashed on me every second upload which is a drag when you have to upluad 5 standard sizes per clothing :-P
[12:37]	Asha (ashasekayi.ra) 	You didn't miss much Yuzuru.
[12:37]	Timmi Allen 	hi Yuzuru
[12:37]	Nyx Linden 	we were wrapping up, but I would like to see an example of your roads at some point
[12:37]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	OK Please wait..
[12:37]	Nyx Linden 	do submit crash reports Paco, and if you can reproduce such a crash, then logs would help as well (in a JIRA)
[12:37]	Motor Loon 	hehe impatient little guy ¬∞Õú¬∞
[12:38]	Vincent Nacon 	it can be any kind of road... just make two boxes touches each other on the side and drive on top of it
[12:38]	Nyx Linden 	does this happen even if you use box prims?
[12:38]	Vincent Nacon 	the bump is coming from edge collision
[12:38]	Nyx Linden 	or is it mesh-specific?
[12:38]	Vincent Nacon 	it's not just box or mesh, it's the polygon in Havok engine
[12:39]	Vincent Nacon 	the physic doesn't react to back side of a polygon, only on front face
[12:39]	Vincent Nacon 	but when coming to collide on the side of the polygon face, it bumps
[12:40]	Vincent Nacon 	because it's kinda confused wether you should bump from backside or the front side
[12:40]	Vincent Nacon 	since polygon is only 2D
[12:40]	Nyx Linden 	are you decomposing your physics shapes?
[12:40]	Vincent Nacon 	it doesn't matter what shape they are
[12:40]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	I can't Rez it.. Why?
[12:40]	Nyx Linden 	doing so would make them volumes instead of triangles
[12:41]	Tiberious Neruda 	we had build turned off because of a griefer attack
[12:41]	Vincent Nacon 	it's an issue with havok engine
[12:41]	Nyx Linden 	I turned off rezzing for today - we were having issues with griefers.
[12:41]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	owner does not allow it..
[12:41]	Cale Flanagan 	is the tp object working as attachment?
[12:41]	Tiberious Neruda 	I think it is
[12:41]	Cale Flanagan 	then no build is no help
[12:42]	Tiberious Neruda 	we got TPed away TWICE, remember?
[12:42]	Motor Loon 	and from another parcel ¬∞Õú¬∞
[12:42]	Tiberious Neruda 	yep
[12:42]	Cale Flanagan 	yeah.. just before i took picture, but i could tp back to the field (tought you cant tp in there)
[12:43]	Nyx Linden 	yuzuru - is there a jira for this? I'd like to get other lindens to take a look at your roads as well (please include a slurl)
[12:43]	Nal (nalates.urriah) 	You can tp out of Cornfield today... they enabled tp
[12:43]	kaizersem Tenk 	i have a question too, i started a vehicle today, the base mesh is symetric, i separate it in 2 part (exactly the same part but mirrored), and the prims count of each symetrical part is not the same
[12:43]	Tiberious Neruda 	otherwise, all they'd be doing is supporting requests to get out of the field
[12:44]	Cale Flanagan 	ah..., ok
[12:44]	Second Life 	There is no suitable surface to sit on, try another spot.
[12:44]	Zaggs 	hey guys how are you?
[12:44]	Cale Flanagan 	(it will show up in the top dests i guess)
[12:44]	Tiberious Neruda 	LOL!
[12:44]	Kopilo Hallard 	night all
[12:44]	Motor Loon 	https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-2006
[12:44]	Myronx Zemenis 	hi
[12:44]	JIRA-helper 	[#SVC-2006] Spheres bounce when rolling over flat seams in Havok 4. - Second Life Bug Tracker
[12:44]	Vincent Nacon 	I think that mesh road Yuzuru was wearing cashed me
[12:44]	Motor Loon 	probably related
[12:45]	Vincent Nacon 	again... that bump is havok engine related issue on edge collision
[12:45]	Martin RJ (martinrj.fayray) 	what a day
[12:45]	Nyx Linden 	please fly up if you'd like to attach large objects
[12:45]	Motor Loon 	come on stop attaching the big prims eh
[12:45]	Vincent Nacon 	since it rolls around on its own edges in sphere
[12:46]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	I tested these.. I can't rez them..
[12:46]	Motor Loon 	no you cant rez them when build it off
[12:46]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	I think they are concerned to that.
[12:47]	Tiberious Neruda 	LOL!
[12:47]	Tiberious Neruda 	http://secondlife.com/destination/the-corn-field
[12:47]	Nyx Linden 	ok, I think that's all we have for today. Yuzuru I'll ask around a bit internally. If you have your roads set up somewhere please send me a SLURL
[12:47]	Tiberious Neruda 	it DID make the guide, apparently
[12:48]	Cale Flanagan 	great:)
[12:48]	Jonie Fearsum 	ÔΩ°‚óï‚Äø‚óïÔΩ° ƒ¨ K Œµ m b ‚óê ÔΩ≤ - ƒ¨ g ƒ¨ Ôæö ƒ¨ –∏ g
[12:48]	Jonie Fearsum 	ÔΩ°‚óï‚Äø‚óïÔΩ° ƒ¨ K Œµ m b ‚óê ÔΩ≤ - ƒ¨ g ƒ¨ Ôæö ƒ¨ –∏ g !!!
[12:48]	Yuzuru (yuzuru.jewell) 	OK. I will
[12:48]	Nyx Linden 	thanks for coming out everyone! Next week should be calmer
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