Doc Team/2009-03-25

== Transcript ==
*[13:03 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: em, I'm not English... I'm Italian.. I don't speake very well...
*[13:03 SLT] xstorm Radek: hi Fuzzy
*[13:03 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Hey everyone!
*[13:03 SLT] xstorm Radek: hi Vista
*[13:03 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: I know :)
*[13:03 SLT] Kimala Kohime: hi :)
*[13:04 SLT] Vista Questi: Hallo
*[13:04 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: You are not properly rezzed - you look like a cloud to me
*[13:04 SLT] Stev Spiegel: were not all english...
*[13:04 SLT] xstorm Radek: hi Ryu
*[13:04 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: what is "rebake"?
*[13:04 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Hiyas :)
*[13:04 SLT] Stev Spiegel: re-bake is to sit in the sun too long
*[13:04 SLT] Jeremy Linden looks around.
*[13:04 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Vista, love the wings!
*[13:04 SLT] Kimala Kohime: lol
*[13:04 SLT] Arawn Spitteler wonderstht he gets an L$ icon, when his mouse hovers over that couch: I'm American, The English don' think I should butcher their language either.
*[13:04 SLT] Jeremy Linden: No other Lindens yet?
*[13:04 SLT] Vista Questi: Weeee! ^.^
*[13:04 SLT] Ryu Darragh: rebake is to reload your avatar textures
*[13:04 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Rebake your av atar - do cntrl + lat + r
*[13:04 SLT] Vista Questi: I get that alot, thx!
*[13:04 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: omg I can't type
*[13:04 SLT] Torley Linden: OWWWWWWWWWWW
*[13:04 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: alt*
*[13:04 SLT] Torley Linden: i've returned
*[13:04 SLT] xstorm Radek: hi Kate
*[13:04 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Torley was here for 10 seconds
*[13:05 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Torley, after I have to talk to you. Can I?
*[13:05 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: LOL
*[13:05 SLT] xstorm Radek: *GIGGLES* :)Jeremy Linden 21:07, 25 March 2009 (UTC)
*[13:05 SLT] Torley Linden: okay i'd better find a seat
*[13:05 SLT] Vista Questi: rebaking recombines the textures.. there's a wiki on thta.
*[13:05 SLT] Judi Newall: oops sorry not rezzed
*[13:05 SLT] Torley Linden: TheBlackNightPanta, please explain what it's about! :D
*[13:05 SLT] Torley Linden: to make sure it's something i can help with ^_^
*[13:05 SLT] Marianne McCann: Rez rez rez rez REZ REZ REZ REZ!!!
*[13:05 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: A tutorial that I've created
*[13:05 SLT] Judi Newall: Hiya Mari
*[13:05 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Well I was waiting for us to get our very own Choo choo!
*[13:05 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Panta is Italian and doesnt understand the word rebake
*[13:05 SLT] Vista Questi: what CAN'T u help with, Mr. Torley? :3
*[13:05 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: I did see an Enlightenmentor, briefly. If lLindens are crashing, maybe they can ask the lindens for technical support.
*[13:05 SLT] Torley Linden: heh hehh oh a tutorial, well sure!
*[13:06 SLT] Spunke Slade laughs
*[13:06 SLT] Jeremy Linden: I ask other Lindens for tech support all the time :-P
*[13:06 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: *iz rezzin*
*[13:06 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Hahaha Jeremy
*[13:06 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Hello Jeremy
*[13:06 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Dreamin22 Nitely has pinged you.
*[13:06 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy has pinged you.
*[13:06 SLT] xstorm Radek: hi Judi
*[13:06 SLT] Torley Linden: you can feel free to ask your question out in the open TheBlackNightPanta , seems like something that would benefit from that
*[13:06 SLT] Torley Linden: Judi, AWESOME TRAIN
*[13:06 SLT] Kimala Kohime: hi willa ;)
*[13:06 SLT] Torley Linden: OMG
*[13:06 SLT] Jeremy Linden: We *still* don't have the collective mind worked out.
*[13:06 SLT] Judi Newall: Madcow Cosmos again RFL special
*[13:06 SLT] Torley Linden: Kate and Jeremy are here to help!
*[13:06 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Torley Linden has pinged you.
*[13:06 SLT] Kate Linden: Hi, how is everyone this week?
*[13:06 SLT] Shippo Westland: found it XD
*[13:06 SLT] Spunke Slade: as long as we dont hear, wall, what wall, i didnt get a wall with this computer...
*[13:06 SLT] Willa Wycliffe: hi Kimala :)
*[13:06 SLT] Torley Linden: ah that Madcow, what a wonderful creator
*[13:06 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: um I hear ... drums?
*[13:06 SLT] Daniel Voyager: Hey Kate :)
*[13:06 SLT] Vista Questi: I hope u never do. I like suprises!
*[13:06 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Jeremy, as long as you don't email yourself and ask a question, that's cool
*[13:06 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Dreamin22 Nitely has pinged you.
*[13:07 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Mad.. utterly mad.
*[13:07 SLT] Kate Linden: Hi Daniel :)
*[13:07 SLT] Jeremy Linden does sometimes make KB suggestions.
*[13:07 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Same as last week :P
*[13:07 SLT] Marianne McCann: Madcow rocks. You shoulda seen the stuff he had at the nova Albion parade
*[13:07 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Hehhehe
*[13:07 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Hello Kate
*[13:07 SLT] Torley Linden: unfortunately i missed that Mari, what was it?
*[13:07 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Sounds like a Gemini thing
*[13:07 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: Hope I didn't step on anyone! Just wanted to get out of the limelight, LOL! I apologize!
*[13:07 SLT] Kate Linden: Hi TheBlackNightPanta
*[13:07 SLT] Judi Newall: and he's made LOADS for RFL! Great guy
*[13:07 SLT] Marianne McCann: He had several new bandbots he brought out over time
*[13:07 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: wow, There are many Linden
*[13:07 SLT] xstorm Radek: need to look in to a problem of the OpenGL and tell people how they can turn it off
*[13:07 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: ^_^
*[13:07 SLT] Marianne McCann: I'll find the URL to the youtube of the parade
*[13:07 SLT] Torley Linden: quite alright to be in our limelight, we should put one of Jeremy's signature glow beacons so we can do a Mr. Bean thing on all new people dropping in on our center rug
*[13:07 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Torley Linden has pinged you.
*[13:08 SLT] Torley Linden: TheBlackNightPanta, so you were wondering about... rebake? please explain more?
*[13:08 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: XD
*[13:08 SLT] Stev Spiegel: oh so you do that on purpose...
*[13:08 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: "Hey look, another one! And another one!"
*[13:08 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: wow, Torley.. Your avatar is beatiful xD
*[13:08 SLT] xstorm Radek: hi Carolin
*[13:08 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: Ask and ye shall receive. :D
*[13:09 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: eh eh eh tour xD
*[13:09 SLT] Kate Linden: Nicely done Jeremy : )
*[13:09 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Kate Linden has pinged you.
*[13:09 SLT] Carolin Morgenstern: Hello xstorm
*[13:09 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Nothing special, just a couple cylinders :-)
*[13:09 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: I was trying to explain that he doesnt appear rezzed to me, but Panta is Italian
*[13:09 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: So doesnt understasnd rebake
*[13:09 SLT] Ryu Darragh: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Rebake#Rebake_Textures
*[13:09 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: I have training for ISTE in half an hour, so figured I'd bop in and see what was going on.
*[13:10 SLT] Ryu Darragh: It reloads your textures so everyone can see you as you should be seen :)
*[13:10 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Look on the rebake as a sort of refreshing of the textures.
*[13:10 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: ---or putting a fresh coat of paint.
*[13:10 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: You lost your seat Panta :)
*[13:11 SLT] xstorm Radek: paint is bad for the fur
*[13:11 SLT] Torley Linden: ahhh. there are known texture rezzing issues in the current Second Life, e.g., textures may not rez until you move your cursor over them
*[13:11 SLT] Torley Linden: thanks TheBlackNightPanta :)
*[13:11 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: ops. sorry
*[13:11 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: yes Tour xD
*[13:11 SLT] Torley Linden: "rebake" is like "refresh" or "reload it again so it will load this time"
*[13:11 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Thanks you ;)
*[13:11 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Also happens if you change your POV to get closer to a textured object, Torley.
*[13:12 SLT] Marianne McCann: So here's an off the wall question while I find an URL. I've been doing a presentation on the architecture and style behind Bay City lately, as a resource to other Bay Citizens who want to create a "period" feel for their buildings. Some have suggested I put the materials on the Wiki. Would such be appropriate for there?
*[13:12 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: So I wonder if we can order Italian food?
*[13:12 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Oooops, I mentioned food.
*[13:12 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: lol Dreamin
*[13:12 SLT] Arawn Spitteler suggests going ahead, and letting the lindens figure out who's in charge.
*[13:12 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Hahahhaa
*[13:12 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: lool Dream
*[13:13 SLT] Stev Spiegel: Panta is perhaps chef
*[13:13 SLT] Ryu Darragh has 6 trays of lasagna enough to feed this entire crowd in his freezer.. he also tends to cook like he's in the Army.
*[13:13 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: ahah no lool ;)
*[13:13 SLT] Jeremy Linden: I think information stemming from research about the architectural style of Bay City would probably be appropriate on the wiki... Do you have any examples of existing articles like that?
*[13:14 SLT] Marianne McCann: Not that I can think of Jeremy. I've not seen anything specific to style in any of the city type regions
*[13:14 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Marianne McCann has pinged you.
*[13:14 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: THAT is an interesting topic.
*[13:14 SLT] Torley Linden: there's some related LDP info on the wiki too
*[13:14 SLT] Jeremy Linden: I'm mostly going to be offering my opinion here; this team doesn't often deal directly with the wiki, so we're not the best to ask about wiki policy :-)
*[13:14 SLT] Torley Linden: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Department_of_Public_Works_scrapbook
*[13:14 SLT] Torley Linden: plus Magellan's earlier tour log
*[13:14 SLT] Marianne McCann: True, Torley, but it is very sparce. Actually, the best info out there is on the blog.
*[13:14 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Isn't Jon coming? I even brought my spoon :P
*[13:15 SLT] Marianne McCann: That's where the specifics on the time preiod were expressed strongest
*[13:15 SLT] Torley Linden: i think then, that if not already, that blog stuff should be linked to from the wiki, Mari, and feel free to sprout a page (or pages) and encourage more awareness!
*[13:15 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Hey Fred!
*[13:15 SLT] Jeremy Linden: If there are some informational articles about Bay City already, maybe some notes about the visual style could be appended to them.
*[13:15 SLT] Marianne McCann: Off, I feel like I was just walked over
*[13:15 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Hey Dream.
*[13:15 SLT] xstorm Radek: thats to many prims
*[13:16 SLT] Reed Steamroller: hola :D
*[13:16 SLT] xstorm Radek: i can see the prim litter now
*[13:16 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Sorry, no Jon this week. He's busy on a super-high priority project our team's going to be working on.
*[13:16 SLT] Marianne McCann: I'll take a gander at that Jeremy
*[13:16 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Marianne McCann has pinged you.
*[13:16 SLT] Torley Linden: the wiki is really useful to just splash some info, even in a naive state, and refine it later
*[13:16 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: ok
*[13:16 SLT] Torley Linden: it doesn't have to be the final place but it IS useful for getting stuff organized
*[13:16 SLT] Torley Linden: and getting help from others too
*[13:16 SLT] xstorm Radek: the wiki needs to get fix
*[13:16 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: The Italian Mentor lists are closed?
*[13:17 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Hey Colton!
*[13:17 SLT] Colton Linden: Hia :)
*[13:17 SLT] Torley Linden: xstorm, how so? details please!
*[13:17 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Apologies if I stomped on someone while I rezzed, stuff's still rezzing...
*[13:17 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Hi Colton
*[13:17 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Hello Colton ;)
*[13:17 SLT] Torley Linden: if anyone is interested in wiki philosophy and why compiling info matters, http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Art_of_compiling
*[13:17 SLT] Torley Linden: friendly greetings Colton!
*[13:17 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: I did it too Fred. No worries
*[13:17 SLT] Torley Linden: welcome aboard Fred!
*[13:17 SLT] Marianne McCann: Very brief article on style talk in question http://morrisvig.wordpress.com/2009/03/25/marianne-mccanns-bay-city-architecture-talk/
*[13:17 SLT] Colton Linden waves
*[13:17 SLT] Torley Linden: and everyone who's joined us for today!
*[13:17 SLT] Torley Linden: *looks at Mari's link*
*[13:17 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Thanks, Torley.
*[13:17 SLT] Torley Linden: you are aboard the GOOD SHIP DOCTEAM
*[13:17 SLT] Marianne McCann: Sokay, Fred. My mesh is pretty strong
*[13:17 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Cool
*[13:17 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Glad to be aboard.
*[13:18 SLT] Shippo Westland: Hey :P
*[13:18 SLT] Marianne McCann: And here's that Nova Albion 5th Anniversary Parade video I mentioned (save it for later): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNd4g4IJ3aA
*[13:18 SLT] Marianne McCann: Great avvie, Colton. But can it hold a fishing rod?
*[13:19 SLT] Colton Linden: I blow em out of the water
*[13:19 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Zing!
*[13:19 SLT] Marianne McCann: I do too. With a sack of dynamite
*[13:19 SLT] xstorm Radek: there needs to be more info thats up to date on the OpenGL thats still not working right in SL
*[13:19 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Can you elaborate on that, xstorm?
*[13:19 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Torley, is legal go on the site www.secondlife.com, search for avatars, open your profile and derive the key? Sorry for my English xD
*[13:19 SLT] Reed Steamroller: Hi, I'm wondering about support for running SL in windows w/ an ATI Radeon 2600. SL website says it recommends that card for use with SL, but there are apparently a plethora of problems with OpenGL and that card: http://bit.ly/D7dGM Do you all have any recommended drivers that we should be using?
*[13:19 SLT] Jeremy Linden: I'm not sure I'm familiar with the problem.
*[13:20 SLT] xstorm Radek: drats have to go bye all
*[13:20 SLT] Fred Rookstown: See ya, X.
*[13:20 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Thanks for coming, xstorm!
*[13:20 SLT] Arawn Spitteler notes the Bug Treage Link, that he added to Office Hours, is still there: Hi, Colton. Mari, the Wiki is for user use, rather than official-only
*[13:20 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: bye xstorm
*[13:20 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: bye xstorm
*[13:20 SLT] Shippo Westland: What wiki?
*[13:21 SLT] Ryu Darragh: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki
*[13:21 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Office_Hours
*[13:21 SLT] Shippo Westland: thank you
*[13:21 SLT] Jeremy Linden: TheBlackNightPanta: http://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=4417&task=knowledge&questionID=5812
*[13:21 SLT] Jeremy Linden: I think it's legal :-)
*[13:21 SLT] Torley Linden: Reed, we generally recommend the latest stable drivers and searching jira.secondlife.com to see what other Residents have reported.
*[13:21 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: ok, thanks very much Jeremy ;-))
*[13:21 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy has pinged you.
*[13:21 SLT] Vista Questi: IF you can do it , it's legal until someone tells u no.
*[13:22 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: well perhaps they're talking about the Nivida GL bug with clothing that *STILL* seems to exist.. for instance.. Jeremy's pant bottoms are bugged for me right now. they go right on past his shoes without texture. it might not be part of the original nvidia bug.. but I still see it on occation with the Microsoft nvidia drivers and the latest release candidate.
*[13:22 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Fuzzy Mocha has pinged you.
*[13:22 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: If youwant to hack the viewer, there's a link from the http://wiki.secondlife.com homepage
*[13:22 SLT] Ryu Darragh: You can also check specifically to see if they have an update to OpenGL on the drivers page
*[13:22 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Sometimes all they include is 2.0
*[13:22 SLT] Fred Rookstown: I'm on an nvidia geforce 8800 GTS, no problems with clothing on the latest drivers.
*[13:22 SLT] Ryu Darragh: And you need better then 2.0 now
*[13:22 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Fuzzy, I see that too. I'm on an nVidia card, though.
*[13:23 SLT] Marianne's Lollipop whispers: 
*[13:23 SLT] Reed Steamroller: ty torley :D the thing is that the drivers ATI put out for that card on win suck :( and basically the card refuses to use its own video memory when in opengl mode on windows, and dumps everything on system memory. note: this only happens on win systems, the linux and mac drivers should run just fine because they don't have direct x to focus on
*[13:23 SLT] Shippo Westland: I haed some probelms where when i put on my jacket my pants disapper but they fix that by what i see
*[13:23 SLT] Arawn Spitteler uses Finger Paints, and has to keep the string tight, for SL to come through the can...
*[13:23 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Reed--if you don't mind me adding a suggestion, I use a Radeon HD 2600 and I have found great results using a driver v4.8.442 made by Omega. Check out Radeon Omega Driver
*[13:23 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Be careful, tho.. there are problems jumping all the way to or beyond OpenGL 3.0
*[13:23 SLT] Reed Steamroller: my problem is that i'm pretty sure we're going to have to return this card to run SL, and i'm wondering why it is being listed as "recommended" on the SL website, while it won't run SL under windows
*[13:23 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Well it does
*[13:24 SLT] Reed Steamroller: Dreamin: thanks i will definitly give those drivers a shot
*[13:24 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Problem with 64 bit OS and drivers ?
*[13:24 SLT] Reed Steamroller: no win xp 32
*[13:24 SLT] Reed Steamroller: xp pro
*[13:24 SLT] Fred Rookstown: None on Vista Ultimate 64bit.
*[13:24 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Ah
*[13:24 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Cool. he ATI site did not help much, but a friend told me about the Omega site. Worked like a charm!
*[13:24 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: Which card this this, Reed?
*[13:25 SLT] Reed Steamroller: yeah this is the very last time i ever buy anything from ATI
*[13:25 SLT] Reed Steamroller: one sec
*[13:25 SLT] Reed Steamroller: i'll get the exact model for you
*[13:25 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Well
*[13:25 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: Okay
*[13:25 SLT] Torley Linden: wouldn't those problematic drivers also be affecting other ATI cards in the same line?
*[13:25 SLT] Reed Steamroller: HIS Radeon HD 2600
*[13:25 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Yep
*[13:25 SLT] Ryu Darragh: They tend to use a family driver
*[13:25 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: So Reed I'm using the same thing!
*[13:25 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Before you make the switch to ATI, be aware that the drivers for Vista x64 are very shoddy
*[13:25 SLT] Reed Steamroller: Torley: apparently they do, but this is the only ATI card i own
*[13:25 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Both nVidia and ATI
*[13:25 SLT] Fred Rookstown: *to nvidia
*[13:25 SLT] Courteous Avedon: hello all present but not yet rezzed for me
*[13:25 SLT] Reed Steamroller: we only run XP and Fedora, no vista
*[13:25 SLT] Torley Linden: (i'm curious if anyone here has had experience with the 4870 and 4870 X2 with Second Life, those are popular gamer/enthusiast cards)
*[13:25 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Ah ok then, disregard
*[13:26 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Hello Courteous
*[13:26 SLT] Ryu Darragh: I have, but then my systems are not typical..
*[13:26 SLT] Ryu Darragh: I'm a mad modder
*[13:26 SLT] Marianne McCann: Gotta scoot - have fub, everybuggy!
*[13:26 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: Well all- wish I could stick around but have to go to training for ISTE. Have an excellent day!
*[13:26 SLT] Digo Hynes: I use one Nvidia Geforce GTX 260
*[13:26 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Have fub, too :)
*[13:26 SLT] Fred Rookstown: See ya, Marianne
*[13:26 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: bye Marianne
*[13:26 SLT] Marianne McCann: Bye Bye!!
*[13:26 SLT] Shippo Westland: Bye alasen
*[13:26 SLT] Reed Steamroller: Dreamin: do you have an URL for those omega drivers?
*[13:26 SLT] Judi Newall: Bye Mari
*[13:27 SLT] Stev Spiegel: fub is Italian
*[13:27 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: yes. there are driver issues for nVidia cards too.. though in general SL seems to run well with default MS Update nvidia drivers. *shrugs*. I used to always use the newest beta drivers.. but I ended up noticing that with SL.. newest isn't always bestest *snickers*
*[13:27 SLT] Torley Linden: how's that working for you, Digo?
*[13:27 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: fub?
*[13:27 SLT] Ryu Darragh: That's what I alluded to with OpenGL 3.0 :P
*[13:27 SLT] Digo Hynes: nvidia this one is running pretty fine
*[13:28 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Sincere, looks like you're caught in some tempral disturbance!
*[13:28 SLT] Fred Rookstown: nVidia drivers on my system are OK generally, but under load, they overheat as the automatic fan control system does not work correctly, leaving the fan at 60% dutycycles under extreme load.
*[13:28 SLT] Sincere Wasp: yes
*[13:28 SLT] Digo Hynes: with machiminas and pictures i already posted there at twitter one picture from here
*[13:28 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: I tend to use drivers from nvidia themselves, as the omega ones haven't been updated in years, and I've had bad experiances with MS-based ones.
*[13:28 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: Oh fer... had the time change backwards. *blushes* Isn't until later...
*[13:28 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Nooo not a disturbance in the timespace continuum!
*[13:28 SLT] Reed Steamroller: btw, any info on getting voice to work on Linux 64? I still have to run SLvoice.exe in WINE
*[13:28 SLT] Reed Steamroller: ?
*[13:28 SLT] Digo Hynes: http://twitter.com/bigdigo/statuses/1390102692
*[13:29 SLT] Torley Linden: nice pic Digo!
*[13:29 SLT] Reed Steamroller: i had horrible problems with nvidia driver on fedora, what fixed them was going to the offical nvidia driver and not using 3rd party stuff
*[13:29 SLT] Torley Linden: i like the surreal blue tint
*[13:29 SLT] Digo Hynes: it´s yours : )
*[13:29 SLT] Torley Linden: i'm not sure about Linux, i don't use it, Reed... anyone know?
*[13:30 SLT] Shippo Westland: Sorry cant say i do
*[13:30 SLT] Torley Linden: haha oh yeah those WindLight presets :) many happy times making skies
*[13:30 SLT] Reed Steamroller: kk, i've got to scoot, thanks for your help everyone!
*[13:30 SLT] Vista Questi: sabayon linux has worked famously for me in sl from day one
*[13:30 SLT] Torley Linden: that's one of the things i love most when being creative, amassing a huge amount of stuff and really learning through that
*[13:30 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: bye Reed
*[13:30 SLT] Torley Linden: take care Reed! hope things work better soon
*[13:30 SLT] Shippo Westland: bye reed
*[13:30 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Deep Space simulator regions.. someday..
*[13:30 SLT] Torley Linden: Ryu, that's a classic topic of discussion since when i started... i was visiting some Stargate-esque builds recently
*[13:31 SLT] Ryu Darragh: I have some ideas..
*[13:31 SLT] Vista Questi: i changed distros the way some folks (I HOPE) change underwear, but as far as sl is concenred... i think Sabayon is unbreakable. ; )
*[13:31 SLT] Torley Linden: some VERY creative use of megaprim spheres to create environments
*[13:31 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Just not sure where they fit :P
*[13:31 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: Well, I'm daring to run the viewer on openSUSE 11, and seeing what happens...assuming I can sort out my NIC drivers first.
*[13:31 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Torley, can I do a photo of you?
*[13:31 SLT] Vista Questi: oh! torley! im glad u brought that up!
*[13:31 SLT] Judi Newall: Got any LMs Torley pls?
*[13:31 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: of or to.. boh. i don't know xD
*[13:31 SLT] Torley Linden: Judi i think i posted slurls among http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=stargate&w=70285332%40N00&s=rec
*[13:31 SLT] Torley Linden: let me see...
*[13:31 SLT] Vista Questi: I have grave concerns about megaprims crossing sim boundaries.. in ur opinion... just don't ?
*[13:32 SLT] Judi Newall: thanx will look
*[13:32 SLT] Kimala Kohime: i'm on a newer Dell laptop - with an Intel card - SL is just alomst imposiblen ow
*[13:32 SLT] Ryu Darragh: I managed a half arsed effort at making an open sim do a deep space simulation.. no gravity, but full inertia.
*[13:32 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Megaprims weren't intendedv in SL, afaik. Don't trust them to region boundaries
*[13:32 SLT] Shippo Westland: I have not seen the stargates in 2nd life in some time now really
*[13:32 SLT] Torley Linden: that sounds like something we should tackle in an upcoming EXPLODING SECOND LIFE MYTHS! https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/community/tnt/blog/2009/03/18/exploding-second-life-myths-the-intro-post
*[13:32 SLT] Judi Newall: we have a mega that seems stable enough across a border
*[13:32 SLT] Torley Linden: lots of great comments in there about "is it true? is it just a rumor?"
*[13:32 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Hmm
*[13:33 SLT] Torley Linden: simple rule, tho: a prim CANNOT exist in two regions at once. you may fall through the other side, and thus need to reinforce it.
*[13:33 SLT] Ryu Darragh: The problem across borders for any prim is thet it is phantom to the other side until you are handed off into that region
*[13:33 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Looks interesting. I look forward to that series torley.
*[13:33 SLT] Torley Linden: what Ryu said, even better.
*[13:33 SLT] Vista Questi: ty ryu
*[13:33 SLT] Judi Newall: Yeah we added a patch tho
*[13:33 SLT] Torley Linden: it simply *appears* to be intact but when you actually walk over, there ya go... :O
*[13:33 SLT] Torley Linden: a patch ye say?
*[13:33 SLT] Torley Linden: Fred, yeah, if any ideas come up, feel free to add them and Jon Linden will see!
*[13:33 SLT] Judi Newall: an extra prim from the 'far' side
*[13:34 SLT] Vista Questi: i uninentionally set one for an ocean that crossed, and as far as we know was (iin a few hours)
*[13:34 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: You'd fall through, when you change sims, rather than when te chane is appropriate.
*[13:34 SLT] Young Geoffrion: My word!
*[13:34 SLT] Ryu Darragh: So, to build a bridge or road, make TWO identical sections that cross and make sure the root of each is anchored in the other region
*[13:34 SLT] Young Geoffrion: I apologize!
*[13:34 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Problem solved
*[13:34 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: Roads have to e redundant, or you fall through the ground.
*[13:34 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Someone's mic is on :|
*[13:34 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Yeah, indeed. Remember, we know best what can be done with the tools and software we *currently* provide... Anything more (like megaprims, bots, or opensim) is dependent upon whether any of us happens to have taken a personal interest in it outside work :-)
*[13:34 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: might as well just not cross the sim line with a prim, when then other side needs something to reinforce it anyway, you're not saving prims..
*[13:34 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: you can run Second Life with plugins as PAR?
*[13:34 SLT] Vista Questi: lagging the adjecnt sims, the old 'sim argument' thing, before the ... Wonderful Lindens. <G> fixed that part of it
*[13:35 SLT] Torley Linden: *nods in agreement with Jeremy* we like hearing about novel hacking and innovations, but can't officially support it (unless it becomes part of the official viewer code).
*[13:35 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Torley Linden has pinged you.
*[13:35 SLT] Vista Questi: megabridges... to other sims..
*[13:35 SLT] Torley Linden: unsupported stuff is an adventure, it's so very DIY and "at your own risk"
*[13:35 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Like the deformation AOs of the Seawolf dragons and the semi-deformed ones in IoW
*[13:35 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Nah, we need "Star" or Sim gates.
*[13:35 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: There's an armored road, that needs reinforcing.
*[13:35 SLT] Torley Linden: oh Ryu that's one of my faves with Seawolf, BRILLIANT!
*[13:36 SLT] Torley Linden: Ryu, what's IoW stand for?
*[13:36 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Isle of Wyrms
*[13:36 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Wyrm being an old term for Dragon
*[13:36 SLT] Torley Linden: Seawolf has put together such a compelling, amazing package. from the on-site exhibit of their vendors to the burning cabin to the HUDs to the animations that grace those dragons and the many options and the documentation OMG
*[13:36 SLT] Torley Linden: OH yes! i know IoW
*[13:36 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Welcome Sophie!
*[13:36 SLT] Ryu Darragh: I love Dragons, get it ? :P
*[13:36 SLT] Fred Rookstown: The problem with bridges/roads, though, is you fall through the sims land before you get handed over, so you practically have to jump over the borders unless you want to end up underground
*[13:36 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: Hi Dreamin22 :)
*[13:36 SLT] Torley Linden: :D
*[13:37 SLT] Torley Linden: i love a conceptual and cognitive completeness when it comes to making and presenting content
*[13:37 SLT] Ryu Darragh: That's why overlapping redundant bridges on crossings, Fred
*[13:37 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: I couldn't guess, Ryu. ~Smiles~
*[13:37 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: 
*[13:37 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: But that's part of the excitement....falling through roads, etc. Part of the charm.
*[13:37 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Heh. You could make a cheap workaround by creating a gap and a placing a sign that says "JUMP HERE" :-P
*[13:37 SLT] Judi Newall: I had a problem on the estate, someone had searched groups info on the wiki for how to set senior group members with the powers to ban, eject freeze etc, but no matter what they did it wasn't working. Would it be possible to add a note there that unless the land is deeded, then no setting in groups will help?
*[13:37 SLT] Torley Linden: it's incredibly valuable to have both a deep-versed interest in the details AND a broad overview of "how is this thing gonna sell on the market?"
*[13:37 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Each root anchored in the opposite region and extending far enough for handoff
*[13:37 SLT] Collie Lindman: if a linked (scripted) build is "off sim" with it's root in the sim, does it any adverse effect on the sim?
*[13:37 SLT] Torley Linden: one of the first times i got stuck on a region crossing was when riding a tricycle, it went into the asphalt and i was like "WOE IS ME"
*[13:37 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Nope
*[13:37 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: you can run Second Life with plugins as PAR?
*[13:38 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Regions can handle prims off world as long as the root is inworld.. in theory, up to 1024m
*[13:38 SLT] Torley Linden: nah Collie, barring other circumstances of course. but normally i've seen that done to great creative effect, making an illusion that extends beyond the region boundaries
*[13:38 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Yes we have that problem still at the edge of our two sims, Torley
*[13:38 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: What can be done about it?
*[13:38 SLT] Fred Rookstown: I was once on a bus trip across the mainland here, and I can't count how many times we ended up in the ocean or underground :|
*[13:38 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: Okay, I just want to point out that ease of crossing sim boarders with moving objects,, cars, boats planes etc.. was something LL was supposed to be fixing like a year ago.. to make it a smooth transition.. so we wouldn't need to 'jump' when is that going to happen?
*[13:38 SLT] Fred Rookstown: But that's a topic for another meeting I think
*[13:39 SLT] Fred Rookstown: THis is documentation
*[13:39 SLT] Shippo Westland: Well it was nice hearing what everyone had to say but i need to log. good day everyone
*[13:39 SLT] Ryu Darragh: We have that with bridges or pure land trnsitions, don;t we?
*[13:39 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Shippo, good day to you!
*[13:39 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Bye SHippo ;)
*[13:39 SLT] Torley Linden: Fuzzy, someone with insight into physics like Andrew (who has a podcast interview up @ http://blogs.secondlife.com btw!) would know more of the story.
*[13:39 SLT] Shippo Westland: =^.^= bye all
*[13:39 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: bye Shippo
*[13:39 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: Have we documentation, on what to expect on a Sim Crossing Crash? I just filed aJira, that it could be a new feature.
*[13:39 SLT] Torley Linden: region crossing handoffs *should* be better than they were years ago. when i first started, they were noticeably worse.
*[13:39 SLT] Torley Linden: (i started Second Lire in 2004)
*[13:39 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Pfft :P~
*[13:40 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Relog is the way to fix a sim cross crash, imo
*[13:40 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: Okay yes sorry, I went off topic there..
*[13:40 SLT] Torley Linden: Andrew has literally done rocket science, re: physics of megaprims and other topics of interest, you REALLY gotta look up his forum posts, GREAT stuff
*[13:40 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: I remember "falling" through sim crossings a lot when I first started... not so much now.
*[13:40 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: So at present there is no "tip or trick" to help with problem sim crossings? :D
*[13:40 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: Going through the Wall, you still fall into the floor, quite a bit
*[13:40 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Just relog if you crash.
*[13:41 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: I do appreciate some area owners posting signs for Sim crossings.
*[13:41 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Well that's a given Fred - just wondered if there was a way of approaching it to minimise the effect
*[13:41 SLT] Ryu Darragh: As I said, make prim transitions overlapping redundant and they'll be better
*[13:41 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: sorry Ryu I missed that
*[13:41 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Jump over it, fly, whatever.
*[13:41 SLT] Torley Linden: those "sim crossing signs" are a great cultural joke
*[13:41 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: flying is still a problem
*[13:41 SLT] Ryu Darragh: For a bridge, make 2 identical except the root is at opposite ends
*[13:41 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: juming I havent tried lol
*[13:42 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Don't fly too fast, though
*[13:42 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Overlap then and anchor the root at each end
*[13:42 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: We need an SL department of transportation to inspect and certify SIM and other dangerous transportation points. :-)
*[13:42 SLT] Ryu Darragh: In the opposite regions
*[13:42 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: I think what happens is that it needs to connect to the next sim, and disconnect from the previous sim. Maybe that's why, but it's just a theory.
*[13:42 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Or you'll end up not being handed over
*[13:42 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Ok, I go... Thanks very much for all ;)
*[13:42 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: You should put sim crossing signs in the library.. :p lol
*[13:42 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Definitely
*[13:42 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: Bye Panta
*[13:42 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Have a good night or day ;)
*[13:42 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: You too!
*[13:42 SLT] Ryu Darragh: The prim on the region you are headed to is phantom to you until you are handed off
*[13:43 SLT] TheBlackNightPanta Galaxy: Thanks Tour! You too
*[13:43 SLT] Spunke Slade: im curious to know why every time i run SL recently, im still not releasing memory, im running at 85% Physical Mem usage right now with only SL running, any suggestions? BTW i have 2 gb ram
*[13:43 SLT] Ryu Darragh: So, if the bridge extends far enough to hand you off, you need a bridge on the other side because the old bridge has just become phantom to you
*[13:43 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: That sounds right.
*[13:44 SLT] Fred Rookstown: 32bit or 64bit?
*[13:44 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: Is there a Wiki on Memory Leaks?
*[13:44 SLT] Spunke Slade: 32
*[13:44 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Been using that trick since Sept 2006
*[13:44 SLT] Fred Rookstown: AFAIK, 32bit doesn't even use the full 2GB
*[13:44 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: colton are you blowing a big cloud next to me?
*[13:44 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Well said, Ryu. That's an essential trick for anyone building cross-sim.
*[13:45 SLT] Ryu Darragh: A tutorial!
*[13:45 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Hahahaha...
*[13:45 SLT] Torley Linden: i did a video quicktip on it awhile ago, yes, because it was good to know :D
*[13:45 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Heh. I used to work for a company that did mobile phone data networking... it's interesting that there are similar handoff concepts to deal with here :-)
*[13:45 SLT] Torley Linden: hahaha
*[13:46 SLT] Ryu Darragh: I do mesh and small system networking, so it gets.. odd, doesn't it :P
*[13:46 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Jeremy....that's a very interesting thought. I totally agree!
*[13:46 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Dreamin22 Nitely has pinged you.
*[13:46 SLT] Torley Linden: i love parallels between careers
*[13:46 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: SL is one big IRC, so some similarietis will happen
*[13:46 SLT] Fred Rookstown: ... One of the couches is for sale?
*[13:46 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Hahahha
*[13:46 SLT] Torley Linden: http://vodpod.com/watch/937913-stop-falling-through-floors?pod=secondlife was the "Stop falling through floors" re: region handoffs i did.
*[13:46 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Reminds me of the collaborative 3D CAD work I did for Summagraphics years ago..
*[13:46 SLT] Jeremy Linden: The creator left the click-action that way, apparently.
*[13:47 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Hmm. </Off-topic>
*[13:47 SLT] Torley Linden: click actions are incredibly useful but have a few oddities, e.g., they can't be copied! :( you need to reapply it to each object
*[13:47 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: "Objec does not appear to be for sale." It should bea matter of resetting the root prim
*[13:47 SLT] Jeremy Linden: If I had mod permissions on it :-)
*[13:48 SLT] Dave Urriah: Regarding the Sim Crossing, could you engineer it so that if your in a reagion of a couple of meters of the edge of a sim, you are automatically linked to your current sim and the one adjasent to you?
*[13:48 SLT] Torley Linden: i'm tempted to ring up Jamay Greene and let him know!
*[13:48 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: I doubt the documentation team could do that.
*[13:48 SLT] Dave Urriah: That would be less expensive (computing wise) then linking to all 8 sims.
*[13:48 SLT] Tourmaline Falken didnt think people said "ring up" any more ;)
*[13:49 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Problem of concurancy, I bet. You'd have 2 instances of the same person
*[13:49 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Yeah, in regards to failed handovers, it would be nice to be shoved back to the sim you were on, but again, that's the topic for whoever handles the sim stuff.
*[13:49 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: Look through the Jira, and ask Andrew tommorrow at 5PM
*[13:49 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Dave, that sounds similar to the mobile phone idea. I don't know if any Linden here has the technical knowledge to respond in a meaningful way, though :-/
*[13:49 SLT] Torley Linden: yeah Dave, i'd save that one for Andrew :)
*[13:50 SLT] Torley Linden: there were a number of ideas which sounded good but weren't technically feasible and i'm sure Andrew could help shed light on that
*[13:50 SLT] Vista Questi: ty torley and ryu. one bridge solution and one megaprim info thing!
*[13:50 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: Sounds a lot like a proximity alarm. ~Smiles~
*[13:50 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: It might actually be solved with a Cell Phone Algorhythm
*[13:50 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: 
*[13:50 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Open question for the Lindens: Have some of the other tech groups of SL considered having an open forum like this to answer questions more relating to their field? I know may people find these Documentation sessions invaluable and helpful!
*[13:51 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: most of these ways aren't feasable it would drive up hardware resource use and bandwidth use which isn't something people want to happen.. not people who are here to make money anyway..
*[13:51 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Actually, Marching Arny problem.. handling handoffs that fail and don't at the same time..
*[13:51 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: Now if anyone could tell me why I get those blank "sends" all the time I'd love to hear it. It happens all the time regardless of what computer or router I use!
*[13:51 SLT] Vista Questi: even if it's never documentation that we discuss! ^_^
*[13:51 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: HAhahah
*[13:51 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Office_Hours
*[13:51 SLT] Vista Questi: never met a fur who could stay on topic, it's good to see that others are like that, too. ;)
*[13:51 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Dreamin22, many Lindens hold office hours similar to this one. Arawn just pasted the link to our wiki page.
*[13:52 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Oh, cool. Thanks.
*[13:52 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: a "fur"?
*[13:52 SLT] Jeremy Linden: There are also some Resident groups who teach classes; you should be able to search for them under "events" in the Search tool.
*[13:52 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Furry. The things looking like 2-legged dogs etc
*[13:52 SLT] Ryu Darragh: That's one kind of furry
*[13:52 SLT] Vista Questi: not always anthro, but we digress. ^_^
*[13:52 SLT] Jeremy Linden still thinks of furries as a cross-breed between anime and mascots.
*[13:53 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Hehe
*[13:53 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Two more kinds of furries :P
*[13:53 SLT] Torley Linden: Dreamin22, thrilled you feel that way about us. also, when we aren't inworld, we're sharing knowledge on our blogs: http://blogs.secondlife.com
*[13:53 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Eh, it's a touchy subject.
*[13:53 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: Animascot?
*[13:53 SLT] Torley Linden: "blog" is just a funny shortening for "weblog", or "internet diary" ;)
*[13:53 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: I know what furries are, yes....I just did not understand the reference
*[13:53 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Ah, ok.
*[13:53 SLT] Jeremy Linden: That is to say, I've got nothing against them!
*[13:53 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Neko.. Cat Girls
*[13:54 SLT] Vista Questi: i'm sorry if i distracted. lol bascially furry is 'yes' u can be that, whatever it is. ; O)
*[13:54 SLT] Fred Rookstown: In other news, I despise the new blog layout :(
*[13:54 SLT] Torley Linden: haha Jeremy from my own experiences i can assure you there is truth in that.
*[13:54 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Torley Linden has pinged you.
*[13:54 SLT] Vista Questi: ttfn, i have a call to another meetin, sorry if i distracted,
*[13:54 SLT] Torley Linden: Fred, more details please! point us to something you prefer more?
*[13:54 SLT] Colton Linden: take care everyone, I have to run :)
*[13:54 SLT] Vista Questi: torley so GREAT to see u inworld again!
*[13:54 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: Torley... I would like to suggest some documentation
*[13:54 SLT] Fred Rookstown: THe wordpress was fine, as everything was right there on the front page
*[13:54 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: if I can start a new topic
*[13:54 SLT] Ryu Darragh: Fair winds, Colton.
*[13:54 SLT] Judi Newall: how about wiki documentation, I have a question on that?
*[13:54 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Fred, do any particular blogs stand out as better or worse than the others?
*[13:54 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: If there should be any intolerance to different people. I think we should all be intolerant to Torley because he's too bright.. thats it. I'm starting the anti-bright coalition. heh
*[13:54 SLT] Torley Linden: GREAT t o see you too Vista =D
*[13:54 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Thanks. I'm a big fan of what you all do and how you all communicate. I have just noticed other times when topics are brought up better addressed by other groups. I'm really glad the other SL teams have office hours too. I feel at home here though. ;-)
*[13:55 SLT] Arawn Spitteler grants sophiwe the privilege of starteing an On-topic
*[13:55 SLT] Torley Linden: Fred, ahh you can get a feed that shows ALL posts if that's what you prefer.
*[13:55 SLT] Vista Questi: I' just jealous
*[13:55 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Judi, we can try our best to address wiki questions, but again, we don't often directly work with it.
*[13:55 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Jeremy: it's just that one has to dig through categories to find what you want
*[13:55 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Fred Rookstown has pinged you.
*[13:55 SLT] Torley Linden: http://feeds2.feedburner.com/lindenlabALL
*[13:55 SLT] Vista Questi: when he sleeps, i hope to eat his brain, if he's nearby. :D
*[13:55 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Thanks, torley
*[13:55 SLT] Torley Linden: that has EVERYTHING from our blog, easiest to read in a Feed Reader like Google Reader
*[13:55 SLT] Vista Questi: tt!
*[13:55 SLT] Torley Linden: the question of "too much info vs. too little and how to balance, find, organize, and make sense of it all" is always on our minds and hearts
*[13:55 SLT] Torley Linden: hahahaha Vista
*[13:55 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Maybe I'm just a luddite, but thanks.
*[13:56 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: Torley, the newbies need info on where to start fast..
*[13:56 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: how to start
*[13:56 SLT] Torley Linden: oh no worries Fred, some of this stuff weirded me out at first but it's often a matter of giving it time...
*[13:56 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Agreed. That topic was mentioned last week too.
*[13:56 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: hey wonder around.... they need more of a road map
*[13:56 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: *they
*[13:57 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: please offer more documentation for newbies
*[13:57 SLT] Torley Linden: Sophie, definitely a high priority for many groups @ LL that can be broken down in a number of ways. we're of course focused on better instructions and guides to get started. other teams are working on changing the UI, making it easier to learn about SL from other sources, etc.
*[13:57 SLT] Jeremy Linden: We're making a company-wide effort to help improve that experience, Sophie.
*[13:57 SLT] Ryu Darragh: http://www.wimp.com/twittertrouble/
*[13:57 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Heh. And Torley beat me to it.
*[13:57 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: once they are here, we want them TO STAY
*[13:57 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: and they leave
*[13:57 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: Speaking of Fur, and speaking of newbs looking for a start.. Why has the fur been removed from the starting avatar options? will there be an attempt to give easy access to a new free furry avatar? in some way shape or form?
*[13:57 SLT] Torley Linden: it can be very useful to focus on specifics -- where little changes make a big difference, Sophie.
*[13:57 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: no guys, no...don't pass the buck
*[13:57 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: please
*[13:57 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Wasn't there a dragon av as a choice of the newbie avs?
*[13:58 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: No Furry? Ugh!!!
*[13:58 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: Go ahewad, Sophie
*[13:58 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: listen... someone has to do this..have you taken a survey to see how many people start SL , only to never go back?
*[13:58 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: ahead...
*[13:58 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: it is too hard to 90% of people to do without support
*[13:58 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Uh, the Dragonlet av is still there in the library.
*[13:58 SLT] Jeremy Linden: Sophie, we're not passing the buck; we're doing our part, but it's part of a larger, longer-term effort. We can't change the world overnight :-)
*[13:58 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: I would think that logistically, it would be a difficult survey to get answers to
*[13:58 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: then connect Jeremy, with those that WANT to help
*[13:58 SLT] WidgetHUD v1.2 (Mono): Sophie Wellesley has pinged you.
*[13:58 SLT] Ryu Darragh: There's a free Dragonlet.. a baby dragon, in the library
*[13:58 SLT] Torley Linden: and Sophie, re: surveys, YES, we have, several times. and the *specific* data from that we've acted on.
*[13:59 SLT] Torley Linden: i appreciate your sentiment to "help" but it's *essential* to go into further details than that.
*[13:59 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: There does need to be more...well, advertising of some of the "newbie help" groups that are availible.
*[13:59 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: No library reference to Fur. What's Alexandria Linden thinking of?
*[13:59 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: ok, specifics...when new people come on line, give them a notecard for where tutorials are
*[13:59 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: give them clothes
*[13:59 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Arawn: Dragonlet av under Clothing.
*[13:59 SLT] Judi Newall: Excuse me folks, see you again!
*[13:59 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: give them LMs
*[13:59 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: and a MENTOR
*[13:59 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: A newbie starter pack, essentially
*[14:00 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: Dragonet is a Scaley
*[14:00 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: I like that!
*[14:00 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: hook up with Educator
*[14:00 SLT] Ryu Darragh: I have over 50 free avatars, including the ones originally in the library, available where I habg out
*[14:00 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: *educators
*[14:00 SLT] Courteous Avedon: Build a sim where you teach things like "sitting" "walking" "talking"
*[14:00 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Beggars can't be choosers?
*[14:00 SLT] Torley Linden: Sophie, what you mention sounds just like what Mentors do. it has worked in concentrated pockets but isn't the most scalable, since there are many different preferences and needs. however, i do agree we can make the Knowledge Base more visible on the website from the get-go.
*[14:00 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: please, educators would love to help do this
*[14:00 SLT] Ryu Darragh: In fact, the very Chester Ringtail and others..
*[14:00 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: Torley, we are talking about 200 people at most in a day, it is Scaleable, I do it RL ..
*[14:00 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: Nod- I bet ISTE would love to help with that.
*[14:00 SLT] Torley Linden: there are a number of ideas which WERE tried but are no longer done because they didn't expand well.
*[14:00 SLT] Fuzzy Mocha: Another meeting to go to ttfn.
*[14:00 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: you need a plan from someone that does it
*[14:01 SLT] Torley Linden: no, we have far more than 200 people a day.
*[14:01 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: Sitting, Walking and Talking is at Orientation Island, isn't it?
*[14:01 SLT] Courteous Avedon: ah oh
*[14:01 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: it is possible
*[14:01 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: ISTE?
*[14:01 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: yes, ISTE woudl do it
*[14:01 SLT] Dreamin22 Nitely: I'll help.
*[14:01 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: NCM
*[14:01 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: What ISTE?
*[14:01 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: Int'l Societty for Technology in Education
*[14:01 SLT] Courteous Avedon: But does the orientation exclude distracting griefests
*[14:01 SLT] Fred Rookstown: <OT>Great, another steam u[pdate.</OT>
*[14:01 SLT] Courteous Avedon: *orientation island
*[14:01 SLT] Collie Lindman: hate to mention it but openlife (spits over his shoulder) has picture help boards at their start places
*[14:01 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: oyu have 60,000 on at any one time, and more than 200 at any one time are new,
*[14:02 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: that is my gues
*[14:02 SLT] Torley Linden: Sophie, you feel strongly about this and that's great -- i'd encourage you to mine the archives of what we've already tried before (like Greeters), programmes that had their time and place. it's possible some of them will be revisited in a greater form, but important to be well-familiar with our history.
*[14:02 SLT] Kate Linden: If you go to Help > tutorial there is a window showing basics like walking , flying etc.
*[14:02 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: just looking at stats
*[14:02 SLT] Ryu Darragh: There are private help/orientation/intro places going up all over.
*[14:02 SLT] Fred Rookstown: OpenLife's WA is horrible.
*[14:02 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: then send it to me
*[14:02 SLT] Fred Rookstown: I can't find a way to get out of it
*[14:02 SLT] Kate Linden: This window is automatically open upon first login.
*[14:02 SLT] Jaymes Kjeller: OpenLife is horrible, full stop.
*[14:02 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: I do feel strongly about it
*[14:02 SLT] Collie Lindman: lol fred
*[14:02 SLT] Torley Linden: Sophie, much of it is on public record, like http://forums.secondlife.com :)
*[14:02 SLT] Torley Linden: search and ye shall find
*[14:02 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: I think it is too easy for people to sit back and say "it has been dont" or "it is not my job"
*[14:03 SLT] Arawn Spitteler: BeforeSearching, find your butt.
*[14:03 SLT] Torley Linden: there are some Resis who are like walking history books, more than content to detail what has happened before
*[14:03 SLT] Jeremy Linden: If you'd like to discuss volunteering in detail with someone who has answers, Lexie Linden appears to be the Linden to ask. We'd love suggestions about what you'd like to see from our written teaching tools, though.
*[14:03 SLT] Courteous Avedon: Yes Kate, that sentence must shout to the newbie "go to Help > Tutorial...
*[14:03 SLT] Courteous Avedon: :-))
*[14:03 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: all the while, the newbies come once, enter, and leave
*[14:04 SLT] Courteous Avedon: I have heard that it takes 20 hours to become a basic well function avatar (rough estimate)
*[14:04 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Well, then, ask the newbies WHY.
*[14:04 SLT] Courteous Avedon: *functioning
*[14:04 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: and, I do know what I am talking about, I teach SL
*[14:04 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: to educators
*[14:04 SLT] Stev Spiegel: in that avatar? wow!
*[14:04 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Like, have a survey pop up if they leave after their first login.
*[14:04 SLT] Sophie Wellesley: what I am saying is that we dont want them to leave
*[14:04 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: So that begs the question, Sophie- why are they l;eaving? There is a decent starting help available on first log in, and people are usually pretty cool with helpif asked, in my experience...
*[14:04 SLT] Kate Linden: It was great seeing everyone this week. I have to take off. See you next week and thanks for your conversation. :)
*[14:04 SLT] Young Geoffrion: Many come as curious spectators, without an intention to saty in the first place.
*[14:04 SLT] Ryu Darragh: We have a pretty good retention rate for newbies that come to IoW, but, then they know more about what to expect having been coached before ever going to SecondLife.com
*[14:05 SLT] Courteous Avedon: There will be a whole new group of newbies if there is a method to have interop between worlds
*[14:05 SLT] Young Geoffrion: *stay
*[14:05 SLT] Torley Linden: oh wow 2:04 already!
*[14:05 SLT] Fred Rookstown: Yeah, time flies.
*[14:05 SLT] Tourmaline Falken: .. when youre having fun
*[14:05 SLT] Torley Linden: we're having fun alright hehe
*[14:05 SLT] Arawn Spitteler imagines starting newbies in Panda Avatars, with food and gun, that he Eats, Shoots and Leaves.
*[14:05 SLT] Collie Lindman: adverse publicity sophie. 50% of all the newbies i've helped had one question "where's the free sex?"
*[14:05 SLT] Ryu Darragh pictures the Dali-esque flies with clock bodies..
*[14:05 SLT] Alasen Chaparral: LOL Collie
*[14:05 SLT] Collie Lindman: happens everytime a newspaper comes with an article
*[14:06 SLT] Jeremy Linden cuts here for the transcript.
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