Beta Server Office Hours/Minutes/2010-09-23

Category:Beta Server Office Hours - Minutes
This meeting was held on September 23rd, 2010
= Agenda =
=== Discuss resolution of previous open items ===
=== Updates ===
Second Life Server 10.9.10.210079 is on the full grid
* How does it look?
* Any major issues?
BlueSteel 10.09.21.210146 is live
* https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Beta/BlueSteel
* How does it look?
* Any major issues?
* Reports of increased TPV crash rates.
** Can anyone corroborate?
LeTigre regions are getting corralled today
* https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Beta/LeTigre
* We might get an RC here next week.
Effective Beta Testing in the NWO
* What is ADITI used for now?
* How does that affect you?
* How can you help?
The Simulator Console
* What is it?
* What does it do?
* When can we expect it?
** Soon™
* What do you want it to do?
=== Releases ===
* Second Life Server 10.9.10.210079 went into production this week.
* BlueSteel 10.09.21.210146 RC is live
** https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Beta/BlueSteel
=== Any other business ===
What you want to talk about goes here
Is the password change Aditi account update working? I've been waiting 6 days for an update to get my passwords in sync.
= Meeting Minutes =
= Transcript =
Transcript of Oskar Linden's Beta Server Office Hour for September 23rd, 2010:
* [15:02] Lares Carter: heya oskar
* [15:02] XLR8RRICK Hudson: Greetings
* [15:02] Gooden Uggla: hiya oskar
* [15:02] Oskar Linden: hi hi
* [15:03] Sigma Avro: cant join group, am already in
* [15:03] Sigma Avro: nice object asking to join
* [15:03] Oskar Linden: what's playing the music? :-p
* [15:05] Oskar Linden: ok ok how do you do sound beacons in vwr 2 *sigh*
* [15:05] Rex Cronon: greetings everybody
* [15:05] XLR8RRICK Hudson: I dont hear any music or sounds
* [15:05] Flynn Tigerpaw: I wish the menus were easier to read.. don't
* [15:05] Flynn Tigerpaw: know
* [15:06] Oskar Linden: is it just me then?
* [15:06] XLR8RRICK Hudson: Takes Oskars temperature
* [15:06] Lares Carter: i dont hear music either
* [15:06] Oskar Linden: something around here is playing music
* [15:07] Jonathan Yap: Can't you show beacons for music?
* [15:07] XLR8RRICK Hudson: I see no Sound Beacons
* [15:07] Flynn Tigerpaw: there is sound sources beacon in 1.23
* [15:07] Ovaltine Constantine: Could it be media?
* [15:07] Lares Carter: i dont see any close sound sources with beacons
* [15:07] Flynn Tigerpaw: turning mine on
* [15:07] Oskar Linden: aha
* [15:08] Oskar Linden: it was ansi!
* [15:08] Sigma Avro: it is media Oskar
* [15:09] Rex Cronon: do u also see dead people:)
* [15:09] Oskar Linden: i'll figure it out later
* [15:09] Oskar Linden: at least I made it stop
* [15:10] Oskar Linden: and only 10 minutes after the hour *sigh*
* [15:10] Rickk Turbo: not late am I?
* [15:10] Oskar Linden: nope
* [15:10] Rickk Turbo: good
* [15:10] Rickk Turbo: :)
* [15:10] Oskar Linden: ok where was I
* [15:10] Oskar Linden: the agenda!
* [15:10] Oskar Linden: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Beta_Server_Office_Hours
* [15:10] Gooden Uggla: `*`WooT`*`
* [15:11] Oskar Linden: alright uhm so
* [15:11] Oskar Linden: Second Life Server 10.9.10.210079 is on the full grid
* [15:12] Oskar Linden: our first RC made it through the week
* [15:12] Oskar Linden: so it got promoted to a production release
* [15:12] Oskar Linden: seems to have worked
* [15:12] Oskar Linden: the enxt day we put out a new RC onto the BlueSteel Channel
* [15:12] Oskar Linden: BlueSteel 10.09.21.210146
* [15:13] Oskar Linden: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Beta/BlueSteel not on that there
* [15:13] Oskar Linden: * Simulator crash modes
* * Improvements to the Region Conductor[1]] 
* This helps down regions come back up more quickly.
* * Modifications to deploy tools to support Release Candidates
* [15:13] Conover's Flight-Helper: 6.3.3 (WEAR ME!): Flight-helper is ready and operational.
* [15:13] Oskar Linden: among other fixes
* [15:14] Sigma Avro: and whish are these ; those regions on a sim host that has room for it
* [15:14] Oskar Linden: what?
* [15:15] Oskar Linden: i don't understand the question
* [15:15] Sigma Avro: the region conductos ? Will load other sims ?
* [15:15] Oskar Linden: the region conductor does a lot. it's not new
* [15:16] Lares Carter: were there any changes that could impact sim performance? i have seen slightly better FPS
* [15:16] Oskar Linden: possibly, but nothing targetting that specifically
* [15:16] Sigma Avro: ye, I am speakin the link [1
* [15:16] Oskar Linden: some bug fixes
* [15:17] Oskar Linden: simhosts can only run a few regions. when that simhost is full it can't start up a new region. the region conductor finds a free simhost
* [15:17] Oskar Linden: is all that it is saying
* [15:17] Sigma Avro: ok, but what is a sim host ?
* [15:18] Gooden Uggla: server
* [15:18] Oskar Linden: a host for the simulators
* [15:18] Sigma Avro: I eman servers dedicated to this, or other sims ?
* [15:18] Oskar Linden: a box in a server room
* [15:18] Oskar Linden: I'm not really followin gyour questions Sigma
* [15:19] Gooden Uggla: TPV crash rates are up on blue steel?
* [15:19] Oskar Linden: so they say
* [15:19] Oskar Linden: I have no more info
* [15:19] Rickk Turbo: i can't i've experienced any crashes myself
* [15:19] Rickk Turbo: no more than the regular servers
* [15:19] Marigold Devin: I'm not crashing on Phoenix on main grid.
* [15:19] Oskar Linden: ok
* [15:19] Gooden Uggla: i only crrash at oz's meeting ... hmm...
* [15:19] Oskar Linden: I don't know what is going on there
* [15:20] Marigold Devin: I think there is a certain amount of hysteria. Negativity.
* [15:20] Oskar Linden: in SL?!
* [15:20] Oskar Linden: no!
* [15:20] Marigold Devin: haha sorry I state the obvious.
* [15:20] Oskar Linden: say it isn't so
* [15:20] Oskar Linden: so we just keep steaming right along
* [15:20] Bronson Blackadder: I havent noticed any crashes on any tpv
* [15:20] Bronson Blackadder: yet
* [15:20] Oskar Linden: we are setting up our second RC channel LeTigre
* [15:20] Oskar Linden: Lil is sectioning off some servers from the rest of the herd
* [15:21] Oskar Linden: roping em in
* [15:21] Oskar Linden: and branding them LeTigre
* [15:21] Oskar Linden: he'll be done later today
* [15:21] Marigold Devin: Hence your lovely tiger themed outfit?
* [15:21] Oskar Linden: yeah. u like that?
* [15:21] Marigold Devin: Love it more than I ever loved Undertaker Colman ;-)
* [15:21] Bronson Blackadder: stunning Oskar
* [15:21] Jonathan Yap: Here are some terms defined (most people write "sim" when they really are referring to a "region") 
* [15:21] Gooden Uggla: it's nicely weird, yup :)
* [15:22] Flynn Tigerpaw: I have land on both RC's, the "Running a different server Version" messages are driving me nuts
* [15:22] Oskar Linden: textured it myself! can you tell?
* [15:22] Flynn Tigerpaw: when I cross the boundries
* [15:22] Marigold Devin: haha looks like how I would texture it.
* [15:22] Marigold Devin: Random
* [15:22] Marigold Devin: quirky
* [15:22] Oskar Linden: anyway
* [15:22] Bronson Blackadder: now all you need is a bass guitar and you can be in Kiss
* [15:23] Flynn Tigerpaw: Is there a way to turn that message off?
* [15:23] Oskar Linden: barring any unforeseen issues we will push this bluesteel to the main grid next Tuesday
* [15:23] Sigma Avro: dont think so Flynn
* [15:23] Oskar Linden: then wednesday we will get a new bluesteel and probably a letigre release
* [15:23] Jonathan Yap: Flynn, compile your own viewer?
* [15:23] Jonathan Yap: That would be a nice debug setting actually
* [15:24] Flynn Tigerpaw: lol I guess the moral of the story is don't buy mainland on both sides of a sim crossing
* [15:24] Oskar Linden: this stuff is moving fast. it's hard to keep track of it all
* [15:24] Marigold Devin: That was my line in the script o.O
* [15:24] Oskar Linden: you mean the server message on region crossings/tp?
* [15:24] Flynn Tigerpaw: yes
* [15:24] Oskar Linden: I can bring up that idea
* [15:25] Sigma Avro: nice to have new releases, but what new they have ? I expect the answer : bug fixesnice to have new relaeases, but what new ? I expect answer = bug fixes
* [15:25] Rickk Turbo: can that not be supressed?
* [15:25] Flynn Tigerpaw: is it even needed?
* [15:25] Gooden Uggla: it tell you when your sim becomes a pilot
* [15:25] Rickk Turbo: im not even sure why I need to know if I'm crossing into a different version
* [15:25] Oskar Linden: I'll talk about it with the team
* [15:26] Flynn Tigerpaw: great!
* [15:26] Rickk Turbo: would be nice if the SL client has a debug setting
* [15:26] Oskar Linden: it's a good point
* [15:26] Rickk Turbo: to stop it
* [15:26] Gooden Uggla: in the past, server versions have broken content, probably not as necessary now
* [15:27] Oskar Linden: so... let me know if the new BlueSteel starts acting up this weekend
* [15:27] Oskar Linden: it should be fine
* [15:27] Oskar Linden: that brings me to the topic "Effective Beta Testing in the NWO"
* [15:27] Gooden Uggla: when is all of adita going to be on channels?
* [15:27] Oskar Linden: NWOP being New World Order
* [15:27] Oskar Linden: ADITI is quickly losing relevence
* [15:27] Oskar Linden: it will evolve into something else
* [15:28] Oskar Linden: the old way of doing things was beta testing a new server version on ADITI for months
* [15:28] Oskar Linden: it made sense to have lots of sim s and residents here
* [15:28] XLR8RRICK Hudson: The Bilderberg Group is here ?
* [15:28] Gooden Uggla: i was going to build out testing stations for thre versions as they came thru, i guess that saves me the trouble
* [15:28] Sigma Avro: new release = new what Oskar ? Can you tell a few words about it ?
* [15:29] Rex Cronon: so, what will happen with this grid?
* [15:29] Oskar Linden: we're still working it out
* [15:29] Oskar Linden: this grid will be used from a project pov
* [15:29] Oskar Linden: testing specific projects
* [15:29] Jonathan Yap: How many sims are in this grid?
* [15:29] Oskar Linden: like tcmalloc
* [15:29] Gooden Uggla: is TCMalloc going to get released?
* [15:30] Oskar Linden: it is
* [15:30] Oskar Linden: soon(tm)
* [15:30] Oskar Linden: my guess is October
* [15:30] Gooden Uggla: nice
* [15:30] Oskar Linden: it's being finished up
* [15:30] Oskar Linden: it'll be ready for an AGNI RC soon
* [15:30] Oskar Linden: when that happens most likely it'll be the next week
* [15:31] XLR8RRICK Hudson: sim3007.aditi.lindenlab.com (216.82.16.126:13001)
* tcmalloc-beta 1.43.0.209706 How is it running here?
* [15:31] Oskar Linden: not the latest code
* [15:31] Oskar Linden: that tcmalloc was from our old process
* [15:32] Oskar Linden: going forward ADITI will be used to smoke test projects
* [15:32] Oskar Linden: this smoke testing will be done by an outside vendor
* [15:32] Oskar Linden: probably in small ahndfuls of regions
* [15:32] Jonathan Yap: Will you still want us residents to help with testing?
* [15:32] Oskar Linden: the code moves so fast it's hard to do full grid testing with residents
* [15:32] Oskar Linden: yes. certainly. but it will happen on a per project basis
* [15:33] Oskar Linden: kind of like the pileons we've been doing the last few weeks
* [15:33] Oskar Linden: a developer representative comes to my OH to talk about his/her new project
* [15:33] Lares Carter: will aditi still be available for residents 24/7?
* [15:33] Oskar Linden: then we do coordinated feature specific tests
* [15:33] Oskar Linden: aditi will still be here
* [15:33] Gooden Uggla: what about this sounds familiar? oh yeah, V2 development...
* [15:33] Oskar Linden: but it has to be the testing ground for any number of upcoming projects
* [15:34] Flynn Tigerpaw: aditi is very useful for developing animations, etc....
* [15:34] XLR8RRICK Hudson: What about transperency
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: I'm willing to let you continue to use aditi for however you need
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: but aditi isn't what aditi was
* [15:34] Oskar Linden: this brings me to the next agenda item
* [15:35] Oskar Linden: The Simulator Console
* [15:35] Oskar Linden: I've chatted ebfore about this
* [15:35] Oskar Linden: and we have a base proof of concept working that I've messed around with
* [15:36] Oskar Linden: the idea is to more quickly allow new features be made accessible to estate managers without having to wait for web or vwr deploys
* [15:36] Oskar Linden: lemme see here. I have a screenshot
* [15:36] Oskar Linden: load, load, load
* [15:37] Oskar Linden: come on inventory
* [15:37] Rickk Turbo: lol
* [15:37] Flynn Tigerpaw: loading...
* [15:37] Rickk Turbo: no URL?
* [15:37] Oskar Linden: there we go
* [15:37] Oskar Linden: that's me
* [15:37] Oskar Linden: using the simulator console out on a dev grid
* [15:37] Oskar Linden: CTRL - SHIFT - ~ invokes it
* [15:37] Oskar Linden: gives you access to GET and SET variables
* [15:38] Oskar Linden: if you are a region owner or Estate Manager
* [15:38] Oskar Linden: it's super handy
* [15:38] Oskar Linden: but not deeply integrated yet
* [15:38] Oskar Linden: we're still playing around with how much control to give it
* [15:39] Oskar Linden: most likely it will not take over items that are already in the UI
* [15:39] Oskar Linden: not sure
* [15:39] Oskar Linden: one good idea is the ability to stop a region restart
* [15:40] Oskar Linden: like in the middle of a rolling restart and you have a critical meeting and get the 5 minute warning you could cancel it
* [15:40] Sigma Avro: have sim file would be nice. I have never seen such a file
* [15:40] Oskar Linden: what?
* [15:40] Sigma Avro: infos on sim
* [15:41] Gooden Uggla: we had that before, a 1 hour delay
* [15:41] Gooden Uggla: was taken out last year
* [15:41] Oskar Linden: this is only going to be for estate managers and region owners
* [15:41] Sigma Avro: sure
* [15:41] Oskar Linden: I do not know when this will be available.
* [15:41] Oskar Linden: most likely the server portion will go out before the vwr part
* [15:42] Lares Carter: it looks like some awesome feature to have
* [15:42] Marigold Devin: Particularly good on the roleplaying sims
* [15:42] Oskar Linden: I'm real excited for this feature
* [15:42] Oskar Linden: because it gives EM's the ability to do a lot
* [15:42] Gooden Uggla: yup, very cool
* [15:42] Oskar Linden: the ability I am pushing for is choosing your RC Channel
* [15:42] Oskar Linden: like
* [15:42] Oskar Linden: SET RC_Channel BlueSteel
* [15:42] Oskar Linden: then restart and you are on BlueSteel
* [15:43] Sigma Avro: oh! nice
* [15:43] Oskar Linden: 1 EM could test all the different upcoming changes on AGNI
* [15:43] Oskar Linden: then go back to the production channel
* [15:43] Gooden Uggla: nice:0
* [15:43] Gooden Uggla: will this be on aditi too?
* [15:43] Oskar Linden: still working on that
* [15:43] Oskar Linden: it _could_ be on ADITI
* [15:44] Oskar Linden: we'll see
* [15:44] Oskar Linden: stuff on aditi is even more confusing though
* [15:44] Gooden Uggla: i'll build out test sets if it is
* [15:44] Lares Carter: heya Maestro
* [15:44] Maestro Linden: hey guys, sorry I'm late
* [15:44] Oskar Linden: hey maestro
* [15:44] Oskar Linden: we're talking about the sim console
* [15:44] Rex Cronon: hi
* [15:44] Maestro LindenMaestro: Linden got caught up in some weird bug
* [15:44] Oskar Linden: I took sekrit pics
* [15:45] Maestro Linden: cool
* [15:45] Oskar Linden: here's what I need from you guys
* [15:45] Oskar Linden: and I present this with a HUGE caveat
* [15:46] Oskar Linden: fully assume that nothing you ask for will get implemented :-)
* [15:46] Bronson Blackadder: lol
* [15:46] Oskar Linden: "what would you like to see the simulator console do?"
* [15:46] Sigma Avro: used to, hehe
* [15:46] Amilia Zabaleta: wow
* [15:46] Oskar Linden: in the most perfect world of your dreams
* [15:46] Rickk Turbo: C:\>
* [15:46] Rickk Turbo: heh
* [15:46] Gooden Uggla: hmm...
* [15:47] Sigma Avro: see sim file at sim crashes, other sims on same server, data flow rates from sim to other szervers
* [15:47] Maestro Linden: set simFPS 100
* [15:47] Bronson Blackadder: return neighbors overhanging prims from off of your land
* [15:47] Jonathan Yap: See top scripts accurately
* [15:47] Lares Carter: kick & ban might be handy
* [15:47] Rex Cronon: maybe u should ask sim owners and EMs? i am neither so i can;t help
* [15:47] Oskar Linden: kick Gooden Uggla
* [15:48] Oskar Linden: I can see that being ez to do :-p
* [15:48] Marigold Devin: o.O
* [15:48] Gooden Uggla: see all objects as well as scripted objects
* [15:48] Sigma Avro: have control on physics. Someone asked physics buffer to record data
* [15:48] Gooden Uggla: estate managers can already ban, (sometimes)
* [15:48] Bronson Blackadder: have griefer objects attack the person who spawned them
* [15:48] Psi Merlin: I'd like the ability to set the RC channel as you jsut indicated - the changes being testes in a given channel may be more - or less relavent to the use for a given sim
* [15:49] Marigold Devin: Nice one, BB, I like that.
* [15:49] Jonathan Yap: Show time since last restart
* [15:49] Amilia ZabaletaAmilia: Zabaleta chuckles to herself...
* [15:49] Rex Cronon: u have an idea:) how about allowing scripts to interreact with the sim console:)
* [15:49] Gooden Uggla: see what avatars are wearing as attachments and how much time and memory they use
* [15:49] Ovaltine Constantine: llConsoleRequest
* [15:49] Oskar Linden: the console is going to start out having only a very few functions
* [15:50] Sigma Avro: implement llTakeMoneyFromLindens
* [15:50] Psi Merlin: I'd also like to be able to have a view of my regions resource use on the simhost - virtual memory , cpu load etc.
* [15:50] Jonathan Yap: Show what other regions the simulator is running -- to help track down lag issues
* [15:50] Oskar Linden: just a handful of variables that aren't easily editable from the UI
* [15:50] Rex Cronon: i don't think u will ever be able to make everybody happy, so why not let users program/design their own console:)
* [15:50] Gooden Uggla: return one avatar's objects from the entire sim
* [15:50] Lares Carter: yes, dump region resource usage to a file would be cool or just display the info
* [15:50] Amilia Zabaleta: I'm agreeing with jonathan...
* [15:51] XLR8RRICK Hudson: Find Objects by Date rezzed
* [15:51] Maestro Linden: an LSL interface would be interesting
* [15:51] Oskar Linden: ok ok... I can see it
* [15:51] Sigma Avro: possible ?
* [15:51] Oskar Linden: tweak your scripted objects from the console
* [15:51] Ovaltine Constantine: Find (and return?) objects by (insert criteria here)
* [15:51] Gooden Uggla: sort criteria, yes
* [15:51] Amilia Zabaleta: yup
* [15:52] Sigma Avro: Share resources from different sims
* [15:52] Oskar Linden: that's not gonna happen :-p
* [15:52] Jonathan Yap: Oskar, you will need to give some thought to having ~ in the shortcut -- not all foreign language keyboards have that character
* [15:52] Oskar Linden: SET StealFromNeighbors 1
* [15:52] Ovaltine Constantine: Find objects with more than so much script time, with more than so many prims, above a certain height
* [15:52] Oskar Linden: well it is the ` specifically
* [15:53] Sigma Avro: Allow for rezing at higher than 4 km
* [15:53] Amilia Zabaleta: <--agree with Ovaltine...
* [15:53] Flynn Tigerpaw: allow flying above 200m w/o assist
* [15:53] Gooden Uggla: when script limits come up, the ability toi share memory and prims independant of the size of parcels or the group they belong to
* [15:53] Psi Merlin: So any info you can epose to allow us to have a better undersanding of the way our regions are performing would be very welcome. - and should be reasonably simple to do as it's read-only.
* [15:53] Rickk Turbo: limit the number of rezzable objects by the same user?
* [15:53] Rickk Turbo: per sec
* [15:54] XLR8RRICK Hudson: Hahaha you asked for it Oskar
* [15:54] Sigma Avro: detect btemp on rez would be the good place for this
* [15:54] Sigma Avro: -temp on rez
* [15:54] Oskar Linden: oh and for those that don't want the server version messages on every region crossing I have been told to tell you to use vwr 2
* [15:54] Maestro Linden: yep, I could definitely see uses for modifying rez rate limits in a region
* [15:54] Rickk Turbo: deny objects rezzing capabilties
* [15:55] Flynn Tigerpaw: I tried on v2, I still get a message
* [15:55] Oskar Linden: hmm
* [15:55] XLR8RRICK Hudson: ok but you have to drive a Uggo
* [15:55] Gooden Uggla: don't allow avatars with X (set variable) script time to enter the region
* [15:55] Techwolf Lupindo: rez limit are different for different sims. Combat want ti super high while meeting places want it very low.
* [15:56] Rex Cronon: just a sec. allow them to enter but don't allow over n scripts to run for each avatar. that is better IMO:)
* [15:56] Gooden Uggla: yup tech, the ability to drop the gray goo fence threshold
* [15:56] Rickk Turbo: gray goo?
* [15:56] Rickk Turbo: lol
* [15:57] Oskar Linden: long story
* [15:57] Sigma Avro: scripting physics of the sim would be conceivable ?
* [15:57] Oskar Linden: so in the last three minutes...
* [15:57] Oskar Linden: who asked "Is the password change Aditi account update working? I've been waiting 6 days for an update to get my passwords in sync. " ?
* [15:58] Flynn Tigerpaw: me!
* [15:58] Gooden Uggla: i'm all for a "silent fail" approach to overscripted avatars, but the idea was kinda given the cold shoulder by the lab
* [15:58] Oskar Linden: leave your name next time :-D
* [15:58] Rickk Turbo: it update for me last week but not my money
* [15:58] Flynn Tigerpaw: OK didn't think of that
* [15:58] Rickk Turbo: :(
* [15:58] XLR8RRICK Hudson: Hahaha
* [15:58] Oskar Linden: it won't update money
* [15:59] Oskar Linden: but money isn't so important here
* [15:59] Flynn Tigerpaw: I updated, changed my password back.. no update
* [15:59] Oskar Linden: I set everyones money to 5000 every month or so
* [15:59] Rickk Turbo: indeed but i had 20k added to my other account
* [15:59] Rickk Turbo: but not this one
* [15:59] XLR8RRICK Hudson: Flynn you have to leave it changed
* [15:59] Oskar Linden: did you leave your password changed over night?
* [15:59] Sigma Avro: lol, I do not spend 1 linden here, if anyone needs some...
* [15:59] Flynn Tigerpaw: yes, for 6 days. my passwords are different
* [16:00] Oskar Linden: ok
* [16:00] Oskar Linden: I'll ask around
* [16:00] Lares Carter: any new info about llCastRay() ?
* [16:00] Oskar Linden: no new info
* [16:00] Oskar Linden: but it would be on a back burner
* [16:00] Oskar Linden: if we have one
* [16:00] Gooden Uggla: mono update?
* [16:00] Lares Carter: kay, thx
* [16:01] Oskar Linden: it's on a project backlog
* [16:01] Oskar Linden: I think fixing group chat is higher