Community Tools User Group/18-August-2011

==Attendees List==
*Arcane Laval (arcane.laval)
*camptownladysingthissongdoodah (camptownladysingthissongdoodah)
*Jeremy Linden (jeremy.linden)
*Liisa Runo (liisa.runo)
*Peewee Musytari (peewee.musytari)
*Qie (qie.niangao)
*Time Minder (time.minder)
*Torben (torben.trautman)
==Transcript for Thursday August 18, 2011==
[13:02]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	hey Jeremy
[13:02]	Qie (qie.niangao) 	Hi Jeremy
[13:02]	Peewee Musytari 	yay jeremy loves us
[13:02]	Peewee Musytari 	hewo
[13:02]	Jeremy Linden 	Hello!
[13:02]	Jeremy Linden 	Rand and Lexie are both on vacation today, so you guys are stuck with me :-D
[13:02]	Arcane Laval 	Hiya
[13:02]	Peewee Musytari 	doesnt` seem to be many of us here either
[13:03]	Peewee Musytari 	is there anything really urgent?
[13:03]	Arcane Laval 	Everybody else is prolly on vacation too
[13:03]	Peewee Musytari 	have u fixed answers?
[13:03]	Peewee Musytari 	lol
[13:03]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	^^^
[13:03]	Jeremy Linden 	I don't have any super urgent news, but Lexie gave me a few notes to go over for updates.
[13:03]	Jeremy Linden 	Lemme see here...
[13:03]	Peewee Musytari 	yay a quick meeting...go for it :)
[13:04]	Jeremy Linden 	the InWorld blog is now higlighting a picture each day from Flickr
[13:04]	Jeremy Linden 	Lithium is still in a production freeze, so we don't have any fixes or changes to report this week...
[13:05]	Jeremy Linden 	But we do have people looking at fixing the issue with image albums not working correctly.
[13:06]	Jeremy Linden 	In his spare time, Rand has been working on organizing the remaining wiki KB content into an "Extended KB", which will contain more advanced content than the official KB on Lithium. So far, it can be found here: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Extended_Knowledge_Base
[13:07]	Peewee Musytari 	ooh what prompted that?
[13:07]	Jeremy Linden 	Personally, I've been working on documentation for the Mesh project - I finished uploading our first round of translated mesh documentation today :-)
[13:07]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	yay
[13:08]	Jeremy Linden 	Oh, we've known for some time that there's a division between the technical level of the content in Lithium and on the wiki. The extended KB is a way for us to better organize official (if sometimes outdated) info on the wiki, especially if it's specialized info about how to best use complicated features.
[13:09]	Peewee Musytari 	so it keeps the KB more simple?
[13:09]	Peewee Musytari 	it is a lot easier to navigate than the old one
[13:10]	Jeremy Linden 	In fact, I would gladly welcome contributions from mesh creators on my mesh tools pages. I can't possibly learn how to use every third party tool out there, but we have lots of Residents who love sharing their knowledge of their favorite mesh tools.
[13:10]	Jeremy Linden 	That's the idea, Peewee. We try to keep the Lithium KB fairly basic for new Residents. More advanced topics like building tips generally go on the wiki.
[13:11]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	I tried to read the german mesh page but didnÂ´t understand a word...
[13:11]	Peewee Musytari 	good idea
[13:11]	Jeremy Linden 	Uh oh. Was it not in german, Torben?
[13:11]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	yes, the words were german
[13:11]	Peewee Musytari 	u should post a request for suggestions on the mesh forum Jeremy...they love talking mesh in there lol
[13:11]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	but my understanding of mesh isnÂ´t sufficient enough
[13:11]	Peewee Musytari 	I`m sure they would give u great tips
[13:12]	Jeremy Linden 	Yeah, there are some great mesh discussions in the forums. I need to catch back up with them there and ask for some basic tutorials :-)
[13:12]	Peewee Musytari 	the group chat in the mesh volunteers group is usually pretty active too
[13:13]	Jeremy Linden 	Interesting, Torben. The translated articles for Mesh should be for beginners. I wonder if there was something lost in translations?
[13:13]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	o.O
[13:13]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	you find me speechless now
[13:13]	Jeremy Linden 	There is a lot of new terminology, but I tried hard to explain it all in English :-)
[13:13]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	I thought it was for experts and I was just too dumb ^^
[13:13]	Arcane Laval 	In your current documentation, which 3rd party tool(s) did you cover so far, Jemery?
[13:13]	Jeremy Linden 	Which article is it?
[13:14]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	maybe I give it another shot
[13:14]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	one sec
[13:14]	Arcane Laval 	*Jeremy
[13:14]	Jeremy Linden 	Hey Arcane - The current collection of pages is here, but I don't think many of them are covered very well yet. Most of what is there was contributed by helpful Residents: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Mesh/Tools
[13:15]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/UI-Referenz_zum_Hochladen_eines_Netzes/Modells
[13:15]	Jeremy Linden 	Ohh... *that* page. Yes, that's the most complicated one.
[13:15]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	pizza's here
[13:15]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	hah!
[13:15]	Peewee Musytari 	lol
[13:15]	Peewee Musytari 	anchovies plz
[13:15]	Peewee Musytari 	=^.^= *Nahm Nahm Nahm!*
[13:16]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	yay I had fungi
[13:16]	Arcane Laval 	Interesting, thanks for the link :)
[13:16]	Jeremy Linden 	That's for helping advanced mesh creators make the best decisions when uploading their models. You probably want something more like:
[13:16]	Jeremy Linden 	http://community.secondlife.com/t5/Deutsche-Knowledge-Base/Modell-hochladen/ta-p/988263
[13:17]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	camptownladysingthissongdoodah points out "excuse me if i suddenly vanish, using my netbbok with my cell phone in use asa mobile dongle"
[13:17]	Jeremy Linden 	This one also: http://community.secondlife.com/t5/Deutsche-Knowledge-Base/Prim-%C3%84quivalenzgewicht-berechnen/ta-p/988269
[13:18]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	yah, that one is more written for me :)
[13:18]	Jeremy Linden 	Hi camptownladysingthissongdoodah. Glad you could make it via netbook!
[13:19]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	well, we tries, we really do, but hardly anyone here
[13:19]	Arcane Laval 	That is one hell of a long name
[13:19]	Qie (qie.niangao) 	hmmm. I don't think I've ever seen a username wrap lines like that
[13:20]	Jeremy Linden 	Heh! Good observation, Qie.
[13:20]	Jeremy Linden 	Ok, what's next on the agenda... I apologize in advance for not actually having answers to most of these; I'll leave them for next time when Lexie is here.
[13:21]	Jeremy Linden 	Apparently there is no update yet on tooltips for the new smileys.
[13:21]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	jere - im me will ya? cn't work out how to do it on this text viewer
[13:21]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	I believe this is still the agenda for Aug 4
[13:21]	Jeremy Linden 	Oh dear!
[13:22]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	it is when i looked
[13:22]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	perfect, makes it easier to answer ;)
[13:22]	Jeremy Linden 	Well, that makes my job a bit easier. Does anyone here have any more questions about the Mesh articles? Or suggestions for more?
[13:23]	Peewee Musytari 	the thing with the pictures on the blog
[13:23]	Jeremy Linden 	Favorite kind of pie?
[13:23]	Peewee Musytari 	whats that about?
[13:23]	Arcane Laval 	Peanut butter pie? lol
[13:23]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	I have a jira for the doc team: https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-26678
[13:23]	Peewee Musytari 	just for fun?
[13:23]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	Strawberry cheese cake
[13:23]	Jeremy Linden 	I'm not 100% sure, Peewee. It's something Lexie told me was new :-)
[13:24]	Peewee Musytari 	just someone`s random flickr stream blogged one by one?
[13:24]	Peewee Musytari 	lol
[13:24]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	itÂ´s the funky flickr pic of the day
[13:24]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	chosen by someone
[13:24]	Peewee Musytari 	the daily mystery blog hehe
[13:24]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	yah
[13:25]	Jeremy Linden 	I'm actually just seeing it myself, now: http://community.secondlife.com/t5/Inworld/Flickr-Pic-of-the-Day/ba-p/1044653
[13:25]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	someone posted a blog about their favorite dj
[13:25]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	what's a good site to start a blog on? i miss that one about all the weird stuff you find inworld
[13:25]	Peewee Musytari 	is it cos the dynamic login screen might make people get withdrawals from not seeing a daily pic?
[13:25]	Peewee Musytari 	lol
[13:25]	Jeremy Linden 	camptown, I was just looking for that one yesterday! SL Discoveries, I think it was called. It seems to have been deleted.
[13:26]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	call me betty, it's essier on the tongue
[13:26]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	i have an lm on my desktop i'll have to look for it tomorrow
[13:26]	Jeremy Linden 	Haha, I'm not sure, Peewee. I'll have to ask Lexie about it when she gets back.
[13:27]	Peewee Musytari 	I have nothing against cool pics ...be interesting to know what the thinking is behind it :)
[13:27]	Peewee Musytari 	can we submit pics etc
[13:27]	Jeremy Linden 	SL photography has become quite an art form, though! Has anyone here played with the new light and shadow, along with depth of field?
[13:27]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	used to find som epretty good places, and since i travel the world a lot (bugging ldpw along the way) i thought i might try blogging it meself
[13:27]	Peewee Musytari 	maybe its a torley thing
[13:27]	Qie (qie.niangao) 	Light and shadow, definitely. I'm not a huge fan of DoF myself.
[13:28]	Peewee Musytari 	i love the lighting and shadows for pics...not easy to run all the time
[13:28]	Peewee Musytari 	puter doesn`t love them so much
[13:28]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	jer - if you're okay eith this i'll im you some sl photography links tomorrow, a dear frined of mine is meticulous at that
[13:28]	Qie (qie.niangao) 	I wonder if anybody has tried HDR ... some RL HDR photos remind me of SL scenes.
[13:28]	Arcane Laval 	Same here. Things start to freeze up when using shadows
[13:29]	Jeremy Linden 	I find depth-of-field is fun to play with, but for simply wandering around I find it blurs too much of the scene. GREAT for photos, though!
[13:29]	Peewee Musytari 	yeah there are some awesome pics around now
[13:29]	Peewee Musytari 	dont` even need to PS effects in a lot of the time lol
[13:30]	Peewee Musytari 	which is good
[13:30]	Jeremy Linden 	I took one as a demo at my desk in LindenWorld: http://www.screencast.com/t/oF7HRtBb0VXw
[13:30]	Qie (qie.niangao) 	that's pretty cool, yeah. good use of DoF.
[13:31]	Arcane Laval 	Oh, so depth of field turns background blurry? I havent tried it out yet
[13:31]	Qie (qie.niangao) 	(oh crap: RL turn-to-pumpkin time for me. Have fun all.)
[13:31]	Arcane Laval 	Bye bye
[13:31]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	bye bye Qie
[13:31]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	bye qie tc
[13:31]	Qie (qie.niangao) 	Qie waves and poofs
[13:31]	Jeremy Linden 	Depth of field works like a camera focus. It brings whatever your camera is pointed at (alt-click) into focus and blurs the rest.
[13:31]	Peewee Musytari 	cool pic...I notice u said ur desk not ur office...how long till they let ya have walls? lol
[13:31]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	camptownladysingthissongdoodah can relate, i'm at work atm on nights
[13:32]	Jeremy Linden 	Oh, I could have walls. I prefer open spaces when I build SL architecture though. Like this platform!
[13:32]	Arcane Laval 	Thats quite nice for pictures yeah
[13:32]	Peewee Musytari 	hehe
[13:32]	Peewee Musytari 	I had a question but I forgot it so it can`t have been very important
[13:32]	Jeremy Linden 	What's the point of being able to fly and zoom your camera around if you're going to block it with walls, I say :-)
[13:33]	Peewee Musytari 	true
[13:33]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	hhe, derender makes walls obsolete now
[13:33]	Peewee Musytari 	my "office" is a sim sized deck
[13:33]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	and the use of an npv too
[13:33]	Jeremy Linden 	camptown "betty", you mean the new parcel privacy feature?
[13:34]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	nah, i use phoenix usually, and it can derender specific items
[13:34]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	which iss why my home sim is now clear of junk, at least to me :)
[13:34]	Peewee Musytari 	great feature for cleaning up mainland
[13:34]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	wow, with DoF I went from 34 FPS to 0.6
[13:34]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	scary
[13:34]	Peewee Musytari 	haha torben
[13:34]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!
[13:34]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	yup peewee it is
[13:35]	Jeremy Linden 	Interesting. I'm often behind on TPV features because I'm not allowed to use non-linden viewers on any computer that connects to our network.
[13:35]	Arcane Laval 	That's smart
[13:35]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	are you allowed to read their wikis jeremy?
[13:35]	Arcane Laval 	You never know what they program into those viewers lol
[13:35]	Jeremy Linden 	Whoa, Torben. Is that with light and shadow? That'll be a big hit to your FPS>
[13:35]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	yah
[13:36]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	I was impressed by that too
[13:36]	Peewee Musytari 	one thing I found weird with that parcel privacy thing...
[13:36]	Peewee Musytari 	you can`t see out either
[13:36]	Peewee Musytari 	so its kinda creepy private
[13:36]	Peewee Musytari 	u don`t know if ur surrounded by people lol
[13:36]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	do we have a wiki link to that new feature? i saw it but not tried it yet
[13:36]	Peewee Musytari 	except for map ofc
[13:37]	Jeremy Linden 	I suppose that's got its positive and negative aspects. If you're, um, doing something private, you might not necesarily want to know there are people having a bonfire 10 feet away.
[13:37]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	heh thast's why zindra exists
[13:37]	Jeremy Linden 	I think Rand wrote an article on parcel privacy. Lemme check.
[13:38]	Peewee Musytari 	it is funny standing next to someone touching avvies and a parcel border between u and you can`t see each other lol
[13:38]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	jere could i ask a favour on that - im it to "me" so i can see it tomorrow?
[13:39]	Jeremy Linden 	Peewee, you can get similar behavior with voice channels between Adult regions and other regions. You can only hear and speak to other people on your side of the border.
[13:40]	Jeremy Linden 	Of course, I'm not sure how common it is to have an A region next to an M or G.
[13:40]	Jeremy Linden 	Aha, here it is, I think: http://community.secondlife.com/t5/English-Knowledge-Base/Hiding-avatars-and-restricting-avatar-sounds/ta-p/999779
[13:40]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	I love the restriction of avatar sounds
[13:40]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	itÂ´s awesome!
[13:41]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	i like being able to mute gestures
[13:41]	Peewee Musytari 	I know a couple of joined sims where one is adult and others are moderate...not seen one joined to a PG one, but I guess there is somewhere
[13:41]	Jeremy Linden 	..........
[13:41]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	i love that
[13:41]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	no more
[13:41]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	width=100% style="padding:0 6px;"
[13:41]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	spam
[13:41]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	hehe
[13:41]	Jeremy Linden 	Heh.
[13:41]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	there are many mainland sims like that, pg and mature right next to each other
[13:42]	Peewee Musytari 	yeah but maindland adult is separate
[13:42]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	some are not so suitable like that, but no doub tplanned like that
[13:42]	Peewee Musytari 	would only be a private estate that would have adult mixed with others
[13:42]	Jeremy Linden 	Right, Peewee. The voice and sound restriction I mentioned for Adult regions probably most often applies to private regions.
[13:43]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	i did ask for a rezoning but just have to wait on that
[13:43]	Jeremy Linden 	Um. So to speak.
[13:43]	Peewee Musytari 	are LL not bothered that the privacy thing could have poeple breaking the TOS on PG sims?
[13:43]	Peewee Musytari 	or is it out of sight out of mind
[13:44]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	jeremy 1 thing to say: kinda silly that stuff cos you can adult verify now justy by ticking a box with no id
[13:44]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	itÂ´s donÂ´t ask donÂ´t tell ;)
[13:44]	Jeremy Linden 	I don't think we changed the policy, Peewee, but I'd have to check the TOS to make sure.
[13:44]	Peewee Musytari 	but think of the kids lol....they are locked away in PG land
[13:44]	Peewee Musytari 	the wolves might get in
[13:44]	Peewee Musytari 	lol
[13:45]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	i notice that removing underage avatars is kinda prompy nowadays, kudos to g-team
[13:45]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	but , and i am sad to say this, since main/teen grid merger, my land is now no longer open access
[13:45]	Jeremy Linden 	I haven't heard much about that on the documentation side. I did need to update some docs for the new adult verification, though.
[13:46]	Peewee Musytari 	if u can call it that
[13:46]	Peewee Musytari 	not really sure the point of it anymore
[13:46]	Peewee Musytari 	may as well just say on registration...did you lie??
[13:47]	Peewee Musytari 	save the extra step
[13:47]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	people age verified as Elvis before
[13:47]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	so canÂ´t be worse now than it was before ^^
[13:47]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	google "elvis lives at bbc"
[13:47]	Peewee Musytari 	yeah there was a website showing famous people`s info that u could use to verify
[13:48]	Peewee Musytari 	I think even MJ is verified in sl
[13:48]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	rod did say he was going to re-visit that
[13:49]	Jeremy Linden 	Well, it's the same type of verification used on the rest of the Internet. I'm not really knowledgeable enough about the strategic decision behind changing it to make any comments.
[13:49]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	understand that 100% jeremy
[13:49]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	sorry, shouldn't have mentioned that here
[13:49]	Peewee Musytari 	the irony is that it is the genuine rule abiding adults that trie to use the old system and spent weeks dealing with support etc
[13:50]	Peewee Musytari 	and the kids know all the tricks and get verified
[13:50]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	i won't deal with support now, my crusade on them is finished - they just cost ll my concierge business, now im moving to pvt sim :)
[13:50]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	so should we release poor Jeremy from the hot seat and call it a day?
[13:51]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	but if age verifying can be made to work i think it will work correctly
[13:51]	Peewee Musytari 	some guy posted on answers asking if LL would let him into mature sims cos he is 18 in a month and all his friends are there and said how unfair it was cos he knows all these RL 12 year olds in on their parents info
[13:51]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	yeah jeremy grb a 10 minute coffee break on us :)
[13:51]	Jeremy Linden 	Oh, sorry. Charlar is chatting to me in Skype :-P
[13:51]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	hehe
[13:52]	Peewee Musytari 	so any system will only mess with the real adults, the kids don`t care
[13:52]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	ps my comment above - not ll support, the scouts i meant
[13:53]	Peewee Musytari 	haha scoutbots
[13:53]	Jeremy Linden 	Noted.
[13:53]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	rod did por
[13:53]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	Jeremy, did you see the url I posted?
[13:53]	camptownladysingthissongdoodah	rod did say he'd look at them too :)
[13:53]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-26678
[13:53]	Jeremy Linden 	One sec, Torben...
[13:53]	Jeremy Linden 	Ah
[13:53]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	something went wrong there ^^
[13:53]	Jeremy Linden 	Whoa!
[13:53]	Jeremy Linden 	What version of the Viewer are you on?
[13:54]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	double /de
[13:54]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	right now 3.2
[13:54]	Jeremy Linden 	We're not up to 3.2... even in beta.
[13:54]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	but itÂ´s on the 2.8 hotfix
[13:54]	Jeremy Linden 	Ah.
[13:54]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	well, the latest dev build then
[13:54]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	*$*LoL *$*
[13:55]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	3.0.2
[13:55]	Jeremy Linden 	Weird! I'll check that out. It's most likely an error on our end. Maybe someone did (or didn't) translated an article link correctly.
[13:55]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	and I see it in 2.8.3 (238392)
[13:55]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	okies :)
[13:56]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	time to go home :)
[13:56]	Torben (torben.trautman) 	take care all
[13:56]	Jeremy Linden 	You can actually see the source for all viewerhelp on the public wiki: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Viewerhelp:Active_Releases
[13:56]	Jeremy Linden 	Under "map file"
[13:56]	Peewee Musytari 	jeremy do you know about the dashboard links for merchant tools and shop that all go to the marketplace homepage?.....there have been a couple of threads about them but no one ever answers what they are for
[13:57]	Jeremy Linden 	Peewee, I haven't heard about that... Did they appear recently?
[13:57]	Peewee Musytari 	I did a thread back in may and nothing has changed
[13:57]	Jeremy Linden 	My team actually doesn't have any direct control over what's on secondlife.com, interestingly enough :-)
[13:57]	Peewee Musytari 	there is like 4 or 5 links in each section but they all go to same place
[13:58]	Peewee Musytari 	who does the dashboard?
[13:58]	Peewee Musytari 	someone that doesn`t read the forums hehe
[13:59]	Peewee Musytari 	excessive dashboard clutter, may as well get rid of them if they aren`t gonna work
[13:59]	Jeremy Linden 	Hmm. I'm actually not sure!
[13:59]	Peewee Musytari 	aww I would a emailed them if u knew
[14:00]	Peewee Musytari 	maybe no one...thats the problem :P
[14:00]	Jeremy Linden 	Well, if you report it as a bug under the WEB component, it should go to the right people.
[14:01]	Peewee Musytari 	yeah I think I will JIRA it..as its been so long if it was a work in progress they had long enough
[14:01]	Peewee Musytari 	at least 3 months
[14:01]	Time Minder 	You have been online for 1 hours.
[14:02]	Peewee Musytari 	thanks for not just cancelling the meetiing Jeremey...was some interesting stuff
[14:02]	Liisa Runo 	thanks
[14:03]	Jeremy Linden 	My pleasure! I actually used to run my personal office hour in this space, so it's like old times :-)
[14:03]	Peewee Musytari 	hehe
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