Adult Content User Group/06/27/2011

==Attendees List==
*BBQBill Odriscoll (bbqbill.odriscoll)
*Couldbe (couldbe)
*Counter Landfall (counter.landfall)
*Dancer Greenfield (dancer.greenfield)
*Ginette Pinazzo (ginette.pinazzo)
*Huntress Catteneo (huntress.catteneo)
*Hypatia Meili (hypatia.meili)
*Innula Zenovka (innula.zenovka)
*Janicka Engineer (janicka.engineer)
*JeZeBeLe Dagger (jezebele.dagger)
*Kaleu Voir (kaleu.voir)
*Qie (qie)
*Sissy Blitz (sissy.blitz)
*Slaton Linden (slaton.linden)
*StarSong Bright (starsong.bright)
*Temperance Hax (temperance.hax)
*Viale Linden (viale.linden)
*Vick Forcella (vick.forcella)
*Zada Bury (zada.bury)
*Zan (zan)
==Transcript for Monday June 27, 2011==
[11:00]	Slaton Linden 	hello
[11:00]	Innula Zenovka 	hi, Slaton
[11:00]	Viale Linden 	thanks everyon for your notes
[11:01]	Viale Linden 	I want to circle back on some items from last week
[11:01]	Dancer Greenfield	This is the biggest attendance for months... did the word go around that it's an important meeting?
[11:01]	Viale Linden 	Business Objectives
[11:01]	Hypatia Meili 	Hi Viale
[11:01]	Viale Linden 	Community goal
[11:01]	Viale Linden 	Leverage our passionate community to help us convert new users and retain existing users.
[11:02]	Couldbe 	you forgot the word committed as well Viale
[11:02]	Viale Linden 	1. 1. Facilitate sustainable, productive communities by partnering with key groups and residents. (different from executing on a community wishlist).
[11:02]	Zada Bury 	back, here
[11:02]	Viale Linden 	2. Bring the value forward - Use Social Media (Facebook, Twitter, & YouTube), Message Of The Day, Blogs, Destination Guide, Welcome Feeds, and in-viewer SL social efforts to showcase Second Life UGC.
[11:02]	Viale Linden 	3. Focus on sustainable movements, not discrete campaigns. Source the community for naturally sustaining, organic initiatives that scale and utilize trusted community resources while still aligning with corporate goals. Move away from LL-driven events and start spotting movements with natural momentum.
[11:03]	Ginette Pinazzo 	fabulous
[11:03]	Viale Linden 	4. Embrace community content as an untapped, invaluable resource.
[11:03]	Viale Linden 	Metrics
[11:03]	Zan 	greetings between lag
[11:03]	Viale Linden 	let me clarify som key points
[11:03]	Counter Landfall 	great
[11:04]	Viale Linden 	We are focused on sustainable and organic movements
[11:04]	Couldbe 	where's adult content in all of this?
[11:04]	Viale Linden 	Let me give you a moment to digest
[11:04]	Viale Linden 	and I will answer questions
[11:04]	Counter Landfall 	can you translate your last sentence?
[11:04]	Ginette Pinazzo 	I thinkwe all feel the active user chrun soemtimes...haha
[11:05]	Janicka Engineer 	hello all
[11:05]	Viale Linden 	Actually churn is very light but we need to find new users to replace
[11:05]	Hypatia Meili 	hey Jani
[11:05]	Zada Bury 	Zada Bury wawes. "Heya Jani." ^_^
''
[11:05]	Janicka Engineer 	:)
[11:05]	Innula Zenovka 	does, " 3. Surfacing the best content related to SL events and locations will boost the amount of new user" mean that adult content is likely to be featured in advertising and the destination guide?
[11:06]	Couldbe 	ahh so those approximately 97% of people who create an account each day but don't actually continue aren't considered churn?
[11:06]	Couldbe 	I suppose that's only around 17K people a day
[11:06]	Viale Linden 	That is something I would like to discuss
[11:06]	Qie 	actually, there *is* adult content in the destination guide now, which is important
[11:07]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	Sustainable movements, does this mean that you will actively allow the officership of the ZE. To change when applicable. Currently our transcript. Currently we were to nominate folks to take on that leadership and we have no system to do this accountably outside of "Monday Meetings" which everyone can not attend. We forget about the culture of sustainability and focus on the marketing "Events" that do not relate to cultures. But relate to "marketing income" vs wholesome experiences.
[11:07]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Viale, will you have that mission in writing soemplace...for easy reference later?
[11:07]	Viale Linden 	The zexpo 2011 event seems like a great event, but I would prefer little or no linden involvement
[11:07]	Innula Zenovka 	is there, Qie?
[11:07]	Viale Linden 	Prefer organic
[11:07]	Counter Landfall 	I think you need to translate your objectives to adult content because they are all ok as a general objective, but they don't necessarily scale to us given your own restrictions set in the adult content policy.
[11:08]	Viale Linden 	I see linden involvment as a way to figure out how we can promote or make your events discoverable
[11:08]	Qie 	Innula, maybe not. I thought I got it before, but now I can't repro.
[11:08]	Couldbe 	are you saying that this user group is about the mainland community of zindra and no longer about adult content?
[11:08]	Ginette Pinazzo 	I agree 'little ' involvemetn is best Vialke....though 'no ' involveemtn woudl have never allowed soemthing like ZEXPO 2011 ti ever occur
[11:08]	Hypatia Meili 	LL simply neds to asing land control as need , keep contro of the groups for that
[11:08]	Viale Linden 	Good point - this group is not about zindra only
[11:08]	Zada Bury 	(( aduld placeas are in the destination guide ... you can switch, like in the regular search also your maturity-level to set, what you want see. ... last was ... 5 to 10 places in.))
[11:08]	Hypatia Meili 	it is curently still under blondin
[11:08]	BBQBill Odriscoll	Unless users are empowered Gina
[11:08]	Counter Landfall 	great I apprechite you made that poin only
[11:08]	Couldbe 	the two areas are not mutually compatible
[11:09]	Counter Landfall 	point*
[11:09]	Couldbe 	there is very little overlap
[11:09]	Viale Linden 	It is about the Adult segment and I would like to hear from "A" region holders too
[11:09]	Counter Landfall 	nice
[11:09]	Couldbe 	you do realise that all of zindra is rated A, don't you?
[11:09]	Innula Zenovka 	that's very good news, Viale..
[11:09]	Hypatia Meili 	weli work for a place on an island too
[11:09]	Counter Landfall 	visibility and marketing encompass all adult regions and content
[11:10]	Ginette Pinazzo 	well, I love the sound of the mission, anywya
[11:10]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	If its organic, we lose grasp of the "Arts, the Entertainment takes control, and the cultural experiences of Adult themed events relating to themed catagories. (LBGT, Femdom, D/s, Education, Enrichment arts, Mentorship, Cultural themes relating to nationality, etc.)
[11:10]	Viale Linden 	I want to hold off on any decisions for management of Zindra region and 4 corners until post zexpo 2011
[11:10]	Innula Zenovka 	search, the marketplace, problems with age verification.. not just events and questions that only affect Zindra..
[11:10]	Qie 	There are Zindra-specific issues, too, but they have little or nothing to do with adult content. Indeed, Zindra is less and less about adult content as time goes on (despite being rated A, uniformly)
[11:10]	Zada Bury 	(( for the destination-guide: http://secondlife.com/destinations/romance?r=a ))
[11:11]	Counter Landfall 	why that decision point only?
[11:11]	Counter Landfall 	what happens at that time that makes you want to postpone?
[11:11]	Viale Linden 	I would like this meeting to be more strategic and less about ticket management
[11:11]	Couldbe 	ticket management?
[11:12]	Sissy Blitz 	I agree Viale
[11:12]	Counter Landfall 	good signal only
[11:12]	Counter Landfall 	and I agree
[11:12]	Hypatia Meili 	Zindar specific by defintionhas pelenty to do with adult, uit just is not all
[11:12]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Viale...marlketiong works months in a dvance....I agree no big changes should occir now....but you shoudl at least have the matreiual in froitn of you eralkty BEFORE the end of ZEXPO 2011.....to allow for momentum to be continued
[11:12]	Counter Landfall 	we have been preoccupied with micro managment
[11:12]	Kaleu Voir 	Hello for everyone ,I been in contact with LL on phone last week !
[11:13]	Qie 	FWIW, I think it's best to wait, too, because nobody really wants to stop or complicate the current ZEXPO. Let it run to completion, then decide. (That said, however, we *need* progress on Podyan, and could benefit from some progress on the Zindra sim)
[11:13]	Viale Linden 	I believe Lindens stunt your creativity and I would like you present great ideas to move thise segment forward
[11:13]	Kaleu Voir 	I will like to go direct to the subject
[11:14]	Zan 	Lindens could add to the creativity Vuiale
[11:14]	Kaleu Voir 	last time the meeting has not professional ,look like been run by teenages
[11:14]	BBQBill Odriscoll	Good approach Viale
[11:14]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Viale.....I would like to announce ZE's basic plan well in advance..today.....so you at least know where we wish to go with this......we couldnt wait until 'kast minute' and plan this stuff succesfully
[11:14]	Viale Linden 	Ginette - not sure what you are asking
[11:15]	Dancer Greenfield	My main wish is that LL should be seen to support Zexpo. The only LL member to visit Zexpo was M Linden. Even Blondin didn't show his face during the week.
[11:15]	Dancer Greenfield	Zexpo 2010, that is
[11:15]	Zada Bury 	On the OH he was there
[11:15]	Sissy Blitz 	Give Viale a chance Ginette he can not fix all your problems in one meeting
[11:15]	Counter Landfall 	yes he was
[11:15]	Ginette Pinazzo 	I am asking that we presrnt(quickly) the overview of where we want to go....how we want to set things up with oursleves.........it affects everything...and affects how we even plan t6his show
[11:15]	Counter Landfall 	ZE does not affect everything ;-)
[11:15]	Viale Linden 	Are you asking for the floor?
[11:16]	Ginette Pinazzo 	when its ready, tes
[11:16]	Counter Landfall 	he just said he wanted to keep this trategic and all adult conent
[11:16]	Couldbe 	if so, please limit your time
[11:16]	Viale Linden 	Ginette - please
[11:16]	Couldbe 	there are other items that need to be discussed other then the Zexpo group
[11:16]	Viale Linden 	Ginette - go ahead
[11:16]	Ginette Pinazzo 	tha nks Vial...Ill be brief
[11:16]	Viale Linden 	couldbe - u are next
[11:16]	Qie 	(incidentally, I *do* get 43 Adult results in destinations, Midian City being topmost)
[11:17]	Ginette Pinazzo 	ZEG has been meeting and many of the most active members have pulled together with a solid naturally evolved plan for ZE's future. You asked for some nominations; I think we have that and better, and these people are woven into a comprehensive plan that seamlessly continues the good work we've been doing, addresses key concerns, and matches perfectly with LL mission for Zindra and, by extension, adult SL. I am sending you the info you need right now......... This represents the 'will of the group' (see the chart) ...
[11:17]	Ginette Pinazzo 	(passes chart to Viale)
[11:18]	Viale Linden 	Please post in chat
[11:18]	Ginette Pinazzo 	we have used consensus to build this structure. I'd be happy to explain it in more detail, easily done off the meeting clock. .....
[11:18]	Ginette Pinazzo 	http://sites.google.com/site/zindrabusiness/home/zindra-expo-group-overview-plan
[11:18]	Ginette Pinazzo 	We also have 2 comments about this:
[11:18]	Viale Linden 	be back - checking doc
[11:18]	Ginette Pinazzo 	1) ZE was formed as an LL group and has done much work. The group wants to continue on this path, attracting and retaining more and more people to Zindra, adult SL, and this process. This specific plan is all about Zindra, I know (though I believe this will impact adult SL in general) but this plan is not meant to infringe upon other 'adult topics' that may come up at these meetings.....
[11:18]	Ginette Pinazzo 	I suggest that LL respect the past record of success of ZE and support us as we continue forward with initiatives, most of which have already been approved by LL. There is a lot of talent here that can really realize a mutually beneficial mission. .....
[11:18]	Ginette Pinazzo 	In short, ZE can certainly plan its own management, whether LL is involved or not (but we strongly feel LL should at least have a rep in the group for some very practical purposes). ZE cannot and should not be subject to another group's 'nominations' to manage ZE's projects. It;'s outrageous and unethical to allow one group to have a say over another's operations. ZE has spoken, and we'd like to be heard, supported and allowed to continue to help in as official capacity as possible. We believe this plan illustrates the best solution for a strong and do-able foundation.
[11:19]	Ginette Pinazzo 	finally....
[11:19]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Finally, one final, very small example of how this group has a Will. Here's a document I'm passing that illustrates how we feel about the group's direction. Note the petition of names at bottom. The petition is the main reason I am showing you this.
[11:19]	Ginette Pinazzo 	FIN
[11:20]	Ginette Pinazzo 	you DID ask for this nomination thing Viale...peoepl have been burbning the candles at both ends to get this done..haha
[11:20]	Viale Linden 	Ginette - as I mentioned before the zexpo 2011 event should move forward and we will make decision post event on the future of the 4 corners
[11:20]	Viale Linden 	Is this clear?
[11:21]	Ginette Pinazzo 	I understand Viale.....its very clear
[11:21]	Viale Linden 	Ok
[11:21]	Viale Linden 	Coube be - you have the floor
[11:21]	Couldbe 	for what viale?
[11:22]	Viale Linden 	Zada - do you kneed to discuss anything?
[11:22]	Couldbe 	apart from wondering what is to become of the adult content issues that we have - which you say are "ticket management" I don't think there's anything left of interest
[11:22]	Zada Bury 	Oh, no. Actualy not.
[11:22]	Viale Linden 	counter?
[11:22]	Zada Bury 	Umm, why?
[11:22]	Couldbe 	you are aware we have an agenda for this meeting, aren't you?
[11:22]	Counter Landfall 	Sure
[11:22]	Janicka Engineer 	I would like one question from another thing Viale :)
[11:23]	Viale Linden 	Ok - first Counter
[11:23]	Counter Landfall 	I kinda read you that we are off the agenda for today, so I am not sure if we should even touch that
[11:23]	Viale Linden 	Can someone list the agenda points
[11:24]	Counter Landfall 	I can list my own points
[11:24]	Zada Bury 	https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Adult_Content_User_Group
[11:24]	Hypatia Meili 	most of the topis on it have to do with what is being put off until after zexpo 2011
[11:24]	Zan 	smiles
[11:24]	Counter Landfall 	most of them pertains to the discussion we had last meeting
[11:24]	Viale Linden 	I will erase all points after meeting
[11:24]	Innula Zenovka 	at some point I'd appreciate clarification about the status and future of the Adult content stuff in the wiki and KB, which i did put on the agenda
[11:24]	Counter Landfall 	and the contention over how the ZE group operates
[11:25]	Counter Landfall 	can we discuss the agenda itmes or do you want to keep that for later only?
[11:25]	Zan 	allow for change & growth Counter
[11:25]	Zan 	& join in wityth it
[11:25]	Viale Linden 	agenda is too long for this meeting
[11:26]	Viale Linden 	let me call some points to order
[11:26]	BBQBill Odriscoll	I suggest giving the new team time to evaluate the process themselves
[11:26]	Zada Bury 	*nods heavy*
[11:26]	Counter Landfall 	ok, allow me one item then
[11:26]	Janicka Engineer 	wb ginette
[11:26]	Viale Linden 	counter - go ahead
[11:26]	Counter Landfall 	last meeting you aksed for the community to indtify 5 potential team members for a land management group
[11:26]	Counter Landfall 	ZA has nominated 6 names, they are in the agenda
[11:26]	Viale Linden 	I saw that
[11:27]	Counter Landfall 	I want to submit these names as candidates for those roles
[11:27]	Viale Linden 	We are postponing management
[11:27]	Counter Landfall 	We expext there will be other dandidates
[11:27]	Viale Linden 	However, duly noted
[11:27]	Counter Landfall 	thanks
[11:27]	Huntress Catteneo	I would appreciate the urgent topic of Zindra Vortex be addressed at some point, that can really not wait until after Zexpo :{ I tried working out what theagenda items listed meant and covered, but sorry, to me they are not in simple english they are generallities that I have no ide of
[11:28]	BBQBill Odriscoll	User enablement in general
[11:28]	Ginette Pinazzo 	sorry I crashed.......the agenda has been bascially trashed......we should get that sorted out soon
[11:28]	Qie 	Huntress: yes, I wanted to know, also, how Vortex is operating without Blondin as owner.
[11:28]	Viale Linden 	Huntress - what is the root of the issue
[11:28]	Temperance Hax 	ZE also has nominations, thats the ones get things done
[11:29]	Sissy Blitz 	why do we need some onein charge
[11:29]	BBQBill Odriscoll	We digress
[11:29]	Viale Linden 	Ok - sec - let me check the agencda
[11:29]	Zan 	the root of the issue is that the managers of Vortex are powerless
[11:30]	Ginette Pinazzo 	I see the agenda wiki has been 'gamed'.....items placed before other people's items, items added with no authorship, and material added that isnt even in the grid, scrawled at the bottom. We need to return to format and sanity. Out of fairness to those who do respect the rules, we shouldnt be giving floor time to that material today.
[11:30]	Zan 	* of that issue
[11:30]	BBQBill Odriscoll	I think Gina does a spectacular job as a facilitator, organizer, and champion.
[11:30]	Vick Forcella 	Vick Forcella slithers in
''
[11:30]	BBQBill Odriscoll	I would not characterize that as incharge
[11:30]	BBQBill Odriscoll	But if that's what you mean I agree
[11:30]	Sissy Blitz 	Ginette does not like me
[11:30]	Viale Linden 	First couple of points about 4 corners - this is answered. Wait till post zexpo2011
[11:30]	Zada Bury 	Maybe, to resolve one ... long and unholy ... discussion. "Zindra Expo"-group ... is owned actually by "Blondin Linden". Ginette, as leader of the ZEXPO-event should have the ownership and that point is done. How she uses the group, is then her part.
[11:30]	Huntress Catteneo	the root is that it is really non functioning, there is no power to do anything but talk very nicely to trouble makers
[11:30]	Ginette Pinazzo 	ZE meetings are fun too...we have decent food
[11:31]	BBQBill Odriscoll	lol
[11:31]	Hypatia Meili 	righ now the vortex group has no powers, weneed to be able to police th site in both sences
[11:31]	Viale Linden 	renaming of zindra sim decision - I think we are in agreement to keep the name - no?
[11:31]	BBQBill Odriscoll	We need to be anabled to serve the community Viale
[11:31]	Hypatia Meili 	troble makers and clean up
[11:31]	BBQBill Odriscoll	Huntress is right
[11:31]	Ginette Pinazzo 	we are not in agreement Viale...not at all
[11:31]	BBQBill Odriscoll	And Hypathia
[11:31]	Dancer Greenfield	The name has to be changed
[11:31]	Temperance Hax 	Gettigng things done is imprtant, the proposals to just stop doing anything by counter are frankly dismaying
[11:31]	Counter Landfall 	ZA's position is to keep the name yes
[11:31]	Ginette Pinazzo 	we want the name to say Zindra PLUS with an added eleemtn...so its not just Zindra.......ZE wants that
[11:32]	Zada Bury 	About the naming, both parties have valid points.
[11:32]	Viale Linden 	can we keep the personal attacks down
[11:32]	Huntress Catteneo	can't return objects, last night a girl rezed a mansion on the arrival point
[11:32]	Vick Forcella 	WE agree!
[11:32]	Dancer Greenfield	At the last Zexpo meeting we were unanimous that the name must be changed
[11:32]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Zindra + Promenade gets you the Zindar search results plus cant be confused with the mainland's name
[11:32]	Viale Linden 	In the lack of consensus on renaming. We may need a solomon solution
[11:32]	Qie 	I think it's a mistake to label all community assets as "Zindra something-or-other"... better just the Zindra sim keep the name, and broaden all the others.
[11:33]	Zada Bury 	Maybe we can mmake following: Until the next meeting, we collect arguments.
[11:33]	Couldbe 	agrees with Qie
[11:33]	Counter Landfall 	ok, only, it is your sim. make a decision
[11:33]	Hypatia Meili 	i think either by nam or signage it simply needs to be made obvious that the zindra sim is starting point
[11:33]	Vick Forcella 	zindra = zindra
[11:33]	Viale Linden 	Zindra is an artifact of the zoning. Why dont you place ads based on subbject?
[11:33]	Qie 	yeah, actually, need that signage regardless of name
[11:33]	Couldbe 	because classifieds don't work?
[11:34]	Couldbe 	because people search using the map?
[11:34]	Counter Landfall 	good point CouldBe
[11:34]	BBQBill Odriscoll	They work for me
[11:34]	Innula Zenovka 	i agree with Qie, too
[11:34]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Viale..its a basic marketing issue....we have many peoepl (not just noobs) who see 'Zindra' and thinks thats the whoelZindra....seriosuly
[11:34]	Zan 	The resticting of the sim name to the continent name is very misleading
[11:34]	Viale Linden 	I think next week agenda item is how we can help promote adult without offending the masses
[11:35]	Viale Linden 	Not noobs
[11:35]	Zan 	1 sim does not = 358 sims
[11:35]	Viale Linden 	maybe alts
[11:35]	Innula Zenovka 	and Zindra != adult content
[11:35]	Janicka Engineer 	zindra grid have 343 regions :)
[11:35]	Hypatia Meili 	New York, New York -> hey how about -> Zindra, Zindra
[11:35]	Counter Landfall 	it is easier for noobs to learn that Zindra = the contient Zindra
[11:35]	Counter Landfall 	and when they search for it land in Zindra
[11:35]	Couldbe 	yes but Innula this is no longer a meeting to talk about adult content
[11:35]	Viale Linden 	I would like some proposals - not text chat on what to do with the zindra region.
[11:36]	Couldbe 	only promoting zindra and its communities
[11:36]	Counter Landfall 	since you cant teleport to a contient
[11:36]	Viale Linden 	added as an agenda item
[11:36]	StarSong Bright 	I have a comment
[11:36]	Ginette Pinazzo 	you have the ages-old Zindra Promenade proposal Viale? thats bene presented in thoroughly and it waht weve bene moving on
[11:36]	Qie 	Proposal: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User:Qie_Niangao/Zindra_and_Adult_Content
[11:36]	Hypatia Meili 	Viale, i wonder because of something you said if LL is aware of something
[11:37]	Counter Landfall 	and Ginette tend to forget the even older original proposla for Zindra and the anme
[11:37]	Counter Landfall 	name*
[11:37]	Vick Forcella 	Zindra is named perfectly imnsho
[11:37]	Counter Landfall 	ZA's newest proposla is to keep the name Zindra
[11:37]	Viale Linden 	Ok - I will not be fielding proposals in the meeting
[11:37]	Counter Landfall 	it is on the ganda for today
[11:37]	Viale Linden 	look for an update on agenda for wiki
[11:37]	Viale Linden 	Ok
[11:38]	Sissy Blitz 	I propose a Art Exhibition
[11:38]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Viale.....question abt an item youd say you would think abt for today.......
[11:38]	Viale Linden 	someone posted this as an agenda itemAdult Content KB/Wiki Articles being updated
[11:38]	Innula Zenovka 	i did
[11:38]	Counter Landfall 	cool, but is that strategic Sissy?
[11:39]	Innula Zenovka 	i noticed there was a lot of tidying up going on, and wondered if this might mean a much-overdue update was likely to happen
[11:39]	Huntress Catteneo	It it is to be an arrival point it needs to be like a starting into the world help spot, but with adult specific material available and a more festive welcoming look
[11:39]	Sissy Blitz 	Yes Counter art built second life
[11:39]	Temperance Hax 	artmaze was awesome
[11:39]	Viale Linden 	Innula - please address this at the Community tools user group
[11:39]	Sissy Blitz 	I was removed from the art maze
[11:40]	StarSong Bright 	StarSong Bright would like to see the Zexpo and Zinda sim address "adult content in sl" more and not just the adult continent. A great deal of SL's adult content is on estates, not mainland, due to issues of lag and control and whatnot. I would like to see the scope visibily widened to includ "all adult content in sl". I am fairly new to these meetings, but clearly LL leadership is needed in the current Zexpo group and in giving the necessary rights to the EXISTING programs underway. Putting them all off until september is a disservice to all IMHO.
''
[11:40]	Couldbe 	ok, so adult specific questions now have to be addressed to the specific user group? we no longer have a single point of contact?
[11:40]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	zindra has been zindra for over two years. Name doesnt change the content. The fact is businesses are failing in Zindra, people are moving back to Mature land to sell their wares and make more money on the marketplaces. ADFARMS being on the roof tops of buildings in Zindra causes a decline in Zindra activity as well. People do not tend to gather at those places. You can tell on the map where people gather. Having a vistor counter. I have not seen an increase in population on my zindra land. I've seen the land aruond my parcel sell 3 times already. That is a problem.
[11:40]	Viale Linden 	Please no more private ims
[11:40]	Innula Zenovka 	this is the problem, only.. adult content spans so many different topics.. we need an adult content group where we can raise them.. i can't attending three or four different user groups a week
[11:40]	Viale Linden 	I am not a bot
[11:40]	Vick Forcella 	we agree
[11:41]	Hypatia Meili 	so more adult moves back to mature
[11:41]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	So if Zindra has a delcine LL has a decline... thats fact things go back to govenor linden.
[11:41]	Viale Linden 	Innula - community tools meeting discussed changes to the wiki and kb
[11:41]	Hypatia Meili 	whichis anisue to us on zindra and on othe A sims
[11:41]	Couldbe 	there's more adult on mature than here these days anyway
[11:41]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Viale...do you think it woudl reduce stress if these AUCUG metsg split back int6o 2 sepaaretr ones as before: one for Zindra stuf and one for adult content stuff? woudl that help or hurt?
[11:42]	Viale Linden 	You guys can do that and report back here
[11:42]	Couldbe 	so you are determined that this meeting is no longer about adult content issues and is solely to be around promoting zindra?
[11:42]	Innula Zenovka 	so are you saying, only, that topics relating to adult content AND something else need to go to the something else group?
[11:42]	Hypatia Meili 	blondinuse to also have general comuites meeting on his plot
[11:43]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	that was the problem from Day one Couldbe. zindra isnt being promoted. Entertainment groups outside of Zindra are being imported in grid to promote those bands not the businesses, or arts already existing in world.
[11:43]	Counter Landfall 	I think we can say Blondin's format was not always helpful
[11:43]	Counter Landfall 	most of the time went to dodge issues he could not answer
[11:43]	Qie 	there are hundreds of reasons that we need a Land / Mainland / LDPW user group, desperately. Zindra is just one such reason.
[11:43]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Blondin's format made progress out of chaos....success should eb bilt upon
[11:44]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Soemtrimes I think breaking this meeting into 2 again woudl help
[11:44]	Dancer Greenfield	It was Blondin's idea to combine Zindra issues and general Adult issues into one meeting, I didn't like that but I went along with it
[11:44]	Hypatia Meili 	just saying ther are les actul meetings
[11:44]	BBQBill Odriscoll	I agree on both points Gina
[11:44]	Ginette Pinazzo 	because the dynamics are so diffeernt
[11:44]	Couldbe 	blondin delivered very little to resolving adult content issues - even amanda made more headway in her two weeks in the chair
[11:44]	BBQBill Odriscoll	Yes
[11:44]	Hypatia Meili 	he stil held is general one
[11:44]	Vick Forcella 	I adodred Amanda her approach
[11:44]	Hypatia Meili 	maybe it should be 2 back to back ones here then interrelated
[11:45]	BBQBill Odriscoll	More focus on those issues would help Couldbe
[11:45]	Ginette Pinazzo 	I am curious how Viale feels about 1 meeting turning into 2...haha
[11:45]	Hypatia Meili 	or just longer
[11:45]	Viale Linden 	any more questions? appears agenda items are answered
[11:45]	Couldbe 	originally the meetings were adult content and zindra because that's all there was! for the first few months it was only those of us with businesses who were forced to come here or change our estates to adult that were the target group
[11:45]	Zan 	lols
[11:45]	Counter Landfall 	it is pretty useless for the adult content interested to sit and micro manage Zindra issues in the same meeting
[11:45]	Janicka Engineer 	yes I would like
[11:45]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Viale...there is one small issue on the agenda not addressed
[11:45]	Janicka Engineer 	and wait for place
[11:45]	Janicka Engineer 	:)
[11:45]	Zada Bury 	But .... depart it back in 2 meetings ... would be part of LL. It will need at least 1 from LL-staff for 1 hour for an other meeting.
[11:45]	Viale Linden 	Ginette - please
[11:46]	Counter Landfall 	I would have a general adult content meeting where we can discuss strategic and overall marketing issues
[11:46]	Ginette Pinazzo 	ok Viale.....
[11:46]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	We discussed that GInette. Blondin said he would have 2 meetings because we complained mOndays are discrimintory against people who can not attend or vote on Mondays. Not everyone who wants to be involved are being in volved because people are too hard headed to get the reality check that Zindra represents over 300 sims
[11:46]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Do you have feedback or decision on the 'Better ACUG meetings' proposal from last week? (relating to improving the meeting format with the chair and agenda and adding some professional tweaks). You seemed to indicate youd be thinking it over.
[11:46]	Couldbe 	and adult content represents around 4,000 iirc
[11:47]	Viale Linden 	I need to wait on that approach. As I would like to learn more about the attendees and maybe add some
[11:47]	Couldbe 	although I think the number declined last week - unsurprisingly
[11:47]	Counter Landfall 	there are about 2300 adult sims including Zindra with 343
[11:47]	Vick Forcella 	Drop by anytime viale
[11:47]	Viale Linden 	is anyone here a private region holder for adult
[11:47]	Qie 	no, Couldbe, adult was up, at least as a percentage of sims, and has been increasing steadily, IIRC
[11:47]	Ginette Pinazzo 	ok Viale...how do you want handle the out of control agenda wiki?
[11:47]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	Monday meetings can not possibly represent 2643 sims. thats silly.
[11:47]	Qie 	it's G that's tanking, fast.
[11:47]	Janicka Engineer 	yes me
[11:47]	BBQBill Odriscoll	Viale- Question when you get a moment Viale
[11:48]	Hypatia Meili 	im wonderin how many off zindra are even aware of the meeting
[11:48]	Viale Linden 	or Janiacka - what is your region?
[11:48]	Huntress Catteneo	I have an adult private sim
[11:48]	Couldbe 	I stand corrected Adult rated regions grew by 16 to 2659 whilst General rated fell by 21 to 4807. Adult rated now 8.5% of the grid, whilst General rated are 15.4%.
[11:48]	Janicka Engineer 	Mistress
[11:48]	Janicka Engineer 	I am one of rental group owners
[11:48]	Counter Landfall 	not 3643 sims Jez, but issues pertainint to adult content in those sims can
[11:48]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Star owns estates not on Zindra..right, Star?
[11:48]	Counter Landfall 	Zindra has its own issues they will not want to be involved in
[11:48]	StarSong Bright 	yes i have a dozen sims, about half have adult content, the rest are residential
[11:48]	Zan 	agrees Counter
[11:48]	Innula Zenovka 	Estate - Adult: 2284 + Linden - Adult: 348 according to Tyche's latest survey
[11:48]	Hypatia Meili 	but cant be ignored either
[11:48]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	whats pertinant counter is they do not have representation here. They did not vote on who will be the leadersship either.
[11:49]	Viale Linden 	woudl it be fair to say 95% of you are mainland zindra concerns?
[11:49]	Hypatia Meili 	itily this meetinwaqs zindra comnuity
[11:49]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Star to me represenst an important link....estate ownersd who feel Zindra IS connected to tgheirr interests
[11:49]	Zan 	Mainland is not related to Private estates
[11:49]	Hypatia Meili 	i suport all adult content tho
[11:49]	Counter Landfall 	ZA has suggested of r along time an adult section in the forusm where thse things also can be discussed
[11:49]	Zan 	I hold several Zindra sims
[11:49]	Vick Forcella 	We are mainland, wit some minor exceptions
[11:49]	StarSong Bright 	but zindra is adult content, its not all about being mainland or not
[11:49]	Qie 	viale, probably accurate, but that may not be what this meeting *should* be about.
[11:49]	Counter Landfall 	that will be more fluid I think
[11:49]	Hypatia Meili 	and manyisues are genral adult issues
[11:49]	Ginette Pinazzo 	mainldn IS related becsuee of marketing/promotion
[11:49]	Viale Linden 	Ok - we may need to recuit some region holders too
[11:49]	Hypatia Meili 	i have off zindra adult issues too
[11:50]	Viale Linden 	would like to broaden the scope
[11:50]	Viale Linden 	I will look into this
[11:50]	Couldbe 	mainland is mainland - there used to be a group dedicated to mainland issues an that's where all issues with the zindra mainland should be addressed
[11:50]	Counter Landfall 	issues like visibility in search, events, on signup pages etc etc are general
[11:50]	Counter Landfall 	and can be discussed as such
[11:50]	Huntress Catteneo	I would not say 95% here are just mainland
[11:50]	Hypatia Meili 	i am manger at amjor adult club and we are tired of adult clubs in mature competeing
[11:50]	Viale Linden 	I would like to move away from mainland issue only
[11:50]	Zan 	Adult content = aduilt regions
[11:50]	Vick Forcella 	Viale, I think it's to soon for private to participate on these meetings
[11:51]	Ginette Pinazzo 	(did we get a response abt breaking back into 2 meetings or not? I missed it maybe)
[11:51]	Counter Landfall 	sounds good Viale
[11:51]	Zan 	Zindra needs it's own treatment
[11:51]	Couldbe 	adult content = land, advertising, visibility, marketplace, search, verification
[11:51]	Couldbe 	amongst others
[11:51]	StarSong Bright 	StarSong Bright volunteers to give Viale a tour of some of the adult content to be found out in the estates. :-)
''
[11:51]	Zan 	mainland can not be compared to private estates in many ways
[11:51]	Viale Linden 	one meeting and if we cannot be productive. We will need to review the purpoose of this meeting
[11:51]	JeZeBeLe Dagger 	ACES is a network cooperative, 15 private sims involved, 2000 members 80 educators. All focused on adult education linked to the freedom Continent Network another 20 sims registered as adult content. We haven't needed zindra expo or alliance to be successful. Being cross cultural we've done it without that co dependancy. I notice that what what the few think really doesnt represent the whole due to the whole not having the voice.
[11:52]	Vick Forcella 	We have common interests, adult verification and promotion
[11:52]	Viale Linden 	As you know - 1 hour for everyone is very expensive and we should not waste time
[11:52]	Hypatia Meili 	a lot of that was adressed first by zindar at zindra meetings tho
[11:52]	BBQBill Odriscoll	Question
[11:52]	Ginette Pinazzo 	actually, Zindra topics dotn really take up the whoel meeting...often just half.........its not just the subject matter...its the WAY its handled thats the difference....Zindar topics have largeky been a matter of postive proposals.......Adult Conent topics ar eles prtoposals and more just banter..to be honest
[11:52]	Viale Linden 	I may reach out to more productive members for more discussion that aligns with the goals mentioned above
[11:52]	Hypatia Meili 	its th arguing that takes time :(
[11:53]	Huntress Catteneo	At the moment I have seen a lot of argument on everything except one, that something needs to be done to make the Vortex workable, it is owned by LL and not a group etc, noone can do anything there except wait for it to blow up
[11:53]	Viale Linden 	5 minutes - any last min questions?
[11:53]	Vick Forcella 	IM me viale, or e-mail
[11:53]	Ginette Pinazzo 	Viale..can vortex staff meet with you 1v1 during week to develop quick solutions to their immeduate needs?
[11:53]	Hypatia Meili 	ihad coment onsomethin els you said Vale
[11:53]	Janicka Engineer 	I still wait for space on my question
[11:53]	Counter Landfall 	are you now our primary contact Viale?
[11:53]	Viale Linden 	Vic - try this email community@lindenlab.com
[11:53]	Hypatia Meili 	LL keeps pushing facebook, are you aware that leave user two choices, Link RL identity or violate facebook TOS
[11:53]	Temperance Hax 	Yes vortex adult sandbox, the helpers cant return objects, can t hat be addressed please?
[11:54]	Vick Forcella 	Viale, ask Lexi... :)
[11:54]	Viale Linden 	We cannot promote Adult via Facbook
[11:54]	Huntress Catteneo	or eject abusers
[11:54]	Dancer Greenfield	What are the Facebook TOS problems?
[11:54]	Couldbe 	you could if you wanted to
[11:54]	Vick Forcella 	We can promote naughty :)
[11:54]	Huntress Catteneo	facebook must have rl names
[11:54]	Hypatia Meili 	neds tobe real personwith real doienty , = use yor RL name
[11:54]	Counter Landfall 	sigh, it can be done on FB without Linden Lab
[11:54]	Viale Linden 	Cearte a facebook page
[11:54]	Hypatia Meili 	identy
[11:55]	Couldbe 	have you made sure that your page cannot be accessed by those under 16? otherwise you are probably in breach of the facebook tos
[11:55]	Innula Zenovka 	where would it be appropriate to raise questions about the sort-of-brokeness of age verification for a lot of people, only?
[11:55]	Viale Linden 	However, it cannot promote adult content
[11:55]	Counter Landfall 	understood Viale
[11:55]	BBQBill Odriscoll	Question Viale
[11:55]	Viale Linden 	shoot Innula
[11:55]	Vick Forcella 	Promote all aspects of Second Life
[11:55]	Vick Forcella 	include *naughty*..
[11:55]	StarSong Bright 	personally i will *not* connect my sl adult activities and rl identity.... too easy for it to bite you in the tuckus when future employers or grandma go googling you...... its really not a good option for adult content.
[11:55]	Temperance Hax 	In the past people have lost their rl jobs due to being identified as adult content users via hasty facebook links to SL
[11:55]	Dancer Greenfield	My Facebook page is in my real name, no "avatar page" for me :)
[11:56]	Viale Linden 	I want to talk ways to promote adult next week and elevate this dicussiion
[11:56]	Innula Zenovka 	well, i hadn't really prepared anything.. more noting that it's a general complaint in the forums that people can't get age verification to work
[11:56]	Counter Landfall 	sounds good
[11:56]	Innula Zenovka 	and i wondered what, if anything, was happening on that front
[11:56]	Slaton Linden 	Couldbe, no we cannot promote adult using FB. It's clearly against their ToS
[11:56]	Vick Forcella 	Viale, request, clean up the agenda pls
[11:56]	Counter Landfall 	shall we submit input in advnace to the agenda?
[11:56]	Innula Zenovka 	and also, for non-US users, i wondered if Dragonfish could help
[11:56]	Couldbe 	you could - what they classify as adult is very limited
[11:56]	Innula Zenovka 	since they have to get age verification to work, as a matter of law, for the their gambling stuff
[11:57]	Couldbe 	and you didn't answer my question about whether you've locked it down or not
[11:57]	Hypatia Meili 	fine for you Kaleu, but not many others
[11:57]	Innula Zenovka 	so they must have an idea about how to verify the ages of non-US residents
[11:57]	Viale Linden 	Thanks - Innula. we will look into that
[11:57]	Counter Landfall 	shall we submit input in advnace to the agenda for next week?
[11:57]	Hypatia Meili 	i hope elvis can no longer verify
[11:57]	Huntress Catteneo	mmm non US, Aussie here, and it is now 4.30am yay love these meeting times but shows how important to us, I know I am not the only aussie here right now
[11:58]	Vick Forcella 	I request more info about Zindra and adult verification info at the noob hubs
[11:58]	Innula Zenovka 	will you follow up at a subsequent meeting, only?
[11:58]	Ginette Pinazzo 	I have to say one thing abt the agenda itself before we part! its key
[11:58]	Couldbe 	elvis can't apparently - you need to try another dead entertainer these days
[11:58]	Viale Linden 	we are clearing the messy wiki agenda and you can submit new one
[11:58]	Temperance Hax 	4.30 AM for me, also
[11:58]	Counter Landfall 	ok, thanks
[11:58]	Zada Bury 	Any "homework" we should do until next week?
[11:58]	Vick Forcella 	Great Viale, we thing you rock!
[11:58]	Viale Linden 	The 2 i am interested in are 1) promotion tools, 2) Zidnra Sim solution
[11:58]	Ginette Pinazzo 	great. everyone please remember to put your name on agedna items and dont 'bump' anyone
[11:59]	Slaton Linden 	We'll review new agenda items and then let you know what will be included by the end of this week
[11:59]	Viale Linden 	links like Ginette would be helpfu;
[11:59]	Counter Landfall 	great
[11:59]	Innula Zenovka 	promotion of what.. zindra or of adult content in general?
[11:59]	Couldbe 	a new column that indicates the date first raised would be good - one of the things about that page is that items drag on for years and never get resolved
[11:59]	Counter Landfall 	we have good ideas on the table
[11:59]	Viale Linden 	Notecards inworld are not helpful
[11:59]	Vick Forcella 	There is only promoion of Second Life
[11:59]	Viale Linden 	Thanks everyone for your time today.
[11:59]	Zada Bury 	We have to thank you.
[11:59]	Vick Forcella 	You quick Viale, wow :)
[12:00]	Counter Landfall 	so where do we submit input if not on notecards?
[12:00]	Viale Linden 	I think we are on the road to productive dialogue
[12:00]	Vick Forcella 	e-mail
[12:00]	Dancer Greenfield	Thank you too
[12:00]	Counter Landfall 	which email address?
[12:00]	Zada Bury 	*gives the feather-bag some coffee* Slaton ... awake?
[12:00]	Counter Landfall 	the community one?
[12:00]	Vick Forcella 	community@
[12:00]	Huntress Catteneo	please please do not forget Vortex again, my negotiation skills are good, but eventually the miscreants will realise we are all toothless tigers
[12:00]	Slaton Linden 	Counter - email community@lindenlab.com
[12:00]	Viale Linden 	Bye
[12:00]	Counter Landfall 	bye
[12:00]	Vick Forcella 	TC Viale, SLanton!
[12:00]	Qie 	thanks Viale, Slaton
[12:00]	Vick Forcella 	Beer anyone?
[12:00]	Temperance Hax 	what d ecision was made about the vortex sandbox?
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