125286-recently-returned-goodbad

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Hey kids,I've recently subbed once again with one of my friends (He's till on 10 days, however we have both been here since Beta) and thought I'd share my experiences, thoughts, and opinions.
 
 
 
Good news first?
 
Optimisation seems 100x better. I've not been subject to the previous stuttering or bad shiz I was. It's amazing and I can finally see the awesome looking world!
 
Small QOL updates! Example: Skipping shit-shiz tutorial. Loving it. Shove it in me.Early questing seems easier, and more enjoyable with mounts! (Not sure if anything else changed?)
 
Community: I've been /zone with my mate in tow recently trying to find dungeon members, or just levelling mates, and we've found a few....everyone is really talkative, engaging and mature, nothing they say is toxic or degrading like other MMOs can be. Everyone seems to have a sense of community and belonging. It's refreshing and will probably be destroyed if my next point changes....
 
 
 
Bad shiz?The population is still far too low. I've queue'd for about 5hr (Protogames/BG, Aussie, GMT+10) I'm from XIV 1.0 so I understand this takes time, and have seen massive improvements! Hoping WS can pull a WS2.0.
 
UI: Terrible still. Just. Terrible. Please go play XIV and adapt to their simplistic and readable approach. Their 'Duty Finder' is terrible....but please steal it. It'd be a massive improvement. And please steal WoWs 'Party member quest %' tracker (Though, I think I read changes are coming?).Third and final point: Your terminology for stats  deviate too far from the norm. It's annoying. They're just stats. Keep them in line with every other MMO. STR, AGI, VIT, CRIT,  etc. You're over complicating something to the point that I don't care. I shouldn't have to head tilt like a beagle, google, google my google then throw a dictionary at the wall to work out your stats. I understand and appreciate that you were trying to do something different...but it's terrible. Nothing is wrong with the currently used terms, it just makes it harder to jump from one game to the next. Imagine you're trying WoW and WS after XIV, WoW is somewhat relatable - they have Strength and Crit. All the values are easy to understand and known. Move on to WS? There's moxie and grit. No one cares about your stat names. Make them easy to understand, relate/compare them to other games.
 
Are you intentionally trying to alienate yourself from mainstream MMOs?My recommendation? It's XIV time.Run a poll. Ask people what they like, dislike, what they'd like to see, etc etc.Have 2 versions though: Current players, and open to public.
 
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Regards,
 
Bravo.	
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Errrr Swtor deviates from the norm aswell - they use Cunning, Aim & Willpower.
 
The only state in WS that would get anyone "head tilting" imo would be moxie
 
Finesse - just another word for agility 
Brutality - Come on.....if you don't think that means strength then I don't know what does
Insight - Tells me it has to do with the brain aka willpower aka magic
Grit - determination and "Endurance"
Tech - A funny one like Aim from Swtor. a few MMOs have "tech" or technology, but seem to mean different things in different games.
 
 
I'm sorry, but I think you're being a tad too hard in the acronyms department. You cant really use STR, AGIL and MGK in a sci-fi type game.......just doen't fit	
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			I love feedback threads, but it seems like this feedback amounts to little more than "this game doesn't play like Final Fantasy, so you're alienating me because I have to learn new words!"  :lol:	
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			main difference being I hate XIV's UI personally, and they don't allow/support addons (something they said they would). WS's stock UI is looking better each drop and you can always use addons for a lot of things, I know I even use one for the party finder.Winner? The one that lets you actually run a parse in game. I can expect a better UI from WS as they continue polishing it up too.	
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...Brutality means strength?
 
 
God help <insert your country here>
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I've been watching my son play FF as well and as far as UI's go I cannot imagine anyone calling that out as a paragon of UI design.  EVERYTHING has a different font.  None of the fonts even remotely look good together.  A hideous amount of screen clutter with things overlapping.  It's really quite insane.
 
WS's stock is getting pared down a bit more in Drop 5 as we'll see the Datachron go away in favor of sort of a combo quest tracker.  I haven't come to a full conclusion of how good a job they did on it (it's on the PTR, you can go check it out) but I think it's probably in the general direction of "better".
 
In all honesty, I think WS's is pretty compact on the whole, though maybe I have my monitor and screen resolution to thank for that.  There are behaviors that I dislike (wish raid frame would stick to two column, dislike the buff bar's method of having things go off into invisibility, etc.  But these are quite fixable things and there are addons now that manage some of this, and I'm sure the stock UI will get massaged as time goes on.	
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Bad point #1 on Population:  It's too low and dungeon finder takes too long.  Well, you said you have used /zone to find groups, there's one solution, keep doing that.
 
Bad point #2 on UI:  Addons work.  And I don't know what the big deal is with it, I only use addons for my UI to make it more streamlined in the information provided.  I have no problems with the default UI.
 
Bad point #3 on stat terminology:  Give it two weeks, and you wont notice.  Words changed, and if you are confused by them, they are explained in the character window.
 
 
I would suspect that FFXIV wouldn't have anything close to the numbers it has if it wasn't a final fantasy game.  Their most difficult content put me to sleep.	
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{| class="blockquote"
...Brutality means strength?
 
 
God help <insert your country here>
.
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actually, don't the attributes translate to different stats for different classes (mostly where they get assault power)? It confused me at first too when people said to stack different things and i just thought "oh, they might need crit or whatever more than other classes", but nope it's actually because that's the stat that gives them damage.
 
Here: http://wildstar.mmorpg-life.com/guides/wildstar-stats-attributes/
 
In the end, this is a brilliant move because it prevents the two classes that share the same armor tier from fighting over the same gear while still allowing them to cross-gear when necessary.
 
As for grouping, you should join the global chat (for entity exile side, it's /chjoin lfg. dunno about dominion) and spam there.	
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{| class="blockquote"
...Brutality means strength?
 
 
God help <insert your country here>
.
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			The moments I mentioned XIV were in references to the UI. Not about the gameplay.	
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			The idea of that stat naming is to give it a "WS feel" on top of being generic enough that they can make the stat do different things on other classes. Brutality is strikethrough (deflect reduction) on a lot of dps as well as assault power. Tech is assault power on medic,  support power on a tank, deflect rating/crit on every other class	
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			Would like to point out that FF XIV went out of its way to change words in it's own setting too. I had to headtilt google-google-google throw dictionary when I saw terms like onze, ponze, yalms, malms etc.. had to ask what measure of time a "bell" was. Please don't criticize one game for changing stat terms around, then praise another game for doing the same thing with units of measure and distance.	
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			They do.  And I don't think that's necessarily a problem, as most MMOs have something different for each class to value (unless you homogenize it like GW2 or something).  It DOES kind of become a problem for crafting.  If I'm making someone a weapon for a class I'm not real familiar with, I usually have to double check which stat is main, and which stat is crithit/critsev.  At this point I know them mostly but doesn't hurt to check.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Would like to point out that FF XIV went out of its way to change words in it's own setting too. I had to headtilt google-google-google throw dictionary when I saw terms like onze, ponze, yalms, malms etc.. had to ask what measure of time a "bell" was. Please don't criticize one game for changing stat terms around, then praise another game for doing the same thing with units of measure and distance.
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{| class="blockquote"
Third and final point: Your terminology for stats  deviate too far from the norm. It's annoying. They're just stats. Keep them in line with every other MMO. STR, AGI, VIT, CRIT,  etc. You're over complicating something to the point that I don't care. I shouldn't have to head tilt like a beagle, google, google my google then throw a dictionary at the wall to work out your stats. I understand and appreciate that you were trying to do something different...but it's terrible. Nothing is wrong with the currently used terms, it just makes it harder to jump from one game to the next. Imagine you're trying WoW and WS after XIV, WoW is somewhat relatable - they have Strength and Crit. All the values are easy to understand and known. Move on to WS? There's moxie and grit. No one cares about your stat names. Make them easy to understand, relate/compare them to other games. 
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Am I the only one who thinks it's absolutely downright awesome that, instead of our strength, dexterity, and intellect (especially that last one always seemed so subjective; are all our melee classes idiots?), that our damage dealing stats are related to our brutality, finesse, and moxie?
 
Those words sound so much better.  Goes along with that feel that convinces all us players that we're all just *cupcake*ing awesome!	
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The population is still far too low. I've queue'd for about 5hr (Protogames/BG, Aussie, GMT+10) I'm from XIV 1.0 so I understand this takes time, and have seen massive improvements! Hoping WS can pull a WS2.0.\
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			Regarding the stats, I can understand how they're confusing to people at first - especially as what they do changes from class to class. I still have to check and double-check stats when on alts because for some reason I can't seem to remember the changes for each class. xD	
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{| class="blockquote"
 
Third and final point: Your terminology for stats  deviate too far from the norm. It's annoying. They're just stats. Keep them in line with every other MMO. STR, AGI, VIT, CRIT,  etc. You're over complicating something to the point that I don't care. I shouldn't have to head tilt like a beagle, google, google my google then throw a dictionary at the wall to work out your stats. I understand and appreciate that you were trying to do something different...but it's terrible. Nothing is wrong with the currently used terms, it just makes it harder to jump from one game to the next. Imagine you're trying WoW and WS after XIV, WoW is somewhat relatable - they have Strength and Crit. All the values are easy to understand and known. Move on to WS? There's moxie and grit. No one cares about your stat names. Make them easy to understand, relate/compare them to other games.
 
 
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			Do remember that this game has an amazing and robust UI modding system available.  Curse.com is your friend.	
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I've thought moxie was an awesome term ever since I first played Kingdom of Loathing way back in the day.
 
If you know what the words mean then it makes perfect sense that the stats would produce certain effects.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Errrr Swtor deviates from the norm aswell - they use Cunning, Aim & Willpower.
 
The only state in WS that would get anyone "head tilting" imo would be moxie
 
Finesse - just another word for agility 
Brutality - Come on.....if you don't think that means strength then I don't know what does
Insight - Tells me it has to do with the brain aka willpower aka magic
Grit - determination and "Endurance"
Tech - A funny one like Aim from Swtor. a few MMOs have "tech" or technology, but seem to mean different things in different games.
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			Finesse could also be associated with precision, so finding a way to strike through an opponent's defenses or deflect their attacks makes sense.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Do remember that this game has an amazing and robust UI modding system available.  Curse.com is your friend.
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A lot of the "old" addons were abandoned by their owners, try looking for "redux" versions, some members of the community took over the role.
 
You are better looking on the addon section of the forum here to see them in development, as some aren't listed on curse :)
 
As for the op, I prefer wildstar's ui to FF's stock UI, I found it much easier to change things even in stock (the interface menu has a lot of interactions that people don't mess with and they should :P)
 
I do hope you'll keep playing and enjoy the great community we have here, lfg is mostly unused for me as I have a large group of friends and guildies to ask before I even have to queue. I think this is the case for a lot of people :)	
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{| class="blockquote"
actually, don't the attributes translate to different stats for different classes (mostly where they get assault power)? It confused me at first too when people said to stack different things and i just thought "oh, they might need crit or whatever more than other classes", but nope it's actually because that's the stat that gives them damage.
 
Here: http://wildstar.mmorpg-life.com/guides/wildstar-stats-attributes/
 
In the end, this is a brilliant move because it prevents the two classes that share the same armor tier from fighting over the same gear while still allowing them to cross-gear when necessary.
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{| class="blockquote"
The attributes do affect different stats for different classes, but I don't agree with you that it's brilliant.  If two classes share the same armor tier and have reasons to "cross-gear when necessary", they will still be fighting over the same gear.
 
But when the attributes have class-specific meaning, it's like saying "Strength only increases damage if you're a fighter. If you're a thief, it increases your odds of a critical strike. If you're a wizard, strength increases the amount of damage your critical strikes do and if you're a priest, strength increases the odds that you'll penetrate an attempt to deflect."
 
This is so obviously silly that I would imagine it's part of why they don't use the common words like "Strength"--so that we never notice how silly it is that the same stat should do such completely different things for different classes.
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			I for one, don't feel alienated.  Likely because I own a thesaurus.	
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why don't you just mouseover and read the tooltip like the rest of us? It tells you exactly what and how much every stat does
It's not that hard to figure out. easy really
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Maybe you think it's silly, but I think it's pretty damn cool.  I like that all stats can be important to all classes.
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{| class="blockquote"
"Strength only increases damage if you're a fighter. If you're a thief, it increases your odds of a critical strike. If you're a wizard, strength increases the amount of damage your critical strikes do and if you're a priest, strength increases the odds that you'll penetrate an attempt to deflect."
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			Moxie can be dangerous in large amounts.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Bad shiz?
The population is still far too low. I've queue'd for about 5hr (Protogames/BG, Aussie, GMT+10) I'm from XIV 1.0 so I understand this takes time, and have seen massive improvements! Hoping WS can pull a WS2.0.
 
UI: Terrible still. Just. Terrible. Please go play XIV and adapt to their simplistic and readable approach. Their 'Duty Finder' is terrible....but please steal it. It'd be a massive improvement. And please steal WoWs 'Party member quest %' tracker (Though, I think I read changes are coming?).
 
Third and final point: Your terminology for stats  deviate too far from the norm. It's annoying. They're just stats. Keep them in line with every other MMO. STR, AGI, VIT, CRIT,  etc. You're over complicating something to the point that I don't care. I shouldn't have to head tilt like a beagle, google, google my google then throw a dictionary at the wall to work out your stats. I understand and appreciate that you were trying to do something different...but it's terrible. Nothing is wrong with the currently used terms, it just makes it harder to jump from one game to the next. Imagine you're trying WoW and WS after XIV, WoW is somewhat relatable - they have Strength and Crit. All the values are easy to understand and known. Move on to WS? There's moxie and grit. No one cares about your stat names. Make them easy to understand, relate/compare them to other games.
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{| class="blockquote"
There will likely be a B2P/F2P announcement coming in the next month, so do stick around as the population issues might easily correct themselves afterwards. 
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Hey, maybe stop proliferating that discussion into every thread on the forum.  It didn't come this month.  It didn't come last month, or the month before that, or the month before that, so just stop it already.  We don't need a payment model discussion in every *cupcake* forum thread in General.
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{| class="blockquote"
I don't get how that's silly at all. Different "classes" are trained differently and have varying perspectives on how to fight
 
a fighter will use his physical strength to swing his sword harder to increase damage
a thief will use his physical strength to put more force into a stab or thrust, therefore allowing the dagger to go deeper and his something more vital.
if you've read any old-school fantasy book, you'll know wizards need physical strength for endurance reasons. there are some magic systems that also link mana capacity to physical fitness if you tie strength and endurance into the same thing. having more strength also allows them to carry more reagents, spellbooks, etc.
a priest would use his strength for defensive reasons like deflection or even blocking with a shield. things like that require a *lot* of arm strength. and not to mention there are the zealot priests that actually fight frontline.
 
in the end, and I'm not talking about just in wildstar or games in general, the same "attribute" has many different uses.
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{| class="blockquote"
Absolutely right. The same attribute does have many different uses. But your breakdown by class of what strength does is simply incorrect. All classes need several of those uses.
 
Which class will use physical strength to swing a weapon harder? All of them that use weapons.
Which class will use physical strength to put more force into a stab or thrust? All of them that use stabbing weapons.
Which class will need physical strength to carry things? All of them that have to carry things.
Which class will need physical strength for defensive reasons like deflection or blocking with a shield? All of them that use shields.
 
That's why it's silly to make physical strength do one for a fighter, a different one for a thief, a different one for a wizard, and a different one for a priest. Because most of the things you listed would be relevant to all classes, and the rest would be relevant to at least 2 or 3 of them.
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{| class="blockquote"
Absolutely right. The same attribute does have many different uses. But your breakdown by class of what strength does is simply incorrect. All classes need several of those uses.
 
Which class will use physical strength to swing a weapon harder? All of them that use weapons.
Which class will use physical strength to put more force into a stab or thrust? All of them that use stabbing weapons.
Which class will need physical strength to carry things? All of them that have to carry things.
Which class will need physical strength for defensive reasons like deflection or blocking with a shield? All of them that use shields.
 
That's why it's silly to make physical strength do one for a fighter, a different one for a thief, a different one for a wizard, and a different one for a priest. Because most of the things you listed would be relevant to all classes, and the rest would be relevant to at least 2 or 3 of them.
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