122276-the-new-player-issue

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In light of today's NCsoft quarterly earnings report (http://massivelyop.net/2015/02/11/ncsoft-financials-paint-a-grim-picture-for-wildstar/) I posted this on Reddit and elsewhere, but I thought it was worth repeating here.
 
I think getting newer players into the game has been a problem and is going to continue to be a problem unless Carbine changes some things. From what I have seen while leveling recently on the Entity server, the lower-level zones have a fair amount of people in them during primetime, but are very empty during off hours. It's almost impossible to get into a lower level dungeon group as no one seems to be queuing up for them. The questing system (as has been said a million times) is very generic.
 
I would love to see Carbine do some things to encourage new players, such as an improved questing system and a reduction in the amount of players needed to run a dungeon. I loved that in SWTOR you only needed 4 players to run a dungeon and I think Wildstar would benefit from that system.
 
Yes, the max-level content is fantastic, but if it's too tiresome to get there, I think that will discourage people from playing the game. 
 
I'm sure a F2P or B2P model would help as well. I was just wondering if the community had any other thoughts about how to encourage new players?
 
 	
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Oh wow I didn't know the sales were that low.  Does that mean box purchases though or subs, cash shop etc.?  F2P/B2P will probably bring back more money but it will ruin the game for good.  I actually loved ToR until it went f2p.  Sure they are doing pretty good and likely saved the game, but the quality is horrible and having that cash shop shoved down your throat is horrible.  Yes you can pay a sub fee to access it all still, but their content is coming very slow and their most recent expansion, people were finishing it in 4-6 hours.  Such a shame.
 
Probably need to wait for the next quarter though too as some people are coming back, but how many no one knows.
 
As to encouraging new players, no clue.  That isn't my concern.  It is Carbine's.  But I guess you can just spread the word via forums, word of mouth etc.	
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Pardon my ignorance if I'm incorrect but don't these numbers only reflect box sales and not subscriptions and CREDD sales?
 
Also, there has been a noticeable jump in population since drop 4 and I believe this data reflects the population decline prior to that.
 
If this is the case, the actual revenue numbers may be significantly higher than they appear.
 
 
Anyway, on topic, I believe Carbine is working to fix a lot of the issues that were causing players to leave the game (drop 4 contained some of the bigger things that folks were asking for). After they get these issues resolved, I believe they intend to go for a big marketing push to bring in new players and bring back ones who left. I cannot recall where I heard this but I believe that's the plan.	
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.  
I'm sure a F2P or B2P model would help as well. I was just wondering if the community had any other thoughts about how to encourage new players?
 
 
B2p.	
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You know...i think i had suggested a few months ago if it would be possible to create an area in Wildstar similar to WoW's Darkmoon Faire.  And well...yah...still waiting to hear back from them on that.  There are several areas perfect for this that wouldnt even have to be instanced off.  For example Ellevar in Lightsreach.  There is a huge cliff right behind the town that goes right into a huge lake.  They could totally make that place party central and put a diving board at the edge of that cliff and a ladder/teleporter going back up so you could keep doing it and add events in that people will want to do.  They could put a lake in Algoroc close to the main town and put some events in there or whatever.
 
The key is to make the events something that people of any level will want to attend.  Guildwars 2 has their event and scaling system that allows players of any level to group up and take on zone bosses and whatnot.  WS wont get a scaling system, probably not without a major engine rework.  But is it possible to replicate a system in WS that puts low levels and high levels in the same place cooperating to do the same events?  The events dont really have to be kill zone bosses.  It can be like the Darkmoon Faire which has carnival type events.  And make the rewards worth their while and even level 50 Wildstar players will want to do the events.  And they might find that the events are actually fun.	
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Hey,
 
Seeing that the issues raised in this thread are presently being discussed extensively in the f2p thread, I would like to request a mod to merge the threads.
 
The last thing I think we need is new and returning players being confronted with multiple threads in this vein.
 
Also: No to F2P/B2P!
 
Cheers,	
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Hey,
 
Seeing that the issues raised in this thread are presently being discussed extensively in the f2p thread, I would like to request a mod to merge the threads.
 
The last thing I think we need is new and returning players being confronted with multiple threads in this vein.
 
Also: No to F2P/B2P!
 
Cheers,
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Hey,
 
Seeing that the issues raised in this thread are presently being discussed extensively in the f2p thread, I would like to request a mod to merge the threads.
 
The last thing I think we need is new and returning players being confronted with multiple threads in this vein.
 
Also: No to F2P/B2P!
 
Cheers,
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I suspect really the only thing is to keep on keeping on.  When they're ready, they can invest in some promotional activities.  I wouldn't read too much into the tea leaves of highly filtered financial reports.  Drop could be due to WS's extended development, the behemoth release of Blizzard's next expansion, holidays, weather, the price of tea in China... etc.
 
You want to get new players in?  To borrow the GM of Nihilism's advice (which I thought was excellently stated in a reddit post)
 
Actually play the game	Provide positive feedback and structured criticism	Actually use the features as they are and stop "refusing" to play like a spoiled brat	Talk about the game, makes streams, posts and what not.
Emphasis on 1 and 4 I think.  There's been plenty of 2.  3 was more directed at the more ... pessimistic... community on Reddit.	
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			Why do I have to find out about the 10 day trial on a link of a link and some other web site?? WHY IS THIS NOT PLASTERED ON THE MAIN PAGE? Why is there no post announcing it?	
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			It makes me sad to read the comments and see how pervasive the "Wildstar catered to hardcores" myth is.	
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It makes me sad to read the comments and see how pervasive the "Wildstar catered to hardcores" myth is.
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The most frustrating thing is that I frequently hear so many people gush over how much they love the aesthetic and humor of Wildstar but they just could not bring themselves to continue playing the game because of the #HARDCORE perception. =/
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I disagreee that it is a myth but if it is then its a myth that Carbine themselves perpetuated and encouraged long before the game even launched
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			The most frustrating thing is that I frequently hear so many people gush over how much they love the aesthetic and humor of Wildstar but they just could not bring themselves to continue playing the game because of the #HARDCORE perception. =/	
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The key is to make the events something that people of any level will want to attend.  Guildwars 2 has their event and scaling system that allows players of any level to group up and take on zone bosses and whatnot.  WS wont get a scaling system, probably not without a major engine rework.  But is it possible to replicate a system in WS that puts low levels and high levels in the same place cooperating to do the same events?  The events dont really have to be kill zone bosses.  It can be like the Darkmoon Faire which has carnival type events.  And make the rewards worth their while and even level 50 Wildstar players will want to do the events.  And they might find that the events are actually fun.
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I saw one video that said the raids were hardcore, and even that I kind of took as a joke. But even at that, hardcore raids is just one aspect of the game. I never got the impression the rest of it was intended to be.
 
 
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You can.  You'd have to find some way to have the mentoring system realize what their actual level is so that the quest reward will award based on level instead of who you're mentoring.
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Yeah, this game belongs to the hardcores!
 
I live #hardcorehousing....
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The Hardcore! perception came from a couple of places. First, the non standard combat: in Wildstar, combat is frantic and even mooks can transform you into a pate if you are not careful. Contrast this with basically every other MMO, where you can be half-absent of the game and still complete objectives and stay alive.
The second place it comes from is the endgame paradigm: Progress after levelling up comes in the form of gear. That gear was, and still is, locked behind challenging group content. Nevermind that the game allowed you to level up enterely via solo questing. Suddenly it changed its tone from "play how you want!" to "now go find a group, cupcake!". This change in tone was pretty stunning to some people, specially when the alternative to that endgame 'grind dailies ad nauseam' or PvP.
 
Veteran Shiphands now allow solo players to have an activity that catters to them. But they are still only supposed to be the first step of endgame progression. So Carbine still clings to the Hardcore! mentality, albeit they thankfully diluted it into bearable levels for the rest of us.
 
And of course we always had one of the best housing systems in the MMO market. So there's that.
 
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I don't see why having a harcore component to the game makes the entire game "catering to the hardcore".
 
I know it's an old, old argument, but if there *is* hardcore content, whether solo or group, it just makes sense that the best rewards goes to those who play the hardest content. But there's plenty of other great stuff for everyone- especially now with veteran shiphands, and there are rewards enough to keep people busy, with more content on the way in the future.
 
Anyway, it was clear to me from the beginning they intended to please all kinds of folks, including hardcore raiders. But if the game was *only* catering to hardcore, they wouldn't have put in the housing system they did (hardcore raiders might like the housing system, but I'll bet they'd have preferred another raid), they wouldn't have had shiphands at all, and probably not even adventures. There's so much to indicate that the developers were not "catering to hardcore", yet this is the story that is told over and over again.I can't believe the combat system is being used to justify "catering to the hardcore". Goodness, lots of non-hardcore people think it's fantastic. What do people want? It's amazing and feels great to play.
 
It is what it is, but it's a shame because the great game that this is is getting overlooked by being jammed into the "hardcore vs casual" war when all it want's to do is provide all kinds of people (including hardcore raiders) a fun game to play.	
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It makes me sad to read the comments and see how pervasive the "Wildstar catered to hardcores" myth is.
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Having followed the game for a long time, the marketing of this game as being "hardcore" was definitely out there (see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbItL4qcugk). In retrospect, I feel like it was a mistake. It has scared away some new players who might think that the whole game is like that Dev Speak video. 
 
Carbine did an awesome job with Drop 4 of making Shiphands more accessible to everyone, including making a whole new one for lower-level players that is a ton of fun. I just think they need do some more with the questing system to get more people into the game. 
 
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It is what it is, but it's a shame because the great game that this is is getting overlooked by being jammed into the "hardcore vs casual" war when all it want's to do is provide all kinds of people (including hardcore raiders) a fun game to play.
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			I am by far a expert in these matters, but i would like to give an opinion stating this thread, because i am a client too, to be honest, i love the way the game is and anything they make from here on it will satisfy me, i like WoW way of presenting the content, which is developing the Lore presented, i think Carbine should do the same and give us more raids, workout the pvp balance issue, give us more Bgs, and never i rly mean never switch to free to play, i play a lot of hours per day Wildstar, switching for f2p, though i am only 1 player, i believe some of the community sees the F2P system with a lot of flaws, there will be lack of renewed content, no new raids for months, the game will go low on players, just a opinion, and btw the hardcore term is associated to the time and dedication spent in a game, not the skill level of a player, you can have really good players but some of them having no time to play that does not make them a hardcore player, so i would forget this silly hardcore idea of a player base, it gives no population to the game, keep giving us challenging raids, sooner or later we will master them all anyway, and stick to ways of increasing game population with not quitting on developing the game.  	
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"First we want to appeal to hardcore MMO gamers,"
http://www.digitalspy.ca/gaming/news/a513082/wildstar-wants-to-be-world-of-warcraft-for-next-generation.html
 
Says Gaffney: “We don’t walk a tightrope: we’re very willing to throw ourselves right off it. It’s the hardcore that matters in the long haul.
 
http://www.vg247.com/2011/08/17/carbine-announces-wildstar-aims-at-mmo-reinvention/
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I don't see why having a harcore component to the game makes the entire game "catering to the hardcore".
 
I know it's an old, old argument, but if there *is* hardcore content, whether solo or group, it just makes sense that the best rewards goes to those who play the hardest content. But there's plenty of other great stuff for everyone- especially now with veteran shiphands, and there are rewards enough to keep people busy, with more content on the way in the future.
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It doesn't have to. If the difference in rewards that you get for being hardcore is modestly improved over what you get by not being hardcore, then the game rewards hardcore content without handing the people who do it the keys to the game.
 
But that's not what they did here. Don't kid yourself that players can't look at what you can buy with EGs/Prestige and compare it to what you can buy with Glory/Rating. The gear differential remains enormous, and you have two options for endgame: hardcore or suck.
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You're just deliberately ignoring the entire race altogether. You're essentially complaining AT starting line over not being AT the finish line, because you don't want to run.
 
Did I miss that vet running dungeons to get Glory was removed? No. It's still there. And that's hardly being hardcore.
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Anyway, it was clear to me from the beginning they intended to please all kinds of folks, including hardcore raiders. 
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"First we want to appeal to hardcore MMO gamers,"
http://www.digitalspy.ca/gaming/news/a513082/wildstar-wants-to-be-world-of-warcraft-for-next-generation.html
 
Says Gaffney: “We don’t walk a tightrope: we’re very willing to throw ourselves right off it. It’s the hardcore that matters in the long haul.
 
http://www.vg247.com/2011/08/17/carbine-announces-wildstar-aims-at-mmo-reinvention/
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Why are you equating hardcore with 'bad' anyway?
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Don't kid yourself that players can't look at what you can buy with EGs/Prestige and compare it to what you can buy with Glory/Rating. The gear differential remains enormous, and you have two options for endgame: hardcore or suck.
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Having followed the game for a long time, the marketing of this game as being "hardcore" was definitely out there (see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbItL4qcugk).
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What we have is a hierarchy of playstyles: soloing and crafting seem to be on the 'entry' tier. If you are 'serious' about progression, you have to go into group content. If you are even more serious, you have to go into raids.
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Locking the best rewards behind a particular playstyle is a form of funnelling players into that playstyle. By virtue of existance, those better rewarded playstyles are instantly 'the best'. If it was truly trying to please everyone, it wouldn't lock character progression behind a particular style. What it would do is lock titles, cosmetics, bragging rights of various kinds. You know, things that aren't actually required to improve your character.
But no. What we have is a hierarchy of playstyles: soloing and crafting seem to be on the 'entry' tier. If you are 'serious' about progression, you have to go into group content. If you are even more serious, you have to go into raids.
 
The juiciest carrot is reserved for raiders. Let me remind you that you cannot get raid gear without running the raids. The second best carrot is reserved fror groupies. Let me remind you that you cannot get dungeon gear without running dungeons. Which require a group.The worst carrot is reserved for soloers. Let me remind you that solo gear is basically the same as crafted gear and is below dungeon gear. So progression? That's for groups. The best progress? That's HARDCORE!.
How is that pleasing anyone but raiders?
 
Let me catch the bullet before you can actually fire it: We 'do need' the gear, because gear is power. A character with the best gear available in the game is more efficient at basically everything (except crafting, -maybe-): he kills things faster; he survives more; he heals more; he can complete content faster and better than the others (assuming equal levels of skill); he can carry other through attunement. You get the idea.
 
 
 
Why is it surprising? The combat is non standard. It's involved. It requires the player to make strategical decisions over their LAS. It requires the player to pay attention to positioning to avoid telegraphs or to be inside the telegraphs of his friends. It's not easy combat. What do you think people will think when they see this combat system turned up to ten in dungeons with their jiggzaw puzzle mechanicst? Or turned up to eleven in raids? 'This is hadrcore.'
 
Why are you equating hardcore with 'bad' anyway?
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			A lot of the gear in Protogames is on par and sometimes better than the 1st half of GA... As soon as the first boss. There are also specific pieces in other dungeons that are as well, even if a lower ilvl. Also there ARE games that reward the best gear for soloers, those are just not MMOs...	
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A lot of the gear in Protogames is on par and sometimes better than the 1st half of GA... As soon as the first boss. There are also specific pieces in other dungeons that are as well, even if a lower ilvl. Also there ARE games that reward the best gear for soloers, those are just not MMOs...
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You forgot all the purple world drops that are soulbound like Grim-grim hands and chest, one weapon for each role/class, pretty much every slot can be filled with random purple world drops that ARE quite frequents when you actually spend time playing. A few select of those are best in slot until the second half of GA no less...
 
And then the purples from the reputation vendors : some are pretty good.
 
Actually gear wise, Wildstar has one of the smoothest progression for soloers i've ever seen. Lots of choice, many many purples BEFORE even entering a dungeon...	
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You forgot all the purple world drops that are soulbound like Grim-grim hands and chest, one weapon for each role/class, pretty much every slot can be filled with random purple world drops that ARE quite frequents when you actually spend time playing. A few select of those are best in slot until the second half of GA no less...
 
You also forgot the purples from the reputation vendors : some are pretty good.
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Yeah but how high do you wish the power of solo items to go ?
 
Because, and it's the path of least resistance, if you offer high end items for solo play, then lots of people who did put in the effort to do dungeons (at least those) will not do them anymore. Look at what happened with the stupid renown train... Not only tons of people abused this, but on top of that they even *complained* when it was fixed...
 
And the problem, if people stop doing group content because they can get the same with solo content, what will happen is that they will come rage to the forums that they are *bored* of their solo content. This is a reality. This is why no game company will ever give the same gear power to soloers : this is just NOT possible, because from there everything go into a *very* negative spiral...
 
Soloers have already MORE with Wildstar than they get with other MMOs, trust me...	
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[...] Still, drop 4 didn't add that much to the high end of the gear available for soloers and casuals, it just filled in a gap in the funnel. [...]
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The problem this financial report presents is self-fulfilling prophesy. People will perceive the drop in quarterly revenue as a 2/3 drop in subscriptions, which may not be true. The cost is front loaded because of the cost of the box.
 
So the data can't really tell us there was a drop in subcribers, but it DOES tell us there is a lack of new subs. This is a scary predicament. NCSoft has a history of chopping games-particularly US-based games.
 
So WS revenue was about 5 million US dollars in last quarter. That is a rate of 20 million a year. WS sales represent about 25% of their revenue in US and EU. So the question becomes, how much do they want to be in the US/EU market?
 
So here's the thing. Only an idiot would cancel the game. They cancel this game, they might as well just back out of the the US/EU market all together. They need to show the US/EU that they will stay committed to a game.
 
I was reluctant to come to WS because of the fiasco that was the City of Heros closure. If they cancel another profitable game, they will loose more face and will likely never recover in that market.
 
 	
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Yes, there are big differences in gear. I would hardly say that the options are "hardcore" or "suck".
I'm nowhere near DS gear and I hardly think what I've gotten sucks. I didn't think my gear sucked when I hit 50 and just had a bunch of blues. I guess I just don't think of it in terms of what other people have.
 
It's an age old debate and it won't be won here. If making the most challenging content in the game yield the best benefits is "catering to hardcore" then yes, they did. And so has just about every other game that has varying difficulties along with rewards.
 
I'm not hardcore and I've never felt like the hardcore folks were given priority over me.
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My response to this argument was actually already written before you even wrote your post, so I'll just quote it for you. Relevant bits in red, since apparently you missed them in my prior post.
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As far as who deserves what gear- I really, really don't get why people feel they have to have a pathway to the best gear in the game. And I suppose that is where the disconnect lies. It may just be a personality thing. For me, gear is digital pixels that open doors to new content. If I'm interested in doing the new content, then it matters to me that I can gear up for it. If I'm not, then it's just not an issue for me. I couldn't care less.
 
Case in point, my spellslinger is sitting at 3120 AP and we're working on Kuralak. Getting a few upgrades here and there will help us get past Kuralak (down to 1% last raid!) and on to ACT II of GA. That's pretty exciting. On the other hand, I have a warrior that I never intend to raid with (at least not any time soon). He's maybe at 2500 AP in dps gear and has good enough tanking gear for vet dungeons, and I feel no compulsion about getting him better gear. I whip him out whenever I want to tank and instance, but he's sitting at stock amp/ability points with gear that is "good enough".
 
I'm saying this because I think some of you guys don't understand that there are people like me who are in it more for the experience than the gear. And it is hard for us to understand what your driving need to have the best gear in the game is, because we don't think that way. Now, it has finally gotten through my head that this really is important to you- that you feel restless and like you can't be successful in the game without access to the best gear it has to offer. If that is how you are, then I can see why WS would be a frustrating experience, but I don't think that's "catering to the hardcore"; it's more that this really isn't a game that makes sense for you.
 
I'm not saying "get out of my game" or anything like that, but WS endgame *is* built on the idea (as many have pointed out) that the most challenging content is locked behind gear and gear progression is necessary to get there. Gear is a tool the game uses to make end game progression happen. But if the tool is what you see as the goal, then that's a problem they can't really resolved without changing the whole ball of wax.
 
People understand gear progression and it's the way MMOs work. Expecting WS to come in and do it differently is unrealistic. If you want a game where you can achieve the best rewards without group play, WS just isn't the game you are looking for. But it doesn't mean they are "catering to the hardcore". This isn't a new concept- many MMOs have worked this way, and it works for a reason: since the dawn of time in RPGs gear has made you more powerful and able to accomplish more. It has always been a tool to unlock new content. That isn't going to change with WS- it's innovative in many ways, but not that one.	
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			Why do solo players and casual players want gear progression? Some people just like seeing there numbers increase. Some people want gear goals that they can work towards in their chosen play style. Some people actually like the gear/power treadmill from leveling and just want it to continue at max level. Other games provide something for these play styles, including other MMOs. There were plans to support this in Wildstar, too. I'd just like to see that actually happen.	
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			There is plenty of gear progression for casual players; however, it doesn't go all the way to the top.	
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			Sure, and I'm not saying that it should. But just about all other PVE styles have had new gear added to the end of their progression with drop 4. The top end has increased for them. What was added to the end of solo progression? (Also PvPers... But that's another thread.)	
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Sure, and I'm not saying that it should. But just about all other PVE styles have had new gear added to the end of their progression with drop 4. The top end has increased for them. What was added to the end of solo progression? (Also PvPers... But that's another thread.)
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			Ship hand gear is below crafted gear in power. Even post nerf crafted gear. It's actually below a lot of the rep gear too, so I don't really see it as a tier above what was available before.	
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			I agree with you that solo probably has not seen much love on the gear end of things. But not giving soloers a good gear progression is not the same as "catering to the hardcore", which has been the point. There is plenty of group activity with gear progression that is not hardcore.	
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Ship hand gear is below crafted gear in power. Even post nerf crafted gear. It's actually below a lot of the rep gear too, so I don't really see it as a tier above what was available before.
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[...].  What was added to the end of solo progression? [...]
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			Did I say it was weak or uninteresting? No, I just said that it ended at a certain point, and I'd like to see it continued past that point in the future. Is that so odd if the power of gear in all other PvE play styles continues to creep up as well?	
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Did I say it was weak or uninteresting? No, I just said that it ended at a certain point, and I'd like to see it continued past that point in the future. Is that so odd if the power of gear in all other PvE play styles continues to creep up as well?
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If you don't, then you aren't worried about "gear progression" really, since buying crafted gear isn't progression.  And it does involve other people, so it's not really "solo" either.  I thought we were discussing a sort of hypothetical man-not-interacting-with-anyone scenario.  If you're willing to hit up the CX and crafting, you're already not technically soloing anymore.  You might play alone, but you would be taking advantage of the social situation.
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Not that I disagree with you, but as a person with 6 max level crafters.... yes, you can 'solo' your way into crafted gear ;)
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Gear progression only ends when the developers stop adding tiers at the top. DS and GA were re-itemized with better gear. Protogames was added and Vet SSM was re-itemized so that they are tier 2 dungeons with appropriately higher gear. Please don't act like nothing was added elsewhere.
 
You may not consider crafting to be "solo" but that's such an odd argument I don't even know how to respond to it.	
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Gear progression only ends when the developers stop adding tiers at the top. DS and GA were re-itemized with better gear. Protogames was added and Vet SSM was re-itemized so that they are tier 2 dungeons with appropriately higher gear. Please don't act like nothing was added elsewhere.
 
You may not consider crafting to be "solo" but that's such an odd argument I don't even know how to respond to it.
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It's an odd argument because all crafting can be done solo. For me, a working definition of solo content is anything that does not have a hard, immediate dependency on having another player there at the same time. Theoretically and practically, crafting gear doesn't require that except for some specific recipes. I've never had to group up or join a guild to farm mats and go to the crafting station. No one has ever said "LF4M need to craft adventus gloves".
 
Have solo players gotten a lot if content? Yeah about 60% of it, which nicely lines up with Carbines prediction of what their player base would look like. But not much of it has been an increase in the gear ladder above crafting.	
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It's an odd argument because all crafting can be done solo. For me, a working definition of solo content is anything that does not have a hard, immediate dependency on having another player there at the same time. Theoretically and practically, crafting gear doesn't require that except for some specific recipes. I've never had to group up or join a guild to farm mats and go to the crafting station. No one has ever said "LF4M need to craft adventus gloves".
 
Have solo players gotten a lot if content? Yeah about 60% of it, which nicely lines up with Carbines prediction of what their player base would look like. But not much of it has been an increase in the gear ladder above crafting.
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One thing I haven't seen anyone talk about here is the fact that the game was available for less money during Q4 by a long shot.
 
So, if these numbers are based off new sales, what do people expect to happen if the price goes down 30-40% like it did for the holidays at many outlets? Even now you can get WS for $19.99 (reg edition) $27.50 (deluxe) on Amazon and Gamestop's websites which is 50% off the price here on the official site. That's a HUGE difference in things. I have no idea how long it's been discounted either site. If that's been happening for a while could be another reason for the decline in revenue. I know that there was a sale from Carbine/NCSoft as well...	
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{| class="blockquote"
One thing I haven't seen anyone talk about here is the fact that the game was available for less money during Q4 by a long shot.
 
So, if these numbers are based off new sales, what do people expect to happen if the price goes down 30-40% like it did for the holidays at many outlets? Even now you can get WS for $19.99 (reg edition) $27.50 (deluxe) on Amazon and Gamestop's websites which is 50% off the price here on the official site. That's a HUGE difference in things. I have no idea how long it's been discounted either site. If that's been happening for a while could be another reason for the decline in revenue. I know that there was a sale from Carbine/NCSoft as well...
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			It's a valid point, but any new sale is going to going to be 33-50% less than those in the previous two quarters. It still accounts for something in those numbers, maybe not the biggest issue in the room but it's still there to consider.	
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It's a valid point, but any new sale is going to going to be 33-50% less than those in the previous two quarters. It still accounts for something in those numbers, maybe not the biggest issue in the room but it's still there to consider.
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			If they made random shiphands a decent way to level up I think that'd be more like what the OP wants, personally I just think the random bonuses for dungeon/shiphand/adventure from veterans should be there on normal (scaled to level).	
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From my perspective, Wildstar by Design was going to have Dificulty.
The combat and the world Are Great, providing a good backbone to the game.
 
But many fundimental game designs are lacking.
First you have a personal progression at any cost, you must be a raider to be apart of the raiding progress.
This is a huge thing that i think MMOs that follow Wow are failing with, not just wildstart.
There is virtuly no real econemy, This is shown right from the start.
A new player has nearly no reason to buy anything from other players in any capasicity, and the game doesnt seem to give players much at all to sell.
crafting when you start gives little opitunity, with mostly usless items that have little value to new players.
Ether they are picking up new gear from questing and drops to fast to make the purchase any value or its to hard to find players to sell to at all.
This again filters right up to end game progression, with crafters needing to find players that have just got to that place in the game.
 
you can make alot of money crafting, but its time to value is greatly diminished when you can simply progress down the raiding path and rush though the content.
Above someone said that crafting is a solo experiance, This i think is a true showing that Wildstar has failed as a MMO, why is something that should be tightly ingraned into the econemy and server such a solo experiance.
Its something that by its vary nature should be interactive, if you want to succed as a crafter you should be buying goods and services and selling them.
But by design it seems there isnt anything to realy sell, and nothing to buy.
Gear progression in Dunegons and raids could be suplimented by crafting mats that can only be collected there, which in turn could sell to a crafter to make gear that is on a simliar lvl.
It could be difernt, or have difernt value posibly more specilised ? but in the end it would tie into the server and create a more social exepriance in the game from the start.
 
other things the game should have done is find ways to bring crafters and custermers together. crafting quests that actuly privide gear to players as they lvl up, NPCs that buy items that they then sell to players.
There are many options that would have made this experiance much better for newer players and bring players together outside of simply having content be harder/imposible to complete alone. No MMO has 100% solo or group players, many things that shouldnt be solo are pushed into that place by design.
 
The sad reality is that The big player WoW has a bad econemy but a large player base to keep it running, a new MMO just cant follow that.
and for me this was something that realy hurts wildstar, is that getting on and being one thing to do to progress and nothing other was what stopped my friends comeing back at all.
of corse its not just one thing that will realy harm the game :(
 
Sorry about my english, it isnt very good. but i think from a Developer perspective an smooth econemy should be something they work on from the ground up, and in the end alot of MMOs are training players to play there games in a negitive way. and getting away from this is the toughest thing a Dev will face D:	
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First you have a personal progression at any cost, you must be a raider to be apart of the raiding progress.
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			Its game sites like mmorpg.com that killing Wildstar!. they do bad rewives and have big rewives about when wildstar going free to play, They do more harm then good. If I was reding about wildstar on there site i shode never try wildstar ether !	
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Yep it has been said already. I waited with buy till now because off the bad rep this game have....everywhere. Sure trailers looked great but all those people saying game actually suck? ... They wouldn´t lie right? Not on the internet!!! :D
 
But holy crap! The game is exactly how I thought it will be based on those kick-ass trailers.
 
Ratchet and Clank MMO...pretty much :D design of monsters, world, funny story, awesome destructive weapons (MAH CHUA ENGINEER WILL BLOW NEXUS UP ONE DAY MARK MY WORDS!) . When I took taxi for the first time I just couldn't stop laughing...brilliant.
 
Last time I had this much fun while playing MMO was vanilla WoW....and that was because it was first MMO I ever played.
 
Leveling up is really fun. Even quests. Hell even kill monsters in area type of quests are fun because of that kick-ass combat system. Best there is, hands down (Smite is only moba I like for the very same reason) .
 
DEAR GOD guys. I hope more people will try this game like I did and game gonna have bright future. Im not youtuber but doing my part....going around and telling everyone I know to try this game.
Usual reaction? "Oh Wildstar? I read all over that its pretty bad."  So I try to tell em otherwise :) . I believe there is metric s*it ton of players that play MMOs....but never gave this one a chance. So imho not all is lost.
 
And from where I stand. Game seems pretty alive. I keep seeing lot of people when leveling up. Everywhere :) .	
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{| class="blockquote"
Yep it has been said already. I waited with buy till now because off the bad rep this game have....everywhere. Sure trailers looked great but all those people saying game actually suck? ... They wouldn´t lie right? Not on the internet!!! :D
 
But holy crap! The game is exactly how I thought it will be based on those kick-ass trailers.
 
Ratchet and Clank MMO...pretty much :D design of monsters, world, funny story, awesome destructive weapons (MAH CHUA ENGINEER WILL BLOW NEXUS UP ONE DAY MARK MY WORDS!) . When I took taxi for the first time I just couldn't stop laughing...brilliant.
 
Last time I had this much time playing MMO was vanilla WoW....and that was because it was first MMO I ever played.
 
Leveling up is really fun. Even quests. Hell even kill monsters in area type of quests are fun because of that kick-ass combat system. Best there is, hands down (Smite is only moba I like for the very same reason) .
 
DEAR GOD guys. I hope more people will try this game like I did and game gonna have bright future. Im not youtuber but doing my part....going around and telling everyone I know to try this game.
Usual reaction? "Oh Wildstar? I read all over that its pretty bad."  So I try to tell em otherwise :) . I believe there is metric s*it ton of players that play MMOs....but never gave this one a chance. So imho not all is lost.
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{| class="blockquote"
Yep it has been said already. I waited with buy till now because off the bad rep this game have....everywhere. Sure trailers looked great but all those people saying game actually suck? ... They wouldn´t lie right? Not on the internet!!! :D
 
But holy crap! The game is exactly how I thought it will be based on those kick-ass trailers.
 
Ratchet and Clank MMO...pretty much :D design of monsters, world, funny story, awesome destructive weapons (MAH CHUA ENGINEER WILL BLOW NEXUS UP ONE DAY MARK MY WORDS!) . When I took taxi for the first time I just couldn't stop laughing...brilliant.
 
Last time I had this much fun while playing MMO was vanilla WoW....and that was because it was first MMO I ever played.
 
Leveling up is really fun. Even quests. Hell even kill monsters in area type of quests are fun because of that kick-ass combat system. Best there is, hands down (Smite is only moba I like for the very same reason) .
 
DEAR GOD guys. I hope more people will try this game like I did and game gonna have bright future. Im not youtuber but doing my part....going around and telling everyone I know to try this game.
Usual reaction? "Oh Wildstar? I read all over that its pretty bad."  So I try to tell em otherwise :) . I believe there is metric s*it ton of players that play MMOs....but never gave this one a chance. So imho not all is lost.
 
And from where I stand. Game seems pretty alive. I keep seeing lot of people when leveling up. Everywhere :) .
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