Report 841

Report #841
Skillset: Druidry Skill: Special
 Org: Elders Status: Completed Apr 2012
Furies' Decision:
Implemented solutions 1-3 and a slight balance loss on sapping.
Problem: The Special Report changes so far do not synergise well with stacking
thornlashes or sticking sap.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #1: Change allergy balance malus to increased writhe time
 (each allergy level adds +0.1 seconds to writhe time).
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #2: Allergy levels should affect your ability to climb up
 and down (your limbs feel achy and sore). At level 8+
 (severe), climb up/down has a 50% chance to fail and
 take some balance (you try to climb but then give up
 because it's too sore). At level 12+
 (incapacitating), the chance to fail climb up/down
 increases to 80%.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #3: Increase the delay on sapped commands relative to how
 bad the target's allergy is (sore limbs pushing
 through sap requires more effort). Make the delay
 1.00 seconds (normal aeon delay) at max allergy,
 which equates to approx +0.03 seconds delay per
 allergy level. At this rate I'd expect someone to
 have a sap delay of about 0.75-0.80 (someone staying
 at max allergy is probably unlikely).
Player Comments:
---[Shuyin on 4/25 @ 23:30 writes]:
All of these solutions are fine with me. Please implement them all into allergy
mechanic. 1 helps out with thornlashes, 2 helps with getting sap on a victim,
and 3 helps with perpetuating the saplock. So please do all of them.
---[Shuyin on 4/25 @ 23:34 writes]:
Furthermore, I suggest the following to further help with Druids: 1. Have sap
put the victim offbalance for an initial amount of time (3s?, maybe), then have
that scale up depending on the victim's allergy level at the time. At the worst,
perhaps 8+s offbalance. 2. Change thornlashes to function off allergy levels
somewhat. Have it add 1 extra thornlash if the victim is at a severe allergic
reaction and have it add 2 extra thornlashes if done at the level above that.
These 2 ideas will help accomplish these goals: helping perpetuate the saplock
(the initial offbalance, since the first 10s is critical to the druid) and
helping build thornlashes quickly (extra lashes = less time spent lashing and
wasting balance)
---[Raeri on 4/26 @ 05:38 writes]:
I fully support all of these solutions in tandem, and agree with Shuyin's
comment that they should all be implemented into the allergy mechanic.
---[Viynain on 4/26 @ 06:39 writes]:
After what I've heard regarding the newly implemented allergy levels, I agree
that the above solutions and comments should be considered to actually round out
the desire for a druid to build allergy levels. I'm not sure about making lash
100% add an extra lash at severe allergies and 100% to add two extra lashes at
incapacitating, however, but I can see a percent chance to do so instead.
---[Enyalida on 4/26 @ 14:44 writes]:
Agreed with the above, including Viynain's concerns with high levels of lashing.
I still wish we could change what sap actually does, but that's life, I suppose!
---[Xazlael on 4/26 @ 18:06 writes]:
All the solutions sound reasonable.
---[Shuyin on 4/26 @ 19:34 writes]:
After a conversation with Sidd and confirmation with Iosai, the following moves
generate the corresponding allergy points (out of 15, out = non-trees, in = in-
trees): seedburst - 1 out, 2/3 in, pollen/swarn - 1 out, 1 + 50% chance of
another 1 in. With that said, at the slowest, it will take 2.5 minutes to build
somone up to max allergies, assuming they do not run, however it will take
somewhere around 30s at the very fastest to build up max allergies. If we are
going to go with most, if not all, of these changes, I would strongly
recommended that allergies be given a manual cure -in addition to- the running
mechanic. I suggest liniment, given the precedent set by burns. If you want
something cute and RP appropriate, have it cured by the sneeze emote and have
sneezing take balance when used to cure allergies and take perhaps 2-3 allergies
off every time. If we can find a healthy balance where spamming the cure will
still eventually result in max allergies, but after 2 minutes or so, then that
would be great.
---[Shuyin on 4/26 @ 19:46 writes]:
Incidentally, 30s is also how long it takes if all the druid does is spam seeds
and meld ticks (4 seeds, 3 ticks = max). So yeah, it is probably going a bit too
fast right now. I'd prefer adding a manual cure over slowing down/reducing the
effects/seedcloud, but if we're going the latter route, here are my suggestions:
seedcloud - 1 out, 1 in + 50% chance of another, pollen/swarm - .5 out, 1 in
---[Ushaara on 4/26 @ 20:42 writes]:
Are these changes all additional to the current balance malus (I believe 0.09
per each of the 15 allergy levels), or is that going to be removed in favour of
these changes? I'm slightly wary that a general increased balance + increased
writhe times will make it difficult for warrior/monk classes to get anywhere vs
a druid, especially since warriors can't really afford to run away to cure
allergies. If both are still going to be included, I do think there should be
something like Shuyin's suggested means of curing allergy levels making this
something like deathmark curing. Anyway, I'd say I'm tentatively supporting all
three solutions.
---[Enyalida on 4/26 @ 21:12 writes]:
It should replace the current balance malus, for the reasons you mentioned. If
across the board writhe extension is a problem, I suggest making it only slow
down writhing from vines and lashes. I think one or two of Shuyin's
numbers/chances are off (from what I was told when testing things), but I'd far
rather slow down the progression then add a salve cure. Unlike deathmark, where
you must give up quite a few long balances to get rid of the affliction, you
won't be losing out on anything applying a salve against a druid. I was pretty
sure that admins were deadset against any non-time-cured afflictions, also.
---[Enyalida on 4/26 @ 21:52 writes]:
I'd shift Seedcloud to doing 1 with a 50% chance for 2 in the trees. Then, make
pollen and swarm only do 1 ever. That means that in Shuyin's example, you'd only
be seeing an average of 10 levels after 30 seconds of focusing on a single
target who is in the trees, not hindering the druid. This avoids messy .5
allergy levels, and allows the druid to raise this counter on their single
focused target at a comfortable rate. 2 minutes buildup on a single target for
what isn't an instakill is too slow. ~45 seconds is more acceptable, imo. Many
players are quite adept at staying down out of the trees, and if the druid does
not chase them, the allergen levels will decay at 1 per 7.5 seconds! Assuming
that the target will stay in the trees for 30 seconds straight and not do
anything to hinder the druid is stretching the imagination a little. Could make
pollen just not hit for anything out of the trees if need be, or remove swarm's
pollen capability entirely. I haven't done the math on what that would mean, but
I'd lobby to make pollen go after treelife in that case...
---[Vadi on 4/26 @ 23:25 writes]:
I agree with Shuyin's initial comment ideas and the follow-up comment ideas. It
makes theoretical sense as being workable.
---[Raeri on 4/27 @ 08:19 writes]:
Woah now, before we talk about making it cure quicker, keep in mind allergy
levels completely go poof if you get out of the forest for 10 seconds - very
unlike deathmark or burns. And liniment to cure may be a bit too easy - it's
what, 1s balance? Unless it's not 1 apply per level (much like how burns is not
one apply per level), which could potentially work out great if the apply-to-
cure replaced the passive curing of the forest/druid separation.