Report 1382

Report #1382
Skillset: Stag Skill: Greenman
 Org: Hartstone Status: Completed Sept 2015
Furies' Decision:
Approved for h/m/e regen at 1/5.
Problem: With endurance and willpower gone, Stag's Greenman paint is left
without an effect.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #1: When painted with Greenman, killing an npc will
 restore some health to the user.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #2: In addition to solution 1, having greenman painted
 gives a small chance that using a curative will
 consume the balance but not the curative.
[A: 0 R: 0] Solution #3: In addition to Solution 1, greenman gives slight
 resistance to wafer afflictions.
Player Comments:
---[Enyalida on 9/11 @ 15:20 writes]:
The intent is to mirror the Trueheart paint, which has a niche combat
application AND a minor buff to Influencing. The thought is that Solution 1 will
be useful for hunting (as trueheart is for influencing). The combat effect is up
in the air, I've included one that was suggested and am looking for additional
options.
---[Llandros on 9/11 @ 19:01 writes]:
HP on kill and reduced curatives are fine. You could even go with regen buffs if
that would be simpler/actually help. With reduced affs and cures, aff blocking
skills are a lot more powerful than they were so no support for that.
---[Jaamil on 9/12 @ 09:40 writes]:
This seems fine to me
---[Enyalida on 9/12 @ 19:16 writes]:
@Llandros I wanted to avoid a regen buff expressly because it would be less
helpful. Without any class-specific, racial, godly, karmic, or artifact/limited
item boosts, I easily get up to 7 levels of health regen. In a forest terrain or
during the day, that number only goes up. Regen just isn't a useful property for
a paint, leaving aside that each level of regen is a fairly small amount of
healing once every 10 seconds.
---[Xenthos on 9/12 @ 19:27 writes]:
All three solutions are asking for a mirror of one of Crowform's benefits, as a
facepaint. In addition, it is stacking with very good health restoration
already available to Stag (both Medicinebag and TotemCall) which are an option
for any Stag user, especially if they spend a little bit of time gathering
essence to draw as much power as they want. Stag does not need to give
additional healing outside of regen levels than it already has, because it is
already one of the best in the game.
---[Enyalida on 9/12 @ 19:29 writes]:
@Llandros I wanted to avoid a regen buff expressly because it would be less
helpful. Without any class-specific, racial, godly, karmic, or artifact/limited
item boosts, I easily get up to 7 levels of health regen. In a forest terrain or
during the day, that number only goes up. Regen just isn't a useful property for
a paint, leaving aside that each level of regen is a fairly small amount of
healing once every 10 seconds.
---[Enyalida on 9/12 @ 19:29 writes]:
Oops, sorry for the repeat comment.
---[Xenthos on 9/12 @ 20:02 writes]:
My suggestion would be: Make it a health/mana/ego regen with a sub-10 cap (maybe
8). This way you're retaining its original style, which is something useful &
helpful to lower level / non-Demigod players, but not as useful to established
long-term players. That seems the most reasonable path to take this.
---[Allehnon on 9/14 @ 02:34 writes]:
Looks fine to me. Supported.
---[Celina on 9/16 @ 00:33 writes]:
Uh, you want improved crowform as a facepaint? Come on. Rejected. Be reasonable.
---[Allehnon on 9/22 @ 22:44 writes]:
I have been trying to figure out what to comment for this report, including
doing some research on the mythos of the Greenman, but am unable to find
something suitable. I have to agree with Celina that it seems to be a 2 paint
version of a 10p skill and in that regard raise objection to it. Any thoughts I
have as to what to do with the skill are very situational, but I don't think
adding more healing or even making it a regen buff is the way to go. Currently,
the skill is an always on, always useful (or was till WP and END got removed)
skill and I would like to see it retain that sort of usefulness for any level.
---[Allehnon on 9/22 @ 22:46 writes]:
I should have said after reading the comments and looking into it, I have been
trying to figure out what to comment (my original support of the report has
obviously changed with more in depth knowledge of the situation)
---[Enyalida on 9/28 @ 21:28 writes]:
I rate low level healing (like minor regen buffs) very lowly on a scale of
strength. An ability that saves you a sparkleberry after you've already killed
an npc rates even lower, at least comprable to trueheart, crowsfeet, or
spiderweb - its closest analogues. That this is one of the minor effects
associated with crowform is something that escaped me - I thought it was a
feature of the earlier carrion skill. Either way, it's disingenuous to compare
it to one of the several effects of that ability, in the same way that it would
be silly to disprove of any celerity bonuses in any skillset because Stagform
includes a celerity bonus and costs a WHOLE TEN POWER. The original solutions
were for a non-direct regen solution because of the ease all players have in
stacking moderate regeneration levels, and the very minor effect a few extra
levels have on health totals - increasing regeneration by mere percentage points
of total hp over ten seconds. Having an effect that heals a small amount of hp
when killing a mob helps younger players who lack later abilities in Stag to
engage slightly better with grouping mobs (like the Grey Moors Aslarans and
Krokani) and bash in general more than regen will, without disproprotionally
scaling for established players. It's REALLY not a big deal.
---[Enyalida on 9/28 @ 21:28 writes]:
That said, making it a regeneration effect plus some other minor utility side
benefit, or just a unique utility skill (analogous to crowsfeet, the only
personal way to see the movements of dreambodies) would also be fine. Some
suggestions have related to making curatives have a chance to not be consumed
while the paint is on, having it offer a chance to resist a certain affliction
or small subset of afflictions (analogous to spiderweb, bonenose) when painted,
or making greenman increase stun or blackout immunities slightly. I have no
strong attachment to any of those suggestions, and there isn't any extant lore
on the greenman to guide the solutions. As long as it's an effect that has a
situational chance to compete with trueheart.