114735-starting-to-get-nervous-game-does-seem-to-be-dying

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			I've played about 10+ mmos now and there is always complaining and doom calling but this is the first "A" title I've played where the game just seems dead after a few months.    Most games have a huge drop of interest after launch and settle to a much smaller population, servers are merged and such... but even those games seem playable and have a half way decent population that's maintainable going forward.   But I just logged in and no one is queued for rated pvp,  there is a long wait for regulars and my server is a ghost town... and I'm on my second server...   I know personal observation is the weakest form of evidence, but this seems bad.	
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I have the same feeling.
But then I log in 4 days a night and do the awesome raid with 20 awesome players, which makes me absolutely fall in love with game again. Despite all the issues and pretty much nothing to do other than hoping another guilds wants to merge so you can start on DS.	
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			I know people don't want to hear this but this game won't grow until F2P is announced. Megaservers are a band aid imo. End Game is still just raiding at the end of the day. World Bosses are "one and done" so there's no real Large Group Non-Raid content. There's no Minigames(housing is more Fluff than Minigame). That's honestly what they could have been working on if they had just used the Modern MMORPG template. Instead they have spen that time re-doing a lot of their Core Design and systems. It's going to be a long a bumpy Road back.	
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I have the same feeling.
But then I log in 4 days a night and do the awesome raid with 20 awesome players, which makes me absolutely fall in love with game again. Despite all the issues and pretty much nothing to do other than hoping another guilds wants to merge so you can start on DS.
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			No way to accurately tell if game is dead or just spread out to thin due to the extra servers they added after launch que complaining.   Wait till Megaserver comes then see how it is.   	
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			I recommend reading the forums less, playing the game more. Your personal enjoyment will likely increase while your stress levels decrease. At least, it's working fine for me LOL	
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This is at 3PM, saturday (today) on Avatus (PvE US)
 
I know its not exactly primetime but only 10 max level players? I'm really starting to think that megaservers just wont be enough 	
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This is at 3PM, saturday (today) on Avatus (PvE US)
 
I know its not exactly primetime but only 10 max level players? I'm really starting to think that megaservers just wont be enough 
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Dude it's  weekend,   :)  Who's playing video games on a beautiful day!  Plus it's only 1pm for me :P
 
Should honestly go to Evindra  we do have more players :)	
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			What comforts me is that regardless of how bad it gets they likely won't close up shop for a few years minimum. There is time for things to turn around, and WoD could always be a massive flop. Really with how much of a MMO share WoW eats up its near impossible for many others to make it. Just be patient and find ways to have fun! 	
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What comforts me is that regardless of how bad it gets they likely won't close up shop for a few years minimum. There is time for things to turn around, and WoD could always be a massive flop. Really with how much of a MMO share WoW eats up its near impossible for many others to make it. Just be patient and find ways to have fun! 
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Free transfers are open and the community has been encouraged to concentrate on two most popular realms on their side. I don't think that Avatus is one of them.
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Avatus and stormtalon are the go-to servers for pve-ers from what i've heard. Lemmi check what ST is like
 
EDIT: 24 max level on exile side.
 
Thats still a kinda scarylow amount
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RP server is set up just like a PVE serverjust with RP in certain places.   :P
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I know what it is, im just quoting population amounts.
 
All in all, it looks like that for the majority of the time (i've done this across several servers for both factions several times now) there is only a couple of hundred max level players on. This may change during prime raiding times where theres maybe 1k or so but a large number of those will be locked in raids.
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			It pretty simple , when you build a game catering to the elite 2% , that's what's left 2%. And the sad thing is its a good game , but the casuals players never got to experience the end game content . When I first saw ads for Warplots I was so excited played 2 months and never saw one . You don't build a game and wall out 98% of your player base , The answer was so simple and still simple today , but now they will have to work 10 times harder just to get back the player that they had in the first place . Answer is just have a lower skilled entry point into the content . It doesn't have to have any effect or barring on the Hardcore content they currently have and only reason not to have lower entry is because they thought only hardcore content would make the game more epic . LOL Fail . What would make the game more awesome is having 100% of the player base telling friends what you built . At level 49 I was telling everyone I know how great of a game I thought it was , a cant miss MMO and at 50 it was structure so bad , even 2 months after I,m still in total shock that someone in the front office didn't stand up and yell to everyone . Are you crazy . Who runs 98% of the players off . My dads always had a motto , we was in a public business ," He would say kicked them out ?,hell no !!! ,  there is no money out , I'm kicking them back in "	
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			I've said numerous times I'd leave if the game ever went F2P but the Raiding in this game is just amazing. I'd possibly stick around if the game ever went F2P but only if the game's end game difficulty stayed where it is. I don't want a Raid that can be beat within a month's time. I'd prefer to actually have to work to beat it. But I'm just scared if F2P hits they'll dumb the game down as well. At that point I would be out. If I want raids for retards I'd just go back to DCUO.	
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People still play that game?   :P  last numbers I seen  were  2.6million -active subs-   that was in 2012 though.
 
Edited:  Just looked they're up to 2.7mil  online not active subs.
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You're asking if people play the most popular MMO? You're acting as if 2.6 million subs is a bad number. Furthermore, the sub number of quarter 2 2014 was 6.8 million. 
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I've played about 10+ mmos now and there is always complaining and doom calling but this is the first "A" title I've played where the game just seems dead after a few months.    Most games have a huge drop of interest after launch and settle to a much smaller population, servers are merged and such... but even those games seem playable and have a half way decent population that's maintainable going forward.   But I just logged in and no one is queued for rated pvp,  there is a long wait for regulars and my server is a ghost town... and I'm on my second server...   I know personal observation is the weakest form of evidence, but this seems bad.
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			I'm probably leaving this tuesday before they take my monthly sub. Not waiting till Nov for the rune upgrade. I may be back. But I doubt it.. you know 1 step forward 2 steps back eh Carbine	
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It pretty simple , when you build a game catering to the elite 2% , that's what's left 2%. And the sad thing is its a good game , but the casuals players never got to experience the end game content . When I first saw ads for Warplots I was so excited played 2 months and never saw one . You don't build a game and wall out 98% of your player base , The answer was so simple and still simple today , but now they will have to work 10 times harder just to get back the player that they had in the first place . Answer is just have a lower skilled entry point into the content . It doesn't have to have any effect or barring on the Hardcore content they currently have and only reason not to have lower entry is because they thought only hardcore content would make the game more epic . LOL Fail . What would make the game more awesome is having 100% of the player base telling friends what you built . At level 49 I was telling everyone I know how great of a game I thought it was , a cant miss MMO and at 50 it was structure so bad , even 2 months after I,m still in total shock that someone in the front office didn't stand up and yell to everyone . Are you crazy . Who runs 98% of the players off . My dads always had a motto , we was in a public business ," He would say kicked them out ?,hell no !!! ,  there is no money out , I'm kicking them back in "
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Wow is old and tired.
 
No thanks to lvl 100 and instant pay to level 100	
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			If your theory is correct , how come they don't remove all the levels and just run Heroic mode and gain back the 12 million subs ? . And you claim Cata what brought it down . You forget 10 / 25 man raids during WOTLK . normal and heroic's . The faceroll theories has always been a trade chat troll theory at best . You always had people talking crap and that  WOW was to easy but they never downed Lich King and only 7% actual did while current . That the main reason Wildstar is failing is exactly your side of the debate , This myth about the masses want the old school super hard content . The developers listen and structure Wildstar for that the 2% . What they didn't see was Blizzard wasn't going for the super hardcore , it wasn't hardcore due to the mechanics and how hard the questing was . It was hardcore due to the having to organize and teach people how to be a basic raider . Everything was new and MMO's was just evolving . Blizzard during their hardcore days , was still trying to reach 100% of its players . .	
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I know people don't want to hear this but this game won't grow until F2P is announced. Megaservers are a band aid imo. End Game is still just raiding at the end of the day. World Bosses are "one and done" so there's no real Large Group Non-Raid content. There's no Minigames(housing is more Fluff than Minigame). That's honestly what they could have been working on if they had just used the Modern MMORPG template. Instead they have spen that time re-doing a lot of their Core Design and systems. It's going to be a long a bumpy Road back.
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This is not exactly true, because WoW constantly grew during the "Hardcore or Shut up!" period. Even after it was done being brand new and that model was well known to it's then larger number of casuals. And there were same "Give casuals what they want or we will quit because of it!" threats on a daily basis. Even in Vanilla, going in to Burning Crusade. Only when Blizzard catered to the non-elite in Cata, with it's Looking for Raid and "bad friendly" content did it's subs ever decrease.
 
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You're asking if people play the most popular MMO? You're acting as if 2.6 million subs is a bad number. Furthermore, the sub number of quarter 2 2014 was 6.8 million. 
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This is not exactly true, because WoW constantly grew during the "Hardcore or Shut up!" period. Even after it was done being brand new and that model was well known to it's then larger number of casuals. And there were same "Give casuals what they want or we will quit because of it!" threats on a daily basis. Even in Vanilla, going in to Burning Crusade. Only when Blizzard catered to the non-elite in Cata, with it's Looking for Raid and "bad friendly" content did it's subs ever decrease.
 
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I don't think megaservers are a band-aid. More like prep for surgery. The megaservers and Drop 3 and other changes may very well breathe new life into the game, but if and when the game does go F2P, having it on a megaserver will make the transition easier.
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			I've never seen a game die when people were expecting it, so all these threads make me feel all safe and cozy.	
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I've never seen a game die when people were expecting it, so all these threads make me feel all safe and cozy.
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Correlation is not causation. You have to control for other variables like the LOW-HANGING FRUIT effect and the overall GAMERS ARE GETTING TIRED OF MMOS effect.
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His point wasn't to show causation; it was to refute the silly Idea that catering to hardcore content lovers is NECESSARILY bad for subs or makes a game unpopular.
 
All the point was is that when done right, games can focus on more difficulty and still be well received. I did not get the idea that Dhar was suggesting focusing on hardcore content was the only factor that made games popular; just providing proof negative of a previous assertion.
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His point wasn't to show causation; it was to refute the silly Idea that catering to hardcore content lovers is NECESSARILY bad for subs or makes a game unpopular.
 
All the point was is that when done right, games can focus on more difficulty and still be well received. I did not get the idea that Dhar was suggesting focusing on hardcore content was the only factor that made games popular; just providing proof negative of a previous assertion.
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His point wasn't to show causation; it was to refute the silly Idea that catering to hardcore content lovers is NECESSARILY bad for subs or makes a game unpopular.
 
All the point was is that when done right, games can focus on more difficulty and still be well received. I did not get the idea that Dhar was suggesting focusing on hardcore content was the only factor that made games popular; just providing proof negative of a previous assertion.
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Hardcore content wasn't the main reason.
 
- Terrible itemization where adventure gear was equal to or better than dungeon gear played a huge part
 
- Having a system that allows boosters to completely destroy PVP played a massive part
 
- A rating system that gave you minus 40 for a loss and plus 10 for a win played a huge part
 
- Exploits that went on for months without fix and carbines unwillingness to ban those who used them played a massive part. He'll there has been a Domi warrior that exploits his way out of the starting area of every blood sworn match for the past 2 months. Hundreds of people have reported him but here he is... Still doing it...
 
It's absolutely frustrating because at its core, wildstar is the best game I've played since wow 2004 but with the above mentioned issues it's unplayable and I've lost all confidence that Carbine will actually fix it
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			One thing I have never understood about MMO companies is why is there no wall of shame proudly announcing which jerks got banned each month.	
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Hello,
 
We do already have an active thread on this subject here. Instead of creating duplicate threads please continue to post in the active one. :) Thank you. 
 
- Team WildStar 	
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