143424-credd-needs-to-compinsate-the-seller-more

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So I made enough for a month's membership is less than 3 hours.If the prices are so low I don't know why....why anyone pay that much money for 12P.
 
Paying $20 for 12P is not competitive when it comes to what gold sellers can sell for....and if you want to eliminate RWT you have to offer a price that is even to the seller or of a better price.
 
For $20 people who sell C.R.E.D.D should be compensated at least 30Plat.(This means the average player will have to make 1P per day, not very hard)
 
But something has to be done with these prices or else RWT will come back.....and if CREDD prices don't go up no one will sell it.
 
 :lol: thnx
			
				
	Edited October 15, 2015 by Nin ja	
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That's the consequence of the F2P transition, I'm afraid.
 
Before, people could not play AT ALL without a subscription or purchasing CREDD, so the motivation to "farm enough plat to keep playing" was very, very real.
 
Today? Who freaking cares if you have a sub or not? A crapload of us have 4 "free" months of Signature service, many more people already subbed this month on the (mistaken) assumption that the queues would be faster for them.
 
And, to be blunt, that's not likely to change much when those subs end.
 
Basically, the age of CREDD is coming to a close.	
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Very true, I don't see why anyone after lvl 50 is buying a sub...except for the guild invites...more AH spaces, exp and rep gain.I made the mistake of buying a sub 2 weeks ago....and now I realize that there is literally no reason for it....If can buy CREDD for dirt cheap.I think the CREDD system is fine, you can that WoW has a "WoWToken" which lets players buy game time for gold, making the game virtually free to play with those who have the resources to make enough gold for one....I think they are about 30k gold (which I could make in about 3-4weeks of causal play).
 
The problem is that I, and many people like me don't want to spend $15 on a worthless sub system when we would rather pay Platinum for our sub....as long as the prices is higher and benefits the SELLER more than the buyer (in terms of platinum gain) ... its a good system. But if Carbine decides not to have a "standard price" type thing....no one will buy CREDD and SELL it.	
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Basically, the age of CREDD is coming to a close.
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			No, its the consequence of being so close to launch, prices will hit a deep low and slowly start ricing never to get low again, its how market functions. Right now a lot of people buying and selling right away but 6 months from now it will probably be 30+ plat.	
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			*scratches head" You said the there is someone that buys CREDD from the shop but the way you make it sound like there will always be CREDD for f2players,it doesn't come cheap, it's actually more expensive than a simple signature,with the transition to f2p i expect it to die out, because it's not exactly a money making tactic, it's a sure way to bankruptcy at least.
			
				
	Edited October 15, 2015 by xRaymanx	
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I think it's a bit premature to declare a time of death.  The value of CREDD will heavily depend on how much Carbine incentivizes Signature Service.  Right now many people are questioning that value when people are still being strongarmed into buying Service Tokens.
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			All ill say is I don't think CREDD prices should be regulated by player economy	
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			Bet on them restructuring the costs of everything to do with the store and signature status in five months, once they've got some real data to guide them to the pricing sweet spots.  Rotating sales will also come, if they follow the pattern of other successful cash shop F2P games.	
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All ill say is I don't think CREDD prices should be regulated by player economy
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			It will go up again.  Right now in Entity 2 I see it listing for as low as 10 plat and offers for as high as 6 plat.  Those days will come to an end and credd will once again rise.  Give it a month or two more, I am sure it will go back up.	
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			I would like them to add an option when redeeming CREDD to choose either 30 days game time or 800 Omnibits. That should help increase demand for CREDD and give players another way to get account unlocks and service tokens easier.	
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			Tradable store currency!  I like it!	
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			Or maybe a trade-in for NCoins?Only because I've seen at least one thing that doesn't take Omnibits...I can't recall what it was.
			
				
	Edited October 15, 2015 by Lethrface	
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I would like them to add an option when redeeming CREDD to choose either 30 days game time or 800 Omnibits. That should help increase demand for CREDD and give players another way to get account unlocks and service tokens easier.
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The Economics of the CREDD market and Potential Carbine Regulation in the Face of Market Failure 
by 
Melawen Saralonde
 
The average MMO player is very familiar with an out-of-game market for an in game commodity. Real Money Transactions ("RMT") have been a staple of non-sanctioned outside activity in MMOs as innovators and business men created out-of-game markets for in game currency, characters, leveling services, and other in-game commodities. While the owners of various Game have implemented various protections against outside RMTs, using EULAs, TOS, and other legal avenues available to them, they have not been able to close those markets entirely. 
 
CREDD, and other similar systems, were created by game companies as a way to preempt the providers of RMT, by providing players with a way to exchange an in-game item purchased for real money and worth game time for in-game currency. Because the system involved both creators (those who purchase CREDD) and consumers (those who buy and use CREDD), the prices were not set by company so that in game supply and demand could set the price. 
 
Before continuing, it is necessary to note that this analysis assumes that MMO players are reasonable actors and that the in-game CREDD market functions similarly to a traditional economic market. Further, in addressing questions of market failure, Carbine will be assumed to take the role of a government intervenor, since regulating the CREDD market would fall to it as an entity. 
 
The question is "Is the price of CREDD so low that Carbine should intervene to correct the market?" The Original Poster argues that this is the case and further advances his argument by stating the price of CREDD is low that it will not continue to perform its function of preventing outside RMT. I will attempt to answer this question and propose potential solutions below. 
 
First, it is necessarily to discuss how the price of CREDD is determined. Assuming a normal market, and absent any unknown interference, the price of CREDD is set at two price points via traditional supply and demand. First, it is worth noting that the price of CREDD is set at two points based on whether the buyer and seller wish to buy/sell it now for a worse price or place a buy/sell order at a more desirable price. Other than that, the mean price of CREDD is a simple function of supply and demand. Supply will increase so long as the amount of plat is such that the reasonable MMO player believes it is worth $20. Demand will only increase when there is a combination of unsubscribed players and  high perceived value in the CREDD itself (that is a high perceived value of 1 month of signature status). Further, it is worth noting, that based on the duration for which CREDD is good, demand and thus price for CREDD will likely increase near the end of a monthly cycle when a majority of players are looking to re-up their signature status. 
 
I also want to look at the market for RMTs. CREDD is a substitute good for RMTs, however it is an imperfect substitute. The advantages to CREDD are the lower risk. When one engages in CREDD based RMTs, they do not violate the EULA or TOS and thus do not risk getting their account banned. Additionally, they avoid dealing with the shadier, negative elements of outside RMTs, such as risk of being hacked or not receiving the goods that one pays for. However, CREDD is not a perfect substitute and has disadvantages. The exchange rate for CREDD unlike RMTs is not set and the player must take the risk of a weak market. Further, CREDD purchases are limited to once a day, limiting the amount of in-game currency that can be gained this way and increasing the time investment required to gain larger amounts. 
 
Since I don't have evidence of outside RMTs occurring in Wildstar, it is impossible to quantify the effect of the availability and price of CREDD on the occurrence and frequency of outside RMTs. However, logical economics applied to the situation suggest that while CREDD should have the effect of decreasing outside RMTs, particularly among risk adverse consumers, it will not replace them as the sole source for RMTs because it is not a perfect substitute. However, once can also argue based on the same principles that a market failure affecting the viability of CREDD would likely cause an increase in outside RMTs. 
 
So the question becomes. has the market for CREDD become unviable. With the advent of Free 2 Play, demand for CREDD is uncertain because while a large new number of players have come in, a subscription is no longer mandatory to play the game. Before free 2 play, demand for CREDD could remain fairly stable because a subscription was required. Demand was mainly affected by the size of player base and the tolerance of the person toward the time investment necessary to acquire it each month. Post F2P introduced the newer dynamic of perceived value, the subscription is no longer required and can be viewed as a value-added option. Thus demand must also account for value-added.
 
With this, we have to ask two questions. First, why is the Price of CREDD falling? Second, is the equilibrium price too low. 
 
As discussed, the price of CREDD could be falling for several reasons. First, it could be falling as result of an uptick in supply. With new players coming to the game, not all of who may understand exactly how the CREDD system worked, it is possible that the system is simply over-supplying CREDD. When supply exceeds demand, the equilibrium price falls. Further, it could be failing do to downturn in demand. A downturn in demand may be caused by lower desirability of signature status, an increased demand for outside RMTs (because of higher perceived value or lower perceived risk), it could be that are hitting a low point in the monthly subscription cycle, and finally, it could be the large amount of free signature service given by Carbine to players who were already subscribed or returned to the game prior to F2P (4 months). 
 
Next I will turn to the desirability of intervention by Carbine in the market. As we have stated, they have already done so to some extent by limiting the number of CREDD that can be purchased by one account in a day. This creates a cap on CREDD and ensures a more stable supply and thus a more stable price. This is, in my opinion, appropriate corrective action for what could be a serious problem. Setting a price floor for CREDD, on the other hand, is not a move I would recommend in this market. A price floor will likely create an uptick in supply and a downtick in demand, creating a surplus.
 
Now, I will turn to the solutions section of my piece. It is important to note here, that I will be proposing what a potential problem could be and what I think the solution should be if that is what is creating the problem. However, there is a significant dearth of data available to players on the workings of the CREDD market, so implementing any of these solutions should not be undertaken without a better understanding of the data. 
 
First, if the problem is a surplus of CREDD, I think the solution is simply to wait it out. If the price of CREDD is low enough, people will stop buying until it rises. A new equilibrium will be found and the market will adjust. "Waiting it out" is also an acceptable solution if the problem is simply lower demand due to a low point in the monthly cycle. 
 
Second, if the problem is the value of signature status, the solution is to increase its value. If signature status is not perceived as particularly valuable, the CREDD market cannot remain viable in the long run because the cost of CREDD will outweigh the in-game currency benefits. Increasing the value of signature will increase the demand for CREDD and drive up the price, as well as potentially generating additional revenue. A stipend has the potential to be a valuable bonus. Another option would be to instead increase the value of CREDD by offering additional trade in options, for example, as was suggested earlier, omnibits. This would also increase demand for CREDD.
 
Finally, if the problem is that outside RMTs are simply more desirable than CREDD transactions, Carbine can either increase risk of outside RMTs by upping enforcement against them or they can increase the value of the CREDD package. I don't want to recommend a policy prescription for this simply because I don't have the available data to recommend which route would be more valuable to stabilizing CREDD at a viable market price. 
 
In Conclusion, there simply isn't enough data to conclude anything about the CREDD market at this point. With the introduction of f2p introducing new dynamics into the CREDD market, the best idea at this point is probably to take a wait and see approach for several service cycles. This will give the market more time to adjust for the new changes in demand structures for CREDD as well as the influx of new players in F2P. However, it is incredibly important that the data be collected and analyzed so that the CREDD market does not become an unviable market plagued by failures. 
 
TL;DR ECONOMICS
			
				
	Edited October 15, 2015 by MedicMelawen	
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{| class="blockquote"
I would like them to add an option when redeeming CREDD to choose either 30 days game time or 800 Omnibits. That should help increase demand for CREDD and give players another way to get account unlocks and service tokens easier.
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			What if they just started adding more vanity items like the squirg hat and all that other stuff monthly for players that have signature? We had that going for a while kinda back in the day. I just don't know why people are still buying and selling CREDD right now for $20, when I could put $20 towards Ncoins. Buy a pet, sell them for 12 plat and still have some Ncoin left. CREDD is really not competitive right now. It needs an edge.	
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{| class="blockquote"
 
The Economics of the CREDD market and Potential Carbine Regulation in the Face of Market Failure 
by 
Melawen Saralonde
 
The average MMO player is very familiar with an out-of-game market for an in game commodity. Real Money Transactions ("RMT") have been a staple of non-sanctioned outside activity in MMOs as innovators and business men created out-of-game markets for in game currency, characters, leveling services, and other in-game commodities. While the owners of various Game have implemented various protections against outside RMTs, using EULAs, TOS, and other legal avenues available to them, they have not been able to close those markets entirely. 
 
CREDD, and other similar systems, were created by game companies as a way to preempt the providers of RMT, by providing players with a way to exchange an in-game item purchased for real money and worth game time for in-game currency. Because the system involved both creators (those who purchase CREDD) and consumers (those who buy and use CREDD), the prices were not set by company so that in game supply and demand could set the price. 
 
Before continuing, it is necessary to note that this analysis assumes that MMO players are reasonable actors and that the in-game CREDD market functions similarly to a traditional economic market. Further, in addressing questions of market failure, Carbine will be assumed to take the role of a government intervenor, since regulating the CREDD market would fall to it as an entity. 
 
The question is "Is the price of CREDD so low that Carbine should intervene to correct the market?" The Original Poster argues that this is the case and further advances his argument by stating the price of CREDD is low that it will not continue to perform its function of preventing outside RMT. I will attempt to answer this question and propose potential solutions below. 
 
First, it is necessarily to discuss how the price of CREDD is determined. Assuming a normal market, and absent any unknown interference, the price of CREDD is set at two price points via traditional supply and demand. First, it is worth noting that the price of CREDD is set at two points based on whether the buyer and seller wish to buy/sell it now for a worse price or place a buy/sell order at a more desirable price. Other than that, the mean price of CREDD is a simple function of supply and demand. Supply will increase so long as the amount of plat is such that the reasonable MMO player believes it is worth $20. Demand will only increase when there is a combination of unsubscribed players and  high perceived value in the CREDD itself (that is a high perceived value of 1 month of signature status). Further, it is worth noting, that based on the duration for which CREDD is good, demand and thus price for CREDD will likely increase near the end of a monthly cycle when a majority of players are looking to re-up their signature status. 
 
I also want to look at the market for RMTs. CREDD is a substitute good for RMTs, however it is an imperfect substitute. The advantages to CREDD are the lower risk. When one engages in CREDD based RMTs, they do not violate the EULA or TOS and thus do not risk getting their account banned. Additionally, they avoid dealing with the shadier, negative elements of outside RMTs, such as risk of being hacked or not receiving the goods that one pays for. However, CREDD is not a perfect substitute and has disadvantages. The exchange rate for CREDD unlike RMTs is not set and the player must take the risk of a weak market. Further, CREDD purchases are limited to once a day, limiting the amount of in-game currency that can be gained this way and increasing the time investment required to gain larger amounts. 
 
Since I don't have evidence of outside RMTs occurring in Wildstar, it is impossible to quantify the effect of the availability and price of CREDD on the occurrence and frequency of outside RMTs. However, logical economics applied to the situation suggest that while CREDD should have the effect of decreasing outside RMTs, particularly among risk adverse consumers, it will not replace them as the sole source for RMTs because it is not a perfect substitute. However, once can also argue based on the same principles that a market failure affecting the viability of CREDD would likely cause an increase in outside RMTs. 
 
So the question becomes. has the market for CREDD become unviable. With the advent of Free 2 Play, demand for CREDD is uncertain because while a large new number of players have come in, a subscription is no longer mandatory to play the game. Before free 2 play, demand for CREDD could remain fairly stable because a subscription was required. Demand was mainly affected by the size of player base and the tolerance of the person toward the time investment necessary to acquire it each month. Post F2P introduced the newer dynamic of perceived value, the subscription is no longer required and can be viewed as a value-added option. Thus demand must also account for value-added.
 
With this, we have to ask two questions. First, why is the Price of CREDD falling? Second, is the equilibrium price too low. 
 
As discussed, the price of CREDD could be falling for several reasons. First, it could be falling as result of an uptick in supply. With new players coming to the game, not all of who may understand exactly how the CREDD system worked, it is possible that the system is simply over-supplying CREDD. When supply exceeds demand, the equilibrium price falls. Further, it could be failing do to downturn in demand. A downturn in demand may be caused by lower desirability of signature status, an increased demand for outside RMTs (because of higher perceived value or lower perceived risk), it could be that are hitting a low point in the monthly subscription cycle, and finally, it could be the large amount of free signature service given by Carbine to players who were already subscribed or returned to the game prior to F2P (4 months). 
 
Next I will turn to the desirability of intervention by Carbine in the market. As we have stated, they have already done so to some extent by limiting the number of CREDD that can be purchased by one account in a day. This creates a cap on CREDD and ensures a more stable supply and thus a more stable price. This is, in my opinion, appropriate corrective action for what could be a serious problem. Setting a price floor for CREDD, on the other hand, is not a move I would recommend in this market. A price floor will likely create an uptick in supply and a downtick in demand, creating a surplus.
 
Now, I will turn to the solutions section of my piece. It is important to note here, that I will be proposing what a potential problem could be and what I think the solution should be if that is what is creating the problem. However, there is a significant dearth of data available to players on the workings of the CREDD market, so implementing any of these solutions should not be undertaken without a better understanding of the data. 
 
First, if the problem is a surplus of CREDD, I think the solution is simply to wait it out. If the price of CREDD is low enough, people will stop buying until it rises. A new equilibrium will be found and the market will adjust. "Waiting it out" is also an acceptable solution if the problem is simply lower demand due to a low point in the monthly cycle. 
 
Second, if the problem is the value of signature status, the solution is to increase its value. If signature status is not perceived as particularly valuable, the CREDD market cannot remain viable in the long run because the cost of CREDD will outweigh the in-game currency benefits. Increasing the value of signature will increase the demand for CREDD and drive up the price, as well as potentially generating additional revenue. A stipend has the potential to be a valuable bonus. Another option would be to instead increase the value of CREDD by offering additional trade in options, for example, as was suggested earlier, omnibits. This would also increase demand for CREDD.
 
Finally, if the problem is that outside RMTs are simply more desirable than CREDD transactions, Carbine can either increase risk of outside RMTs by upping enforcement against them or they can increase the value of the CREDD package. I don't want to recommend a policy prescription for this simply because I don't have the available data to recommend which route would be more valuable to stabilizing CREDD at a viable market price. 
 
In Conclusion, there simply isn't enough data to conclude anything about the CREDD market at this point. With the introduction of f2p introducing new dynamics into the CREDD market, the best idea at this point is probably to take a wait and see approach for several service cycles. This will give the market more time to adjust for the new changes in demand structures for CREDD as well as the influx of new players in F2P. However, it is incredibly important that the data be collected and analyzed so that the CREDD market does not become an unviable market plagued by failures. 
 
TL;DR ECONOMICS
 
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			 The CREDD prices are set by the sellers aren't they?  It's more or less a free market.  You can't blame anyone but the market itself for that.    If you trade in CREDD while the market is low, why are you surprised that you're not getting a good value?  If you make bad investments, that's YOUR fault, not Carbine's, not the other players, not the market.   
			
				
	Edited October 15, 2015 by Elite Seraph	
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I didn't bother to read the entire thread.  The CREDD prices are set by the sellers aren't they?  It's more or less a free market.  You can't blame anyone but the market itself for that.    If you trade in CREDD while the market is low, why are you surprised that you're not getting a good value?  If you make bad investments, that's YOUR fault, not Carbine's, not the other players, not the market.  
 
 
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{| class="blockquote"
I didn't bother to read the entire thread.  The CREDD prices are set by the sellers aren't they?  It's more or less a free market.  You can't blame anyone but the market itself for that.    If you trade in CREDD while the market is low, why are you surprised that you're not getting a good value?  If you make bad investments, that's YOUR fault, not Carbine's, not the other players, not the market.  
 
 
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CREDD has retained more value than I expected.  It's hovering around 9p on Entity-1 and I expected 6p or lower.  Depending how things stand in a month or two it may be worth speculating especially in light of the four month bonus that many of us have.
 
On a personal note, a CREDD to OmniBits conversion is far more interesting than Signature Service.	
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All ill say is I don't think CREDD prices should be regulated by player economy
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I dont know why people assume that its credd bought for RL money thats being sold cheap atm.
Plenty of people has stocked away 100s of credd.. Some of those people stopped playing and have now returned, some just need quick plat to rune, others want some of the new fluff thats been added..
 
With so few people buying credd and so many selling, its no wonder that the price took a steep dive.
			
				
	Edited October 15, 2015 by negoleg	
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			Can we go back to the days when CREDD was 1.5plat?	
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I dont know why people assume that its credd bought for RL money thats being sold cheap atm.
Plenty of people has stocked away 100s of credd.. Some of those people stopped playing and have now returned, some just need quick plat to rune, others want some of the new fluff thats been added..
 
With so few people buying credd and so many selling, its no wonder that the price took a steep dive.
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			Back when I stopped playing, CREDD was worth 5 platinum.	
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You don't need more data.  The price of credd is low, because the signature service does not provide much value. Its not rocket science.
 
There is a massive  problem incoming,  end game can become expensive.  If players have few options to mitigate this they will most likely leave.  
 
I hope carbine address this problem before the subscription vets have there free months expire. 
 
Again its consumer science 101,  people don't buy things they see no value in.  	
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{| class="blockquote"
You don't need more data.  The price of credd is low, because the signature service does not provide much value. Its not rocket science.
 
There is a massive  problem incoming,  end game can become expensive.  If players have few options to mitigate this they will most likely leave.  
 
I hope carbine address this problem before the subscription vets have there free months expire. 
 
Again its consumer science 101,  people don't buy things they see no value in.  
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