127041-loyalty-rewards-feedback-discussion-title-mount-etc-page-2

Page 1, Page 2, Page 3, Page 4, Page 5
== Content ==
			
{| class="blockquote"
Thank you carbine for the lesson about loyalty,i appreciate it. I won't gonna make the same mistake in my future upcoming mmo,for which i am uncertain what will it be.
 
I am a collectionist,i try to get everything in the game or i simply don't play it. I always focus on 1 game only at a time,for the past year it was wildstar.
I have prepurchased the CE,have all the account inventory rewards...hats,rest in piecemaker,gamescom goodies,purchased 6 boxes on promotion to collect everything (6 because costume did not drop),got every item through promotions,rewards.
Had lapsed account a few times only for a couple of days.
I cannot watch a greyed out mount everytime i pop my collectibles tab,so i am leaving the game and i won't gonna look back ever again. Some people can call me childish for it,but my OCD is stronger,i wish i could not care about that 1 mount,but i just can't.
Anyway,it is time to move on. Wishing you all the best and bright future for both players and carbine.
Bye-bye.
----
			As someone who has paid for every month and bought multiple credd who loves this game. Kind of sucks my sub fell off for a few hours one time. So am I not loyal enough?	
----
			
@Henzilla I will probably post a giveaway here or on reddit in the future about the account,if it will make someone happy,why not? I will contact the support to erase my card info.
 
@ZombieTechnix dont't think that i am butthurt or anything,i just know better myself and my ocd. If something makes you unhappy and you just can't change anything it is better to leave it.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
 
It's probable that a year ago Carbine had no idea whether or not they'd be going Free-to-Play, which only compounds how ridiculous it is that remaining subscribed for the timeframe between is the criterion for getting something nifty.
Pretty please, address my point on measuring players by money spent.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Not to mention, if they had did that, the ones upset now would have been complaining then that it's an entrapment-technique that's slaving them to the game.  Heck, I know I kinda even felt that way with the boomboxes... I still have some left that I open every now and again, lol. :P
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Again, you get so much more...you get Minus 1 mount. But let's flood the forums for that mount and scrape the barrel dry of reasons. 
Everyone knows how it's going to be when FTP gets here, how the cash shop is going to work. Although I suspect some folks are in denial about it but like it or not you will be milked, and you have no one to blame for it other than yourselves. IE The dudes who bought 6 boxes of the game when the fat kitty cat mount was introduced and were tweeting them. All Carbine saw when people posted them pictures were dollar symbols. $$$
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Returning player here, my subscription started around launch, and went away while I waited for the huge number of bugs and problems with PvP and etc to get fixed.
 
Finding out the day I get back that there are rewards for having had a subscription early is neat.
Finding out that the only way to qualify for those rewards is to have spent money continuously on something that was broken post-launch is not okay.
 
Carbine, you have a lot of veteran players considering a return to your game. It's cool that you're offering loyalty rewards - it would be much cooler if the full suite was available to everyone that was around during the non-free-to-play phase for any amount of time.
 
Personally, I got a new job. I've been working on finishing my degree. Squeezing in an mmo on top of that wasn't an option on my budget.
Now that I have time to play games on the weekends again, it'd be really cool if I wasn't getting fisted because I had other responsibilities, especially since another huge factor in dropping my subscription for awhile was that a lot of stuff was completely broken (PvP especially so).
----
			
So what about if say you canceled ur sub because u bought credd from the wildstar store at $20 a pop and personally helped pay not just for your sub but someone elses to (which is essentially what buying credd from the website to sell in game was), i mean that system to some degree really helped carbine stay afloat or make the "max" they were capable of at the time by keeping more people subbed.... but that aside and moving on.
 
What im getting at is people who paid $180(for a contious sub from launch till now) plus either $60 or $75 for actual game, a whopping max of $255, are being considered more loyal then people like myself who let my account lapse for maybe a month (really feel bad for the people who are in similar situation as im describing but only unsubbed for a day or 2..... or worse a few hours) but i have personally paid carbine from launch till now.... $505 thats my $75 limited edition preorder, $165 for 11months of subbing, $100 for 5 purchases of credd,  another copy at $60 at launch for Wife (which ended up as my 2nd account, $15 for 1 month of sub on that....  and $90 to top it all for 3 boxed copies at $30 each from the local walmart when they announced the boxed copy promotion for mounts and costumes.... but yea im not loyal.... didnt show you know twice the support or anything as someone who just stayed subbed.... i mean wouldnt i be the perfect canidate to keep happy in a f2p game with a cash shop, just saying lol	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
So what about if say you canceled ur sub because u bought credd from the wildstar store at $20 a pop and personally helped pay not just for your sub but someone elses to (which is essentially what buying credd from the website to sell in game was), i mean that system to some degree really helped carbine stay afloat or make the "max" they were capable of at the time by keeping more people subbed.... but that aside and moving on.
 
What im getting at is people who paid $180(for a contious sub from launch till now) plus either $60 or $75 for actual game, a whopping max of $255, are being considered more loyal then people like myself who let my account lapse for maybe a month (really feel bad for the people who are in similar situation as im describing but only unsubbed for a day or 2..... or worse a few hours) but i have personally paid carbine from launch till now.... $505 thats my $75 limited edition preorder, $165 for 11months of subbing, $100 for 5 purchases of credd,  another copy at $60 at launch for Wife (which ended up as my 2nd account, $15 for 1 month of sub on that....  and $90 to top it all for 3 boxed copies at $30 each from the local walmart when they announced the boxed copy promotion for mounts and costumes.... but yea im not loyal.... didnt show you know twice the support or anything as someone who just stayed subbed.... i mean wouldnt i be the perfect canidate to keep happy in a f2p game with a cash shop, just saying lol
----
			
@Dead Smell: (Not quoting because the quote chains are getting a little unwieldy)
You bring up a good point. I left for awhile and came back, and according to the current requirements for the mount, that means I don't get it.
 
I don't think our points are mutually exclusive, though.
 
I don't like that the gifts being given out have arbitrary criteria that were never formally announced. 
Whether or not I receive a mount when the game's Free-to-Play launches is up to Carbine - my point is that if you're gonna drop the super exclusive cool stuff, the only way to execute that without alienating people is to give everyone a heads-up well in advance, and that didn't happen. Someone's responsible for that, and if posting here will prompt them to fix their mistake, then I'll be happy. If I'm lucky, a bunch of people will get a crawler, too.
 
I do think, though, that if your measurement for loyalty/appreciation has nothing to do with promoting the game, bringing new players into the game, or contributing to the game in any other way than throwing money at it, then the measurement for loyalty is indeed money. The FAQ doesn't mention anything other than simply staying subscribed - even if you didn't even play. If that pattern persists into F2P, then even the people who have stayed subscribed since launch are potential victims of marginalization in whatever next financial move gets made, and I feel that you and I would be able to agree that a situation like that would be bad.
 
We can't allow this precedent to be set. This error needs to be corrected.
 
Edit: Kyrill's post is a really excellent example of why the arbitrary timeline requirement is bad. Even pulling the weight of several people's potential subscription costs, they're still not eligible for cool stuff. That's not okay.	
----
			Whatever. I doubt Carbine will consider any of this conversation, and I doubt we'll see any sort of response.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
I just believe that the mount and title should remain exclusive to those who have actually stuck around and didn't leave the game. <-- With the allowances I have already explained.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
 
Again, you are Loyal and that is being expressed in Loyalty Points which you will get to the value of money you have spent. No one knows enough about the points to determine everything that will be purchasable. 
Your account/s will receive gifts under the appreciation heading. Now people aren't going to see much difference from being appreciated enough or loyal enough but you are getting a gift for free... The loyalty points are what
you have earned.
Please can everyone stop putting the 2 together... One is free and yes not everyone will get all the "free" stuff, the other is what you have earned through what you have spent.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Whatever. I doubt Carbine will consider any of this conversation, and I doubt we'll see any sort of response.
----
			
This i what the end of my post is refering to btw 
 
FOR ANY1 WHO PAID $180 CONSECUTIVELY
For the loyal subscribers who have maintained a subscription from WildStar’s official launch on June 3rd, 2014 until the Free-to-Play launch, we will award this exclusive Ikthian Crawler mount, an exclusive DJ Caretaker housing décor item, a Disco Snoglug companion pet, a new housing music track, four months of Signature service, and two new titles: “Living Legend” and “Nexus Loyalist”!
 
FOR EVERY1 WHO MIGHT OF MISSED JUST 1 DAY OF SUBBING AND PAID ALOT TO SHOW SUPPORT(Quite a bit more then the $180 level, ike me at $505) We are appreciated as much as the guy below who pay $50
If you missed out on launch but you’re a current subscriber and maintain your subscription through transition to Free-to-Play, you will still receive the DJ Caretaker housing décor item, the Disco Snoglug companion pet, the new housing music track, four months of Signature service, and the "Nexus Loyalist" title.
 
FOR THE PERSON WHO BUYS AND SUBS (ALL OF $50 TOTAL) RIGHT NOW OR ANY TIME BEFORE JUNE 15TH
If you’re not a subscriber today, don’t worry! If you subscribe by June 15th, 2015 and maintain it through our Free-to-Play launch you will receive the DJ Caretaker housing décor item, the Disco Snoglug companion pet, the new housing music track, four months of Signature service and the ‘’Nexus Loyalist’ title.	
----
			Just super frustrating and as lame as it may sound hurtful, wildstar was and is my favorite MMO (yes ive played any and all of ur tripleAAA MMO titles), it was the one i followed all through the gaming news, tried beyond all doubt to get into closed beta to help shape and test the game, stuck with it from closed winter beta till now (even kept paying my sub when layoffs happened, when the f2p rumor started on reddit with the "official" employee announcing it, even after that i bought 3 boxed copies for their promo to show support and get some sweet in game loot at $90, even bought credd and paid my subs after that, paid out 2-3 times more then the top tier appreciation level, but will be forever reminded by that mount and title that the month my sub ended and i paid with a credd a bit late, i became as appreciated as new guy who joins in 1month before f2p.... just sucks really... kind puts people off the game	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Then we work together to make it clear that the community will not be simply herded around, that mistakes are admitted, accountability is maintained, and most importantly - that the errors are corrected and steps are taken to prevent the same mistake from happening twice. WildStar does not have to become just-another-bad-F2P-model-with-a-bad-cash-shop. It has so much more potential than that, and if we want it to realize that potential we have to make it clear that it's what we want so that the people calling the shots make it happen.
 
This game isn't F2P yet, and there's no reason to deny cool stuff to anyone that was along for the ride.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Cept, I'm okay with this. I flipped to the FTP team back in October when all PvP servers were killed off and I watched this game become a ghost town. Look around at all the people coming back now that FTP is openly embraced. Life is returning to Nexus. I'm fine with FTP, I embrace it. I'm not gonna start a campaign because I didn't get 1 mount >.> and besides they can't do any worse than swtor. Freaking EA >.>
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
As someone who meets that reward criteria. I don't care about exclusive. I don't even feel happy thinking about riding it right now. I think exclusive is the wrong/right decision in certain situations. But when done right with no dumb grey areas can be something really really fun for the community. That's what they tried. It clearly isn't working out. So what is the next step? I agree with everyone's discussed allowances. I just can't get behind defending the system as it is. It really is serving to be bad PR. I've probably stressed that enough though. 
 
I can understand the opinion of some other people in this thread who "don't care at all". Because to you all you see is people complaining about stuff you don't have any interest in. Which leads me to question why you would be in a feedback thread specifically for this issue  :huh:. (Maybe you just like critiquing player feedback).
----
			
@Threevie: The criteria was announced 3days ago, a few weeks before cut off and potentially up to 4 months before they transition too f2p. This is more announcement than most on a payment model change.
 
The loyalty and appreciation systems have everything to do with getting more people into the game prior to transition, yes it has to do with money but that should be expected from any business.
I do agree that they shouldn't marginalise, but I am confident that Carbine wont block everything behind the f2p paywall. they have already said that plenty of new content that could potentially be put on the cash shop wont be.
I could eat my words in a year or so on that but I reckon they will be reasonable and strike a balance between what you can earn in game and what can be bought with cash.
 
I am all for not allowing Carbine to strip us of all our hard earned cash. I know I will be diligently testing omnibit drops on the ptr when it breaks and if I don't believe that they are sufficient I will tell them so..
 
@Kyrill: The appreciation gifts are still free regardless of the definition. They are as stated being given as appreciation. Carbine is not asking for further payment for them, they are additional to what you would already receive if you picked the game up now and started an account.
Players are putting value to them just as we put value to an item on the A/H or even the USD, but Carbine are giving them of their own free will. They didn't have to give us anything.
Before announcement the mount didnt exist, they have decided that everyone will receive a bunch of items for free, and others will receive those same items as well as another 2. Yes there is a criteria but money isn't it... As you said you have spent over 500 on this game. I have spent 131 for my sub and 40 in credd and due too living in Australia these values are alot higher for my dollar. I bought 2 mystery box's which cost me more than 100AUD after shipping because Australia had already sent all our boxes back. If the criteria was a monetary requirement then I probably wouldn't make it, as my sub cost less because I decided to give Carbine my money from the start... mind you at the time I was not well off, I saved the money as if I was paying a sub during the beta period prior to launch so I could afford the cheaper option.
 
As I see it Carbine did not put a monetary value on the ikthian mount other wise the criteria could be vastly different. They put the monetary value on the Loyalty system.
 
I understand Kyrill that you have spent a vast sum of money on this game of your own volition, your loyalty is not being taken too account. If you sold any Credd on the market then you have been compensated in game for your rl purchase, that is the purpose of the credd system. It's great you bought the game for your missus.. if my missus was willing to play I would as well.
 
Opinions on this thread are going to be strong for both sides of the coin. I'm not here to personally attack anyone and have no hard feelings towards any of you. Hopefully tomorrow they make an announcement to try and assuage some of the issues with the poor wording that has been used to describe the appreciation program and its associated restrictions.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
It could be a mount, it could be a hat, but at the end of the day, it's really cool and keeping it exclusive in the way that Carbine has decided to do it is making a lot of people feel very unloved, even if they've been pulling more weight than the people who are eligible.
 
We're all customers here. Carbine likes money. Customers that are happy offer up more money than customers who are jaded from silly PR decisions.
Embracing F2P is fine, but let us not willingly segregate ourselves based on money spent. All of us were here first.
----
			
 
{| class="blockquote"
@Kyrill: The appreciation gifts are still free regardless of the definition. They are as stated being given as appreciation. Carbine is not asking for further payment for them, they are additional to what you would already receive if you picked the game up now and started an account.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
So where all the folks who left and continue to this day to spew out crap about how bad this game is. Seriously, go into another mmo and just ask in say Trade chat, what folks think about Wildstar. Hell I have a guildie who keeps telling folks this game is filled with nothing but exploiters and even he's butt hurt about not getting a mount, but according to so many of you guys here, he should be eligible, cus his feelings.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
My position is that anyone who was on the boat before F2P should be eligible.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
As heart-felt as that idea might be... it would also rob any that were die-hard loyal without any lapses all along.  Which also raises the problem that if Carbine did give ALL transitional gifts to this point to everybody that was aboard, AND whipped up some other special trophy-item for the die-hards, people would then scream that they deserve that too.  So it's definitely a no-win situation. -_-
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
The entire measuring system by which people are being sorted into loyal and non-loyal is broken. People who have committed to the idea that they're the biggest most loyalest because their sub happens to fall into a vaguely-worded-yet-somehow-unfortunately-tight-area will need to abandon that point of view for the greater good of the community.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
 
 
 
Indeed and agreed.  The mount can't have monetary value, as it doesn't even exist to anybody yet, therefore, can't exactly lose what they don't already have... and nobody even knew it was even a possible existence until the other day.  As for the attempted monetary value that people are trying to appoint to it, $180... first of all, the monetary value of the gameplay up until now, would be $180, NOT the mount.  That'd be like saying you just bought a car for $25,000 and were given a free key-chain with it, therefore the value of the key-chain is also $25,000.  Logically, no, that really don't work like that.   B)
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Context context and well more context, so a more valid comparison using ur car theme. Say u went to a dealership with a friend on the same day and you bought a $75,000 car and paid the full tag upfront in cash and even gave the guy a handsome tip of $15,000 cuz why the hell not.... you like the dealership, the salesman was nice and u like the "product" he sold you so you show your "support". So that same day and same time your friend buys a car for $25,000 but he makes payments on it over 1 year... doesnt do anything extra no tips nothing... now you go back to said dealership 1 year from that day with said friend to buy another car and continue doing business with a dealership you like and trust, but when you get there they give your friend keys to a boat and trailer as a "free gift" (which again isnt free because it required previous business to obtain) for his business and making his payments over 1 year consistently, all the while your standing there and all ya get is handshake, a thank you for coming back, and a portable cd player..... now they tell you your friend got his boat for being a loyal customer and appreciated his business for that 1 year.... and well they appreciated your business to but not quite as much....
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I won't disagree that it is broken, because it has its flaws... but my point is... if they back-pedal now, and shift the lines, and change how it works... it'll appease those that want it changed, but could very well upset those that were die-hards.  Even though as non-objective as you might see it as the greater good of the community... it could just as easily backfire and anger others of the community even more.
 
You know how so many premium sub-game subscribers tend to look down on f2p'ers as pleb-leeches?  It's kind of like that... those that met all criteria and fit all specifications, suddenly have to pander the boundaries to those that may not.  Similarly to how in the early goings, when myself and others said "hardcore" was an old-hat idea that needed to be done... everybody shouted, "no, everything in Wildstar is a trophy... you have to meet all criteria and be able to get the job done to be worthy of said trophy", (heck, I still even remember people saying, "hardcore or go home")... this is no different. -_-
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
It is impossible to please the entire community on this issue, but if we can set a precedent for fixing huge PR mistakes when they happen it'll be a victory greater than a few players getting a new robotic spider to show off.
 
Earning content is fine. Earning a loyalty point balance to acquire the mount is fine. Locking a surprise collectible behind requirements that are now impossible to meet by anyone getting in late or coming home from orbit is not okay.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Well, can make a message so the NEXT PR incident can be fixed... again, the precedent you're arguing for, to change this PR debacle, would please those in the community, yourself included, that have something to stake on it, and are unable to be non-objective... so of course they're going to claim it's "for the community".  Not trying to be mean in saying that, just honest.  :unsure:
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I stand to gain a mount, correct.
I am also interested in pursuing WildStar through it's Free-To-Play transition now that I've got time to play again, and if my forum feedback has a positive impact on how this game evolves then everyone stands to gain an overall better experience. 
 
You can sacrifice my crawler to Phineas T. Rotostar if it'll guarantee one for everybody else.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Well, that interest in pursuing will happen regardless... unless it's a passive-aggressive statement that's meant to state that either you get the mount or you refuse to pursue.
 
As for the sacrificing the crawling mount so everybody else can get one... as honorable and apathetic as that might be... it's still a hypothetical to the extent of this current PR situation... where some would get it, and others, or yourself, would not.  ;)  (Or perhaps we could pretend that those that aren't found eligible are sacrificing their mount for the greater good, so that those that are found eligible can get it, and call it a day.)
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
My position is that anyone who was on the boat before F2P should be eligible.
----
			
the "monetary value" i put with the mount is only there to show that the current system to determine what is deemed "loyal" by carbine is rather offensive.... it shouldnt be gated as such. Not because people dont get the mount or do get it, but because this is a company which works for money and needs subs (well i guess needed now) to make money. Now subs or money being paid or given to carbine allows them the ability to be a company and continue to do business.... now to say that some peoples money is more appreciated more then others (which is what this comes off as) is wrong...  IT IS A HUGE PR MISTAKE.... How many people may leave over it..... maybe not many, How many people wont play because of it, maybe only a few, How much bad PR does Carbine have and how much BS does other game communities feed to their player bases..... just saying overalll regardless of who gets the mount THAT IS BAD BUSINESS. Doesnt look good.
 
There are plenty of outcomes where everyone can be appreciated and feel rewarded without feeling left out or less appreciated. Being told that over a very rough year of games life, its rough launch, and the huge fallout throughout that year only if you meet a very very strict and unforgiving requirement you get to obtain a limited item, and everyone who thought there support was worthy can just go get over it because your just going to whine is rather unpleasant.... Again in my mind when i  look at the requirement from a logical stand point... the reward is their to say thank you for sticking it out and well.... paying us to help keep the game going this far. Without you the player and your money we couldnt of made it this far... especially since you never jumped ship on us..... So what about all the other people that were here for the majority of the time showing there support and are still here supporting them? They didnt jump ship... so why arnt they equally appreciated.... because they missed a few days of sub time but stuck it out from now to then.... Or the people who spent alot more money on the game then most to directly fund and help and show support.... I mean hell i know a few people who spent a ton more then me to turn credd to plat.... so those people who spent $2,000 like my old raid leader but took 2months off is appreciated as much? Maybe the word appreciated should be taken out by carbine cuz people showed support in my honest opinion better then just keeping a consistent sub.... as said in previous post some people brought droves of people to the game... help advertise to their friends but thats not as valued as $180 uninterupted payments?	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Context context and well more context, so a more valid comparison using ur car theme. Say u went to a dealership with a friend on the same day and you bought a $75,000 car and paid the full tag upfront in cash and even gave the guy a handsome tip of $15,000 cuz why the hell not.... you like the dealership, the salesman was nice and u like the "product" he sold you so you show your "support". So that same day and same time your friend buys a car for $25,000 but he makes payments on it over 1 year... doesnt do anything extra no tips nothing... now you go back to said dealership 1 year from that day with said friend to buy another car and continue doing business with a dealership you like and trust, but when you get there they give your friend keys to a boat and trailer as a "free gift" (which again isnt free because it required previous business to obtain) for his business and making his payments over 1 year consistently, all the while your standing there and all ya get is handshake, a thank you for coming back, and a portable cd player..... now they tell you your friend got his boat for being a loyal customer and appreciated his business for that 1 year.... and well they appreciated your business to but not quite as much....
----
			sigh i mean i could add more to the "scenario" to make it seem more like said situation, dealership is going bankrupt, sell shady cars yada yada yada, NONE of that is the point.... its more of the principal behind the words appreciation and loyalty and how they weigh out in the real world.... u cant say in a similar situation if a company did something like that you wouldnt be offend? or take your money else where? again this all comes down to what "supporting" a company really comes down to.... money. So with the words used by carbine it is rather misleading and offensive to say 1 form is more supportive then another. When you, carbine and i know which 1 really helps them out.... not the idea of a consistent sub, it was the money behind the consistent sub. So again change the wording calling 1 loyal and appreciation worthy and the other not is well contradicting. Hell the real appreciation shouldnt even go just high dollar players..... in my honest opinion, if they want to make it exclusive and not rewarded to all who stuck it out for more then 5months (which i think is more then enough to say u supported the game and stuck around) give it the guys who put out extreme amounts of credd on the exchange....... those guys single handly kept the game afloat and "supported" more then any person who just subbed for 1year consistently or my $505 i spent. Again comes back to the word appreciation.... how going to say you appreciate 1 more then the other...	
----
			For what it's worth, I am going to be getting the mount, but I still think it's pretty crappy that people who have been here since launch but had to change payment methods or have been subbing month-by-month with CREDD won't get recognized with it.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
sigh i mean i could add more to the "scenario" to make it seem more like said situation, dealership is going bankrupt, sell shady cars yada yada yada, NONE of that is the point.... its more of the principal behind the words appreciation and loyalty and how they weigh out in the real world.... u cant say in a similar situation if a company did something like that you wouldnt be offend? or take your money else where? again this all comes down to what "supporting" a company really comes down to.... money. So with the words used by carbine it is rather misleading and offensive to say 1 form is more supportive then another. When you, carbine and i know which 1 really helps them out.... not the idea of a consistent sub, it was the money behind the consistent sub. So again change the wording calling 1 loyal and appreciation worthy and the other not is well contradicting. Hell the real appreciation shouldnt even go just high dollar players..... in my honest opinion, if they want to make it exclusive and not rewarded to all who stuck it out for more then 5months (which i think is more then enough to say u supported the game and stuck around) give it the guys who put out extreme amounts of credd on the exchange....... those guys single handly kept the game afloat and "supported" more then any person who just subbed for 1year consistently or my $505 i spent. Again comes back to the word appreciation.... how going to say you appreciate 1 more then the other...
----
			
Since we're approaching 10 pages can everyone just really quickly summarize their position in one or two sentences so that devs looking through this thread know what's up?
 
My position:
This is a PR disaster. People feel like they're being taken for granted and the way the mount is being handled was not very well planned. Requirements should have been been public from the start, not magically revealed months after it was far too late to qualify.
 
Proposed solution:
Make mount available to everyone who purchased a copy of the game before the F2P transition, or make mount available for loyalty points on loyalty shop launch day (award loyalty points appropriately to anyone who ever had a subscription). Create loyalty / appreciation policy for future such content to avoid community upheaval over exclusive or locked content.
 
Alternative solution:
Provide mount for free to anyone with unbroken subscription (or meets qualifications with sane adjustments to policy).
Provide mount in loyalty shop for anyone with subscription/purchase who does not fall under reasonable accommodations for current requirements.	
----
			
My position:
Even though this is ending up to be a PR disaster, can't exactly go shifting the lines of something that's already been stated and laid out in black and white, without the risk of upsetting others who met the criteria, or risking others trying to argue for the lines to be shifted even more, which would then upset others even further (domino effect of sorts)... give an inch, they take a mile and all that.  Make this one exception, what's the next exception people are going to protest for.
 
Proposed Solution:
Keep it as it is, look closely at those that come very close to qualifying, and any that have minor lapses due to technical-issues on Carbine's behalf, allow them an exception.  Learn from this PR fallout, and perhaps eventually offer the mount again for Loyalty Points at a high to semi-high Loyalty-Point-Pricing.	
----
			
Again they are appreciating you. What if they made it so that only people before the announcement got the appreciation rewards -not including the mount and title-
No one would jump on the bandwagon to get 0 rewards at the transition. They need something to get more people to try an sub before fall. This is the best way to do it offer something
additional to a normal purchase. Realistically they should drop a middle tier for those of you who have done alot of the time. Make it so that people who sign on now with a new account -not just re-subbing-
don't get the title and pet for instance. But then again you risk people not coming onboard.
They can't really change the conditions they have already set other than very small allowances.
If they did they would lose a great deal of respect, even from those players who all of a sudden got those extra rewards.
What else might they change on there word in the future and they might not always be in favour of community.
I only pulled your scenario apart because it doesn't fit the bill.
You are getting free stuff. You just aren't getting enough free stuff in your opinion.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Again they are appreciating you. What if they made it so that only people before the announcement got the appreciation rewards -not including the mount and title-
No one would jump on the bandwagon to get 0 rewards at the transition. They need something to get more people to try an sub before fall. This is the best way to do it offer something
----
			
My Position:Your wording in the PR campaign needs to be reviewed and "rewards" should be changed to gifts. Having something exclusive to give to the lower percentage of your player base is fine when handled correctly, the black and whitestate of your requirements are a little too tight.
You have given us plenty of heads up on transition and most everything else seems to be in order and less "rage" inducing.
Proposed Solution:Make adjustments to the PR campaign to emphasise these are free appreciation gifts. Not as easy to be upset when something is free and
you can't put an arbitrary value on it.
Amend your requirements to something more sensible. There are alot of suggestions in the feedback,
mine is to allow launch "day" to become launch "week" and either a period of no more then 24 consecutive hrs unsubbed (or a period of 5* days total unsubbed.)
 
 
*5 days because it actually lines up with the allowance "that other game" made when they allowed 60days from launch to buy there game to receive a statue.	
----
			
again the amount of "free" stuff i get isnt the issue here.... its the fact that alot of people contributed more than the higher appreciation tier in different ways... they showed their support for the company in other valuable ways and are not being appreciated for it..... as a few have already posted they had enough credd on account and sub to last them the whole year and didnt log in for 4-5 months how can that be a decent measurement of support, by that player not being there we had a lower pop and lower pop caused alot to leave..... but they will still get a mount, where as someone who was say active in the community and has 8x the play time as said player and or has invested more money as well as their time actually playing the game and running events to help what was left of the community stay together, less appreciated then someone who just set up autopay... for $180
 
Again alot of these players yall wish to exclude, like credd suppliers are way more deserving then just doing autopay... not only did they pay more but they kept more players in the game to help pay for it and keep it from being pulled and i dont even fit in that category ( arguing that 1 for a friend that again bought well over 25 credd and sold on exchange) that means this guy paid for 2 peoples subs for 1 year each and.... gave carbine a extra $5 per sub.... but let me guess thats not worthy of said appreciation....	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
again the amount of "free" stuff i get isnt the issue here.... its the fact that alot of people contributed more than the higher appreciation tier in different ways... they showed their support for the company in other valuable ways and are not being appreciated for it..... as a few have already posted they had enough credd on account and sub to last them the whole year and didnt log in for 4-5 months how can that be a decent measurement of support, by that player not being there we had a lower pop and lower pop caused alot to leave..... but they will still get a mount, where as someone who was say active in the community and has 8x the play time as said player and or has invested more money as well as their time actually playing the game and running events to help what was left of the community stay together, less appreciated then someone who just set up autopay... for $180
 
Again alot of these players yall wish to exclude, like credd suppliers are way more deserving then just doing autopay... not only did they pay more but they kept more players in the game to help pay for it and keep it from being pulled and i dont even fit in that category ( arguing that 1 for a friend that again bought well over 25 credd and sold on exchange) that means this guy paid for 2 peoples subs for 1 year each and.... gave carbine a extra $5 per sub.... but let me guess thats not worthy of said appreciation....
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
For what it's worth, I am going to be getting the mount, but I still think it's pretty crappy that people who have been here since launch but had to change payment methods or have been subbing month-by-month with CREDD won't get recognized with it.
----
			with the way the game ran over the past year imo and all of the issues in perfomance, broken promises as far as content drop time frames, the server closing down to 1 sever per region, population getting so low that pvp was impossible to match up and actually play over the past 3-4 months until just recent, with endless loss of high end raiding guilds and lack of players, the imbalance, and extreme bugs, i honestly think it more then fair to open the rewards up to anyone who subbed / played for more then 7months..... hell even putting the requirement on a player base average played time is more then fair enough to allow EVERYONE who helped keep game alive and funded at all to be appreciated..... this wasnt an easy ride at all and to annex as many as this requirement does means they are rewarding less then 10% of what was left of the playerbase.... when all reality they couldnt of done without the other people.... thats my arguement here.... how can you claim its appreciation and support based and then have a screening like that.... auto pay for 1 year and afking 80% of the duration is better then a player who maybe missed 2 weeks of subbing?! hell even 6months of not subbing? 	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Well for what it's worth people who used CREDD or switched billing that still maintained 100% up time and no lapse of service will be getting it.
 
I asked if me switching to credd means I wouldn't get it and this was the response: https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/126784-feedback-f2p-announcement-faq/page-9&do=findComment&comment=1325904
----
			
My only issue with you using Credd as justification is that you are already compensated in game depending on the market price. Whether that was 3plat at the start or close to 20 now you got in game compensation for your cash purchase.As for the amount of money spent you are getting points towards the "loyalty" thermometer. Which very well may have its own mount associated with it that other people who haven't earned as many points as said player can't get.If I buy another account tomorrow should I argue that I'm entitled to full loyalty points on both accounts because they are both in my name. Of course not. You aren't able to see the distinction between the 2 different programs, loyalty and appreciation. Both are earned, one requires you to spend your rl money the other requires that you have held a continuous sub from start till transition.
Running community events is rewarded in and of itself. Other players appreciate your commitment, Carbine and any mmo for that matter can't give rewards based on community events.... You would have a 100 people all saying that the event they are running is worthy of Carbines undivided attention.I am not trying to exclude people from loyalty rewards or appreciation rewards that don't deserve them.
You say autopay as if it is a bad thing... That is what a subscription is... People who have lapsed have had to manually cancel the subscription for one reason or another.
The lapse is in most cases the fault of the person who cancelled. If your cc expired that is your fault for not keeping on top of your own affairs.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
You say autopay as if it is a bad thing... That is what a subscription is... People who have lapsed have had to manually cancel the subscription for one reason or another.
The lapse is in most cases the fault of the person who cancelled. If your cc expired that is your fault for not keeping on top of your own affairs.
----
			
Ugh... leaving because the game was failing and had bugs and bla bla bla means you didn't stay the entire time, you weren't as loyal as the person who stayed the entire time, can you deny that? therefore you lose out on 2 of the rewards, that is fair.
 
Now whats not fair is the people that DID stay here the entire time and online everyday the game was live, but had a lapse of minutes/hours while repaying. Why are those people not getting the highest reward, why is the line set to disqualify those that lapsed for even 1 second, where is the logic in that? i dare anyone to tell me what is so bad about lapsing for a few minutes/hours, and why that should disqualify you, other than "Carbine said so".	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Well, to be honest... it's not like people that bought and resold CREDD got NOTHING... they got large amounts of in-game platinum to have a leg-up on others who didn't have as much platinum, so there is that.
 
Secondly... being active is good, not saying it wasn't... but since you were stating the amount of money paid earlier, those that paid in advanced, and weren't logged in for 4-5 months, have given Carbine the money for the time in advance... again, just going by the dollar-sign examples you were tossing out earlier.  :unsure:
 
This is an example of what I was talking about... anybody that wants something bad enough can paint the reasoning for exceptions (it's how so many lawyers win so many cases that make zero sense, leaving behind bad precedents).  Not saying you don't deserve an exception, but if this was granted, somebody else who did pay far in advance, that didn't play all that much, that only had a minor lapse, could argue that they're just as worthy as well for their own specified reasons.  Again, the whole, give 'em an inch, they'll take a mile adage.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Ugh... leaving because the game was failing and had bugs and bla bla bla means you didn't stay the entire time, you weren't as loyal as the person who stayed the entire time, can you deny that? therefore you lose out on 2 of the rewards, that is fair.
 
Now whats not fair is the people that DID stay here the entire time and online everyday the game was live, but had a lapse of minutes/hours while repaying. Why are those people not getting the highest reward, why is the line set to disqualify those that lapsed for even 1 second, where is the logic in that? i dare anyone to tell me what is so bad about lapsing for a few minutes/hours, and why that should disqualify you, other than "Carbine said so".
----
			
This is the thing, I am not so bothered about the rewards. The rewards is a lovely idea from carbine and it is great they are giving them away to show their appreciation to recurring sub members.
 
The thing I am bothered about is the wording carbine has used in their PA. They made it about $ when they said only people with a recurring sub since launch will receive it.
 
Loyalty as a concept at least for me is a huge thing and should not have been bandied around with such stringent requirements without knowing it will alienate a large section of members. I feel like I am loyal to this game, I have been since beta and I will continue to be well into the f2p transition. A mount and title won't change that, and I'm very happy about the other loyalty rewards (the snoglug is sooo cute ^-^) It's not a sense of entitlement for the gifts, it's the fact that my commitment to this game has been measured up against other people who may have paid a 12month sub in advance then quit a couple weeks later and left the sub running. I know it sounds like I'm whining about a mount, or I sound entitled... But the extra gifts will not make or break my continuing support for this game. It would just be nice for carbine to at least identify the people who did put a lot of time into the game, who did pay for all months and played almost every day but happen to fall into a grey area of a couple of hours or a day.
 
My point is, I just want the wording to change. Ideally I would like there to be a slight alteration for the "grey areas" that so many people will fall into.
 
If carbine do not do this, then I will just continue to show my support and hope that the "loyalty" scheme has some cool rewards in the future. I already paid for a year advance in sub /sob	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
That is my point exactly tho..... if you cant measure a players contribution fairly enough and consistently enough with a certain method would that not be ideal to change it to a more accepted method by the masses? i mean this all falls back on the wording.... if this is truly appreciation / support / loyalty based then their requirement is not fully and thoroughly relevant. They need to change the wording or not annex those who helped support the game just as much if not more... and by the logic of well ppl who got credd didnt get nothing.... neither did people who either paid 1 year up front (cheaper over sub) or consistently paid every month (they got to play the game woohoo) so see that logic is completely sound or fair cuz... yes everyone who bought something for or in wildstar got something already for their money... so why tie it to such a trivial requirement when again their are better ways, ways that dont *cupcake* off the masses and actually would make alot more people happy. Why *cupcake* of ur more active players, higher paying players, and  credd trading players.... why not include more people to make more happy? i can say i wouldnt be said if they brought back my promo mounts on the cash shop, or my top hat... because who cares if more people have it... atleast they could have the option to enjoy it rather then be, left out or found constantly wanting and reminded of locked content they cant acess... no1 wants that... 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Ugh... leaving because the game was failing and had bugs and bla bla bla means you didn't stay the entire time, you weren't as loyal as the person who stayed the entire time, can you deny that? therefore you lose out on 2 of the rewards, that is fair.
 
Now whats not fair is the people that DID stay here the entire time and online everyday the game was live, but had a lapse of minutes/hours while repaying. Why are those people not getting the highest reward, why is the line set to disqualify those that lapsed for even 1 second, where is the logic in that? i dare anyone to tell me what is so bad about lapsing for a few minutes/hours, and why that should disqualify you, other than "Carbine said so".
----
			
@KyrillThe method being used to measure your contribution in terms of monetary support is the "Loyalty Program" not the appreciation gifts. Every dollar spent will most likely equate to a certain number of points
to be spent in game on whatever they decide to put on the thermometer. 	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
No, it wouldn't be ideal.  Because I already stated... if they shift the line now, there'll be other people protest other types of examples to get them to shift the line again.
 
I wholeheartedly agree they worded it wrong, and made a tremendous mess in the way this was announced... but they've already laid out the stipulations... if they shift on them, they'll have to shift again and again and again.  Because if they shift now, and somebody else lobbies their reasoning/complaints and they refuse to shift later, then the other parties can shout that it's unfair and unethical.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
This is the thing, I am not so bothered about the rewards. The rewards is a lovely idea from carbine and it is great they are giving them away to show their appreciation to recurring sub members.
 
The thing I am bothered about is the wording carbine has used in their PA. They made it about $ when they said only people with a recurring sub since launch will receive it.
 
Loyalty as a concept at least for me is a huge thing and should not have been bandied around with such stringent requirements without knowing it will alienate a large section of members. I feel like I am loyal to this game, I have been since beta and I will continue to be well into the f2p transition. A mount and title won't change that, and I'm very happy about the other loyalty rewards (the snoglug is sooo cute ^-^) It's not a sense of entitlement for the gifts, it's the fact that my commitment to this game has been measured up against other people who may have paid a 12month sub in advance then quit a couple weeks later and left the sub running. I know it sounds like I'm whining about a mount, or I sound entitled... But the extra gifts will not make or break my continuing support for this game. It would just be nice for carbine to at least identify the people who did put a lot of time into the game, who did pay for all months and played almost every day but happen to fall into a grey area of a couple of hours or a day.
 
My point is, I just want the wording to change. Ideally I would like there to be a slight alteration for the "grey areas" that so many people will fall into.
 
If carbine do not do this, then I will just continue to show my support and hope that the "loyalty" scheme has some cool rewards in the future. I already paid for a year advance in sub /sob
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
LOL OTHER PROTESTS by what the 25-50 people who will qualify versus what the few other thousand? thats what your worried about? the minority instead of the masses? you know thats why we end up in this very predicament... game was originally designed for the minority and drove away the masses.....
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
lol thats literally what ive been arguing... yet u mock me... funny that not once did i demand the mount... all i have argued is that this said method is inconsistent and unfair..... why did they draw the line where they did... when i say i missed out 1 month i mean in the month of november i missed 2 days... was out of time but had credd sitting on my account, however i was not home... how does that make me disloyal? how do pull that i left due to game failing? i missed 2 days in 1 month and which is 11months when rounded to the nearest month... lol i dont reach the full 1year because of this im marked at 11months 27-8 days.... thats fair? when ive spent what ive spent and played as long as i did?
----
			
The thread grew 3 pages since I was last online (and might've grown more by the time I finish this post due to me being unable to quote quickly) but I only think I should respond to the posts quoting me since my stance on the matter is clear. Neither copy/paste nor the quote button work for me so I'll have to quote you manually, please correct me if I mess anything up (there is probably an easy fix but normally I only lurk here so I haven't found one).
 
Me:
 
{| class="blockquote"
 
There is nothing wrong with giving the players subbed from launch to F2P something cool, but player feedback made it clear that the Ikthian Crawler was TOO cool to be gated behind a very narrow definition of "loyal enough" (being subbed from launch to F2P is currently considered superior to contributing through websites/livestreams/enjoying the game and recommending it etc.).
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
It could be a mount, it could be a hat, but at the end of the day, it's really cool and keeping it exclusive in the way that Carbine has decided to do it is making a lot of people feel very unloved, even if they've been pulling more weight than the people who are eligible.
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Are these the same people who asked for the strain board to drop by 90% of it's total value and tried to rationalize it by comparing it to clearing out venue at a car dealership?
https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/119995-strain-hoverboard-price-reduction-on-ptr/page-2
 
Will these people also ask for anything that gets rewarded exclusively to the top tier PvP players? I know you got one dude in there already asking for it.
https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/125288-drop-5-season-15/page-6
 
Point is...these guys are everywhere. "Give to me!" "I paid for this game, I deserve this content." 
They'll hide behind whatever reason they can muster to get their ways and you just have to tell them, this is how you get it, now do it. If you want stuff handed to you, go play WoW (and I say that as a big fan of WoW.)
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Naaaaw don't worry they're not so dumb that they would prevent you from getting the mount for 3 minutes.
 
 :)
----
			
I would like to think Carbine would give a days grace for every month. I know I am not the only one that subs, then cancels and if I want to continue playing, reapply the sub. If not then oh well, they have a "requirement" if you dont meet it, too bad. As rude or blunt that may be, it is the truth.
 
moderator edit: content
			
				
	Edited June 1, 2015 by Chillia	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Since they did change my start date from May 29, 2014 to Jan 13, 2015, I pretty certain those 3 minutes will cost me dearly. Thanks for trying to give me hope though.   :)
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Ugh... leaving because the game was failing and had bugs and bla bla bla means you didn't stay the entire time, you weren't as loyal as the person who stayed the entire time, can you deny that? therefore you lose out on 2 of the rewards, that is fair.
 
Now whats not fair is the people that DID stay here the entire time and online everyday the game was live, but had a lapse of minutes/hours while repaying. Why are those people not getting the highest reward, why is the line set to disqualify those that lapsed for even 1 second, where is the logic in that? i dare anyone to tell me what is so bad about lapsing for a few minutes/hours, and why that should disqualify you, other than "Carbine said so".
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
The beta costume is cool but players who didn't play beta shouldn't get it, because it was a reward for playing in beta. The Ikthian Crawler is cool and is a player appreciation gift gated behind an unreasonable definition of "loyal enough". I want both but I'm not eligible for either, though I really think I should be eligible for the latter, hence why I leave my opinion/feedback on this here for Carbine to see.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Carbine set "maintaining a subscription from WildStar’s official launch on June 3rd, 2014 until the Free-to-Play launch" as criteria for getting the pet and title, not as a definition of "loyalty". The only thing that makes it unreasonable is that it has to be uninterrupted. 
----
			
WE KNEW about the hover board from beta.
WE KNEW about the deluxe rewards. 
WE KNEW about the boom boxes. 
WE KNEW about the sword. 
 
WE DID NOT KNOW about the player appreciation awards. THAT is what pisses me off as a collector. 
 
At least with the pumera pet they let you contact CS to get one no matter what as long as you contacted them promptly. The same needs to be done here. If you were subbed at the announcement (even if they require a launch purchase) the full rewards should be offered. 
 
Whether that happens or not I do not know. I am extremely disappointed in how this is being handled and only a select few seem to be anto-leniency for whatever reason. They sure are loud though and comment on nearly every post.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
WE KNEW about the hover board from beta.
WE KNEW about the deluxe rewards. 
WE KNEW about the boom boxes. 
WE KNEW about the sword. 
 
WE DID NOT KNOW about the player appreciation awards. THAT is what pisses me off as a collector. 
 
At least with the pumera pet they let you contact CS to get one no matter what as long as you contacted them promptly. The same needs to be done here. If you were subbed at the announcement (even if they require a launch purchase) the full rewards should be offered. 
 
Whether that happens or not I do not know. I am extremely disappointed in how this is being handled and only a select few seem to be anto-leniency for whatever reason. They sure are loud though and comment on nearly every post.
----
			
It's supposed to be a player appreciation gift.
 
Currently you are considered eligible for the mount if you paid for a year sub and couldn't be arsed to cancel it, regardless of how much you played/enjoyed the game.
 
Then why can't players subbed before the F2P announcement pay for the missing months? Because it's a player appreciation gift- oh, right ^
 
It's bad business, it's bad PR, it's utterly and completely broken.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
lol thats literally what ive been arguing... yet u mock me... funny that not once did i demand the mount... all i have argued is that this said method is inconsistent and unfair..... why did they draw the line where they did... when i say i missed out 1 month i mean in the month of november i missed 2 days... was out of time but had credd sitting on my account, however i was not home... how does that make me disloyal? how do pull that i left due to game failing? i missed 2 days in 1 month and which is 11months when rounded to the nearest month... lol i dont reach the full 1year because of this im marked at 11months 27-8 days.... thats fair? when ive spent what ive spent and played as long as i did?
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
It's supposed to be a player appreciation gift.
 
Currently you are considered eligible for the mount if you paid for a year sub and couldn't be arsed to cancel it, regardless of how much you played/enjoyed the game.
 
Then why can't players subbed before the F2P announcement pay for the missing months? Because it's a player appreciation gift- oh, right ^
 
It's bad business, it's bad PR, it's utterly and completely broken.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
...and also that nobody knew about it until after it was too late.
----
			
I think what would help is just extending the launch period and or knocking off a week of the total time needed for an active sub would be sufficient. It is not unheard of for MMOS to extend their definition of "launch" from the day after headstart. I know a couple of people for example couldn't apply their retail codes as their boxes arrived after June 3rd for whatever reasons. From the sounds of it, most people I see that are upset over the continuous subscription would seem to fall into a category of missing a day or two due to "poop happening" with their game time.
 
I don't think it's feasible to believe Carbine can or will be able to measure how long each lapse is, but I can easily see them being able to measure total number of active days subbed.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
 
- Would you stay subscribed the entire time knowing that there's a mount at the end of it for you?
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Yes, I would.
 
In FACT, I have done it in the past. Blizzard gave away (in WoW) a Tyrael's Charger mount in exchange for paying for 1 year in advance. Other rewards were given as well, but I exclusively did this for that mount.
----
			
I also am apparently disloyal. I pay using credd and have had my credd subscription end while I was away for a weekend, so I would have a lapse of a day in my account until I was home to log back in.
 
*sigh*	
----
			I'm almost certain that they will do something for the players that have had credit card issues, hours between resubs etc. That doesn't change the fact that Carbine's current player appreciation gift system appreciate those who couldn't be arsed to cancel their from launch year sub regardless of how much they played/enjoyed the game more than the majority of their current niche playerbase.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I'm almost certain that they will do something for the players that have had credit card issues, hours between resubs etc. That doesn't change the fact that Carbine's current player appreciation gift system appreciate those who couldn't be arsed to cancel their from launch year sub regardless of how much they played/enjoyed the game more than the majority of their current niche playerbase.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I also am apparently disloyal. I pay using credd and have had my credd subscription end while I was away for a weekend, so I would have a lapse of a day in my account until I was home to log back in.
 
*sigh*
----
			@Lethality: Look at the last post at page 10, is that logical?	
----
			
Heres a question as well. Hopefully a Carbine staff can poke at this one...
 
When the pumera pet was given out and people were told to contact CS about it. What was the criteria for obtaining it? Was it simply that the persons account glitched out and they were not given the pet, but should have OR did the person just simply have to ask?	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I also am apparently disloyal. I pay using credd and have had my credd subscription end while I was away for a weekend, so I would have a lapse of a day in my account until I was home to log back in.
 
*sigh*
----
			
Some of the reasoning in this thread for why people "deserve" the mount just breaks my brain. 
I don't get what is so hard about understanding that if you were able to stay with Carbine through thick and thin, regardless if you couldn't due to circumstances outside of your control, you get something extra.
My sub lapsed because life happened and I couldn't play for a while. I don't get the mount. And the funny part is, that I could have if I tried/cared enough. I had CREDD sitting on my account that eventually expired. I could have logged in just to activate the CREDD, but my interest in games had waned and I didn't.  
I still get other stuff for being here at least part of the time.
 
The one-off's of a minute or three between card changing or whatever I can understand, but if you stopped playing, again for whatever reason, you don't qualify as per the perfectly logical and sane rules that Carbine put forth. While you don't have control over why you couldn't play, neither does Carbine and they don't have to make up for that.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
 
 
No one answered my question earlier, so I'll post it again, since it seems appropriate for you two.
 
If Carbine came out today and said:
 
"Hey guys, we're going to do another Anniversary Giveaway next year when we turn 2! All you need to do is log in during that period and you'll get the rewards! As a special gift to customers who maintain a subscription without lapse between now and then, we'll be giving those folks an additional gift in the forum of an exclusive mount!"
 
Given that "heads up" I pose these questions to you:
 
- Would you stay subscribed the entire time knowing that there's a mount at the end of it for you?
- If no, would you honestly expect to receive it after you returned anyway?
 
This is no different, and the biggest thing is the nature of surprise gifts is that they reward past behavior without knowing.
 
Players would *cupcake* up a storm if they were "forced" to stay subscribed to a game they hate and pay $180 for a mount.
 
Tell me I'm wrong.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
 
 
Tell me I'm wrong.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Difference being that you entered into a contract and essentially couldn't cancel.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Yes, I can. YOU DON'T KNOW ME! lol.
 
Truthfully, I would 100% have kept it active. If with f2p they announce a 12 month sub gets an exclusive "aurin cup" (shudders) I would still do it. For a collector, its all or nothing baby, doesn't matter what the item in question is.
----
			
Well...they are asking us to keep our sub going even further until the actual implementation of F2P to get the loyalty rewards if I'm reading right. So they've kind of already asked us that question Lethality proposed, just not a year...it'd be more technically for the mount/title and roughly 3-4+ months for the other stuff as long as you sub prior to June 15th...Unless I'm reading it wrong.
 
I'm also offended that my birthday is used as the cutoff point *shakes fist at Caydiem*	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
No, it wouldn't be ideal. Because I already stated... if they shift the line now, there'll be other people protesting other types of examples to get them to shift the line again.
 
I wholeheartedly agree they worded it wrong, and made a tremendous mess in the way this was announced... but they've already laid out the stipulations... if they shift on them, they'll have to shift again and again and again. Because if they shift now, and somebody else lobbies their reasoning/complaints and they refuse to shift later, then the other parties can shout that it's unfair and unethical.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Well...they are asking us to keep our sub going even further until the actual implementation of F2P to get the loyalty rewards if I'm reading right. So they've kind of already asked us that question Lethality proposed, just not a year...it'd be more technically for the mount/title and roughly 3-4+ months for the other stuff as long as you sub prior to June 15th...Unless I'm reading it wrong.
 
I'm also offended that my birthday is used as the cutoff point *shakes fist at Caydiem*
----
			@Typrop: They are still eligible if they keep it up, unlike other loyal players who might have played/enjoyed the game more than them.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Ugh... leaving because the game was failing and had bugs and bla bla bla means you didn't stay the entire time, you weren't as loyal as the person who stayed the entire time, can you deny that? therefore you lose out on 2 of the rewards, that is fair.
 
Now whats not fair is the people that DID stay here the entire time and online everyday the game was live, but had a lapse of minutes/hours while repaying. Why are those people not getting the highest reward, why is the line set to disqualify those that lapsed for even 1 second, where is the logic in that? i dare anyone to tell me what is so bad about lapsing for a few minutes/hours, and why that should disqualify you, other than "Carbine said so".
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I have your answer Byona. Carbine Engineer not enough good for complex SQL. Sorry if any dev see this but this is the only one explanation I found that can match this "action". 
----
			
Not reading thru 12 pages but all I know, and according to how things are read and I think someone mentioned that CArbine said it in their stream is if you want the mount, has to be continous with 0 interuptions.  So that bad credit card (whatever reason it became bad) n auto renewal that cancelled your account for the hours it was cancelled well your out of luck (My experience and problem).  For the ones that changed their method of payment and cancelled their account doing this, well your out of luck.
 
And being out of luck, you lose out on a title and a cool mount.  And they are telling you that your loyalty for this game is as good as someone that purchased the game by June 15, 2015, a full year after release and what you have been subscribing too.  This is what may *cupcake* off people.  The fact that people have stayed with this game and put up with some of this in the past and yet still subscribed and didn't quit, well, what if they did quit.  This game would be gone.
 
For those that cancelled for a month, well, I completly understand why you should not get the rewards.  You weren't loyal by canceling for a month, sorry.  It sucks but should be given something more than those that just sign up by June 15.  
 
CARBINE, Honestly, make the amount of monthly subscription requirements for the rewards, not based on continous account.  	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
@Typrop: They are still eligible if they keep it up, unlike other loyal players who might have played/enjoyed the game more than them.
----