128523-do-carbine-making-huge-step-out-of-old-hardcore-oriented-players

== Content ==
			
First of all,forgive me for my broken english,I'm russian tho
To clear everything up						Wildstar and even participate in community life by helping russian players with...basically everything that  can provide
i honestly tried to quit after the f2p confirmation as		
----
			
Im not going to exagerate but the so called "hardcore" player on my server (Warhound) is just less than 10 on regular time. P2P isn't going to work on wildstar.
 
moderator edit: language 
			
				
	Edited June 26, 2015 by Chillia	
----
			Talking about subscription (p2p) vs buy to play (b2p) vs free to play (f2p)?  P2p hasn't worked for wildstar so far, and getting an influx of players most likely would happen with f2p.  Alot of MMO's these days are f2p and offer stuff to buy.  I know some MMO's is a pay to win mentality when they see f2p but Wildstar will not be that (kindof).  The kindof is you can purchase credd to sell for plat and buy gear, amps/abilities for that.  Can do that now though.  So choice is either b2p or f2p.  F2p is the choice they made, and it gets players in, and I really like what Wildstar is doing for content, you don't have to purchase it, it is all included.  What you do purchase is costumes/pets/mounts/dyes/housing and I'm sure other things too will be included.  The stuff they have to sell has so much potential, it can carry the f2p population.  And in no way will f2p make it more casual friendly (hopefully).  I'm sure the raids and even some of the vet dungeons will have the hardcore aspect still built in (the hardcore aspect is having to run it more than 2 times to understand the mechanics of each fight and trash, not the actual content).  	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Talking about subscription (p2p) vs buy to play (b2p) vs free to play (f2p)?  P2p hasn't worked for wildstar so far, and getting an influx of players most likely would happen with f2p.  Alot of MMO's these days are f2p and offer stuff to buy.  I know some MMO's is a pay to win mentality when they see f2p but Wildstar will not be that (kindof).  The kindof is you can purchase credd to sell for plat and buy gear, amps/abilities for that.  Can do that now though.  So choice is either b2p or f2p.  F2p is the choice they made, and it gets players in, and I really like what Wildstar is doing for content, you don't have to purchase it, it is all included.  What you do purchase is costumes/pets/mounts/dyes/housing and I'm sure other things too will be included.  The stuff they have to sell has so much potential, it can carry the f2p population.  And in no way will f2p make it more casual friendly (hopefully).  I'm sure the raids and even some of the vet dungeons will have the hardcore aspect still built in (the hardcore aspect is having to run it more than 2 times to understand the mechanics of each fight and trash, not the actual content).  
----
			Thats alot of MMO's.  And there is build diversity, just there are main skills to use, and options outside fo that.  There is only so many different ways to play a class.  And the time devotion to do raid content isn't as bad.  I spend 10.5-12 hours a week on raiding (depending on how often I decide to join early).  And I have 100% attendance for my guild.  Thats it.  And I'm at the last boss.  If playing 10 hours a week on a game is to much for some, than idk what to say.  Other than having a set schedule of when to play.  And if I play extra, I do the "irrelevant" content.  I will agree on the non-raiders there's not alot to do compared to some other games, but it's not this huge gap that is portrayed.  	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Thats alot of MMO's.  And there is build diversity, just there are main skills to use, and options outside fo that.  There is only so many different ways to play a class.  And the time devotion to do raid content isn't as bad.  I spend 10.5-12 hours a week on raiding (depending on how often I decide to join early).  And I have 100% attendance for my guild.  Thats it.  And I'm at the last boss.  If playing 10 hours a week on a game is to much for some, than idk what to say.  Other than having a set schedule of when to play.  And if I play extra, I do the "irrelevant" content.  I will agree on the non-raiders there's not alot to do compared to some other games, but it's not this huge gap that is portrayed.  
----
			
curious how you would want difference in a way a warrior plays?  The only game I can think of that has some diversity in "warrior" is WoW and thats tentative.  2 Main skills change.  What want a choice of 2 diffrent builders or 2 different spenders?  Sort of like espers?  Warrior difference is PL vs AB vs neither and use WW more.  I guess you can see different weapons but than again look at FFXIV, they only use one weapon.  And Runing is different but mostly comes to AP vs Crit but most likely will change once the new stats come out.  More diversity.  But what do you expect from a 1st year game?  A huge amount of content that rivals other MMO's that have been out for years?
 
And the book of 3 nights, idk.  I know there is a guild that only does 2 nights a week.  We have players that only log on wednesdays to raid.  Just have to find a guild that does this.  But this game endgame is raiding and imho, not a problem.   FFXIV is raiding.  Swtor is raiding/group content.  WoW is raiding.  Rift is raiding/events.  Teso and GW2 is open world pvp/questing.  This game isn't built for that.  Maybe if they inlcuded a PVP endgame, but they are building on it, and eventually will get there.	
----
			
We book 2 evenings a week and not everyone is there every night. Granted, we are not at the final boss, but we are making progress and having fun.
 
And we still do loads of content other than raids.	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
curious how you would want difference in a way a warrior plays?  The only game I can think of that has some diversity in "warrior" is WoW and thats tentative.  2 Main skills change.  What want a choice of 2 diffrent builders or 2 different spenders?  Sort of like espers?  Warrior difference is PL vs AB vs neither and use WW more.  I guess you can see different weapons but than again look at FFXIV, they only use one weapon.  And Runing is different but mostly comes to AP vs Crit but most likely will change once the new stats come out.  More diversity.  But what do you expect from a 1st year game?  A huge amount of content that rivals other MMO's that have been out for years?
 
And the book of 3 nights, idk.  I know there is a guild that only does 2 nights a week.  We have players that only log on wednesdays to raid.  Just have to find a guild that does this.  But this game endgame is raiding and imho, not a problem.   FFXIV is raiding.  Swtor is raiding/group content.  WoW is raiding.  Rift is raiding/events.  Teso and GW2 is open world pvp/questing.  This game isn't built for that.  Maybe if they inlcuded a PVP endgame, but they are building on it, and eventually will get there.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
maybe its just my PoV..
in teso, or gw2, i feel like i can customize my warrior to my liking much more. actually... i can make him quite unique...
in wildstar, i'm assuredly the same as the other guy. basically i just have to compare Assault Power stat to know who raided more and thats about the only difference that is worthwhile to make.
i feel that for an mmorpg, the options to customize your toon mechanically are not deep enough.
----
			
well, maybe the game just needs a bit more different builders.
right now there is 1 builder skill for DPS and 1 for TANK (talking about warriors).
 
maybe if there was 2 options for DPS builder skills (i.e.: relentless strike and another one, "insert cool name" strike) with different animation and some different synergy.
then also put 2 builders for TANK.
so you end up with.. a bit more variation.
maybe the game just lacks abilities. not enough of them. just not enough choices to change your gameplay.
			
				
	Edited June 26, 2015 by Avatar111	
----
			Some classes have mutliple builders and multiple spenders.  Medic and esper come to mind.  Warriors not so much but if warriors got changed to do this, I think some of the utilty would go away.  	
----
			 I dont think WWW from gw2 would work here.. since there really is only one server per region.. had they started it out like that and didnt blunder pvp.. it might have worked though. 	
----
			Hardcore can be fun when its new and you haven't done it for years.  If you are anything like me, you get to a point where you just want content that is just hard enough to be fun, but not so complicated that some guy standing in the wrong place every pull wipes it in the first minute, requiring another 5-10+ minutes to rez/rebuff/repull.  f2p brings people and more people brings the possibility of more hardcore players.  /shrug   If you are looking for a successfully hardcore spacefaring game, try EvE, join a corp and get out of high sec asap.  That'll put hair on your chest.  	
----
			Hardcore puts more people off than it encourages to play. FTP will be a good thing for Wildstar as in its current model anyone checking out the forums will be put off by complaints of lack of dungeon running opportunities, attunement and focus on raiding.	
----