133716-original-ce-member-guild-leader-but

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			So you're telling me that if my friends are promoted to council and set with permissions to invite and kick from the guild, they can't if they're using f2p accounts?You're going to cripple the entire administrative process of your in game organizational tools for $15 while claiming f2p members have access to the same game that us people who bought it do?I can understand not allowing F2P members to found new guilds, but if they're given permission under someone elses umbrella, should you not at least let them do their jobs?also, because of this,  I can't get my alts into my own guild even though I paid for this game, and if I invite someone else with a paid membership to the guild and they're in the same boat as me, who's going to invite them back to their guild? >.>
			
				
	Edited September 30, 2015 by Shauk	
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It's rough, but Madda's pretty sure other games like this (Tera, TOR, etc.) have a similar feature where freeloaders F2Pers can't do admin stuffs.
 
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			yeah but I mean the way it's set up now it cripples MY experience as a paying member just because i'm surrounded by people who can't even help me get into my own guild, despite their permissions. I'm pretty sure the penalties should only apply to f2p members, not paid.	
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It's rough, but Madda's pretty sure other games like this (Tera, TOR, etc.) have a similar feature where freeloaders F2Pers can't do admin stuffs.
 
While Madda does feel for you, paying for the game =/= valid reason for not getting access to a specific feature.	
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			Well bruised egos and video game pride aside, I feel like any chance I had at ressurecting my guild via the teamwork of my personally selected officers has now been thrown out the window unless they're each expected to pony up specifically for a feature that's more to my benefit than theirs.
			
				
	Edited September 29, 2015 by Shauk	
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It's rough, but Madda's pretty sure other games like this (Tera, TOR, etc.) have a similar feature where freeloaders F2Pers can't do admin stuffs.
 
While Madda does feel for you, paying for the game =/= valid reason for not getting access to a specific feature.
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I'm not really sure how that particular post is insulting F2P players...
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Hello. You might want to try pestering the customer service lopp to see of it can help you; alternatively you can create a new guild if you don't mind losing the guild name.
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Except for the fact that all data shows that F2P players actually spend MORE on games than P2P players do.  Please stop insulting F2P players.  It's causing a toxic community already.
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			Uhh, if the "resurrection" of your guild is for your benefit rather than the combined benefit of ALL your members I think you have more problems ahead of you than not getting your alts invited...	
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			Hello. You might want to try pestering the customer service lopp to see of it can help you; alternatively you can create a new guild if you don't mind losing the guild name.	
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Calling F2P players freeloaders is insulting.  Especially when they're the one's who are gonna keep this game afloat and will spend more money than Signature members statistically.
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yeah but I mean the way it's set up now it cripples MY experience as a paying member just because i'm surrounded by people who can't even help me get into my own guild, despite their permissions. I'm pretty sure the penalties should only apply to f2p members, not paid.
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Got a way to back up that claim?
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Calling F2P players freeloaders is insulting.  Especially when they're the one's who are gonna keep this game afloat and will spend more money than Signature members statistically.
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			This is garbage, and you're 10000% right. That shouldn't be a feature held behind a paywall. It should be at the guild leader's discretion who does and doesn't get responsibility and privilege in their guild structure. That's not something that should have a dollar amount to it. The only effective work-around would be to appoint signature member recruiters for the guild, and just have the higher up admins monitor chat and manage events. Although, it'd be hard to find people you trust more than who you've already promoted. There's gotta be a policy change with this. 	
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yeah but I mean the way it's set up now it cripples MY experience as a paying member just because i'm surrounded by people who can't even help me get into my own guild, despite their permissions. I'm pretty sure the penalties should only apply to f2p members, not paid.
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			Hey man, I am a subber and I have unguilded toons on both sides. Let the servers come up and I'll join your guild, invite your alts and leave you in peace. I expect there are other helpful people willing to do the same.	
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yeah but I mean the way it's set up now it cripples MY experience as a paying member just because i'm surrounded by people who can't even help me get into my own guild, despite their permissions. I'm pretty sure the penalties should only apply to f2p members, not paid.
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 As someone who's ran a guild successfully in a f2p enviroment for several years.. here is my advice. Encourage them to go signature especially if they want any leadership roles. Don't be afraid to do this.. But don't force them either. You'll have to change the way you do things a bit. But in the end it usually works out for the better. The guild I ran had a high number of subbed players and a low turn over of new recruits at the time. 
 
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Well, welcome to F2P business models. You either dish out for some features, or you suck it up and play. Forum topics don't get you anything besides venting off some steam.
 
Again, Madda does feel for you, but just because you paid for WildStar up front doesn't mean that you decide how they design the game.
 
 
Boy, while you were in your "LFGs" and "Raid Finders" Madda was on Nexus, grinding the end game. 
 
You merely adopted the toxicity. Madda was born in it, molded by it. Madda didn't see the casual nature until Madda was already a max level! By then it was nothing to Madda but poisonous!
 
OT: Madda's poking fun at F2Pers. Don't get so riled up over some person you barely know~
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Except for the fact that all data shows that F2P players actually spend MORE on games than P2P players do.  Please stop insulting F2P players.  It's causing a toxic community already.
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			something something,I forgot what happening	
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So you're telling me that if my friends are promoted to council and set with permissions to invite and kick from the guild, they can't if they're using f2p accounts?
 
You're going to cripple the entire administrative process of your in game organizational tools for $15 while claiming f2p members have access to the same game that us people who bought it do?
 
I can understand not allowing F2P members to found new guilds, but if they're given permission under someone elses umbrella, you shold at least let them do their jobs.
 
TLDR: I can't get my alts into my own guild even though I paid for this game.
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Calling F2P players freeloaders is insulting.  Especially when they're the one's who are gonna keep this game afloat and will spend more money than Signature members statistically.
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your presence & tone are becoming unwelcome as it's clear you're missing the point.
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			Instead of all the insulting, you should realise it's neither the F2Pers who'll contribute the most.  Or the P2Pers.  It's the community as a whole	
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 As someone who's ran a guild successfully in a f2p enviroment for several years.. here is my advice. Encourage them to go signature especially if they want any leadership roles. Don't be afraid to do this.. But don't force them either. You'll have to change the way you do things a bit. But in the end it usually works out for the better. The guild I ran had a high number of subbed players and a low turn over of new recruits at the time. 
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Got a way to back up that claim?
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If they start spending money, they won't be F2P'ers anymore....
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I don't think creating a new guild would do anything, the goal being to get all my characters into one guild, not having 6 characters in 6 different guilds
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If they start spending money, they won't be F2P'ers anymore....
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Isn't it enough that you have to not be f2p in order to create a guild? That's a pretty big barrier for most people, to think that they have keep being a signature to manage the guild is a bit of nonsense.
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			They actually don't even need to spend real money.  They can in-game buy a couple of CREDD, and they have enough Cosmic Points to have full guild access.	
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Calling F2P players freeloaders is insulting.  Especially when they're the one's who are gonna keep this game afloat and will spend more money than Signature members statistically.
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That's just arguing semantics, now is it? Point is, even if they spend money on the game, they will still be considered "f2p players" by the algorithm. You can quite literally spend thousands of dollars on the cash stop and still remain a "free player", simply because you didn't buy signature status.
 
Personally I agree with the OP, f2p players may not be allowed to create guilds, but it should be possible for them to invite people into one, if they have been given the proper righty by a paying player. For the simple reason that otherwise creating and leading guilds will become an incredible chore for the guild leader. Instead of looking for good players that fit your guild you now also need to ask everyone if they are paying players, or not. Is that really the kind of environment we want in the game? o_O "Sorry, no freebots!" Yeah, thanks. I don't need that kind of of community schism.
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While I agree that it has it's... workarounds, I feel like for a game that has suffered to the point that it went against it's own claims that it would (and I quote) "never go to a free to play model" in a sink or swim effort, they'd want to let me stuff a guild full of free to play members to the brim in hopes that they'd keep playing and venture into that cash shop in their down time to get something cool and unique to express themselves, not pay $15 a month to, essentially, do my job for me.
(yes I'm aware there are other perks but people feeling those perks aren't worth it shouldn't necessarily be held against my decision on who to appoint into councilship roles)
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Just ask a random person in /lfg or /zone if they can invite your alts to your guild for you.  It's pretty simple and most subs would be willing to help you.  In time I'm pretty sure Carbine will add a feature that will allow you to add offline players to your guild.
 
If you post a more constructive thread rather than an anger-filled tirade they would be more than willing to listen to you.
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			its not $15 its $5 they can just go by ncoins, they dont need to be subbed to get access. its similar to rift, you have to spend some money so they know you are serious. if you really want to "resurect" a guild i would think you would be able to find 1 person with access 	
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If they spend money(or in-game buy and redeem CREDD) they get Cosmic Points, the more points they get the more perks they get that sub'ers are getting, so looked at in that way they really aren't "F2P'ers" anymore.  That's what I meant.
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While I agree that it has it's... workarounds, I feel like for a game that has suffered to the point that it went against it's own claims that it would (and I quote) "never go to a free to play model" in a sink or swim effort, they'd want to let me stuff a guild full of free to play members to the brim in hopes that they'd keep playing and venture into that cash shop in their down time to get something cool and unique to express themselves, not pay $15 a month to, essentially, do my job for me.
(yes I'm aware there are other perks but people feeling those perks aren't worth it shouldn't necessarily be held against my decision on who to appoint into councilship roles)
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https://www.superdataresearch.com/market-data/mmo-market/
 
Data shows that far, far more money is spent on F2P games than P2P.  And it doesn't matter that it's only 20% of F2P players seeing as, on average, they spend far more than $15 a month.  
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Calling F2P players freeloaders is insulting.  Especially when they're the one's who are gonna keep this game afloat and will spend more money than Signature members statistically.
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You're delusional if you think I'm raging even in the slightest. Only one raging here is you.
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			*sigh*I don't know why people (with the exception of Rebel Angel who is actually trying to be helpful) are flipping me so much attitude over this. The only point I'm trying to illustrate is it seems a bit suspect for carbine to be "free to play = No guild creation or invites" "pay to play = guild creation and invites"While, yes, technically that's exactly where the line in the sand got drawn, I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one who reads that and buys into the guild creation also thought that would extend to creating an administration framework.there should be a huge asterisk next to that bulletpoint in the faq saying "anyone you appoint as an officer is completely gimped and useless as a dishrag in the desert until they jump through the carbine cash kings or cosmic blah blah hoops"Point is, if it's my guild, I would find it reasonable expectation that I choose the administration roles, not carbine's paywall, which was touted to be strictly cosmetic until this point. 	
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			all that said, I really enjoy the game at the core of everything. it's just policy decisions like this that put undue stress on people in my position when in reality all we're trying to do is enjoy ourselves and have fun at the end of the day.	
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*sigh*
 
I don't know why people (with the exception of Rebel Angel who is actually trying to be helpful) are flipping me so much attitude over this. The only point I'm trying to illustrate is it seems a bit suspect for carbine to be "free to play = No guild creation or invites" "pay to play = guild creation and invites"
 
While, yes, technically that's exactly where the line in the sand got drawn, I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one who reads that and buys into the guild creation also thought that would extend to creating an administration framework.
 
there should be a huge asterisk next to that bulletpoint in the faq saying "anyone you appoint as an officer is completely gimped and useless as a dishrag in the desert until they jump through the carbine cash kings or cosmic blah blah hoops"
Point is, if it's my guild, I would find it reasonable expectation that I choose the administration roles, not carbine's paywall, which was touted to be strictly cosmetic until this point.
 
 
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Therefore it's impossible for me to get what I paid for without having others pay for what isn't theirs to pay for. All they really need to do is add the ability to invite offline characters and it'd be fine I guess, hell what was it?
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This particular paywall has a good reason for existing and it is not just to make it a cash grab, its an anti gold spammer measure
anyone who was here at the original launch probably remembers how bad the constant spam invites for arena teams, circles and guilds with names like buygoldhere, loveyoulongtimebuygoldcheap cheapgoldatwwwhackers
etc etc
 
Its a small annoyance for a few to save the masses from a much larger annoyance
 
 
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This particular paywall has a good reason for existing and it is not just to make it a cash grab, its an anti gold spammer measure
anyone who was here at the original launch probably remembers how bad the constant spam invites for arena teams, circles and guilds with names like buygoldhere, loveyoulongtimebuygoldcheap cheapgoldatwwwhackers
etc etc
 
Its a small annoyance for a few to save the masses from a much larger annoyance
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			I somewhat agree with your issue however the only real restrictions from f2p to signature is the invite privledges and more broker spots really. They have to have something held back from f2p to entice people to sub. And seriously lets face it, CREDD really isn't expensive. You can make taht money in a couple days at end game	
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Isn't it enough that you have to not be f2p in order to create a guild? That's a pretty big barrier for most people, to think that they have keep being a signature to manage the guild is a bit of nonsense.
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yeah but I mean the way it's set up now it cripples MY experience as a paying member just because i'm surrounded by people who can't even help me get into my own guild, despite their permissions. I'm pretty sure the penalties should only apply to f2p members, not paid.
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I would firmly agree that it is ridiculous if you had to maintain a signature account to be able to invite people to a guild.
That, however, is not the case. In fact, the second cosmic points reward unlocks all social features permanently, I think you have to spend about 5$ one time to get that feature.
Personally (as someone who played W* at launch, and who has played a number of MMOs, F2P and otherwise) I would rather make people pay a few dollars for full guild privileges than have to deal with the the constant barrage of gold-farming guild invites that was present when the game originally launched.
			
				
	Edited September 30, 2015 by AndClank	
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			I im guild leader of a small friends guild and once bought the game back when if first launched, but luckily i can still do everything in the guild with my non sub account.	
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Got a way to back up that claim?
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			ok I guess $5 isn't an unreasonable amount for someone to spend for someone planning on taking on a leadership role. But yeah I was under the impression that it was only for people for signature memberships as they included that on their f2p vs signature faq. Good to find out that it's not the case at all  :) PROGRESS! XDhowever now I'm stuck at the character screen as trying to load any of my 6 characters just boots me back to the select screen after a brief attempt to load. v.v*patience*	
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It's rough, but Madda's pretty sure other games like this (Tera, TOR, etc.) have a similar feature where freeloaders F2Pers can't do admin stuffs.
 
While Madda does feel for you, paying for the game =/= valid reason for not getting access to a specific feature.
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