127397-returned-after-10-months-but-some-things-still-bug-me

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Hello there. After the announcement for F2P some of my friends said they would start playing the game when it finally has transitioned. But since that is still ~2-3 months away (most likely, if Carbine continues with the quarterly drops) I subscribed for another month. Many of the things that annoyed me back when I unsubscribed have since been resolved, like the silver medal dungeon attunement or (the main reason) nearly no solo content at max level. Now there is much more to do, thanks to Veteran Shiphands, more (and variying) daily zones and Contracts.
 
However, there are still some things which I would like to see changed in the future.
 
1.) More variety while leveling. Once you hit level 22, there is only 1 zone for each level range and at least for me, that kills pretty much all the reason to level an alt. Especially since at least one zone (Halon Ring) was announced before the game launched and it's still not ingame. I do understand that it takes time to create those huge zones, but I really would like to see at least 1 more zone for each level 22-50 zone (or at least until you hit Grimvault). These zones could even come with endgame content, having dungeons/adventures taking place in said zone or like malgrave having a whole max level area in it. 
 
2.) There are no "epic" solo battles. I have to admit I haven't done Omnicore-1 yet, but back in the day when I ventured through the final parts of Grimvault (before Drop 1), I remember getting this "final dungeon" feeling. And then, the boss before the giant robot... felt like any other mob I fought before. Battle was of course also over after ~20-30 seconds. And that's how it felt for pretty much all quests where you kill a named mob. Said mobs do the exact same thing as other mobs of the same category. No special attacks, not more HP, the exact same thing. The only times I actually had the feeling I was in a boss battle was during Shiphands and Housing Expeditions. I just finished the first Defile episode and the final battle again was over in ~10-15 seconds. 
So, for the future, please buff up some of the more important story quests so they actually feel somewhat interesting. Buff the enemies HP, give them unique attacks, just something to spice things up. Currently most of it just feels completely underwhelming, gameplay wise.
 
3.) This doesn't really concern me, but after reading through the Protogames Academy thread it seems new players have problems to understand the whole Interrupt Armor and Moment of Opportunity system. While the first boss is of course not hard, if you don't understand what the game wants from you you just die instantly. 
Do all classes have an interrupt by level 6? If so I would add a small "military base" after finishing the level 6 zone. This would have a small questchain that teaches players about the whole Interrupt, Interrupt Armor and Moment of Opportunity system. If not by 6, maybe at 8 or 9, but before they hit 10. it's true that this system isn't really that well explained ingame, and with F2P coming it might be a good idea to revisit this somehow that the game actually teaches new player this really important system.
 
4.) For the love of god, please never add one time achievements again unless they are stuff like anniversaries or realm first boss kills. 
 
No idea if I will stay subbed until the game has transistioned, as I don't have that much to do except for maybe leveling a dominion character and doing the new level 50 stuff, but I doubt those things alone will be enough to last through a whole month. Anyway, the game is much better nowadays and I do have fun, I just think some things could still be improved.	
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2.) There are no "epic" solo battles. I have to admit I haven't done Omnicore-1 yet, but back in the day when I ventured through the final parts of Grimvault (before Drop 1), I remember getting this "final dungeon" feeling. And then, the boss before the giant robot... felt like any other mob I fought before. Battle was of course also over after ~20-30 seconds. And that's how it felt for pretty much all quests where you kill a named mob. Said mobs do the exact same thing as other mobs of the same category. No special attacks, not more HP, the exact same thing. The only times I actually had the feeling I was in a boss battle was during Shiphands and Housing Expeditions. I just finished the first Defile episode and the final battle again was over in ~10-15 seconds. 
So, for the future, please buff up some of the more important story quests so they actually feel somewhat interesting. Buff the enemies HP, give them unique attacks, just something to spice things up. Currently most of it just feels completely underwhelming, gameplay wise.
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fact. the game is way to easy for combats if you just want to do the solo questing.
keep in mind that some players are "clickers" and/or don't use mmo mouses etc... and some don't even rebind keys!
 
its very hard to make an mmo with a challenge rating everyone will enjoy :\
the gear powercreep doesn't help here, if you are a bit min-maxer you will just destroy every solo quest without trying.
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I just finished the first Defile episode and the final battle again was over in ~10-15 seconds.
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			#3 ) Pretty sure the Protostar Clone explains just that in the beginning, as you work through the various phases of the dungeon.. then you have to apply everything you learned in the big show down. If people are just clicking through what he's saying and what pops on screen... that's their issue, not the game.	
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Are you talking about that guy waaaaay up at the top of the Black Focus? o.0 That took way longer than 10-15 seconds with three people...
 
I do agree that named mobs/end-of-quest-chain mobs should have something special about them. A little more HP, some unique abilities to separate them from other mobs.
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1)As far as I'm aware and recall halon ring is actually Farside. Someone can correct me if  I'm wrong, unless you're referring to Pyria(?). There are 2 zones that we know exist, but just can't be accessed yet which form what we've seen so far would fulfill what you're asking for as they're roughly alternates to whitevale and another zone(I think it was wilderrun?).
 
2) Omnicore feels about right for what you're asking for and that type of stuff would be nice, along with the end of the black focus quest which i thought was fun. There is also the technophage daily you unlock in the defile as well that is soloable, but if you don't pay attention it will kick your cupcake hard.
 
3) Correct me if I'm wrong, but unless they don't read, the protogame academy has announcements telling you everything you need to know. Only way I can see them not seeing the messages is if they don't read the announcements or have an altered UI that blocks it form displaying. Least when I ran it, there seemed to be distinct messages saying "do X/Y/Z" and repeats the message as well if you do the fight again. I have the tutorial addon turnd off, but I believe at some point an MoO pops up too now...
Also to answer your question, everyone gets an interrupt by the time they do protostar academy(at least by level 4 or 3 everyone gets an interrupt)
 
4)eh...i cant see that not happening, so far the one times have ben for very special events or criteria. Like completing silver age before that ended, or wrecking ball for helping stress the servers, etc..	
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My post is the starting post on Protostar so I'll explain a little bit more on that and repeat a few things I typed.
 
"I think that comes with the Action Sets. This area completely lacks explanation in game, completely. Considering Wildstar uses different stats; Brutality, Finesse, Moxie, aka different words from what is normally expected like Strength, Dexterity, etc sometimes skill descriptions read like gibberish. I'm a Warrior, I know I can Tank or DPS, Protogames told me I can Tank or DPS as well, but how can I know what skills help and what skills completely disrupt my set? In other games, sets are your sets, you can pick the moves you like and simply go for it. But because of Wildstar's emphasis on insta-kills, it makes picking action sets very nerve-wracking. From the get go, if there had been an Action Set tutorial, because even the Ship Tutorial doesn't go in depth and serves more as a lore intro, I think Interrupts would have been clearer and then actually practicing utilizing them in Protogames would have read immediately."
 
While you're first leveling up, even with the arkship tutorial, there is no explanation on the more complicated elements on combat in Wildstar. There's no explanation on what Interrupts are, what skills count as Interrupts, when to know when a boss is preparing for a move that you have to interrupt, how to change your skill set, what traits increase what aspect of your character's progression, nothing. The arkship serves as a lore tutorial and nothing more than that. So between Level 1 and Level 10, since Protogames is supposed to be a Level 10 dungeon, there's absolutely no prior preparation for it.
 
I'll quote another person:
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It sounds like people don't know
1) What abilities count as interrupts;
2) What removing Interrupt Armor means; and
3) Why Moments of Opportunity are important.
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don't forget that it is quite hard to see the number of interrupt armor a mob have because it isn't written on its nameplate and you have to look at the target tab at bottom of the screen!
really? put the number of IA of the nameplate as default. REALLY.
 
also, interruptible casts should have a different cast bar color, or maybe a flashing effect on it or something.
 
thats it folks.
put your hands up in the air and praise the words of wisdom.	
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https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/127386-help-how-to-kill-the-freaking-invulnotron/
 
This thread was also created. If it was very abundantly clear what to do in this dungeon for a new player, I don't think this thread would have been created.
Reviewed the intro of the Academy and yes essentially what he says is "Get that interrupt skill ready and don't stand in the red" "You need to Interrupt his spell!"
 
Again it doesn't cover the crucial points of:
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1) What abilities count as interrupts;
2) What removing Interrupt Armor means; and
3) Why Moments of Opportunity are important.
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I can see it being an issue for a person new to MMOs as interrupting abilities and CC is very common term. I can only speak from my own experience and the new people I've broguht through that came from other games whom picked up on it without my help, but people brand new to MMOs needed some further instruction, which I think is a bit of an issue with a lot of games. Everyone learns a bit differently though, so with that said though...
 
Point 1:
 
So essentially what you want is for Protostar to instead say "Get that interrupt skill X Ready and don't stand in the red"?
Where X is the name of the interrupt ability that you as your class would use and should ahve available at that point. 
 
Then for point 2: 
 
Option 1)after the interruption is done there is a "pause" where all players are knocked down for a reasonable amount of time. During this time an explanation of what jsut happened, why their health bar is purple pops up, etc...
Option 2) An NPC demonstration prior to the fight. Showing both when enough interrupts are used and how  
Then for 3:
I honestly think that just a simple tutorial pop-up would suffice for this saying monsters take more damage when MoO is triggered.
 
Would that help?	
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Then for 3:
I honestly think that just a simple tutorial pop-up would suffice for this saying monsters take more damage when MoO is triggered.
 
Would that help?
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we already have that, i remember when leveled my first char didnt turn off the tutorial tips and there you find explained things like cc break, tether, moments of opportunity, interrupt armor, interrupt skills, disarmed and blind.
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Which moves can be interrupted is made very clear with an addon called interrupter.  Non interruptable casts in red and interruptable casts in green.
 
Opti plates is an addon I use for bars which will display the IA on the floating health bar on the mob. 
 
It is not in the game originally which can be problematic, but this game was designed with third party add on developers in mind.
 
If you are not one to use addons you will be missing out.
 
As to the solo questing end of chain mobs.  I am curious as to what kind of difficulty you are looking for?  Or are you just looking for some variability?  The dungeons are a great place to see mobs with different mechanics but that is not solo play, which I think is what you are focusing on.  Was pyrolos (sp?) more of what you are looking for?  Soloable attunement step if you don't recall the name.	
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Which moves can be interrupted is made very clear with an addon called interrupter.  Non interruptable casts in red and interruptable casts in green.
 
Opti plates is an addon I use for bars which will display the IA on the floating health bar on the mob. 
 
It is not in the game originally which can be problematic, but this game was designed with third party add on developers in mind.
 
If you are not one to use addons you will be missing out.
 
As to the solo questing end of chain mobs.  I am curious as to what kind of difficulty you are looking for?  Or are you just looking for some variability?  The dungeons are a great place to see mobs with different mechanics but that is not solo play, which I think is what you are focusing on.  Was pyrolos (sp?) more of what you are looking for?  Soloable attunement step if you don't recall the name.
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			I wasn't late...just gave a solution to the problem ;).  I saw these things mentioned without a solution.  Granted these things being implemented by carbine as standard add ons would be good.  But the third party add on developers tend to put out some good stuff.	
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I wasn't late...just gave a solution to the problem ;).  I saw these things mentioned without a solution.  Granted these things being implemented by carbine as standard add ons would be good.  But the third party add on developers tend to put out some good stuff.
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I can see it being an issue for a person new to MMOs as interrupting abilities and CC is very common term. I can only speak from my own experience and the new people I've broguht through that came from other games whom picked up on it without my help, but people brand new to MMOs needed some further instruction, which I think is a bit of an issue with a lot of games. Everyone learns a bit differently though, so with that said though...
 
Point 1:
 
So essentially what you want is for Protostar to instead say "Get that interrupt skill X Ready and don't stand in the red"?
Where X is the name of the interrupt ability that you as your class would use and should ahve available at that point. 
 
Then for point 2: 
 
Option 1)after the interruption is done there is a "pause" where all players are knocked down for a reasonable amount of time. During this time an explanation of what jsut happened, why their health bar is purple pops up, etc...
Option 2) An NPC demonstration prior to the fight. Showing both when enough interrupts are used and how 
 
Then for 3:
I honestly think that just a simple tutorial pop-up would suffice for this saying monsters take more damage when MoO is triggered.
 
Would that help?
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			Resilience will fix it.	
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			Pappy said in the last stream that all arkship experience has been revamped to give a better introduction to nexus and we will see it in drop 6	
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As to the solo questing end of chain mobs.  I am curious as to what kind of difficulty you are looking for?  Or are you just looking for some variability?  The dungeons are a great place to see mobs with different mechanics but that is not solo play, which I think is what you are focusing on.  Was pyrolos (sp?) more of what you are looking for?  Soloable attunement step if you don't recall the name.
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I agree that the leveling solo-quest "bosses" are rather weak and unimpressive. Only thing that separates em from the peons is they take one extra faceroll to die. I have some ideas to tweak em:
 
hp +20%. Make the fight last longer.
dmg +10%. They should hit harder than a peon. That's why they're the boss.
1 interrupt armor for higher level ones so you need to use 2 interrupts to stun em.
give some of them more challenging mechanics/skills you need to interrupt.
 
There's a pretty large difficulty gap between leveling and running content and I feel there should be more "tie-ins" to help people prepare.	
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2.) There are no "epic" solo battles. I have to admit I haven't done Omnicore-1 yet, but back in the day when I ventured through the final parts of Grimvault (before Drop 1), I remember getting this "final dungeon" feeling. And then, the boss before the giant robot... felt like any other mob I fought before. Battle was of course also over after ~20-30 seconds. And that's how it felt for pretty much all quests where you kill a named mob. Said mobs do the exact same thing as other mobs of the same category. No special attacks, not more HP, the exact same thing. The only times I actually had the feeling I was in a boss battle was during Shiphands and Housing Expeditions. I just finished the first Defile episode and the final battle again was over in ~10-15 seconds. 
So, for the future, please buff up some of the more important story quests so they actually feel somewhat interesting. Buff the enemies HP, give them unique attacks, just something to spice things up. Currently most of it just feels completely underwhelming, gameplay wise.
 
 
 
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I can't go into details but I wanted to say that we agree and it's on our radar.
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I can't go into details but I wanted to say that we agree and it's on our radar.
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			i agree, i believe there should be some good variation of choice when it comes to leveling. and more dungeons and adventures, its what i remember most from wow at least	
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Talking about epic solo battles? You have my attention.
 
I've done the large scale guild raiding scene since 2005. I'm personally tired of it. What I want is raid level challenges for small(5man) groups. I'm talking content long enough that it needs a lockout ID because it takes several nights to finish. Omnicore was a pretty good example of how small group content can be fun. Now it just needs to be more difficult.	
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Talking about epic solo battles? You have my attention.
 
I've done the large scale guild raiding scene since 2005. I'm personally tired of it. What I want is raid level challenges for small(5man) groups. I'm talking content long enough that it needs a lockout ID because it takes several nights to finish. Omnicore was a pretty good example of how small group content can be fun. Now it just needs to be more difficult.
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My post is the starting post on Protostar so I'll explain a little bit more on that and repeat a few things I typed.
 
"I think that comes with the Action Sets. This area completely lacks explanation in game, completely. Considering Wildstar uses different stats; Brutality, Finesse, Moxie, aka different words from what is normally expected like Strength, Dexterity, etc sometimes skill descriptions read like gibberish. I'm a Warrior, I know I can Tank or DPS, Protogames told me I can Tank or DPS as well, but how can I know what skills help and what skills completely disrupt my set? In other games, sets are your sets, you can pick the moves you like and simply go for it. But because of Wildstar's emphasis on insta-kills, it makes picking action sets very nerve-wracking. From the get go, if there had been an Action Set tutorial, because even the Ship Tutorial doesn't go in depth and serves more as a lore intro, I think Interrupts would have been clearer and then actually practicing utilizing them in Protogames would have read immediately."
 
While you're first leveling up, even with the arkship tutorial, there is no explanation on the more complicated elements on combat in Wildstar. There's no explanation on what Interrupts are, what skills count as Interrupts, when to know when a boss is preparing for a move that you have to interrupt, how to change your skill set, what traits increase what aspect of your character's progression, nothing. The arkship serves as a lore tutorial and nothing more than that. So between Level 1 and Level 10, since Protogames is supposed to be a Level 10 dungeon, there's absolutely no prior preparation for it.
 
I'll quote another person:
 
These things do not get explained by the Protostar narrator. He simply says to interrupt to avoid being killed and that's pretty much it. When you're familiar with different types of MMOs, or have never played an MMO before Wildstar, a lot of it is pretty foreign because some combat elements are not "typical."
I still think it's an issue and because Protostar was introduced after so many people had already been playing Wildstar. They know what interrupts are, they know what moments of opportunities are, they've been playing enough and went back to run it and see how it is, there's a complete detachment on how it feels to be completely new to this game. It's very difficult to get feedback out as a new player because of this.
 
EDIT:
 
I like your suggestion a lot for a training ground of some sort to further explain how the skillsets of Wildstar are different from other MMOs. It seems TT listened to the feedback however but there's been no additional information on changes (if any) will be made.
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			I returned after 10 months as well, and cancelled 3 days later. Game is dead and nothing good has been added. It seems so....small and uninspired. After playing other games for the past year and returning, it's easier to understand why the game has struggled so much to retain players. It's just not that fun.	
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Talking about epic solo battles? You have my attention.
 
I've done the large scale guild raiding scene since 2005. I'm personally tired of it. What I want is raid level challenges for small(5man) groups. I'm talking content long enough that it needs a lockout ID because it takes several nights to finish. Omnicore was a pretty good example of how small group content can be fun. Now it just needs to be more difficult.
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I returned after 10 months as well, and cancelled 3 days later. Game is dead and nothing good has been added. It seems so....small and uninspired. After playing other games for the past year and returning, it's easier to understand why the game has struggled so much to retain players. It's just not that fun.
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I returned after 10 months as well, and cancelled 3 days later. Game is dead and nothing good has been added. It seems so....small and uninspired. After playing other games for the past year and returning, it's easier to understand why the game has struggled so much to retain players. It's just not that fun.
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I returned after 10 months as well, and cancelled 3 days later. Game is dead and nothing good has been added. It seems so....small and uninspired. After playing other games for the past year and returning, it's easier to understand why the game has struggled so much to retain players. It's just not that fun.
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Talking about epic solo battles? You have my attention.
 
I've done the large scale guild raiding scene since 2005. I'm personally tired of it. What I want is raid level challenges for small(5man) groups. I'm talking content long enough that it needs a lockout ID because it takes several nights to finish. Omnicore was a pretty good example of how small group content can be fun. Now it just needs to be more difficult.
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Not sure if it really needs to be extremely hard. On one hand, if it is like OMNICore-1 and tells a story, the difficulty is fine. Also, if you do not overgear it, so you have no loot from Veteran Adventures and Dungeons, I am pretty sure the final fight can be quite hard. 
 
Now, if is something completely optional, like the Brawler's Guild in WoW, where it is just different battles one after another, or a dungeon that doesn't tell the main story, I have no problem with it being pretty hard, even with really good gear. As for small group content, the Dungeons are fine imo. They are not that easy, especially if you are new and/or go in it with a new group (so Veteran Adventure gear max). If you want longer ones, just take something like Sanctuary of the Swordmaiden, put in a few extras (minibosses and challenges), let it be a bit random like the raids and put in a 3 day reset. I have no problem with big dungeons, but if you are new to this one (heck, I haven't finished it once before I left back in August) even the speedrun for silver/gold takes over an hour. And I think if something is this long, then it can have a small reset of a few days and be even a bit bigger, so you can choose what to do.
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Do people not read their Skills and Abilities tooltips?  They'll tell you if they are interrupts.
 
@TheBigCheese, I've actually left the other games I was playing when I started this, it is a lot more fun than WoW, SWTOR, and Rift were to me.
			
				
	Edited June 13, 2015 by beattlebilly	
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I'm just looking for an alternative to raiding. I play mmos because I enjoy spending time with others and being competitive with progression but I hate having to rely on others for progress. Whenever I make a comment like that someone always pops up and tells me I'm in the wrong genre. >_>
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I can't go into details but I wanted to say that we agree and it's on our radar.
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Do people not read their Skills and Abilities tooltips?  They'll tell you if they are interrupts.
 
@TheBigCheese, I've actually left the other games I was playing when I started this, it is a lot more fun than WoW, SWTOR, and Rift were to me.
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			Wildstar does a good job of explaining the IA system.  IMNSHO this falls back on players being lazy, and people coming into the game thinking "I'm a MMO vet, I know what I'm doing, ignoring/clicking off tutorials".  When I first started playing I had no idea what the IA system was, took me a while to figure out the shields with numbers on enemy nameplates and why my T4 Paralytic Surge said "Can now remove 2 IA", and I'll readily admit I played a loooong time before I realized my Magnetic Lockdown was an interrupt too,  because I didn't read the information given to me.  But then again, I don't do a lot of PvE group play, so I didn't really need to know that information :P  We players need to start taking responsibility for some of the difficulties we face, and yes sometimes make for ourselves, in the games we play.
			
				
	Edited June 14, 2015 by beattlebilly	
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Yeah I just came back after a long hiatus.
Honestly I'm too lost in trying to get caught up to really have an opinion yet.	
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Wildstar does a good job of explaining the IA system.  IMNSHO this falls back on players being lazy, and people coming into the game thinking "I'm a MMO vet, I know what I'm doing, ignoring/clicking off tutorials".  When I first started playing I had no idea what the IA system was, took me a while to figure out the shields with numbers on enemy nameplates and why my T4 Paralytic Surge said "Can now remove 2 IA", and I'll readily admit I played a loooong time before I realized my Magnetic Lockdown was an interrupt too,  because I didn't read the information given to me.  But then again, I don't do a lot of PvE group play, so I didn't really need to know that information :P  We players need to start taking responsibility for some of the difficulties we face, and yes sometimes make for ourselves, in the games we play.
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Because Pop-Up Turtorials are the absolute worse way to try to convey information to a player base. That worked 10 years ago, but in today's day and age, the average consumer is bombarded with so many pop-ups on a given day, or invasive advertisements that take up a section of a screen (particularly mobile), that we, as consumers, as a majority now do everything we can to avoid them. I have a degree in Marketing, and this was something covered in one of the wife's Marketing courses last semester as well.
 
Well, unfortunately this applies to video game design as well. Using pop-up tutorials that have the same mental trigger nowadays of invading one's screen, is antithesis to actually implementing a solid learning feature into a game. Even I have to admit, by reflex now I turn the damned things off. Having pop-ups of any kind completely kills my enjoyment of a product. They are invasive, unwanted, and unwelcome.
 
This comes down to Consumer Behavior today. So, it shouldn't come as a shock that many out there do not read the Pop-Ups even in an MMO, even when they say "Tutorial." In today's consumer market, game designers are going to have to allocate budget and resources to creating actual tutorials that take the players through mechanics, especially when they're rather unique to a game like IA is here. Otherwise, you see what happens. New players don't know because they avoid the Pop-Ups.
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Yes, the pop ups are annoying, but the tutorials are still there waiting for us to take the time to read them later, but we choose not to.  Either because we think we know better or we just plain out ignore them period.  I have the feeling though that if they take away pop tutorials, or tutorials that are visible in some other way when you trigger them, people would complain about not having seen them.  I've played games long enough to expect tutorial pop ups, so while I may be slightly annoyed by them, in general I'm happy they're there in the games that I am new to just in case there's something being done different than what I'm used to(which Wildstar definitely was in a few aspects :P)
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