108705-carbine-please-help-the-empty-servers-page-3

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Honestly, I think you should get some decent rewards for running world bosses at level (mentoring down or, once that's not feasible, a manual level lowering tool).  I mean, they're easy raid bosses, but they are open world event content and they can be a hoot, especially running with a bunch of newbies.
 
I love running Kraggar just to see how many people panic when the giant circle of death pops out.
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A couple of us 50s helped a bunch of lvl 8-12's kill Metal Maw a while back, and it was a lot of fun. I specced for healing and made keeping everyone alive my challenge instead of DPS'ing what is otherwise a really easy boss for lvl 50 characters. I was proud of the lowbies, because not a single one of them died.
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A limit has got to be there to prevent exploiting TBH. 
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So there have been a few replies to my thread then :)
 
I've just read through every comment and it's clear that there are hundreds if not thousands of people who want this game to prosper and succeed. I do have a few additional things to say regarding this topic so here goes.
 
First of all there isn't a day goes by that someone in my guild comments on the fact this thread has had no response from a dev. It's not just this thread, even on the countless other threads here and on other forums asking for server populations to be looked at there's been no word. I'm pretty sure you guys are well aware of the problems and (I hope) are working on a solution but the radio silence causing damage which could be avoided. Those less supportive of you than me are now being vindicated by this total lack of acknowledgement that there is a problem, it doesn't help when your catch phase is what it is.
 
So I see two possibilities. You either don't want to (or don't feel the need to) engage with your players about this topic or a far more concerning prospect, you've been told not to. See after looking at Wildstar long and hard I decided the game had everything it needed to buck the MMO graveyard trend and become an amazing game we would play for years to come. I always support games (and devs teams) I believe in and so I purchased a twelve month sub right out of the door. I'm just worried NCsoft are now stepping in behind the scenes and interfering (again), maybe even stripping the game down for free to play as the game isn't doing great on the books.
 
Let's assume I've been watching too much Xfiles and you're just too busy to answer these threads let's be very clear about something. This is absolutely the number one problem facing Wildstar and if it's not dealt with fast I fear it will not survive it's first year. Hey I know nothing about running an MMO and I'm not privy to your current game plan, maybe you can run it on super low numbers. What I can tell you is that if my own guild is anything to go off, the casual players are just not going to play Wildstar on my server. For our casual members having a healthy server population is fundamental for everything they enjoy about the game, from rolling alts, open world PVP, playing the economy meta game or just finding groups of players out in the game to play with. None of this works when your playing on a deserted server.
 
Our raiding team is doing very well as these problems won't really affect us directly in the short term, but it's very disconcerting to see the house falling down around us as most raiders also like to play other aspects of the game. Additionally you feel far less inclined to raid in a game that may not last.
 
I apologise for my gloomy post but if we are to discuss these matters it can't be avoided. As I said in my OP, MMOs are a special type of game that require special management. You can't just ignore your customers/supporters and expect them to re-sub next month. Once people leave Wildstar it will be near impossible to get them back. I'm tired of the play and throw away mentality that seems to saturate the whole MMO scene now, I want to play for keeps.
 
Please consider the following actions.
 
- Engage with your player base and acknowledge server population is a problem.
- If you are able explain to us what your short and long term plans are to deal with this problem.
- Incentivise all the low population servers to move to one or two servers designated by yourselves.
- Remove server transfer fees 
 
Last of all I just wanted to say that to spite the problems the game is having personally I'm still having a blast. I know you guys are working so hard over there and so keep pushing, I'm sure most players will never know the insane amount of work it is to keep a AAA MMO afloat.
 
Best regards,
Genophix
aka Artemis
Exterminatus EU
Zhur	
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I find it astounding that Carbine comes out with a big thread about how they are delaying the next drop because they want to focus on community concerns, and don't even mention the population issues.
 
We cannot get a consistent dungeon group going with people from our own server.
World PvP does not happen.
Warplots do not happen.
The Auction house is horrible (go to rowsdower, filter the AH by Light Armor Helms, 2 items come up)
The CREDD exchange frequently runs dry
Guilds cannot field 20 people for raids, because people get attuned then transfer off to Pergo, or don't get attuned at all because they are forced to try to get silver in the dungeon finder.
Crafted items do not sell on the auction house because nobody is leveling new characters to buy the items.
World bosses stay alive for days because there aren't enough level 50s online to even make a dent in them.
Group quests in leveling zones do not get done because there aren't enough people leveling.
Guilds cannot recruit enough level 50 players to cover those who are leaving
You can actually hear crickets in zone chats.
 
How many more people need to quit the game before carbine realizes this is actually something they should be thinking about? Right now for a lot of us, this game is not an "MMO", it's just an "O"
 
I paid $60 up front for this game on release, I'm not going to pay another $60 for my 3 level 50s just 3 months after release so that I can have other people to play with.	
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			Great post as usual Geno i just wish the developers would do the honorable thing and actually respond instead of posting Youtube clips of them doing the ice bucket challenge	
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			It seems that there are new transfers in pergo seems pretty packed and that's a good thing.	
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			I want this game to succeed, but I'm worried about its future. Some very bad decisions have been made by management. The game was clearly released too early with many flaws (both in design and bugs) that shouldn't have been. I feel like this may be its downfall. My server too is dying and it needs to be addressed with free transfers/merges. Because my faith in this game is dwindling I can't really justify paying for a server transfer. 	
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So there have been a few replies to my thread then :)
 
I've just read through every comment and it's clear that there are hundreds if not thousands of people who want this game to prosper and succeed. I do have a few additional things to say regarding this topic so here goes.
 
First of all there isn't a day goes by that someone in my guild comments on the fact this thread has had no response from a dev. It's not just this thread, even on the countless other threads here and on other forums asking for server populations to be looked at there's been no word. I'm pretty sure you guys are well aware of the problems and (I hope) are working on a solution but the radio silence causing damage which could be avoided. Those less supportive of you than me are now being vindicated by this total lack of acknowledgement that there is a problem, it doesn't help when your catch phase is what it is.
 
So I see two possibilities. You either don't want to (or don't feel the need to) engage with your players about this topic or a far more concerning prospect, you've been told not to. See after looking at Wildstar long and hard I decided the game had everything it needed to buck the MMO graveyard trend and become an amazing game we would play for years to come. I always support games (and devs teams) I believe in and so I purchased a twelve month sub right out of the door. I'm just worried NCsoft are now stepping in behind the scenes and interfering (again), maybe even stripping the game down for free to play as the game isn't doing great on the books.
 
Let's assume I've been watching too much Xfiles and you're just too busy to answer these threads let's be very clear about something. This is absolutely the number one problem facing Wildstar and if it's not dealt with fast I fear it will not survive it's first year. Hey I know nothing about running an MMO and I'm not privy to your current game plan, maybe you can run it on super low numbers. What I can tell you is that if my own guild is anything to go off, the casual players are just not going to play Wildstar on my server. For our casual members having a healthy server population is fundamental for everything they enjoy about the game, from rolling alts, open world PVP, playing the economy meta game or just finding groups of players out in the game to play with. None of this works when your playing on a deserted server.
 
Our raiding team is doing very well as these problems won't really affect us directly in the short term, but it's very disconcerting to see the house falling down around us as most raiders also like to play other aspects of the game. Additionally you feel far less inclined to raid in a game that may not last.
 
I apologise for my gloomy post but if we are to discuss these matters it can't be avoided. As I said in my OP, MMOs are a special type of game that require special management. You can't just ignore your customers/supporters and expect them to re-sub next month. Once people leave Wildstar it will be near impossible to get them back. I'm tired of the play and throw away mentality that seems to saturate the whole MMO scene now, I want to play for keeps.
 
Please consider the following actions.
 
- Engage with your player base and acknowledge server population is a problem.
- If you are able explain to us what your short and long term plans are to deal with this problem.
- Incentivise all the low population servers to move to one or two servers designated by yourselves.
- Remove server transfer fees 
 
Last of all I just wanted to say that to spite the problems the game is having personally I'm still having a blast. I know you guys are working so hard over there and so keep pushing, I'm sure most players will never know the insane amount of work it is to keep a AAA MMO afloat.
 
Best regards,
Genophix
aka Artemis
Exterminatus EU
Zhur
----
			I can only think NCSoft is trying to suppress Wildstar because it doesn't want it to be better than GW2.  GW2 is such a crappy game in comparison.	
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I can only think NCSoft is trying to suppress Wildstar because it doesn't want it to be better than GW2.  GW2 is such a crappy game in comparison.
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Considering the way GW2 development/new content has been treated in the past, that seems unlikely to me.
If anything they're trying to gimp Wildstar because they're finally preparing to get Blade&Soul released in the west.
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So I see two possibilities. You either don't want to (or don't feel the need to) engage with your players about this topic or a far more concerning prospect, you've been told not to. 
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I'm not picking a side here, but a lot of people forget that just because the developers don't respond, it doesn't mean they don't listen. Of course they listen. They know perfectly well that a lot of people are having issues with low-populated and near-dead servers, and they (the devs) are definitely working on solutions.
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I think the problem with server merges is they come with a certain stigma, for the developer and the player as merges usually come when a game isn't doing all that well. In addition it's really difficult for Carbine to merge the servers. Imagine every single character created in the first few days, as soon as the account owner stops playing that character remains but dormant. I think what they have to be very careful of is that if every player suddenly logged on would that server have enough space. There's been plenty of talk about this already.
 
I agree Duchess that merging servers would also mess with peoples chosen rule sets. If it was me I would merge all the PVE servers and all the PVP servers, but the problem set out above would maybe prevent this. 
 
I agree with Folsarc, just one line, anything to say 'hey, we know about the server population problem and we are looking at solutions to fix it'. I don't mean here on this thread, just somewhere. Doing this will save so many subs. I would also speak about it on the next nexus report, while I always love watching these last weeks on adventures was a bit like making the bed while house is on fire.	
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I don't think the majority of players really doubt that devs are not listening or ignoring the problem. Sure they listen and are most likely working on solutions, but what does stop them from spending a couple of minutes to post and acknowledge the problem? Is 3 minutes of their time (and may be plus 2-3 minutes spent on switchign tasks) that much more important than reassuring hundreds of players that they know about/working on low population problem?
 
Because there is always doubt and fear that nothing is being done regardless of how unreasonable the idea might be. A few sentences from a developer will be very powerful in the current situation.
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			They only care about stuffing thier pockets fat from all the guilds moving to Pergo. WHole DnT guild, hahah why would they want to merge now when thier new car is right around the corner. Its a game they are playing, "lets see how many people will pay for transfers while we sit back and keep our mouths shut about this situation." I bet thouse words came out of Carbines mouth.	
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			Merging servers are a must.	
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			I like my empty server the cross realm stuff will cover my world pve group content	
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Unfortunately, every time the devs come out and announce something, they make the situation worse.  That aforementioned post about pushing back content to push forward bug fixes and systems updates?  Broke into a full on flame war.  The one before that, which announced the relatively popular change in medal attunement from silver to bronze?  Almost took over this corner of the forums with the flames.
 
I think, at this point, if Carbine can't tell us what we want to hear (i.e. unless they have finally decided that they will be doing server merges), they give us information as a last resort.  The community, in general, doesn't handle it well.
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Merging servers are a must.
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Stumbled across this today.  Pretty funny considering!
 	
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I wonder where does such confidence come from? I've read several reddit topics on the theme and read replies to the actual dev post stating the change in the content update delivery schedule and in both cases the majority, if not almost everyone was saying that it was a good move and they would rather see bugs removed and game features/activities balanced instead of more content delivered, that sometimes breeds even more bugs and problems.
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Hey, just wanted to update the status of Warbringer PvP Server.  EVEN WORSE.  More guilds have left the server as a whole, gutting the auction house and removing players from the list of people to play with.
 
EVERYTHING is more expensive on the low population servers.  It is ridiculous how long it is taking for servers to be merged.  If I didn't have more than one character at 1800 and geared, I would transfer off tonight, but I simply don't want to pay that much money for a game that's getting no needed response from the decision makers.
 
Why the hell are you locking and consolidating server population posts if you can't even give us an official response on it?	
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Hey, just wanted to update the status of Warbringer PvP Server.  EVEN WORSE.  More guilds have left the server as a whole, gutting the auction house and removing players from the list of people to play with.
 
EVERYTHING is more expensive on the low population servers.  It is ridiculous how long it is taking for servers to be merged.  If I didn't have more than one character at 1800 and geared, I would transfer off tonight, but I simply don't want to pay that much money for a game that's getting no needed response from the decision makers.
 
Why the hell are you locking and consolidating server population posts if you can't even give us an official response on it?
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They've stated that there are too many active accounts to be able to merge servers at this point. People invested in CREDD and have active accounts for quite some time and probably aren't playing.
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I would risk having queues again if it meant people would actually log in to the game.  Imo cater to the people that are actually playing!
 
 
Thanks for your guesses.  I could guess all kinds of reasons as to why they aren't merging servers, and cash grabbing from 20$ transfers is just as valid an answer at this point as any of your other guesses.
 
I said it before in another post, but perception is everything. Right now perception for Wildstar is BAAAAAAAAAD.
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I really don't even see the point in speculating what Carbine is doing and their decision making.  I'd like some answers.  I could give a shit about bugs and lack of end-game (I have 2x 1800 geared characters, leaving me 4 more).  I just want to play this MMO with a large number of people, something I'm currently not allowed to do without paying more money on top of my sub.
 
I know we got a half assed post about how they've decided to push content release back in favor of better quality patches, but the server population issue is a much more urgent matter.  No one cares about new zones when they're just going to explore them by themselves.	
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			Whenever this isn't one of the top 5 threads on the general forums, I am going to bump it. Really tired of carbine ignoring this and hoping we will stop talking about it, and then the forum mods close down every other thread and redirect to this one hoping it will go away.	
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			Well i for one is not putting a subscription into the game untill this question has been answered. Atm i have to live with 13 plat C.R.E.D.D costs but that isnt a problem for me. However i would love to subscribe if i didnt have to play on low pop server while running the risk of actually paying money each month for a game that i wont be enjoying.	
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			Visibility. Anyone saying they don't think the server population problem is the biggest issue wildstar has right now is obviously on pergo/stormtalon/hazak.	
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I think the game is very not alt friendly.  So that really contributes.    It makes servers seem totally empty.  
 
I love the graphics and characters, but I can't see myself staying at this rate.  Oh well.  	
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			Rerolled on Pergo and it seems pretty empty, even though it's ArchAge beta weekend its still a weekend night, the starter zones and main city feel considerably more isolating and empty then a Medium pop servers main city on WoW. Go make a free WoW trial right now! Randomly pick a medium server and run into Stormwind or Orgrimaar, you'll likely notice it too.	
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			That could be the instancing that this game has for cities for no apparent reason. I never understood that as a design choice. People want to see a ton of players in the cities. They are cities, not ghost towns.	
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I like my empty server the cross realm stuff will cover my world pve group content
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			When you enter your game today try /who and count how many players are on when you enter the game. Do this periodically throughout the day. I have found on my server (bloodsworn) that there is on avg only 35 players at peak on the dominion side online at any given time. Thats the equivalent of one guild on at peak.I was informed by a carbine moderator that sometimes this does not perform correctly and leaves propel off the list but my eyes perform pretty good and i am seeing a markedly decrease population just about everywhere. try it and you be the judge.	
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When you enter your game today try /who and count how many players are on when you enter the game. Do this periodically throughout the day. I have found on my server (bloodsworn) that there is on avg only 35 players at peak on the dominion side online at any given time. Thats the equivalent of one guild on at peak.
 
I was informed by a carbine moderator that sometimes this does not perform correctly and leaves propel off the list but my eyes perform pretty good and i am seeing a markedly decrease population just about everywhere. try it and you be the judge.
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While the server population is very much so an issue /who function has never worked properly. You would have received a similar result on launch day as well.
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When you enter your game today try /who and count how many players are on when you enter the game. Do this periodically throughout the day. I have found on my server (bloodsworn) that there is on avg only 35 players at peak on the dominion side online at any given time. Thats the equivalent of one guild on at peak.
 
I was informed by a carbine moderator that sometimes this does not perform correctly and leaves propel off the list but my eyes perform pretty good and i am seeing a markedly decrease population just about everywhere. try it and you be the judge.
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Here's a neat source I found on reddit listing "Xfire and Raptr" player activity every week since June.
http://www.reddit.com/r/WildStar/comments/2edzk7/is_population_to_get_any_better/
 
http://nosygamer.blogspot.com/search/label/digital_dozen
 
http://caas.raptr.com/most-played-pc-games-july-2014-summers-winners-and-losers/
			
				
	Edited August 24, 2014 by PinkPanther	
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A few years ago XFire was the no1 tracking program but now its almost dead. Instead Raptr has grown a lot and it tracks more than 30m players played hours. According to Raptr played hours / week for mmo's are:
 
1. WoW 1.2m
2. FFX 206k
3. GW2 185k
4. SWTOR 172k
5. Firefall 92k
6. AA 86k
7. WildStar 79k
8. EvE 70k
9. NeverWinter 66k
10. ESO 62k
11. Rift 60k
 
*Just fot he record, Rift for 60k hours have a global total of 13 servers (most of them medium), while Wildstar for 79k hours more than 35 servers...Considering Rift servers can hold much less ppl at max capacity than WS ones, you can figure that if they had servers like WS there will be much fewer than 13. Same can be said for SWTOR which has 17 global servers for 172k hours and anyway greater player base than WildStar. Can you see now why servers feels (are) empty and why an action is required ASAP?	
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They only thing that I don't like about the current server situation is the lack of Settlers willing to do what is necessary to maintain city teleports.
 
Please carbine make is easier to maintain them given the low population.  I would be willing to do my part on the server that I play on to maintain city teleports if it weren't so cumbersome. :P	
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			The server merge stigma is what most fears. The "end of the world" thing of MMOs.	
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			I don't care if its merge or free transfers or what ever else. We just need a solution. If they have a better one, or thinking of a better plan, then they at least must give us some info. Just don't pretend there isn't a problem.	
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			Ya its getting pretty ridiculous :(	
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I recommend all of us having these issues band together and fill up one of the servers. Let's pick one and transfer there. Me and 4 other friends are looking to transfer right now. It would be awesome if we could all transfer and fill one server up. I play on EU servers. Any interested? We could form a Nomad's guild of sorts ;)
 
Besides, in all honesty it hurts a company a lot harder if so many of their players find a situation so bad that the playerbase decide to fix it themselves. It's plain embarrassing to have on an MMO's rep. Let's be the ones to fix Carbine's problem. Let's fill up the server. Sure Carbine will benefit from all the server transfer cash - but then they can use that cash to fix the problem before they start looking ridiculous. If we as a community can get this going, I know a few people who would be able to publicize this once it's taken effect and it should warrant a response from Carbine afterwards.
 
Make sure you keep your email receipt/code/proof of purchase  of your server transfer payment. We'll stack these up together to prove the issue and record statistics when going public.
 
Be the change you want to see.
Join me!Throw me a PM with how many people you can drag along and let's decide on a server to hop to. Create a guild or circles and start playing the game the way it was meant to be played.	
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			I bought "now" 3 credd from Bloodsworn for 9P each then sold "now" them on Pergo for 5.5P, that exchange rate stings and brought Booty Bay AH nostalgia. Rerolling is a gonna be a drag, atleast my account is playable until April and I have 3 Elite Thickets to look forward to on Pergo.. 	
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I recommend all of us having these issues band together and fill up one of the servers. Let's pick one and transfer there. Me and 4 other friends are looking to transfer right now. It would be awesome if we could all transfer and fill one server up. I play on EU servers. Any interested? We could form a Nomad's guild of sorts ;)
 
Besides, in all honesty it hurts a company a lot harder if so many of their players find a situation so bad that the playerbase decide to fix it themselves. It's plain embarrassing to have on an MMO's rep. Let's be the ones to fix Carbine's problem. Let's fill up the server. Sure Carbine will benefit from all the server transfer cash - but then they can use that cash to fix the problem before they start looking ridiculous. If we as a community can get this going, I know a few people who would be able to publicize this once it's taken effect and it should warrant a response from Carbine afterwards.
 
Make sure you keep your email receipt/code/proof of purchase  of your server transfer payment. We'll stack these up together to prove the issue and record statistics when going public.
 
Be the change you want to see.
Join me!
 
Throw me a PM with how many people you can drag along and let's decide on a server to hop to. Create a guild or circles and start playing the game the way it was meant to be played.
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{| class="blockquote"
I recommend all of us having these issues band together and fill up one of the servers. Let's pick one and transfer there. Me and 4 other friends are looking to transfer right now. It would be awesome if we could all transfer and fill one server up. I play on EU servers. Any interested? We could form a Nomad's guild of sorts ;)
 
Besides, in all honesty it hurts a company a lot harder if so many of their players find a situation so bad that the playerbase decide to fix it themselves. It's plain embarrassing to have on an MMO's rep. Let's be the ones to fix Carbine's problem. Let's fill up the server. Sure Carbine will benefit from all the server transfer cash - but then they can use that cash to fix the problem before they start looking ridiculous. If we as a community can get this going, I know a few people who would be able to publicize this once it's taken effect and it should warrant a response from Carbine afterwards.
 
Make sure you keep your email receipt/code/proof of purchase  of your server transfer payment. We'll stack these up together to prove the issue and record statistics when going public.
 
Be the change you want to see.
Join me!
 
Throw me a PM with how many people you can drag along and let's decide on a server to hop to. Create a guild or circles and start playing the game the way it was meant to be played.
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			Ah yes excellent point, some servers are indeed dead and need a merge. Right-o.	
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The server merge stigma is what most fears. The "end of the world" thing of MMOs.
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{| class="blockquote"
I recommend all of us having these issues band together and fill up one of the servers. Let's pick one and transfer there. Me and 4 other friends are looking to transfer right now. It would be awesome if we could all transfer and fill one server up. I play on EU servers. Any interested? We could form a Nomad's guild of sorts ;)
 
Besides, in all honesty it hurts a company a lot harder if so many of their players find a situation so bad that the playerbase decide to fix it themselves. It's plain embarrassing to have on an MMO's rep. Let's be the ones to fix Carbine's problem. Let's fill up the server. Sure Carbine will benefit from all the server transfer cash - but then they can use that cash to fix the problem before they start looking ridiculous. If we as a community can get this going, I know a few people who would be able to publicize this once it's taken effect and it should warrant a response from Carbine afterwards.
 
Make sure you keep your email receipt/code/proof of purchase  of your server transfer payment. We'll stack these up together to prove the issue and record statistics when going public.
 
Be the change you want to see.
Join me!
 
Throw me a PM with how many people you can drag along and let's decide on a server to hop to. Create a guild or circles and start playing the game the way it was meant to be played.
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{| class="blockquote"
They only thing that I don't like about the current server situation is the lack of Settlers willing to do what is necessary to maintain city teleports.
 
Please carbine make is easier to maintain them given the low population.  I would be willing to do my part on the server that I play on to maintain city teleports if it weren't so cumbersome. :P
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			since my post got closed, i am just commenting on this one to get my 2 cents in. i tried to play last night, literally no one online on stormtalon, the most populated server......	
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{| class="blockquote"
They only thing that I don't like about the current server situation is the lack of Settlers willing to do what is necessary to maintain city teleports.
 
Please carbine make is easier to maintain them given the low population.  I would be willing to do my part on the server that I play on to maintain city teleports if it weren't so cumbersome. :P
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When I started playing SWTOR (fairly late), it was in exactly the same state. The server I was on, any zone you were in there'd be maybe three or four players tops.
 
Then they merged the servers, and the game got a whole new lease on life, and I got 2 years of great guild raiding fun out of it. Having said that, obviously they saw it as a failure, as not long after it went free-to-play (and downhill).	
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obviously they saw it as a failure, as not long after it went free-to-play (and downhill).
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			Imho SWTOR is in its best state ever. I cant play it anymore (tbh i cant play any game with that combat after i played WS) but it sure is in a very good state in every aspect. Both in quality/content & population.	
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			Last time I hopped on swtor the f2p model was a glorified trial account. If you plan on doing any pvp you need to pay the premium.	
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Imho SWTOR is in its best state ever. I cant play it anymore (tbh i cant play any game with that combat after i played WS) but it sure is in a very good state in every aspect. Both in quality/content & population.
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Imho SWTOR is in its best state ever. I cant play it anymore (tbh i cant play any game with that combat after i played WS) but it sure is in a very good state in every aspect. Both in quality/content & population.
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Why does F2P = fail?
 
I still play SWTOr; and the new content is awesome; the game is still fun, and theres lots to do and enjoy.
 
The game raked in something like 200+ million last year... thats really a failure? When it's both running, fun, and profitable?
 
GSF is one of my favorite MMO sub-games...
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actually the "creators" of swtor considered f2p to have been the saving grace of it. i missed all the problems at lunch and thereafter. got attracted by f2p and became a subscriber. stopped playing swtor for ws.
 
as long as the difference between f2p and sub is only quality of life stuff (like the amount of actionbars on swtor and such) and not game relevant power with better items/etc, then i consider f2p a quite reasonable business model.
you want to attract ppl and try it out and get hooked up. if swtor wasnt f2p, then i would have never tested it out and they never would have seen a dime from me.	
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{| class="blockquote"
F2p under SWTOR circumstances does equal fail to me, a fail to the SWTOR community pre going f2p/p2p/cash shop, and an overall fail to this genre due to its horrible handling in the 1st year.  Any mmo that puts that much emphasis in their cash shop like GW2 & SWTOR won't even register to a player like me, immediately I shut it off from any possibility of support or playing it, especially SWTOR w/its bs model of f2p/p2p/cash shop.
 
Like everything SWTOR did it was too little too late for the community that was their for beta and release-year one, by the time merges happen our whole raiding guild quit. 
 
GW2 would be considered a huge success too from NCsoft perspective, every 20 players that quit one spends $300 in their cash shop.
----
			Enough with SWTOR. Back in the topic. Fix server pop pls :)	
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Irrelevant but I'll try and stay on topic. Empty server feels like a isolated fish bowl.. This made me think of Ikthian, then that made me think of Wildstar then that reminded me my preferred server feels empty then I got sad and had to hit replay to cheer back up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdw25G29tOU
 	
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There is a major difference between SWTOR and W*; SWTOR had 70 servers for around 500,000 players before merges.At launch, W* had (after the additions because of QQ about server queues) 22 servers for ~500,000 accounts. The player concurrency issues in W* ARE NOT THE SAME as the ones SWTOR faced.
 
W* has systems in place that SWTOR did not that work against player concurrency; SWTOR had systems that promoted concurency, but too many servers for too few players per server. W* has fewer servers for the players playing; but a lot of content / systems that reward players for not playing at the same times / for longer periods of time.
 
Lets not fall into the trap of believing the problems in one MMO are = to the problems in another. 	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
There is a major difference between SWTOR and W*; SWTOR had 70 servers for around 500,000 players before merges.At launch, W* had (after the additions because of QQ about server queues) 22 servers for ~500,000 accounts. The player concurrency issues in W* ARE NOT THE SAME as the ones SWTOR faced.
 
W* has systems in place that SWTOR did not that work against player concurrency; SWTOR had systems that promoted concurency, but too many servers for too few players per server. W* has fewer servers for the players playing; but a lot of content / systems that reward players for not playing at the same times / for longer periods of time.
 
Lets not fall into the trap of believing the problems in one MMO are = to the problems in another. 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
There is a major difference between SWTOR and W*; SWTOR had 70 servers for around 500,000 players before merges.At launch, W* had (after the additions because of QQ about server queues) 22 servers for ~500,000 accounts. The player concurrency issues in W* ARE NOT THE SAME as the ones SWTOR faced.
 
W* has systems in place that SWTOR did not that work against player concurrency; SWTOR had systems that promoted concurency, but too many servers for too few players per server. W* has fewer servers for the players playing; but a lot of content / systems that reward players for not playing at the same times / for longer periods of time.
 
Lets not fall into the trap of believing the problems in one MMO are = to the problems in another. 
----
			Anyway who cares about SWTOR problems. The point is that ALL WS servers (at least EU ones) are low even in prime time. At launch the same servers were almost all high and some of them even had queues.32 server with higher capacity than any other non megaserver game are way too many for WS population. You dont need metrics or numbers. You have just to log in, check the AH, the chat, the zones, the guilds etc. I dont care if merging or free transfers are the way to go. We just need a solution and its up to Carbine hands. We only want to know what are they planning to do, what are their thoughts about this one.	
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{| class="blockquote"
SWTOR had 70 servers not for 500k but for more than 1.5-2m at launch. Now it has 17 for more than 1.5m ppl (subs are ~400k + f2p ppl). WildStar had 32 servers (not 22) for 500k at launch. Now it still has 32 for much less than 500k (i estimate 100-150k max). Considering that WS server capacity (according to Carbine) can hold many more than any other non megaserver game, 32 servers are WAAAY too many for the current population.
----
			You missed all the servers added in the first few days.	
----
			
There are 17 EU servers and 15 US (i m bored to write down the names tbh). I cant say about US ones but in EU almost all of them were high and many had queues. Only 2 servers were medium even at prime time during launch. If you do the math with your numbers, players at launch must be more than 350-400k only in EU...
 
Anyway i ll say it once more. You DONT NEED NUMBERS! Just log in to any EU server and check the zones, the economy, the state of the guilds, the chat, everything you want, name it. They all feel and in most cases are dead.
 
So stop pls this silliness with numbers. I don't want to be rude but you seem to live in another place or playing another game...	
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Merge the *cupcake*ing servers already for christ sake. How much more do we need to beg to get a full mmo expierence?
Its like playing a singleplayer game with a monthly fee.	
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{| class="blockquote"
There are 17 EU servers and 15 US (i m bored to write down the names tbh). I cant say about US ones but in EU almost all of them were high and many had queues. Only 2 servers were medium even at prime time during launch. If you do the math with your numbers, players at launch must be more than 350-400k only in EU...
 
Anyway i ll say it once more. You DONT NEED NUMBERS! Just log in to any EU server and check the zones, the economy, the state of the guilds, the chat, everything you want, name it. They all feel and in most cases are dead.
 
So stop pls this silliness with numbers. I don't want to be rude but you seem to live in another place or playing another game...
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Well if it doesn't happen soon I know at least 20 people in my guild who are going to quit. :/
It sucks because 5 of them are RL friends, which means i'll probably end up leaving too. I'm on credd till Oct 2nd. 	
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{| class="blockquote"
What I am claiming is that sheer population isnt the major problem on W*; systems that act against player concurency are. Housing plots being unconnected to main cities; poor sharding ; region locks; EP caps; binge content, etc etc etc... 
 
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
 
Anyway i ll say it once more. You DONT NEED NUMBERS! Just log in to any EU server and check the zones, the economy, the state of the guilds, the chat, everything you want, name it. They all feel and in most cases are dead.
 
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{| class="blockquote"
I'll give you the EP cap and binge content, but the rest is just... no.
It is not player perception, not even "mostly".
 
The economy does not lie.
Commodities move at snail's pace, the auction house has nearly no gear selection anymore.
This is not happening just because it looks like no one is playing.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Shoot, on my server it is so bad, Crafted swords are up for 5 plat.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Yeah the AH is a big indicator. Shoot, on my server it is so bad, Crafted swords are up for 5 plat.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Well that might just be people dumb enough to pay those prices. ;)
 
Too sad.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
In my server there are still ppl selling stuff less that vendor value so there is the opposite spectrum as well
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21 pages of questions...
 
♪Do you trust me enough, to tell me your dreams?♪
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDMhlvbOFaM	
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Now I  might not know what I am talking about because I haven't really hit level cap and everything. The open chat channels certainly aren't as lively as when I was in wow in cata, However I honestly wonder how much of this is carbine's problem and how much is carbine's design issue and how much is most players of mmos being super spoiled brats with delusions of entitlement.
 
 
I am thirty years old. I remember in my teens when I first started playing an obscure German based mmo called Tibia, and I didn't speak German but many of the players spoke English and the game text was in English, I was talked into playing it by a Finnish friend of mine I met on Gamefaqs. Both in that game, on the Gamefaqs forums, and when he convinced me to play wow by showing me that Cranius mage music video. There were communities. Not just in guilds, but just period.
 
You knew people, or you knew OF them if you had not talked to them personally. Even as far as cata when I left I believe I was on one of the first RP servers. There was this one blacksmith that basically had legit "commerials" like ads in trade chat to entice people to buy his wares. Sure he probably didn't sell much that any other blacksmith didn't have but he had personality, and took the effort to make those ads... and people whined about it. Despite him using trade chat for what it's for to do trade, they complained, but they didn't complain *cupcake* [skill link here].
 
 
Sure in tibia it may have been because it was kind of sandboxy, and there is not really a level cap. I could, in theory anyway, grind killing rotworms to level 400 if I wanted to waste that much time. However wow was always a theme park and people weren't always so rude and anti-social.
 
 
 
This game feels a bit more sandboxy, even though I'm fairly sure it isn't, than any other mmo I have really played since. Maybe it's the theme. I dunno.
 
 
Honestly to just state my conclusion. I don't blame carbine. I don't even blame the people who make more obvious wow clones. I blame the players and other people for turning the Internet into a cesspit, probably because they weren't raised to be decent human beings.	
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{| class="blockquote"
I'll give you the EP cap and binge content, but the rest is just... no.
It is not player perception, not even "mostly".
 
The economy does not lie.
Commodities move at snail's pace, the auction house has nearly no gear selection anymore.
This is not happening just because it looks like no one is playing.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Not saying its perception; I'm saying its a player concurrency problem. If 10,000 people only play for 2 hours a week; there will be less gear drops to sell compared to 10,000 players playing 6- 8 hours a day. 
 
Some comodities move at a snails pace; others are booming. Honestly I attribute that more to the crafters than the pop. Farmers / crafters will tend to focus on the highest RoI and what their pushing at the time. I'm sure on some servers (e.g. Rowsdower) it's much more pronounced because of the low pops; but that focus on certain comodities is happening everywhere (server wise).
 
I agree that the economy shows us alot about the player base Tenner; I don't agree that we can just blindly attribute the obvious player concurrency problems to population drop alone. Even with high pops these issues could very well still persist because of the incentivization systems in game.  
 
Honestly what I see happening; is Carbine merging servers to appease the QQ'rs and then everyone realizing they still see alot of the same problems still. After which point Carbine has wasted tremendous time effort and resources to do something that doesn't solve the underlying issues. They'll get more QQ for it, and will have to eventually stop and fix the systematic issues anyway. 
 
I say fix the concurrency issues FIRST. Then asses the impacts population is having after the fix and merge / close servers with free transfers from there. Really all I'm suggesting is to fix the systematic problems that hinder concurency before we start going all Oprah on server merges....
 
You get a merge, and you get a merge, Merges for everyone!!!! 
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{| class="blockquote"
After a week of venting I've cooled off and took a step back, realizing the problem isn't black and white but instead I'm blind to it. I'm through speculating, I'm done begging for merges/megas, and done grand standing against transfers.. All I need is Carbine or NCSoft to say is you've been heard, at this point that'd be enough for the time being. What I want though is a Dev to just come out us with some numbers, factoids and a game plan. A small sliver of light to put down some of the gloomy hysteria which would reassure me I'm a valued customer and am not being left out to dry after a good milking.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
After a week of venting I've cooled off and took a step back, realizing the problem isn't black and white but instead I'm blind to it. I'm through speculating, I'm done begging for merges/megas, and done grand standing against transfers.. All I need is Carbine or NCSoft to say is you've been heard, at this point that'd be enough for the time being. What I want though is a Dev to just come at us with some numbers, factoids and a game plan. A small sliver of light to put down some of the gloomy hysteria which would reassure me I'm a valued customer and am not being left out to dry after a good milking.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
To be fair, there's a place to have a very deep discussion about megaservers.  I mean, at present, server merges are only useful if the population is going to stay exactly as it is, and I think Carbine and NCSoft are planning on expanding greatly after the WoD hoopla dies down.  If they have to open new servers because they can't unmerge merged servers, it's a complete waste of time.  Free transfers will exacerbate the problem, considering if everyone leaves Rowsdower, for instance, and they do improve and people come back, they will come back to an empty Rowsdower.
 
But megaservers, though a LOT of work on the front end, fix the problem permanently.  They might be a good idea whether or not there IS a population issue, or whether it won't be in the future.  Having just three "servers" (PVE, PVP, RP) for all regions and either running names by address blocks or having double- or triple-barreled names could be a good idea irrespective of the current population issue.  Certainly, nobody will ever complain about not having anyone again.  The only issue might be how the CX is handled.  Having the entire PVE or PVP population on one auction house might be a bit overcrowded and could screw up mechanics.  However, the current situation doesn't leave them in the best state and I don't see any of the other solutions handling it any better.
 
It might be best to just put in the work up front, go to megaservers, and call it a done issue for the game.  It's at least something to be brought up.  Wildstar already uses zone sharding, so they already have that going for them.
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{| class="blockquote"
Ya it's a mess and REALLY sucks that it seems best to be waited on until the whole Warlords of Derpnor fuss comes and goes.. if they were to start migrating some of the really suffering servers then that server should be barred from new character creations while the migration is held, then after phased out of the list taking any remaining character and just give them a "PinkPanther-Rosdower" and a free name change to lose the suffix, to give those the option to kinda keep their name if it was already taken. Mega Servers is as intriguing as it is scary, if they take away wPvP there goes any immersion open world. In faction split games it's PvP or nothing because seeing my enemy and not able to attack or speak with them doesn't make sense.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I think it could stick around.  World PVP could exist if they make three megaservers, one for PVE rules, one for PVP rules, one for PVE-RP.  Hey, maybe one day, we'll even have enough people for PVP-RP.
----
			this is important	
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{| class="blockquote"
Or even to be safe two for PvP / PvE using group phasing to RP scripts at the given area, in the chat settings there's a check box for  All Messages and No RP, I never understood what that meant. The ability to phase out strangers in a given area would open up some awesome machinima potential which if something went viral that in itself is amazing advertisement.
 
Infact it was this video how I discovered WoW in the first place, sure I heard the title but it was the video that got me off the computer and to the store to buy the game.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4TyqYsC26g
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Nah, RP server should be fine on its own.  I think we have the least complaints coming from our corner because we know what it's like having an "unofficial" RP server.
 
Honestly, the dedicated RP server is half the reason I played this game.  SquareEnix definitely didn't think the demographic was especially valuable.
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my guild just died. rip 'smart casual'
 
we were on eu dominion ravenous, and were having great raids, killed x89 and kuralak.
 
but as soon as 1 or 2 ppl start having other things to do and raid couldn't happen, more ppl just followed suit. we even tried raiding with another guild that were having population issues as well. with no new players joining the guild, even the raiders that were always present have now decided to quit the game. my guild master just decided to quit as well 2 days back, sealing the fate of my guild. 
 
most of them didn't want to go for realm transfers as they feel that it is a problem that developers can fix.
 
i really like the combat mechanics of this game but without anyone to play with,I really cant raid alone. I have cancelled my subscription and hope that there are more players for me to return to this awesome game. thanks	
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{| class="blockquote"
Not trying to say servers aren't low, but I'm not sure gear costs are a great indicator.  Commodities maybe, but even since launch, when the servers were dense, commodities were on for less than vendor prices and gear was cheap.  I know I still make gear on all my characters, but I rarely sell it because of that.  I tend to sell commodities or just straight vendor.  Why sell gear if it gets replaced in three hours anyway?  All the money is in vet dungeon replacement gear, where the demand is insane and the stuff flies off the shelves.
 
In the end, server population is irrelevant, it's server activity and concurrency.  I think that's what's being changed for the huge megadrop incoming; they need to give people reasons to be in the game playing, queueing, crafting, what have you.  Otherwise, even if ten million people log into the game, if they log in, cap EG with their guild, hit raids, and don't log in for a week, they may as well not even be there.
 
Lots of changes Carbine can make on that front won't just help the server issue, they can make the game better in the long term.
----
			Well, my second guild died and I canceled my sub. :\	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
To be fair, there's a place to have a very deep discussion about megaservers.  I mean, at present, server merges are only useful if the population is going to stay exactly as it is, and I think Carbine and NCSoft are planning on expanding greatly after the WoD hoopla dies down.  If they have to open new servers because they can't unmerge merged servers, it's a complete waste of time.  Free transfers will exacerbate the problem, considering if everyone leaves Rowsdower, for instance, and they do improve and people come back, they will come back to an empty Rowsdower.
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I tried SO hard to just let this go. But unless you plan on saucing that shit stop saying it. They said on the gamescom interview that they pushed it for polish and bug fixes. You know what they didn't say? "we're implementing systems that will increase player concurrency in drop 3 and that's why it got pushed back". New content might as well be a band-aid for player concurrency issues because as soon as people play though it the first time it's back to grinding out elder gems and either working on attunement or just flat out logging out until they have to raid. 
 
Yes, player concurrency sucks the big one, but you can't outright dismiss the population. The less player population there is the less likely players are going to be on at the same time(hello concurrency). There's been a bunch of talk about SWTOR in this thread. You know what Bioware did that *cupcake*ed over SWTOR? They *cupcake*ing waited. They were no where quick enough to move on a whole plethora of issues that led to a mass exodus which eventually led to it going f2p. That's why everyone says SWTOR failed. WildStar does not have the luxury of waiting. WildStar can't fall back on it's studio name OR it's IP to prop it up. They need to be doing it better than the competition at every turn to prove to players that this game is worth a damn. They said that they're not competing with WoW, but make no mistake, as soon as WoD drops WS will take another population hit. You can practically bank on it. They need to be using all the time they have in the interim to solidify their population. Having it fractured across so many servers isn't doing them any favors. Lets not forget that gamers are a fickle bunch, if this game doesn't provide what they want, they'll go somewhere else. And rightfully so.
 
Now, some people might say that I'm saying that the sky is falling. But here we sit, discussing population issues and player concurrency in a 22 page long thread, with many more locked and redirected here a mere 3 months after launch. There are plenty of reasons for this, but now you can add in that people are leaving because they feel like the games population is dying or dead.
 
I like this game, I like the people that make this game. I like the people in my guild, and I like the people that are on my server. But I wont stay if they stay the course that they're on now, and that would make me sad, and a bit angry, that all this potential was essentially pissed away.
----
			
I am afraid that even if Carbine merged servers now that it would be too little far too late. My guild on Lightspire is dead *insert dead parrot sketch replacing Parrot with Guild*, I logged in yesterday to see that the last time people logged on was 2 weeks ago. The circle that I setup for the 20 & 5 man dailies which had 50+ members is now dead. People havent been logging on for weeks now. 
 
Talking to my guild members on Skype, they all are saying that they wont be back. The lack of action has upset people. However the lack of response from Carbine to even acknowledge the issue has driven them away.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Talking to my guild members on Skype, they all are saying that they wont be back. The lack of action has upset people. However the lack of response from Carbine to even acknowledge the issue has driven them away.
----
			Just happy we got only one oceanic designated PvE server otherwise it would be worst for me although dominion look pretty deserted compared to exiles. 	
----
			
I am enjoying this game even though I feel at times I am playing a solo MMO. I really do think that Lightspire EU server needs help with the population.
 
Set er merges would be the best for all.	
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Good morning ppl! One more day without a Dev answer. Great!
 
WS at Raptr moved to 42 place down to 75k hours and keel falling.
 
Almost all my rl and in game friends are gone now. Most of them are preparing for WoD and there are 2.5 more months until its release. It will be another great slap for WS.
 
I think i m not the only one who is facing this. I m trying hard to keep playing WS but if Carbine keeps this policy i don't think i ll stay for much longer. Even while i like WS much more than the other mmo's, i m not going to stay in a dead game, where all my friends/guild m8's are gone. This joke must have an end and they better end it now with an announcement of their fix plan.
 
I don't care if the plan says about merging or free transferring or what ever else. I just need to hear about their intentions, their thoughts and their best possible solution. That would be enough for now.	
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{| class="blockquote"
Good morning ppl! One more day without a Dev answer. Great!
 
WS at Raptr moved to 42 place down to 75k hours and keel falling.
----
			
There are some really excellent replies here guys so thankyou for all taking the time to add your thoughts and ideas, I hope this thread doesn't get shut down because if anything else it shows plenty of people are still hoping Carbine take the time to response to us.
 
In regard to us sorting ourselves out Psycostar, kudos to you sir. While I don't think it would work I can't help have respect for your positive attitude.
 
We have been talking over the server problem for the last few weeks and have come to the decision to stay on Zhur. The main reason for this is that out of the active players we have left there are a significant number who either can't afford the fee or will not pay it due to the principle of the matter. I respect these players decision and as we would never consider leaving a guild member behind so that's us based on Zhur until Carbine decide what they are doing. It's painful to see the guild I've built up with my fellow officers slowing crumbling away with the absent playerbase.
 
Unfortunately some of our newer and less loyal members are leaving the guild and moving themselves to Hazzak in the hope of a better game experience. While it's not what we would like to see I can't blame these players as they are only looking to play their game with other people and that's simply not possible on Zhur. I started my third Alt last night, made it to level 10 and deleted it. There is simply not point in playing through fifty levels solo. For me a large part of the enjoyment of leveling is interacting with players outside my guild and getting to know people I group with. As someone also quite rightly said, many of the systems in Wildstar are designed to work with many players around. Such as the settler path, it's sad to see all these building nodes empty now and no-one to activate them.
 
It's so frustrating to see a game with so much potential and so much ambition receiving so much flak. As some of you have pointed out, server merges (or being directed to one server) are critical to saving the remaining player base but I'm constantly asking myself, why did do many people take a look at Wildstar and move on? One theory of mine is that while the MMO scene is relatively quiet right now with only Archeage and Landmark being worth a look there isn't really much to pull players away. However if you look at the games industry in a broader sense look how many amazing games are landing this year. Many of these are also excellent multiplayer games, I think people are just spoilt for choice right now and that's going to become even more insane of the next six months.	
----
			Well said cfStatic, I couldn't agree with you more.	
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I still can't decide if Carbine won't do, or cannot do anything about server merges.As mentioned by cfStatic, SW:TOR died in essence (IMO) for two reasons, the first was there was little to do at level 50.  I recall many a thread claiming that they'd spent all their monies on voice actors rather than developing max level content, and once the populations started to slide they held on rigidly to their server structure.  By the time they admitted their mistake, TORtanic had well and truly sunk.
 
My experience of levelling an alt and the general absence of players in daily zones etc makes me believe, that W* is on that same boat.  Most who have left won't return, they've gone back to the games they came from full of tales of dead servers, borked PvP etc.  Those that remain are faced with two choices, either pony up the cash and transfer to the server in their region with a reputation for high pop, or cling to the liferaft that is the belief of "free server hops" in the near future with fixes to the more serious bugs.I strongly believe that there is a good game here, waiting to break out of the shell its currently in, but at this rate, by the time it does, the MMO crowd will have moved on to the next big thing, be it FF, WoD, AA or <insert name here>	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
You do realise how stupid it is to use something like Raptr as an indication of a games popularity right?
 
It would be like using the Curse Client as an indication of how popular the website is.
 
Next you'll bring up Twitch......
----
			
Agree with Rafi89.
 
Can we pls have a link of Overwolf showing games played hours? Thank you.	
----
			
I decided to play some WoW over the weekend.  PUT YOUR PITCHFORKS DOWN.Some observations:
 
1)  It's really, really, really, really nice to play an MMO and have it feel like an MMO.  I'm pretty certain there were more people idling in the AH than play Dominion on Evindra.2)  Aside from all its faults, it's no wonder why WildStar scared people off in droves.  Holy *cupcake* I forgot how absolutely shiteous the average MMO player is at doing.. well, anything.  I'm not convinced half of them can tell left from right, let alone not keyboard turn, use hotkeys, know a rotation, AND dodge telegraphs. 	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
Agree with Rafi89.
 
Can we pls have a link of Overwolf showing games played hours? Thank you.
----
			
Hmm ... even the forum traffic seems to be slowing down ... :P
 
"Dance puppets ... dance" ... need mah forum PvP. ;)	
----
			
{| class="blockquote"
I tried SO hard to just let this go. But unless you plan on saucing that shit stop saying it. They said on the gamescom interview that they pushed it for polish and bug fixes. You know what they didn't say? "we're implementing systems that will increase player concurrency in drop 3 and that's why it got pushed back". New content might as well be a band-aid for player concurrency issues because as soon as people play though it the first time it's back to grinding out elder gems and either working on attunement or just flat out logging out until they have to raid. 
 
Yes, player concurrency sucks the big one, but you can't outright dismiss the population. The less player population there is the less likely players are going to be on at the same time(hello concurrency). There's been a bunch of talk about SWTOR in this thread. You know what Bioware did that *cupcake*ed over SWTOR? They *cupcake*ing waited. They were no where quick enough to move on a whole plethora of issues that led to a mass exodus which eventually led to it going f2p. That's why everyone says SWTOR failed. WildStar does not have the luxury of waiting. WildStar can't fall back on it's studio name OR it's IP to prop it up. They need to be doing it better than the competition at every turn to prove to players that this game is worth a damn. They said that they're not competing with WoW, but make no mistake, as soon as WoD drops WS will take another population hit. You can practically bank on it. They need to be using all the time they have in the interim to solidify their population. Having it fractured across so many servers isn't doing them any favors. Lets not forget that gamers are a fickle bunch, if this game doesn't provide what they want, they'll go somewhere else. And rightfully so.
 
Now, some people might say that I'm saying that the sky is falling. But here we sit, discussing population issues and player concurrency in a 22 page long thread, with many more locked and redirected here a mere 3 months after launch. There are plenty of reasons for this, but now you can add in that people are leaving because they feel like the games population is dying or dead.
 
I like this game, I like the people that make this game. I like the people in my guild, and I like the people that are on my server. But I wont stay if they stay the course that they're on now, and that would make me sad, and a bit angry, that all this potential was essentially pissed away.
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And follow those who already transfered to more populated servers? Sorry, I fail to understand this argument.
 
And even if they plan to expand greatly at some point, which I personally highly doubt, as this can only happen with Free-to-Play conversion, I don't see why they can't open one PvE, PVP and RP server for such an occasion? At least they can save a fair deal of the current population through merges. Or do you seriously believe they should leave the current population completely screwed in hopes that F2P influx will be so massive so that all the current servers will be needed? Thus saving questionable amount of money on deploying new servers? It didn't seem all that difficult, beside understandable hesitation, for them at launch.
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			Why does this game have so many instanced zones, all of this instanced content, and so many servers?	
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Hm, yeah i find is quite strange that they dont give us feedback when the next patch is coming, we are allready 2 weeks late, i really hope its this week but somehow i dont think it will happen.
 
On Progenitor the Population is still ok, i mean there are 6 20 raids and 1 40 raid on exile on domi i think there are 4-5 20 raids, but we are the highest German Server and the other German Server are nearly dead atleast Deathstar.
 
I just hope that Carbine dident loose fate in there game.
 
But 5 thinks need to happen soon:
 
1: Dungeons need to be easier (Random groups should be able to finish them in maximum 40 mins.
2: Gear from Raids need to be better than blue craftet Gear
3: RNG from Runes need to go
4: Set Runes need to be stronger
5: PVP needs a fix.	
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Why does this game have so many instanced zones, all of this instanced content, and so many servers?
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If there are 80 million PC gamers, and either Overwolf or Raptr (separately not combined) have a 10 million userbase (which they do) to use as a pool for information that is 1/8th of the PC gaming population right there. They report the number of unique games played per month which is a good statistical representation of what games are being played and taking this information over a few months is a good way of seeing the rise and fall of the popularity of games in the PC market. This is actually one of the services that companies like Overwolf and Raptr offer to businesses as it's an accurate representation of the PC market.
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Ah ok, so how many of the 10 million have the app running, tracking the game and/or have it registered? I have Raptr installed, but i don't use it. Am i part of the 10 million people who have Raptr?
 
 
And just because some people use it, doesn't mean all people use it.
 
Can you not see how fallacious your argument is?
 
 
You would have to remove from that 10 million the people who don't use it and don't have Wildstar associated with their account, then you'd have to detract the people who haven't launched the client with the game.
 
But instead your saying "Well 10 million people have Raptr and only 1% is playing Wildstar. Wildstar = dead", its a complete fallacy.
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It's called a statistical representation. It's a representation of what the gaming community does as a whole. It isn't a fallacy, because the whole point is to take that number of people and use it as a group of people representing the whole. This is statistics, not an exact replication as doing that would be nearly impossible.
 
The way these kinds of numbers work (for Overwolf, as I can only speak to them) is that you have to have Overwolf installed and running while the game is played and you count one time per month.
 
And no the argument isn't a fallacy, whether or not 100% of the PC gaming population uses the service or not, a large enough portion of it does to create a good statistical model does. You do not need the whole gaming population to answer a poll to create a statistical representation of the gaming community. This is exactly how scientific research is done. You take a large enough pool of people with varying ages. sexes, nationalities and test a drug to see what kind of reactions they have in order to state that "So and so is a possible side affect of using the drug".
 
So long as your pool of people (or trials or runs) is large enough to be statistically viable, which in this case it is, the results can be said to  be statistically accurate and a good representation of the PC market. 
 
And no, I don't think the game is dead.
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Ah ok, so how many of the 10 million have the app running, tracking the game and/or have it registered? I have Raptr installed, but i don't use it. Am i part of the 10 million people who have Raptr?
 
 
And just because some people use it, doesn't mean all people use it.
 
Can you not see how fallacious your argument is?
 
 
You would have to remove from that 10 million the people who don't use it and don't have Wildstar associated with their account, then you'd have to detract the people who haven't launched the client with the game.
 
But instead your saying "Well 10 million people have Raptr and only 1% is playing Wildstar. Wildstar = dead", its a complete fallacy.
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To support your argument, it doesn't matter to us how many people are subscribed (AKA the game is dead or alive) but how many people are playing when we're playing (the concurrency issue).  And I think it is somewhat beyond debate at this point that, whatever the reason and whatever the purpose, there are not enough people actively playing the game at the same time.  Whether the game has 10 million subs and NCSoft is rolling in money or not doesn't matter much to us gamers, what matters to us is essentially that people are online and playing.  The server consolidation issue is meant to address that by somehow raising the number of people that see each other in a zone or zone shard (and the number of fingers in the CX, warm bodies in the queues, heads in the guilds, et al).  Paired with gameplay improvements, it's necessary for the health of the game.
 
You don't even need to say the game is dead to think we're having an issue with server populations having adverse effects on related game systems.
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It's called a statistical representation. It's a representation of what the gaming community does as a whole. It isn't a fallacy, because the whole point is to take that number of people and use it as a group of people representing the whole. This is statistics, not an exact replication as doing that would be nearly impossible.
 
The way these kinds of numbers work (for Overwolf, as I can only speak to them) is that you have to have Overwolf installed and running while the game is played and you count one time per month.
 
And no the argument isn't a fallacy, whether or not 100% of the PC gaming population uses the service or not, a large enough portion of it does to create a good statistical model does. You do not need the whole gaming population to answer a poll to create a statistical representation of the gaming community. This is exactly how scientific research is done. You take a large enough pool of people with varying ages. sexes, nationalities and test a drug to see what kind of reactions they have in order to state that "So and so is a possible side affect of using the drug".
 
So long as your pool of people (or trials or runs) is large enough to be statistically viable, which in this case it is, the results can be said to  be statistically accurate and a good representation of the PC market. 
 
And no, I don't think the game is dead.
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